Rocksolid Light

Welcome to novaBBS (click a section below)

mail  files  register  newsreader  groups  login

Message-ID:  

The absence of labels [in ECL] is probably a good thing. -- T. Cheatham


tech / sci.physics.relativity / Re: Petrov Classification

SubjectAuthor
* Petrov Classificationiuval
+- Re: Petrov ClassificationRoss A. Finlayson
`- Re: Petrov ClassificationJanPB

1
Petrov Classification

<38d21e15-e582-43a2-88c3-a089a0edd60an@googlegroups.com>

  copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=65104&group=sci.physics.relativity#65104

  copy link   Newsgroups: sci.physics.relativity
X-Received: by 2002:a05:6214:10c4:: with SMTP id r4mr4125944qvs.58.1628880307121; Fri, 13 Aug 2021 11:45:07 -0700 (PDT)
X-Received: by 2002:ac8:e02:: with SMTP id a2mr3233897qti.318.1628880306826; Fri, 13 Aug 2021 11:45:06 -0700 (PDT)
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!paganini.bofh.team!news.dns-netz.com!news.freedyn.net!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed7.news.xs4all.nl!tr2.eu1.usenetexpress.com!feeder.usenetexpress.com!tr2.iad1.usenetexpress.com!border1.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!news-out.google.com!nntp.google.com!postnews.google.com!google-groups.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail
Newsgroups: sci.physics.relativity
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2021 11:45:06 -0700 (PDT)
Injection-Info: google-groups.googlegroups.com; posting-host=96.245.15.2; posting-account=57tVTQkAAACqkrfiFeD6OxKlD9bs_0ib
NNTP-Posting-Host: 96.245.15.2
User-Agent: G2/1.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: <38d21e15-e582-43a2-88c3-a089a0edd60an@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Petrov Classification
From: clejan.i...@gmail.com (iuval)
Injection-Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2021 18:45:07 +0000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Lines: 16
 by: iuval - Fri, 13 Aug 2021 18:45 UTC

Hi, I have a few questions, maybe someone can answer some of them?
1. Why is it not possible to classify Einstein spaces (vacuum solutions to the Einstein equation) with the eigenvalues of the metric tensor? Why was it done with the eigenvalues of the Weyl tensor (as a linear operator on a bivector space) instead? I think perhaps the answer is that the eigenvalues of the metric tensor (and their multiplicity) are not invariant under a general coordinate transformation, whereas the ones of the Weyl tensor are? Or at least their multiplicity is invariant (similar to how the number of positive and
negative eigenvalues is an invariant)? But has anyone actually shown this? Couldn't see it from a cursory reading of Petrov's paper.
2. Can the classification be generalized to when (non-gravitational) matter/energy is present?
3. Is there a more general version of the Poincare-Hopf theorem to n-tensor fields, not just vector fields? I saw something in a hydrodynamics journal but it was only for Euclidian 2D spaces and I'm not sure it's correct for the reason in (1) above.

Re: Petrov Classification

<26f3272e-ada3-4287-ba53-94ac0efb3379n@googlegroups.com>

  copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=65394&group=sci.physics.relativity#65394

  copy link   Newsgroups: sci.physics.relativity
X-Received: by 2002:a37:a80c:: with SMTP id r12mr1877648qke.299.1629176082270;
Mon, 16 Aug 2021 21:54:42 -0700 (PDT)
X-Received: by 2002:ad4:5551:: with SMTP id v17mr1494949qvy.11.1629176082119;
Mon, 16 Aug 2021 21:54:42 -0700 (PDT)
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!weretis.net!feeder8.news.weretis.net!proxad.net!feeder1-2.proxad.net!209.85.160.216.MISMATCH!news-out.google.com!nntp.google.com!postnews.google.com!google-groups.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail
Newsgroups: sci.physics.relativity
Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2021 21:54:41 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <38d21e15-e582-43a2-88c3-a089a0edd60an@googlegroups.com>
Injection-Info: google-groups.googlegroups.com; posting-host=75.172.111.74; posting-account=_-PQygoAAAAciOn_89sZIlnxfb74FzXU
NNTP-Posting-Host: 75.172.111.74
References: <38d21e15-e582-43a2-88c3-a089a0edd60an@googlegroups.com>
User-Agent: G2/1.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: <26f3272e-ada3-4287-ba53-94ac0efb3379n@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: Petrov Classification
From: ross.fin...@gmail.com (Ross A. Finlayson)
Injection-Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2021 04:54:42 +0000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 by: Ross A. Finlayson - Tue, 17 Aug 2021 04:54 UTC

On Friday, August 13, 2021 at 11:45:08 AM UTC-7, iuval wrote:
> Hi, I have a few questions, maybe someone can answer some of them?
> 1. Why is it not possible to classify Einstein spaces (vacuum solutions to the Einstein equation) with the eigenvalues of the metric tensor? Why was it done with the eigenvalues of the Weyl tensor (as a linear operator on a bivector space) instead? I think perhaps the answer is that the eigenvalues of the metric tensor (and their multiplicity) are not invariant under a general coordinate transformation, whereas the ones of the Weyl tensor are? Or at least their multiplicity is invariant (similar to how the number of positive and
> negative eigenvalues is an invariant)? But has anyone actually shown this? Couldn't see it from a cursory reading of Petrov's paper.
> 2. Can the classification be generalized to when (non-gravitational) matter/energy is present?
> 3. Is there a more general version of the Poincare-Hopf theorem to n-tensor fields, not just vector fields? I saw something in a hydrodynamics journal but it was only for Euclidian 2D spaces and I'm not sure it's correct for the reason in (1) above.

Why you no Ricci? There is Kerr.

Re: Petrov Classification

<c70eab44-73cc-458e-b426-ae6dc546fb14n@googlegroups.com>

  copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=65433&group=sci.physics.relativity#65433

  copy link   Newsgroups: sci.physics.relativity
X-Received: by 2002:a05:620a:88c:: with SMTP id b12mr6087991qka.483.1629236255192;
Tue, 17 Aug 2021 14:37:35 -0700 (PDT)
X-Received: by 2002:a05:620a:4147:: with SMTP id k7mr3177271qko.140.1629236254942;
Tue, 17 Aug 2021 14:37:34 -0700 (PDT)
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!weretis.net!feeder8.news.weretis.net!proxad.net!feeder1-2.proxad.net!209.85.160.216.MISMATCH!news-out.google.com!nntp.google.com!postnews.google.com!google-groups.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail
Newsgroups: sci.physics.relativity
Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2021 14:37:34 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <38d21e15-e582-43a2-88c3-a089a0edd60an@googlegroups.com>
Injection-Info: google-groups.googlegroups.com; posting-host=96.64.206.30; posting-account=Y2v6DQoAAACGpOrX04JGhSdsTevCdArN
NNTP-Posting-Host: 96.64.206.30
References: <38d21e15-e582-43a2-88c3-a089a0edd60an@googlegroups.com>
User-Agent: G2/1.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: <c70eab44-73cc-458e-b426-ae6dc546fb14n@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: Petrov Classification
From: film...@gmail.com (JanPB)
Injection-Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2021 21:37:35 +0000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
 by: JanPB - Tue, 17 Aug 2021 21:37 UTC

On Friday, August 13, 2021 at 11:45:08 AM UTC-7, iuval wrote:
> Hi, I have a few questions, maybe someone can answer some of them?
> 1. Why is it not possible to classify Einstein spaces (vacuum solutions to the Einstein equation) with the eigenvalues of the metric tensor?

That's because the metric tensor, being a bilinear map (rank (2,0)), does not have eigenvalues. They are defined for maps of
linear spaces (rank (1,1)). What persists for different (orthogonal) base choices is the number of + and - signs.

> Why was it done with the eigenvalues of the Weyl tensor (as a linear operator on a bivector space) instead?

Because it's a linear operator from a certain (complex 3D) space V to itself.

> I think perhaps the answer is that the eigenvalues of the metric tensor (and their multiplicity) are not invariant under a general coordinate transformation, whereas the ones of the Weyl tensor are?

Yes.

> Or at least their multiplicity is invariant (similar to how the number of positive and
> negative eigenvalues is an invariant)?

Yes.

> But has anyone actually shown this? Couldn't see it from a cursory reading of Petrov's paper.

Has anyone shown what? The constant number of +/- on the diagonal (they are not eigenvalues) is
an old theorem.

> 2. Can the classification be generalized to when (non-gravitational) matter/energy is present?

Not sure what you mean by non-gravitational matter/energy. Can you give an example of such thing?

> 3. Is there a more general version of the Poincare-Hopf theorem to n-tensor fields, not just vector fields? I saw something in a hydrodynamics journal but it was only for Euclidian 2D spaces and I'm not sure it's correct for the reason in (1) above.

I don't know.

--
Jan

1
server_pubkey.txt

rocksolid light 0.9.8
clearnet tor