Rocksolid Light

Welcome to novaBBS (click a section below)

mail  files  register  newsreader  groups  login

Message-ID:  

In space, no one can hear you fart.


tech / rec.crafts.metalworking / macro etchant for Ali

SubjectAuthor
* macro etchant for AliRichard Smith
+- Re: macro etchant for AliRichard Smith
`* Re: macro etchant for AliJim Wilkins
 +- Re: macro etchant for AliRichard Smith
 `* Re: macro etchant for AliRichard Smith
  +- Re: macro etchant for AliJim Wilkins
  `* Re: macro etchant for AliRichard Smith
   +* Re: macro etchant for AliSnag
   |`* Re: macro etchant for AliJim Wilkins
   | `- Re: macro etchant for AliRichard Smith
   `* Re: macro etchant for AliBob Engelhardt
    `* Re: macro etchant for AliJim Wilkins
     `* Re: macro etchant for AliRichard Smith
      `* Re: macro etchant for AliJim Wilkins
       `* Re: macro etchant for AliRichard Smith
        `* Re: macro etchant for AliJim Wilkins
         `* Re: macro etchant for AliRichard Smith
          `- Re: macro etchant for AliJim Wilkins

1
macro etchant for Ali

<lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=6638&group=rec.crafts.metalworking#6638

 copy link   Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!3/k4ysjauCmWh/C5zVgrOg.user.46.165.242.91.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: nul...@void.com (Richard Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: macro etchant for Ali
Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2022 17:37:22 +0000
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID: <lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Injection-Info: gioia.aioe.org; logging-data="19062"; posting-host="3/k4ysjauCmWh/C5zVgrOg.user.gioia.aioe.org"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@aioe.org";
User-Agent: Gnus/5.11 (Gnus v5.11) Emacs/22.1 (darwin)
X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.9.2
Cancel-Lock: sha1:6p7TBiX4c4JCc/ZQKkw6zYy7L5Q=
 by: Richard Smith - Sat, 12 Nov 2022 17:37 UTC

Hi all
Could you remind me.
Macro etchant for Aluminum...
To inspect welds on Ali.
I think the suggestion a few months back was spray-on oven cleaner.
Brands/types which work?
Am in the UK, so would have to look for one available here.
If anyone nominates a brand which isn't available here, I could still
look up the overall nature of its ingredients and find the most
similar here.
I tried washing soda, which seemed to clean the Ali, but didn't etch
it even steaming hot at high concentration.
Thanks in advance,
Rich Smith

Re: macro etchant for Ali

<lyh6z4ax78.fsf@void.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=6639&group=rec.crafts.metalworking#6639

 copy link   Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!3/k4ysjauCmWh/C5zVgrOg.user.46.165.242.91.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: nul...@void.com (Richard Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: macro etchant for Ali
Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2022 17:39:55 +0000
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID: <lyh6z4ax78.fsf@void.com>
References: <lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Injection-Info: gioia.aioe.org; logging-data="20161"; posting-host="3/k4ysjauCmWh/C5zVgrOg.user.gioia.aioe.org"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@aioe.org";
User-Agent: Gnus/5.11 (Gnus v5.11) Emacs/22.1 (darwin)
X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.9.2
Cancel-Lock: sha1:Io0us3Y4o5t4FGuxHkKdieoNgsc=
 by: Richard Smith - Sat, 12 Nov 2022 17:39 UTC

Hi all
Immediately written it, recalled where had made note.
Jody at weldingtipsandtricks recommends "Easy Off" oven cleaner as his
favoured method.
Rich S

Re: macro etchant for Ali

<tkp3vm$18b8k$1@dont-email.me>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=6643&group=rec.crafts.metalworking#6643

 copy link   Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader01.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: muratla...@gmail.com (Jim Wilkins)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: macro etchant for Ali
Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2022 16:41:33 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 1
Message-ID: <tkp3vm$18b8k$1@dont-email.me>
References: <lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain;
format=flowed;
charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Injection-Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2022 21:42:14 -0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: reader01.eternal-september.org; posting-host="70616669e7c5a1ad89d2ddb66d83148e";
logging-data="1322260"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1+sI9sPxW6QWeuY1iiYh88iYGRUxo64kiI="
Cancel-Lock: sha1:VtqH4Qq49bXRD+Z6B+aWo7GzJeg=
In-Reply-To: <lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com>
X-Antivirus: AVG (VPS 221112-6, 11/12/2022), Outbound message
Importance: Normal
X-Antivirus-Status: Clean
X-Priority: 3
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V16.4.3505.912
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 16.4.3505.912
 by: Jim Wilkins - Sat, 12 Nov 2022 21:41 UTC

"Richard Smith" wrote in message news:lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com...

Hi all
Could you remind me.
Macro etchant for Aluminum...
To inspect welds on Ali.
I think the suggestion a few months back was spray-on oven cleaner.
Brands/types which work?
Am in the UK, so would have to look for one available here.
If anyone nominates a brand which isn't available here, I could still
look up the overall nature of its ingredients and find the most
similar here.
I tried washing soda, which seemed to clean the Ali, but didn't etch
it even steaming hot at high concentration.
Thanks in advance,
Rich Smith

----
The active ingredient is Sodium or Potassium Hydroxide, AKA lye, alkali,
caustic soda, caustic potash. Besides Aluminium they also dissolve Zinc and
human flesh. They are sold as oven and drain cleaner, for home made soap,
and to put on pretzels before baking them, to create the brown color and
glaze. Hopefully they absorb CO2 from the air or oven flame and are
neutralized to baking soda.
https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2014/08/09/338591194/for-a-proper-pretzel-crust-count-on-chemistry-and-memories

The fizzing when they react with Aluminium is Hydrogen, in case you want to
make UFO balloons which we did as pranks in college. It's nearly impossible
to correctly estimate the size of or distance to an unidentified object in
the sky, or on a movie screen.
https://www.thepropgallery.com/media/wysiwyg/DW-TARDIS-mike1.jpg

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exeter_incident
I wasn't involved in that one but I've flown less ambitious Hydrogen and hot
air balloons in that region. The plans for balloon sections (gores) had been
published in a Boy Scout magazine. The reported erratic movements are
typical of a marginally buoyant balloon in the turbulence around trees and
buildings. The bright red light could have been road flare powder.

Re: macro etchant for Ali

<lyy1sf3kt9.fsf@void.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=6644&group=rec.crafts.metalworking#6644

 copy link   Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!3/k4ysjauCmWh/C5zVgrOg.user.46.165.242.91.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: nul...@void.com (Richard Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: macro etchant for Ali
Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2022 21:49:22 +0000
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID: <lyy1sf3kt9.fsf@void.com>
References: <lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com> <tkp3vm$18b8k$1@dont-email.me>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Injection-Info: gioia.aioe.org; logging-data="33634"; posting-host="3/k4ysjauCmWh/C5zVgrOg.user.gioia.aioe.org"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@aioe.org";
User-Agent: Gnus/5.11 (Gnus v5.11) Emacs/22.1 (darwin)
X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.9.2
Cancel-Lock: sha1:cIaAdXDve37mTpGZTbNL43MXsAY=
 by: Richard Smith - Sat, 12 Nov 2022 21:49 UTC

Thanks. Will make sure NaOH is high up on the list of ingredients.
I like the idea of being able to carry NaOH in a convenient form - as
a spray-can.

Re: macro etchant for Ali

<lyk03swruk.fsf@void.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=6672&group=rec.crafts.metalworking#6672

 copy link   Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!xoV4yU4PHPjb8RyljFeA5w.user.46.165.242.91.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: nul...@void.com (Richard Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: macro etchant for Ali
Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2022 09:10:27 +0000
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID: <lyk03swruk.fsf@void.com>
References: <lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com> <tkp3vm$18b8k$1@dont-email.me>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Injection-Info: gioia.aioe.org; logging-data="18214"; posting-host="xoV4yU4PHPjb8RyljFeA5w.user.gioia.aioe.org"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@aioe.org";
User-Agent: Gnus/5.11 (Gnus v5.11) Emacs/22.1 (darwin)
X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.9.2
Cancel-Lock: sha1:D69oOSSdTg9CAaCjGF2nQm8nAVs=
 by: Richard Smith - Fri, 18 Nov 2022 09:10 UTC

Hi all
Just managed to etch my weld with "Drain cleaner / Drain unblocker".
Which is NaOH.
Couple of teaspoons of in a thin layer of water at the bottom of a
stainless steel pan, hot.
There is a fizzing reaction on the surface, and I repeatedly wiped it
with a tissue wrapped around a rod.
Gave a good etch - cross-sectional structure of weld totally clearly
revealed. Objective achieved.
This is with 5000-series Al-Mg alloy - very corrosion resistant.
Rich Smith

Re: macro etchant for Ali

<tl7v5u$2uhda$1@dont-email.me>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=6673&group=rec.crafts.metalworking#6673

 copy link   Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader01.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: muratla...@gmail.com (Jim Wilkins)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: macro etchant for Ali
Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2022 07:51:32 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 1
Message-ID: <tl7v5u$2uhda$1@dont-email.me>
References: <lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com> <tkp3vm$18b8k$1@dont-email.me> <lyk03swruk.fsf@void.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain;
format=flowed;
charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Injection-Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2022 12:52:15 -0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: reader01.eternal-september.org; posting-host="3af5de1778a11077c34d376de9171075";
logging-data="3098026"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1/J+m5AWoL4t3Bv/56aTzQ27n4stdl4Iyw="
Cancel-Lock: sha1:2LkvWwBP8UkwiNmjWePyotc6cmI=
In-Reply-To: <lyk03swruk.fsf@void.com>
X-Priority: 3
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V16.4.3505.912
X-Antivirus-Status: Clean
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 16.4.3505.912
Importance: Normal
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Antivirus: AVG (VPS 221118-2, 11/18/2022), Outbound message
 by: Jim Wilkins - Fri, 18 Nov 2022 12:51 UTC

"Richard Smith" wrote in message news:lyk03swruk.fsf@void.com...

Hi all
Just managed to etch my weld with "Drain cleaner / Drain unblocker".
Which is NaOH.
Couple of teaspoons of in a thin layer of water at the bottom of a
stainless steel pan, hot.
There is a fizzing reaction on the surface, and I repeatedly wiped it
with a tissue wrapped around a rod.
Gave a good etch - cross-sectional structure of weld totally clearly
revealed. Objective achieved.
This is with 5000-series Al-Mg alloy - very corrosion resistant.
Rich Smith

-----------------

The rule is to always add strong acid or alkali to water instead of the
water to them, to avoid instant boiling and spattering. Wear safety glasses
and if possible use them within reach of a sink or hose so you can wash off
any spills.
https://www.pure-chemical.com/blog/general-guidelines-safe-chemicals-laboratory/

NaOH will absorb water and CO2 from the air if not kept sealed.

Re: macro etchant for Ali

<ly8rk0j9rg.fsf@void.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=6677&group=rec.crafts.metalworking#6677

 copy link   Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!3/k4ysjauCmWh/C5zVgrOg.user.46.165.242.91.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: nul...@void.com (Richard Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: macro etchant for Ali
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2022 21:57:39 +0000
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID: <ly8rk0j9rg.fsf@void.com>
References: <lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com> <tkp3vm$18b8k$1@dont-email.me> <lyk03swruk.fsf@void.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Injection-Info: gioia.aioe.org; logging-data="51491"; posting-host="3/k4ysjauCmWh/C5zVgrOg.user.gioia.aioe.org"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@aioe.org";
User-Agent: Gnus/5.11 (Gnus v5.11) Emacs/22.1 (darwin)
X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.9.2
Cancel-Lock: sha1:7qeK59mKT3OucqrJhZmmVwFBoYY=
 by: Richard Smith - Thu, 24 Nov 2022 21:57 UTC

On my own "weldsmith" website - webpage

http://weldsmith.co.uk/tech/welding/weld_test/macro_etch/221117_alimig_macro1st.html
"Ali MIG/GMAW 1st-ever macro-etch"

Images of the macro.
Quite good I venture to reckon.

Re: macro etchant for Ali

<tloqas$o312$1@dont-email.me>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=6678&group=rec.crafts.metalworking#6678

 copy link   Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader01.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: Snag_...@msn.com (Snag)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: macro etchant for Ali
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2022 16:13:49 -0600
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 16
Message-ID: <tloqas$o312$1@dont-email.me>
References: <lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com> <tkp3vm$18b8k$1@dont-email.me>
<lyk03swruk.fsf@void.com> <ly8rk0j9rg.fsf@void.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Injection-Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2022 22:13:49 -0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: reader01.eternal-september.org; posting-host="e7d3ed25720c75666d21589ccc69cf48";
logging-data="789538"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX18YDjafA0dA/oSBwkyWs5rB9YTD8h2I9ZU="
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101
Thunderbird/60.6.1
Cancel-Lock: sha1:dvtJ8HctS+aPTuOwd/9Gsnhd63Y=
X-Antivirus: Avast (VPS 221124-6, 11/24/2022), Outbound message
Content-Language: en-US
X-Antivirus-Status: Clean
In-Reply-To: <ly8rk0j9rg.fsf@void.com>
 by: Snag - Thu, 24 Nov 2022 22:13 UTC

On 11/24/2022 3:57 PM, Richard Smith wrote:
> On my own "weldsmith" website - webpage
>
> http://weldsmith.co.uk/tech/welding/weld_test/macro_etch/221117_alimig_macro1st.html
> "Ali MIG/GMAW 1st-ever macro-etch"
>
> Images of the macro.
> Quite good I venture to reckon.
>

That makes me want to go out and weld something so I can cut it up
and etch it ...
--
Snag
"You can lead a dummy to facts
but you can't make him think."

Re: macro etchant for Ali

<tlp1st$olls$1@dont-email.me>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=6679&group=rec.crafts.metalworking#6679

 copy link   Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader01.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: muratla...@gmail.com (Jim Wilkins)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: macro etchant for Ali
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2022 19:22:10 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <tlp1st$olls$1@dont-email.me>
References: <lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com> <tkp3vm$18b8k$1@dont-email.me> <lyk03swruk.fsf@void.com> <ly8rk0j9rg.fsf@void.com> <tloqas$o312$1@dont-email.me>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain;
format=flowed;
charset="UTF-8";
reply-type=response
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Injection-Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2022 00:22:53 -0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: reader01.eternal-september.org; posting-host="ba7494b19a1ee87cf560b05fdd52d638";
logging-data="808636"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX18+jRWAGMFp9HPJ5VoOrQH4lSPU9jIMuGY="
Cancel-Lock: sha1:etDfVHVJ4CurxCo9a4M3IQACsB4=
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V16.4.3505.912
X-Priority: 3
In-Reply-To: <tloqas$o312$1@dont-email.me>
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
Importance: Normal
X-Antivirus-Status: Clean
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 16.4.3505.912
X-Antivirus: AVG (VPS 221124-6, 11/24/2022), Outbound message
 by: Jim Wilkins - Fri, 25 Nov 2022 00:22 UTC

"Snag" wrote in message news:tloqas$o312$1@dont-email.me...

On 11/24/2022 3:57 PM, Richard Smith wrote:
> On my own "weldsmith" website - webpage
>
> http://weldsmith.co.uk/tech/welding/weld_test/macro_etch/221117_alimig_macro1st.html
> "Ali MIG/GMAW 1st-ever macro-etch"
>
> Images of the macro.
> Quite good I venture to reckon.
>

That makes me want to go out and weld something so I can cut it up
and etch it ...
Snag

-------------------------------
Hardening and tempering steel produce distinctive grain patterns too.

Here is more general info on etching for analysis:
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf/10.1002/9781118960332.app4

Don't try to buy chromic or hydrofluoric acid which are corrosive poisons,
or picric acid which is the WW1 explosive Lyddite. Oxalic acid is in
Barkeepers Friend cleaner. Although they are not a strong acids, it and
citric acid wrap themselves around iron atoms to make them more soluble in
water. That's why Coca Cola (and Army coffee, I found) dissolve rust.

Nital becomes explosive if the HNO3 content exceeds 5%. It's what we used in
the Materials Science course to show the grain of polished steel samples.
Polishing (buffing) minimized the scratches that interfere with seeing grain
boundaries. To make the small and irregular metal sample manageable it was
cast into a plastic disk of standard size to fit the polishing machine and
microscope.

Re: macro etchant for Ali

<pO3gL.89418$kmVf.29128@fx15.iad>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=6680&group=rec.crafts.metalworking#6680

 copy link   Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!usenet.blueworldhosting.com!feed1.usenet.blueworldhosting.com!peer01.iad!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!fx15.iad.POSTED!not-for-mail
Subject: Re: macro etchant for Ali
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
References: <lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com> <tkp3vm$18b8k$1@dont-email.me>
<lyk03swruk.fsf@void.com> <ly8rk0j9rg.fsf@void.com>
From: BobEngel...@comcast.net (Bob Engelhardt)
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101
Thunderbird/52.6.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <ly8rk0j9rg.fsf@void.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Content-Language: en-US
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <pO3gL.89418$kmVf.29128@fx15.iad>
X-Complaints-To: https://www.astraweb.com/aup
NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2022 13:54:29 UTC
Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2022 08:54:28 -0500
X-Received-Bytes: 1428
 by: Bob Engelhardt - Fri, 25 Nov 2022 13:54 UTC

On 11/24/2022 4:57 PM, Richard Smith wrote:
> On my own "weldsmith" website - webpage
>
> http://weldsmith.co.uk/tech/welding/weld_test/macro_etch/221117_alimig_macro1st.html
> "Ali MIG/GMAW 1st-ever macro-etch"
>
> Images of the macro.
> Quite good I venture to reckon.
>

Quite good, I agree.

A note about drain cleaner: there are other ingredients beside NaOH. I
use NaOH as paint stripper & when I tried to substitute drain cleaner,
those other ingredients made a proper mess. I can't say that they would
affect your etching, but you might try pure NaOH to see. The pure stuff
is reasonably available from soap-making supply houses.

Re: macro etchant for Ali

<tlquek$125al$1@dont-email.me>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=6681&group=rec.crafts.metalworking#6681

 copy link   Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader01.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: muratla...@gmail.com (Jim Wilkins)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: macro etchant for Ali
Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2022 12:35:38 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 1
Message-ID: <tlquek$125al$1@dont-email.me>
References: <lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com> <tkp3vm$18b8k$1@dont-email.me> <lyk03swruk.fsf@void.com> <ly8rk0j9rg.fsf@void.com> <pO3gL.89418$kmVf.29128@fx15.iad>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain;
format=flowed;
charset="UTF-8";
reply-type=response
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Injection-Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2022 17:36:20 -0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: reader01.eternal-september.org; posting-host="0e76cbadc1f40112bc676dd4b7ddda94";
logging-data="1119573"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1+IgKLZsBb+BOmb2jW4Uk6a4EQw+a8XNQM="
Cancel-Lock: sha1:IuRyN2sjsteq/0NGlyn7QSje6I4=
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 16.4.3505.912
X-Antivirus: AVG (VPS 221125-2, 11/25/2022), Outbound message
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Antivirus-Status: Clean
Importance: Normal
X-Priority: 3
In-Reply-To: <pO3gL.89418$kmVf.29128@fx15.iad>
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V16.4.3505.912
 by: Jim Wilkins - Fri, 25 Nov 2022 17:35 UTC

"Bob Engelhardt" wrote in message news:pO3gL.89418$kmVf.29128@fx15.iad...

On 11/24/2022 4:57 PM, Richard Smith wrote:
> On my own "weldsmith" website - webpage
>
> http://weldsmith.co.uk/tech/welding/weld_test/macro_etch/221117_alimig_macro1st.html
> "Ali MIG/GMAW 1st-ever macro-etch"
>
> Images of the macro.
> Quite good I venture to reckon.
>

Quite good, I agree.

A note about drain cleaner: there are other ingredients beside NaOH. I
use NaOH as paint stripper & when I tried to substitute drain cleaner,
those other ingredients made a proper mess. I can't say that they would
affect your etching, but you might try pure NaOH to see. The pure stuff
is reasonably available from soap-making supply houses.

-------------------

I haven't seen "Red Devil" for a while, but I recently noticed "Rooto" lye
in white plastic 1 Lb bottles at a local True Value hardware store.

Re: macro etchant for Ali

<lyfse6i2s2.fsf@void.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=6682&group=rec.crafts.metalworking#6682

 copy link   Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!4hhd6LSOAO/7IVynXhoEAg.user.46.165.242.91.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: nul...@void.com (Richard Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: macro etchant for Ali
Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2022 07:38:21 +0000
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID: <lyfse6i2s2.fsf@void.com>
References: <lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com> <tkp3vm$18b8k$1@dont-email.me> <lyk03swruk.fsf@void.com> <ly8rk0j9rg.fsf@void.com> <tloqas$o312$1@dont-email.me> <tlp1st$olls$1@dont-email.me>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Injection-Info: gioia.aioe.org; logging-data="17653"; posting-host="4hhd6LSOAO/7IVynXhoEAg.user.gioia.aioe.org"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@aioe.org";
User-Agent: Gnus/5.11 (Gnus v5.11) Emacs/22.1 (darwin)
Cancel-Lock: sha1:dFTngSw6dsmhaWV/8Y36t47qZdE=
X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.9.2
 by: Richard Smith - Sat, 26 Nov 2022 07:38 UTC

Thanks for your treatment of the topic.
Fantastic information about what works.
Well-judged mention of realistic bounds - what's "no go".
I've done this with Ali at home, but from what I know I'd grant the
"off-limits" for "kitchen" etching you bring into view.

Re: macro etchant for Ali

<ly7czii24i.fsf@void.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=6683&group=rec.crafts.metalworking#6683

 copy link   Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!4hhd6LSOAO/7IVynXhoEAg.user.46.165.242.91.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: nul...@void.com (Richard Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: macro etchant for Ali
Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2022 07:52:29 +0000
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID: <ly7czii24i.fsf@void.com>
References: <lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com> <tkp3vm$18b8k$1@dont-email.me> <lyk03swruk.fsf@void.com> <ly8rk0j9rg.fsf@void.com> <pO3gL.89418$kmVf.29128@fx15.iad> <tlquek$125al$1@dont-email.me>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Injection-Info: gioia.aioe.org; logging-data="26931"; posting-host="4hhd6LSOAO/7IVynXhoEAg.user.gioia.aioe.org"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@aioe.org";
User-Agent: Gnus/5.11 (Gnus v5.11) Emacs/22.1 (darwin)
Cancel-Lock: sha1:gy312iQrIHbPkeunU6AoG4IPVB4=
X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.9.2
 by: Richard Smith - Sat, 26 Nov 2022 07:52 UTC

For any onlooker wondering "why" - why this effort, why this
happiness...

As seen
Snag
Bob Engelhardt

"macro" (macro-etch) is a window into the internal form and structure
of your weld.
Cut across your weld and expose a cross-section; prepare and etch that
cross-section.

Coupled with visual inspection seeing the external surface form, you
have a strong diagnostic tool.
"nick-break" will inspect consistency along a long length of weld, so
that is a valued ready test ("macro" samples one plane at random).
"Visual", "macro" and "nick-break" take you a very long way refining a
weld.

Re: macro etchant for Ali

<tlsua0$1cheq$1@dont-email.me>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=6684&group=rec.crafts.metalworking#6684

 copy link   Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader01.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: muratla...@gmail.com (Jim Wilkins)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: macro etchant for Ali
Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2022 06:45:25 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 1
Message-ID: <tlsua0$1cheq$1@dont-email.me>
References: <lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com> <tkp3vm$18b8k$1@dont-email.me> <lyk03swruk.fsf@void.com> <ly8rk0j9rg.fsf@void.com> <pO3gL.89418$kmVf.29128@fx15.iad> <tlquek$125al$1@dont-email.me> <ly7czii24i.fsf@void.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain;
format=flowed;
charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Injection-Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2022 11:46:08 -0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: reader01.eternal-september.org; posting-host="0acfdc6fce3648cf6ae93673ff211f10";
logging-data="1459674"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1/o5HGfh83ry1n7VwbD+BkrIIcwxSiLHX8="
Cancel-Lock: sha1:oWVOKcnNvzOLP18VkzyYPav7h68=
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 16.4.3505.912
X-Antivirus: AVG (VPS 221126-0, 11/25/2022), Outbound message
In-Reply-To: <ly7czii24i.fsf@void.com>
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V16.4.3505.912
Importance: Normal
X-Antivirus-Status: Clean
X-Priority: 3
 by: Jim Wilkins - Sat, 26 Nov 2022 11:45 UTC

"Richard Smith" wrote in message news:ly7czii24i.fsf@void.com...

For any onlooker wondering "why" - why this effort, why this
happiness...

As seen
Snag
Bob Engelhardt

"macro" (macro-etch) is a window into the internal form and structure
of your weld.
Cut across your weld and expose a cross-section; prepare and etch that
cross-section.

Coupled with visual inspection seeing the external surface form, you
have a strong diagnostic tool.
"nick-break" will inspect consistency along a long length of weld, so
that is a valued ready test ("macro" samples one plane at random).
"Visual", "macro" and "nick-break" take you a very long way refining a
weld.

----------------

There are visible lines both between the parent metal and the rod, which are
different alloys, and also at the apparent depth of passes within the rod
alloy. Are these are crystal size/structure differences due to different
cooling rates?

Re: macro etchant for Ali

<lyo7stwo5l.fsf@void.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=6685&group=rec.crafts.metalworking#6685

 copy link   Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!4hhd6LSOAO/7IVynXhoEAg.user.46.165.242.91.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: nul...@void.com (Richard Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: macro etchant for Ali
Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2022 18:45:10 +0000
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID: <lyo7stwo5l.fsf@void.com>
References: <lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com> <tkp3vm$18b8k$1@dont-email.me> <lyk03swruk.fsf@void.com> <ly8rk0j9rg.fsf@void.com> <pO3gL.89418$kmVf.29128@fx15.iad> <tlquek$125al$1@dont-email.me> <ly7czii24i.fsf@void.com> <tlsua0$1cheq$1@dont-email.me>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Injection-Info: gioia.aioe.org; logging-data="34779"; posting-host="4hhd6LSOAO/7IVynXhoEAg.user.gioia.aioe.org"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@aioe.org";
User-Agent: Gnus/5.11 (Gnus v5.11) Emacs/22.1 (darwin)
Cancel-Lock: sha1:e/EiVD4/+sy5cGpc23IMbYbLPtY=
X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.9.2
 by: Richard Smith - Sat, 26 Nov 2022 18:45 UTC

Simple answer - don't know!
You are reading a lot more into this than I presumed to be able to (!).

Re: macro etchant for Ali

<tlu229$1fbji$1@dont-email.me>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=6688&group=rec.crafts.metalworking#6688

 copy link   Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader01.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: muratla...@gmail.com (Jim Wilkins)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: macro etchant for Ali
Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2022 16:55:43 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 1
Message-ID: <tlu229$1fbji$1@dont-email.me>
References: <lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com> <tkp3vm$18b8k$1@dont-email.me> <lyk03swruk.fsf@void.com> <ly8rk0j9rg.fsf@void.com> <pO3gL.89418$kmVf.29128@fx15.iad> <tlquek$125al$1@dont-email.me> <ly7czii24i.fsf@void.com> <tlsua0$1cheq$1@dont-email.me> <lyo7stwo5l.fsf@void.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain;
format=flowed;
charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Injection-Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2022 21:56:26 -0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: reader01.eternal-september.org; posting-host="9fe8d39ff4e167d11249766c61de22ad";
logging-data="1551986"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX18D5HZlpIIwZBH9Ierhj4/TMTMCiyMEFcc="
Cancel-Lock: sha1:Rr6+xez2n3Q507QJ3yRiXQs+gP4=
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V16.4.3505.912
X-Antivirus-Status: Clean
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 16.4.3505.912
X-Priority: 3
Importance: Normal
In-Reply-To: <lyo7stwo5l.fsf@void.com>
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Antivirus: AVG (VPS 221126-4, 11/26/2022), Outbound message
 by: Jim Wilkins - Sat, 26 Nov 2022 21:55 UTC

"Richard Smith" wrote in message news:lyo7stwo5l.fsf@void.com...

Simple answer - don't know!
You are reading a lot more into this than I presumed to be able to (!).

----------------------

You seem very well informed so I guessed you might know.

https://www.mig-welding.co.uk/wiki/Macro_Etch

Re: macro etchant for Ali

<ly4jujo5xu.fsf@void.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=6693&group=rec.crafts.metalworking#6693

 copy link   Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!4hhd6LSOAO/7IVynXhoEAg.user.46.165.242.91.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: nul...@void.com (Richard Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: macro etchant for Ali
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2022 08:10:21 +0000
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID: <ly4jujo5xu.fsf@void.com>
References: <lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com> <tkp3vm$18b8k$1@dont-email.me> <lyk03swruk.fsf@void.com> <ly8rk0j9rg.fsf@void.com> <pO3gL.89418$kmVf.29128@fx15.iad> <tlquek$125al$1@dont-email.me> <ly7czii24i.fsf@void.com> <tlsua0$1cheq$1@dont-email.me> <lyo7stwo5l.fsf@void.com> <tlu229$1fbji$1@dont-email.me>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Injection-Info: gioia.aioe.org; logging-data="49413"; posting-host="4hhd6LSOAO/7IVynXhoEAg.user.gioia.aioe.org"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@aioe.org";
User-Agent: Gnus/5.11 (Gnus v5.11) Emacs/22.1 (darwin)
Cancel-Lock: sha1:OjgbEIqNLyBCZCMJobhg2TrB3TI=
X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.9.2
 by: Richard Smith - Mon, 28 Nov 2022 08:10 UTC

Funny thing - the "steel" weld looks so incredibly similar to some of
my own macros - for laser+MIG/GMAW-hybrid... About 3kW to 4kW of
laser additional to MIG/GMAW (can't be bothered to look, but doubt
ever laser+FCAW as would have had to deal with the slag when already
difficult enough going in and out of a locked & interlocked vault to
deal with the test-welds).
See
http://weldsmith.co.uk/big_files/thesis_fatgproj_rev111029/fatigue_perform_Tjoint.pdf
sequential page 25 of 48 (numbered page 17) top right-hand-side two

"Monster" penno. not in general useful as engineering design basis -
the strength calculations - would usually be penetration / fusion to
fillet corner.
The cheapness of fillet welds is not just how readily done and robust
of conditions to achieve they are, but also you are very satisfied
with visual inspection only. You are not asking anyone to believe
there is something complex going on deep inside the weldment which
would need and expensive volumetric inspection test to see (typically
Ultrasonic Testing). [there's no way to "pocket" money for not doing
what you are contracted to do with fillet welds - as the external size
you can measure at the surface dictates how much metal you must
deposit, which forces a cost, and you cannot "trouser" money in any
way (you could vindictively do a "not weld" by doing a machine setting
which likely gives only "kissing contact" and weld metal there but no
weld but that wouldn't "trouser" you any money - and that would
show-up on mag-part, which would have you thrown off the job with no
pay having run up expenses)]

Anyway, I'm just looking bemused at the similarity - no suggestion of
anything at all...

Rich S

Re: macro etchant for Ali

<tm3fhp$22m9v$1@dont-email.me>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=6695&group=rec.crafts.metalworking#6695

 copy link   Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader01.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: muratla...@gmail.com (Jim Wilkins)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: macro etchant for Ali
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2022 18:16:31 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 2
Message-ID: <tm3fhp$22m9v$1@dont-email.me>
References: <lyleogaxbh.fsf@void.com> <tkp3vm$18b8k$1@dont-email.me> <lyk03swruk.fsf@void.com> <ly8rk0j9rg.fsf@void.com> <pO3gL.89418$kmVf.29128@fx15.iad> <tlquek$125al$1@dont-email.me> <ly7czii24i.fsf@void.com> <tlsua0$1cheq$1@dont-email.me> <lyo7stwo5l.fsf@void.com> <tlu229$1fbji$1@dont-email.me> <ly4jujo5xu.fsf@void.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain;
format=flowed;
charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Injection-Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2022 23:17:13 -0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: reader01.eternal-september.org; posting-host="9ede2e864de126a66b313feb18ff36ce";
logging-data="2185535"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1/k++bt6g//j2tTEjYfcH5hbNv3xgFHfGw="
Cancel-Lock: sha1:X+cuBksCTvSUwkECKYZBSJwIE5M=
X-Antivirus-Status: Clean
In-Reply-To: <ly4jujo5xu.fsf@void.com>
Importance: Normal
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V16.4.3505.912
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Antivirus: AVG (VPS 221128-4, 11/28/2022), Outbound message
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 16.4.3505.912
 by: Jim Wilkins - Mon, 28 Nov 2022 23:16 UTC

"Richard Smith" wrote in message news:ly4jujo5xu.fsf@void.com...

(you could vindictively do a "not weld" by doing a machine setting
which likely gives only "kissing contact" and weld metal there but no
weld but that wouldn't "trouser" you any money - and that would
show-up on mag-part, which would have you thrown off the job with no
pay having run up expenses)]

---------------------

A sabotage trick by slave labor U-Boot hull welders was to pack most of the
joint with loose welding rod and only cover it on the outsides.

1
server_pubkey.txt

rocksolid light 0.9.7
clearnet tor