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tech / rec.crafts.metalworking / Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on

SubjectAuthor
* Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked onRichard Smith
+* Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked onJim Wilkins
|`* Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat ILeon Fisk
| +* Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked onpyotr filipivich
| |+* Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked onJim Wilkins
| ||`* Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked onpyotr filipivich
| || `- Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked onJim Wilkins
| |`* Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat ILeon Fisk
| | `* Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked onRichard Smith
| |  `* Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked onJim Wilkins
| |   `* Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked onRichard Smith
| |    `- Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked onJim Wilkins
| `* Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked onRichard Smith
|  `* Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked onJim Wilkins
|   `* Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked onRichard Smith
|    `- Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked onJim Wilkins
`- Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat IDavid Billington

1
Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on

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From: nul...@void.com (Richard Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on
Date: Sat, 07 Jan 2023 13:43:31 +0000
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 by: Richard Smith - Sat, 7 Jan 2023 13:43 UTC

Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on.

http://weldsmith.co.uk/tech/marine/221231_fhs/221231_froudehs_eg.html
"Hydrodynamics, Froude number and a clever vessel design"

I knew this in late March 2022, but wrote the article on New Year's
Eve when had a virus and was alone until it passed.

A non-technical friend said "This is >>>*not*<<< trivial!" and helped
me straighten-out the language to try to make the story accessible.

What they have achieved is astonishing.

These boats are about the size they need to be at about 25m length.
But has a speed up 26kt - which should be infeasible - they've
"ripped-up a rule-book".

26kt is the domain of significant-sized military vessels and
hundred-of-metres long streamlined container-ships carrying high-value
time-sensitive fully-manufactured cargoes at premium speed.

The boats are no panacea - they have a very limited application
(eg. their cargo capacity is minimal for their size). But for this
one application of servicing offshore wind-farms they are pretty-much
a panacea. A crucial advantage is they ride the waves by hardly
moving at all, which makes transfer over the bow to wind-turbine
towers do-able in quite fearsome seas.

Regards,
Rich Smith

Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on

<tpcdt8$3ip7k$1@dont-email.me>

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From: muratla...@gmail.com (Jim Wilkins)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on
Date: Sat, 7 Jan 2023 13:32:23 -0500
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 by: Jim Wilkins - Sat, 7 Jan 2023 18:32 UTC

"Richard Smith" wrote in message news:ly7cxysbng.fsf@void.com...

Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on.

http://weldsmith.co.uk/tech/marine/221231_fhs/221231_froudehs_eg.html
"Hydrodynamics, Froude number and a clever vessel design"

I knew this in late March 2022, but wrote the article on New Year's
Eve when had a virus and was alone until it passed.

A non-technical friend said "This is >>>*not*<<< trivial!" and helped
me straighten-out the language to try to make the story accessible.

What they have achieved is astonishing.

These boats are about the size they need to be at about 25m length.
But has a speed up 26kt - which should be infeasible - they've
"ripped-up a rule-book".

26kt is the domain of significant-sized military vessels and
hundred-of-metres long streamlined container-ships carrying high-value
time-sensitive fully-manufactured cargoes at premium speed.

The boats are no panacea - they have a very limited application
(eg. their cargo capacity is minimal for their size). But for this
one application of servicing offshore wind-farms they are pretty-much
a panacea. A crucial advantage is they ride the waves by hardly
moving at all, which makes transfer over the bow to wind-turbine
towers do-able in quite fearsome seas.

Regards,
Rich Smith
---------------------

The RMS Mauretania needed to be very narrow and 240 meters long to cross the
Atlantic at 26 kts, a record she held for 20 years. Although ~100 feet
longer, RMS Titanic was designed for less extravagant fuel consumption and
did 22 kts.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_destroyer_Shimakaze_(1942)
126 meter waterline length, 40 kt speed, but it didn't protect her from 400
kt aircraft.

In a print article about a racing boat attempt to set the Atlantic crossing
record they joked that they might still need a rear view mirror to show an
overtaking USN aircraft carrier.

The 5 meter (16') long Hobie Cat sailboat can reach around 23~24 kts.

The old-time clipper ship speed record is 22 kts, and fast sailing ships may
return:

https://www.businessinsider.com/coffee-company-cargo-sailboats-instead-of-container-ships-sustainable-shipping-2022-8

Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on

<tpcg2r$3ii58$1@dont-email.me>

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From: lfis...@gmail.invalid (Leon Fisk)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I
worked on
Date: Sat, 7 Jan 2023 15:10:52 -0400
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 by: Leon Fisk - Sat, 7 Jan 2023 19:10 UTC

On Sat, 7 Jan 2023 13:32:23 -0500
"Jim Wilkins" <muratlanne@gmail.com> wrote:

<snip>
>https://www.businessinsider.com/coffee-company-cargo-sailboats-instead-of-container-ships-sustainable-shipping-2022-8

I remember hearing of hybrid sailing cargo ships coming soon years ago.
Seems like a good idea to me but doesn't seem to gain much
traction...

We have a car ferry not too far away in Muskegon, MI that claims it can
hit 34kn (39mph):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HSC_Lake_Express

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI

Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on

<tpcgj8$3j1gn$1@dont-email.me>

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From: djb...@invalid.com (David Billington)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I
worked on
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 by: David Billington - Sat, 7 Jan 2023 19:19 UTC

On 07/01/2023 13:43, Richard Smith wrote:
> Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on.
>
> http://weldsmith.co.uk/tech/marine/221231_fhs/221231_froudehs_eg.html
> "Hydrodynamics, Froude number and a clever vessel design"
>
> I knew this in late March 2022, but wrote the article on New Year's
> Eve when had a virus and was alone until it passed.
>
> A non-technical friend said "This is >>>*not*<<< trivial!" and helped
> me straighten-out the language to try to make the story accessible.
>
> What they have achieved is astonishing.
>
> These boats are about the size they need to be at about 25m length.
> But has a speed up 26kt - which should be infeasible - they've
> "ripped-up a rule-book".
>
> 26kt is the domain of significant-sized military vessels and
> hundred-of-metres long streamlined container-ships carrying high-value
> time-sensitive fully-manufactured cargoes at premium speed.
>
> The boats are no panacea - they have a very limited application
> (eg. their cargo capacity is minimal for their size). But for this
> one application of servicing offshore wind-farms they are pretty-much
> a panacea. A crucial advantage is they ride the waves by hardly
> moving at all, which makes transfer over the bow to wind-turbine
> towers do-able in quite fearsome seas.
>
> Regards,
> Rich Smith

Wiki mentions long slender hulls can exceed the traditional hull speed
see here
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hull_speed#Hull_design_implications . I
guess that's why the ship can go as fast as it does.

Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on

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From: pha...@mindspring.com (pyotr filipivich)
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Subject: Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on
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 by: pyotr filipivich - Sat, 7 Jan 2023 21:23 UTC

Leon Fisk <lfiskgr@gmail.invalid> on Sat, 7 Jan 2023 15:10:52 -0400
typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
>On Sat, 7 Jan 2023 13:32:23 -0500
>"Jim Wilkins" <muratlanne@gmail.com> wrote:
>
><snip>
>>https://www.businessinsider.com/coffee-company-cargo-sailboats-instead-of-container-ships-sustainable-shipping-2022-8
>
>I remember hearing of hybrid sailing cargo ships coming soon years ago.
>Seems like a good idea to me but doesn't seem to gain much
>traction...

The issue remains as it always has: schedules, and "time
sensitive" cargos. If you're moving bulk cargo, it can make sense.
But with "just in time" global supply chains, "it positively
absolutely has to be there in two months".
Like wise, as cool as it might be to take a cruise on a sailing
ship, there is the small issue of "T be back at work, I have to catch
a flight in 10 days. Arriving on the next tide doesn't cut it."
(I had a friend who took Amtrak to Disneyland, and flew back. The
train was delayed, so 'half' the first day at Disneyland was lost
because the train was late. If there is a next time, she'll fly down,
and take the train back. Amtrak is by and large about the trip, more
than getting there.)
--
pyotr filipivich
"With Age comes Wisdom. Although far too often, Age travels alone."

Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on

<lyeds66l86.fsf@void.com>

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From: nul...@void.com (Richard Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on
Date: Sat, 07 Jan 2023 22:19:53 +0000
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 by: Richard Smith - Sat, 7 Jan 2023 22:19 UTC

Leon Fisk <lfiskgr@gmail.invalid> writes:

>> ...
> We have a car ferry not too far away in Muskegon, MI that claims it can
> hit 34kn (39mph):
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HSC_Lake_Express

That's also escaping the Froude hull-speed concept.

(mps2knot
(v-from-froude-number 0.4 9.81 58.40) ;; 9.574165237763552 ;; m/s
) ;; 18.610688367142973 ;; kt

It was exciting for me to work out this, but it is obvious - make a
catamaran with largely submerged hulls and you start with a new
hydrodynamic "rulle-book".

Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on

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From: muratla...@gmail.com (Jim Wilkins)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on
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 by: Jim Wilkins - Sat, 7 Jan 2023 22:27 UTC

"pyotr filipivich" wrote in message
news:u0ojrh5rlqjdn0046p059jrbb7sck3aeed@4ax.com...

Leon Fisk <lfiskgr@gmail.invalid> on Sat, 7 Jan 2023 15:10:52 -0400
typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
>On Sat, 7 Jan 2023 13:32:23 -0500
>"Jim Wilkins" <muratlanne@gmail.com> wrote:
>
><snip>
>>https://www.businessinsider.com/coffee-company-cargo-sailboats-instead-of-container-ships-sustainable-shipping-2022-8
>
>I remember hearing of hybrid sailing cargo ships coming soon years ago.
>Seems like a good idea to me but doesn't seem to gain much
>traction...

The issue remains as it always has: schedules, and "time
sensitive" cargos. If you're moving bulk cargo, it can make sense.
But with "just in time" global supply chains, "it positively
absolutely has to be there in two months".
Like wise, as cool as it might be to take a cruise on a sailing
ship, there is the small issue of "T be back at work, I have to catch
a flight in 10 days. Arriving on the next tide doesn't cut it."
(I had a friend who took Amtrak to Disneyland, and flew back. The
train was delayed, so 'half' the first day at Disneyland was lost
because the train was late. If there is a next time, she'll fly down,
and take the train back. Amtrak is by and large about the trip, more
than getting there.)
--
pyotr filipivich
"With Age comes Wisdom. Although far too often, Age travels alone."

--------------------------

A well publicized local effort to revive wooden sailing cargo ships did not
end well.
https://www.hrmm.org/history-blog/media-monday-coaster-a-true-story-of-the-john-f-leavitt-1983

Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on

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From: muratla...@gmail.com (Jim Wilkins)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on
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 by: Jim Wilkins - Sat, 7 Jan 2023 23:08 UTC

"Richard Smith" wrote in message news:lyeds66l86.fsf@void.com...

Leon Fisk <lfiskgr@gmail.invalid> writes:

>> ...
> We have a car ferry not too far away in Muskegon, MI that claims it can
> hit 34kn (39mph):
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HSC_Lake_Express

That's also escaping the Froude hull-speed concept.

(mps2knot
(v-from-froude-number 0.4 9.81 58.40) ;; 9.574165237763552 ;; m/s
) ;; 18.610688367142973 ;; kt

It was exciting for me to work out this, but it is obvious - make a
catamaran with largely submerged hulls and you start with a new
hydrodynamic "rulle-book".

-------------------------------

These creatures know the rules:
https://www.thoughtco.com/worlds-fastest-fish-2291602

I was just reading about what is the fastest animal. Apparently the record
of 242 MPH is shared by a sky diver and his pet peregrine.

Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on

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From: pha...@mindspring.com (pyotr filipivich)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on
Date: Sat, 07 Jan 2023 18:57:55 -0800
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 by: pyotr filipivich - Sun, 8 Jan 2023 02:57 UTC

"Jim Wilkins" <muratlanne@gmail.com> on Sat, 7 Jan 2023 17:27:53 -0500
typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
>"pyotr filipivich" wrote in message
>news:u0ojrh5rlqjdn0046p059jrbb7sck3aeed@4ax.com...
>
>Leon Fisk <lfiskgr@gmail.invalid> on Sat, 7 Jan 2023 15:10:52 -0400
>typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
>>On Sat, 7 Jan 2023 13:32:23 -0500
>>"Jim Wilkins" <muratlanne@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>><snip>
>>>https://www.businessinsider.com/coffee-company-cargo-sailboats-instead-of-container-ships-sustainable-shipping-2022-8
>>
>>I remember hearing of hybrid sailing cargo ships coming soon years ago.
>>Seems like a good idea to me but doesn't seem to gain much
>>traction...
>
>The issue remains as it always has: schedules, and "time
>sensitive" cargos. If you're moving bulk cargo, it can make sense.
>But with "just in time" global supply chains, "it positively
>absolutely has to be there in two months".
>Like wise, as cool as it might be to take a cruise on a sailing
>ship, there is the small issue of "T be back at work, I have to catch
>a flight in 10 days. Arriving on the next tide doesn't cut it."
>(I had a friend who took Amtrak to Disneyland, and flew back. The
>train was delayed, so 'half' the first day at Disneyland was lost
>because the train was late. If there is a next time, she'll fly down,
>and take the train back. Amtrak is by and large about the trip, more
>than getting there.)
>--
>pyotr filipivich
>"With Age comes Wisdom. Although far too often, Age travels alone."
>
>--------------------------
>
>A well publicized local effort to revive wooden sailing cargo ships did not
>end well.
>https://www.hrmm.org/history-blog/media-monday-coaster-a-true-story-of-the-john-f-leavitt-1983

Ufda. There were reasons one didn't sail in winter if one could
avoid it.
--
pyotr filipivich
"With Age comes Wisdom. Although far too often, Age travels alone."

Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on

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From: nul...@void.com (Richard Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on
Date: Sun, 08 Jan 2023 06:58:05 +0000
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 by: Richard Smith - Sun, 8 Jan 2023 06:58 UTC

Fully submerged and that is a completely new hydrodynamic "rule book".

Submarines - military application - they go to enormous lengths to
optimise form, I gather. Liquid helium test tanks for scale models,
etc.

Fish - well, didn't know of these. They must be super-efficient.
Puts our "swimming" in perspective. Feels good though on a warm
summer's day... :-)

Everyone - I have to accept that I learned a lot and contributed
little writing that article.

You've caused me to look-around, recalling the Irish Sea service, and
with one thing and another I come to
Incat
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incat

I think I have handled cut Ali profiles for ships which have come from
Australia...

Seems there's been quite a lot of twin-hulls around slicing the water
efficiently since at minimum the 1990's.

Regards,

"Jim Wilkins" <muratlanne@gmail.com> writes:

> "Richard Smith" wrote in message news:lyeds66l86.fsf@void.com...
>
> Leon Fisk <lfiskgr@gmail.invalid> writes:
>
>>> ...
>> We have a car ferry not too far away in Muskegon, MI that claims it can
>> hit 34kn (39mph):
>>
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HSC_Lake_Express
>
> That's also escaping the Froude hull-speed concept.
>
> (mps2knot
> (v-from-froude-number 0.4 9.81 58.40) ;; 9.574165237763552 ;; m/s
> ) ;; 18.610688367142973 ;; kt
>
> It was exciting for me to work out this, but it is obvious - make a
> catamaran with largely submerged hulls and you start with a new
> hydrodynamic "rulle-book".
>
> -------------------------------
>
> These creatures know the rules:
> https://www.thoughtco.com/worlds-fastest-fish-2291602
>
> I was just reading about what is the fastest animal. Apparently the
> record of 242 MPH is shared by a sky diver and his pet peregrine.

Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on

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 by: Jim Wilkins - Sun, 8 Jan 2023 11:48 UTC

"Richard Smith" wrote in message news:lylemdikci.fsf@void.com...

Fish - well, didn't know of these. They must be super-efficient.
Puts our "swimming" in perspective. Feels good though on a warm
summer's day... :-)

------------------

In the 1600's Samuel Pepys described a proper underwater hull shape as
having the form of a codfish.

Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on

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 by: Jim Wilkins - Sun, 8 Jan 2023 12:10 UTC

"pyotr filipivich" wrote in message
news:3qbkrhl3itpid46uovfg9ejrfk828ls4v1@4ax.com...
>
>A well publicized local effort to revive wooden sailing cargo ships did not
>end well.
>https://www.hrmm.org/history-blog/media-monday-coaster-a-true-story-of-the-john-f-leavitt-1983

Ufda. There were reasons one didn't sail in winter if one could
avoid it.
pyotr filipivich

----------------------------

There are reasons other New Englanders call Maine residents "Mainiacs".

Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on

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From: lfis...@gmail.invalid (Leon Fisk)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I
worked on
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 by: Leon Fisk - Sun, 8 Jan 2023 14:06 UTC

On Sat, 07 Jan 2023 13:23:24 -0800
pyotr filipivich <phamp@mindspring.com> wrote:

<snip>
>Like wise, as cool as it might be to take a cruise on a sailing
>ship, there is the small issue of "T be back at work, I have to catch
>a flight in 10 days. Arriving on the next tide doesn't cut it."
<snip>

I quickly learned that taking very busy time constrained vacations
wasn't for me. Always planned an extra day to both start and end.
Didn't try to fit a whole bunch of must sees together...

The job hassle was knowing there would be a bunch of stuff waiting for
me when I got back. Because there was nobody else that could do them
while I was away. Which was better than having to smooth over the ones
where they did send someone who screwed up...

I never really thought that I was that good but rather that the others
didn't care or try that hard. Pay was the same either way...

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI

Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on

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From: nul...@void.com (Richard Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on
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 by: Richard Smith - Mon, 9 Jan 2023 08:00 UTC

Leon Fisk <lfiskgr@gmail.invalid> writes:

> On Sat, 07 Jan 2023 13:23:24 -0800
> pyotr filipivich <phamp@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
> <snip>
>>Like wise, as cool as it might be to take a cruise on a sailing
>>ship, there is the small issue of "T be back at work, I have to catch
>>a flight in 10 days. Arriving on the next tide doesn't cut it."
> <snip>
>
> I quickly learned that taking very busy time constrained vacations
> wasn't for me. Always planned an extra day to both start and end.
> Didn't try to fit a whole bunch of must sees together...
>
> The job hassle was knowing there would be a bunch of stuff waiting for
> me when I got back. Because there was nobody else that could do them
> while I was away. Which was better than having to smooth over the ones
> where they did send someone who screwed up...
>
> I never really thought that I was that good but rather that the others
> didn't care or try that hard. Pay was the same either way...
>
> --
> Leon Fisk
> Grand Rapids MI

You eloquently describe in few words the entirety of how things do and
don't work.

There's those who believe systems deliver (many - from "managerialists" to "communists" they all share that core belief)
There's those who believe individuals deliver (not many, and you'd find them here :-) )

Best wishes everyone,

Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on

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 by: Jim Wilkins - Mon, 9 Jan 2023 14:00 UTC

"Richard Smith" wrote in message news:lyy1qcw30n.fsf@void.com...

There's those who believe systems deliver (many - from "managerialists" to
"communists" they all share that core belief)
There's those who believe individuals deliver (not many, and you'd find them
here :-) )
------------------

After my father was chosen for a high level position in NH State government
he took management classes and told me what he'd learned. One was that many
skills and tasks could be treated as commodities, like hiring a temporary
plumber or welder or tax preparer. The unstated assumption is that the
hiring person can distinguish good from bad candidates for a job they can't
do themselves. We cynically say those who can, do, those who can't, teach.

He had come up the hard way, from barefoot farm boy to cotton mill worker to
the mill's cost accountant, and during WW2 was pushed hard into Officer
Candidate School and became a Company Commander in the Air Corps, so he knew
better from his own experience. But that was the accepted wisdom.

I wonder how business school professors would like being treated as equally
paid interchangeable commodities, with their individual accomplishments (or
lack of them) ignored, the way proponents of social equity demand of
students. The socialists have no rational answer to why Asians do so much
better here than other historically disadvantaged minorities.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2022/04/mit-admissions-reinstates-sat-act-tests/629455/

Social pressure to not achieve more than and embarrass your peers:
http://www.cnam.com/people-like-us/film/dana.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acting_white

As an Army sergeant with a college degree I had to learn to "code switch" to
the level of the troops.
https://www.health.com/mind-body/health-diversity-inclusion/code-switching
I wasn't really aware of it until I was translating directions for friends
from a German girl who asked why I mispronounced "Mannheim" in English but
not German.

Everything I see from the Left appears based only on wanting to feel
superior without the effort. When they have the opportunity to actually
accomplish what they demand they change the subject instead. Do you see them
drying their laundry on clotheslines to reduce their fossil fuel
consumption? Are they teaching legal immigrants English or helping the
homeless gain life skills?

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From: nul...@void.com (Richard Smith)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on
Date: Mon, 09 Jan 2023 16:32:01 +0000
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 by: Richard Smith - Mon, 9 Jan 2023 16:32 UTC

"Jim Wilkins" <muratlanne@gmail.com> writes:

> ... The unstated assumption is that the
> hiring person can distinguish good from bad candidates for a job they can't
> do themselves. ...

The founding tenet of "management".

Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on

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From: muratla...@gmail.com (Jim Wilkins)
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking
Subject: Re: Article - application of "Froude Number" analysing a boat I worked on
Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2023 12:22:07 -0500
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 by: Jim Wilkins - Mon, 9 Jan 2023 17:22 UTC

"Richard Smith" wrote in message news:ly1qo31xfi.fsf@void.com...

"Jim Wilkins" <muratlanne@gmail.com> writes:

> ... The unstated assumption is that the
> hiring person can distinguish good from bad candidates for a job they
> can't
> do themselves. ...

The founding tenet of "management".

-----------------

So they go with what they know and select the smoothest talker, repeatedly,
until they happen on one who can also do the job. I spent 9 years doing the
work of two techs because they couldn't find another with my combination of
experience and abilities. Some of the most skilled artisans I've known were
the least articulate.

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