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tech / sci.electronics.design / Re: Any Tesla driver here?

SubjectAuthor
* Any Tesla driver here?Jeroen Belleman
+* Re: Any Tesla driver here?John Larkin
|`* Re: Any Tesla driver here?Ricky
| +* Re: Any Tesla driver here?Cydrome Leader
| |+* Re: Any Tesla driver here?John Larkin
| ||`* Re: Any Tesla driver here?bitrex
| || +* Re: Any Tesla driver here?bitrex
| || |+* Re: Any Tesla driver here?Ricky
| || ||`* Re: Any Tesla driver here?bitrex
| || || `- Re: Any Tesla driver here?Ricky
| || |`* Re: Any Tesla driver here?Don Y
| || | `* Re: Any Tesla driver here?Cydrome Leader
| || |  `* Re: Any Tesla driver here?Phil Hobbs
| || |   +* Re: Any Tesla driver here?Cydrome Leader
| || |   |`- Re: Any Tesla driver here?Ricky
| || |   `- Re: Any Tesla driver here?Ricky
| || `- Re: Any Tesla driver here?rbowman
| |`* Re: Any Tesla driver here?Ricky
| | `* Re: Any Tesla driver here?Jeroen Belleman
| |  `- Re: Any Tesla driver here?Don Y
| `* Re: Any Tesla driver here?Cursitor Doom
|  `- Re: Any Tesla driver here?DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno
+- Re: Any Tesla driver here?Ricky
+* Re: Any Tesla driver here?Martin Brown
|+- Re: Any Tesla driver here?Phil Hobbs
|`* Re: Any Tesla driver here?Cursitor Doom
| +- Re: Any Tesla driver here?Ricky
| +- Re: Any Tesla driver here?DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno
| `* Re: Any Tesla driver here?John Doe
|  `* Re: Any Tesla driver here?Edward Hernandez
|   `* Re: Any Tesla driver here?John Doe
|    `- Re: Any Tesla driver here?Edward Hernandez
+* Re: Any Tesla driver here?Don Y
|`* Re: Any Tesla driver here?Jasen Betts
| `- Re: Any Tesla driver here?Don Y
+* Re: Any Tesla driver here?Jeff Layman
|`- Re: Any Tesla driver here?Don Y
+* Re: Any Tesla driver here?bitrex
|+* Re: Any Tesla driver here?jlarkin
||`* Re: Any Tesla driver here?Joe Gwinn
|| +* Re: Any Tesla driver here?Ricky
|| |`* Re: Any Tesla driver here?Lasse Langwadt Christensen
|| | `- Re: Any Tesla driver here?Ricky
|| `- Re: Any Tesla driver here?John Doe
|`* Re: Any Tesla driver here?jlarkin
| +* Re: Any Tesla driver here?bitrex
| |`* Re: Any Tesla driver here?jlarkin
| | `* Re: Any Tesla driver here?bitrex
| |  `* Re: Any Tesla driver here?jlarkin
| |   +* Re: Any Tesla driver here?bitrex
| |   |`- Re: Any Tesla driver here?Lasse Langwadt Christensen
| |   `- Re: Any Tesla driver here?bitrex
| `- Re: Any Tesla driver here?Ricky
+* Re: Any Tesla driver here?bitrex
|`- Re: Any Tesla driver here?Ricky
`- Re: Any Tesla driver here?John Doe

Pages:123
Any Tesla driver here?

<t660hr$1714$1@gioia.aioe.org>

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From: jer...@nospam.please (Jeroen Belleman)
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Any Tesla driver here?
Date: Thu, 19 May 2022 19:59:23 +0200
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 by: Jeroen Belleman - Thu, 19 May 2022 17:59 UTC

Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
to move. Don't you love modern cars?

Comments?

Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word-- Belleman

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

<r02d8h53i53olj0gr6u8ms78srhkiolpli@4ax.com>

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From: jlar...@highland_atwork_technology.com (John Larkin)
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: Any Tesla driver here?
Date: Thu, 19 May 2022 11:36:02 -0700
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 by: John Larkin - Thu, 19 May 2022 18:36 UTC

On Thu, 19 May 2022 19:59:23 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
<jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

>Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
>someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
>button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
>you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
>to move. Don't you love modern cars?
>
>Comments?
>
>Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word-- Belleman

With luck, the microprocessor shortage will drive the car designers
back to using knobs that you can grab and turn without taking your
eyes off the road.

Or just common sense will do it.

--

If a man will begin with certainties, he shall end with doubts,
but if he will be content to begin with doubts he shall end in certainties.
Francis Bacon

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

<bae6532a-093f-480a-88a1-3c32bc3e7e80n@googlegroups.com>

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Subject: Re: Any Tesla driver here?
From: gnuarm.d...@gmail.com (Ricky)
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 by: Ricky - Thu, 19 May 2022 19:58 UTC

On Thursday, May 19, 2022 at 1:59:34 PM UTC-4, Jeroen Belleman wrote:
> Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
> someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
> button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
> you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
> to move. Don't you love modern cars?

Are you sure you are talking about a Tesla? I have the model X which has no hatches. It has doors and a tailgate/trunk and a frunk (front trunk). I can close any of them by pushing them shut. I do that on the frunk because it doesn't close itself, but have done it on the tail gate because it is super cautious to not harm anyone and often only needs to push something a tiny bit out of the way. If it won't, and I know what's wrong, I push it closed and drive off. I've closed the doors by hand as well.

What are you talking about? I think the model X is the only Tesla that closes it's own doors and tailgate.

Where did you hear about this?

--

Rick C.

- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

<784936e9-2348-432b-9d85-3c1acdc5d4f0n@googlegroups.com>

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Subject: Re: Any Tesla driver here?
From: gnuarm.d...@gmail.com (Ricky)
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 by: Ricky - Thu, 19 May 2022 19:59 UTC

On Thursday, May 19, 2022 at 2:36:14 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
> On Thu, 19 May 2022 19:59:23 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
> <jer...@nospam.please> wrote:
>
> >Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
> >someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
> >button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
> >you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
> >to move. Don't you love modern cars?
> >
> >Comments?
> >
> >Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word-- Belleman
> With luck, the microprocessor shortage will drive the car designers
> back to using knobs that you can grab and turn without taking your
> eyes off the road.
>
> Or just common sense will do it.

The reason they don't have a choice is the proliferation of controls. Cars are becoming far too complex to put buttons on the dash for everything.

--

Rick C.

+ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
+ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

<t66bcq$9kp$1@gioia.aioe.org>

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From: '''newsp...@nonad.co.uk (Martin Brown)
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: Any Tesla driver here?
Date: Thu, 19 May 2022 22:04:24 +0100
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 by: Martin Brown - Thu, 19 May 2022 21:04 UTC

On 19/05/2022 18:59, Jeroen Belleman wrote:
> Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
> someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
> button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
> you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
> to move. Don't you love modern cars?
>
> Comments?
>
> Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word-- Belleman

Even in the pre smartphone with everything era I have had a fairly high
end car decide to freeze on me because it suddenly thought it had been
stolen and on a roundabout at rush hour. The only thing that could be
done was push it to the side of the road and await rescue. Immobilisers
were quite new and little understood back then. I expect the thieves
understood them batter than anyone else!

Roadside assistance couldn't do anything with it beyond dragging it onto
a tow away truck. It came back with the immobiliser reset and "no fault
found" from the dealer. It didn't ever do it again which was a bonus.

I discovered the hard way after parking in a very tight spot in an
underground carpark that entering the car by the passenger door and then
trying to start the car would also set off the alarm.

Luckily there was just enough room to open the drivers side door to
satisfy the stupid magnetic door sensor (but barely enough to get a
piece of paper through the resulting crack in the door).

Another that got me on a test drive (take home for the weekend to try)
was a Saab where you cannot get the keys out of ignition unless you put
the damn thing into reverse gear. The fleet manager forgot to tell me
that crucial detail - lucky we had a secure garage at home.

The only thing it did well was driving at speed on cobbled streets.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

<6f873e97-2809-4dce-142d-69d25576b2f7@electrooptical.net>

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From: pcdhSpam...@electrooptical.net (Phil Hobbs)
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: Any Tesla driver here?
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 by: Phil Hobbs - Thu, 19 May 2022 21:15 UTC

Martin Brown wrote:
> On 19/05/2022 18:59, Jeroen Belleman wrote:
>> Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
>> someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
>> button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
>> you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
>> to move. Don't you love modern cars?
>>
>> Comments?
>>
>> Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word-- Belleman
>
> Even in the pre smartphone with everything era I have had a fairly high
> end car decide to freeze on me because it suddenly thought it had been
> stolen and on a roundabout at rush hour. The only thing that could be
> done was push it to the side of the road and await rescue. Immobilisers
> were quite new and little understood back then. I expect the thieves
> understood them batter than anyone else!
>
> Roadside assistance couldn't do anything with it beyond dragging it onto
> a tow away truck. It came back with the immobiliser reset and "no fault
> found" from the dealer. It didn't ever do it again which was a bonus.
>
> I discovered the hard way after parking in a very tight spot in an
> underground carpark that entering the car by the passenger door and then
> trying to start the car would also set off the alarm.
>
> Luckily there was just enough room to open the drivers side door to
> satisfy the stupid magnetic door sensor (but barely enough to get a
> piece of paper through the resulting crack in the door).
>
> Another that got me on a test drive (take home for the weekend to try)
> was a Saab where you cannot get the keys out of ignition unless you put
> the damn thing into reverse gear. The fleet manager forgot to tell me
> that crucial detail - lucky we had a secure garage at home.
>
> The only thing it did well was driving at speed on cobbled streets.
>

Yeah, I like cars that do as they're damn well told. I drive a 2012
convertible Mustang that has a manual transmission and none of that
other crap, and intend to keep it going till I die.

Failing that, I might switch to something that's easy to get parts for,
such as a 1972 Chevelle.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

<t66e0p$9gp$1@reader1.panix.com>

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From: prese...@MUNGEpanix.com (Cydrome Leader)
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: Any Tesla driver here?
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 by: Cydrome Leader - Thu, 19 May 2022 21:49 UTC

Ricky <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Thursday, May 19, 2022 at 2:36:14 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
>> On Thu, 19 May 2022 19:59:23 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
>> <jer...@nospam.please> wrote:
>>
>> >Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
>> >someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
>> >button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
>> >you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
>> >to move. Don't you love modern cars?
>> >
>> >Comments?
>> >
>> >Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word-- Belleman
>> With luck, the microprocessor shortage will drive the car designers
>> back to using knobs that you can grab and turn without taking your
>> eyes off the road.
>>
>> Or just common sense will do it.
>
> The reason they don't have a choice is the proliferation of controls. Cars are becoming far too complex to put buttons on the dash for everything.

Most of those controls are not necessary in the first place.

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

<tuhd8hlchh0uh6q1ksljlrc141k94s884d@4ax.com>

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 by: John Larkin - Thu, 19 May 2022 22:42 UTC

On Thu, 19 May 2022 21:49:14 -0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
<presence@MUNGEpanix.com> wrote:

>Ricky <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Thursday, May 19, 2022 at 2:36:14 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
>>> On Thu, 19 May 2022 19:59:23 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
>>> <jer...@nospam.please> wrote:
>>>
>>> >Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
>>> >someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
>>> >button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
>>> >you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
>>> >to move. Don't you love modern cars?
>>> >
>>> >Comments?
>>> >
>>> >Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word-- Belleman
>>> With luck, the microprocessor shortage will drive the car designers
>>> back to using knobs that you can grab and turn without taking your
>>> eyes off the road.
>>>
>>> Or just common sense will do it.
>>
>> The reason they don't have a choice is the proliferation of controls. Cars are becoming far too complex to put buttons on the dash for everything.
>
>Most of those controls are not necessary in the first place.
>

Right. It's a car.

--

If a man will begin with certainties, he shall end with doubts,
but if he will be content to begin with doubts he shall end in certainties.
Francis Bacon

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

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Subject: Re: Any Tesla driver here?
Date: Thu, 19 May 2022 18:32:49 -0700
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 by: Don Y - Fri, 20 May 2022 01:32 UTC

On 5/19/2022 10:59 AM, Jeroen Belleman wrote:
> Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
> someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
> button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
> you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
> to move. Don't you love modern cars?
>
> Comments?
>
> Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word-- Belleman

That's some stupid PHB's notion (or, some consultant hired by same)
of how things should work. I'm sure there is formal language
that defines that behavior -- for *some* reason (which MAY make
sense but likely isn't intuitive to the driver/user)

Many SUVs complain if the hatchback is left open. How do you
transport an "oversize load" if you can't leave the item
hanging out the ass end of the vehicle? (buy a truck, instead?)
You can trip the sensor in the latch -- but then you're still
faced with the problem of holding the hatch "partially closed"
(there's often nothing to "tie onto" on the hatch!)

SWMBO's vehicle has the controls for the seat heaters located on the
center console. So, if you ever set anything on it (e.g., her purse),
you will likely turn one or both on. You won't see the VISUAL indicator
that tells you this -- because it has been covered by the object.
Instead, you'll eventually feel the seat getting unusually warm...

The car is smart enough to remember which the positions we each prefer
for the driver's seat (but not the passenger's! :< ). And, our
music preferences, station presets, order in which we like to see
audio sources listed, etc. *BUT*, always sets the entertainment
system to the state it was in when the car was last driven -- regardless
of the driver! (so "her" radio station will be selected even if it
doesn't exist in my presets -- and, I was listening to a specific MP3
when I last drove the vehicle.

*Someone* had to make a conscious decision as to where these
controls would be sited, how implemented and their overall behavior.
You'd assume companies with the resources of car manufacturers would
have smarter people making those decisions!

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

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 by: bitrex - Fri, 20 May 2022 01:39 UTC

On 5/19/2022 6:42 PM, John Larkin wrote:
> On Thu, 19 May 2022 21:49:14 -0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
> <presence@MUNGEpanix.com> wrote:
>
>> Ricky <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Thursday, May 19, 2022 at 2:36:14 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 19 May 2022 19:59:23 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
>>>> <jer...@nospam.please> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
>>>>> someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
>>>>> button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
>>>>> you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
>>>>> to move. Don't you love modern cars?
>>>>>
>>>>> Comments?
>>>>>
>>>>> Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word-- Belleman
>>>> With luck, the microprocessor shortage will drive the car designers
>>>> back to using knobs that you can grab and turn without taking your
>>>> eyes off the road.
>>>>
>>>> Or just common sense will do it.
>>>
>>> The reason they don't have a choice is the proliferation of controls. Cars are becoming far too complex to put buttons on the dash for everything.
>>
>> Most of those controls are not necessary in the first place.
>>
>
> Right. It's a car.
>

An option on I believe the Mercedes Benz E class coupe for 2022 is a
cabin fragrance management system. You put the Mercedes Benz-brand
fragrance vials in your choice of scents into the locking,
LED-illuminated fragrance injector unit at the back of the glove
compartment.

Mind you to my reading this option doesn't use the existing HVAC ducting
to manage fragrance, it has its own set of fragrance-management blowers
and ductwork.

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

<iqChK.488$NAs.347@fx04.iad>

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 by: bitrex - Fri, 20 May 2022 01:46 UTC

On 5/19/2022 9:39 PM, bitrex wrote:
> On 5/19/2022 6:42 PM, John Larkin wrote:
>> On Thu, 19 May 2022 21:49:14 -0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
>> <presence@MUNGEpanix.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Ricky <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Thursday, May 19, 2022 at 2:36:14 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
>>>>> On Thu, 19 May 2022 19:59:23 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
>>>>> <jer...@nospam.please> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
>>>>>> someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
>>>>>> button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
>>>>>> you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
>>>>>> to move. Don't you love modern cars?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Comments?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word-- Belleman
>>>>> With luck, the microprocessor shortage will drive the car designers
>>>>> back to using knobs that you can grab and turn without taking your
>>>>> eyes off the road.
>>>>>
>>>>> Or just common sense will do it.
>>>>
>>>> The reason they don't have a choice is the proliferation of
>>>> controls.  Cars are becoming far too complex to put buttons on the
>>>> dash for everything.
>>>
>>> Most of those controls are not necessary in the first place.
>>>
>>
>> Right. It's a car.
>>
>
> An option on I believe the Mercedes Benz E class coupe for 2022 is a
> cabin fragrance management system. You put the Mercedes Benz-brand
> fragrance vials in your choice of scents into the locking,
> LED-illuminated fragrance injector unit at the back of the glove
> compartment.
>
> Mind you to my reading this option doesn't use the existing HVAC ducting
> to manage fragrance, it has its own set of fragrance-management blowers
> and ductwork.

This isn't a joke btw folks, I'm not shitting you it's a real option

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

<9175f1ad-34c6-4b7d-97e3-2be6abd1c33fn@googlegroups.com>

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Subject: Re: Any Tesla driver here?
From: gnuarm.d...@gmail.com (Ricky)
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 by: Ricky - Fri, 20 May 2022 02:31 UTC

On Thursday, May 19, 2022 at 5:49:21 PM UTC-4, Cydrome Leader wrote:
> Ricky <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Thursday, May 19, 2022 at 2:36:14 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
> >> On Thu, 19 May 2022 19:59:23 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
> >> <jer...@nospam.please> wrote:
> >>
> >> >Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
> >> >someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
> >> >button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
> >> >you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
> >> >to move. Don't you love modern cars?
> >> >
> >> >Comments?
> >> >
> >> >Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word-- Belleman
> >> With luck, the microprocessor shortage will drive the car designers
> >> back to using knobs that you can grab and turn without taking your
> >> eyes off the road.
> >>
> >> Or just common sense will do it.
> >
> > The reason they don't have a choice is the proliferation of controls. Cars are becoming far too complex to put buttons on the dash for everything.
> Most of those controls are not necessary in the first place.

Ok, but people buy them. That makes them necessary for those who make and sell the cars. They can't sell what people don't buy.

--

Rick C.

-- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
-- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

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 by: rbowman - Fri, 20 May 2022 02:33 UTC

On 05/19/2022 07:39 PM, bitrex wrote:
> On 5/19/2022 6:42 PM, John Larkin wrote:
>> On Thu, 19 May 2022 21:49:14 -0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
>> <presence@MUNGEpanix.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Ricky <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Thursday, May 19, 2022 at 2:36:14 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
>>>>> On Thu, 19 May 2022 19:59:23 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
>>>>> <jer...@nospam.please> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
>>>>>> someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
>>>>>> button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
>>>>>> you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
>>>>>> to move. Don't you love modern cars?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Comments?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word-- Belleman
>>>>> With luck, the microprocessor shortage will drive the car designers
>>>>> back to using knobs that you can grab and turn without taking your
>>>>> eyes off the road.
>>>>>
>>>>> Or just common sense will do it.
>>>>
>>>> The reason they don't have a choice is the proliferation of
>>>> controls. Cars are becoming far too complex to put buttons on the
>>>> dash for everything.
>>>
>>> Most of those controls are not necessary in the first place.
>>>
>>
>> Right. It's a car.
>>
>
> An option on I believe the Mercedes Benz E class coupe for 2022 is a
> cabin fragrance management system. You put the Mercedes Benz-brand
> fragrance vials in your choice of scents into the locking,
> LED-illuminated fragrance injector unit at the back of the glove
> compartment.
>
> Mind you to my reading this option doesn't use the existing HVAC ducting
> to manage fragrance, it has its own set of fragrance-management blowers
> and ductwork.

What do they have against little pine trees?

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

<f24b3faa-6586-402a-b024-85286c0c8905n@googlegroups.com>

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Subject: Re: Any Tesla driver here?
From: gnuarm.d...@gmail.com (Ricky)
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 by: Ricky - Fri, 20 May 2022 02:35 UTC

On Thursday, May 19, 2022 at 9:47:03 PM UTC-4, bitrex wrote:
> On 5/19/2022 9:39 PM, bitrex wrote:
> > On 5/19/2022 6:42 PM, John Larkin wrote:
> >> On Thu, 19 May 2022 21:49:14 -0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
> >> <pres...@MUNGEpanix.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Ricky <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>> On Thursday, May 19, 2022 at 2:36:14 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
> >>>>> On Thu, 19 May 2022 19:59:23 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
> >>>>> <jer...@nospam.please> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
> >>>>>> someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
> >>>>>> button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
> >>>>>> you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
> >>>>>> to move. Don't you love modern cars?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Comments?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word-- Belleman
> >>>>> With luck, the microprocessor shortage will drive the car designers
> >>>>> back to using knobs that you can grab and turn without taking your
> >>>>> eyes off the road.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Or just common sense will do it.
> >>>>
> >>>> The reason they don't have a choice is the proliferation of
> >>>> controls. Cars are becoming far too complex to put buttons on the
> >>>> dash for everything.
> >>>
> >>> Most of those controls are not necessary in the first place.
> >>>
> >>
> >> Right. It's a car.
> >>
> >
> > An option on I believe the Mercedes Benz E class coupe for 2022 is a
> > cabin fragrance management system. You put the Mercedes Benz-brand
> > fragrance vials in your choice of scents into the locking,
> > LED-illuminated fragrance injector unit at the back of the glove
> > compartment.
> >
> > Mind you to my reading this option doesn't use the existing HVAC ducting
> > to manage fragrance, it has its own set of fragrance-management blowers
> > and ductwork.
> This isn't a joke btw folks, I'm not shitting you it's a real option

What's wrong with that? People have been using scents in cars for decades. So the luxury car brand is making available without stopping at a gas station... sounds like an improvement for those who like it.

Why is everyone on the rag over the fact that people like things and car makers provide them? What a bunch of whiny little girls!

--

Rick C.

-+ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
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Re: Any Tesla driver here?

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From: blockedo...@foo.invalid (Don Y)
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: Any Tesla driver here?
Date: Thu, 19 May 2022 19:58:29 -0700
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 by: Don Y - Fri, 20 May 2022 02:58 UTC

On 5/19/2022 6:46 PM, bitrex wrote:
>> Mind you to my reading this option doesn't use the existing HVAC ducting to
>> manage fragrance, it has its own set of fragrance-management blowers and
>> ductwork.
>
> This isn't a joke btw folks, I'm not shitting you it's a real option

Neighbor's vehicle has a Peltier cooler built in (to keep your beer
cold while driving?)

There are trucks with running boards that automatically raise/lower to
make boarding/disbarking more convenient.

Neighbor's Huracan is some god-awful (IMO) color -- that he's proud
of (cuz it's one-of-a-kind).

Another is proud that he gets *8* MPG!

To some folks, cars are the equivalent of jewelry (what role does THAT
play?).

OTOH, there are some "features" that definitely improve a driving experience.

I sure wouldn't like to be tooling around without ACbrrr. And, the
backup cameras are nice (though I suspect too many folks rely on them
too heavily). As are the LIDAR detectors for cars/people passing behind
you as you back out (don't RELY on it but it's a nice fallback to catch
cases you may have missed).

I like the fact that the seats remember where I like them to be positioned
as do the mirrors.

And, as I back into the garage, it's nice that the side mirrors automatically
tilt downward to give me a better view of what's alongside the car as I
back in.

Do I need a moonroof? No (OTOH, I enjoy removing the roof panels on *my*
vehicle!). Or, the ability to close the hatchback from the driver's seat?
(why didn't I close it when I was back there??!)

But, people like toys in their vehicles. Esp american car vendors.
Do you really need a HUD to get from point A to point B?? Is there
some reason you can't notice the most recent speed limit sign as
you pass it -- why rely on the one displayed in your HUD?!

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

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From: use...@revmaps.no-ip.org (Jasen Betts)
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: Any Tesla driver here?
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 by: Jasen Betts - Fri, 20 May 2022 06:30 UTC

On 2022-05-20, Don Y <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> wrote:
> On 5/19/2022 10:59 AM, Jeroen Belleman wrote:
>> Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
>> someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
>> button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
>> you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
>> to move. Don't you love modern cars?
>>
>> Comments?
>>
>> Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word-- Belleman
>
> That's some stupid PHB's notion (or, some consultant hired by same)
> of how things should work. I'm sure there is formal language
> that defines that behavior -- for *some* reason (which MAY make
> sense but likely isn't intuitive to the driver/user)
>
> Many SUVs complain if the hatchback is left open. How do you
> transport an "oversize load" if you can't leave the item
> hanging out the ass end of the vehicle? (buy a truck, instead?)
> You can trip the sensor in the latch -- but then you're still
> faced with the problem of holding the hatch "partially closed"
> (there's often nothing to "tie onto" on the hatch!)

I usually join the catch (I catch a pice of wire or rope in the catch)
to the ring that usually engages with the catch,

but you can also tie to hinges(and run the rope over the outside
or tie to the wiper axle.

on the body of the car you can also tie to the external tie-down point,
and internally the child-seat anchor point, and spare wheel are other
options

--
Jasen.

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

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From: jmlay...@invalid.invalid (Jeff Layman)
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: Any Tesla driver here?
Date: Fri, 20 May 2022 08:06:34 +0100
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 by: Jeff Layman - Fri, 20 May 2022 07:06 UTC

On 19/05/2022 18:59, Jeroen Belleman wrote:
> Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
> someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
> button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
> you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
> to move. Don't you love modern cars?
>
> Comments?
>
> Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word-- Belleman

Perhaps something like this would help. ;-)
<https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2022/05/new-bluetooth-hack-can-unlock-your-tesla-and-all-kinds-of-other-devices/>

--

Jeff

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

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From: jer...@nospam.please (Jeroen Belleman)
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: Any Tesla driver here?
Date: Fri, 20 May 2022 09:16:35 +0200
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 by: Jeroen Belleman - Fri, 20 May 2022 07:16 UTC

On 2022-05-20 04:31, Ricky wrote:
> On Thursday, May 19, 2022 at 5:49:21 PM UTC-4, Cydrome Leader wrote:
>> Ricky <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Thursday, May 19, 2022 at 2:36:14 PM UTC-4, John Larkin
>>> wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 19 May 2022 19:59:23 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
>>>> <jer...@nospam.please> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
>>>>> someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing
>>>>> the button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently,
>>>>> when you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and
>>>>> refuses to move. Don't you love modern cars?
>>>>>
>>>>> Comments?
>>>>>
>>>>> Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word--
>>>>> Belleman
>>>> With luck, the microprocessor shortage will drive the car
>>>> designers back to using knobs that you can grab and turn
>>>> without taking your eyes off the road. with
>>>> Or just common sense will do it.
>>>
>>> The reason they don't have a choice is the proliferation of controls. Cars are becoming far too complex to put buttons on the dash for everything.
>> Most of those controls are not necessary in the first place.
>
> Ok, but people buy them. That makes them necessary for those who make and sell the cars. They can't sell what people don't buy.
>

I'd gladly buy a car with a manual transmission and fewer useless gadgets,
but I still want the airco, the auto-darkening rear view mirror, etc.
They just don't seem to exist anymore. Cars are computers on wheels
these days, with all the weird bugs that entails.

Jeroen Belleman

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

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From: blockedo...@foo.invalid (Don Y)
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: Any Tesla driver here?
Date: Fri, 20 May 2022 01:15:31 -0700
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 by: Don Y - Fri, 20 May 2022 08:15 UTC

On 5/19/2022 11:30 PM, Jasen Betts wrote:
> On 2022-05-20, Don Y <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> wrote:
>> On 5/19/2022 10:59 AM, Jeroen Belleman wrote:
>>> Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
>>> someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
>>> button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
>>> you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
>>> to move. Don't you love modern cars?
>>>
>>> Comments?
>>>
>>> Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word-- Belleman
>>
>> That's some stupid PHB's notion (or, some consultant hired by same)
>> of how things should work. I'm sure there is formal language
>> that defines that behavior -- for *some* reason (which MAY make
>> sense but likely isn't intuitive to the driver/user)
>>
>> Many SUVs complain if the hatchback is left open. How do you
>> transport an "oversize load" if you can't leave the item
>> hanging out the ass end of the vehicle? (buy a truck, instead?)
>> You can trip the sensor in the latch -- but then you're still
>> faced with the problem of holding the hatch "partially closed"
>> (there's often nothing to "tie onto" on the hatch!)
>
> I usually join the catch (I catch a pice of wire or rope in the catch)
> to the ring that usually engages with the catch,

I put a short length of chain terminated in a steel ring (thickness
of the "ring" on the back of car) with a short bungy cord on the
other end (terminating in its hook).

Chain Bungy
O888888~~~~~~~~C
Ring 8 Hook
8 excess chain
8

Place the ring in the catch and let the hatch grab it and "suck it in".
Use the hook on the other end of the bungy cord to engage the "ring"
at the bottom of the cargo area. So, there is some "give" to the tie down.

If you need to have the hatch a bit more open (to accommodate something
"thicker"), move the bungy to expose another link in the chain while
keeping the same tension on the bungy cord.

Slip a furniture pad (Harbor Freight) between the hatch and the item
its being held against -- and another *under* the item between it
and the cargo floor. So, when the hatch bounces -- as you navigate
the potholes and speed bumps in the neighborhood -- it has some
cushion (I keep several furniture pads in the car at all times as
there's often something that needs to be isolated from the vehicle's
interior surfaces, even if the hatch CAN close)

[This assumes the hatch can be held AGAINST whatever is sticking out
the ass end of the vehicle, under the tension of the bungy cord]

I'd not want to drive long distances like this but it has been
quite good for the 2-3 mile trip to home depot, lowes, etc.

[Store the contraption in the "trunk" (spare tire storage area)
as you never know when you will need it]

> but you can also tie to hinges(and run the rope over the outside
> or tie to the wiper axle.

Hinges aren't accessible "over the outside" when the hatch is
going to be almost closed; there's a rubber seal there (the
hinges are inboard of the door) so barely room for a bit of twine!

Wiper axle seems like it's an invitation for a "wiper repair"!
(That was my first idea, thankfully rejected.)

> on the body of the car you can also tie to the external tie-down point,
> and internally the child-seat anchor point, and spare wheel are other
> options

There are some tie points on the sides of the cargo area. But, the
"ring" that the hatch normally catches is much easier to access
and better positioned.

Spare wheel is under the cargo area (SUV) so you'd have to remove the
"floor insert" to get access to the wheel. Then, where do you put
that large piece of "floor" while you're transporting cargo?

Rear seat needs to be folded down. As does the passenger seat, often.
But, I can easily carry 12 ft lumber, copper/PVC tubing, etc. like
this (furniture pads used to protect seat leather, etc.). Reserve those
favors you ask of neighbors with trucks to the really difficult
transports!

Would it have been so hard for the manufacturer to have anticipated this?
(I suspect driving with the hatch open -- in any way -- would likely
be seen as a liability issue.)

In a previous hatchback, I could lie in the back and HOLD the hatch
closed. Used this technique to transport many 10' trees home when
we were landscaping the yard!

But, this hatch has too much mass (inertia) to be comfortable doing so.
First bump would have it flying open with me attached!

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

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From: blockedo...@foo.invalid (Don Y)
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: Any Tesla driver here?
Date: Fri, 20 May 2022 01:20:25 -0700
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 by: Don Y - Fri, 20 May 2022 08:20 UTC

On 5/20/2022 12:06 AM, Jeff Layman wrote:
> On 19/05/2022 18:59, Jeroen Belleman wrote:
>> Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
>> someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
>> button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
>> you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
>> to move. Don't you love modern cars?
>>
>> Comments?
>>
>> Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word-- Belleman
>
> Perhaps something like this would help. ;-)
> <https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2022/05/new-bluetooth-hack-can-unlock-your-tesla-and-all-kinds-of-other-devices/>

This can be countered by measuring time of flight (assuming "keys" aren't
repeated and subject to replay attack).

This is just common when folks treat security as an afterthought
instead of building it *into* the device/process.

<https://www.wired.com/story/pacemaker-hack-malware-black-hat/>

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

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From: blockedo...@foo.invalid (Don Y)
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: Any Tesla driver here?
Date: Fri, 20 May 2022 01:46:56 -0700
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 by: Don Y - Fri, 20 May 2022 08:46 UTC

On 5/20/2022 12:16 AM, Jeroen Belleman wrote:
> I'd gladly buy a car with a manual transmission and fewer useless gadgets,

Which "gadgets" (that have software and/or add to the number of
"useless controls") would you do away with?

Personally, I can live without the mirror and seat position memory
(in MY car -- because SWMBO doesn't drive it: "too big" -- so everything
stays exactly as I left it)

I'd miss the backup camera and cross traffic alert system (for cars and
people passing behind the vehicle as you're backing up).

And, the gizmo that watches for vehicles in the blind spots while
driving (sometimes catches things that I may have missed, esp "determined"
road sheep).

No need for GPS (which isn't as good as some of the portable GPS units).
And, ditch the moonroof (that came as part of the trim level upgrade
that gave the power *passenger* seat). How exactly does that N-way
control operate? Am I *sure* it's closed WATER TIGHT??

I would, however, still want that power passenger seat for the times
I'm seated in it and want to LOWER it (SWMBO likes it set "high"...
so she can see what's passing UNDER the front bumper???)

Sound system is easy to implement with a PMP tied in to the "radio".

Nice to have the built-in garage door openers overhead. But, clipping
an old-fashioned "remote" to the visor isn't a big deal. Maybe not quite
as "aesthetically pleasing".

Nice to know what sort of fuel economy I'm presently getting. And, a
summary for this tankful. Saves a bit of mental arithmetic. "Available
miles" in the tank? <shrug> Rarely more than a few blocks from a gas
station so the prospect of being stuck with an empty tank is pretty remote.

Cruise control? Rarely make long drives. (but has not been the case,
historically)

Oil life monitor? I guess I could go back to keeping track of that in
my head.

Driver/passenger temperature controls? How often do you want significantly
different temperature regions a few feet apart?!

Yeah, it's nice to have the headlights turn on when needed (?). But,
its not like that's a huge labor-saver, for me!

Hands free cell phone tie in? "Cell phone? What's that?!"

Keyless entry/ignition? I've already got to carry the damn keyfob so
how's that any different than carrying a *key*?! ("Ah, but you can unlock
the door BEFORE you get to the car!" Whoopdedoo)

Speech interface to all of the above? Yes, please get rid of the
damn thing! It's far too sluggish to be useful (you end up
*watching* the display -- instead of the roadway -- to see WHAT it
*thinks* you said)

And, no, I don't need to be reminded to put the car in park when
I turn off the ignition. And, don't have a shit fit if I exit the
vehicle while its still running! Or, nag me for not putting on the
damn seat belt. Maybe I plan on exiting the vehicle (to check
the mail) once I get to the end of the driveway!

And, what the hell is THAT annunciator (without any accompanying MESSAGE
on any of the three displays)? Did you save 10 bytes of code by relying
exclusively on a cryptic SOUND instead of declaring the intent??

What I'd LIKE is something that alerts me to things like bulb failures
(headlamps, turn signals, brake/running lights, etc.). But, don't know
if its smart enough to do that. OTOH, I see lots of "new" cars with
failed lamps and assume the drivers haven't been told of those failures,
yet (?)

Or, diagnostics of other "not trivial" systems (low on refrigerant?).

> but I still want the airco, the auto-darkening rear view mirror, etc.
> They just don't seem to exist anymore. Cars are computers on wheels
> these days, with all the weird bugs that entails.

Here, I think newer vehicles are required to have many of these
"safety features" (backup camera, etc.). But, for the most part,
they don't require any/much fiddling (I think the cameras can
be configured for different "views")

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

<VUMhK.3532$kaDc.2693@fx46.iad>

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 by: bitrex - Fri, 20 May 2022 13:42 UTC

On 5/19/2022 10:35 PM, Ricky wrote:
> On Thursday, May 19, 2022 at 9:47:03 PM UTC-4, bitrex wrote:
>> On 5/19/2022 9:39 PM, bitrex wrote:
>>> On 5/19/2022 6:42 PM, John Larkin wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 19 May 2022 21:49:14 -0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
>>>> <pres...@MUNGEpanix.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Ricky <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On Thursday, May 19, 2022 at 2:36:14 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
>>>>>>> On Thu, 19 May 2022 19:59:23 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
>>>>>>> <jer...@nospam.please> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
>>>>>>>> someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
>>>>>>>> button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
>>>>>>>> you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
>>>>>>>> to move. Don't you love modern cars?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Comments?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word-- Belleman
>>>>>>> With luck, the microprocessor shortage will drive the car designers
>>>>>>> back to using knobs that you can grab and turn without taking your
>>>>>>> eyes off the road.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Or just common sense will do it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The reason they don't have a choice is the proliferation of
>>>>>> controls. Cars are becoming far too complex to put buttons on the
>>>>>> dash for everything.
>>>>>
>>>>> Most of those controls are not necessary in the first place.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Right. It's a car.
>>>>
>>>
>>> An option on I believe the Mercedes Benz E class coupe for 2022 is a
>>> cabin fragrance management system. You put the Mercedes Benz-brand
>>> fragrance vials in your choice of scents into the locking,
>>> LED-illuminated fragrance injector unit at the back of the glove
>>> compartment.
>>>
>>> Mind you to my reading this option doesn't use the existing HVAC ducting
>>> to manage fragrance, it has its own set of fragrance-management blowers
>>> and ductwork.
>> This isn't a joke btw folks, I'm not shitting you it's a real option
>
> What's wrong with that? People have been using scents in cars for decades. So the luxury car brand is making available without stopping at a gas station... sounds like an improvement for those who like it.

They're probably out of stock of the fragrance vials due to supply-chain
issues, lol

> Why is everyone on the rag over the fact that people like things and car makers provide them? What a bunch of whiny little girls!
>

That's racist

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

<oiOhK.1784$vAW9.959@fx10.iad>

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 by: bitrex - Fri, 20 May 2022 15:17 UTC

On 5/19/2022 1:59 PM, Jeroen Belleman wrote:
> Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
> someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
> button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
> you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
> to move. Don't you love modern cars?
>
> Comments?

Yeah, in other news Elon Musk has been a Republican for less than 48
hours and he already has a hush-money sexual harassment case against
him. Ancient story of Cinderella, if shoe fits...

> Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word-- Belleman

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

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 by: jlar...@highlandsniptechnology.com - Fri, 20 May 2022 15:27 UTC

On Fri, 20 May 2022 11:17:39 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

>On 5/19/2022 1:59 PM, Jeroen Belleman wrote:
>> Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
>> someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
>> button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
>> you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
>> to move. Don't you love modern cars?
>>
>> Comments?
>
>
>Yeah, in other news Elon Musk has been a Republican for less than 48
>hours and he already has a hush-money sexual harassment case against
>him. Ancient story of Cinderella, if shoe fits...
>
>> Jeroen --the driver should always have the final word-- Belleman

New movie:

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2022/may/17/elon-musk-crash-course-documentary-tesla

--

Anybody can count to one.

- Robert Widlar

Re: Any Tesla driver here?

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 by: jlar...@highlandsniptechnology.com - Fri, 20 May 2022 15:34 UTC

On Fri, 20 May 2022 11:17:39 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

>On 5/19/2022 1:59 PM, Jeroen Belleman wrote:
>> Any Tesla drivers here? I heard of this silly incident where
>> someone forced the hatch shut by hand rather than pushing the
>> button, and by doing so immobilized the car. Apparently, when
>> you do that, it believes the hatch is still open and refuses
>> to move. Don't you love modern cars?
>>
>> Comments?
>
>
>Yeah, in other news Elon Musk has been a Republican for less than 48
>hours and he already has a hush-money sexual harassment case against
>him.

He apparently propositioned a woman. I'm sure none of the guys here
would ever do anything so evil.

The alleged incident was in 2018. Within 48 hours of becoming a
Republican, the scandal is public.

--

Anybody can count to one.

- Robert Widlar

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