I've mentioned the very rideable Clark Street in Chicago
from time to time. Should be phrased in past tense now!

Today, daughter writes to say she's had enough and is
exploring other routes as the new 'improvements' have
increased her risk in traffic, especially the new yellow
spears for cyclists besides the concrete impedimenta.

https://chi.streetsblog.org/2023/11/03/a-sneak-peak-at-the-new-clark-street-protected-lanes-between-montrose-and-irving-park

https://chi.streetsblog.org/2023/09/21/protected-bike-lanes-are-coming-to-dearborn-clark-and-maybe-someday-wells-in-river-north

Today's user report:

"I Am saddened to see my favorite road to bike ( well it’s
a de stress —was!— break …Clark up to about Wilson) turned
into a dangerous bike lane
It has bars sticking up that feel so dangerous to me … they
get hit often :0 ..and stay on as an obstruction in bike
lane..besides giving the biker no maneuvering buffer for any
of the very much debree that accumulated in bike land now
that the street sweeper can’t get to that part of the road

It was wide, no stops or lights and traffic flowed along
never congested.

Oh. It’s green. Yay.

I used to sail up it. I’ll find another way now. In fact I
must do that tonight!!! I’m in Lakeview later…..

Looks great at a big planning table but the officials need
to be required 100 hours at least of biking road time before
being allowed to design or approve or give input!!!

Evanston is pretty well done..but they don’t need them
because cars are too polite and cautious! Ha
Chicago should look at cities that work as well as requiring
road experience
( and best of all that will eliminate corruption as most
officials most likely would not survive the hazards of
biking in Chicago or be fit enough to do it !) ha"

--
Andrew Muzi
am@yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On Tuesday, December 19, 2023 at 7:30:10 AM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
> I've mentioned the very rideable Clark Street in Chicago
> from time to time. Should be phrased in past tense now!
>
> Today, daughter writes to say she's had enough and is
> exploring other routes as the new 'improvements' have
> increased her risk in traffic, especially the new yellow
> spears for cyclists besides the concrete impedimenta.
>
> https://chi.streetsblog.org/2023/11/03/a-sneak-peak-at-the-new-clark-street-protected-lanes-between-montrose-and-irving-park
>
> https://chi.streetsblog.org/2023/09/21/protected-bike-lanes-are-coming-to-dearborn-clark-and-maybe-someday-wells-in-river-north
>
> Today's user report:
>
> "I Am saddened to see my favorite road to bike ( well it’s
> a de stress —was!— break …Clark up to about Wilson) turned
> into a dangerous bike lane
> It has bars sticking up that feel so dangerous to me … they
> get hit often :0 ..and stay on as an obstruction in bike
> lane..besides giving the biker no maneuvering buffer for any
> of the very much debree that accumulated in bike land now
> that the street sweeper can’t get to that part of the road
>
> It was wide, no stops or lights and traffic flowed along
> never congested.
>
> Oh. It’s green. Yay.
>
> I used to sail up it. I’ll find another way now. In fact I
> must do that tonight!!! I’m in Lakeview later…..
>
>
> Looks great at a big planning table but the officials need
> to be required 100 hours at least of biking road time before
> being allowed to design or approve or give input!!!
>
> Evanston is pretty well done..but they don’t need them
> because cars are too polite and cautious! Ha
> Chicago should look at cities that work as well as requiring
> road experience
> ( and best of all that will eliminate corruption as most
> officials most likely would not survive the hazards of
> biking in Chicago or be fit enough to do it !) ha"
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Andrew Muzi
> a...@yellowjersey.org
> Open every day since 1 April, 1971

If you design a road that is separated from the actual road by barriers it cannot be swept by the normal street sweepers and this forces the bicycle traffic now out onto the narrowed car lanes, I have recorded this many times and people who pass themselves off as traffic planners whose sole qualification is a college degree, and no real knowledge at all, are given high paying government jobs to experiment on the populace. Krygowski's answer is to make NO improvements for bicycles despite the fact that a simple painted bike lane cost very little, requires no more planning than measuring the road width and has proven to add safety to bicyclists through nothing more than visual road division of the type that separates opposite direction lanes which I assume Krygowski is also against. Until there is a national standard of a simple painted bike lane, State traffic planners will continue to do the wrong thing at every turn.

On 12/19/2023 10:30 AM, AMuzi wrote:
> I've mentioned the very rideable Clark Street in Chicago from time to
> time. Should be phrased in past tense now!
>
> Today, daughter writes to say she's had enough and is exploring other
> routes as the new 'improvements' have increased her risk in traffic,
> especially the new yellow spears for cyclists besides the concrete
> impedimenta.
>
> https://chi.streetsblog.org/2023/11/03/a-sneak-peak-at-the-new-clark-street-protected-lanes-between-montrose-and-irving-park
>
> https://chi.streetsblog.org/2023/09/21/protected-bike-lanes-are-coming-to-dearborn-clark-and-maybe-someday-wells-in-river-north
>
> Today's user report:
>
> "I   Am saddened to see my favorite road to bike ( well it’s a de stress
> —was!— break …Clark up to about Wilson) turned into a dangerous bike lane
> It has bars sticking up that feel so dangerous to me … they get hit
> often :0 ..and stay on as an obstruction in bike lane..besides giving
> the biker no maneuvering buffer for any of the very much debree that
> accumulated in bike land now that the street sweeper can’t get to that
> part of the road
>
> It was wide, no stops or lights and traffic flowed along never congested.
>
> Oh. It’s green. Yay.
>
> I used to sail up it. I’ll find another way now.  In fact I must do that
> tonight!!! I’m in Lakeview later…..
>
>
> Looks great at a big planning table but the officials need to be
> required 100 hours at least of biking road time before being allowed to
> design or approve or give input!!!
>
> Evanston is pretty well done..but they don’t need them because cars are
> too polite and cautious! Ha
> Chicago should look at cities that work as well as requiring road
> experience
> ( and best of all that will eliminate corruption as most officials most
> likely would not survive the hazards of biking in Chicago or be fit
> enough to do it !) ha"

I was invited to be part of an ad hoc bicycle club committee that met
yesterday. The topic of the meeting had nothing to do with bike
facilities, but in the course of conversation, three local facilities
that I've mentioned here were discussed - painted bike lanes on a road
with a new "road diet," and two different bi-directional "protected"
bike lanes. Also one other proposed (crazy) facility that I helped put a
stop to.

In any case, all six of the club members at the meeting said all those
facilities are both useless and nuts. And all agreed that they are
seeing only the barest minimum use - as in "I saw one rider once." The
fantasy "Build it and they will come" is clearly not working here.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On Tue, 19 Dec 2023 09:30:06 -0600, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:

>I've mentioned the very rideable Clark Street in Chicago
>from time to time. Should be phrased in past tense now!
>
>Today, daughter writes to say she's had enough and is
>exploring other routes as the new 'improvements' have
>increased her risk in traffic, especially the new yellow
>spears for cyclists besides the concrete impedimenta.
>
>https://chi.streetsblog.org/2023/11/03/a-sneak-peak-at-the-new-clark-street-protected-lanes-between-montrose-and-irving-park
>
>https://chi.streetsblog.org/2023/09/21/protected-bike-lanes-are-coming-to-dearborn-clark-and-maybe-someday-wells-in-river-north
>
>Today's user report:
>
>"I Am saddened to see my favorite road to bike ( well it’s
>a de stress —was!— break …Clark up to about Wilson) turned
>into a dangerous bike lane
>It has bars sticking up that feel so dangerous to me … they
>get hit often :0 ..and stay on as an obstruction in bike
>lane..besides giving the biker no maneuvering buffer for any
>of the very much debree that accumulated in bike land now
>that the street sweeper can’t get to that part of the road
>
>It was wide, no stops or lights and traffic flowed along
>never congested.
>
>Oh. It’s green. Yay.
>
>I used to sail up it. I’ll find another way now. In fact I
>must do that tonight!!! I’m in Lakeview later…..
>
>
>Looks great at a big planning table but the officials need
>to be required 100 hours at least of biking road time before
>being allowed to design or approve or give input!!!
>
>Evanston is pretty well done..but they don’t need them
>because cars are too polite and cautious! Ha
>Chicago should look at cities that work as well as requiring
>road experience
>( and best of all that will eliminate corruption as most
>officials most likely would not survive the hazards of
>biking in Chicago or be fit enough to do it !) ha"

Strangely enough, I see your point and I don't disagree. A bike lane
isn't "protected" from traffic unless it's well off the highway, not
with only those flimsy posts. By "well off off the highway, I mean 5
or 6 feet, and with a curb on the highway if it's big, high speed
highway.

On Tue, 19 Dec 2023 11:51:03 -0500, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

>On 12/19/2023 10:30 AM, AMuzi wrote:
>> I've mentioned the very rideable Clark Street in Chicago from time to
>> time. Should be phrased in past tense now!
>>
>> Today, daughter writes to say she's had enough and is exploring other
>> routes as the new 'improvements' have increased her risk in traffic,
>> especially the new yellow spears for cyclists besides the concrete
>> impedimenta.
>>
>> https://chi.streetsblog.org/2023/11/03/a-sneak-peak-at-the-new-clark-street-protected-lanes-between-montrose-and-irving-park
>>
>> https://chi.streetsblog.org/2023/09/21/protected-bike-lanes-are-coming-to-dearborn-clark-and-maybe-someday-wells-in-river-north
>>
>> Today's user report:
>>
>> "I   Am saddened to see my favorite road to bike ( well it’s a de stress
>> —was!— break …Clark up to about Wilson) turned into a dangerous bike lane
>> It has bars sticking up that feel so dangerous to me … they get hit
>> often :0 ..and stay on as an obstruction in bike lane..besides giving
>> the biker no maneuvering buffer for any of the very much debree that
>> accumulated in bike land now that the street sweeper can’t get to that
>> part of the road
>>
>> It was wide, no stops or lights and traffic flowed along never congested.
>>
>> Oh. It’s green. Yay.
>>
>> I used to sail up it. I’ll find another way now.  In fact I must do that
>> tonight!!! I’m in Lakeview later…..
>>
>>
>> Looks great at a big planning table but the officials need to be
>> required 100 hours at least of biking road time before being allowed to
>> design or approve or give input!!!
>>
>> Evanston is pretty well done..but they don’t need them because cars are
>> too polite and cautious! Ha
>> Chicago should look at cities that work as well as requiring road
>> experience
>> ( and best of all that will eliminate corruption as most officials most
>> likely would not survive the hazards of biking in Chicago or be fit
>> enough to do it !) ha"
>
>I was invited to be part of an ad hoc bicycle club committee that met
>yesterday. The topic of the meeting had nothing to do with bike
>facilities, but in the course of conversation, three local facilities
>that I've mentioned here were discussed - painted bike lanes on a road
>with a new "road diet," and two different bi-directional "protected"
>bike lanes. Also one other proposed (crazy) facility that I helped put a
>stop to.
>
>In any case, all six of the club members at the meeting said all those
>facilities are both useless and nuts. And all agreed that they are
>seeing only the barest minimum use - as in "I saw one rider once." The
>fantasy "Build it and they will come" is clearly not working here.

Appears to be some group thinking going on.