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tech / sci.math / Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence

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* WM Challange, Dark property existencezelos...@gmail.com
+* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceGus Gassmann
|`* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
| +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceGus Gassmann
| +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
| `- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
+* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
|+* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceGus Gassmann
||`* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
|| +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
|| `- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceGus Gassmann
|+- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
|+* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencezelos...@gmail.com
||`* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
|| +* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceFromTheRafters
|| |`* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
|| | +* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceJim Burns
|| | |`* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
|| | | +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
|| | | `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceJim Burns
|| | |  `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
|| | |   +* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
|| | |   |`- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
|| | |   `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceJim Burns
|| | |    `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
|| | |     `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceFromTheRafters
|| | |      `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceJim Burns
|| | |       `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
|| | |        +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
|| | |        +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceJim Burns
|| | |        `- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceFromTheRafters
|| | +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceFromTheRafters
|| | `- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
|| +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
|| `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencezelos...@gmail.com
||  `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
||   +* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencezelos...@gmail.com
||   |`* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceGus Gassmann
||   | +* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceFromTheRafters
||   | |+* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
||   | ||+* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceTom Bola
||   | |||`- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
||   | ||+- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
||   | ||+- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceFromTheRafters
||   | ||`- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencezelos...@gmail.com
||   | |`* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceGus Gassmann
||   | | `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceFromTheRafters
||   | |  `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceGus Gassmann
||   | |   +* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceFromTheRafters
||   | |   |`* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
||   | |   | +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencezelos...@gmail.com
||   | |   | +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceGus Gassmann
||   | |   | +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
||   | |   | `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceFromTheRafters
||   | |   |  `- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
||   | |   `- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencezelos...@gmail.com
||   | `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
||   |  `- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceGus Gassmann
||   `- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencezelos...@gmail.com
|`* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceDavid Petry
| +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
| +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencezelos...@gmail.com
| `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
|  +* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencezelos...@gmail.com
|  |`- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceGus Gassmann
|  `- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
+* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencemitchr...@gmail.com
|`* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencezelos...@gmail.com
| `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencezelos...@gmail.com
|  `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
|   +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceGus Gassmann
|   +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
|   `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencezelos...@gmail.com
|    `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
|     +* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceGus Gassmann
|     |`* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
|     | `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceGus Gassmann
|     |  `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
|     |   +* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceGus Gassmann
|     |   |`* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
|     |   | +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
|     |   | +* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceGus Gassmann
|     |   | |`* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
|     |   | | `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceGus Gassmann
|     |   | |  `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
|     |   | |   +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
|     |   | |   +* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceGus Gassmann
|     |   | |   |+- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
|     |   | |   |+* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
|     |   | |   ||`- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
|     |   | |   |+* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
|     |   | |   ||`* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceChris M. Thomasson
|     |   | |   || `- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
|     |   | |   |`* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceWM
|     |   | |   | `- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
|     |   | |   +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceGus Gassmann
|     |   | |   +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencezelos...@gmail.com
|     |   | |   +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencezelos...@gmail.com
|     |   | |   +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencezelos...@gmail.com
|     |   | |   `- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencezelos...@gmail.com
|     |   | `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existenceJim Burns
|     |   +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
|     |   `- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencezelos...@gmail.com
|     +- Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencesergio
|     `* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencezelos...@gmail.com
`* Re: WM Challange, Dark property existencemitchr...@gmail.com

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Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence

<9b52895a-8371-4573-b32f-cf139bbefc55n@googlegroups.com>

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Subject: Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence
From: askaske...@gmail.com (WM)
Injection-Date: Fri, 13 May 2022 16:55:17 +0000
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 by: WM - Fri, 13 May 2022 16:55 UTC

horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Donnerstag, 12. Mai 2022 um 17:41:31 UTC+2:
> On Thursday, 12 May 2022 at 11:08:32 UTC-3, WM wrote:
> > horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Donnerstag, 12. Mai 2022 um 15:42:01 UTC+2:
> > > On Thursday, 12 May 2022 at 10:05:38 UTC-3, WM wrote:
> > > > horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Mittwoch, 11. Mai 2022 um 21:12:10 UTC+2:
> [...]
> > > Good job! (This also gives me the opportunity to point out to you again that "element for element" does not mean "one after the other".
> > "unter beidseitiger Wahrung der Rangfolge ihrer Elemente auf einander beziehen, abbilden lassen" [G. Cantor, letter to R. Lipschitz (19 Nov 1883)]
> That does not say or mean "one after the other".

Try to learn German. "Unter beidseitiger Wahrung der Rangfolge" means one after the other in the given order.

> > "So stellt uns beispielsweise eine veränderliche Größe x, die nacheinander die verschiedenen endlichen ganzen Zahlwerte 1, 2, 3, ...., ν, ... anzunehmen hat, ein potentiales Unendliches vor, während die durch ein Gesetz begrifflich durchaus bestimmte Menge (y) aller ganzen endlichen Zahlen y das einfachste Beispiel eines actual unendlichen Quantums darbietet." [1886, Mai. Cantor to S. Giulio Vivanti in Mantua]
> >
> > Do you know this law? If you have n, then go to n+1.
> That emphatically is *NOT* stated here.

"nacheinander die verschiedenen endlichen ganzen Zahlwerte 1, 2, 3, ..., ν, ... anzunehmen". Try to recover.

> > We have 1 = |E0|. Now combine another thing e1 with E0. The sum set be called E1, such that E1 = (E0, e1) = (e0, e1). The cardinal number |E1| of E1 is called "two" and is denoted by 2 = |E1|. By adding new elements we obtain the sequence of sets E2 = (E1, e2), E3 = (E2, e3), ... which in an unbounded sequence successively supply the other so-called finite cardinal numbers denoted by 3, 4, 5, ... . [G. Cantor: "Beiträge zur Begründung der transfiniten Mengenlehre 1", Math. Annalen 46 (1895) § 5]
> >
> > Denn wir haben hier ein dem Rang nach niedrigstes Element, die kleinste Kardinalzahl 1 und eine auf jede endliche Kardinalzahl  dem Range, d. h. hier der Größe nach nächstfolgende endliche Kardinalzahl  + 1. So erhalten wir die Gesamtheit aller endlichen Kardinalzahlen in der sogenannten natürlichen endlosen Folge: 1, 2, 3, ..., , ..., in welcher Folge sie eine wohlgeordnete Menge vom Ordnungstypus  darstellt.

> OK. This is the process of induction. Please give a proper citation.

Cantor, Collected Works, p. 419
>
Die Gesamtheit aller endlichen Kardinalzahlen bildet also, wenn in ihr die kleineren Zahlen einen niedrigeren Rang erhalten als die größeren, in dieser Rangordnung das, was ich eine einfach geordnete Menge nenne. Doch noch mehr; sie stellt sich uns in dieser Rangordnung als eine wohlgeordnete Menge (vgl. Grundlagen e. allg. Mannigfaltigkeitslehre S. 4 [S. 168]) vor. Denn wir haben hier ein dem Rang nach niedrigstes Element, die kleinste Kardinalzahl 1 und eine auf jede endliche Kardinalzahl  dem Range, d. h. hier der Größe nach nächstfolgende endliche Kardinalzahl  + 1. So erhalten wir die Gesamtheit aller endlichen Kardinalzahlen in der sogenannten natürlichen endlosen Folge: 1, 2, 3, ..., , ..., in welcher Folge sie eine wohlgeordnete Menge vom Ordnungstypus  darstellt.
Die Endlosigkeit dieser Folge gibt den Beweis, daß die Gesamtheit aller endlichen Zahlen, als ein Ding für sich betrachtet, eine aktual unendliche Menge, ein Transfinitum ist. Denn für die Behauptung, daß eine Menge aktual unendlich sei, ist die Bestimmtheit aller ihrer Elemente sowie das Größersein der Anzahl derselben im Vergleich mit jeder endlichen Zahl das allein Wesentliche; nicht aber ist erforderlich, daß die Menge in irgendeiner Form durch ein letztes, zu ihr gehöriges Glied begrenzt sei. Abgegrenzt ist eine Menge vollkommen schon dadurch, daß alles zu ihr gehörige in sich bestimmt und von allem nicht zu ihr Gehörigen wohl unterschieden ist. Dies stimmt völlig mit demjenigen überein, was S. Augustin in dem pag. 32 abgedruckten Kapitel seiner Hauptschrift De Civitate Dei, lib. XII, cap. 19, sagt: "Ita vero suis quisque numerus proprietatibus terminatur, ut nullus eorum par esse cuicumque alteri possit. Ergo et dispares inter se atque diversi sunt, et singuli quique finiti sunt, et omnes infiniti sunt."

Note finally: Abzählen is a process step by step, one element after the other. Every contrary claim shows stupidity or dishonesty.

Regards, WM

Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence

<t5m37n$t99$1@gioia.aioe.org>

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https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=99948&group=sci.math#99948

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From: inva...@invalid.com (sergio)
Newsgroups: sci.math
Subject: Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence
Date: Fri, 13 May 2022 12:07:01 -0500
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 by: sergio - Fri, 13 May 2022 17:07 UTC

On 5/13/2022 11:55 AM, WM wrote:
> horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Donnerstag, 12. Mai 2022 um 17:41:31 UTC+2:
>> On Thursday, 12 May 2022 at 11:08:32 UTC-3, WM wrote:
>>> horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Donnerstag, 12. Mai 2022 um 15:42:01 UTC+2:
>>>> On Thursday, 12 May 2022 at 10:05:38 UTC-3, WM wrote:
>>>>> horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Mittwoch, 11. Mai 2022 um 21:12:10 UTC+2:
>> [...]
>>>> Good job! (This also gives me the opportunity to point out to you again that "element for element" does not mean "one after the other".
>>> "unter beidseitiger Wahrung der Rangfolge ihrer Elemente auf einander beziehen, abbilden lassen" [G. Cantor, letter to R. Lipschitz (19 Nov 1883)]
>> That does not say or mean "one after the other".
>
> Try to learn German. "Unter beidseitiger Wahrung der Rangfolge" means one after the other in the given order.
Wrong. there is no "one after the other"
"Order of precedence on both sides"
"...refer to each other while maintaining the order of precedence of their elements on both sides, have them mapped..."


>
>>> "So stellt uns beispielsweise eine veränderliche Größe x, die nacheinander die verschiedenen endlichen ganzen Zahlwerte 1, 2, 3, ..., ν, ... anzunehmen hat, ein potentiales Unendliches vor, während die durch ein Gesetz begrifflich durchaus bestimmte Menge (y) aller ganzen endlichen Zahlen y das einfachste Beispiel eines actual unendlichen Quantums darbietet." [1886, Mai. Cantor to S. Giulio Vivanti in Mantua]
>>>
>>> Do you know this law? If you have n, then go to n+1.
>> That emphatically is *NOT* stated here.
>
> "nacheinander die verschiedenen endlichen ganzen Zahlwerte 1, 2, 3, ..., ν, ... anzunehmen". Try to recover.
wrong again. ""For example, a variable quantity x represents us, which successively represents the various finite integer values 1, 2, 3,..., ν,... the
set (y) of all whole finite numbers y, which is conceptually determined by a law, represents the simplest example of an actual infinite quantum."
you do like to misquote!
>
>>> We have 1 = |E0|. Now combine another thing e1 with E0. The sum set be called E1, such that E1 = (E0, e1) = (e0, e1). The cardinal number |E1| of E1 is called "two" and is denoted by 2 = |E1|. By adding new elements we obtain the sequence of sets E2 = (E1, e2), E3 = (E2, e3), ... which in an unbounded sequence successively supply the other so-called finite cardinal numbers denoted by 3, 4, 5, ... . [G. Cantor: "Beiträge zur Begründung der transfiniten Mengenlehre 1", Math. Annalen 46 (1895) § 5]
>>>
>>> Denn wir haben hier ein dem Rang nach niedrigstes Element, die kleinste Kardinalzahl 1 und eine auf jede endliche Kardinalzahl  dem Range, d. h. hier der Größe nach nächstfolgende endliche Kardinalzahl  + 1. So erhalten wir die Gesamtheit aller endlichen Kardinalzahlen in der sogenannten natürlichen endlosen Folge: 1, 2, 3, ..., , ..., in welcher Folge sie eine wohlgeordnete Menge vom Ordnungstypus  darstellt.
>
>> OK. This is the process of induction. Please give a proper citation.
>
> Cantor, Collected Works, p. 419
>>
> Die Gesamtheit aller endlichen Kardinalzahlen bildet also, wenn in ihr die kleineren Zahlen einen niedrigeren Rang erhalten als die größeren, in dieser Rangordnung das, was ich eine einfach geordnete Menge nenne. Doch noch mehr; sie stellt sich uns in dieser Rangordnung als eine wohlgeordnete Menge (vgl. Grundlagen e. allg. Mannigfaltigkeitslehre S. 4 [S. 168]) vor. Denn wir haben hier ein dem Rang nach niedrigstes Element, die kleinste Kardinalzahl 1 und eine auf jede endliche Kardinalzahl  dem Range, d. h. hier der Größe nach nächstfolgende endliche Kardinalzahl  + 1. So erhalten wir die Gesamtheit aller endlichen Kardinalzahlen in der sogenannten natürlichen endlosen Folge: 1, 2, 3, ..., , ..., in welcher Folge sie eine wohlgeordnete Menge vom Ordnungstypus  darstellt.
> Die Endlosigkeit dieser Folge gibt den Beweis, daß die Gesamtheit aller endlichen Zahlen, als ein Ding für sich betrachtet, eine aktual unendliche Menge, ein Transfinitum ist. Denn für die Behauptung, daß eine Menge aktual unendlich sei, ist die Bestimmtheit aller ihrer Elemente sowie das Größersein der Anzahl derselben im Vergleich mit jeder endlichen Zahl das allein Wesentliche; nicht aber ist erforderlich, daß die Menge in irgendeiner Form durch ein letztes, zu ihr gehöriges Glied begrenzt sei. Abgegrenzt ist eine Menge vollkommen schon dadurch, daß alles zu ihr gehörige in sich bestimmt und von allem nicht zu ihr Gehörigen wohl unterschieden ist. Dies stimmt völlig mit demjenigen überein, was S. Augustin in dem pag. 32 abgedruckten Kapitel seiner Hauptschrift De Civitate Dei, lib. XII, cap. 19, sagt: "Ita vero suis quisque numerus proprietatibus terminatur, ut nullus eorum par esse cuicumque alteri possit. Ergo et dispares inter se atque diversi sunt, et singuli quique finiti sunt, et omnes infiniti sunt."
>
> Note finally: Abzählen is a process step by step, one element after the other. Every contrary claim shows stupidity or dishonesty.
>
> Regards, WM

Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence

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Subject: Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence
From: horand.g...@gmail.com (Gus Gassmann)
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 by: Gus Gassmann - Fri, 13 May 2022 17:28 UTC

On Friday, 13 May 2022 at 13:55:23 UTC-3, WM wrote:
> horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Donnerstag, 12. Mai 2022 um 17:41:31 UTC+2:
> > On Thursday, 12 May 2022 at 11:08:32 UTC-3, WM wrote:
> > > horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Donnerstag, 12. Mai 2022 um 15:42:01 UTC+2:
> > > > On Thursday, 12 May 2022 at 10:05:38 UTC-3, WM wrote:
> > > > > horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Mittwoch, 11. Mai 2022 um 21:12:10 UTC+2:
> > [...]
> > > > Good job! (This also gives me the opportunity to point out to you again that "element for element" does not mean "one after the other".
> > > "unter beidseitiger Wahrung der Rangfolge ihrer Elemente auf einander beziehen, abbilden lassen" [G. Cantor, letter to R. Lipschitz (19 Nov 1883)]
> > That does not say or mean "one after the other".
>
> Try to learn German. "Unter beidseitiger Wahrung der Rangfolge" means one after the other in the given order.

It does *NOT*! All it means is that n < m iff f(n) < f(m). It does *NOT* mean that f(n) has to be constructed before f(m). You really have *NO CLUE* about *ANYTHING*. I would recommend that *YOU* learn German, if you had not demonstrated time and time again that even *THAT* is beyond you. What a *FUCKING ASSHOLE* you are. Get lost.

[...]

Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence

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Subject: Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence
From: askaske...@gmail.com (WM)
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 by: WM - Fri, 13 May 2022 20:21 UTC

horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Freitag, 13. Mai 2022 um 19:28:18 UTC+2:
> On Friday, 13 May 2022 at 13:55:23 UTC-3, WM wrote:
> > horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Donnerstag, 12. Mai 2022 um 17:41:31 UTC+2:
> > > On Thursday, 12 May 2022 at 11:08:32 UTC-3, WM wrote:
> > > > horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Donnerstag, 12. Mai 2022 um 15:42:01 UTC+2:
> > > > > On Thursday, 12 May 2022 at 10:05:38 UTC-3, WM wrote:
> > > > > > horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Mittwoch, 11. Mai 2022 um 21:12:10 UTC+2:
> > > [...]
> > > > > Good job! (This also gives me the opportunity to point out to you again that "element for element" does not mean "one after the other".
> > > > "unter beidseitiger Wahrung der Rangfolge ihrer Elemente auf einander beziehen, abbilden lassen" [G. Cantor, letter to R. Lipschitz (19 Nov 1883)]
> > > That does not say or mean "one after the other".
> >
> > Try to learn German. "Unter beidseitiger Wahrung der Rangfolge" means one after the other in the given order.
> It does *NOT*! All it means is that n < m iff f(n) < f(m). It does *NOT* mean that f(n) has to be constructed before f(m).

There is no time in mathematics. It means that for every element we can find its position with respect to the other elements in the given order. That is what we mean by

Element für Element (Cantor)

aufeinander abzählen lassen. (Cantor)

Sind M und N zwei wohlg. M. von verschiedenen Typen,  und  Zeichen für diese beiden Typen, so muss nothwendig bei dem Versuche sie aufeinander abzuzählen von der einen Menge ein Rest bleiben; (Cantor)

Regards, WM

Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence

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From: chris.m....@gmail.com (Chris M. Thomasson)
Newsgroups: sci.math
Subject: Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence
Date: Fri, 13 May 2022 15:16:51 -0700
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 by: Chris M. Thomasson - Fri, 13 May 2022 22:16 UTC

On 5/13/2022 1:21 PM, WM wrote:
> horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Freitag, 13. Mai 2022 um 19:28:18 UTC+2:
>> On Friday, 13 May 2022 at 13:55:23 UTC-3, WM wrote:
>>> horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Donnerstag, 12. Mai 2022 um 17:41:31 UTC+2:
>>>> On Thursday, 12 May 2022 at 11:08:32 UTC-3, WM wrote:
>>>>> horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Donnerstag, 12. Mai 2022 um 15:42:01 UTC+2:
>>>>>> On Thursday, 12 May 2022 at 10:05:38 UTC-3, WM wrote:
>>>>>>> horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Mittwoch, 11. Mai 2022 um 21:12:10 UTC+2:
>>>> [...]
>>>>>> Good job! (This also gives me the opportunity to point out to you again that "element for element" does not mean "one after the other".
>>>>> "unter beidseitiger Wahrung der Rangfolge ihrer Elemente auf einander beziehen, abbilden lassen" [G. Cantor, letter to R. Lipschitz (19 Nov 1883)]
>>>> That does not say or mean "one after the other".
>>>
>>> Try to learn German. "Unter beidseitiger Wahrung der Rangfolge" means one after the other in the given order.
>> It does *NOT*! All it means is that n < m iff f(n) < f(m). It does *NOT* mean that f(n) has to be constructed before f(m).
>
> There is no time in mathematics.

Dark number time 0... Oh shit zero is no longer dark... Have you ever
thought about zero? If so, how long did it take you to think about it.
Time is now introduced. ;^)

> It means that for every element we can find its position with respect to the other elements in the given order. That is what we mean by
>
> Element für Element (Cantor)
>
> aufeinander abzählen lassen. (Cantor)
>
> Sind M und N zwei wohlg. M. von verschiedenen Typen,  und  Zeichen für diese beiden Typen, so muss nothwendig bei dem Versuche sie aufeinander abzuzählen von der einen Menge ein Rest bleiben; (Cantor)
>
> Regards, WM
>
>

Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence

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From: inva...@invalid.com (sergio)
Newsgroups: sci.math
Subject: Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence
Date: Fri, 13 May 2022 22:21:12 -0500
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 by: sergio - Sat, 14 May 2022 03:21 UTC

On 5/13/2022 5:16 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
> On 5/13/2022 1:21 PM, WM wrote:
>> horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Freitag, 13. Mai 2022 um 19:28:18 UTC+2:
>>> On Friday, 13 May 2022 at 13:55:23 UTC-3, WM wrote:
>>>> horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Donnerstag, 12. Mai 2022 um 17:41:31 UTC+2:
>>>>> On Thursday, 12 May 2022 at 11:08:32 UTC-3, WM wrote:
>>>>>> horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Donnerstag, 12. Mai 2022 um 15:42:01 UTC+2:
>>>>>>> On Thursday, 12 May 2022 at 10:05:38 UTC-3, WM wrote:
>>>>>>>> horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Mittwoch, 11. Mai 2022 um 21:12:10 UTC+2:
>>>>> [...]
>>>>>>> Good job! (This also gives me the opportunity to point out to you again that "element for element" does not mean "one after the other".
>>>>>> "unter beidseitiger Wahrung der Rangfolge ihrer Elemente auf einander beziehen, abbilden lassen" [G. Cantor, letter to R. Lipschitz (19 Nov 1883)]
>>>>> That does not say or mean "one after the other".
>>>>
>>>> Try to learn German. "Unter beidseitiger Wahrung der Rangfolge" means one after the other in the given order.
>>> It does *NOT*! All it means is that n < m iff f(n) < f(m). It does *NOT* mean that f(n) has to be constructed before f(m).
>>
>> There is no time in mathematics.
>
> Dark number time 0... Oh shit zero is no longer dark... Have you ever thought about zero? If so, how long did it take you to think about it. Time is now
> introduced. ;^)

these are deep problems for dark numbers.

How many people that glance at a 0, actually think "that is a 0" ? hardly any.

do all 0's look the same ?

How long does it take to rap,( tap, barcode, color of the rainbow, flashing light) a 0 ? infinity !!

>
>
>> It means that for every element we can find its position with respect to the other elements in the given order. That is what we mean by
>>
>> Element für Element (Cantor)
>>
>> aufeinander abzählen lassen. (Cantor)
>>
>> Sind M und N zwei wohlg. M. von verschiedenen Typen,  und  Zeichen für diese beiden Typen, so muss nothwendig bei dem Versuche sie aufeinander
>> abzuzählen von der einen Menge ein Rest bleiben; (Cantor)
>>
>> Regards, WM
>>
>>
>

Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence

<38686ea6-6f10-41ab-91a0-8001356fe95dn@googlegroups.com>

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Subject: Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence
From: zelos.ma...@gmail.com (zelos...@gmail.com)
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 by: zelos...@gmail.com - Mon, 16 May 2022 08:31 UTC

fredag 13 maj 2022 kl. 22:21:38 UTC+2 skrev WM:
> horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Freitag, 13. Mai 2022 um 19:28:18 UTC+2:
> > On Friday, 13 May 2022 at 13:55:23 UTC-3, WM wrote:
> > > horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Donnerstag, 12. Mai 2022 um 17:41:31 UTC+2:
> > > > On Thursday, 12 May 2022 at 11:08:32 UTC-3, WM wrote:
> > > > > horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Donnerstag, 12. Mai 2022 um 15:42:01 UTC+2:
> > > > > > On Thursday, 12 May 2022 at 10:05:38 UTC-3, WM wrote:
> > > > > > > horand....@gmail.com schrieb am Mittwoch, 11. Mai 2022 um 21:12:10 UTC+2:
> > > > [...]
> > > > > > Good job! (This also gives me the opportunity to point out to you again that "element for element" does not mean "one after the other".
> > > > > "unter beidseitiger Wahrung der Rangfolge ihrer Elemente auf einander beziehen, abbilden lassen" [G. Cantor, letter to R. Lipschitz (19 Nov 1883)]
> > > > That does not say or mean "one after the other".
> > >
> > > Try to learn German. "Unter beidseitiger Wahrung der Rangfolge" means one after the other in the given order.
> > It does *NOT*! All it means is that n < m iff f(n) < f(m). It does *NOT* mean that f(n) has to be constructed before f(m).
> There is no time in mathematics. It means that for every element we can find its position with respect to the other elements in the given order. That is what we mean by
>
> Element für Element (Cantor)
>
> aufeinander abzählen lassen. (Cantor)
>
> Sind M und N zwei wohlg. M. von verschiedenen Typen,  und  Zeichen für diese beiden Typen, so muss nothwendig bei dem Versuche sie aufeinander abzuzählen von der einen Menge ein Rest bleiben; (Cantor)
>
> Regards, WM
notice how you STILL have not been able to define what dark numbers.

Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence

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Subject: Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence
From: askaske...@gmail.com (WM)
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 by: WM - Mon, 16 May 2022 14:36 UTC

zelos...@gmail.com schrieb am Montag, 16. Mai 2022 um 10:31:06 UTC+2:
> fredag 13 maj 2022 kl. 22:21:38 UTC+2 skrev WM:

> > Sind M und N zwei wohlg. M. von verschiedenen Typen,  und  Zeichen für diese beiden Typen, so muss nothwendig bei dem Versuche sie aufeinander abzuzählen von der einen Menge ein Rest bleiben; (Cantor)
> >
> notice how you STILL have not been able to define what dark numbers.

They are only collectively definable. As Cantor says above: The attempt to count an uncountable set will necessarily leave a remainder. But since we never reach the end of the countable set and therefore never come to prove the remainder in the uncountable set, the end of the countable set is proved as dark already.

Regards, WM

Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence

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From: inva...@invalid.com (sergio)
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Subject: Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence
Date: Mon, 16 May 2022 10:55:14 -0500
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 by: sergio - Mon, 16 May 2022 15:55 UTC

On 5/16/2022 9:36 AM, WM wrote:
> zelos...@gmail.com schrieb am Montag, 16. Mai 2022 um 10:31:06 UTC+2:
>> fredag 13 maj 2022 kl. 22:21:38 UTC+2 skrev WM:
>
>>> Sind M und N zwei wohlg. M. von verschiedenen Typen,  und  Zeichen für diese beiden Typen, so muss nothwendig bei dem Versuche sie aufeinander abzuzählen von der einen Menge ein Rest bleiben; (Cantor)
>>>
>> notice how you STILL have not been able to define what dark numbers.
>
> They are only collectively definable. As Cantor says above: The attempt to count an uncountable set will necessarily leave a remainder.

That is not what Cantor says at all.

> But since we never reach the end of the countable set and therefore never come to prove the remainder in the uncountable set, the end of the countable set is proved as dark already.

Wrong, the countable set is never dark.

>
> Regards, WM

Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence

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Subject: Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence
From: zelos.ma...@gmail.com (zelos...@gmail.com)
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 by: zelos...@gmail.com - Tue, 17 May 2022 05:07 UTC

måndag 16 maj 2022 kl. 16:36:35 UTC+2 skrev WM:
> zelos...@gmail.com schrieb am Montag, 16. Mai 2022 um 10:31:06 UTC+2:
> > fredag 13 maj 2022 kl. 22:21:38 UTC+2 skrev WM:
>
> > > Sind M und N zwei wohlg. M. von verschiedenen Typen,  und  Zeichen für diese beiden Typen, so muss nothwendig bei dem Versuche sie aufeinander abzuzählen von der einen Menge ein Rest bleiben; (Cantor)
> > >
> > notice how you STILL have not been able to define what dark numbers.
> They are only collectively definable.

And what does that mean? Define it in first order logic.

>As Cantor says above: The attempt to count an uncountable set will necessarily leave a remainder. But since we never reach the end of the countable set and therefore never come to prove the remainder in the uncountable set, the end of the countable set is proved as dark already.
>
> Regards, WM

Meaningless garbage.

You fail again

Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence

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Subject: Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence
From: zelos.ma...@gmail.com (zelos...@gmail.com)
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 by: zelos...@gmail.com - Thu, 19 May 2022 06:20 UTC

tisdag 17 maj 2022 kl. 07:07:07 UTC+2 skrev zelos...@gmail.com:
> måndag 16 maj 2022 kl. 16:36:35 UTC+2 skrev WM:
> > zelos...@gmail.com schrieb am Montag, 16. Mai 2022 um 10:31:06 UTC+2:
> > > fredag 13 maj 2022 kl. 22:21:38 UTC+2 skrev WM:
> >
> > > > Sind M und N zwei wohlg. M. von verschiedenen Typen,  und  Zeichen für diese beiden Typen, so muss nothwendig bei dem Versuche sie aufeinander abzuzählen von der einen Menge ein Rest bleiben; (Cantor)
> > > >
> > > notice how you STILL have not been able to define what dark numbers.
> > They are only collectively definable.
> And what does that mean? Define it in first order logic.
> >As Cantor says above: The attempt to count an uncountable set will necessarily leave a remainder. But since we never reach the end of the countable set and therefore never come to prove the remainder in the uncountable set, the end of the countable set is proved as dark already.
> >
> > Regards, WM
> Meaningless garbage.
>
> You fail again
you are a total failure WM

Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence

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Newsgroups: sci.math
Date: Sun, 29 May 2022 21:45:38 -0700 (PDT)
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Subject: Re: WM Challange, Dark property existence
From: zelos.ma...@gmail.com (zelos...@gmail.com)
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 by: zelos...@gmail.com - Mon, 30 May 2022 04:45 UTC

torsdag 19 maj 2022 kl. 08:20:58 UTC+2 skrev zelos...@gmail.com:
> tisdag 17 maj 2022 kl. 07:07:07 UTC+2 skrev zelos...@gmail.com:
> > måndag 16 maj 2022 kl. 16:36:35 UTC+2 skrev WM:
> > > zelos...@gmail.com schrieb am Montag, 16. Mai 2022 um 10:31:06 UTC+2:
> > > > fredag 13 maj 2022 kl. 22:21:38 UTC+2 skrev WM:
> > >
> > > > > Sind M und N zwei wohlg. M. von verschiedenen Typen,  und  Zeichen für diese beiden Typen, so muss nothwendig bei dem Versuche sie aufeinander abzuzählen von der einen Menge ein Rest bleiben; (Cantor)
> > > > >
> > > > notice how you STILL have not been able to define what dark numbers..
> > > They are only collectively definable.
> > And what does that mean? Define it in first order logic.
> > >As Cantor says above: The attempt to count an uncountable set will necessarily leave a remainder. But since we never reach the end of the countable set and therefore never come to prove the remainder in the uncountable set, the end of the countable set is proved as dark already.
> > >
> > > Regards, WM
> > Meaningless garbage.
> >
> > You fail again
> you are a total failure WM
And as we see, you still fail, pathetic

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