On 2022-08-05 1:08 AM, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
> BTR1701 <no_email@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>
>>> . . .
>
>> Well, I know we're supposed to hate everything Trump but this shit wasn't
>> happening under his policies.
>
>> Why is the United States the only country in the world that's racist if it
>> controls its own borders?
>
> The United States is obliged to accept assylum seekers under
> international treaty obligations enforced in federal statute.
>
> We've discussed tiny countries in Europe like The Netherlands. They
> accept all assylum seekers. They get a lawyer. They get a hearing within
> a month. If they don't qualify under the treaty definition, they are not
> paroled into The Netherlands and are sent back.
>
Canada has a process to determine if people are legitimate refugees too
but it takes MUCH longer than a month! We too have a big backlog and
despite our immense bureaucracy are years behind in the refugee
determination process. Our process is MUCH more complex than the Dutch
one. In fact, at one point it had not one, not two, but NINETEEN levels
of appeal, although I believe the Conservatives under Stephen Harper
reduced that somewhat. So, what happens to these refugee-wannabes while
waiting for the bureaucrats to determine their cases? They stay in this
country. I believe they can work too. And what happens if they lose
their final appeals? At that point, they can be deported but some of
them will have gone underground in the meantime so it will be difficult
to impossible to find them to deport them.

I saw a story in the paper the other day about a Nicaraguan national who
had been here in Canada for 31 YEARS waiting for his refugee
determination! He was, by his own admission, a Sandinista but swore that
he'd never tortured or killed anybody although he had seen those things
done. He claimed to be in fear of his life if sent back and said he was
very disappointed in Canada for treating him this way.

Another case I heard about a few years ago involved a guy in jail for
attempted murder who was supposed to be deported to his native country,
somewhere in the Caribbean if I recall correctly. In order to deport
him, the government needed to take his picture for travel documents but
every time they tried to take his picture, he refused to co-operate. (I
don't know why they simply didn't hold him so that they could take his
picture against his will.) His lawyer took the matter to court and the
judge not only found that the criminal couldn't be deported since he
wasn't co-operating with the picture-taking, he let him out of jail and
back into Canadian society. I wish I'd bookmarked that story (or printed
it since it might have been pre-Internet) so that I could get all the
details but I've stated the gist of it as best I can remember.

> Trump mostly stopped the assylum hearing process, which was already
> years backed up and had an extreme shortage of administrative law
> judges. This was something Trump did beyond the Remain In Mexico policy.
>
> There's absolutely no question that Trump did the wrong thing here.

--
Rhino

BTR1701 wrote:

> On Aug 4, 2022 at 8:04:10 PM PDT, "moviePig"
> <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
>
>> On 8/4/2022 9:32 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>> On Aug 4, 2022 at 2:57:53 PM PDT, "moviePig"
>>> <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 8/4/2022 3:48 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>> On Aug 4, 2022 at 9:06:22 AM PDT, "moviePig"
>>>>> <pwallace@moviepig.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 8/4/2022 11:44 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>>>> moviePig <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 8/4/2022 12:50 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> According to DHS disclosures to the federal
>>>>>>>>> court hearing the
>>>>>>>>> case Biden
>>>>>>>>> v. Texas, the Biden Administration has
>>>>>>>>> intentionally released 1,049,532 illegals
>>>>>>>>> into the country since Old Joe was
>>>>>>>>> inaugurated. That's more
>>>>>>>>> people
>>>>>>>>> than the population of Joe's home state of
>>>>>>>>> Delaware.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> And that doesn't even include the
>>>>>>>>> 'got-aways'-- the illegals who
>>>>>>>>> managed to
>>>>>>>>> cross over, evade the Border Patrol, and
>>>>>>>>> disappear into the countryside. DHS estimates
>>>>>>>>> that number to be an additional 700,000 to
>>>>>>>>> one million illegals.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> But it's rrraaaaciiissst to talk about
>>>>>>>>> Democrats intentionally trying to change the
>>>>>>>>> demographics of the nation and dilute the
>>>>>>>>> votes of the
>>>>>>>>> current
>>>>>>>>> citizenry, even as they've intentionally
>>>>>>>>> opened the border for an entire state's worth
>>>>>>>>> of illegal aliens with the promise of no end
>>>>>>>>> in sight.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And the solution you recommend is?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Well, I know we're supposed to hate everything
>>>>>>> Trump but this shit
>>>>>>> wasn't
>>>>>>> happening under his policies.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Why is the United States the only country in
>>>>>>> the world that's
>>>>>>> racist if it
>>>>>>> controls its own borders?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Somehow, I think charges of charges of racism
>>>>>> aren't the big issue here.
>>>>>
>>>>> The hypocrisy of DC Democrats in decrying the fact
>>>>> that *they* are now
>>>>> being
>>>>> asked to deal with a tiny fraction of the crushing
>>>>> burden that Texas and Arizona have been forced to
>>>>> shoulder for years (and which they apparently think
>>>>> those states should *still* be dealing with so they
>>>>> won't have to)
>>>>> just
>>>>> leaves me speechless.
>>>>>
>>>>> ----------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2022/08/gop-governors-created-a-
migrant-crisis-in-washington
>>>>>
>>>>> "The Border Has Come to D.C.": GOP Governor Have
>>>>> Successfully Created a Migrant Crisis in Washington
>>>>>
>>>>> It has been a "somewhat herculean effort," Nadeau
>>>>> tells me, but an unsustainable one. "This is a
>>>>> crisis," the councilmember says. "We are a
>>>>> sanctuary city. We welcome folks. But certainly we
>>>>> are not prepared for
>>>>> this.
>>>>> This is going to strain our system."
>>>>>
>>>>> [Well, no shit. But it's okay to 'strain the
>>>>> [systems' of Texas and
>>>>> Arizona,
>>>>> amirite? You've virtue-signaled to everyone that
>>>>> you're a sanctuary
>>>>> city and
>>>>> now you have to walk your talk. Boo-hoo.]
>>>>>
>>>>> Bowser echoed the latter sentiment last Thursday as
>>>>> she called for the National Guard to be activated;
>>>>> she said the city had reached its "tipping point",
>>>>> but while Nadeau and groups on the ground have been
>>>>> calling for
>>>>> action
>>>>> by Bowser and the federal government for three
>>>>> months now, they say
>>>>> military
>>>>> response echoes the hardline Abbott and Ducey
>>>>> policies that moved the
>>>>> border
>>>>> crisis to the Capitol.
>>>>>
>>>>> ["They should have just kept that border crisis
>>>>> [down south where all the
>>>>> hicks
>>>>> and rubes live and just suffered through it for the
>>>>> good of the Agenda.
>>>>> How
>>>>> dare they send it here and dump it in our laps? I
>>>>> mean sure, we created
>>>>> the
>>>>> problem, but we shouldn't have to deal with it.
>>>>> That's what the little
>>>>> people
>>>>> in flyover states are for."]
>>>>>
>>>>> "It's really disappointing to see the mayor
>>>>> engaging in basically the same xenophobic,
>>>>> invasionist rhetoric" as Abbott, Fischer says.
>>>>>
>>>>> [moviePig was dubious that the very notion of
>>>>> [America controlling its own
>>>>> borders is painted as racist by the leftist
>>>>> intelligentsia... well, right there's Exhibit
>>>>> Number One above.]
>>>>
>>>> Is xenoophobia racism? Who knew?
>>>
>>> Everything is racism. Haven't you been keeping up?
>>>
>>> I just heard on the news today that California's
>>> historic Proposition 13, which has kept the government
>>> from raising people's property taxes through
>>> the
>>> roof for close to 40 years now has just been declared
>>> racist.
>>
>> By whom? Anybody who's anybody?
>
> Well, it's a bunch of leftist academics and activists who
> call themselves the Opportunity Institute. Do they count?
>
>
>
https://static1.squarespace.com/static/55f70367e4b0974cf2b82009/t/62b34bd3
19072b7c70d02020/1655917530375/OI%2BReport%2BProp%2B13%2BFinal.pdf
>
> It always seemed to me that the worst victims of an
> out-of-control government raising property taxes sky-high
> would be the disadvantaged, the marginalized, and the
> bipocks. The rich might not like being gouged, but they
> could pay the high taxes. They wouldn't be forced out of
> their homes over it. The poor and the bipocks are the ones
> who could lose everything and had the most to gain from
> Prop 13's protections.
>
> But in an era where literally everything is racist,
> apparently a law that protects bipocks from losing their
> homes is somehow racist as well.
>
>
Okay, I probably need to get out more, but can someone
please explain to me what a "bipock" is supposed to be?

BTR1701 wrote:

> On Aug 4, 2022 at 8:04:10 PM PDT, "moviePig"
> <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
>
>> On 8/4/2022 9:32 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>> On Aug 4, 2022 at 2:57:53 PM PDT, "moviePig"
>>> <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 8/4/2022 3:48 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>> On Aug 4, 2022 at 9:06:22 AM PDT, "moviePig"
>>>>> <pwallace@moviepig.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 8/4/2022 11:44 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>>>> moviePig <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 8/4/2022 12:50 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> According to DHS disclosures to the federal
>>>>>>>>> court hearing the
>>>>>>>>> case Biden
>>>>>>>>> v. Texas, the Biden Administration has
>>>>>>>>> intentionally released 1,049,532 illegals
>>>>>>>>> into the country since Old Joe was
>>>>>>>>> inaugurated. That's more
>>>>>>>>> people
>>>>>>>>> than the population of Joe's home state of
>>>>>>>>> Delaware.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> And that doesn't even include the
>>>>>>>>> 'got-aways'-- the illegals who
>>>>>>>>> managed to
>>>>>>>>> cross over, evade the Border Patrol, and
>>>>>>>>> disappear into the countryside. DHS estimates
>>>>>>>>> that number to be an additional 700,000 to
>>>>>>>>> one million illegals.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> But it's rrraaaaciiissst to talk about
>>>>>>>>> Democrats intentionally trying to change the
>>>>>>>>> demographics of the nation and dilute the
>>>>>>>>> votes of the
>>>>>>>>> current
>>>>>>>>> citizenry, even as they've intentionally
>>>>>>>>> opened the border for an entire state's worth
>>>>>>>>> of illegal aliens with the promise of no end
>>>>>>>>> in sight.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And the solution you recommend is?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Well, I know we're supposed to hate everything
>>>>>>> Trump but this shit
>>>>>>> wasn't
>>>>>>> happening under his policies.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Why is the United States the only country in
>>>>>>> the world that's
>>>>>>> racist if it
>>>>>>> controls its own borders?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Somehow, I think charges of charges of racism
>>>>>> aren't the big issue here.
>>>>>
>>>>> The hypocrisy of DC Democrats in decrying the fact
>>>>> that *they* are now
>>>>> being
>>>>> asked to deal with a tiny fraction of the crushing
>>>>> burden that Texas and Arizona have been forced to
>>>>> shoulder for years (and which they apparently think
>>>>> those states should *still* be dealing with so they
>>>>> won't have to)
>>>>> just
>>>>> leaves me speechless.
>>>>>
>>>>> ----------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2022/08/gop-governors-created-a-
migrant-crisis-in-washington
>>>>>
>>>>> "The Border Has Come to D.C.": GOP Governor Have
>>>>> Successfully Created a Migrant Crisis in Washington
>>>>>
>>>>> It has been a "somewhat herculean effort," Nadeau
>>>>> tells me, but an unsustainable one. "This is a
>>>>> crisis," the councilmember says. "We are a
>>>>> sanctuary city. We welcome folks. But certainly we
>>>>> are not prepared for
>>>>> this.
>>>>> This is going to strain our system."
>>>>>
>>>>> [Well, no shit. But it's okay to 'strain the
>>>>> [systems' of Texas and
>>>>> Arizona,
>>>>> amirite? You've virtue-signaled to everyone that
>>>>> you're a sanctuary
>>>>> city and
>>>>> now you have to walk your talk. Boo-hoo.]
>>>>>
>>>>> Bowser echoed the latter sentiment last Thursday as
>>>>> she called for the National Guard to be activated;
>>>>> she said the city had reached its "tipping point",
>>>>> but while Nadeau and groups on the ground have been
>>>>> calling for
>>>>> action
>>>>> by Bowser and the federal government for three
>>>>> months now, they say
>>>>> military
>>>>> response echoes the hardline Abbott and Ducey
>>>>> policies that moved the
>>>>> border
>>>>> crisis to the Capitol.
>>>>>
>>>>> ["They should have just kept that border crisis
>>>>> [down south where all the
>>>>> hicks
>>>>> and rubes live and just suffered through it for the
>>>>> good of the Agenda.
>>>>> How
>>>>> dare they send it here and dump it in our laps? I
>>>>> mean sure, we created
>>>>> the
>>>>> problem, but we shouldn't have to deal with it.
>>>>> That's what the little
>>>>> people
>>>>> in flyover states are for."]
>>>>>
>>>>> "It's really disappointing to see the mayor
>>>>> engaging in basically the same xenophobic,
>>>>> invasionist rhetoric" as Abbott, Fischer says.
>>>>>
>>>>> [moviePig was dubious that the very notion of
>>>>> [America controlling its own
>>>>> borders is painted as racist by the leftist
>>>>> intelligentsia... well, right there's Exhibit
>>>>> Number One above.]
>>>>
>>>> Is xenoophobia racism? Who knew?
>>>
>>> Everything is racism. Haven't you been keeping up?
>>>
>>> I just heard on the news today that California's
>>> historic Proposition 13, which has kept the government
>>> from raising people's property taxes through
>>> the
>>> roof for close to 40 years now has just been declared
>>> racist.
>>
>> By whom? Anybody who's anybody?
>
> Well, it's a bunch of leftist academics and activists who
> call themselves the Opportunity Institute. Do they count?
>
>
>
https://static1.squarespace.com/static/55f70367e4b0974cf2b82009/t/62b34bd3
19072b7c70d02020/1655917530375/OI%2BReport%2BProp%2B13%2BFinal.pdf
>
> It always seemed to me that the worst victims of an
> out-of-control government raising property taxes sky-high
> would be the disadvantaged, the marginalized, and the
> bipocks. The rich might not like being gouged, but they
> could pay the high taxes. They wouldn't be forced out of
> their homes over it. The poor and the bipocks are the ones
> who could lose everything and had the most to gain from
> Prop 13's protections.
>
> But in an era where literally everything is racist,
> apparently a law that protects bipocks from losing their
> homes is somehow racist as well.
>
>
Okay, I probably need to get out more, but can someone
please explain to me what a "bipock" is supposed to be?

On 2022-08-05 9:12 AM, Nyssa wrote:
> BTR1701 wrote:
>
>> On Aug 4, 2022 at 8:04:10 PM PDT, "moviePig"
>> <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 8/4/2022 9:32 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>> On Aug 4, 2022 at 2:57:53 PM PDT, "moviePig"
>>>> <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 8/4/2022 3:48 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>>> On Aug 4, 2022 at 9:06:22 AM PDT, "moviePig"
>>>>>> <pwallace@moviepig.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 8/4/2022 11:44 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>>>>> moviePig <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 8/4/2022 12:50 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> According to DHS disclosures to the federal
>>>>>>>>>> court hearing the
>>>>>>>>>> case Biden
>>>>>>>>>> v. Texas, the Biden Administration has
>>>>>>>>>> intentionally released 1,049,532 illegals
>>>>>>>>>> into the country since Old Joe was
>>>>>>>>>> inaugurated. That's more
>>>>>>>>>> people
>>>>>>>>>> than the population of Joe's home state of
>>>>>>>>>> Delaware.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> And that doesn't even include the
>>>>>>>>>> 'got-aways'-- the illegals who
>>>>>>>>>> managed to
>>>>>>>>>> cross over, evade the Border Patrol, and
>>>>>>>>>> disappear into the countryside. DHS estimates
>>>>>>>>>> that number to be an additional 700,000 to
>>>>>>>>>> one million illegals.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> But it's rrraaaaciiissst to talk about
>>>>>>>>>> Democrats intentionally trying to change the
>>>>>>>>>> demographics of the nation and dilute the
>>>>>>>>>> votes of the
>>>>>>>>>> current
>>>>>>>>>> citizenry, even as they've intentionally
>>>>>>>>>> opened the border for an entire state's worth
>>>>>>>>>> of illegal aliens with the promise of no end
>>>>>>>>>> in sight.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> And the solution you recommend is?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Well, I know we're supposed to hate everything
>>>>>>>> Trump but this shit
>>>>>>>> wasn't
>>>>>>>> happening under his policies.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Why is the United States the only country in
>>>>>>>> the world that's
>>>>>>>> racist if it
>>>>>>>> controls its own borders?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Somehow, I think charges of charges of racism
>>>>>>> aren't the big issue here.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The hypocrisy of DC Democrats in decrying the fact
>>>>>> that *they* are now
>>>>>> being
>>>>>> asked to deal with a tiny fraction of the crushing
>>>>>> burden that Texas and Arizona have been forced to
>>>>>> shoulder for years (and which they apparently think
>>>>>> those states should *still* be dealing with so they
>>>>>> won't have to)
>>>>>> just
>>>>>> leaves me speechless.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----------------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2022/08/gop-governors-created-a-
> migrant-crisis-in-washington
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "The Border Has Come to D.C.": GOP Governor Have
>>>>>> Successfully Created a Migrant Crisis in Washington
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It has been a "somewhat herculean effort," Nadeau
>>>>>> tells me, but an unsustainable one. "This is a
>>>>>> crisis," the councilmember says. "We are a
>>>>>> sanctuary city. We welcome folks. But certainly we
>>>>>> are not prepared for
>>>>>> this.
>>>>>> This is going to strain our system."
>>>>>>
>>>>>> [Well, no shit. But it's okay to 'strain the
>>>>>> [systems' of Texas and
>>>>>> Arizona,
>>>>>> amirite? You've virtue-signaled to everyone that
>>>>>> you're a sanctuary
>>>>>> city and
>>>>>> now you have to walk your talk. Boo-hoo.]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Bowser echoed the latter sentiment last Thursday as
>>>>>> she called for the National Guard to be activated;
>>>>>> she said the city had reached its "tipping point",
>>>>>> but while Nadeau and groups on the ground have been
>>>>>> calling for
>>>>>> action
>>>>>> by Bowser and the federal government for three
>>>>>> months now, they say
>>>>>> military
>>>>>> response echoes the hardline Abbott and Ducey
>>>>>> policies that moved the
>>>>>> border
>>>>>> crisis to the Capitol.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ["They should have just kept that border crisis
>>>>>> [down south where all the
>>>>>> hicks
>>>>>> and rubes live and just suffered through it for the
>>>>>> good of the Agenda.
>>>>>> How
>>>>>> dare they send it here and dump it in our laps? I
>>>>>> mean sure, we created
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> problem, but we shouldn't have to deal with it.
>>>>>> That's what the little
>>>>>> people
>>>>>> in flyover states are for."]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "It's really disappointing to see the mayor
>>>>>> engaging in basically the same xenophobic,
>>>>>> invasionist rhetoric" as Abbott, Fischer says.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> [moviePig was dubious that the very notion of
>>>>>> [America controlling its own
>>>>>> borders is painted as racist by the leftist
>>>>>> intelligentsia... well, right there's Exhibit
>>>>>> Number One above.]
>>>>>
>>>>> Is xenoophobia racism? Who knew?
>>>>
>>>> Everything is racism. Haven't you been keeping up?
>>>>
>>>> I just heard on the news today that California's
>>>> historic Proposition 13, which has kept the government
>>>> from raising people's property taxes through
>>>> the
>>>> roof for close to 40 years now has just been declared
>>>> racist.
>>>
>>> By whom? Anybody who's anybody?
>>
>> Well, it's a bunch of leftist academics and activists who
>> call themselves the Opportunity Institute. Do they count?
>>
>>
>>
> https://static1.squarespace.com/static/55f70367e4b0974cf2b82009/t/62b34bd3
> 19072b7c70d02020/1655917530375/OI%2BReport%2BProp%2B13%2BFinal.pdf
>>
>> It always seemed to me that the worst victims of an
>> out-of-control government raising property taxes sky-high
>> would be the disadvantaged, the marginalized, and the
>> bipocks. The rich might not like being gouged, but they
>> could pay the high taxes. They wouldn't be forced out of
>> their homes over it. The poor and the bipocks are the ones
>> who could lose everything and had the most to gain from
>> Prop 13's protections.
>>
>> But in an era where literally everything is racist,
>> apparently a law that protects bipocks from losing their
>> homes is somehow racist as well.
>>
>>
> Okay, I probably need to get out more, but can someone
> please explain to me what a "bipock" is supposed to be?
>
I think he's giving you an alternate spelling of BIPOC, which is
something-something-People-Of-Colour. I want to say that the "B" stands
for "Black" and the "I" for Indigenous but blacks are already "people of
colour" - as are indigenous people - so that seems redundant. But given
the "progressive" obsession with virtue-signalling, I'm willing to
believe they put blacks first just to emphasize that they were
forgetting them and perhaps the same for indigenous people.

> moviePig
> > Ed Stasiak
> >
> > If illegals can’t work here or find a place to live, they’ll leave.
>
> You're proposing an official change in America's self-image, from
> a welcomer of freedom-yearning huddled masses, to an
> I've-got-mine-you-get-yours gated community with attack dogs.

A later bit of propaganda added to the Statue of Liberty, but the fact
is that almost all nations outside the West have very strict immigration
laws.

Mexico for instance, requires potential immigrants to prove that they
have sufficient income or savings/pensions (something like $100K)
before they’ll even look at your application.

> One can debate the necessity of that shift in stance but not, afaics,
> the fact of it.

There is no “necessity” to flood the West with bazillions of dirt poor,
poorly educated, frequently criminally prone, 3rd world peasants, what’s
necessary is that they get their shit together in their _home nations_
instead of sponging off the West.

On 8/5/2022 12:13 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
> On Aug 4, 2022 at 8:04:10 PM PDT, "moviePig" <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
>
>> On 8/4/2022 9:32 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>> On Aug 4, 2022 at 2:57:53 PM PDT, "moviePig" <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 8/4/2022 3:48 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>> On Aug 4, 2022 at 9:06:22 AM PDT, "moviePig" <pwallace@moviepig.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 8/4/2022 11:44 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>>>> moviePig <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 8/4/2022 12:50 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> According to DHS disclosures to the federal court hearing the
>>>>>>>>> case Biden
>>>>>>>>> v. Texas, the Biden Administration has intentionally released 1,049,532
>>>>>>>>> illegals into the country since Old Joe was inaugurated. That's more
>>>>>>>>> people
>>>>>>>>> than the population of Joe's home state of Delaware.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> And that doesn't even include the 'got-aways'-- the illegals who
>>>>>>>>> managed to
>>>>>>>>> cross over, evade the Border Patrol, and disappear into the countryside.
>>>>>>>>> DHS estimates that number to be an additional 700,000 to one million
>>>>>>>>> illegals.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> But it's rrraaaaciiissst to talk about Democrats intentionally trying to
>>>>>>>>> change the demographics of the nation and dilute the votes of the
>>>>>>>>> current
>>>>>>>>> citizenry, even as they've intentionally opened the border for an entire
>>>>>>>>> state's worth of illegal aliens with the promise of no end in sight.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And the solution you recommend is?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Well, I know we're supposed to hate everything Trump but this shit
>>>>>>> wasn't
>>>>>>> happening under his policies.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Why is the United States the only country in the world that's
>>>>>>> racist if it
>>>>>>> controls its own borders?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Somehow, I think charges of charges of racism aren't the big issue here.
>>>>>
>>>>> The hypocrisy of DC Democrats in decrying the fact that *they* are now
>>>>> being
>>>>> asked to deal with a tiny fraction of the crushing burden that Texas and
>>>>> Arizona have been forced to shoulder for years (and which they apparently
>>>>> think those states should *still* be dealing with so they won't have to)
>>>>> just
>>>>> leaves me speechless.
>>>>>
>>>>> ----------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2022/08/gop-governors-created-a-migrant-crisis-in-washington
>>>>>
>>>>> "The Border Has Come to D.C.": GOP Governor Have Successfully Created a
>>>>> Migrant Crisis in Washington
>>>>>
>>>>> It has been a "somewhat herculean effort," Nadeau tells me, but an
>>>>> unsustainable one. "This is a crisis," the councilmember says. "We are a
>>>>> sanctuary city. We welcome folks. But certainly we are not prepared for
>>>>> this.
>>>>> This is going to strain our system."
>>>>>
>>>>> [Well, no shit. But it's okay to 'strain the systems' of Texas and
>>>>> Arizona,
>>>>> amirite? You've virtue-signaled to everyone that you're a sanctuary
>>>>> city and
>>>>> now you have to walk your talk. Boo-hoo.]
>>>>>
>>>>> Bowser echoed the latter sentiment last Thursday as she called for the
>>>>> National Guard to be activated; she said the city had reached its "tipping
>>>>> point", but while Nadeau and groups on the ground have been calling for
>>>>> action
>>>>> by Bowser and the federal government for three months now, they say
>>>>> military
>>>>> response echoes the hardline Abbott and Ducey policies that moved the
>>>>> border
>>>>> crisis to the Capitol.
>>>>>
>>>>> ["They should have just kept that border crisis down south where all the
>>>>> hicks
>>>>> and rubes live and just suffered through it for the good of the Agenda.
>>>>> How
>>>>> dare they send it here and dump it in our laps? I mean sure, we created
>>>>> the
>>>>> problem, but we shouldn't have to deal with it. That's what the little
>>>>> people
>>>>> in flyover states are for."]
>>>>>
>>>>> "It's really disappointing to see the mayor engaging in basically the same
>>>>> xenophobic, invasionist rhetoric" as Abbott, Fischer says.
>>>>>
>>>>> [moviePig was dubious that the very notion of America controlling its own
>>>>> borders is painted as racist by the leftist intelligentsia... well, right
>>>>> there's Exhibit Number One above.]
>>>>
>>>> Is xenoophobia racism? Who knew?
>>>
>>> Everything is racism. Haven't you been keeping up?
>>>
>>> I just heard on the news today that California's historic Proposition 13,
>>> which has kept the government from raising people's property taxes through
>>> the
>>> roof for close to 40 years now has just been declared racist.
>>
>> By whom? Anybody who's anybody?
>
> Well, it's a bunch of leftist academics and activists who call themselves the
> Opportunity Institute. Do they count?

No. Nor does anyone who'd call themselves the "Opportunity Institute".

> https://static1.squarespace.com/static/55f70367e4b0974cf2b82009/t/62b34bd319072b7c70d02020/1655917530375/OI%2BReport%2BProp%2B13%2BFinal.pdf
>
> It always seemed to me that the worst victims of an out-of-control government
> raising property taxes sky-high would be the disadvantaged, the marginalized,
> and the bipocks. The rich might not like being gouged, but they could pay the
> high taxes. They wouldn't be forced out of their homes over it. The poor and
> the bipocks are the ones who could lose everything and had the most to gain
> from Prop 13's protections.
>
> But in an era where literally everything is racist, apparently a law that
> protects bipocks from losing their homes is somehow racist as well.

As far as I can squint, the headline says that racial inequities are
exacerbated, not sought, by Prop13 -- which I don't doubt, as the
disadvantaged are usually the ones to be further disadvantaged by
*anything*...

On 8/5/2022 6:56 AM, Ed Stasiak wrote:
>> moviePig
>>> Ed Stasiak
>>>
>>> If illegals can’t work here or find a place to live, they’ll leave.
>>
>> You're proposing an official change in America's self-image, from
>> a welcomer of freedom-yearning huddled masses, to an
>> I've-got-mine-you-get-yours gated community with attack dogs.
>
> A later bit of propaganda added to the Statue of Liberty, but the fact
> is that almost all nations outside the West have very strict immigration
> laws.
>
> Mexico for instance, requires potential immigrants to prove that they
> have sufficient income or savings/pensions (something like $100K)
> before they’ll even look at your application.
>
>> One can debate the necessity of that shift in stance but not, afaics,
>> the fact of it.
>
> There is no “necessity” to flood the West with bazillions of dirt poor,
> poorly educated, frequently criminally prone, 3rd world peasants, what’s
> necessary is that they get their shit together in their _home nations_
> instead of sponging off the West.
>
And how do they get their shit together in their home country when they
have very little money, no say in who their dictator is, and no voting
rights?

> suzeeq
> > Ed Stasiak
> >
> > There is no “necessity” to flood the West with bazillions of dirt poor,
> > poorly educated, frequently criminally prone, 3rd world peasants, what’s
> > necessary is that they get their shit together in their _home nations_
> > instead of sponging off the West.
> >
> And how do they get their shit together in their home country when they
> have very little money, no say in who their dictator is, and no voting
> rights?

Mexico ain't North Korea and the illegals flooding into the US from Mexico
Latin America are doing so for economic reasons.

On 8/5/2022 8:14 AM, Ed Stasiak wrote:
>> suzeeq
>>> Ed Stasiak
>>>
>>> There is no “necessity” to flood the West with bazillions of dirt poor,
>>> poorly educated, frequently criminally prone, 3rd world peasants, what’s
>>> necessary is that they get their shit together in their _home nations_
>>> instead of sponging off the West.
>>>
>> And how do they get their shit together in their home country when they
>> have very little money, no say in who their dictator is, and no voting
>> rights?
>
> Mexico ain't North Korea and the illegals flooding into the US from Mexico
> Latin America are doing so for economic reasons.
>
Central America still has dictators who rountinely murders people who
try to work against them.

> suzeeq
> > Ed Stasiak
> >
> > Mexico ain't North Korea and the illegals flooding into the US from Mexico
> > Latin America are doing so for economic reasons.
> >
> Central America still has dictators who rountinely murders people who
> try to work against them.

Sure, there's some of that but the Latin Americans in danger of this are
few and far between and in fact, they would actually be beneficial (legal)
immigrants to the U.S. as political activists like that tend to be from the
middle/upper class and thus have good educations and will have good
employment opportunities here, beneficial to both them and us.

But that's not who we're getting, we're being flooded with lower class poor
Latin Americans who their (possibly dictatorial) governments WANT to
expel, as they're an overall drain on society, so let the stupid American
tax payers pick up the check and deal with the problems.

Meanwhile, Wall Street gets bazillions of cheep worker drones who drive
down wages, benefits and employment protections for actual Americans
while providing more consumers to buy crappy Chinese made products...

In article <tcjbpe$d13v$1@solani.org>, suzeeq <suzee@imbris.com> wrote:

> On 8/5/2022 6:56 AM, Ed Stasiak wrote:
> >> moviePig
> >>> Ed Stasiak
> >>>
> >>> If illegals can’t work here or find a place to live, they’ll leave.
> >>
> >> You're proposing an official change in America's self-image, from
> >> a welcomer of freedom-yearning huddled masses, to an
> >> I've-got-mine-you-get-yours gated community with attack dogs.
> >
> > A later bit of propaganda added to the Statue of Liberty, but the fact
> > is that almost all nations outside the West have very strict immigration
> > laws.
> >
> > Mexico for instance, requires potential immigrants to prove that they
> > have sufficient income or savings/pensions (something like $100K)
> > before they’ll even look at your application.
> >
> >> One can debate the necessity of that shift in stance but not, afaics,
> >> the fact of it.
> >
> > There is no "necessity" to flood the West with bazillions of dirt poor,
> > poorly educated, frequently criminally prone, 3rd world peasants, what’s
> > necessary is that they get their shit together in their _home nations_
> > instead of sponging off the West.
> >
> And how do they get their shit together in their home country when they
> have very little money, no say in who their dictator is, and no voting
> rights?

And none of that entitles the entire population to move here.

Plus, you know, you just described the American revolutionaries. Aside
from a few leaders, they weren't rich, had no say who their dictator
was, and had no voting rights.

In article <tcjds6$d2kq$1@solani.org>, suzeeq <suzee@imbris.com> wrote:

> On 8/5/2022 8:14 AM, Ed Stasiak wrote:
> >> suzeeq
> >>> Ed Stasiak
> >>>
> >>> There is no "necessity" to flood the West with bazillions of dirt poor,
> >>> poorly educated, frequently criminally prone, 3rd world peasants, what's
> >>> necessary is that they get their shit together in their _home nations_
> >>> instead of sponging off the West.
> >>>
> >> And how do they get their shit together in their home country when they
> >> have very little money, no say in who their dictator is, and no voting
> >> rights?
> >
> > Mexico ain't North Korea and the illegals flooding into the US from Mexico
> > Latin America are doing so for economic reasons.
> >
> Central America still has dictators who rountinely murders people who
> try to work against them.

And if America took in every person whose government was authoritarian,
our population would be in the billions. How sustainable do you think
that would be?

In article <Y0aHK.628281$J0r9.249848@fx11.iad>,
moviePig <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:

> On 8/5/2022 12:13 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
> > On Aug 4, 2022 at 8:04:10 PM PDT, "moviePig" <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
> >
> >> On 8/4/2022 9:32 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
> >>> On Aug 4, 2022 at 2:57:53 PM PDT, "moviePig" <pwallace@moviepig.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> On 8/4/2022 3:48 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
> >>>>> On Aug 4, 2022 at 9:06:22 AM PDT, "moviePig"
> >>>>> <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> On 8/4/2022 11:44 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
> >>>>>>> moviePig <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> On 8/4/2022 12:50 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> According to DHS disclosures to the federal court hearing the
> >>>>>>>>> case Biden v. Texas, the Biden Administration has intentionally
> >>>>>>>>> released 1,049,532 illegals into the country since Old Joe was
> >>>>>>>>> inaugurated. That's more people than the population of Joe's
> >>>>>>>>> home state of Delaware.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> And that doesn't even include the 'got-aways'-- the illegals who
> >>>>>>>>> managed to cross over, evade the Border Patrol, and disappear
> >>>>>>>>> into the countryside. DHS estimates that number to be an additional
> >>>>>>>>> 700,000 to one million illegals.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> But it's rrraaaaciiissst to talk about Democrats intentionally
> >>>>>>>>> trying to change the demographics of the nation and dilute the
> >>>>>>>>> votes of the current citizenry, even as they've intentionally
> >>>>>>>>> opened the border for an entire state's worth of illegal aliens
> >>>>>>>>> with the promise of no end in sight.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> And the solution you recommend is?
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Well, I know we're supposed to hate everything Trump but this shit
> >>>>>>> wasn't happening under his policies.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Why is the United States the only country in the world that's racist
> >>>>>>> if it controls its own borders?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Somehow, I think charges of charges of racism aren't the big issue
> >>>>>> here.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> The hypocrisy of DC Democrats in decrying the fact that *they* are now
> >>>>> being asked to deal with a tiny fraction of the crushing burden that
> >>>>> Texas and Arizona have been forced to shoulder for years (and which
> >>>>> they apparently think those states should *still* be dealing with so
> >>>>> they won't have to) just leaves me speechless.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> ----------------------------
> >>>>>
> >>>>> https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2022/08/gop-governors-created-a-migrant-
> >>>>> crisis-in-washington
> >>>>>
> >>>>> "The Border Has Come to D.C.": GOP Governor Have Successfully Created a
> >>>>> Migrant Crisis in Washington
> >>>>>
> >>>>> It has been a "somewhat herculean effort," Nadeau tells me, but an
> >>>>> unsustainable one. "This is a crisis," the councilmember says. "We
> >>>>> are a sanctuary city. We welcome folks. But certainly we are not
> >>>>> prepared for this. This is going to strain our system."
> >>>>>
> >>>>> [Well, no shit. But it's okay to 'strain the systems' of Texas and
> >>>>> Arizona, amirite? You've virtue-signaled to everyone that you're a
> >>>>> sanctuary city and now you have to walk your talk. Boo-hoo.]
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Bowser echoed the latter sentiment last Thursday as she called for
> >>>>> the National Guard to be activated; she said the city had reached its
> >>>>> "tipping point", but while Nadeau and groups on the ground have been
> >>>>> calling for action by Bowser and the federal government for three
> >>>>> months now, they say military response echoes the hardline Abbott and
> >>>>> Ducey policies that moved the border crisis to the Capitol.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> ["They should have just kept that border crisis down south where
> >>>>> all the hicks and rubes live and just suffered through it for the good
> >>>>> of the Agenda. How dare they send it here and dump it in our laps? I
> >>>>> mean sure, we created the problem, but we shouldn't have to deal with
> >>>>> it. That's what the little people in flyover states are for."]
> >>>>>
> >>>>> "It's really disappointing to see the mayor engaging in basically
> >>>>> the same xenophobic, invasionist rhetoric" as Abbott, Fischer says.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> [moviePig was dubious that the very notion of America controlling its
> >>>>> own borders is painted as racist by the leftist intelligentsia...
> >>>>> well, right there's Exhibit Number One above.]
> >>>>
> >>>> Is xenoophobia racism? Who knew?
> >>>
> >>> Everything is racism. Haven't you been keeping up?
> >>>
> >>> I just heard on the news today that California's historic Proposition 13,
> >>> which has kept the government from raising people's property taxes
> >>> through the roof for close to 40 years now has just been declared racist.
> >>
> >> By whom? Anybody who's anybody?
> >
> > Well, it's a bunch of leftist academics and activists who call themselves
> > the Opportunity Institute. Do they count?
>
> No. Nor does anyone who'd call themselves the "Opportunity Institute".

So what criteria does one have to meet to be "anybody"?

> > https://static1.squarespace.com/static/55f70367e4b0974cf2b82009/t/62b34bd319
> > 072b7c70d02020/1655917530375/OI%2BReport%2BProp%2B13%2BFinal.pdf
> >
> > It always seemed to me that the worst victims of an out-of-control
> > government raising property taxes sky-high would be the disadvantaged, the
> > marginalized, and the bipocks. The rich might not like being gouged,
> > but they could pay the high taxes. They wouldn't be forced out of their
> > homes over it. The poor and the bipocks are the ones who could lose
> > everything and had the most to gain from Prop 13's protections.
> >
> > But in an era where literally everything is racist, apparently a law that
> > protects bipocks from losing their homes is somehow racist as well.
>
> As far as I can squint, the headline says that racial inequities are
> exacerbated, not sought, by Prop13 -- which I don't doubt, as the
> disadvantaged are usually the ones to be further disadvantaged by
> *anything*...

On 2022-08-05 11:08 AM, suzeeq wrote:
> On 8/5/2022 6:56 AM, Ed Stasiak wrote:
>>> moviePig
>>>> Ed Stasiak
>>>>
>>>> If illegals can’t work here or find a place to live, they’ll leave.
>>>
>>> You're proposing an official change in America's self-image, from
>>> a welcomer of freedom-yearning huddled masses, to an
>>> I've-got-mine-you-get-yours gated community with attack dogs.
>>
>> A later bit of propaganda added to the Statue of Liberty, but the fact
>> is that almost all nations outside the West have very strict immigration
>> laws.
>>
>> Mexico for instance, requires potential immigrants to prove that they
>> have sufficient income or savings/pensions (something like $100K)
>> before they’ll even look at your application.
>>
>>> One can debate the necessity of that shift in stance but not, afaics,
>>> the fact of it.
>>
>> There is no “necessity” to flood the West with bazillions of dirt poor,
>> poorly educated, frequently criminally prone, 3rd world peasants, what’s
>> necessary is that they get their shit together in their _home nations_
>> instead of sponging off the West.
>>
> And how do they get their shit together in their home country when they
> have very little money, no say in who their dictator is, and no voting
> rights?

I agree that their circumstances may well justify seeking a better life
in another country, particularly when the chances of improving their own
country is negligible for the reasons you've stated. However, I don't
think that automatically confers a RIGHT for them to live in my country
or yours.

--
Rhino

In article <tcj4vq$35dbc$1@dont-email.me>,
Nyssa <Nyssa@LogicalInsight.net> wrote:

> BTR1701 wrote:
>
> > On Aug 4, 2022 at 8:04:10 PM PDT, "moviePig"
> > <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
> >
> >> On 8/4/2022 9:32 PM, BTR1701 wrote:

> >>> I just heard on the news today that California's historic Proposition
> >>> 13, which has kept the government from raising people's property taxes
> >>> through the roof for close to 40 years now has just been declared
> >>> racist.
> >>
> >> By whom? Anybody who's anybody?
> >
> > Well, it's a bunch of leftist academics and activists who
> > call themselves the Opportunity Institute. Do they count?

> https://static1.squarespace.com/static/55f70367e4b0974cf2b82009/t/62b34bd3
> 19072b7c70d02020/1655917530375/OI%2BReport%2BProp%2B13%2BFinal.pdf
> >
> > It always seemed to me that the worst victims of an
> > out-of-control government raising property taxes sky-high
> > would be the disadvantaged, the marginalized, and the
> > bipocks. The rich might not like being gouged, but they
> > could pay the high taxes. They wouldn't be forced out of
> > their homes over it. The poor and the bipocks are the ones
> > who could lose everything and had the most to gain from
> > Prop 13's protections.
> >
> > But in an era where literally everything is racist,
> > apparently a law that protects bipocks from losing their
> > homes is somehow racist as well.

> Okay, I probably need to get out more, but can someone
> please explain to me what a "bipock" is supposed to be?

Apparently "people of color" has fallen out of favor among the wokest of
the woke as not inclusive enough, so they invented a new acronym which
stands for "black, indigenous and people of color".

In article <17086b9a3f162a1f$71$1950103$c2d58868@news.newsdemon.com>,
trotsky <gmsingh@email.com> wrote:

> On 8/4/2022 11:13 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
> > On Aug 4, 2022 at 8:04:10 PM PDT, "moviePig" <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
> >
> >> On 8/4/2022 9:32 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
> >>> On Aug 4, 2022 at 2:57:53 PM PDT, "moviePig" <pwallace@moviepig.com>
> >>> wrote:

> >>>> Is xenoophobia racism? Who knew?
> >>>
> >>> Everything is racism. Haven't you been keeping up?
> >>>
> >>> I just heard on the news today that California's historic Proposition
> >>> 13, which has kept the government from raising people's property taxes
> >>> through the roof for close to 40 years now has just been declared racist.
> >>
> >> By whom? Anybody who's anybody?
> >
> > Well, it's a bunch of leftist academics and activists who call themselves
> > the Opportunity Institute. Do they count?
>
> Robert Reich and former Governor Bill Richardson are members so yeah,
> they count. I'd like a link to these declarations of racism to prove
> you aren't LYING but that will never happen.

You literally snipped the link I provided to bitch about there being no
link.

Amazing.

On 8/5/2022 1:04 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
> In article <Y0aHK.628281$J0r9.249848@fx11.iad>,
> moviePig <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
>
>> On 8/5/2022 12:13 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>> On Aug 4, 2022 at 8:04:10 PM PDT, "moviePig" <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 8/4/2022 9:32 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>> On Aug 4, 2022 at 2:57:53 PM PDT, "moviePig" <pwallace@moviepig.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 8/4/2022 3:48 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>>>> On Aug 4, 2022 at 9:06:22 AM PDT, "moviePig"
>>>>>>> <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 8/4/2022 11:44 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>>>>>> moviePig <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On 8/4/2022 12:50 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> According to DHS disclosures to the federal court hearing the
>>>>>>>>>>> case Biden v. Texas, the Biden Administration has intentionally
>>>>>>>>>>> released 1,049,532 illegals into the country since Old Joe was
>>>>>>>>>>> inaugurated. That's more people than the population of Joe's
>>>>>>>>>>> home state of Delaware.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> And that doesn't even include the 'got-aways'-- the illegals who
>>>>>>>>>>> managed to cross over, evade the Border Patrol, and disappear
>>>>>>>>>>> into the countryside. DHS estimates that number to be an additional
>>>>>>>>>>> 700,000 to one million illegals.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> But it's rrraaaaciiissst to talk about Democrats intentionally
>>>>>>>>>>> trying to change the demographics of the nation and dilute the
>>>>>>>>>>> votes of the current citizenry, even as they've intentionally
>>>>>>>>>>> opened the border for an entire state's worth of illegal aliens
>>>>>>>>>>> with the promise of no end in sight.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> And the solution you recommend is?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Well, I know we're supposed to hate everything Trump but this shit
>>>>>>>>> wasn't happening under his policies.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Why is the United States the only country in the world that's racist
>>>>>>>>> if it controls its own borders?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Somehow, I think charges of charges of racism aren't the big issue
>>>>>>>> here.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The hypocrisy of DC Democrats in decrying the fact that *they* are now
>>>>>>> being asked to deal with a tiny fraction of the crushing burden that
>>>>>>> Texas and Arizona have been forced to shoulder for years (and which
>>>>>>> they apparently think those states should *still* be dealing with so
>>>>>>> they won't have to) just leaves me speechless.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ----------------------------
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2022/08/gop-governors-created-a-migrant-
>>>>>>> crisis-in-washington
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "The Border Has Come to D.C.": GOP Governor Have Successfully Created a
>>>>>>> Migrant Crisis in Washington
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It has been a "somewhat herculean effort," Nadeau tells me, but an
>>>>>>> unsustainable one. "This is a crisis," the councilmember says. "We
>>>>>>> are a sanctuary city. We welcome folks. But certainly we are not
>>>>>>> prepared for this. This is going to strain our system."
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> [Well, no shit. But it's okay to 'strain the systems' of Texas and
>>>>>>> Arizona, amirite? You've virtue-signaled to everyone that you're a
>>>>>>> sanctuary city and now you have to walk your talk. Boo-hoo.]
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Bowser echoed the latter sentiment last Thursday as she called for
>>>>>>> the National Guard to be activated; she said the city had reached its
>>>>>>> "tipping point", but while Nadeau and groups on the ground have been
>>>>>>> calling for action by Bowser and the federal government for three
>>>>>>> months now, they say military response echoes the hardline Abbott and
>>>>>>> Ducey policies that moved the border crisis to the Capitol.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ["They should have just kept that border crisis down south where
>>>>>>> all the hicks and rubes live and just suffered through it for the good
>>>>>>> of the Agenda. How dare they send it here and dump it in our laps? I
>>>>>>> mean sure, we created the problem, but we shouldn't have to deal with
>>>>>>> it. That's what the little people in flyover states are for."]
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "It's really disappointing to see the mayor engaging in basically
>>>>>>> the same xenophobic, invasionist rhetoric" as Abbott, Fischer says.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> [moviePig was dubious that the very notion of America controlling its
>>>>>>> own borders is painted as racist by the leftist intelligentsia...
>>>>>>> well, right there's Exhibit Number One above.]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Is xenoophobia racism? Who knew?
>>>>>
>>>>> Everything is racism. Haven't you been keeping up?
>>>>>
>>>>> I just heard on the news today that California's historic Proposition 13,
>>>>> which has kept the government from raising people's property taxes
>>>>> through the roof for close to 40 years now has just been declared racist.
>>>>
>>>> By whom? Anybody who's anybody?
>>>
>>> Well, it's a bunch of leftist academics and activists who call themselves
>>> the Opportunity Institute. Do they count?
>>
>> No. Nor does anyone who'd call themselves the "Opportunity Institute".
>
> So what criteria does one have to meet to be "anybody"?

Well, e.g., Robert Reich was mentioned in another post as a member of
this organization. I suppose I'd consider his direct support serious.

>>> https://static1.squarespace.com/static/55f70367e4b0974cf2b82009/t/62b34bd319
>>> 072b7c70d02020/1655917530375/OI%2BReport%2BProp%2B13%2BFinal.pdf
>>>
>>> It always seemed to me that the worst victims of an out-of-control
>>> government raising property taxes sky-high would be the disadvantaged, the
>>> marginalized, and the bipocks. The rich might not like being gouged,
>>> but they could pay the high taxes. They wouldn't be forced out of their
>>> homes over it. The poor and the bipocks are the ones who could lose
>>> everything and had the most to gain from Prop 13's protections.
>>>
>>> But in an era where literally everything is racist, apparently a law that
>>> protects bipocks from losing their homes is somehow racist as well.
>>
>> As far as I can squint, the headline says that racial inequities are
>> exacerbated, not sought, by Prop13 -- which I don't doubt, as the
>> disadvantaged are usually the ones to be further disadvantaged by
>> *anything*...

BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>"Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
>>BTR1701 <no_email@invalid.invalid> wrote:

>>>>. . .

>>>Well, I know we're supposed to hate everything Trump but this shit
>>>wasn't happening under his policies.

>>>Why is the United States the only country in the world that's racist
>>>if it controls its own borders?

>>The United States is obliged to accept assylum seekers under
>>international treaty obligations enforced in federal statute.

>Sure, and isn't it amazing how suddenly every illegal alien is now an
>'asylum seeker'? Because it's not like there aren't huge organizations
>and Central American governments coaching them to say exactly that.

Actually, I'm not surprised in the least. These are shithole countries,
especially Guatemala, Honduras, and Nicaragua. To the extent that they
are escaping crime and some of the crime is perpetuated by the police,
then they have an argument to make for assylum.

>Which is evidenced by the 95+% rate of rejection of asylum claims.

Because definitions of assylum claims that are based on the refusal of
Europe and the United States to accept Jews trying to escape Nazi
persecution before WWII. We know all this. That doesn't mean they don't
have valid reason to leave because their lives and families are in
jeopardy, or they are facing starvation.

>Wanting a better job doesn't make you a refugee. International law, such
>as it is, is clear on that much.

The ones leaving to escape terrible conditions at home want a whole lot
more than a better job. I agree that it doesn't meet the international
definition lacking the ability to prove that these terrible conditions
were created by government going after this family individually.

>But that's not the goal anyway. The point is to overwhelm our system with
>hundreds of thousands of claims that can't possibly all be handled. It's
>an engineered crisis right out of Alinsky's RULES FOR RADICALS.

Gee. That's unfortunate, then, that Trump made the system processing
assylum claims so much worse. He had the opportunity to make it less
dysfunctional, fair, even though assylum seekers generally can't prove
their status.

The system was overwhelmed under Obama. Trump made it worse. Biden has
made it even worse.

Why don't you favor a fair system with experienced immigration lawyers
representing assylum seekers capable of procesing claims within a month
and then returning the ones who don't qualify? Why do so many of those
who demand immigration reform want broken assylum claims systems only?

>If this is what 'international treaty obligations enforced in federal
>statute' require, then those treaties and statutes need to be revisited
>and amended.

No. The claims need to be handled on a timely basis, within a month.

On 8/5/2022 9:53 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
> In article <tcjbpe$d13v$1@solani.org>, suzeeq <suzee@imbris.com> wrote:
>
>> On 8/5/2022 6:56 AM, Ed Stasiak wrote:
>>>> moviePig
>>>>> Ed Stasiak
>>>>>
>>>>> If illegals can’t work here or find a place to live, they’ll leave.
>>>>
>>>> You're proposing an official change in America's self-image, from
>>>> a welcomer of freedom-yearning huddled masses, to an
>>>> I've-got-mine-you-get-yours gated community with attack dogs.
>>>
>>> A later bit of propaganda added to the Statue of Liberty, but the fact
>>> is that almost all nations outside the West have very strict immigration
>>> laws.
>>>
>>> Mexico for instance, requires potential immigrants to prove that they
>>> have sufficient income or savings/pensions (something like $100K)
>>> before they’ll even look at your application.
>>>
>>>> One can debate the necessity of that shift in stance but not, afaics,
>>>> the fact of it.
>>>
>>> There is no "necessity" to flood the West with bazillions of dirt poor,
>>> poorly educated, frequently criminally prone, 3rd world peasants, what’s
>>> necessary is that they get their shit together in their _home nations_
>>> instead of sponging off the West.
>>>
>> And how do they get their shit together in their home country when they
>> have very little money, no say in who their dictator is, and no voting
>> rights?
>
> And none of that entitles the entire population to move here.
>
They're really not.

> Plus, you know, you just described the American revolutionaries. Aside
> from a few leaders, they weren't rich, had no say who their dictator
> was, and had no voting rights.
>

On 8/5/2022 9:54 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
> In article <tcjds6$d2kq$1@solani.org>, suzeeq <suzee@imbris.com> wrote:
>
>> On 8/5/2022 8:14 AM, Ed Stasiak wrote:
>>>> suzeeq
>>>>> Ed Stasiak
>>>>>
>>>>> There is no "necessity" to flood the West with bazillions of dirt poor,
>>>>> poorly educated, frequently criminally prone, 3rd world peasants, what's
>>>>> necessary is that they get their shit together in their _home nations_
>>>>> instead of sponging off the West.
>>>>>
>>>> And how do they get their shit together in their home country when they
>>>> have very little money, no say in who their dictator is, and no voting
>>>> rights?
>>>
>>> Mexico ain't North Korea and the illegals flooding into the US from Mexico
>>> Latin America are doing so for economic reasons.
>>>
>> Central America still has dictators who rountinely murders people who
>> try to work against them.
>
> And if America took in every person whose government was authoritarian,
> our population would be in the billions. How sustainable do you think
> that would be?
>
More people paying taxes.

Rhino <no_offline_contact@example.com> wrote:
>On 2022-08-05 1:08 AM, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
>>BTR1701 <no_email@invalid.invalid> wrote:

>>>>. . .

>>>Well, I know we're supposed to hate everything Trump but this shit wasn't
>>>happening under his policies.

>>>Why is the United States the only country in the world that's racist if it
>>>controls its own borders?

>>The United States is obliged to accept assylum seekers under
>>international treaty obligations enforced in federal statute.

>>We've discussed tiny countries in Europe like The Netherlands. They
>>accept all assylum seekers. They get a lawyer. They get a hearing within
>>a month. If they don't qualify under the treaty definition, they are not
>>paroled into The Netherlands and are sent back.

>Canada has a process to determine if people are legitimate refugees too
>but it takes MUCH longer than a month!

I'm going to get pedantic here. We are speaking of assylum seekers, not
refugees. An assylum seeker has to prove discrimination by government
that puts his life or the life of his family in jeopardy.

Refugee is someone displaced by weather or war. There is no question as
to who qualifies as a refugee but their situation isn't permanent. They
don't immigrate. They get sent back after the emergency has ended.

>We too have a big backlog and
>despite our immense bureaucracy are years behind in the refugee
>determination process. Our process is MUCH more complex than the Dutch
>one. In fact, at one point it had not one, not two, but NINETEEN levels
>of appeal, although I believe the Conservatives under Stephen Harper
>reduced that somewhat. So, what happens to these refugee-wannabes while
>waiting for the bureaucrats to determine their cases? They stay in this
>country. I believe they can work too. And what happens if they lose
>their final appeals? At that point, they can be deported but some of
>them will have gone underground in the meantime so it will be difficult
>to impossible to find them to deport them.

Thanks. As far as your processing system is behind, it's ever so much
worse in the United States.

>I saw a story in the paper the other day about a Nicaraguan national who
>had been here in Canada for 31 YEARS waiting for his refugee
>determination! He was, by his own admission, a Sandinista but swore that
>he'd never tortured or killed anybody although he had seen those things
>done. He claimed to be in fear of his life if sent back and said he was
>very disappointed in Canada for treating him this way.

Good grief.

>Another case I heard about a few years ago involved a guy in jail for
>attempted murder who was supposed to be deported to his native country,
>somewhere in the Caribbean if I recall correctly. In order to deport
>him, the government needed to take his picture for travel documents but
>every time they tried to take his picture, he refused to co-operate. (I
>don't know why they simply didn't hold him so that they could take his
>picture against his will.) His lawyer took the matter to court and the
>judge not only found that the criminal couldn't be deported since he
>wasn't co-operating with the picture-taking, he let him out of jail and
>back into Canadian society. I wish I'd bookmarked that story (or printed
>it since it might have been pre-Internet) so that I could get all the
>details but I've stated the gist of it as best I can remember.

That's a travesty of justice. Of course, he has passed through so many
security cameras, it's hard to believe they couldn't make an appropriate
still.

Or just use his mug shot.

>>. . .

On 8/5/2022 10:24 AM, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
> BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>> "Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
>>> BTR1701 <no_email@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>
>>>>> . . .
>
>>>> Well, I know we're supposed to hate everything Trump but this shit
>>>> wasn't happening under his policies.
>
>>>> Why is the United States the only country in the world that's racist
>>>> if it controls its own borders?
>
>>> The United States is obliged to accept assylum seekers under
>>> international treaty obligations enforced in federal statute.
>
>> Sure, and isn't it amazing how suddenly every illegal alien is now an
>> 'asylum seeker'? Because it's not like there aren't huge organizations
>> and Central American governments coaching them to say exactly that.
>
> Actually, I'm not surprised in the least. These are shithole countries,
> especially Guatemala, Honduras, and Nicaragua. To the extent that they
> are escaping crime and some of the crime is perpetuated by the police,
> then they have an argument to make for assylum.
>
>> Which is evidenced by the 95+% rate of rejection of asylum claims.
>
> Because definitions of assylum claims that are based on the refusal of
> Europe and the United States to accept Jews trying to escape Nazi
> persecution before WWII. We know all this. That doesn't mean they don't
> have valid reason to leave because their lives and families are in
> jeopardy, or they are facing starvation.
>
>> Wanting a better job doesn't make you a refugee. International law, such
>> as it is, is clear on that much.
>
> The ones leaving to escape terrible conditions at home want a whole lot
> more than a better job. I agree that it doesn't meet the international
> definition lacking the ability to prove that these terrible conditions
> were created by government going after this family individually.
>
>> But that's not the goal anyway. The point is to overwhelm our system with
>> hundreds of thousands of claims that can't possibly all be handled. It's
>> an engineered crisis right out of Alinsky's RULES FOR RADICALS.
>
> Gee. That's unfortunate, then, that Trump made the system processing
> assylum claims so much worse. He had the opportunity to make it less
> dysfunctional, fair, even though assylum seekers generally can't prove
> their status.
>
> The system was overwhelmed under Obama. Trump made it worse. Biden has
> made it even worse.
>
> Why don't you favor a fair system with experienced immigration lawyers
> representing assylum seekers capable of procesing claims within a month
> and then returning the ones who don't qualify? Why do so many of those
> who demand immigration reform want broken assylum claims systems only?
>
>> If this is what 'international treaty obligations enforced in federal
>> statute' require, then those treaties and statutes need to be revisited
>> and amended.
>
> No. The claims need to be handled on a timely basis, within a month.
>
I've thought for a while that whoever handles these claims needs to hire
more people to process them.

In article <jicHK.621411$ssF.138526@fx14.iad>,
moviePig <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:

> On 8/5/2022 1:04 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
> > In article <Y0aHK.628281$J0r9.249848@fx11.iad>,
> > moviePig <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
> >
> >> On 8/5/2022 12:13 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
> >>> On Aug 4, 2022 at 8:04:10 PM PDT, "moviePig" <pwallace@moviepig.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> On 8/4/2022 9:32 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
> >>>>> On Aug 4, 2022 at 2:57:53 PM PDT, "moviePig" <pwallace@moviepig.com>
> >>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> On 8/4/2022 3:48 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
> >>>>>>> On Aug 4, 2022 at 9:06:22 AM PDT, "moviePig"
> >>>>>>> <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> On 8/4/2022 11:44 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
> >>>>>>>>> moviePig <pwallace@moviepig.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> On 8/4/2022 12:50 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> According to DHS disclosures to the federal court hearing the
> >>>>>>>>>>> case Biden v. Texas, the Biden Administration has intentionally
> >>>>>>>>>>> released 1,049,532 illegals into the country since Old Joe was
> >>>>>>>>>>> inaugurated. That's more people than the population of Joe's
> >>>>>>>>>>> home state of Delaware.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> And that doesn't even include the 'got-aways'-- the illegals who
> >>>>>>>>>>> managed to cross over, evade the Border Patrol, and disappear
> >>>>>>>>>>> into the countryside. DHS estimates that number to be an
> >>>>>>>>>>> additional 700,000 to one million illegals.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> But it's rrraaaaciiissst to talk about Democrats intentionally
> >>>>>>>>>>> trying to change the demographics of the nation and dilute the
> >>>>>>>>>>> votes of the current citizenry, even as they've intentionally
> >>>>>>>>>>> opened the border for an entire state's worth of illegal aliens
> >>>>>>>>>>> with the promise of no end in sight.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> And the solution you recommend is?
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Well, I know we're supposed to hate everything Trump but this shit
> >>>>>>>>> wasn't happening under his policies.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Why is the United States the only country in the world that's
> >>>>>>>>> racist if it controls its own borders?
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Somehow, I think charges of charges of racism aren't the big issue
> >>>>>>>> here.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> The hypocrisy of DC Democrats in decrying the fact that *they* are
> >>>>>>> now being asked to deal with a tiny fraction of the crushing burden
> >>>>>>> that Texas and Arizona have been forced to shoulder for years (and
> >>>>>>> which they apparently think those states should *still* be dealing
> >>>>>>> with so they won't have to) just leaves me speechless.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> ----------------------------
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2022/08/gop-governors-created-a-migran
> >>>>>>> t-
> >>>>>>> crisis-in-washington
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> "The Border Has Come to D.C.": GOP Governor Have Successfully Created
> >>>>>>> a Migrant Crisis in Washington
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> It has been a "somewhat herculean effort," Nadeau tells me, but an
> >>>>>>> unsustainable one. "This is a crisis," the councilmember says. "We
> >>>>>>> are a sanctuary city. We welcome folks. But certainly we are not
> >>>>>>> prepared for this. This is going to strain our system."
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> [Well, no shit. But it's okay to 'strain the systems' of Texas and
> >>>>>>> Arizona, amirite? You've virtue-signaled to everyone that you're a
> >>>>>>> sanctuary city and now you have to walk your talk. Boo-hoo.]
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Bowser echoed the latter sentiment last Thursday as she called for
> >>>>>>> the National Guard to be activated; she said the city had reached its
> >>>>>>> "tipping point", but while Nadeau and groups on the ground have been
> >>>>>>> calling for action by Bowser and the federal government for three
> >>>>>>> months now, they say military response echoes the hardline Abbott and
> >>>>>>> Ducey policies that moved the border crisis to the Capitol.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> ["They should have just kept that border crisis down south where
> >>>>>>> all the hicks and rubes live and just suffered through it for the
> >>>>>>> good
> >>>>>>> of the Agenda. How dare they send it here and dump it in our laps? I
> >>>>>>> mean sure, we created the problem, but we shouldn't have to deal with
> >>>>>>> it. That's what the little people in flyover states are for."]
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> "It's really disappointing to see the mayor engaging in basically
> >>>>>>> the same xenophobic, invasionist rhetoric" as Abbott, Fischer says.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> [moviePig was dubious that the very notion of America controlling its
> >>>>>>> own borders is painted as racist by the leftist intelligentsia...
> >>>>>>> well, right there's Exhibit Number One above.]
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Is xenoophobia racism? Who knew?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Everything is racism. Haven't you been keeping up?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I just heard on the news today that California's historic Proposition
> >>>>> 13, which has kept the government from raising people's property taxes
> >>>>> through the roof for close to 40 years now has just been declared
> >>>>> racist.
> >>>>
> >>>> By whom? Anybody who's anybody?
> >>>
> >>> Well, it's a bunch of leftist academics and activists who call themselves
> >>> the Opportunity Institute. Do they count?
> >>
> >> No. Nor does anyone who'd call themselves the "Opportunity Institute".
> >
> > So what criteria does one have to meet to be "anybody"?
>
> Well, e.g., Robert Reich was mentioned in another post as a member of
> this organization. I suppose I'd consider his direct support serious.

So they are "anybody" after all.

> >>> https://static1.squarespace.com/static/55f70367e4b0974cf2b82009/t/62b34bd3
> >>> 19072b7c70d02020/1655917530375/OI%2BReport%2BProp%2B13%2BFinal.pdf
> >>>
> >>> It always seemed to me that the worst victims of an out-of-control
> >>> government raising property taxes sky-high would be the disadvantaged,
> >>> the
> >>> marginalized, and the bipocks. The rich might not like being gouged,
> >>> but they could pay the high taxes. They wouldn't be forced out of their
> >>> homes over it. The poor and the bipocks are the ones who could lose
> >>> everything and had the most to gain from Prop 13's protections.
> >>>
> >>> But in an era where literally everything is racist, apparently a law that
> >>> protects bipocks from losing their homes is somehow racist as well.
> >>
> >> As far as I can squint, the headline says that racial inequities are
> >> exacerbated, not sought, by Prop13 -- which I don't doubt, as the
> >> disadvantaged are usually the ones to be further disadvantaged by
> >> *anything*...

In article <tcjk7s$d6u4$2@solani.org>, suzeeq <suzee@imbris.com> wrote:

> On 8/5/2022 9:54 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
> > In article <tcjds6$d2kq$1@solani.org>, suzeeq <suzee@imbris.com> wrote:
> >
> >> On 8/5/2022 8:14 AM, Ed Stasiak wrote:
> >>>> suzeeq
> >>>>> Ed Stasiak
> >>>>>
> >>>>> There is no "necessity" to flood the West with bazillions of dirt poor,
> >>>>> poorly educated, frequently criminally prone, 3rd world peasants, what's
> >>>>> necessary is that they get their shit together in their _home nations_
> >>>>> instead of sponging off the West.
> >>>>>
> >>>> And how do they get their shit together in their home country when they
> >>>> have very little money, no say in who their dictator is, and no voting
> >>>> rights?
> >>>
> >>> Mexico ain't North Korea and the illegals flooding into the US from Mexico
> >>> Latin America are doing so for economic reasons.
> >>>
> >> Central America still has dictators who rountinely murders people who
> >> try to work against them.
> >
> > And if America took in every person whose government was authoritarian,
> > our population would be in the billions. How sustainable do you think
> > that would be?
> >
> More people paying taxes.

Sure, because the millions of illegals we have right now aren't a net
loss for the government...

In article <tcjk6h$d6u4$1@solani.org>, suzeeq <suzee@imbris.com> wrote:

> On 8/5/2022 9:53 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
> > In article <tcjbpe$d13v$1@solani.org>, suzeeq <suzee@imbris.com> wrote:
> >
> >> On 8/5/2022 6:56 AM, Ed Stasiak wrote:
> >>>> moviePig
> >>>>> Ed Stasiak
> >>>>>
> >>>>> If illegals can’t work here or find a place to live, they’ll leave.
> >>>>
> >>>> You're proposing an official change in America's self-image, from
> >>>> a welcomer of freedom-yearning huddled masses, to an
> >>>> I've-got-mine-you-get-yours gated community with attack dogs.
> >>>
> >>> A later bit of propaganda added to the Statue of Liberty, but the fact
> >>> is that almost all nations outside the West have very strict immigration
> >>> laws.
> >>>
> >>> Mexico for instance, requires potential immigrants to prove that they
> >>> have sufficient income or savings/pensions (something like $100K)
> >>> before they’ll even look at your application.
> >>>
> >>>> One can debate the necessity of that shift in stance but not, afaics,
> >>>> the fact of it.
> >>>
> >>> There is no "necessity" to flood the West with bazillions of dirt poor,
> >>> poorly educated, frequently criminally prone, 3rd world peasants, what’s
> >>> necessary is that they get their shit together in their _home nations_
> >>> instead of sponging off the West.
> >>>
> >> And how do they get their shit together in their home country when they
> >> have very little money, no say in who their dictator is, and no voting
> >> rights?
> >
> > And none of that entitles the entire population to move here.
> >
> They're really not.

The. Entire. State. Of. Delaware.

> > Plus, you know, you just described the American revolutionaries. Aside
> > from a few leaders, they weren't rich, had no say who their dictator
> > was, and had no voting rights.