https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg

dan....@gmail.com schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 10:40:49 UTC+2:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg

the problem is not A.I. becoming sentient - I don't think they can - but humans becoming less sentient.

On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 2:43:51 AM UTC-7, Marc S wrote:
> dan....@gmail.com schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 10:40:49 UTC+2:
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg
>
> the problem is not A.I. becoming sentient - I don't think they can - but humans becoming less sentient.

In the future, I think that more and more people will start failing BLADE RUNNER's Voigt-Kampff test.

On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 1:19:47 PM UTC-4, gggg gggg wrote:
> On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 2:43:51 AM UTC-7, Marc S wrote:
> > dan....@gmail.com schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 10:40:49 UTC+2:
> > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg
> >
> > the problem is not A.I. becoming sentient - I don't think they can - but humans becoming less sentient.
> In the future, I think that more and more people will start failing BLADE RUNNER's Voigt-Kampff test.

I wonder if conservatives are sentient, as they only seem capable of parroting Republican talking points. I don't believe they would even pass the Turing test.

On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 2:43:51 AM UTC-7, Marc S wrote:
> dan....@gmail.com schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 10:40:49 UTC+2:
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg
>
> the problem is not A.I. becoming sentient - I don't think they can - but humans becoming less sentient.

In the future, won't more and more people fail BLADE RUNNER's Voigt-Kampff test?

On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 1:40:49 AM UTC-7, dan....@gmail.com wrote:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg

Should AI be used to finish unfinished symphonies?

https://www.mentalfloss.com/posts/artificial-intelligence-beethoven-symphony

james.g...@gmail.com schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 19:24:15 UTC+2:
> On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 1:19:47 PM UTC-4, gggg gggg wrote:
> > On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 2:43:51 AM UTC-7, Marc S wrote:
> > > dan....@gmail.com schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 10:40:49 UTC+2:
> > > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg
> > >
> > > the problem is not A.I. becoming sentient - I don't think they can - but humans becoming less sentient.
> > In the future, I think that more and more people will start failing BLADE RUNNER's Voigt-Kampff test.
> I wonder if conservatives are sentient, as they only seem capable of parroting Republican talking points. I don't believe they would even pass the Turing test.

And I wonder if you are... generalizing all conservatives (your enemy it seems) to be not sentient (pure projection by a weak minded fellow... that's what I think about what you said) - parroting the "liberal" talking points yourself...

I am just describing a general sociological phenomena, it is common everywhere, just as it is with you.

On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 2:43:51 AM UTC-7, Marc S wrote:
> dan....@gmail.com schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 10:40:49 UTC+2:
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg
>
> the problem is not A.I. becoming sentient - I don't think they can - but humans becoming less sentient.

Is that because modernity is desensitizing us?

Or simply dehumanizing us?

On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 2:43:51 AM UTC-7, Marc S wrote:
> dan....@gmail.com schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 10:40:49 UTC+2:
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg
>
> the problem is not A.I. becoming sentient - I don't think they can - but humans becoming less sentient.

Is that because modernity has desensitized us?

Or simply dehumanized us?

gggg gggg schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 19:56:30 UTC+2:
> On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 2:43:51 AM UTC-7, Marc S wrote:
> > dan....@gmail.com schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 10:40:49 UTC+2:
> > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg
> >
> > the problem is not A.I. becoming sentient - I don't think they can - but humans becoming less sentient.
> Is that because modernity has desensitized us?
>
> Or simply dehumanized us?

You could say so, but I think people would need to understand in what way the world has dehumanized us (on a psychological as well as sociological level) - and from what I experienced, most don't get it, but simply just continue to behave more or less in automated mechanisms (Look at James Goodzeit; his action is basically scripted and reveals a quite machiavellian viewpoint: conservatives => 1 consequence = bad people/not sentient people - liberals = good people or sentient people; or in this forum: if one likes trump's politics => 1 consequence => he is an idiot or a fascist (okay I am exaggerating with 1 consequence, but it's so automated...)).

On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 10:56:30 AM UTC-7, gggg gggg wrote:
> On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 2:43:51 AM UTC-7, Marc S wrote:
> > dan....@gmail.com schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 10:40:49 UTC+2:
> > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg
> >
> > the problem is not A.I. becoming sentient - I don't think they can - but humans becoming less sentient.
> Is that because modernity has desensitized us?
>
> Or simply dehumanized us?

Or have we become traumatized because modernity has brutalized us with its obsession on progress and efficiency at all co$t$?

On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 1:40:49 AM UTC-7, dan....@gmail.com wrote:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RB-O0V9djEs

gggg gggg schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 22:07:06 UTC+2:
> On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 10:56:30 AM UTC-7, gggg gggg wrote:
> > On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 2:43:51 AM UTC-7, Marc S wrote:
> > > dan....@gmail.com schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 10:40:49 UTC+2:
> > > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg
> > >
> > > the problem is not A.I. becoming sentient - I don't think they can - but humans becoming less sentient.
> > Is that because modernity has desensitized us?
> >
> > Or simply dehumanized us?
> Or have we become traumatized because modernity has brutalized us with its obsession on progress and efficiency at all co$t$?

You are completely deranged... your brutality shows itself in your anticapitalist mentality (and for many the republicans represent capitalism)... crazy guy. Being critical of capitalism is another matter... but for that you would need to understand something about capitalism which you (and everyone I interacted with in this ng) are incapable to do.

Your contributions on this group - your way of communicating thoughts about music to other people - more or less consists of trying to post links to yt performances.

You are entirely what is wrong with society in a large part. Sames goes basically for everyone I interacted with on here - not so much Frank I think, and Oscar neither, and Bob is generally cool as well I guess - besides his blind eye so often.

On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 10:56:30 AM UTC-7, gggg gggg wrote:
> On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 2:43:51 AM UTC-7, Marc S wrote:
> > dan....@gmail.com schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 10:40:49 UTC+2:
> > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg
> >
> > the problem is not A.I. becoming sentient - I don't think they can - but humans becoming less sentient.
> Is that because modernity has desensitized us?
>
> Or simply dehumanized us?

Or have we become traumatized because modernity has brutalized us with its emphasis on efficiency and preoccupation with progress at all co$t$?

On 7/19/22 1:17 PM, Marc S wrote:
> gggg gggg schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 22:07:06 UTC+2:
>> On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 10:56:30 AM UTC-7, gggg gggg wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 2:43:51 AM UTC-7, Marc S wrote:
>>>> dan....@gmail.com schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 10:40:49 UTC+2:
>>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg
>>>>
>>>> the problem is not A.I. becoming sentient - I don't think they can - but humans becoming less sentient.
>>> Is that because modernity has desensitized us?
>>>
>>> Or simply dehumanized us?
>> Or have we become traumatized because modernity has brutalized us with its obsession on progress and efficiency at all co$t$?
>
> You are completely deranged... your brutality shows itself in your anticapitalist mentality (and for many the republicans represent capitalism)... crazy guy. Being critical of capitalism is another matter... but for that you would need to understand something about capitalism which you (and everyone I interacted with in this ng) are incapable to do.
>
> Your contributions on this group - your way of communicating thoughts about music to other people - more or less consists of trying to post links to yt performances.
>
> You are entirely what is wrong with society in a large part. Sames goes basically for everyone I interacted with on here - not so much Frank I think, and Oscar neither, and Bob is generally cool as well I guess - besides his blind eye so often.

If the g man actually wrote that last line before your comments, it
marks one of the first times he has ever done anything beyond post a
link to something else. Not that I think it's particularly wrong; an
obsession with 'progress' and 'efficiency' without a nod to the Torah or
the Gospels is not a good thing.

Bob Harper

On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 1:40:49 AM UTC-7, dan....@gmail.com wrote:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg

"Will Democracy Survive Big Data and Artificial Intelligence?" (2017 article):

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/will-democracy-survive-big-data-and-artificial-intelligence/

On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 3:47:49 PM UTC-7, Bob Harper wrote:
> On 7/19/22 1:17 PM, Marc S wrote:
> > gggg gggg schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 22:07:06 UTC+2:
> >> On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 10:56:30 AM UTC-7, gggg gggg wrote:
> >>> On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 2:43:51 AM UTC-7, Marc S wrote:
> >>>> dan....@gmail.com schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 10:40:49 UTC+2:
> >>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg
> >>>>
> >>>> the problem is not A.I. becoming sentient - I don't think they can - but humans becoming less sentient.
> >>> Is that because modernity has desensitized us?
> >>>
> >>> Or simply dehumanized us?
> >> Or have we become traumatized because modernity has brutalized us with its obsession on progress and efficiency at all co$t$?
> >
> > You are completely deranged... your brutality shows itself in your anticapitalist mentality (and for many the republicans represent capitalism)... crazy guy. Being critical of capitalism is another matter... but for that you would need to understand something about capitalism which you (and everyone I interacted with in this ng) are incapable to do.
> >
> > Your contributions on this group - your way of communicating thoughts about music to other people - more or less consists of trying to post links to yt performances.
> >
> > You are entirely what is wrong with society in a large part. Sames goes basically for everyone I interacted with on here - not so much Frank I think, and Oscar neither, and Bob is generally cool as well I guess - besides his blind eye so often.
> If the g man actually wrote that last line before your comments, it
> marks one of the first times he has ever done anything beyond post a
> link to something else. Not that I think it's particularly wrong; an
> obsession with 'progress' and 'efficiency' without a nod to the Torah or
> the Gospels is not a good thing.
>
> Bob Harper

Dear Mr. Harper (from g man):

Thank you for your backhanded compliment. Yes I indeed wrote that line all by myself so I hope that proves to you (AND some of the others here) that I may have a brain.

On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 1:40:49 AM UTC-7, dan....@gmail.com wrote:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg

According to this:

- The technological changes that matter are the ones that allow people to live safe and pleasant lives, pursuing intellectual challenge and pleasure, rather than simply trying to stay alive.… But that’s not how they’re being used right now. Right now they’re largely being used to exploit human psychological weaknesses for very short-term gains for a very few people, and any benefits the rest of the world derives along the way exist merely to sweeten the pot. This is a consequence of combining unbridled capitalism with technology in the absence of empathetic humanity or public responsibility.

https://www.pewresearch.org/internet/2019/10/28/themes-about-the-next-50-years-of-life-online/

On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 3:47:49 PM UTC-7, Bob Harper wrote:
> On 7/19/22 1:17 PM, Marc S wrote:
> > gggg gggg schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 22:07:06 UTC+2:
> >> On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 10:56:30 AM UTC-7, gggg gggg wrote:
> >>> On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 2:43:51 AM UTC-7, Marc S wrote:
> >>>> dan....@gmail.com schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 10:40:49 UTC+2:
> >>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg
> >>>>
> >>>> the problem is not A.I. becoming sentient - I don't think they can - but humans becoming less sentient.
> >>> Is that because modernity has desensitized us?
> >>>
> >>> Or simply dehumanized us?
> >> Or have we become traumatized because modernity has brutalized us with its obsession on progress and efficiency at all co$t$?
> >
> > You are completely deranged... your brutality shows itself in your anticapitalist mentality (and for many the republicans represent capitalism)... crazy guy. Being critical of capitalism is another matter... but for that you would need to understand something about capitalism which you (and everyone I interacted with in this ng) are incapable to do.
> >
> > Your contributions on this group - your way of communicating thoughts about music to other people - more or less consists of trying to post links to yt performances.
> >
> > You are entirely what is wrong with society in a large part. Sames goes basically for everyone I interacted with on here - not so much Frank I think, and Oscar neither, and Bob is generally cool as well I guess - besides his blind eye so often.
> If the g man actually wrote that last line before your comments, it
> marks one of the first times he has ever done anything beyond post a
> link to something else. Not that I think it's particularly wrong; an
> obsession with 'progress' and 'efficiency' without a nod to the Torah or
> the Gospels is not a good thing.
>
> Bob Harper

Dear Mr. Harper (from g man):

Thank you for your backhanded compliment. Yes I indeed wrote that line all by myself so I hope that proves to you (AND to some of the others here) that I may have a brain that can think.

At least some of the time.

On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 4:11:19 PM UTC-7, wrote:
> On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 1:40:49 AM UTC-7, dan....@gmail.com wrote:
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg
> According to this:
>
> - The technological changes that matter are the ones that allow people to live safe and pleasant lives, pursuing intellectual challenge and pleasure, rather than simply trying to stay alive.… But that’s not how they’re being used right now. Right now they’re largely being used to exploit human psychological weaknesses for very short-term gains for a very few people, and any benefits the rest of the world derives along the way exist merely to sweeten the pot. This is a consequence of combining unbridled capitalism with technology in the absence of empathetic humanity or public responsibility.
>
> https://www.pewresearch.org/internet/2019/10/28/themes-about-the-next-50-years-of-life-online/

- Technological progress is like an axe in the hands of a pathological criminal.

Albert Einstein

Bob Harper schrieb am Mittwoch, 20. Juli 2022 um 00:47:49 UTC+2:
> If the g man actually wrote that last line before your comments, it
> marks one of the first times he has ever done anything beyond post a
> link to something else. Not that I think it's particularly wrong; an
> obsession with 'progress' and 'efficiency' without a nod to the Torah or
> the Gospels is not a good thing.
>
> Bob Harper

Not sure who you are trying to preach to, but it should be clear from everything I wrote on this ng that I value the Torah and the Gospels highly (not so much islamic literature), while also being critical of them (does anyone on here talk about the persecution of jews and christians in islamic shitholes btw?).

Greek philosophy and the Judaistic religion (with its offspring Christianity) are to a large part the foundations of western civilisation.

Not sure what you are referring to with "Not that I think it's particularly wrong". Are you referring to him posting links? I think this behaviour is quite wrong, it's disrespectful, he doesn't communicate with people, he just shoves links in to the faces of people (look at the fp) - people talk about music => g-man posts a link (decay of communication); people talk about philosophy => g-man posts a link; people talk about politics => g-man posts a link. He has no mind of his own, no ideas of his own, no thoughts of his own etc.

If you want to help people, you should maybe realize how fucked up they are.... but if you can't even see how fucked up people are, obviously you won't be able to help.

In case you are referring to his statement... It is totally legitimate to criticise how the obsession with progress and efficiency is backfiring in many regards, otoh one has to realize the good things that came out of this (our living standard in regards to food and housing is way better than it ever was) - g-man only sees one side of the coin leading to the demonisation of capitalism. The Nazis, Chamenei, Hamas, Hezbollah, Putin, Kim Jong-un, Maduro, Taliban etc they all hate capitalism in a similarly simplistic way g-man does... g-man is in the company of lunatics.

gggg gggg schrieb am Mittwoch, 20. Juli 2022 um 01:14:24 UTC+2:
> Dear Mr. Harper (from g man):
>
> Thank you for your backhanded compliment. Yes I indeed wrote that line all by myself so I hope that proves to you (AND to some of the others here) that I may have a brain that can think.
>
> At least some of the time.

This alone proves that you are incapable of thinking... but nvm. I wasted enough time with you already. Not reading anything of you ever again.

On 7/19/22 10:24 AM, James Goodzeit wrote:
> On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 1:19:47 PM UTC-4, gggg gggg wrote:
>> On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 2:43:51 AM UTC-7, Marc S wrote:
>>> dan....@gmail.com schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 10:40:49 UTC+2:
>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg
>>>
>>> the problem is not A.I. becoming sentient - I don't think they can - but humans becoming less sentient.
>> In the future, I think that more and more people will start failing BLADE RUNNER's Voigt-Kampff test.
>
> I wonder if conservatives are sentient, as they only seem capable of parroting Republican talking points. I don't believe they would even pass the Turing test.

Clearly you have been reading sources that write *about* conservatives,
rather than reading conservatives themselves. I suggest you try Kevin
Williamson at National Review for starters, and perhaps David French at
The Dispatch. You might learn something.

Bob Harper

On 7/20/2022 12:14 PM, Bob Harper wrote:
> On 7/19/22 10:24 AM, James Goodzeit wrote:
>> On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 1:19:47 PM UTC-4, gggg gggg wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 2:43:51 AM UTC-7, Marc S wrote:
>>>> dan....@gmail.com schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 10:40:49 UTC+2:
>>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg
>>>>
>>>> the problem is not A.I. becoming sentient - I don't think they can - but humans becoming less sentient.
>>> In the future, I think that more and more people will start failing BLADE RUNNER's Voigt-Kampff test.
>>
>> I wonder if conservatives are sentient, as they only seem capable of parroting Republican talking points. I don't believe they would even pass the Turing test.
>
> Clearly you have been reading sources that write *about* conservatives, rather than reading conservatives themselves. I suggest you try Kevin Williamson at National Review for starters, and perhaps David French at The Dispatch. You might learn something.
>
> Bob Harper

Nice try. Here's how it's not going to go. He reads someone who says he's against minimum wages because he thinks (and he cites research in support) that minimum wages hurt the very group they are intended to help because of lost working class jobs. He reacts by saying, Oh, that's interesting. I'll have to reconsider my position on minimum wages.

Sure. Rather he's likely to call the Conservative/Libertarian who said it a poor-hating racist. Or a n on-sentient. At the least just regurgitating a talking point. Or all of these.

Nothing changes.

On 7/20/22 9:51 AM, Frank Berger wrote:
> On 7/20/2022 12:14 PM, Bob Harper wrote:
>> On 7/19/22 10:24 AM, James Goodzeit wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 1:19:47 PM UTC-4, gggg gggg wrote:
>>>> On Tuesday, July 19, 2022 at 2:43:51 AM UTC-7, Marc S wrote:
>>>>> dan....@gmail.com schrieb am Dienstag, 19. Juli 2022 um 10:40:49
>>>>> UTC+2:
>>>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2856XOaUPpg
>>>>>
>>>>> the problem is not A.I. becoming sentient - I don't think they can
>>>>> - but humans becoming less sentient.
>>>> In the future, I think that more and more people will start failing
>>>> BLADE RUNNER's Voigt-Kampff test.
>>>
>>> I wonder if conservatives are sentient, as they only seem capable of
>>> parroting Republican talking points. I don't believe they would even
>>> pass the Turing test.
>>
>> Clearly you have been reading sources that write *about*
>> conservatives, rather than reading conservatives themselves. I suggest
>> you try Kevin Williamson at National Review for starters, and perhaps
>> David French at The Dispatch. You might learn something.
>>
>> Bob Harper
>
> Nice try.  Here's how it's not going to go.  He reads someone who says
> he's against minimum wages because he thinks (and he cites research in
> support) that minimum wages hurt the very group they are intended to
> help because of lost working class jobs.  He reacts by saying, Oh,
> that's interesting.  I'll have to reconsider my position on minimum wages.
>
>
> Sure.  Rather he's likely to call the Conservative/Libertarian who said
> it a poor-hating racist. Or a n on-sentient.  At the least just
> regurgitating a talking point.  Or all of these.
>
> Nothing changes.

You're probably right, Frank, but as long as hope is a virtue, We need
to keep trying. Frustrating, to be sure, but that doesn't excuse us from
telling the truth as we understand--and can support--it.

Bob Harper