On Wed, 15 Mar 2023 20:41:13 -0700, Ian J. Ball <IJBall@mac.invalid>
wrote:

>On 2023-03-15 20:50:37 +0000, shawn said:
>
>> On Wed, 15 Mar 2023 10:22:59 -0700, anim8rfsk <anim8rfsk@cox.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Ubiquitous <weberm@polaris.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> What did you watch?
>>>
>>> Hey, thanks for asking!
>>>
>>
>>> GOTHAM KNIGHTS S01E01.
>>> This is just some weird ass shit. If you sort of like Batman, but don’t
>>> know much about him and don’t mind watching a cheap knock off of GOTHAM,
>>> then you might enjoy this. If you know much about Batman or have watched
>>> other versions, this will probably give you a headache.
>>
>> Yeah, I don't know what they were thinking with this.
>
>Oh, come now - we've all seen worse (much worse!!) from The C-Wub!
>
>>> Bruce Wayne is murdered and his identity as the Batman exposed. Ian says in
>>> IMDb that the actor will recur so maybe there’s going to be flashbacks.
>>>
>>> None of Bruce Wayne’s first four sons are mentioned but there’s now a fifth
>>> (made up for this show) that he adopted and nobody anywhere mentions all of
>>> the thousands of lawsuits that would instantly be filed when Batman’s
>>> identity became public.
>>>
>>> This show would be 100% better if the lead character was somebody we’d
>>> heard of before. Dick Grayson, Jason Todd, Tim Drake, Damien Wayne… Any of
>>> them.
>>>
>>> Alfred is now a black woman.
>>
>> Hey, she's not Alfred. She's just playing his role but she is a new
>> character and possibly evil.
>
>And she's Asian. But OK.

Well, aren't we back to the point where Asian means evil or is that
still mostly white people are evil?

>>> Carrie Kelly is now a black girl. And she’s apparently been operating as
>>> Robin for some time and yet no one even knows there is a Robin. Which
>>> doesn’t make a whole lot of sense.
>>
>> That's just one of the many things that didn't make sense in this
>> show.
>
>And she is miscast.
>
>>> Bruce Wayne’s office seems to be left over from Batteredwoman.
>>>
>>> Three youts are framed for murdering Bruce and in turn Bruce’s son is
>>> framed for hiring them to do it. One of the youts is jokers daughter, who
>>> is probably the most heavily ret conned character in DC comics history, but
>>> it’s generally agreed that she’s actually two faces daughter.
>>> The other two youts may be brother and sister and may be who they say they
>>> are or not. They are actual characters from the comics. Pretty much
>>> everybody is but the lead but they’ve all had their back stories scrambled
>>> probably because somebody was too lazy to read the comics or even
>>> Wikipedia.
>>
>> You are forgetting that the brother is apparently a gender changed
>> sister.
>
>Yep - totally unnecessary "woke" change/alteration here.

But if they didn't do it how would they meet their quota?

>The one thing I actually like about the new "management" at The CW is
>that they are likely to put an end to this kind of nonsense. But the
>"wokeness" of The CW (see also The SQUIGGLE!!1! Channel) has been
>getting progressively worse to the point where it's been sabotaging the
>watchability of many of their shows.

LOL. He said the magic word, "watchability."

>>> At the center of this is Harvey two face, except he never became two face
>>> in this reality, he’s still Bruce’s best friend. And he’s the district
>>> attorney, but the crooked cops and ADAs apparently run the city without his
>>> input. And he swings wildly back-and-forth as to what side he’s on.
>>>
>>> The only way anything that happens makes sense is if all the cops are in on
>>> it, which turns out to be the case.
>>
>> Well we don't know that all of the cops are in on it. Just apparently
>> more than enough to help rig things.
>
>Heh.
>
>>> But if everybody everywhere is in on it, then what the hell is the point?
>>>
>>> In the most laughable scene in the show, we are told that the Wayne family
>>> battery of lawyers refuses to defend the sole surviving Wayne heir because
>>> they think he might be guilty. Gentlemen, return your retainers!
>>
>> Yeah, that made no sense but then little does.
>
>Again, it makes sense if you assume the Owls either own the law firm,
>or at least own the key people at the firm.

They could at least pretend to defend him. To back out of it entirely
makes it plain that at least someone high up in the firm is working
against the sole surviving Wayne heir.

>>> We are told that the goal of all the crooked cops is to make sure the four
>>> kids are dead. They have the stupidest ways of going about this imaginable.
>>
>> I'm not sure what their plan was. The logical thing to do is to get
>> them to the prison and then have them killed their by one or more of
>> the inmates. Shouldn't be a problem for the Council of Owls.
>
>That is what Duella said was planned, and I think she was right.

See, that doesn't make sense to me in terms of what we saw. If the
intention was to have the kids get killed after they got to prison
then there was no need for all the cops (or any of them) escorting the
kids to prison to be corrupt. They could all have been just regular
hard working cops doing the job of escorting the 'criminals' to the
prison. (Though one has to admit that's a fast transfer to prison.)
The only reason for them all to be corrupt is if they planned to do
something to the kids on the way to the prison, or so it seems to me.

>> Instead
>> it seems like they planned to kill them on the way to the prison,
>
>No, the kids staged an unexpected breakout. So the dirty cops just
>thought they would take advantage of that and kill them there.

That's why they planned to kill them their but it felt like they must
have planned to hurt/kill the kids before they got to the prison.
Hence the reason they had nothing but corrupt cops escorting them.

>OTOH, that clearly *wasn't* their "orders", and I can't imagine the
>Owls would take kindly to this kind of "improvising" from their hired
>cop flunkies!!

That much is true.

>> but
>> they weren't going to stage an escape so they just planned to shoot
>> them while manacled and explain it as self defense?
>
>They were freed from their cuffs, and had beaten several cops, and
>taken one hostage - the dirty cops did have a ready-made
>justification/story for executing them!

That's what happened after the escape. I'm talking about what I
thought seemed to be the plan (kill them before the prison hence
nothing but corrupt cops escorting the kids.)

>(But, like I said - that clearly wasn't their "orders", and I doubt
>they'd deviate from their "orders" like that.)
>
>>> There’s also a blonde girl, who is the Wayne son’s best friend who in the
>>> comics was another Robin. And she hangs out in the green arrows clock
>>> tower from Smallville.
>>
>> I don't remember her name but I kept thinking she should be Barbara
>> Gordon and end up as Oracle.
>
>No, Deadline speculated that she's Taskmaster's daughter.

Doesn't matter as the setup says she SHOULD be Oracle even if she
isn't. :)

>>> The Batcave is the size of a small subdivision and pretty awesome but
>>> nobody seems to have spent much time looking around it and finding the
>>> Batmobile or anything.
>>>
>>> In the second most laughable scene in the show, they find the Batcave by
>>> throwing something breakable with liquid in it and accidentally breaking it
>>> near the door, and they can hear through the wall, the liquid dripping down
>>> the steps inside the cave. That’s really really freaking noisy liquid.
>>> Luckily the second brick they touch just swings the door open with no
>>> security features of any kind.
>>
>> I was thinking that was going to be how they found the entrance just
>> before it happened. Well, without the noisy dripping liquid as I
>> didn't expect that. Yes, pressing down on one brick is all it takes to
>> get into the bat cave so it's a miracle that no one has discovered it
>> before when we know that at least the kid has had parties at Wayne
>> Manor with lots of guests wandering around the place.
>>
>> Oh and the security to get to Oracle's tower (yes, I'm going to go
>> ahead with that Watch tower name) is greater than to the bat cave as
>> it is behind a marked off area and has a security lock on the gate to
>> get to it.
>>
>>> The other big mistake is that this just all looks like an ugly and fairly
>>> flat city. There’s none of the cool factor of GOTHAM in the architecture.
>>>
>>> Verdict? It’s only sort of OK but after SUPERMAN, it felt like genius.
>>>
>>> I’ll be back next week.
>>
>> Maybe I'll check it out again but I'm not expecting it to improve.
>
>I wouldn't expect most people around here to like this. But this isn't
>nearly as bad as it could be (except for some miscasting), and I would
>like to see where it goes, particularly in terms of Duella.

You want it to be THE ARK worthy level of cringe? I think they can do
it as I have confidence in the writers even working with good base
material.