On 2022-04-05 12:15 p.m., pete...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, April 5, 2022 at 11:55:11 AM UTC-4, Paul S Person wrote:
>> On Mon, 04 Apr 2022 10:59:13 -0700, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
>> <taus...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Paul S Person <pspe...@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote in
>>> news:hssg4hl2pbnqr26rd...@4ax.com:
>>>
>>>> On Fri, 01 Apr 2022 09:53:43 -0700, Jibini Kula Tumbili
>>>> Kujisalimisha <taus...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Andrew McDowell <mcdow...@sky.com> wrote in
>>>>> news:342571b7-0a8a-4cb7...@googlegroups.com:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Friday, April 1, 2022 at 1:14:39 AM UTC+1, Quadibloc wrote:
>>>>>>> I can't bring myself to have a lot of sympathy for Chris
>>>>>>> Rock. He should have realized that in this day and age,
>>>>>>> making jokes based on alopecia is something our
>>>>>>> society no longer accepts; it's viewed the same way we
>>>>>>> view making jokes about someone with a disability or
>>>>>>> an exceptionality.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thus, the movie Tropic Thunder was condemned for the
>>>>>>> frequent use of what is now called "the R-word" within it,
>>>>>>> with the intent to convey the same attitude towards the
>>>>>>> word in question as the phrase "the N-word" does.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So if Chris Rock winds up being "cancelled", well, even if
>>>>>>> it is terribly unjust instead of serving him right, it's only
>>>>>>> to be expected.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But what about Will Smith?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> While it is true that it isn't really appropriate to approve
>>>>>>> of his reaction, waxing eloquent about how physical
>>>>>>> violence must never be condoned regardless of the
>>>>>>> provocation... would be hypocritical, at least on my
>>>>>>> part. Because I don't feel like waggilng my finger in the
>>>>>>> same way at Dr. Edwin Aldrin, who lost his temper at
>>>>>>> an advocate of the notion that the moon landings were
>>>>>>> a hoax who called him a liar.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Edwin Aldrin and Will Smith are two unique human
>>>>>>> individuals. So it would be untrue to say that the only
>>>>>>> difference between them is that Edwin Aldrin is a real
>>>>>>> astronaut, and Will Smith only played one in the movie
>>>>>>> Independence Day.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But I'm only going to note _one_ other difference between
>>>>>>> the two of them. And no points for guessing which one of
>>>>>>> those many differences it is going to be.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Because while what Will Smith did wasn't an evil act, and
>>>>>>> it doesn't make him a bad man, it still will have evil
>>>>>>> consequences.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Because, unlike Edwin "Buzz" Aldrin, Will Smith... doesn't
>>>>>>> have white privilege? Maybe _that's_ not the right way to
>>>>>>> put it; if Will Smith had been hauled away by the LAPD,
>>>>>>> _then_ that would be a sequence of events fitting that
>>>>>>> paradigm.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But it's still something in that area.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Because to a lot of the white people who either saw what
>>>>>>> transpired on the Oscars that night, or who just heard about
>>>>>>> it, the incident will only serve as confirmation to some of
>>>>>>> the most harmful racial stereotypes that have been floating
>>>>>>> around for hundreds of years.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The conclusion that has been supported once again is this
>>>>>>> one:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You can put a suit and a tie on a black man, but you can't
>>>>>>> change his "real" nature, said nature being that of... an
>>>>>>> impulsive small child. A savage at heart, rather than a
>>>>>>> civilized adult.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This is where a legitimate criticism of Will Smith needs to
>>>>>>> start; not with hypocritical sanctimony about physical
>>>>>>> violence, but with honestly facing the damage he has the
>>>>>>> potential of doing to the fragile progress being made by
>>>>>>> Americans of color.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> John Savard
>>>>>> We now know from sports that even very mild head trauma can be
>>>>>> dangerous, so we should be even less tolerant of attacks than
>>>>>> before, regardless of excuse. As it happens, I find the
>>>>>> reported joke entirely unobjectionable
>>>>>> (https://www.theguardian.com/film/2022/mar/27/will-smith-punch-
>>>>>> ch ris-rock-wife-joke-gi-jane-video-oscars). I find any
>>>>>> culture that regards violence as the proper reaction to
>>>>>> perceived so-called disrespect much more troubling.
>>>>>>
>>>>> Every state in the US has some form of "fighting words" law,
>>>>> wherein it is recognized that there are things one can say that
>>>>> are *so* offensive that any reasonable person would respond with
>>>>> violence.
>>>>>
>>>>> Rock's joke did not rise to that level. It was, perhaps, in bad
>>>>> taste (but most comedy is), and perhaps not particularly funny,
>>>>> in context, but it certainly wasn't "fighting words."
>>>>>
>>>>> Smith's lucky that Rock doesn't want to pursue it in a legal
>>>>> venue. I guess he's too busy booking more shows due to the
>>>>> massive increase in ticket sales for his concerts.
>>>>
>>>> Exactly. The free publicity is worth more than pursuing criminal
>>>> action. Which might reduce the value of the free publicity.
>>>
>>> Plus, it was a slap. Technically, battery, but c'mon. Man up and
>>> don't whine. Which Rock did. (I suspect that, while he should have
>>> known that Smith's wife is bald due to a medical condition, he
>>> probably didn't concsiously realize it when he wrote the joke,
>>> which was apparently improved (if he'd rehearsed it, it's likely
>>> somebody would have say, "Hey, dude, remember . . .). In the
>>> moment, he was too surprised to react, and by the time he gave any
>>> real thought to police reports, I suspect he felt bad about the
>>> joke anyway.)
>> We are, of course, overlooking the obvious point that these are
>> /performers/ on /television/, meaning the whole thing could have been
>> rehearsed beforehand and written into the script.
>>
>> The entire 50s (?) gaming scandal (contestants being fed answers when
>> the audience was told they were not) could have been avoided by simply
>> admitting that they were entertainment, and then scripting them.
>> Basically, you would have a "sitcom" where the "sit" was advancing
>> through the stages of a game show to the top prize.
>
> There used to be (maybe still is) a whole sub-genre of BBC radio
> game shows where the contestants each week were drawn
> from a small pool of well known entertainers and minor celebrities,
> and the entertainment value was not so much the competition,
> as in the sparkling bon mots and improv remarks of the players
> and MC.
>
> Examples:
> Just a Minute
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Just_a_Minute
> I'm Sorry I haven't a Clue
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I%27m_Sorry_I_Haven%27t_a_Clue

And more recent examples:

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8_Out_of_10_Cats>

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Big_Fat_Quiz_of_the_Year>