I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists" just
cycle or walk instead? The "Motorists" who are too old, too fucked, too
fat, too idle, or too up themselves to walk or to cycle can get a taxi or
use the fantastic, efficient, reasonably priced public transport that the
wonderful Conservative party had the foresight to deregulate and
privatise for them.

Grow Up, Motorists!

On 30/09/2023 13:34, Radio Man wrote:
> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists" just
> cycle or walk instead? The "Motorists" who are too old, too fucked, too
> fat, too idle, or too up themselves to walk or to cycle can get a taxi or
> use the fantastic, efficient, reasonably priced public transport that the
> wonderful Conservative party had the foresight to deregulate and
> privatise for them.
>
> Grow Up, Motorists!
>

Do I sense a large hint of sarcasm in your post?

Anyhow, the anti-motorist brigade would do well to remember it is
motorists who pay a large slice of the taxes, without which there
wouldn't be much less available for public spending.

In article <hBURM.181840$MU78.165776@usenetxs.com>,
Radio Man <no.spam@thank.you.invalid> wrote:
> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists" just
> cycle or walk instead? The "Motorists" who are too old, too fucked, too
> fat, too idle, or too up themselves to walk or to cycle can get a taxi or
> use the fantastic, efficient, reasonably priced public transport that the
> wonderful Conservative party had the foresight to deregulate and
> privatise for them.

> Grow Up, Motorists!

I used to cycle for local journeys but I was knocked off my bike -
receiving a badly broken arm - I lost my nerve after that. Too many
motorist who don't give adequate room when passing.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England - sent from my RISC OS 4té²
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

On 30/09/2023 14:30, charles wrote:
> In article <hBURM.181840$MU78.165776@usenetxs.com>,
> Radio Man <no.spam@thank.you.invalid> wrote:
>> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists" just
>> cycle or walk instead? The "Motorists" who are too old, too fucked, too
>> fat, too idle, or too up themselves to walk or to cycle can get a taxi or
>> use the fantastic, efficient, reasonably priced public transport that the
>> wonderful Conservative party had the foresight to deregulate and
>> privatise for them.
>
>> Grow Up, Motorists!
>
> I used to cycle for local journeys but I was knocked off my bike -
> receiving a badly broken arm - I lost my nerve after that. Too many
> motorist who don't give adequate room when passing.
>
On the roads rind here the LycraLouts™ insist on riding down the
center. They patently have no idea how to control a bicycle accurately
enough with anything less than a 1,5m gap either side and more if they
can arrange it, but of course they never took a test, have no insurance
, and these days have effective immunity under the Law.
Their very saddles stink with the odour of sanctity of their non carbon
emittiung bicycles.

--
I was brought up to believe that you should never give offence if you
can avoid it; the new culture tells us you should always take offence if
you can. There are now experts in the art of taking offence, indeed
whole academic subjects, such as 'gender studies', devoted to it.

Sir Roger Scruton

On Saturday, 30 September 2023 at 15:01:08 UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 30/09/2023 14:30, charles wrote:
> > In article <hBURM.181840$MU78....@usenetxs.com>,
> > Radio Man <no....@thank.you.invalid> wrote:
> >> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists" just
> >> cycle or walk instead? The "Motorists" who are too old, too fucked, too
> >> fat, too idle, or too up themselves to walk or to cycle can get a taxi or
> >> use the fantastic, efficient, reasonably priced public transport that the
> >> wonderful Conservative party had the foresight to deregulate and
> >> privatise for them.
> >
> >> Grow Up, Motorists!
> >
> > I used to cycle for local journeys but I was knocked off my bike -
> > receiving a badly broken arm - I lost my nerve after that. Too many
> > motorist who don't give adequate room when passing.
> >
> On the roads rind here the LycraLouts™ insist on riding down the
> center. They patently have no idea how to control a bicycle accurately
> enough with anything less than a 1,5m gap either side and more if they
> can arrange it, but of course they never took a test, have no insurance
> , and these days have effective immunity under the Law.
> Their very saddles stink with the odour of sanctity of their non carbon
> emittiung bicycles.
>
>
> --
> I was brought up to believe that you should never give offence if you
> can avoid it; the new culture tells us you should always take offence if
> you can. There are now experts in the art of taking offence, indeed
> whole academic subjects, such as 'gender studies', devoted to it.
>
> Sir Roger Scruton
Regurgitating someone's sig - some people are only alive because it's illegal to kill them.

On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 15:01:03 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

> On 30/09/2023 14:30, charles wrote:
>> In article <hBURM.181840$MU78.165776@usenetxs.com>,
>> Radio Man <no.spam@thank.you.invalid> wrote:
>>> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists"
>>> just cycle or walk instead? The "Motorists" who are too old, too
>>> fucked, too fat, too idle, or too up themselves to walk or to cycle
>>> can get a taxi or use the fantastic, efficient, reasonably priced
>>> public transport that the wonderful Conservative party had the
>>> foresight to deregulate and privatise for them.
>>
>>> Grow Up, Motorists!
>>
>> I used to cycle for local journeys but I was knocked off my bike -
>> receiving a badly broken arm - I lost my nerve after that. Too many
>> motorist who don't give adequate room when passing.
>>
> On the roads rind here the LycraLouts™ insist on riding down the
> center. They patently have no idea how to control a bicycle accurately
> enough with anything less than a 1,5m gap either side and more if they
> can arrange it, but of course they never took a test, have no insurance
> , and these days have effective immunity under the Law.
> Their very saddles stink with the odour of sanctity of their non carbon
> emittiung bicycles.

I hope you've got some sort of spittle guard on that keyboard of yours.

On 30 Sep 2023 at 16:08:41 BST, "John J" <johnjessop46@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Saturday, 30 September 2023 at 15:01:08 UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher
> wrote:
>> On 30/09/2023 14:30, charles wrote:
>>> In article <hBURM.181840$MU78....@usenetxs.com>,
>>> Radio Man <no....@thank.you.invalid> wrote:
>>>> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists" just
>>>> cycle or walk instead?

So that would be 6 miles to Morrison's and 6 miles back - carrying two large
shopping bags each. And that's not counting the two large folds on the Downs
in between. Admittedly there is a village shop some 3 miles from here.

>> --
>> I was brought up to believe that you should never give offence if you
>> can avoid it; the new culture tells us you should always take offence if
>> you can. There are now experts in the art of taking offence, indeed
>> whole academic subjects, such as 'gender studies', devoted to it.
>>
>> Sir Roger Scruton

> Regurgitating someone's sig - some people are only alive because it's illegal
> to kill them.

All sigs that anyone has may be purloined free of charge.

--
Some people are only alive because it's illegal to kill them. - John Jessop

On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 15:25:37 +0000, Tim Streater wrote:

> On 30 Sep 2023 at 16:08:41 BST, "John J" <johnjessop46@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Saturday, 30 September 2023 at 15:01:08 UTC+1, The Natural
>> Philosopher wrote:
>>> On 30/09/2023 14:30, charles wrote:
>>>> In article <hBURM.181840$MU78....@usenetxs.com>,
>>>> Radio Man <no....@thank.you.invalid> wrote:
>>>>> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists"
>>>>> just cycle or walk instead?
>
> So that would be 6 miles to Morrison's and 6 miles back - carrying two
> large shopping bags each. And that's not counting the two large folds on
> the Downs in between. Admittedly there is a village shop some 3 miles
> from here.
>

Cargo bike.

On 30 Sep 2023 at 17:34:54 BST, "S Mason" <sm@invalid.invalid> wrote:

> On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 15:25:37 +0000, Tim Streater wrote:
>
>> On 30 Sep 2023 at 16:08:41 BST, "John J" <johnjessop46@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Saturday, 30 September 2023 at 15:01:08 UTC+1, The Natural
>>> Philosopher wrote:
>>>> On 30/09/2023 14:30, charles wrote:
>>>>> In article <hBURM.181840$MU78....@usenetxs.com>,
>>>>> Radio Man <no....@thank.you.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists"
>>>>>> just cycle or walk instead?
>>
>> So that would be 6 miles to Morrison's and 6 miles back - carrying two
>> large shopping bags each. And that's not counting the two large folds on
>> the Downs in between. Admittedly there is a village shop some 3 miles
>> from here.
>
> Cargo bike.

Is that a species of push-bike?

--
"Please stop telling us what you feel. Please stop telling us what your intuition is. Your intuitive feelings are of no interest whatsoever, and nor are mine. I don't give a bugger what you feel, or what I feel. I want to know what the evidence shows." -- Richard Dawkins

On 30/09/2023 16:12, S Mason wrote:
> On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 15:01:03 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>
>> On 30/09/2023 14:30, charles wrote:
>>> In article <hBURM.181840$MU78.165776@usenetxs.com>,
>>> Radio Man <no.spam@thank.you.invalid> wrote:
>>>> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists"
>>>> just cycle or walk instead? The "Motorists" who are too old, too
>>>> fucked, too fat, too idle, or too up themselves to walk or to cycle
>>>> can get a taxi or use the fantastic, efficient, reasonably priced
>>>> public transport that the wonderful Conservative party had the
>>>> foresight to deregulate and privatise for them.
>>>
>>>> Grow Up, Motorists!
>>>
>>> I used to cycle for local journeys but I was knocked off my bike -
>>> receiving a badly broken arm - I lost my nerve after that. Too many
>>> motorist who don't give adequate room when passing.
>>>
>> On the roads rind here the LycraLouts™ insist on riding down the
>> center. They patently have no idea how to control a bicycle accurately
>> enough with anything less than a 1,5m gap either side and more if they
>> can arrange it, but of course they never took a test, have no insurance
>> , and these days have effective immunity under the Law.
>> Their very saddles stink with the odour of sanctity of their non carbon
>> emittiung bicycles.
>
> I hope you've got some sort of spittle guard on that keyboard of yours.

No spittle. Just *facts*. You know the things that cause you to have a
panic attack and cover your ears.
And leap in to mount an *emotional* attack on the people who divulge
them to you.

--
“It is hard to imagine a more stupid decision or more dangerous way of
making decisions than by putting those decisions in the hands of people
who pay no price for being wrong.”

Thomas Sowell

On 30/09/2023 17:34, S Mason wrote:
> On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 15:25:37 +0000, Tim Streater wrote:
>
>> On 30 Sep 2023 at 16:08:41 BST, "John J" <johnjessop46@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Saturday, 30 September 2023 at 15:01:08 UTC+1, The Natural
>>> Philosopher wrote:
>>>> On 30/09/2023 14:30, charles wrote:
>>>>> In article <hBURM.181840$MU78....@usenetxs.com>,
>>>>> Radio Man <no....@thank.you.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists"
>>>>>> just cycle or walk instead?
>>
>> So that would be 6 miles to Morrison's and 6 miles back - carrying two
>> large shopping bags each. And that's not counting the two large folds on
>> the Downs in between. Admittedly there is a village shop some 3 miles
>> from here.
>>
>
> Cargo bike.

with a heart condition, spinal injury and COPD.
What a love he really is.

--
“It is hard to imagine a more stupid decision or more dangerous way of
making decisions than by putting those decisions in the hands of people
who pay no price for being wrong.”

Thomas Sowell

On 30 Sep 2023 17:16:23 GMT
Tim Streater <tim@streater.me.uk> wrote:

"Please stop telling us what you feel. Please stop telling us what your
intuition is. Your intuitive feelings are of no interest whatsoever,
and nor are mine. I don't give a bugger what you feel, or what I feel.
I want to know what the evidence shows." -- Richard Dawkins

"What are the facts? Again and again and again — what are the facts?
Shun wishful thinking, ignore divine revelation, forget what "the stars
foretell," avoid opinion, care not what the neighbors think, never mind
the unguessable "verdict of history" — what are the facts, and to how
many decimal places? You pilot always into an unknown future; facts are
your single clue. Get the facts!"

R A Heinlein

--
Joe

On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 18:23:21 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

> On 30/09/2023 16:12, S Mason wrote:
>> On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 15:01:03 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>
>>> On 30/09/2023 14:30, charles wrote:
>>>> In article <hBURM.181840$MU78.165776@usenetxs.com>,
>>>> Radio Man <no.spam@thank.you.invalid> wrote:
>>>>> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists"
>>>>> just cycle or walk instead? The "Motorists" who are too old, too
>>>>> fucked, too fat, too idle, or too up themselves to walk or to cycle
>>>>> can get a taxi or use the fantastic, efficient, reasonably priced
>>>>> public transport that the wonderful Conservative party had the
>>>>> foresight to deregulate and privatise for them.
>>>>
>>>>> Grow Up, Motorists!
>>>>
>>>> I used to cycle for local journeys but I was knocked off my bike -
>>>> receiving a badly broken arm - I lost my nerve after that. Too many
>>>> motorist who don't give adequate room when passing.
>>>>
>>> On the roads rind here the LycraLouts™ insist on riding down the
>>> center. They patently have no idea how to control a bicycle accurately
>>> enough with anything less than a 1,5m gap either side and more if they
>>> can arrange it, but of course they never took a test, have no
>>> insurance , and these days have effective immunity under the Law.
>>> Their very saddles stink with the odour of sanctity of their non
>>> carbon emittiung bicycles.
>>
>> I hope you've got some sort of spittle guard on that keyboard of yours.
>
> No spittle. Just *facts*. You know the things that cause you to have a
> panic attack and cover your ears.
> And leap in to mount an *emotional* attack on the people who divulge
> them to you.

You wouldn't know a fact if it bit you on the arse.

On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 12:34:21 GMT, Radio Man
<no.spam@thank.you.invalid> wrote:

>I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists" just
>cycle or walk instead? The "Motorists" who are too old, too fucked, too
>fat, too idle, or too up themselves to walk or to cycle can get a taxi or
>use the fantastic, efficient, reasonably priced public transport that the
>wonderful Conservative party had the foresight to deregulate and
>privatise for them.
>
>Grow Up, Motorists!

""too old, too fucked, too fat, too idle, or too up themselves""
sounds like a self parody there Mr Reay !

On 9/30/2023 1:16 PM, Tim Streater wrote:
> On 30 Sep 2023 at 17:34:54 BST, "S Mason" <sm@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 15:25:37 +0000, Tim Streater wrote:
>>
>>> On 30 Sep 2023 at 16:08:41 BST, "John J" <johnjessop46@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Saturday, 30 September 2023 at 15:01:08 UTC+1, The Natural
>>>> Philosopher wrote:
>>>>> On 30/09/2023 14:30, charles wrote:
>>>>>> In article <hBURM.181840$MU78....@usenetxs.com>,
>>>>>> Radio Man <no....@thank.you.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists"
>>>>>>> just cycle or walk instead?
>>>
>>> So that would be 6 miles to Morrison's and 6 miles back - carrying two
>>> large shopping bags each. And that's not counting the two large folds on
>>> the Downs in between. Admittedly there is a village shop some 3 miles
>>> from here.
>>
>> Cargo bike.
>
> Is that a species of push-bike?
>

This is just to give you a form factor. It has a longer wheel base.
Some will also have a hitch on the back, to connect a trailer with
some of your offspring riding in it. There's no suspension on this one.
To carry a cargo, you likely need to keep the tyres inflated well.
When I tried that with some balloon-style tyres here on a bicycle,
they were rock-hard and transmitted every road imperfection.

https://arstechnica.com/cars/2023/09/haul-it-all-treks-latest-e-bike-offering-is-a-cargo-bike/

That particular one is too expensive, and is assisted. There is some
sort of motor at the crank level. Bosch product.

"The bike has a 10-speed rear cassette and a responsive Shimano Deore shifter,
so finding a gear that gets you moving is a snap. But a cargo bike is probably
the best-case argument for electrification of any class of bicycle I've tested so far."

"600-watt motor ... 85 Newton-meters of torque."
"500-watt-hour battery"
"Range ... 65 miles per charge"
"Price $6000 USD" [ridiculous]

I've seen some city cars offered for $6000 USD.

The most expensive bicycle I know of, is $12,000 USD.

So that will haul a rather large ass and a small load of groceries from Morrisons.
With charge remaining.

You may be used to getting on a bicycle a certain way,
and whatever you've learned, will be wrong for that bicycle.

The other issue with that bicycle, is it is using a ten speed
cassette, and that means the chain (thinner on a ten speed)
will not be substantial. Chains don't particularly like motor drive,
because the motor can slam in the torque, whereas a human rider
is "all about moderation". Now, that design has torque sensing,
but it's still too much load for a thin chain.

You can also get a wheel with a hub motor, and that does not
stress the chain. The spoke pattern and number of spokes, may
differ on eBikes, depending on the power levels involved.

In your bicycle parts storage area, you would carry a set of
disc pads for each year of ownership, a set of new tyres per
year of ownership. And at least a chain or two as spares.
If you don't take care of the chain, it can wear the gears
and then it really gets expensive. Part of the problem with
"parts", is you frequently cannot get exact substitutes and
the material that is available is shite.

If you buy synthetic rubber tyres, you get two years of driving,
but... there's no grip. Conventional tyres last for a year, but
there is grip until the belt is exposed. With a synthetic tyre,
if there is a "ridge" in the road, due to a paving being uneven,
the tyre won't roll up the ridge and it slides along the ridge
and it feels like the rear of the bicycle is out of control. That's
why I had to take my test synthetic tyres off, they were driving
me nuts.

*******

This cargo bike, uses a hub motor, and it also uses
a seven speed rear gear, so the chain will be a bit more
substantial (and only your own pedaling goes through the chain).
I much prefer hub motors as an idea, compared to the crank
motors that push the power through the chain drive.

https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2021/11/rad-powers-radwagon-4-is-a-great-e-bike-at-a-surprisingly-low-price/

The most important part, is the price is 1/3rd of the Trek bicycle.
You don't need a bank loan, for an assisted bicycle, if you shop around.

And of course you get wet on a rainy day. Your ability to read a Doppler Radar,
helps keep you dry. I got soaked a couple weeks ago, because the pattern
on the radar was "quite unusual". Clouds spinning in tight circles.
Hard to judge the intercept. I got soaked. And as I got closer to home,
the road was bone-dry. Not a drop of rain fell there.

*******

At the grocery store the other day, I saw an assisted bicycle, and
the gentleman had a huge cable for locking the bicycle up, and the
key lock he was using, was the biggest key lock I've ever seen.
The idea being, the hasp on the lock is too large for the Junior Bolt Cutters
the bicycle thieves use :-)

Paul

On 9/30/2023 1:24 PM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 30/09/2023 17:34, S Mason wrote:
>> On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 15:25:37 +0000, Tim Streater wrote:
>>
>>> On 30 Sep 2023 at 16:08:41 BST, "John J" <johnjessop46@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Saturday, 30 September 2023 at 15:01:08 UTC+1, The Natural
>>>> Philosopher wrote:
>>>>> On 30/09/2023 14:30, charles wrote:
>>>>>> In article <hBURM.181840$MU78....@usenetxs.com>,
>>>>>> Radio Man <no....@thank.you.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists"
>>>>>>> just cycle or walk instead?
>>>
>>> So that would be 6 miles to Morrison's and 6 miles back - carrying two
>>> large shopping bags each. And that's not counting the two large folds on
>>> the Downs in between. Admittedly there is a village shop some 3 miles
>>> from here.
>>>
>>
>> Cargo bike.
>
> with a heart condition, spinal injury and COPD.
> What a love he really is.
>

There are electric motorcycles.

A few people have them here.

There are a large number of petrol powered motor cycles here, and
they race up the highway at night, seemingly no police
to be seen. The electric motorcycles do not have the "specs"
to do that. You can only ride an electric motorcycle like
a "proper gentleman". No rice rocket.

Both of those types of vehicles are expensive.

And, assisted bicycles with the twist-grip throttle on them,
you don't get any exercise on those. None at all. Only if the
battery was knackered, would you be pedaling. And you can
call a taxi, if that is the case.

You can get anything you want. Illegal bicycle ? OK. "No problem, sir"
Bicycles with pedaling and assist. Bicycles with assist only
(pedal is for decoration). On a full assist bicycle, they don't
have gear shifting, so if you were silly enough to use the pedals,
it will only do 5 MPH top speed. It's basically "stuck in low gear"
for the pedal side of it.

Assisted bicycles can have a "readout", and it shows fuel remaining.

Paul

On Sun, 01 Oct 2023 00:35:22 +0100, Rambo wrote:

> On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 12:34:21 GMT, Radio Man <no.spam@thank.you.invalid>
> wrote:
>
>>I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists" just
>>cycle or walk instead? The "Motorists" who are too old, too fucked, too
>>fat, too idle, or too up themselves to walk or to cycle can get a taxi
>>or use the fantastic, efficient, reasonably priced public transport that
>>the wonderful Conservative party had the foresight to deregulate and
>>privatise for them.
>>
>>Grow Up, Motorists!
>
> ""too old, too fucked, too fat, too idle, or too up themselves""
> sounds like a self parody there Mr Reay !

Pissed again, Dumbo Dick?

On 01 Oct 2023 at 03:56:08 BST, "Paul" <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

> On 9/30/2023 1:16 PM, Tim Streater wrote:
>> On 30 Sep 2023 at 17:34:54 BST, "S Mason" <sm@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 15:25:37 +0000, Tim Streater wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 30 Sep 2023 at 16:08:41 BST, "John J" <johnjessop46@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Saturday, 30 September 2023 at 15:01:08 UTC+1, The Natural
>>>>> Philosopher wrote:
>>>>>> On 30/09/2023 14:30, charles wrote:
>>>>>>> In article <hBURM.181840$MU78....@usenetxs.com>,
>>>>>>> Radio Man <no....@thank.you.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>>> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists"
>>>>>>>> just cycle or walk instead?
>>>>
>>>> So that would be 6 miles to Morrison's and 6 miles back - carrying two
>>>> large shopping bags each. And that's not counting the two large folds on
>>>> the Downs in between. Admittedly there is a village shop some 3 miles
>>>> from here.
>>>
>>> Cargo bike.
>>
>> Is that a species of push-bike?
>
> This is just to give you a form factor. It has a longer wheel base.
> Some will also have a hitch on the back, to connect a trailer with
> some of your offspring riding in it. There's no suspension on this one.
> To carry a cargo, you likely need to keep the tyres inflated well.
> When I tried that with some balloon-style tyres here on a bicycle,
> they were rock-hard and transmitted every road imperfection.
>
>
> https://arstechnica.com/cars/2023/09/haul-it-all-treks-latest-e-bike-offering-is-a-cargo-bike/

[snip]

Morrison's is 55ft above sea level, my house is 470ft up with a couple of
150ft ups and downs in between. Not ideal for me these days, even with a
power-assisted bike. Not that those number are particularly large - some 50
years ago I did a hike that involved gaining 5700ft in five-and-a-half hours.
But that was then.

--
“It is not the truth of Marxism that explains the willingness of intellectuals to believe it, but the power that it confers on intellectuals, in their attempts to control the world. And since ... it is futile to reason someone out of a thing that he was not reasoned into, we can conclude that Marxism owes its remarkable power to survive every criticism to the fact that it is not a truth-directed but a power-directed system of thought.”

Sir Roger Scruton

On 30/09/2023 20:18, S Mason wrote:
> On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 18:23:21 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>
>> On 30/09/2023 16:12, S Mason wrote:
>>> On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 15:01:03 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 30/09/2023 14:30, charles wrote:
>>>>> In article <hBURM.181840$MU78.165776@usenetxs.com>,
>>>>> Radio Man <no.spam@thank.you.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists"
>>>>>> just cycle or walk instead? The "Motorists" who are too old, too
>>>>>> fucked, too fat, too idle, or too up themselves to walk or to cycle
>>>>>> can get a taxi or use the fantastic, efficient, reasonably priced
>>>>>> public transport that the wonderful Conservative party had the
>>>>>> foresight to deregulate and privatise for them.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Grow Up, Motorists!
>>>>>
>>>>> I used to cycle for local journeys but I was knocked off my bike -
>>>>> receiving a badly broken arm - I lost my nerve after that. Too many
>>>>> motorist who don't give adequate room when passing.
>>>>>
>>>> On the roads rind here the LycraLouts™ insist on riding down the
>>>> center. They patently have no idea how to control a bicycle accurately
>>>> enough with anything less than a 1,5m gap either side and more if they
>>>> can arrange it, but of course they never took a test, have no
>>>> insurance , and these days have effective immunity under the Law.
>>>> Their very saddles stink with the odour of sanctity of their non
>>>> carbon emittiung bicycles.
>>>
>>> I hope you've got some sort of spittle guard on that keyboard of yours.
>>
>> No spittle. Just *facts*. You know the things that cause you to have a
>> panic attack and cover your ears.
>> And leap in to mount an *emotional* attack on the people who divulge
>> them to you.
>
> You wouldn't know a fact if it bit you on the arse.
Oh dear, more emotional fact free responses.
..
Darling boy, I made my career as a practising engineer. No a BBC newscaster.
Machines respond to facts.
Not to idle opinions.
I cant make my car do another ten miles by promising it that I will fill
up at the next fuel station.
If my designs are not cosnsistent with the facts, they dont work.

I said:
On the roads rind here the LycraLouts™ insist on riding down the
center.

That is an actual fact.

They patently have no idea how to control a bicycle accurately
enough with anything less than a 1,5m gap either side and more if they
can arrange it,

That is also a fact. They are the most selfish road users ever. They
have been told how scared they must be of cars but how they can
prosecute a driver who doesn't leave a meter gap, which means they can
render themselves impossible to overtake, and they do. one mile tailbacks

but of course they never took a test,

Is a fact.

have no insurance ,

is a fact.

and these days have effective immunity under the Law.

is a fact.

Their very saddles stink with the odour of sanctity of their non
carbon emitting bicycles.

Poetic license

--
Gun Control: The law that ensures that only criminals have guns.

On 01/10/2023 04:10, Paul wrote:
> On 9/30/2023 1:24 PM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> On 30/09/2023 17:34, S Mason wrote:
>>> On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 15:25:37 +0000, Tim Streater wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 30 Sep 2023 at 16:08:41 BST, "John J" <johnjessop46@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Saturday, 30 September 2023 at 15:01:08 UTC+1, The Natural
>>>>> Philosopher wrote:
>>>>>> On 30/09/2023 14:30, charles wrote:
>>>>>>> In article <hBURM.181840$MU78....@usenetxs.com>,
>>>>>>> Radio Man <no....@thank.you.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>>> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists"
>>>>>>>> just cycle or walk instead?
>>>>
>>>> So that would be 6 miles to Morrison's and 6 miles back - carrying two
>>>> large shopping bags each. And that's not counting the two large folds on
>>>> the Downs in between. Admittedly there is a village shop some 3 miles
>>>> from here.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Cargo bike.
>>
>> with a heart condition, spinal injury and COPD.
>> What a love he really is.
>>
>
> There are electric motorcycles.
>
> A few people have them here.
>
> There are a large number of petrol powered motor cycles here, and
> they race up the highway at night, seemingly no police
> to be seen. The electric motorcycles do not have the "specs"
> to do that. You can only ride an electric motorcycle like
> a "proper gentleman". No rice rocket.
>
> Both of those types of vehicles are expensive.
>
> And, assisted bicycles with the twist-grip throttle on them,
> you don't get any exercise on those. None at all. Only if the
> battery was knackered, would you be pedaling. And you can
> call a taxi, if that is the case.
>
> You can get anything you want. Illegal bicycle ? OK. "No problem, sir"
> Bicycles with pedaling and assist. Bicycles with assist only
> (pedal is for decoration). On a full assist bicycle, they don't
> have gear shifting, so if you were silly enough to use the pedals,
> it will only do 5 MPH top speed. It's basically "stuck in low gear"
> for the pedal side of it.
>
> Assisted bicycles can have a "readout", and it shows fuel remaining.
>
> Paul
>
Wee were talking about speed limits.
At 20mph it would take me 4 hours to do shopping

--
Gun Control: The law that ensures that only criminals have guns.

On Sun, 01 Oct 2023 10:56:32 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

> On 30/09/2023 20:18, S Mason wrote:
>> On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 18:23:21 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>
>>> On 30/09/2023 16:12, S Mason wrote:
>>>> On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 15:01:03 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 30/09/2023 14:30, charles wrote:
>>>>>> In article <hBURM.181840$MU78.165776@usenetxs.com>,
>>>>>> Radio Man <no.spam@thank.you.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists"
>>>>>>> just cycle or walk instead? The "Motorists" who are too old, too
>>>>>>> fucked, too fat, too idle, or too up themselves to walk or to
>>>>>>> cycle can get a taxi or use the fantastic, efficient, reasonably
>>>>>>> priced public transport that the wonderful Conservative party had
>>>>>>> the foresight to deregulate and privatise for them.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Grow Up, Motorists!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I used to cycle for local journeys but I was knocked off my bike -
>>>>>> receiving a badly broken arm - I lost my nerve after that. Too
>>>>>> many motorist who don't give adequate room when passing.
>>>>>>
>>>>> On the roads rind here the LycraLouts™ insist on riding down the
>>>>> center. They patently have no idea how to control a bicycle
>>>>> accurately enough with anything less than a 1,5m gap either side and
>>>>> more if they can arrange it, but of course they never took a test,
>>>>> have no insurance , and these days have effective immunity under the
>>>>> Law. Their very saddles stink with the odour of sanctity of their
>>>>> non carbon emittiung bicycles.
>>>>
>>>> I hope you've got some sort of spittle guard on that keyboard of
>>>> yours.
>>>
>>> No spittle. Just *facts*. You know the things that cause you to have a
>>> panic attack and cover your ears.
>>> And leap in to mount an *emotional* attack on the people who divulge
>>> them to you.
>>
>> You wouldn't know a fact if it bit you on the arse.
> Oh dear, more emotional fact free responses.
> .
> Darling boy, I made my career as a practising engineer. No a BBC
> newscaster.
> Machines respond to facts.
> Not to idle opinions.
> I cant make my car do another ten miles by promising it that I will fill
> up at the next fuel station.
> If my designs are not cosnsistent with the facts, they dont work.
>
> I said:
> On the roads rind here the LycraLouts™ insist on riding down the
> center.
>
> That is an actual fact.
>
> They patently have no idea how to control a bicycle accurately enough
> with anything less than a 1,5m gap either side and more if they
> can arrange it,
>
> That is also a fact. They are the most selfish road users ever. They
> have been told how scared they must be of cars but how they can
> prosecute a driver who doesn't leave a meter gap, which means they can
> render themselves impossible to overtake, and they do. one mile
> tailbacks
>
> but of course they never took a test,
>
> Is a fact.
>
> have no insurance ,
>
> is a fact.
>
> and these days have effective immunity under the Law.
>
> is a fact.
>
> Their very saddles stink with the odour of sanctity of their non
> carbon emitting bicycles.
>
> Poetic license

All perfectly legal. I thought you lot liked law and order, or is that
only when it suits YOU?

On 10/1/2023 5:59 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 01/10/2023 04:10, Paul wrote:
>> On 9/30/2023 1:24 PM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>> On 30/09/2023 17:34, S Mason wrote:
>>>> On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 15:25:37 +0000, Tim Streater wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 30 Sep 2023 at 16:08:41 BST, "John J" <johnjessop46@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Saturday, 30 September 2023 at 15:01:08 UTC+1, The Natural
>>>>>> Philosopher wrote:
>>>>>>> On 30/09/2023 14:30, charles wrote:
>>>>>>>> In article <hBURM.181840$MU78....@usenetxs.com>,
>>>>>>>> Radio Man <no....@thank.you.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists"
>>>>>>>>> just cycle or walk instead?
>>>>>
>>>>> So that would be 6 miles to Morrison's and 6 miles back - carrying two
>>>>> large shopping bags each. And that's not counting the two large folds on
>>>>> the Downs in between. Admittedly there is a village shop some 3 miles
>>>>> from here.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Cargo bike.
>>>
>>> with a heart condition, spinal injury and COPD.
>>> What a love he really is.
>>>
>>
>> There are electric motorcycles.
>>
>> A few people have them here.
>>
>> There are a large number of petrol powered motor cycles here, and
>> they race up the highway at night, seemingly no police
>> to be seen. The electric motorcycles do not have the "specs"
>> to do that. You can only ride an electric motorcycle like
>> a "proper gentleman". No rice rocket.
>>
>> Both of those types of vehicles are expensive.
>>
>> And, assisted bicycles with the twist-grip throttle on them,
>> you don't get any exercise on those. None at all. Only if the
>> battery was knackered, would you be pedaling. And you can
>> call a taxi, if that is the case.
>>
>> You can get anything you want. Illegal bicycle ? OK. "No problem, sir"
>> Bicycles with pedaling and assist. Bicycles with assist only
>> (pedal is for decoration). On a full assist bicycle, they don't
>> have gear shifting, so if you were silly enough to use the pedals,
>> it will only do 5 MPH top speed. It's basically "stuck in low gear"
>> for the pedal side of it.
>>
>> Assisted bicycles can have a "readout", and it shows fuel remaining.
>>
>>     Paul
>>
> Wee were talking about speed limits.
> At 20mph it would take me 4 hours to do shopping
>
>

Some of the BEV motorcycles, don't have particularly outstanding specs.
This one, you can take the battery in the house and charge it. Making
it a "commuter motorcycle".

https://electrek.co/2022/11/09/kawasaki-electric-ninja-motorcycle/

But there are others.

They have some prices listed here. It would appear the attraction
of these, is supposed to be the high speed, rather than range or something.

https://www.topspeed.com/fastest-electric-motorcycles-on-the-market/#livewire-one-110-mph

Paul

On 30/09/2023 14:23, Jack Harry Teesdale wrote:
> On 30/09/2023 13:34, Radio Man wrote:
>> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists" just
>> cycle or walk instead? The "Motorists" who are too old, too fucked, too
>> fat, too idle, or too up themselves to walk or to cycle can get a taxi or
>> use the fantastic, efficient, reasonably priced public transport that the
>> wonderful Conservative party had the foresight to deregulate and
>> privatise for them.
>>
>> Grow Up, Motorists!
>>
>
> Do I sense a large hint of sarcasm in your post?
>
> Anyhow, the anti-motorist brigade would do well to remember it is
> motorists who pay a large slice of the taxes, without which there
> wouldn't be much less available for public spending.

There is no 'anti-motorist brigade' You have been tricked into the Tory
Culture Wars by reading the Daily Mail or something. Like there is no
right to asylum for being gay or a woman, there never were East European
Immigrants stealing carp from fish ponds, like most terrorists are white
right wingers, not Muslims. Don't be a fool. Don't just believe the Tory
claptrap.
TW

On Sunday, 1 October 2023 at 12:53:26 UTC+1, TimW wrote:
> On 30/09/2023 14:23, Jack Harry Teesdale wrote:
> > On 30/09/2023 13:34, Radio Man wrote:
> >> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists" just
> >> cycle or walk instead? The "Motorists" who are too old, too fucked, too
> >> fat, too idle, or too up themselves to walk or to cycle can get a taxi or
> >> use the fantastic, efficient, reasonably priced public transport that the
> >> wonderful Conservative party had the foresight to deregulate and
> >> privatise for them.
> >>
> >> Grow Up, Motorists!
> >>
> >
> > Do I sense a large hint of sarcasm in your post?
> >
> > Anyhow, the anti-motorist brigade would do well to remember it is
> > motorists who pay a large slice of the taxes, without which there
> > wouldn't be much less available for public spending.
> There is no 'anti-motorist brigade' You have been tricked into the Tory
> Culture Wars by reading the Daily Mail or something. Like there is no
> right to asylum for being gay or a woman, there never were East European
> Immigrants stealing carp from fish ponds, like most terrorists are white
> right wingers, not Muslims. Don't be a fool. Don't just believe the Tory
> claptrap.
> TW
Claptrap is not restricted to one party. There are as many lunatics on the labour benches (possibly more) as the Tories can muster. No matter which party is in power we're going to hell in a handbasket 😞

On Saturday, 30 September 2023 at 18:23:26 UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 30/09/2023 16:12, S Mason wrote:
> > On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 15:01:03 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> >
> >> On 30/09/2023 14:30, charles wrote:
> >>> In article <hBURM.181840$MU78....@usenetxs.com>,
> >>> Radio Man <no....@thank.you.invalid> wrote:
> >>>> I don't know what all the fuss is about. Why don't "The Motorists"
> >>>> just cycle or walk instead? The "Motorists" who are too old, too
> >>>> fucked, too fat, too idle, or too up themselves to walk or to cycle
> >>>> can get a taxi or use the fantastic, efficient, reasonably priced
> >>>> public transport that the wonderful Conservative party had the
> >>>> foresight to deregulate and privatise for them.
> >>>
> >>>> Grow Up, Motorists!
> >>>
> >>> I used to cycle for local journeys but I was knocked off my bike -
> >>> receiving a badly broken arm - I lost my nerve after that. Too many
> >>> motorist who don't give adequate room when passing.
> >>>
> >> On the roads rind here the LycraLouts™ insist on riding down the
> >> center. They patently have no idea how to control a bicycle accurately
> >> enough with anything less than a 1,5m gap either side and more if they
> >> can arrange it, but of course they never took a test, have no insurance
> >> , and these days have effective immunity under the Law.
> >> Their very saddles stink with the odour of sanctity of their non carbon
> >> emittiung bicycles.
> >
> > I hope you've got some sort of spittle guard on that keyboard of yours.
> No spittle. Just *facts*. You know the things that cause you to have a
> panic attack and cover your ears.
> And leap in to mount an *emotional* attack on the people who divulge
> them to you.
>
>
> --
> “It is hard to imagine a more stupid decision or more dangerous way of
> making decisions than by putting those decisions in the hands of people
> who pay no price for being wrong.”
>
> Thomas Sowell

We're back to debating art student theories!