....turning on the cold tap and waiting for hot water to come out ;-)

--
“It is not the truth of Marxism that explains the willingness of
intellectuals to believe it, but the power that it confers on
intellectuals, in their attempts to control the world. And since...it is
futile to reason someone out of a thing that he was not reasoned into,
we can conclude that Marxism owes its remarkable power to survive every
criticism to the fact that it is not a truth-directed but a
power-directed system of thought.”
Sir Roger Scruton

On 22/12/2023 11:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> ...turning on the cold tap and waiting for hot water to come out ;-)

Admission being another feature?

I have come across taps that are the opposite way from convention.

Fredxx <fredxx@spam.invalid> wrote:
> On 22/12/2023 11:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> > ...turning on the cold tap and waiting for hot water to come out ;-)
>
> Admission being another feature?
>
> I have come across taps that are the opposite way from convention.
>
Lots of people don't realise that there *is* a standard/convention.

--
Chris Green

·

On 22/12/2023 11:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> ...turning on the cold tap and waiting for hot water to come out ;-)
>

joining "reform"

In message <um3s5k$1i0b0$2@dont-email.me>, The Natural Philosopher
<tnp@invalid.invalid> writes
>...turning on the cold tap and waiting for hot water to come out ;-)

Hah! Not done that yet..
>

--
Tim Lamb

On 22/12/2023 11:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> ...turning on the cold tap and waiting for hot water to come out ;-)
>

Then going to repair the hot water system as it isn't working?

--
Colin Bignell

On 22/12/2023 12:39, Andrew wrote:
> On 22/12/2023 11:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> ...turning on the cold tap and waiting for hot water to come out ;-)
>>
>
> joining "reform"
No, definitely not.
Senility is voting Tory or Labour and expecting anything to change.
Except for the worse.

--
To ban Christmas, simply give turkeys the vote.

On 22/12/2023 14:28, Colin Bignell wrote:
> On 22/12/2023 11:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> ...turning on the cold tap and waiting for hot water to come out ;-)
>>
>
> Then going to repair the hot water system as it isn't working?
>
>

I think that is probably what happens in the next ten years...

--
"I guess a rattlesnake ain't risponsible fer bein' a rattlesnake, but ah
puts mah heel on um jess the same if'n I catches him around mah chillun".

On 22-Dec-23 12:32, Chris Green wrote:
> Fredxx <fredxx@spam.invalid> wrote:
>> On 22/12/2023 11:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>> ...turning on the cold tap and waiting for hot water to come out ;-)
>>
>> Admission being another feature?
>>
>> I have come across taps that are the opposite way from convention.
>>
> Lots of people don't realise that there *is* a standard/convention.
>
Why bother with a "standard" for such an trivial matter?

Next you'll be telling me on what side of the road I should drive.

--
Sam Plusnet

On 22/12/2023 12:32, Chris Green wrote:
> Fredxx <fredxx@spam.invalid> wrote:
>> On 22/12/2023 11:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>> ...turning on the cold tap and waiting for hot water to come out ;-)
>>
>> Admission being another feature?
>>
>> I have come across taps that are the opposite way from convention.
>>
> Lots of people don't realise that there *is* a standard/convention.

*Is* there a standard for the placement of hot and cold taps? I've come
across some houses where the kitchen sink was one way round and the bath
and wash basin taps were the other way round.

The real problem is mixer taps with a single control that rocks
forwards/backwards for controlling the rate of flow and rotates
clockwise/anticlockwise for temperature. There seems to be no standard
at all for those - and few taps even have any markings for which way you
rotate the control to go from cold to hot. It would have been so easy
for those taps to be engraved with a clockwise/anticlockwise
double-headed arrow with H and C beside the relevant arrow heads.

With the mixer tap in the kitchen, I just turn it one way and if the
water doesn't run warm I turn it the other way. I can never remember
which direction is hot, and the pipe runs are so long in our house that
it takes ages for the hot water to reach the sink. OK, it's a combi
boiler so it takes a little while for the water to run hot even as it
comes out of the boiler, but even with pre-heat enabled (so the boiler
maintains a small reservoir of hot water to cover the period until the
boiler is heating on demand) the delay between water being hot as it
leaves the boiler and running hot at the kitchen tap is a good minute or
so, even at fairly fast flow rates.

On 22/12/2023 21:07, NY wrote:
> On 22/12/2023 12:32, Chris Green wrote:
>> Fredxx <fredxx@spam.invalid> wrote:
>>> On 22/12/2023 11:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>> ...turning on the cold tap and waiting for hot water to come out ;-)
>>>
>>> Admission being another feature?
>>>
>>> I have come across taps that are the opposite way from convention.
>>>
>> Lots of people don't realise that there *is* a standard/convention.
>
> *Is* there a standard for the placement of hot and cold taps?

In the USA there is and it is recommended in the UK. The cold should be
on the right, as most people are right handed. That way, a blind or
partially sighted person is more likely to turn on the cold first,
reducing the risk of scalding. It is quite theoretical and far from
universal. My house has the hot on the right, but, given the time it
takes for the hot water to come through, scalding is not really a risk.

I've come
> across some houses where the kitchen sink was one way round and the bath
> and wash basin taps were the other way round.
>
> The real problem is mixer taps with a single control that rocks
> forwards/backwards for controlling the rate of flow and rotates
> clockwise/anticlockwise for temperature. There seems to be no standard
> at all for those - and few taps even have any markings for which way you
> rotate the control to go from cold to hot. It would have been so easy
> for those taps to be engraved with a clockwise/anticlockwise
> double-headed arrow with H and C beside the relevant arrow heads.
>
> With the mixer tap in the kitchen, I just turn it one way and if the
> water doesn't run warm I turn it the other way. I can never remember
> which direction is hot, and the pipe runs are so long in our house that
> it takes ages for the hot water to reach the sink. OK, it's a combi
> boiler so it takes a little while for the water to run hot even as it
> comes out of the boiler, but even with pre-heat enabled (so the boiler
> maintains a small reservoir of hot water to cover the period until the
> boiler is heating on demand) the delay between water being hot as it
> leaves the boiler and running hot at the kitchen tap is a good minute or
> so, even at fairly fast flow rates.

--
Colin Bignell

On 22/12/2023 in message
<S5ucnc3qGtMfZxj4nZ2dnZfqn_adnZ2d@brightview.co.uk> NY wrote:

>>Lots of people don't realise that there is a standard/convention.
>
>Is there a standard for the placement of hot and cold taps? I've come
>across some houses where the kitchen sink was one way round and the bath
>and wash basin taps were the other way round.

My bath and kitchen taps are the right way round, the bathroom & loo wash
basin taps are the other way round.

--
Jeff Gaines Dorset UK
Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it whether it exists
or not, diagnosing it incorrectly, and applying the wrong remedies.

On 22/12/2023 22:29, Colin Bignell wrote:
> My house has the hot on the right, but, given the time it takes for the hot water to come through, scalding is not really a risk.

I've never yet come across a hot tap that runs hot immediately it is
turned on, unless it was used only a minute or so before. Maybe if the
pipes are end-to-end plastic (right from the boiler or cylinder to the
tap) there is less heat loss than with copper pipe. Our present house
has copper pipes as the "backbone" with plastic spurs off it to the taps.

Amusingly, although it originally had hot water fed from a tank in the
loft (so at very low pressure compared with mains pressure), someone had
chosen to use 15 mm pipe rather than the 22 mm which is normally used
for tank-fed hot water to compensate for the lower pressure.
Consequently the flow rate on the hot water was puny compared with the
cold. When we had to have a new boiler, we went for mains-fed combi, so
the 15 mm hot water pipes are fine - it's easy to balance hot and cold
flow rates in mixer taps or by turning separate taps the same number of
turns.

On 22/12/2023 22:56, NY wrote:
> On 22/12/2023 22:29, Colin Bignell wrote:
>> My house has the hot on the right, but, given the time it takes for
>> the hot water to come through, scalding is not really a risk.
>
> I've never yet come across a hot tap that runs hot immediately it is
> turned on, unless it was used only a minute or so before.

Hot water recirculation systems and instant flow electric boilers can
both produce hot water almost instantaneously.

> Maybe if the
> pipes are end-to-end plastic (right from the boiler or cylinder to the
> tap) there is less heat loss than with copper pipe. Our present house
> has copper pipes as the "backbone" with plastic spurs off it to the taps.
>
> Amusingly, although it originally had hot water fed from a tank in the
> loft (so at very low pressure compared with mains pressure), someone had
> chosen to use 15 mm pipe rather than the 22 mm which is normally used
> for tank-fed hot water to compensate for the lower pressure.
> Consequently the flow rate on the hot water was puny compared with the
> cold. When we had to have a new boiler, we went for mains-fed combi, so
> the 15 mm hot water pipes are fine - it's easy to balance hot and cold
> flow rates in mixer taps or by turning separate taps the same number of
> turns.

--
Colin Bignell

On 22 Dec 2023 at 21:07:12 GMT, "NY" <me@privacy.net> wrote:

> On 22/12/2023 12:32, Chris Green wrote:
>> Fredxx <fredxx@spam.invalid> wrote:
>>> On 22/12/2023 11:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>> ...turning on the cold tap and waiting for hot water to come out ;-)
>>>
>>> Admission being another feature?
>>>
>>> I have come across taps that are the opposite way from convention.
>>>
>> Lots of people don't realise that there *is* a standard/convention.
>
> *Is* there a standard for the placement of hot and cold taps?

Hot on the left, cold on the right.

--
"It is hard to imagine a more stupid decision or more dangerous way of making decisions than by putting those decisions in the hands of people who pay no price for being wrong." -- Thomas Sowell

On 23/12/2023 00:00, Colin Bignell wrote:
> On 22/12/2023 22:56, NY wrote:
>> On 22/12/2023 22:29, Colin Bignell wrote:
>>> My house has the hot on the right, but, given the time it takes for
>>> the hot water to come through, scalding is not really a risk.
>>
>> I've never yet come across a hot tap that runs hot immediately it is
>> turned on, unless it was used only a minute or so before.
>
> Hot water recirculation systems (snip) produce hot water almost instantaneously.

Effectively that's a radiator that you leave on all Summer :)

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On 23/12/2023 10:03, alan_m wrote:
> On 23/12/2023 00:00, Colin Bignell wrote:
>> On 22/12/2023 22:56, NY wrote:
>>> On 22/12/2023 22:29, Colin Bignell wrote:
>>>> My house has the hot on the right, but, given the time it takes for
>>>> the hot water to come through, scalding is not really a risk.
>>>
>>> I've never yet come across a hot tap that runs hot immediately it is
>>> turned on, unless it was used only a minute or so before.
>>
>> Hot water recirculation systems (snip) produce hot water almost
>> instantaneously.
>
> Effectively that's a radiator that you leave on all Summer :)

It is commonly used in hotels. Guests don't have to wait a long time for
hot water and less water is run to waste while waiting for it.

--
Colin Bignell

On Friday 22 December 2023 at 22:56:16 UTC, NY wrote:
> by turning separate taps the same number of
> turns.

I never thought of that before, and I'm 55.

Owain

In message <q8cg5k-onnc1.ln1@esprimo.zbmc.eu>, Chris Green <cl@isbd.net>
writes
>Fredxx <fredxx@spam.invalid> wrote:
>> On 22/12/2023 11:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> > ...turning on the cold tap and waiting for hot water to come out ;-)
>>
>> Admission being another feature?
>>
>> I have come across taps that are the opposite way from convention.
>>
>Lots of people don't realise that there *is* a standard/convention.
>

Mine in the futility room are the opposite way round but are helpfully
labelled "main" and "hot". Maybe the standard was invented after 1907.

Brian
--
Brian Howie

On 23/12/2023 11:35, brian wrote:
> In message <q8cg5k-onnc1.ln1@esprimo.zbmc.eu>, Chris Green <cl@isbd.net>
> writes
>> Fredxx <fredxx@spam.invalid> wrote:
>>> On 22/12/2023 11:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>> > ...turning on the cold tap and waiting for hot water to come out ;-)
>>>
>>> Admission being another feature?
>>>
>>> I have come across taps that are the opposite way from convention.
>>>
>> Lots of people don't realise that there *is* a standard/convention.
>>
>
> Mine in the futility room are the opposite way round but are helpfully
> labelled  "main" and "hot". Maybe the standard was invented after 1907.
>
> Brian

There is no standard, but there us a convention.

I am not sure my parents house didn't have them the other way around,
but I cannot remember.

--
To ban Christmas, simply give turkeys the vote.

On 12/22/2023 12:32 PM, Chris Green wrote:
> Fredxx <fredxx@spam.invalid> wrote:
>> On 22/12/2023 11:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>> ...turning on the cold tap and waiting for hot water to come out ;-)
>>
>> Admission being another feature?
>>
>> I have come across taps that are the opposite way from convention.
>>
> Lots of people don't realise that there *is* a standard/convention.
>
which goes for nothing

On 22/12/2023 22:29, Colin Bignell wrote:
> On 22/12/2023 21:07, NY wrote:

>> *Is* there a standard for the placement of hot and cold taps?
>
> In the USA there is and it is recommended in the UK. The cold should be
> on the right, as most people are right handed. That way, a blind or
> partially sighted person is more likely to turn on the cold first,
> reducing the risk of scalding. It is quite theoretical and far from
> universal. My house has the hot on the right, but, given the time it
> takes for the hot water to come through, scalding is not really a risk.
Do you have any documentary evidence for that explanation? (The matter
has been discussed here before.)

--
Max Demian

On 23/12/2023 14:17, Max Demian wrote:
> On 22/12/2023 22:29, Colin Bignell wrote:
>> On 22/12/2023 21:07, NY wrote:
>
>>> *Is* there a standard for the placement of hot and cold taps?
>>
>> In the USA there is and it is recommended in the UK. The cold should
>> be on the right, as most people are right handed. That way, a blind or
>> partially sighted person is more likely to turn on the cold first,
>> reducing the risk of scalding. It is quite theoretical and far from
>> universal. My house has the hot on the right, but, given the time it
>> takes for the hot water to come through, scalding is not really a risk.
>
> Do you have any documentary evidence for that explanation? (The matter
> has been discussed here before.)

A fuller explanation is here:
https://www.plumbworld.co.uk/blog/hot-bathroom-tap-on-the-left-or-right

I prefer the explanation from when homes only had cold water it was
logical to have the tap on the right, from the majority of us being
right handed. The rest is history where the only place left for a hot
tap is on the left.

On 23/12/2023 14:57, Fredxx wrote:
> On 23/12/2023 14:17, Max Demian wrote:
>> On 22/12/2023 22:29, Colin Bignell wrote:
>>> On 22/12/2023 21:07, NY wrote:
>>
>>>> *Is* there a standard for the placement of hot and cold taps?
>>>
>>> In the USA there is and it is recommended in the UK. The cold should
>>> be on the right, as most people are right handed. That way, a blind
>>> or partially sighted person is more likely to turn on the cold first,
>>> reducing the risk of scalding. It is quite theoretical and far from
>>> universal. My house has the hot on the right, but, given the time it
>>> takes for the hot water to come through, scalding is not really a risk.
> >
>> Do you have any documentary evidence for that explanation? (The matter
>> has been discussed here before.)
>
> A fuller explanation is here:
>   https://www.plumbworld.co.uk/blog/hot-bathroom-tap-on-the-left-or-right

That is one of those that I found saying much the same things. However,
these days, if there is any genuine risk of scalding the answer would be
to fit a temperature regulating valve to the hot water side.

>
> I prefer the explanation from when homes only had cold water it was
> logical to have the tap on the right, from the majority of us being
> right handed. The rest is history where the only place left for a hot
> tap is on the left.
>
>

--
Colin Bignell

On 23/12/2023 14:57, Fredxx wrote:
> On 23/12/2023 14:17, Max Demian wrote:
>> On 22/12/2023 22:29, Colin Bignell wrote:
>>> On 22/12/2023 21:07, NY wrote:
>>
>>>> *Is* there a standard for the placement of hot and cold taps?
>>>
>>> In the USA there is and it is recommended in the UK. The cold should
>>> be on the right, as most people are right handed. That way, a blind
>>> or partially sighted person is more likely to turn on the cold first,
>>> reducing the risk of scalding. It is quite theoretical and far from
>>> universal. My house has the hot on the right, but, given the time it
>>> takes for the hot water to come through, scalding is not really a risk.
> >
>> Do you have any documentary evidence for that explanation? (The matter
>> has been discussed here before.)
>
> A fuller explanation is here:
>   https://www.plumbworld.co.uk/blog/hot-bathroom-tap-on-the-left-or-right
>
> I prefer the explanation from when homes only had cold water it was
> logical to have the tap on the right, from the majority of us being
> right handed. The rest is history where the only place left for a hot
> tap is on the left.

The plumber who replaced my kitchen tap hasn't read that as he reversed
them. I swapped the C and H indicators, not that you can see them as
they are on the side.

With only one tap, I would have thought you would put it in the middle
for symmetry.

--
Max Demian