On Thu, 1 Sep 2022 04:00:48 -0700 (PDT), Stephen Packer
<stephen.packer@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Wednesday, 31 August 2022 at 21:38:35 UTC+1, Champ wrote:
>> On Wed, 31 Aug 2022 09:11:49 -0700 (PDT), Stephen Packer
>> <stephen...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > France repeat offender but France, Germany, Switzerland were all fining
>> > countries on the Alpinestars trip.
>> I didn't get fined in France on the Alpinestars trip - when did you
>> get pulled?

>Pulled[1] on the way from Emma's in Saintes to the hotel at which we met.
>[1] Speeding, fixed penalty on the spot ticket.

Well done. I can see you made an early commitment to the theme of the
trip
--
Champ
neal at champ dot org dot uk

I don't know, but I been told
You never slow down, you never grow old

On Wed, 31 Aug 2022 22:15:23 -0000 (UTC), wessie
<willnotwork@tesco.net> wrote:

>Champ <neal@champ.org.uk> wrote in news:pohvgh5gi8vp0f84ueuksnm5l2r87le8lp@
>4ax.com:

>>>maybe jurisdictions not countries, otherwise the IoM does not count
>>
>> Unsuprisingly, I take a different view on this.
>>
>> From wikipedia:
>> "The Isle of Man ... is an island nation and self-governing British
>> Crown Dependency ..."
>>
>> The use of the words "nation" and "self-governing" make it a different
>> "country" (which AFAICT doesn't have a legal definition) for me

>I go by the notion of nation state.

I don't believe there's a legal definition of nation state, either.
Again, from wiki: "A nation state is a political unit where the state
and nation are congruent". From that, the IoM is definitely distinct
from the UK

>I believe the IoM issues a British Passport and is therefore not close to
>being a country in my view.

Up to a point, Lord Copper
From
https://www.gov.im/categories/travel-traffic-and-motoring/passports/
"The power to issue Isle of Man British passports is derived from the
Royal Prerogative."
My passport says:

"British Islands
Isle of Man"

on the front
--
Champ
neal at champ dot org dot uk

I don't know, but I been told
You never slow down, you never grow old

Mark Roberts wrote:

> > b) 4 I think: (UK, France, Germany, Switzerland).
> > France repeat offender but France, Germany, Switzerland were all
> > fining countries on the Alpinestars trip.
>
> You should have a Hungary in there?

And Turkey

--
Simon

On Thursday, 1 September 2022 at 16:04:48 UTC+1, sweller wrote:
> Mark Roberts wrote:
>
> > > b) 4 I think: (UK, France, Germany, Switzerland).
> > > France repeat offender but France, Germany, Switzerland were all
> > > fining countries on the Alpinestars trip.
> >
> > You should have a Hungary in there?
> And Turkey

No, Turkey was just a stop and incomprehensible lecture on one occasion
and a stop, can't be fucked, go on on the other. No fine.

Hungary was the fine through the post. Sneaky fuckers.

On 8/31/2022 7:20 AM, Turby wrote:
> On 8/31/2022 6:00 AM, Champ wrote:
>> On Mon, 29 Aug 2022 10:48:38 -0700 (PDT), Stephen Packer
>> <stephen.packer@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> When I've been stopped (France, Germany, Slovenia, Turkey, Norway,
>>> Bosnia)
>>
>> OK, new game
>>
>> In how many countries have you been
>> a) stopped by the police, and
>> b) fined
>
> 1. I don't remember, but at least:
> a,b) US, Germany, France, maybe UK.
>
>
b,d) Forgot about Mexico. Their laws are so ambiguous it's not always
clear if it's a real violation or they're just taking the opportunity to
fleece a furriner. It's why I always keep a $20 bill in a separate
pocket as a payoff.

--
The erstwhile Thomas
FJR1300, R1200GS & ST1100 (in memoriam)

On 01/09/2022 19:03, Turby wrote:
> On 8/31/2022 7:20 AM, Turby wrote:
>> On 8/31/2022 6:00 AM, Champ wrote:
>>> On Mon, 29 Aug 2022 10:48:38 -0700 (PDT), Stephen Packer
>>> <stephen.packer@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> When I've been stopped (France, Germany, Slovenia, Turkey, Norway,
>>>> Bosnia)
>>>
>>> OK, new game
>>>
>>> In how many countries have you been
>>> a) stopped by the police, and
>>> b) fined
>>
>> 1. I don't remember, but at least:
>> a,b) US, Germany, France, maybe UK.
>>
>>
> b,d) Forgot about Mexico. Their laws are so ambiguous it's not always
> clear if it's a real violation or they're just taking the opportunity to
> fleece a furriner. It's why I always keep a $20 bill in a separate
> pocket as a payoff.
>

From experience, it is because you are American :-)

--
Bruce Porter
"The internet is a huge and diverse community but mainly friendly"
http://ytc1.blogspot.co.uk/
There *is* an alternative! http://www.openoffice.org/

YTC#1 <bdp@ytc1-spambin.co.uk> wrote:
>
> [1] Bribes paid. Even the Kz stop which was an obvious bribe stop we got
> away with
> [2] After much arm waving, and disagrement the fine was ripped up and I
> was sent on my way.

Same old, same old.

--
FJR1300A, GL1000, KLR650A6F, EX250J9A, DR200SE, Vespa Ciao

On 9/1/2022 11:57 AM, YTC#1 wrote:
>
> On 01/09/2022 19:03, Turby wrote:
>> On 8/31/2022 7:20 AM, Turby wrote:
>>> On 8/31/2022 6:00 AM, Champ wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 29 Aug 2022 10:48:38 -0700 (PDT), Stephen Packer
>>>> <stephen.packer@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> When I've been stopped (France, Germany, Slovenia, Turkey, Norway,
>>>>> Bosnia)
>>>>
>>>> OK, new game
>>>>
>>>> In how many countries have you been
>>>> a) stopped by the police, and
>>>> b) fined
>>>
>>> 1. I don't remember, but at least:
>>> a,b) US, Germany, France, maybe UK.
>>>
>>>
>> b,d) Forgot about Mexico. Their laws are so ambiguous it's not always
>> clear if it's a real violation or they're just taking the opportunity
>> to fleece a furriner. It's why I always keep a $20 bill in a separate
>> pocket as a payoff.
>>
>
> From experience, it is because you are American :-)
>
There's a reason so many come across the border to work.
The peso used to be 4 to 1, now it's 20 to 1.

--
The erstwhile Thomas
FJR1300, R1200GS & ST1100 (in memoriam)

On 01/09/2022 23:04, Turby wrote:
> On 9/1/2022 11:57 AM, YTC#1 wrote:
>>
>> On 01/09/2022 19:03, Turby wrote:
>>> On 8/31/2022 7:20 AM, Turby wrote:
>>>> On 8/31/2022 6:00 AM, Champ wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, 29 Aug 2022 10:48:38 -0700 (PDT), Stephen Packer
>>>>> <stephen.packer@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> When I've been stopped (France, Germany, Slovenia, Turkey, Norway,
>>>>>> Bosnia)
>>>>>
>>>>> OK, new game
>>>>>
>>>>> In how many countries have you been
>>>>> a) stopped by the police, and
>>>>> b) fined
>>>>
>>>> 1. I don't remember, but at least:
>>>> a,b) US, Germany, France, maybe UK.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> b,d) Forgot about Mexico. Their laws are so ambiguous it's not always
>>> clear if it's a real violation or they're just taking the opportunity
>>> to fleece a furriner. It's why I always keep a $20 bill in a separate
>>> pocket as a payoff.
>>>
>>
>>  From experience, it is because you are American :-)
>>
> There's a reason so many come across the border to work.
> The peso used to be 4 to 1, now it's 20 to 1.

That, and the fact you have the same problem the UK has.
You want it cheap, but you don't want to be paid cheap, so you have to
find labour who do.

We fucked up and they all went home.

>

--
Bruce Porter
"The internet is a huge and diverse community but mainly friendly"
http://ytc1.blogspot.co.uk/
There *is* an alternative! http://www.openoffice.org/

Stephen Packer wrote:

> > > You should have a Hungary in there?
> > And Turkey
>
> No, Turkey was just a stop and incomprehensible lecture on one
> occasion and a stop, can't be fucked, go on on the other. No fine.

I misremebered.

> Hungary was the fine through the post. Sneaky fuckers.

...but Mark got away with it.

--
Simon

On Wednesday, August 31, 2022 at 2:00:34 PM UTC+1, Champ wrote:
> On Mon, 29 Aug 2022 10:48:38 -0700 (PDT), Stephen Packer
> <stephen...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >When I've been stopped (France, Germany, Slovenia, Turkey, Norway, Bosnia)
> OK, new game
>
> In how many countries have you been
> a) stopped by the police, and
> b) fined
>
> My answers are:
>
> a) 7 (UK, Isle of Man, France, Germany, Switzerland, Australia, USA)
> b) 5 (UK, Isle of Man, Germany, Switzerland, Australia)

I'm obviously not trying hard enough, or have been lucky.

Once in the UK and once in France.

In the UK, aged 17 on my XL125S (actually a 185 - woo rebel). Three o'clock in the morning patiently waiting at a set of temporary traffic lights, they turn to green, I proceed, local plod in his Ford Escort pulls me over and drops a fine on me for running a red light. Obviously totally wrong; but without witnesses bar two bored cops in a panda, I was hung out like pheasant. Fined and 3 points.

The other time on a French run (can't remember which one), plod hid in bushes on a dual carriageway bridge with a hairdryer, pulled over about a mile up the road. Managed to plead innocence and stupidity and after a long telling off they told me to bob on and not do it again.

There are so many instances where I should have been, but in total these are the only two times I've ever been tugged by the law, and I've been around for 49years now. Very lucky boy. I've often wondered over the years why I don't get pulled over - it's a mystery to me !

On 02/09/2022 00:04, Turby wrote:
>On 9/1/2022 11:57 AM, YTC#1 wrote:
>>
>> On 01/09/2022 19:03, Turby wrote:
>>> On 8/31/2022 7:20 AM, Turby wrote:
>>>> On 8/31/2022 6:00 AM, Champ wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, 29 Aug 2022 10:48:38 -0700 (PDT), Stephen Packer
>>>>> <stephen.packer@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> When I've been stopped (France, Germany, Slovenia, Turkey, Norway,
>>>>>> Bosnia)
>>>>>
>>>>> OK, new game
>>>>>
>>>>> In how many countries have you been
>>>>> a) stopped by the police, and
>>>>> b) fined
>>>>
>>>> 1. I don't remember, but at least:
>>>> a,b) US, Germany, France, maybe UK.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> b,d) Forgot about Mexico. Their laws are so ambiguous it's not always
>>> clear if it's a real violation or they're just taking the opportunity
>>> to fleece a furriner. It's why I always keep a $20 bill in a separate
>>> pocket as a payoff.
>>>
>>
>> From experience, it is because you are American :-)
>>
>There's a reason so many come across the border to work.
>The peso used to be 4 to 1, now it's 20 to 1.

My daughter crosses the border to work in Belgium and the Euro is 1 to 1. So
what?

--
Geoff
NTV 650

On 9/2/2022 3:37 AM, geoffC wrote:
> On 02/09/2022 00:04, Turby wrote:
>> On 9/1/2022 11:57 AM, YTC#1 wrote:
>>>
>>> On 01/09/2022 19:03, Turby wrote:
>>>> On 8/31/2022 7:20 AM, Turby wrote:
>>>>> On 8/31/2022 6:00 AM, Champ wrote:
>>>>>> On Mon, 29 Aug 2022 10:48:38 -0700 (PDT), Stephen Packer
>>>>>> <stephen.packer@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> When I've been stopped (France, Germany, Slovenia, Turkey,
>>>>>>> Norway, Bosnia)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> OK, new game
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In how many countries have you been
>>>>>> a) stopped by the police, and
>>>>>> b) fined
>>>>>
>>>>> 1. I don't remember, but at least:
>>>>> a,b) US, Germany, France, maybe UK.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> b,d) Forgot about Mexico. Their laws are so ambiguous it's not
>>>> always clear if it's a real violation or they're just taking the
>>>> opportunity to fleece a furriner. It's why I always keep a $20 bill
>>>> in a separate pocket as a payoff.
>>>>
>>>
>>>  From experience, it is because you are American :-)
>>>
>> There's a reason so many come across the border to work.
>> The peso used to be 4 to 1, now it's 20 to 1.
>
> My daughter crosses the border to work in Belgium and the Euro is 1 to
> 1. So what?
>

Really? You need an explanation? The economy in all of Central America
sucks (with the exception of Costa Rica.) Almost any job in the US pays
enough to support the worker and still have enough to send some back to
their family across the border. A significant percentage of families in
Mexico and Central America depend on that money. There are over 63
million Hispanic immigrants in the US today. Agriculture and many other
service industries depend on them.

--
The erstwhile Thomas
FJR1300, R1200GS & ST1100 (in memoriam)

On 02/09/2022 12:13, Turby wrote:
> On 9/2/2022 3:37 AM, geoffC wrote:
>> On 02/09/2022 00:04, Turby wrote:
>>> On 9/1/2022 11:57 AM, YTC#1 wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On 01/09/2022 19:03, Turby wrote:
>>>>> On 8/31/2022 7:20 AM, Turby wrote:
>>>>>> On 8/31/2022 6:00 AM, Champ wrote:
>>>>>>> On Mon, 29 Aug 2022 10:48:38 -0700 (PDT), Stephen Packer
>>>>>>> <stephen.packer@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> When I've been stopped (France, Germany, Slovenia, Turkey,
>>>>>>>> Norway, Bosnia)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> OK, new game
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In how many countries have you been
>>>>>>> a) stopped by the police, and
>>>>>>> b) fined
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1. I don't remember, but at least:
>>>>>> a,b) US, Germany, France, maybe UK.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> b,d) Forgot about Mexico. Their laws are so ambiguous it's not
>>>>> always clear if it's a real violation or they're just taking the
>>>>> opportunity to fleece a furriner. It's why I always keep a $20 bill
>>>>> in a separate pocket as a payoff.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>  From experience, it is because you are American :-)
>>>>
>>> There's a reason so many come across the border to work.
>>> The peso used to be 4 to 1, now it's 20 to 1.
>>
>> My daughter crosses the border to work in Belgium and the Euro is 1 to
>> 1. So what?
>>
>
> Really? You need an explanation?

Well hooked sir!

--
Bruce Porter
"The internet is a huge and diverse community but mainly friendly"
http://ytc1.blogspot.co.uk/
There *is* an alternative! http://www.openoffice.org/

On Wednesday, August 31, 2022 at 9:00:34 AM UTC-4, Champ wrote:

> OK, new game
>
> In how many countries have you been
> a) stopped by the police, and
> b) fined

a) 7 (UK, France, Italy, Finland, Qatar, Kuwait, USA)
b) 2 (UK, USA)

On Wednesday, August 31, 2022 at 6:15:25 PM UTC-4, wessie wrote:

> I believe the IoM issues a British Passport and is therefore not close to
> being a country in my view.

Is Wales a country?

Ben Blaney <benblaney@gmail.com> wrote in
news:e00f9b75-a1c5-4d7d-ba44-2988a1da5c64n@googlegroups.com:

> On Wednesday, August 31, 2022 at 6:15:25 PM UTC-4, wessie wrote:
>
>> I believe the IoM issues a British Passport and is therefore not
>> close to being a country in my view.
>
> Is Wales a country?
>

No. I subscribe to the idea of Wales as a region within the UK.

As can be seen in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wales there seems to be a
schism within the UK Government. The ONS agrees with me but the Office of
the PM agrees with Champ.

So, until Tuesday, we have Champ & Boris sitting in a tree...

On 2 Sep 2022 09:34:50 GMT, "sweller" <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk>
wrote:

>..but Mark got away with it.

:)
--
Mark Roberts

On 02/09/2022 15:48, Ben Blaney wrote:
> On Wednesday, August 31, 2022 at 6:15:25 PM UTC-4, wessie wrote:
>
>> I believe the IoM issues a British Passport and is therefore not close to
>> being a country in my view.
>
> Is Wales a country?

No.

--
Bruce Porter
"The internet is a huge and diverse community but mainly friendly"
http://ytc1.blogspot.co.uk/
There *is* an alternative! http://www.openoffice.org/

geoffC wrote:

> Apparently technology has produced 3 major boosts for porn over the
> ages. No1 was when new materials eg canvas, paper and paints made
> art portable instead of being restricted to walls and ceilings etc.
> No2 was photography. No3 the Internet.

I'm sure I read (rather than just made up) that porn was instrumental
in determining the winner in the VHS vs Betamax battle.

Not sure how though.

--
Simon

"sweller" <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in news:jnk9qrFin18U1
@mid.individual.net:

> geoffC wrote:
>
>> Apparently technology has produced 3 major boosts for porn over the
>> ages. No1 was when new materials eg canvas, paper and paints made
>> art portable instead of being restricted to walls and ceilings etc.
>> No2 was photography. No3 the Internet.
>
> I'm sure I read (rather than just made up) that porn was instrumental
> in determining the winner in the VHS vs Betamax battle.
>
> Not sure how though.
>

I worked for a video rental company briefly in the mid 80s[1]. The owner
had a wide selection of porn films in the boot of his car on VHS. At the
time, the main source of the content of these films was the USA.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VHS#Competition_with_Betamax details how JVC
won the N.American market and therefore the world. Having an open standard
and doing a deal with Panasonic who had factories in the US & Europe were
the key elements.

I don't think porn won the war for VHS but it contributed to the economic
success.

[1] after being made redundant, before starting a 15 year stint at Xerox

On 02/09/2022 16:51, wessie wrote:
> Ben Blaney <benblaney@gmail.com> wrote in
> news:e00f9b75-a1c5-4d7d-ba44-2988a1da5c64n@googlegroups.com:
>
>> On Wednesday, August 31, 2022 at 6:15:25 PM UTC-4, wessie wrote:
>>
>>> I believe the IoM issues a British Passport and is therefore not
>>> close to being a country in my view.
>>
>> Is Wales a country?
>>
>
> No. I subscribe to the idea of Wales as a region within the UK.
>
> As can be seen in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wales there seems to be a
> schism within the UK Government. The ONS agrees with me but the Office of
> the PM agrees with Champ.
>
> So, until Tuesday, we have Champ & Boris sitting in a tree...
ha!

Chris

--
The Deuchars BBB#40 COFF#14
Yamaha XV750SE & Suzuki GS550t
http://www.Deuchars.org.uk

On 03/09/2022 09:45, YTC#1 wrote:
>
>
> On 02/09/2022 15:48, Ben Blaney wrote:
>> On Wednesday, August 31, 2022 at 6:15:25 PM UTC-4, wessie wrote:
>>
>>> I believe the IoM issues a British Passport and is therefore not
>>> close to
>>> being a country in my view.
>>
>> Is Wales a country?
>
> No.

Yes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Countries_of_the_United_Kingdom

On 07/09/2022 23:30, Mike Fleming wrote:
> On 03/09/2022 09:45, YTC#1 wrote:
>>
>>
>> On 02/09/2022 15:48, Ben Blaney wrote:
>>> On Wednesday, August 31, 2022 at 6:15:25 PM UTC-4, wessie wrote:
>>>
>>>> I believe the IoM issues a British Passport and is therefore not
>>>> close to
>>>> being a country in my view.
>>>
>>> Is Wales a country?
>>
>> No.
>
> Yes.
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Countries_of_the_United_Kingdom

But most certainly not indepenent
https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/independent-country

:-)

--
Bruce Porter
"The internet is a huge and diverse community but mainly friendly"
http://ytc1.blogspot.co.uk/
There *is* an alternative! http://www.openoffice.org/

El Tue, 30 Aug 2022 15:59:44 +0800, Boots escribió:

> On 30/08/2022 03:31 Turby penned these words:
>> AFAIK, the UK is the only country that requires a MOT
>
> Both Germany, Spain and France have similar systems albeit I think they
> are every 2 years. Wish we had something here the absolute pieces of
> shite you sometimes see on the roads.

Here (Spain), first test after 4 years. Then every 2 years until car is
10 years old. Then every year.

I seem to remember bike requirements were different, but it's been so
long...

--
Paul.

https://paulc.es/elpatio