This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique:
Coming soon
tap on tap off
whether you travel a little or a lot
you'll always get the best price
Hi there,

From 26th May it will be even easier to travel with First Leicester
with Tap on Tap off. There's no need to work out which bus ticket you
need as we'll work out the cheapest on-bus fare for you based on the
journeys you make during the day. You'll never pay more than £4.40 for
a day's travel, or £18 for a week.

All you need to do is tap the same card or contactless device on the
dedicated reader as you board and exit the bus and your payment will
be calculated based on the number of journeys you make.

How it works?
" When you tap on and tap off, we'll automatically calculate the
single fare for your journey.
" If you only make one trip, you'll pay the single fare - if you
make several trips in one day the price you'll pay will be capped at
the day ticket price.
" If you travel several days in a week, the price you'll pay
will be capped at the weekly ticket price.
Payment is taken at the end of the day and you don't receive a paper
receipt while on the bus.

In message <s44qagt5qovq64d4btkv30qn2jao7l74f4@4ax.com>, at 16:02:27 on
Tue, 25 May 2021, Peter Johnson <peter@parksidewood.nospam> remarked:
>This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique:
>
>Coming soon
>tap on tap off
>whether you travel a little or a lot
>you'll always get the best price
>
>Hi there,
>
>From 26th May it will be even easier to travel with First Leicester
>with Tap on Tap off. There's no need to work out which bus ticket you
>need as we'll work out the cheapest on-bus fare for you based on the
>journeys you make during the day. You'll never pay more than £4.40 for
>a day's travel, or £18 for a week.
>
>All you need to do is tap the same card

I presume they mean "Credit/Debit card" not ITSO or Tesco Loyalty card.

[There was a time when National Rail TVMs wanted you to produce a card
when collecting tickets, and anything with your name on (I presume that
was the criterion) worked. Including Tesco Loyalty cards. It didn't have
to be a credit card, let alone the one used to make the booking. How do
I know, this: because I tried!]

>or contactless device on the
>dedicated reader as you board and exit the bus and your payment will
>be calculated based on the number of journeys you make.
>
>How it works?
>" When you tap on and tap off, we'll automatically calculate the
>single fare for your journey.
>" If you only make one trip, you'll pay the single fare - if you
>make several trips in one day the price you'll pay will be capped at
>the day ticket price.
>" If you travel several days in a week, the price you'll pay
>will be capped at the weekly ticket price.
>
>Payment is taken at the end of the day and you don't receive a paper
>receipt while on the bus.

--
Roland Perry

On 25/05/2021 16:02, Peter Johnson wrote:
> This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique:
>
> Coming soon
> tap on tap off
> whether you travel a little or a lot
> you'll always get the best price
>
> Hi there,
>
> From 26th May it will be even easier to travel with First Leicester
> with Tap on Tap off. There's no need to work out which bus ticket you
> need as we'll work out the cheapest on-bus fare for you based on the
> journeys you make during the day. You'll never pay more than £4.40 for
> a day's travel, or £18 for a week.
>
> All you need to do is tap the same card or contactless device on the
> dedicated reader as you board and exit the bus and your payment will
> be calculated based on the number of journeys you make.
>
> How it works?
> " When you tap on and tap off, we'll automatically calculate the
> single fare for your journey.
> " If you only make one trip, you'll pay the single fare - if you
> make several trips in one day the price you'll pay will be capped at
> the day ticket price.
> " If you travel several days in a week, the price you'll pay
> will be capped at the weekly ticket price.
>
> Payment is taken at the end of the day and you don't receive a paper
> receipt while on the bus.
>

Bluestar in Southampton are doing the same.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

On 25/05/2021 17:32, Graeme Wall wrote:
> On 25/05/2021 16:02, Peter Johnson wrote:
>> This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique:
>> Coming soon
>> tap on tap off
>> whether you travel a little or a lot
>> you'll always get the best price
>>
>> Hi there,
>>
>>  From 26th May it will be even easier to travel with First Leicester
>> with Tap on Tap off. There's no need to work out which bus ticket you
>> need as we'll work out the cheapest on-bus fare for you based on the
>> journeys you make during the day. You'll never pay more than £4.40 for
>> a day's travel, or £18 for a week.
>>
>> All you need to do is tap the same card or contactless device on the
>> dedicated reader as you board and exit the bus and your payment will
>> be calculated based on the number of journeys you make.
>>
>> How it works?
>> "    When you tap on and tap off, we'll automatically calculate the
>> single fare for your journey.
>> "    If you only make one trip, you'll pay the single fare - if you
>> make several trips in one day the price you'll pay will be capped at
>> the day ticket price.
>> "    If you travel several days in a week, the price you'll pay
>> will be capped at the weekly ticket price.
>>
>> Payment is taken at the end of the day and you don't receive a paper
>> receipt while on the bus.
>>
>
> Bluestar in Southampton are doing the same.
>
>
>
The Dutch also do that, AIUI.

On 2021-05-25 15:02:27 +0000, Peter Johnson said:

> This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique:
>
> Coming soon
> tap on tap off
> whether you travel a little or a lot
> you'll always get the best price

Googling "tap on tap off bus" seems to get hits for a number of bus
operators around the UK, with the top few results being Brighton &
Hove, Porstmouth & Fareham, Oxford, and the list goes on. Looks like
another nail in the coffin for ITSO.

Robin

On 2021-05-25 15:55:08 +0000, Roland Perry said:

> In message <s44qagt5qovq64d4btkv30qn2jao7l74f4@4ax.com>, at 16:02:27 on
> Tue, 25 May 2021, Peter Johnson <peter@parksidewood.nospam> remarked:
>> This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique:
>>
>> Coming soon
>> tap on tap off
>> whether you travel a little or a lot
>> you'll always get the best price
>>
>> Hi there,
>>
>> From 26th May it will be even easier to travel with First Leicester
>> with Tap on Tap off. There's no need to work out which bus ticket you
>> need as we'll work out the cheapest on-bus fare for you based on the
>> journeys you make during the day. You'll never pay more than £4.40 for
>> a day's travel, or £18 for a week.
>>
>> All you need to do is tap the same card
>
> I presume they mean "Credit/Debit card" not ITSO or Tesco Loyalty card.

Contactless Visa or Mastercard, Apple pay, Google pay.

Another reason not to bother with an ITSO card.

Robin

In message <s8jar8$e3o$2@dont-email.me>, at 19:06:48 on Tue, 25 May
2021, bob <email@domain.com> remarked:
>On 2021-05-25 15:55:08 +0000, Roland Perry said:
>
>> In message <s44qagt5qovq64d4btkv30qn2jao7l74f4@4ax.com>, at 16:02:27
>>on Tue, 25 May 2021, Peter Johnson <peter@parksidewood.nospam>
>>remarked:

>>> This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique: Coming
>>>soon tap on tap off whether you travel a little or a lot you'll
>>>always get the best price Hi there, From 26th May it will be even
>>>easier to travel with First Leicester with Tap on Tap off. There's
>>>no need to work out which bus ticket you need as we'll work out the
>>>cheapest on-bus fare for you based on the journeys you make during
>>>the day. You'll never pay more than £4.40 for a day's travel, or £18
>>>for a week. All you need to do is tap the same card

>> I presume they mean "Credit/Debit card" not ITSO or Tesco Loyalty
>>card.
>
>Contactless Visa or Mastercard, Apple pay, Google pay.
>
>Another reason not to bother with an ITSO card.

Or a bus company swimming against the flow, given that all concessionary
bus passes are ITSO.
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <s8jar8$e3o$2@dont-email.me>, at 19:06:48 on Tue, 25 May
> 2021, bob <email@domain.com> remarked:
>> On 2021-05-25 15:55:08 +0000, Roland Perry said:
>>
>>> In message <s44qagt5qovq64d4btkv30qn2jao7l74f4@4ax.com>, at 16:02:27
>>> on Tue, 25 May 2021, Peter Johnson <peter@parksidewood.nospam>
>>> remarked:
>
>>>> This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique: Coming
>>>> soon tap on tap off whether you travel a little or a lot you'll
>>>> always get the best price Hi there, From 26th May it will be even
>>>> easier to travel with First Leicester with Tap on Tap off. There's
>>>> no need to work out which bus ticket you need as we'll work out the
>>>> cheapest on-bus fare for you based on the journeys you make during
>>>> the day. You'll never pay more than £4.40 for a day's travel, or £18
>>>> for a week. All you need to do is tap the same card
>
>>> I presume they mean "Credit/Debit card" not ITSO or Tesco Loyalty
>>> card.
>>
>> Contactless Visa or Mastercard, Apple pay, Google pay.
>>
>> Another reason not to bother with an ITSO card.
>
> Or a bus company swimming against the flow, given that all concessionary
> bus passes are ITSO.

Sortof. My Scottish National Entitlment Card (NEC) is “ITSO enabled” but
I’ve never seen anything advertising it for storing tickets on it. I fear
it may be another example of the kind of limited card you have such vast
experience of. The fact that Lothian transport passes can’t be stored on
it seems odd since the point of the card is to provide free bus travel
anyway. I can’t think of any Lothian transport services which are not
buses, except the trams, which are free for Edinburgh residents but not for
other NEC holders.

<https://smarttravel.scot/national-entitlement-card>

Sam

--
The entity formerly known as Sam.Wilson@ed.ac.uk
Spit the dummy to reply

Peter Johnson <peter@parksidewood.nospam> wrote:
> This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique:
>
> Coming soon
> tap on tap off
> whether you travel a little or a lot
> you'll always get the best price
>
> Hi there,
>
> From 26th May it will be even easier to travel with First Leicester
> with Tap on Tap off. There's no need to work out which bus ticket you
> need as we'll work out the cheapest on-bus fare for you based on the
> journeys you make during the day. You'll never pay more than £4.40 for
> a day's travel, or £18 for a week.
>
> All you need to do is tap the same card or contactless device on the
> dedicated reader as you board and exit the bus and your payment will
> be calculated based on the number of journeys you make.
>
> How it works?
> " When you tap on and tap off, we'll automatically calculate the
> single fare for your journey.
> " If you only make one trip, you'll pay the single fare - if you
> make several trips in one day the price you'll pay will be capped at
> the day ticket price.
> " If you travel several days in a week, the price you'll pay
> will be capped at the weekly ticket price.
>
> Payment is taken at the end of the day and you don't receive a paper
> receipt while on the bus.

Ah, nothing to do with “taps aff” then...

Sam

--
The entity formerly known as Sam.Wilson@ed.ac.uk
Spit the dummy to reply

On Tue, 25 May 2021 19:29:27 -0000 (UTC), Sam Wilson
<ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> wrote:

>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <s8jar8$e3o$2@dont-email.me>, at 19:06:48 on Tue, 25 May
>> 2021, bob <email@domain.com> remarked:
>>> On 2021-05-25 15:55:08 +0000, Roland Perry said:
>>>
>>>> In message <s44qagt5qovq64d4btkv30qn2jao7l74f4@4ax.com>, at 16:02:27
>>>> on Tue, 25 May 2021, Peter Johnson <peter@parksidewood.nospam>
>>>> remarked:
>>
>>>>> This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique: Coming
>>>>> soon tap on tap off whether you travel a little or a lot you'll
>>>>> always get the best price Hi there, From 26th May it will be even
>>>>> easier to travel with First Leicester with Tap on Tap off. There's
>>>>> no need to work out which bus ticket you need as we'll work out the
>>>>> cheapest on-bus fare for you based on the journeys you make during
>>>>> the day. You'll never pay more than £4.40 for a day's travel, or £18
>>>>> for a week. All you need to do is tap the same card
>>
>>>> I presume they mean "Credit/Debit card" not ITSO or Tesco Loyalty
>>>> card.
>>>
>>> Contactless Visa or Mastercard, Apple pay, Google pay.
>>>
>>> Another reason not to bother with an ITSO card.
>>
>> Or a bus company swimming against the flow, given that all concessionary
>> bus passes are ITSO.
>
>Sortof. My Scottish National Entitlment Card (NEC) is “ITSO enabled” but
>I’ve never seen anything advertising it for storing tickets on it. I fear
>it may be another example of the kind of limited card you have such vast
>experience of. The fact that Lothian transport passes can’t be stored on
>it seems odd since the point of the card is to provide free bus travel
>anyway. I can’t think of any Lothian transport services which are not
>buses, except the trams, which are free for Edinburgh residents but not for
>other NEC holders.
>
><https://smarttravel.scot/national-entitlement-card>
>
Does ITSO do everything that a RidaCard does ?

On 2021-05-25 17:56:42 +0000, Roland Perry said:

> In message <s8jar8$e3o$2@dont-email.me>, at 19:06:48 on Tue, 25 May
> 2021, bob <email@domain.com> remarked:
>> On 2021-05-25 15:55:08 +0000, Roland Perry said:
>>
>>> In message <s44qagt5qovq64d4btkv30qn2jao7l74f4@4ax.com>, at 16:02:27 on
>>> Tue, 25 May 2021, Peter Johnson <peter@parksidewood.nospam> remarked:
>
>>>> This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique: Coming
>>>> soon tap on tap off whether you travel a little or a lot you'll
>>>> always get the best price Hi there, From 26th May it will be even
>>>> easier to travel with First Leicester with Tap on Tap off. There's no
>>>> need to work out which bus ticket you need as we'll work out the
>>>> cheapest on-bus fare for you based on the journeys you make during the
>>>> day. You'll never pay more than £4.40 for a day's travel, or £18 for a
>>>> week. All you need to do is tap the same card
>
>>> I presume they mean "Credit/Debit card" not ITSO or Tesco Loyalty card.
>>
>> Contactless Visa or Mastercard, Apple pay, Google pay.
>>
>> Another reason not to bother with an ITSO card.
>
> Or a bus company swimming against the flow, given that all
> concessionary bus passes are ITSO.

Looking at a few bus company webistes, it looks like all the major bus
companies (first, Arriva, Stagecoach and GoAhead) all ccept contactless
payment on their buses. First and GoAhead are both rolling out a
system like the one described above to parts fo their network. For Go
Ahead, it looks like it covers Gatwick and environs, Brighton & Hove,
Porstsmouth and Solent, Oxford, and Newcastle area (possibly others),
while for first it's currently available in Aberdeen, Doncaster,
Southampton and Bristol. Of course London is also covered via the
contactless on Oyster as well. The bus companies are certainly
swimming, but when it comes to ITSO, I'm not sure I'd say that they are
against the flow exactly.

Robin

In message <s8jj6n$m8r$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:29:27 on Tue, 25 May
2021, Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> remarked:
>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <s8jar8$e3o$2@dont-email.me>, at 19:06:48 on Tue, 25 May
>> 2021, bob <email@domain.com> remarked:
>>> On 2021-05-25 15:55:08 +0000, Roland Perry said:
>>>
>>>> In message <s44qagt5qovq64d4btkv30qn2jao7l74f4@4ax.com>, at 16:02:27
>>>> on Tue, 25 May 2021, Peter Johnson <peter@parksidewood.nospam>
>>>> remarked:
>>
>>>>> This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique: Coming
>>>>> soon tap on tap off whether you travel a little or a lot you'll
>>>>> always get the best price Hi there, From 26th May it will be even
>>>>> easier to travel with First Leicester with Tap on Tap off. There's
>>>>> no need to work out which bus ticket you need as we'll work out the
>>>>> cheapest on-bus fare for you based on the journeys you make during
>>>>> the day. You'll never pay more than £4.40 for a day's travel, or £18
>>>>> for a week. All you need to do is tap the same card
>>
>>>> I presume they mean "Credit/Debit card" not ITSO or Tesco Loyalty
>>>> card.
>>>
>>> Contactless Visa or Mastercard, Apple pay, Google pay.
>>>
>>> Another reason not to bother with an ITSO card.
>>
>> Or a bus company swimming against the flow, given that all concessionary
>> bus passes are ITSO.
>
>Sortof. My Scottish National Entitlment Card (NEC) is “ITSO enabled” but
>I’ve never seen anything advertising it for storing tickets on it.

That's an implementation detail. There's nothing stopping an ITSO card
having multiple 'apps' on it, other than lack of enterprise by those
issuing the cards/tickets.

--
Roland Perry

In message <s8jjkf$p8d$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:36:47 on Tue, 25 May
2021, Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> remarked:
>Peter Johnson <peter@parksidewood.nospam> wrote:
>> This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique:
>>
>> Coming soon
>> tap on tap off
>> whether you travel a little or a lot
>> you'll always get the best price
>>
>> Hi there,
>>
>> From 26th May it will be even easier to travel with First Leicester
>> with Tap on Tap off. There's no need to work out which bus ticket you
>> need as we'll work out the cheapest on-bus fare for you based on the
>> journeys you make during the day. You'll never pay more than £4.40 for
>> a day's travel, or £18 for a week.
>>
>> All you need to do is tap the same card or contactless device on the
>> dedicated reader as you board and exit the bus and your payment will
>> be calculated based on the number of journeys you make.
>>
>> How it works?
>> " When you tap on and tap off, we'll automatically calculate the
>> single fare for your journey.
>> " If you only make one trip, you'll pay the single fare - if you
>> make several trips in one day the price you'll pay will be capped at
>> the day ticket price.
>> " If you travel several days in a week, the price you'll pay
>> will be capped at the weekly ticket price.
>>
>> Payment is taken at the end of the day and you don't receive a paper
>> receipt while on the bus.
>
>Ah, nothing to do with “taps aff” then...

Talking of tapping-off, how many other bus PAYG schemes require the
passenger to tap both getting on, and off, the bus?
--
Roland Perry

In message <s8krmv$h72$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:00:47 on Wed, 26 May
2021, bob <email@domain.com> remarked:
>On 2021-05-25 17:56:42 +0000, Roland Perry said:
>
>> In message <s8jar8$e3o$2@dont-email.me>, at 19:06:48 on Tue, 25 May
>>2021, bob <email@domain.com> remarked:
>>> On 2021-05-25 15:55:08 +0000, Roland Perry said:
>>>
>>>> In message <s44qagt5qovq64d4btkv30qn2jao7l74f4@4ax.com>, at
>>>>16:02:27 on Tue, 25 May 2021, Peter Johnson
>>>><peter@parksidewood.nospam> remarked:
>>
>>>>> This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique: Coming
>>>>>soon tap on tap off whether you travel a little or a lot you'll
>>>>>always get the best price Hi there, From 26th May it will be
>>>>>even easier to travel with First Leicester with Tap on Tap off.
>>>>>There's no need to work out which bus ticket you need as we'll
>>>>>work out the cheapest on-bus fare for you based on the journeys
>>>>>you make during the day. You'll never pay more than £4.40 for a
>>>>>day's travel, or £18 for a week. All you need to do is tap the same card
>>
>>>> I presume they mean "Credit/Debit card" not ITSO or Tesco Loyalty
>>>>card.
>>> Contactless Visa or Mastercard, Apple pay, Google pay.
>>> Another reason not to bother with an ITSO card.
>> Or a bus company swimming against the flow, given that all
>>concessionary bus passes are ITSO.
>
>Looking at a few bus company webistes, it looks like all the major bus
>companies (first, Arriva, Stagecoach and GoAhead) all ccept contactless
>payment on their buses. First and GoAhead are both rolling out a
>system like the one described above to parts fo their network. For Go
>Ahead, it looks like it covers Gatwick and environs, Brighton & Hove,
>Porstsmouth and Solent, Oxford, and Newcastle area (possibly others),

The Brighton and Gatwick buses are also covered by GTR's KeyGo ITSO
card.

>while for first it's currently available in Aberdeen, Doncaster,
>Southampton and Bristol. Of course London is also covered via the
>contactless on Oyster as well. The bus companies are certainly
>swimming, but when it comes to ITSO, I'm not sure I'd say that they are
>against the flow exactly.

The problem with CCC, especially on buses, is that it disenfranchises
the young and non-credit-worthy.
--
Roland Perry

In message <linqag5nnhcp5ia62n57m0fh4qbm6pt14o@4ax.com>, at 21:38:00 on
Tue, 25 May 2021, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
remarked:

>>>>>> This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique: Coming
>>>>>> soon tap on tap off whether you travel a little or a lot you'll
>>>>>> always get the best price Hi there, From 26th May it will be even
>>>>>> easier to travel with First Leicester with Tap on Tap off. There's
>>>>>> no need to work out which bus ticket you need as we'll work out the
>>>>>> cheapest on-bus fare for you based on the journeys you make during
>>>>>> the day. You'll never pay more than £4.40 for a day's travel, or £18
>>>>>> for a week. All you need to do is tap the same card
>>>
>>>>> I presume they mean "Credit/Debit card" not ITSO or Tesco Loyalty
>>>>> card.
>>>>
>>>> Contactless Visa or Mastercard, Apple pay, Google pay.
>>>>
>>>> Another reason not to bother with an ITSO card.
>>>
>>> Or a bus company swimming against the flow, given that all concessionary
>>> bus passes are ITSO.
>>
>>Sortof. My Scottish National Entitlment Card (NEC) is “ITSO enabled” but
>>I’ve never seen anything advertising it for storing tickets on it. I fear
>>it may be another example of the kind of limited card you have such vast
>>experience of. The fact that Lothian transport passes can’t be stored on
>>it seems odd since the point of the card is to provide free bus travel
>>anyway. I can’t think of any Lothian transport services which are not
>>buses, except the trams, which are free for Edinburgh residents but not for
>>other NEC holders.
>>
>><https://smarttravel.scot/national-entitlement-card>
>>
>Does ITSO do everything that a RidaCard does ?

RidaCard information is hard to find, but it sounds like it's a
proprietary card, and doesn't use ITSO as its delivery platform.

In terms of "doing things", all these various regional smartcards have
their own basket of features, which is disjoint from the card technology
itself.
--
Roland Perry

On 2021-05-26 09:35:36 +0000, Roland Perry said:

> In message <s8krmv$h72$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:00:47 on Wed, 26 May
> 2021, bob <email@domain.com> remarked:
>> On 2021-05-25 17:56:42 +0000, Roland Perry said:
>>
>>> In message <s8jar8$e3o$2@dont-email.me>, at 19:06:48 on Tue, 25 May
>>> 2021, bob <email@domain.com> remarked:
>>>> On 2021-05-25 15:55:08 +0000, Roland Perry said:
>>>>
>>>>> In message <s44qagt5qovq64d4btkv30qn2jao7l74f4@4ax.com>, at 16:02:27 on
>>>>> Tue, 25 May 2021, Peter Johnson <peter@parksidewood.nospam> remarked:
>>>
>>>>>> This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique: Coming soon
>>>>>> tap on tap off whether you travel a little or a lot you'll always get
>>>>>> the best price Hi there, From 26th May it will be even easier to
>>>>>> travel with First Leicester with Tap on Tap off. There's no need to
>>>>>> work out which bus ticket you need as we'll work out the cheapest
>>>>>> on-bus fare for you based on the journeys you make during the day.
>>>>>> You'll never pay more than £4.40 for a day's travel, or £18 for a
>>>>>> week. All you need to do is tap the same card
>>>
>>>>> I presume they mean "Credit/Debit card" not ITSO or Tesco Loyalty card.
>>>> Contactless Visa or Mastercard, Apple pay, Google pay.
>>>> Another reason not to bother with an ITSO card.
>>> Or a bus company swimming against the flow, given that all
>>> concessionary bus passes are ITSO.
>>
>> Looking at a few bus company webistes, it looks like all the major bus
>> companies (first, Arriva, Stagecoach and GoAhead) all ccept contactless
>> payment on their buses. First and GoAhead are both rolling out a
>> system like the one described above to parts fo their network. For Go
>> Ahead, it looks like it covers Gatwick and environs, Brighton & Hove,
>> Porstsmouth and Solent, Oxford, and Newcastle area (possibly others),
>
> The Brighton and Gatwick buses are also covered by GTR's KeyGo ITSO card.

Great. Can I use that on buses operated by Arriva, first or
Stagecoach? Can I use that to get around London?

Robin

"Roland Perry" <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote in message
news:kixwJF5EMhrgFAFD@perry.uk...
> In message <s8jjkf$p8d$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:36:47 on Tue, 25 May 2021,
> Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> remarked:
>>Peter Johnson <peter@parksidewood.nospam> wrote:
>>> This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique:
>>>
>>> Coming soon
>>> tap on tap off
>>> whether you travel a little or a lot
>>> you'll always get the best price
>>>
>>> Hi there,
>>>
>>> From 26th May it will be even easier to travel with First Leicester
>>> with Tap on Tap off. There's no need to work out which bus ticket you
>>> need as we'll work out the cheapest on-bus fare for you based on the
>>> journeys you make during the day. You'll never pay more than £4.40 for
>>> a day's travel, or £18 for a week.
>>>
>>> All you need to do is tap the same card or contactless device on the
>>> dedicated reader as you board and exit the bus and your payment will
>>> be calculated based on the number of journeys you make.
>>>
>>> How it works?
>>> " When you tap on and tap off, we'll automatically calculate the
>>> single fare for your journey.
>>> " If you only make one trip, you'll pay the single fare - if you
>>> make several trips in one day the price you'll pay will be capped at
>>> the day ticket price.
>>> " If you travel several days in a week, the price you'll pay
>>> will be capped at the weekly ticket price.
>>>
>>> Payment is taken at the end of the day and you don't receive a paper
>>> receipt while on the bus.
>>
>>Ah, nothing to do with “taps aff” then...
>
> Talking of tapping-off, how many other bus PAYG schemes require the
> passenger to tap both getting on, and off, the bus?

I wondered that

If it's a fixed single fare, what's the point?

I was on a London bus some months ago, we got to a stop and I watched this
(obviously foreign) guy, jump up in a hurry from his seat, get very
flustered whilst he rifled through his pockets to find his wallet, so that,
as it became apparent, he could tap out and jump off the bus seconds before
the doors shut.

And I thought "you didn't need to do that", but it was too late to tell him.
He was on on the pavement and the bus was pulling away from the stop

I wonder what made him think that he needed to tap out?

tim

tim... <timsnews99@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> "Roland Perry" <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:kixwJF5EMhrgFAFD@perry.uk...
>> In message <s8jjkf$p8d$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:36:47 on Tue, 25 May 2021,
>> Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> remarked:
>>> Peter Johnson <peter@parksidewood.nospam> wrote:
>>>> This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique:
>>>>
>>>> Coming soon
>>>> tap on tap off
>>>> whether you travel a little or a lot
>>>> you'll always get the best price
>>>>
>>>> Hi there,
>>>>
>>>> From 26th May it will be even easier to travel with First Leicester
>>>> with Tap on Tap off. There's no need to work out which bus ticket you
>>>> need as we'll work out the cheapest on-bus fare for you based on the
>>>> journeys you make during the day. You'll never pay more than £4.40 for
>>>> a day's travel, or £18 for a week.
>>>>
>>>> All you need to do is tap the same card or contactless device on the
>>>> dedicated reader as you board and exit the bus and your payment will
>>>> be calculated based on the number of journeys you make.
>>>>
>>>> How it works?
>>>> " When you tap on and tap off, we'll automatically calculate the
>>>> single fare for your journey.
>>>> " If you only make one trip, you'll pay the single fare - if you
>>>> make several trips in one day the price you'll pay will be capped at
>>>> the day ticket price.
>>>> " If you travel several days in a week, the price you'll pay
>>>> will be capped at the weekly ticket price.
>>>>
>>>> Payment is taken at the end of the day and you don't receive a paper
>>>> receipt while on the bus.
>>>
>>> Ah, nothing to do with “taps aff” then...
>>
>> Talking of tapping-off, how many other bus PAYG schemes require the
>> passenger to tap both getting on, and off, the bus?
>
> I wondered that
>
> If it's a fixed single fare, what's the point?
>
> I was on a London bus some months ago, we got to a stop and I watched this
> (obviously foreign) guy, jump up in a hurry from his seat, get very
> flustered whilst he rifled through his pockets to find his wallet, so that,
> as it became apparent, he could tap out and jump off the bus seconds before
> the doors shut.
>
> And I thought "you didn't need to do that", but it was too late to tell him.
> He was on on the pavement and the bus was pulling away from the stop
>
> I wonder what made him think that he needed to tap out?
>

It's a perfectly reasonable assumption, given the constant TfL advice to,
"Always touch in at the start of your journey and touch out at the end on a
yellow card reader to pay the right fare". Only in the fine print do you
find, "Only touch in on buses and trams".

<https://tfl.gov.uk/fares/how-to-pay-and-where-to-buy-tickets-and-oyster/pay-as-you-go/touching-in-and-out>

In message <s8l7dr$nni$1@dont-email.me>, at 12:20:43 on Wed, 26 May
2021, bob <email@domain.com> remarked:
>On 2021-05-26 09:35:36 +0000, Roland Perry said:
>
>> In message <s8krmv$h72$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:00:47 on Wed, 26 May
>>2021, bob <email@domain.com> remarked:
>>> On 2021-05-25 17:56:42 +0000, Roland Perry said:
>>>
>>>> In message <s8jar8$e3o$2@dont-email.me>, at 19:06:48 on Tue, 25 May
>>>>2021, bob <email@domain.com> remarked:
>>>>> On 2021-05-25 15:55:08 +0000, Roland Perry said:
>>>>>
>>>>>> In message <s44qagt5qovq64d4btkv30qn2jao7l74f4@4ax.com>, at
>>>>>>16:02:27 on Tue, 25 May 2021, Peter Johnson
>>>>>><peter@parksidewood.nospam> remarked:
>>>>
>>>>>>> This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique:
>>>>>>>Coming soon tap on tap off whether you travel a little or a
>>>>>>>lot you'll always get the best price Hi there, From 26th May
>>>>>>>it will be even easier to travel with First Leicester with Tap
>>>>>>>on Tap off. There's no need to work out which bus ticket you
>>>>>>>need as we'll work out the cheapest on-bus fare for you based
>>>>>>>on the journeys you make during the day. You'll never pay more
>>>>>>>than £4.40 for a day's travel, or £18 for a week. All you need to do is tap the same card
>>>>
>>>>>> I presume they mean "Credit/Debit card" not ITSO or Tesco Loyalty
>>>>>>card.
>>>>> Contactless Visa or Mastercard, Apple pay, Google pay.
>>>>> Another reason not to bother with an ITSO card.
>>>> Or a bus company swimming against the flow, given that all
>>>>concessionary bus passes are ITSO.
>>> Looking at a few bus company webistes, it looks like all the major
>>>bus companies (first, Arriva, Stagecoach and GoAhead) all ccept
>>>contactless payment on their buses. First and GoAhead are both
>>>rolling out a system like the one described above to parts fo their
>>>network. For Go Ahead, it looks like it covers Gatwick and
>>>environs, Brighton & Hove, Porstsmouth and Solent, Oxford, and
>>>Newcastle area (possibly others),

>> The Brighton and Gatwick buses are also covered by GTR's KeyGo ITSO
>>card.
>
>Great. Can I use that on buses operated by Arriva, first or
>Stagecoach?

Do they have any in Brighton?

>Can I use that to get around London?

Yes, a Travelcard can be loaded onto that same Key card.
--
Roland Perry

On 26/05/2021 10:21, Roland Perry wrote:

>
> Talking of tapping-off, how many other bus PAYG schemes require the
> passenger to tap both getting on, and off, the bus?

I believe Brighton offers it, as an alternative to buying a paper ticket
using contactless (or using an app).

--
Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK

On 26/05/2021 11:39, Recliner wrote:
> tim... <timsnews99@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I wonder what made him think that he needed to tap out?
>
> It's a perfectly reasonable assumption, given the constant TfL advice to,
> "Always touch in at the start of your journey and touch out at the end on a
> yellow card reader to pay the right fare". Only in the fine print do you
> find, "Only touch in on buses and trams".
>
> <https://tfl.gov.uk/fares/how-to-pay-and-where-to-buy-tickets-and-oyster/pay-as-you-go/touching-in-and-out>

Except for viewers in Wimbledon.

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <s8jjkf$p8d$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:36:47 on Tue, 25 May
> 2021, Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> remarked:
>> Peter Johnson <peter@parksidewood.nospam> wrote:
>>> This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique:
>>>
>>> Coming soon
>>> tap on tap off
>>> whether you travel a little or a lot
>>> you'll always get the best price
>>>
>>> Hi there,
>>>
>>> From 26th May it will be even easier to travel with First Leicester
>>> with Tap on Tap off. There's no need to work out which bus ticket you
>>> need as we'll work out the cheapest on-bus fare for you based on the
>>> journeys you make during the day. You'll never pay more than £4.40 for
>>> a day's travel, or £18 for a week.
>>>
>>> All you need to do is tap the same card or contactless device on the
>>> dedicated reader as you board and exit the bus and your payment will
>>> be calculated based on the number of journeys you make.
>>>
>>> How it works?
>>> " When you tap on and tap off, we'll automatically calculate the
>>> single fare for your journey.
>>> " If you only make one trip, you'll pay the single fare - if you
>>> make several trips in one day the price you'll pay will be capped at
>>> the day ticket price.
>>> " If you travel several days in a week, the price you'll pay
>>> will be capped at the weekly ticket price.
>>>
>>> Payment is taken at the end of the day and you don't receive a paper
>>> receipt while on the bus.
>>
>> Ah, nothing to do with “taps aff” then...
>
> Talking of tapping-off, how many other bus PAYG schemes require the
> passenger to tap both getting on, and off, the bus?

Blackpool Transport have implemented it on their buses, albeit without any
form of capping.

https://www.blackpooltransport.com/tapandgo

Lew

In message <Hp-dnUiFxutfGDP9nZ2dnUU78aednZ2d@brightview.co.uk>, at
18:30:40 on Wed, 26 May 2021, Arthur Figgis
<afiggis@example.com.invalid> remarked:
>On 26/05/2021 10:21, Roland Perry wrote:
>
>> Talking of tapping-off, how many other bus PAYG schemes require the
>>passenger to tap both getting on, and off, the bus?
>
>I believe Brighton offers it, as an alternative to buying a paper
>ticket using contactless (or using an app).

I was familiar with the KeyGo scheme in Brighton (and several other
towns in former Southern Rail territory), which has a fixed zone and
£2.70 per trip, £4.90 daily cap, using an ITSO-based wallet. Because
it's fixed fare there is no need to tap-off (like there isn't a need in
London). I think the zone is the same as for Plusbus.

However, Brighton and Hove Bus Company has a separate scheme which does
require tapping-off (being charged to wherever the end of the route is,
for not doing so).

There are more of these tap-off schemes than I realised, having
previously used buses with the fixed fare model. That's either fixed
price singles, or automatic day-tickets.

Swift in Birmingham is slightly more complex, because whether you get a
single or a day-ticket depends on the operator (but all are just taor
not) andin).

Stagecoach countrywide (they claim) accept contactless cards, but only
as a way to pay the driver. Round here they strongly encourage (by
failing to market any other tickets, which are barely cheaper anyway)
people to buy the all-day tickets.

There's no particular correlation between the need to tap-off (or not)
and whether the bearer is an ITSO card, proprietary card, CCC or phone
with ApplePay etc.
--
Roland Perry

In message <1913410132.643759719.354153.email-nowhere.com@web.aioe.org>,
at 22:09:36 on Wed, 26 May 2021, Lew 1 <email@nowhere.com> remarked:
>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <s8jjkf$p8d$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:36:47 on Tue, 25 May
>> 2021, Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> remarked:
>>> Peter Johnson <peter@parksidewood.nospam> wrote:
>>>> This just received rom First Leicester so won't be unique:
>>>>
>>>> Coming soon
>>>> tap on tap off
>>>> whether you travel a little or a lot
>>>> you'll always get the best price
>>>>
>>>> Hi there,
>>>>
>>>> From 26th May it will be even easier to travel with First Leicester
>>>> with Tap on Tap off. There's no need to work out which bus ticket you
>>>> need as we'll work out the cheapest on-bus fare for you based on the
>>>> journeys you make during the day. You'll never pay more than £4.40 for
>>>> a day's travel, or £18 for a week.
>>>>
>>>> All you need to do is tap the same card or contactless device on the
>>>> dedicated reader as you board and exit the bus and your payment will
>>>> be calculated based on the number of journeys you make.
>>>>
>>>> How it works?
>>>> " When you tap on and tap off, we'll automatically calculate the
>>>> single fare for your journey.
>>>> " If you only make one trip, you'll pay the single fare - if you
>>>> make several trips in one day the price you'll pay will be capped at
>>>> the day ticket price.
>>>> " If you travel several days in a week, the price you'll pay
>>>> will be capped at the weekly ticket price.
>>>>
>>>> Payment is taken at the end of the day and you don't receive a paper
>>>> receipt while on the bus.
>>>
>>> Ah, nothing to do with “taps aff” then...
>>
>> Talking of tapping-off, how many other bus PAYG schemes require the
>> passenger to tap both getting on, and off, the bus?
>
>Blackpool Transport have implemented it on their buses, albeit without any
>form of capping.
>
>https://www.blackpooltransport.com/tapandgo

Thanks. Their fare structure is £1.90 within one zone, £2.40 for two
zones (the zones being essentially "central" and "outer"). Failing to
tap-off it charges you £2.40
--
Roland Perry

In message <5+r3uDcsA0rgFAXy@perry.uk>, at 07:46:04 on Thu, 27 May 2021,
Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>In message <Hp-dnUiFxutfGDP9nZ2dnUU78aednZ2d@brightview.co.uk>, at
>18:30:40 on Wed, 26 May 2021, Arthur Figgis
><afiggis@example.com.invalid> remarked:
>>On 26/05/2021 10:21, Roland Perry wrote:
>>
>>> Talking of tapping-off, how many other bus PAYG schemes require the
>>>passenger to tap both getting on, and off, the bus?
>>
>>I believe Brighton offers it, as an alternative to buying a paper
>>ticket using contactless (or using an app).
>
>I was familiar with the KeyGo scheme in Brighton (and several other
>towns in former Southern Rail territory), which has a fixed zone and
>£2.70 per trip, £4.90 daily cap, using an ITSO-based wallet. Because
>it's fixed fare there is no need to tap-off (like there isn't a need in
>London). I think the zone is the same as for Plusbus.
>
>However, Brighton and Hove Bus Company has a separate scheme which does
>require tapping-off (being charged to wherever the end of the route is,
>for not doing so).
>
>There are more of these tap-off schemes than I realised, having
>previously used buses with the fixed fare model. That's either fixed
>price singles, or automatic day-tickets.
>
>Swift in Birmingham is slightly more complex, because whether you get a
>single or a day-ticket depends on the operator (but all are just taor
>not) andin).

bleugh. 'just tap in'

>Stagecoach countrywide (they claim) accept contactless cards, but only
>as a way to pay the driver. Round here they strongly encourage (by
>failing to market any other tickets, which are barely cheaper anyway)
>people to buy the all-day tickets.
>
>There's no particular correlation between the need to tap-off (or not)
>and whether the bearer is an ITSO card, proprietary card, CCC or phone
>with ApplePay etc.

--
Roland Perry