On 12/03/2022 10:35, Recliner wrote:
> <martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
>> On 12/03/2022 10:12, Roland Perry wrote:
>>> In message <r6RPImT8raKiFAUC@perry.uk>, at 07:38:36 on Thu, 10 Mar 2022,
>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>>>> instance the
>>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening,
>>>>>> and the
>>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled,
>>>>>> causing
>>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>>
>>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>>
>>>> Places round here are.
>>>>
>>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>>>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>>
>>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>>>
>>>> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>>>> phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>>>> it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>>>> week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>>>> crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
>>>> have stayed at home too.
>>>>
>>>> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps
>>>> a fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
>>>> they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
>>>> staff shortage.
>>>
>>> Biffa still not been around, and national news yesterday was that
>>> infections up 20% in a week. 30-39 year olds most affected, maybe
>>> they are throwing caution to the winds, thrown their masks away,
>>> and going out partying?
>>>
>>> Ordered several things from Amazon Prime yesterday; would normally
>>> expect delivery today, but they were quoting some Tuesday, others
>>> Wednesday.
>>
>> I thought the English government has declared the Covid crisis over in
>> England and Englanders don't have to isolate in England any more even
>> after a positive test?
>>
>
> Correct: self-isolation is no longer a legal requirement. People may choose
> to do it, as with flu, but in neither case does the government intervene.
>

Correction, we don't have an English government.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

On 12/03/2022 11:32, Recliner wrote:
> <martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
>> On 12/03/2022 11:19, Tweed wrote:
>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> <martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
>>>>> On 12/03/2022 10:12, Roland Perry wrote:
>>>>>> In message <r6RPImT8raKiFAUC@perry.uk>, at 07:38:36 on Thu, 10 Mar 2022,
>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>>>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>>>>>>> instance the
>>>>>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening,
>>>>>>>>> and the
>>>>>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled,
>>>>>>>>> causing
>>>>>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>>>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Places round here are.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>>>>>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>>>>>>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>>>>>>> phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>>>>>>> it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>>>>>>> week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>>>>>>> crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
>>>>>>> have stayed at home too.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps
>>>>>>> a fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
>>>>>>> they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
>>>>>>> staff shortage.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Biffa still not been around, and national news yesterday was that
>>>>>> infections up 20% in a week. 30-39 year olds most affected, maybe
>>>>>> they are throwing caution to the winds, thrown their masks away,
>>>>>> and going out partying?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ordered several things from Amazon Prime yesterday; would normally
>>>>>> expect delivery today, but they were quoting some Tuesday, others
>>>>>> Wednesday.
>>>>>
>>>>> I thought the English government has declared the Covid crisis over in
>>>>> England and Englanders don't have to isolate in England any more even
>>>>> after a positive test?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Correct: self-isolation is no longer a legal requirement. People may choose
>>>> to do it, as with flu, but in neither case does the government intervene.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> I’m up in Edinburgh. The place is already heaving with tourists. My hotel
>>> was hosting two late “Christmas” parties. Although mask wearing indoors is
>>> still compulsory for a few more weeks, observance is very patchy. Nobody
>>> was wearing one on the LNER service post the Scottish border. The medical
>>> event I attended yesterday was maskless once the ceremony got going. Nobody
>>> is taking covid precautions seriously here.
>>
>> Which partially explains why the Scottish covid rates are rising at such
>> a spectacularly high rate at the moment.
>
> The recent growth is with the new Omicron subvariant BA.2. It's spreading
> rapidly across the whole of the UK, whether or not people still bother with
> masks.
>
> Omicron is everywhere, and mask wearing makes little difference to its
> spread. We will all be repeatedly exposed to it, and will probably catch it
> regularly, usually with few or no symptoms. Don't think you can hide from
> it by wearing a mask.
>

Once again, wearing a mask doesn't protect you but other people! Unless
you are wearing one of the expensive fancy variants. Not seen anyone
wearing one of those for weeks now.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> On 12/03/2022 10:35, Recliner wrote:
>> <martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
>>> On 12/03/2022 10:12, Roland Perry wrote:
>>>> In message <r6RPImT8raKiFAUC@perry.uk>, at 07:38:36 on Thu, 10 Mar 2022,
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>>>>> instance the
>>>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening,
>>>>>>> and the
>>>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled,
>>>>>>> causing
>>>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>>>
>>>>> Places round here are.
>>>>>
>>>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>>>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>>>>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>>>
>>>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>>>>
>>>>> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>>>>> phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>>>>> it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>>>>> week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>>>>> crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
>>>>> have stayed at home too.
>>>>>
>>>>> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps
>>>>> a fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
>>>>> they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
>>>>> staff shortage.
>>>>
>>>> Biffa still not been around, and national news yesterday was that
>>>> infections up 20% in a week. 30-39 year olds most affected, maybe
>>>> they are throwing caution to the winds, thrown their masks away,
>>>> and going out partying?
>>>>
>>>> Ordered several things from Amazon Prime yesterday; would normally
>>>> expect delivery today, but they were quoting some Tuesday, others
>>>> Wednesday.
>>>
>>> I thought the English government has declared the Covid crisis over in
>>> England and Englanders don't have to isolate in England any more even
>>> after a positive test?
>>>
>>
>> Correct: self-isolation is no longer a legal requirement. People may choose
>> to do it, as with flu, but in neither case does the government intervene.
>>
>
> Correction, we don't have an English government.
>

With healthcare, we do.

In message <t0hsfd$dgg$1@dont-email.me>, at 10:25:49 on Sat, 12 Mar
2022, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk remarked:
>On 12/03/2022 10:12, Roland Perry wrote:
>> In message <r6RPImT8raKiFAUC@perry.uk>, at 07:38:36 on Thu, 10 Mar
>>2022, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>>>2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>>>instance the
>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this
>>>>>evening, and the
>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled,
>>>>>causing
>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>
>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>
>>> Places round here are.
>>>
>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>>year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>>>students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>
>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>>
>>> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>>>phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>>>it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>>>week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>>>crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
>>>have stayed at home too.
>>>
>>> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for
>>>perhaps a fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open.
>>>Unless they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa
>>>having a staff shortage.

>> Biffa still not been around, and national news yesterday was that
>>infections up 20% in a week. 30-39 year olds most affected, maybe
>> they are throwing caution to the winds, thrown their masks away,
>> and going out partying?

>> Ordered several things from Amazon Prime yesterday; would normally
>>expect delivery today, but they were quoting some Tuesday, others
>>Wednesday.
>
>I thought the English government has declared the Covid crisis over in
>England and Englanders don't have to isolate in England any more even
>after a positive test?

They've relaxed the legal minimum, but every employer I know of
(especially in front-line services) is sticking to the old guidelines
voluntarily. Not least because they don't want even more of their own
employees succumbing.
--
Roland Perry

In message <t0i0c4$97s$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:32:20 on Sat, 12 Mar
2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:

>The recent growth is with the new Omicron subvariant BA.2. It's spreading
>rapidly across the whole of the UK, whether or not people still bother with
>masks.
>
>Omicron is everywhere, and mask wearing makes little difference to its
>spread.

I'm sure the health professionals would welcome your expert advice on
this. Meanwhile, wearing a mask to help protect oneself works for any
variant.
--
Roland Perry

Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> On 12/03/2022 11:32, Recliner wrote:
>> <martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
>>> On 12/03/2022 11:19, Tweed wrote:
>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> <martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
>>>>>> On 12/03/2022 10:12, Roland Perry wrote:
>>>>>>> In message <r6RPImT8raKiFAUC@perry.uk>, at 07:38:36 on Thu, 10 Mar 2022,
>>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>>>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>>>>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>>>>>>>> instance the
>>>>>>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening,
>>>>>>>>>> and the
>>>>>>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled,
>>>>>>>>>> causing
>>>>>>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>>>>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Places round here are.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>>>>>>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>>>>>>>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>>>>>>>> phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>>>>>>>> it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>>>>>>>> week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>>>>>>>> crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
>>>>>>>> have stayed at home too.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps
>>>>>>>> a fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
>>>>>>>> they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
>>>>>>>> staff shortage.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Biffa still not been around, and national news yesterday was that
>>>>>>> infections up 20% in a week. 30-39 year olds most affected, maybe
>>>>>>> they are throwing caution to the winds, thrown their masks away,
>>>>>>> and going out partying?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ordered several things from Amazon Prime yesterday; would normally
>>>>>>> expect delivery today, but they were quoting some Tuesday, others
>>>>>>> Wednesday.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I thought the English government has declared the Covid crisis over in
>>>>>> England and Englanders don't have to isolate in England any more even
>>>>>> after a positive test?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Correct: self-isolation is no longer a legal requirement. People may choose
>>>>> to do it, as with flu, but in neither case does the government intervene.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I’m up in Edinburgh. The place is already heaving with tourists. My hotel
>>>> was hosting two late “Christmas” parties. Although mask wearing indoors is
>>>> still compulsory for a few more weeks, observance is very patchy. Nobody
>>>> was wearing one on the LNER service post the Scottish border. The medical
>>>> event I attended yesterday was maskless once the ceremony got going. Nobody
>>>> is taking covid precautions seriously here.
>>>
>>> Which partially explains why the Scottish covid rates are rising at such
>>> a spectacularly high rate at the moment.
>>
>> The recent growth is with the new Omicron subvariant BA.2. It's spreading
>> rapidly across the whole of the UK, whether or not people still bother with
>> masks.
>>
>> Omicron is everywhere, and mask wearing makes little difference to its
>> spread. We will all be repeatedly exposed to it, and will probably catch it
>> regularly, usually with few or no symptoms. Don't think you can hide from
>> it by wearing a mask.
>>
>
> Once again, wearing a mask doesn't protect you but other people!

I know. And ordinary masks don't do much to protect others, either.

> Unless
> you are wearing one of the expensive fancy variants. Not seen anyone
> wearing one of those for weeks now.
>

I wear those if in crowded surroundings.

On 12/03/2022 11:44, Recliner wrote:
> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>> On 12/03/2022 10:35, Recliner wrote:
>>> <martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
>>>> On 12/03/2022 10:12, Roland Perry wrote:
>>>>> In message <r6RPImT8raKiFAUC@perry.uk>, at 07:38:36 on Thu, 10 Mar 2022,
>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>>>>>> instance the
>>>>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening,
>>>>>>>> and the
>>>>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled,
>>>>>>>> causing
>>>>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Places round here are.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>>>>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>>>>>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>>>>>> phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>>>>>> it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>>>>>> week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>>>>>> crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
>>>>>> have stayed at home too.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps
>>>>>> a fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
>>>>>> they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
>>>>>> staff shortage.
>>>>>
>>>>> Biffa still not been around, and national news yesterday was that
>>>>> infections up 20% in a week. 30-39 year olds most affected, maybe
>>>>> they are throwing caution to the winds, thrown their masks away,
>>>>> and going out partying?
>>>>>
>>>>> Ordered several things from Amazon Prime yesterday; would normally
>>>>> expect delivery today, but they were quoting some Tuesday, others
>>>>> Wednesday.
>>>>
>>>> I thought the English government has declared the Covid crisis over in
>>>> England and Englanders don't have to isolate in England any more even
>>>> after a positive test?
>>>>
>>>
>>> Correct: self-isolation is no longer a legal requirement. People may choose
>>> to do it, as with flu, but in neither case does the government intervene.
>>>
>>
>> Correction, we don't have an English government.
>>
>
> With healthcare, we do.
>

Not even for that I'm afraid.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <t0i0c4$97s$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:32:20 on Sat, 12 Mar
> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>
>> The recent growth is with the new Omicron subvariant BA.2. It's spreading
>> rapidly across the whole of the UK, whether or not people still bother with
>> masks.
>>
>> Omicron is everywhere, and mask wearing makes little difference to its
>> spread.
>
> I'm sure the health professionals would welcome your expert advice on
> this.

As we know, they keep catching it too, despite wearing professional masks,
properly. Their masks help protect their patients from droplets of spit.
They provide scant protection against Covid.

> Meanwhile, wearing a mask to help protect oneself works for any variant.

Not really. I take it you're still a keen mask wearer, but didn't you
nevertheless catch it?

In message <t0i10c$cc5$2@dont-email.me>, at 11:43:08 on Sat, 12 Mar
2022, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:

>> Omicron is everywhere, and mask wearing makes little difference to
>>its spread. We will all be repeatedly exposed to it, and will
>>probably catch it regularly, usually with few or no symptoms. Don't
>>think you can hide from it by wearing a mask.
>
>Once again, wearing a mask doesn't protect you but other people! Unless
>you are wearing one of the expensive fancy variants. Not seen anyone
>wearing one of those for weeks now.

We still wear them. Even though I agree it's rare. But then I wore a
seatbelt in my car long before they were compulsory.
--
Roland Perry

In message <t0i1k6$i5h$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:53:42 on Sat, 12 Mar
2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <t0i0c4$97s$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:32:20 on Sat, 12 Mar
>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>
>>> The recent growth is with the new Omicron subvariant BA.2. It's spreading
>>> rapidly across the whole of the UK, whether or not people still bother with
>>> masks.
>>>
>>> Omicron is everywhere, and mask wearing makes little difference to its
>>> spread.
>>
>> I'm sure the health professionals would welcome your expert advice on
>> this.
>
>As we know, they keep catching it too, despite wearing professional masks,
>properly.

I suspect you've not been in very many healthcare settings the last year
or so. I have (on average at least once a week), and I have not seen a
single worker[*] wearing more than a flimsy blue surgical mask. Although
often they wear disposable plastic aprons, which don't seem to me to
provide much protection from airborne respiratory particles.

[*] Apart from one time when the doorkeeper at A&E was wearing a full
hazmat suit.

> Their masks help protect their patients from droplets of spit.
>They provide scant protection against Covid.
>
>> Meanwhile, wearing a mask to help protect oneself works for any variant.
>
>Not really.

Yes, really. The research has been widely available.

For the most risky situations we have some FFP3 respirator masks. They
are about a fiver each in quantity.

>I take it you're still a keen mask wearer, but didn't you nevertheless
>catch it?

Not yet (fingers crossed).
--
Roland Perry

On Sat, 12 Mar 2022 12:08:42 +0000, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:

>In message <t0i1k6$i5h$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:53:42 on Sat, 12 Mar
>2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <t0i0c4$97s$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:32:20 on Sat, 12 Mar
>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>
>>>> The recent growth is with the new Omicron subvariant BA.2. It's spreading
>>>> rapidly across the whole of the UK, whether or not people still bother with
>>>> masks.
>>>>
>>>> Omicron is everywhere, and mask wearing makes little difference to its
>>>> spread.
>>>
>>> I'm sure the health professionals would welcome your expert advice on
>>> this.
>>
>>As we know, they keep catching it too, despite wearing professional masks,
>>properly.
>
>I suspect you've not been in very many healthcare settings the last year
>or so. I have (on average at least once a week), and I have not seen a
>single worker[*] wearing more than a flimsy blue surgical mask. Although
>often they wear disposable plastic aprons, which don't seem to me to
>provide much protection from airborne respiratory particles.

I've noticed the same. But those masks are better, and worn better, than most members of the public manage.

>
>[*] Apart from one time when the doorkeeper at A&E was wearing a full
> hazmat suit.
>
>> Their masks help protect their patients from droplets of spit.
>>They provide scant protection against Covid.
>>
>>> Meanwhile, wearing a mask to help protect oneself works for any variant.
>>
>>Not really.
>
>Yes, really. The research has been widely available.

You had better cite some convincing research then.

>
>For the most risky situations we have some FFP3 respirator masks. They
>are about a fiver each in quantity.

Yes, if properly sealed to the face, they do provide some protection. But not if they mist your glasses.

On 12/03/2022 11:19, Tweed wrote:
> I’m up in Edinburgh. The place is already heaving with tourists. My hotel
> was hosting two late “Christmas” parties. Although mask wearing indoors is
> still compulsory for a few more weeks, observance is very patchy. Nobody
> was wearing one on the LNER service post the Scottish border. The medical
> event I attended yesterday was maskless once the ceremony got going. Nobody
> is taking covid precautions seriously here.

Welcome! The locals still seem to be wearing masks in shops etc. but
I've not met anyone visiting from England indoors, so they may well be
acting as they would at home.

On 12/03/2022 11:41, Graeme Wall wrote:
> On 12/03/2022 10:35, Recliner wrote:
>> <martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
>>> On 12/03/2022 10:12, Roland Perry wrote:
>>>> In message <r6RPImT8raKiFAUC@perry.uk>, at 07:38:36 on Thu, 10 Mar
>>>> 2022,
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>>>>> instance the
>>>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening,
>>>>>>> and the
>>>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled,
>>>>>>> causing
>>>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with
>>>>>>> passengers
>>>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>>>
>>>>> Places round here are.
>>>>>
>>>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>>>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>>>>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>>>
>>>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>>>>
>>>>> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>>>>> phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>>>>> it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>>>>> week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>>>>> crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
>>>>> have stayed at home too.
>>>>>
>>>>> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps
>>>>> a fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
>>>>> they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
>>>>> staff shortage.
>>>>
>>>> Biffa still not been around, and national news yesterday was that
>>>> infections up 20% in a week. 30-39 year olds most affected, maybe
>>>> they are throwing caution to the winds, thrown their masks away,
>>>> and going out partying?
>>>>
>>>> Ordered several things from Amazon Prime yesterday; would normally
>>>> expect delivery today, but they were quoting some Tuesday, others
>>>> Wednesday.
>>>
>>> I thought the English government has declared the Covid crisis over in
>>> England and Englanders don't have to isolate in England any more even
>>> after a positive test?
>>>
>>
>> Correct: self-isolation is no longer a legal requirement. People may
>> choose
>> to do it, as with flu, but in neither case does the government intervene.
>>
>
> Correction, we don't have an English government.
>
HMG function as an English government for such things as health and
transport.

On 12/03/2022 15:32, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk wrote:
> On 12/03/2022 11:41, Graeme Wall wrote:
>> On 12/03/2022 10:35, Recliner wrote:
>>> <martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
>>>> On 12/03/2022 10:12, Roland Perry wrote:
>>>>> In message <r6RPImT8raKiFAUC@perry.uk>, at 07:38:36 on Thu, 10 Mar
>>>>> 2022,
>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>>>>>> instance the
>>>>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening,
>>>>>>>> and the
>>>>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled,
>>>>>>>> causing
>>>>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with
>>>>>>>> passengers
>>>>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Places round here are.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>>>>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>>>>>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>>>>>> phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>>>>>> it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>>>>>> week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>>>>>> crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
>>>>>> have stayed at home too.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps
>>>>>> a fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
>>>>>> they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
>>>>>> staff shortage.
>>>>>
>>>>> Biffa still not been around, and national news yesterday was that
>>>>> infections up 20% in a week. 30-39 year olds most affected, maybe
>>>>> they are throwing caution to the winds, thrown their masks away,
>>>>> and going out partying?
>>>>>
>>>>> Ordered several things from Amazon Prime yesterday; would normally
>>>>> expect delivery today, but they were quoting some Tuesday, others
>>>>> Wednesday.
>>>>
>>>> I thought the English government has declared the Covid crisis over in
>>>> England and Englanders don't have to isolate in England any more even
>>>> after a positive test?
>>>>
>>>
>>> Correct: self-isolation is no longer a legal requirement. People may
>>> choose
>>> to do it, as with flu, but in neither case does the government
>>> intervene.
>>>
>>
>> Correction, we don't have an English government.
>>
> HMG function as an English government for such things as health and
> transport.

This is the problem, it doesn't function…

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <r6RPImT8raKiFAUC@perry.uk>, at 07:38:36 on Thu, 10 Mar 2022,
> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>
>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for instance the
>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening, and the
>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled, causing
>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>
>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>
>> Places round here are.
>>
>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>
>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>
>> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>> phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>> it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>> week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>> crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
>> have stayed at home too.
>>
>> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps a
>> fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
>> they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
>> staff shortage.
>
> Biffa still not been around, and national news yesterday was that
> infections up 20% in a week. 30-39 year olds most affected, maybe
> they are throwing caution to the winds, thrown their masks away,
> and going out partying?
>
> Ordered several things from Amazon Prime yesterday; would normally
> expect delivery today, but they were quoting some Tuesday, others
> Wednesday.

OTOH, I made three orders this week (not from Amazon, because I decided to
avoid them whenever possible when they threatened to stop accepting
payments using Visa cards). One arrived on the due date, the other two
were originally predicted for delivery early next week, but were delivered
on Friday. A pack of lateral flow tests also arrived the morning after
they were ordered.

--
Jeremy Double

Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <r6RPImT8raKiFAUC@perry.uk>, at 07:38:36 on Thu, 10 Mar 2022,
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for instance the
>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening, and the
>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled, causing
>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>
>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>
>>> Places round here are.
>>>
>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>
>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>>
>>> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>>> phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>>> it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>>> week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>>> crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
>>> have stayed at home too.
>>>
>>> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps a
>>> fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
>>> they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
>>> staff shortage.
>>
>> Biffa still not been around, and national news yesterday was that
>> infections up 20% in a week. 30-39 year olds most affected, maybe
>> they are throwing caution to the winds, thrown their masks away,
>> and going out partying?
>>
>> Ordered several things from Amazon Prime yesterday; would normally
>> expect delivery today, but they were quoting some Tuesday, others
>> Wednesday.
>
> OTOH, I made three orders this week (not from Amazon, because I decided to
> avoid them whenever possible when they threatened to stop accepting
> payments using Visa cards). One arrived on the due date, the other two
> were originally predicted for delivery early next week, but were delivered
> on Friday. A pack of lateral flow tests also arrived the morning after
> they were ordered.

I’m expecting a small but slightly valuable item. I was notified
yesterday, Friday, that it had been dispatched and would be delivered on
Monday. Today, Saturday, I got email from DPD saying it would be delivered
this afternoon. Since I was out that wasn’t much use so I got it delayed
until Monday again. We’ll see when it actually arrives.

Sam

--
The entity formerly known as Sam.Wilson@ed.ac.uk
Spit the dummy to reply

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <t0i0c4$97s$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:32:20 on Sat, 12 Mar
> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>
>> The recent growth is with the new Omicron subvariant BA.2. It's spreading
>> rapidly across the whole of the UK, whether or not people still bother with
>> masks.
>>
>> Omicron is everywhere, and mask wearing makes little difference to its
>> spread.
>
> I'm sure the health professionals would welcome your expert advice on
> this. Meanwhile, wearing a mask to help protect oneself works for any
> variant.

I was speaking to a GP this week and her practice has had 3 out of 5
doctors infected this week. Her kids had to have a day off primary school
because there was an outbreak. They were allowed back after Public Health
reviewed the situation, but there are still 30%+ kids off because they’re
testing +ve or their parents won’t risk it.

Sam

--
The entity formerly known as Sam.Wilson@ed.ac.uk
Spit the dummy to reply

In message
<577941494.668804908.725760.jmd.nospam-btinternet.com@news.individual.net
>, at 19:15:18 on Sat, 12 Mar 2022, Jeremy Double
<jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> remarked:
>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <r6RPImT8raKiFAUC@perry.uk>, at 07:38:36 on Thu, 10 Mar 2022,
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>>>instance the
>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this
>>>>>evening, and the
>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled, causing
>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>
>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>
>>> Places round here are.
>>>
>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>
>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>>
>>> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>>> phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>>> it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>>> week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>>> crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
>>> have stayed at home too.
>>>
>>> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps a
>>> fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
>>> they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
>>> staff shortage.
>>
>> Biffa still not been around, and national news yesterday was that
>> infections up 20% in a week. 30-39 year olds most affected, maybe
>> they are throwing caution to the winds, thrown their masks away,
>> and going out partying?
>>
>> Ordered several things from Amazon Prime yesterday; would normally
>> expect delivery today, but they were quoting some Tuesday, others
>> Wednesday.
>
>OTOH, I made three orders this week (not from Amazon, because I decided to
>avoid them whenever possible when they threatened to stop accepting
>payments using Visa cards). One arrived on the due date, the other two
>were originally predicted for delivery early next week, but were delivered
>on Friday. A pack of lateral flow tests also arrived the morning after
>they were ordered.

Those lateral flow tests are usually delivered by Royal Mail Tracked
24hr. Whether RM in your area can consistently achieve that is often a
local debate. They aren't delivered by Amazon or Hermes!

And talking of Amazon, I did finally see an Amazon-branded delivery van
this week. It was a beaten up white van with an "Amazon" plaque propped
up at the bottom of the windscreen.
--
Roland Perry

On Sat, 12 Mar 2022 11:52:27 +0000, Graeme Wall
<rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:

>On 12/03/2022 11:44, Recliner wrote:
>> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>> On 12/03/2022 10:35, Recliner wrote:
>>>> <martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
>>>>> On 12/03/2022 10:12, Roland Perry wrote:
>>>>>> In message <r6RPImT8raKiFAUC@perry.uk>, at 07:38:36 on Thu, 10 Mar 2022,
>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>>>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>>>>>>> instance the
>>>>>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening,
>>>>>>>>> and the
>>>>>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled,
>>>>>>>>> causing
>>>>>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>>>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Places round here are.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>>>>>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>>>>>>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>>>>>>> phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>>>>>>> it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>>>>>>> week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>>>>>>> crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
>>>>>>> have stayed at home too.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps
>>>>>>> a fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
>>>>>>> they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
>>>>>>> staff shortage.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Biffa still not been around, and national news yesterday was that
>>>>>> infections up 20% in a week. 30-39 year olds most affected, maybe
>>>>>> they are throwing caution to the winds, thrown their masks away,
>>>>>> and going out partying?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ordered several things from Amazon Prime yesterday; would normally
>>>>>> expect delivery today, but they were quoting some Tuesday, others
>>>>>> Wednesday.
>>>>>
>>>>> I thought the English government has declared the Covid crisis over in
>>>>> England and Englanders don't have to isolate in England any more even
>>>>> after a positive test?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Correct: self-isolation is no longer a legal requirement. People may choose
>>>> to do it, as with flu, but in neither case does the government intervene.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Correction, we don't have an English government.
>>>
>>
>> With healthcare, we do.
>>
>
>Not even for that I'm afraid.
>
Westminster is in the main only responsible for English health matters
(before considering how "British" is a Parliament with an overwhelming
majority of MPs from English constituencies).

In message <t0ivc2$1fs$2@dont-email.me>, at 20:21:22 on Sat, 12 Mar
2022, Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> remarked:
>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <t0i0c4$97s$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:32:20 on Sat, 12 Mar
>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>
>>> The recent growth is with the new Omicron subvariant BA.2. It's spreading
>>> rapidly across the whole of the UK, whether or not people still bother with
>>> masks.
>>>
>>> Omicron is everywhere, and mask wearing makes little difference to its
>>> spread.
>>
>> I'm sure the health professionals would welcome your expert advice on
>> this. Meanwhile, wearing a mask to help protect oneself works for any
>> variant.
>
>I was speaking to a GP this week and her practice has had 3 out of 5
>doctors infected this week. Her kids had to have a day off primary school
>because there was an outbreak. They were allowed back after Public Health
>reviewed the situation, but there are still 30%+ kids off because they’re
>testing +ve or their parents won’t risk it.

I think the media have been distracted (perhaps by Ukraine) from
properly reporting [aka joining up the dots] on these very current
issues.

They (like much of the public) appear to have swallowed the myth that
because precautions are no longer a legal requirement, there is no need
for precautions.
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <t0ivc2$1fs$2@dont-email.me>, at 20:21:22 on Sat, 12 Mar
> 2022, Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> remarked:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <t0i0c4$97s$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:32:20 on Sat, 12 Mar
>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>
>>>> The recent growth is with the new Omicron subvariant BA.2. It's spreading
>>>> rapidly across the whole of the UK, whether or not people still bother with
>>>> masks.
>>>>
>>>> Omicron is everywhere, and mask wearing makes little difference to its
>>>> spread.
>>>
>>> I'm sure the health professionals would welcome your expert advice on
>>> this. Meanwhile, wearing a mask to help protect oneself works for any
>>> variant.
>>
>> I was speaking to a GP this week and her practice has had 3 out of 5
>> doctors infected this week. Her kids had to have a day off primary school
>> because there was an outbreak. They were allowed back after Public Health
>> reviewed the situation, but there are still 30%+ kids off because they’re
>> testing +ve or their parents won’t risk it.
>
> I think the media have been distracted (perhaps by Ukraine) from
> properly reporting [aka joining up the dots] on these very current
> issues.
>
> They (like much of the public) appear to have swallowed the myth that
> because precautions are no longer a legal requirement, there is no need
> for precautions.

I'm sitting in an airport departure lounge, and have been surprised that
hardly anyone is wearing a mask.

One other surprise is that the armed cops are wandering round the lounge,
engaging in friendly chats with the waiting passengers. Apparently it's a
new initiative that they undertake on their days off. Not seen that before.

Am 12.03.2022 um 12:42 schrieb Roland Perry:
> In message <t0hsfd$dgg$1@dont-email.me>, at 10:25:49 on Sat, 12 Mar
> 2022, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk remarked:
>> On 12/03/2022 10:12, Roland Perry wrote:
>>> In message <r6RPImT8raKiFAUC@perry.uk>, at 07:38:36 on Thu, 10 Mar
>>> 2022,  Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>>>> instance the
>>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this
>>>>>> evening,  and the
>>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled,
>>>>>> causing
>>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with
>>>>>> passengers
>>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>>
>>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>>
>>>> Places round here are.
>>>>
>>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst
>>>> the students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>>
>>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>>>
>>>> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>>>> phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>>>> it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>>>> week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>>>> crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend
>>>> would have stayed at home too.
>>>>
>>>> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for
>>>> perhaps  a fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids
>>>> open. Unless  they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr
>>>> Biffa having a  staff shortage.
>
>>>  Biffa still not been around, and national news yesterday was that
>>> infections up 20% in a week. 30-39 year olds most affected, maybe
>>> they are throwing caution to the winds, thrown their masks away,
>>> and going out partying?
>
>>>  Ordered several things from Amazon Prime yesterday; would normally
>>> expect delivery today, but they were quoting some Tuesday, others
>>> Wednesday.
>>
>> I thought the English government has declared the Covid crisis over in
>> England and Englanders don't have to isolate in England any more even
>> after a positive test?
>
> They've relaxed the legal minimum, but every employer I know of
> (especially in front-line services) is sticking to the old guidelines
> voluntarily. Not least because they don't want even more of their own
> employees succumbing.

Similarly in Germany: They've relaxed the legal guidelines because
there's no protection, and my employer changed the cantines to
"take-away only" to avoid larger outbreaks (once they realized people
were using meeting rooms as substitutes, they re-opened the cantines
with reduced capacity).

Rolf

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>
> I have no idea what the current regime is for people claiming special
> sick pay for such periods. (Whether patient or chauffeur).
>

Assuming this part of your reply is still referring to train crew, Covid
illness and isolation is still, AFAIK, outside the usual sickness regime in
my TOC. I'm not sure, OTTOMH, exactly what covid requirements for staff we
are currently using.

> Extrapolating the system I know pertains in some office buildings, while
> no doubt train crew rest facilities have the same rules about maximum
> occupancy and social distancing as other industries...

Mess room (and other rooms) maximum occupancy was initially specified in
the early days of covid; recently with the relaxation of rules they've been
reassessed and capacity generally doubled. That's still only two chairs at
a table which originally had four, though!

In most locations, additional rooms (formerly meeting rooms or offices, the
occupants of which were moved elsewhere) have been made available as
overflow mess rooms (you can't just make any room a mess room, it must as a
minimum have sufficient seating for expected demand, and access to hot and
cold water, a kettle/boiler, water cooler, microwave and toilets; and not
incur further walking time than that currently allocated for the existing
mess rooms at that location).

> If one crew
> member tests positive, do they quarantine the room and disinfect it,
>

No longer quarantined AFAIK (which would make life difficult where locker
rooms are concerned!), but AFAIK rooms where people who tested positive for
covid have recently been in get an extra clean.

> and
> notify all the crew who might have been in contact to take time off
> until they've had <<whatever number>> of daily negative lateral flow
> tests?
>

Crew who have been in contact with other crews who then test positive, get
notified if they can be identified; at one time they stayed off work until
they received a negative PCR test (IIRC), but I'm not sure what the current
arrangements are, if any.

Anna Noyd-Dryver

Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:

>
> OTOH, I made three orders this week (not from Amazon, because I decided to
> avoid them whenever possible when they threatened to stop accepting
> payments using Visa cards).

Which didn't happen, in the end!

Anna Noyd-Dryver

Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> OTOH, I made three orders this week (not from Amazon, because I decided to
>> avoid them whenever possible when they threatened to stop accepting
>> payments using Visa cards).
>
> Which didn't happen, in the end!

I know, but they p****d me off, so I decided to find alternatives wherever
possible.

--
Jeremy Double