On 18/03/2022 10:23, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
> On Fri, 18 Mar 2022 10:15:07 +0000
> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>> On 18/03/2022 10:05, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>> On Thu, 17 Mar 2022 17:54:51 +0000
>>> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> On 17/03/2022 16:28, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>>> On Thu, 17 Mar 2022 16:24:29 +0000
>>>>> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>> On 17/03/2022 16:18, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>>>>>> Once the vehicle has an air system for one component you might as well
>> use
>>>>
>>>>>>>> it for other components where it makes life easier - on a bus that's
>>>>>>>> parking brake, doors, brakes, wipers and suspension. On a coach you can
>>>> add
>>>>>>>> luggage lockers, driver's seat and potentially the toilet module?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Lockers?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Modern coaches have remotely operated luggage doors.
>>>>>
>>>>> They do? News to me. Anyway, I thought he meant lockers inside the cabin.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> You don't strike me as the sort of person who travels by coach much :-)
>>>
>>> Coach , damn right. If I need to go long distance its either train or car.
>>> NE is strictly for skint students and cabbage pickers IMO.
>>>
>>>> The National Express coaches for London from Portsmouth stop near my
>>>> local Tescos and I've seen them boarding passengers. The driver presses
>>>> a button and the luggage doors open automagically.
>>>
>>> That could just be like a car boot though - it simply unlocks them and the
>>> struts push it up. I'd be surprised if they close automatically too.
>>>
>>
>> They do, driver presses the other button.
>
> Fair enough. Just sounds like something else to go wrong and delay the service
> though.
>
>

Seems to work for them. I'm surprised that Recliner hasn't popped up to
remark that various marks of Land Rover among others have powered tailgates.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

On Fri, 18 Mar 2022 14:46:36 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com
wrote:

>On Fri, 18 Mar 2022 06:18:16 -0700
>Nobody <jock@soccer.com> wrote:
>>On Fri, 18 Mar 2022 10:05:38 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com
>>wrote:
>>
>>>On Thu, 17 Mar 2022 17:54:51 +0000
>>>Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>On 17/03/2022 16:28, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>>> On Thu, 17 Mar 2022 16:24:29 +0000
>>>>> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>> On 17/03/2022 16:18, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>>>>>> Once the vehicle has an air system for one component you might as well
>>use
>>>>
>>>>>>>> it for other components where it makes life easier - on a bus that's
>>>>>>>> parking brake, doors, brakes, wipers and suspension. On a coach you can
>>>>add
>>>>>>>> luggage lockers, driver's seat and potentially the toilet module?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Lockers?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Modern coaches have remotely operated luggage doors.
>>>>>
>>>>> They do? News to me. Anyway, I thought he meant lockers inside the cabin.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>You don't strike me as the sort of person who travels by coach much :-)
>>>
>>>Coach , damn right. If I need to go long distance its either train or car.
>>>NE is strictly for skint students and cabbage pickers IMO.
>>
>>Ouch...
>>
>>As an occasional international visitor to the Ewe Kay, and at times
>>requiring single-stage transfers between airports (e.g.LGW-MAN and
>>reverse).... and direct door-to-door airport-to-hotel out-of-town (LHR
>>to Premier in Southampton) with luggage. NE has been a breeze.
>
>Thats up to you. For me they'd be the absolute last resort since they're
>considerably slower than a train and far less comfortable. Who TF wants to
>sit in a narrow seat in a traffic jam on the motorway where you can't even
>get up and walk around?

Well, I live near Stansted but as everyone knows it;s useless for
long-haul. Normally we get to Heathrow by train: Stansted Express, Vic
LIne, Picc Line, then an airport hotel ready for the morning. Probably
the hotel at T5 so we get to use the pod.
Last time we thought we'd try the NE coach. Got a cab to Stansted.
Coach was delayed at Thetford. So they put us on one from Cambridge.
It was fast, quite a bit quicker than the train, even though it was a
pre-pandemic PM peak on the M25, far less hassle than the train, far
cheaper than parking anywhere near LHR and above all relaxing and
comfortable.
In fact it's the best way between the airports, although Crossrail may
change that.

In message <7qcc3h1nfd7q28jtncu24o9p05lr99n4ms@4ax.com>, at 19:53:59 on
Sat, 19 Mar 2022, Ken <ken@birchanger.com> remarked:
>On Fri, 18 Mar 2022 14:46:36 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com
>wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 18 Mar 2022 06:18:16 -0700
>>Nobody <jock@soccer.com> wrote:
>>>On Fri, 18 Mar 2022 10:05:38 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Thu, 17 Mar 2022 17:54:51 +0000
>>>>Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>On 17/03/2022 16:28, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>>>> On Thu, 17 Mar 2022 16:24:29 +0000
>>>>>> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 17/03/2022 16:18, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Once the vehicle has an air system for one component you might as well
>>>use
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> it for other components where it makes life easier - on a bus that's
>>>>>>>>> parking brake, doors, brakes, wipers and suspension. On a
>>>>>>>>>coach you can
>>>>>add
>>>>>>>>> luggage lockers, driver's seat and potentially the toilet module?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Lockers?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Modern coaches have remotely operated luggage doors.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> They do? News to me. Anyway, I thought he meant lockers inside the cabin.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>You don't strike me as the sort of person who travels by coach much :-)
>>>>
>>>>Coach , damn right. If I need to go long distance its either train or car.
>>>>NE is strictly for skint students and cabbage pickers IMO.
>>>
>>>Ouch...
>>>
>>>As an occasional international visitor to the Ewe Kay, and at times
>>>requiring single-stage transfers between airports (e.g.LGW-MAN and
>>>reverse).... and direct door-to-door airport-to-hotel out-of-town (LHR
>>>to Premier in Southampton) with luggage. NE has been a breeze.
>>
>>Thats up to you. For me they'd be the absolute last resort since they're
>>considerably slower than a train and far less comfortable. Who TF wants to
>>sit in a narrow seat in a traffic jam on the motorway where you can't even
>>get up and walk around?
>
>Well, I live near Stansted but as everyone knows it;s useless for
>long-haul.

I wonder when it has ever been long haul (for pax). I've lost count now
of the number of attempts to set up transatlantic services, which then
failed (legacy airlines as well as entrepreneurial ones).

Without wanting to quibble about the definition of "long haul", versus
"medium haul", I wonder whether they ever had regular flights beyond
whatever one might call Europe.

I flew to Egypt (from Gatwick) with Easyjet, which was perhaps their
most far-flung destination ever.

>In fact it's the best way between the airports, although Crossrail may
>change that.

I've used Thameslink to get between Gatwick and Luton, on a triangular
trip with Easyjet. Not least because they let pax change free of charge
to an earlier flight [subject to availability of course] and counted all
their three London Airports as one for those purposes.
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> I wonder when it has ever been long haul (for pax). I've lost count now
> of the number of attempts to set up transatlantic services, which then
> failed (legacy airlines as well as entrepreneurial ones).
>
> Without wanting to quibble about the definition of "long haul", versus
> "medium haul", I wonder whether they ever had regular flights beyond
> whatever one might call Europe.
>
> I flew to Egypt (from Gatwick) with Easyjet, which was perhaps their
> most far-flung destination ever.

Emirates flies to Stansted. AirAsiaX did for a time from Kuala Lumpur,
although the original 2009 incarnation was with A340s, which didn't do much
for the economics. Then they switched to A330s, moved to Gatwick, moved
back to Stansted, and then cancelled it again. There's talk of them serving
London again via Stansted, but... A route like that is very sensitive to
the cost of fuel, so seems like they cancel it when the fuel price gets too
high (would be better with newer aircraft, but the airline isn't in great
shape after the pandemic and cancelled their A350 order).

Theo

On 20 Mar 2022 11:01:11 +0000 (GMT), Theo
<theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:

>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> I wonder when it has ever been long haul (for pax). I've lost count now
>> of the number of attempts to set up transatlantic services, which then
>> failed (legacy airlines as well as entrepreneurial ones).
>>
>> Without wanting to quibble about the definition of "long haul", versus
>> "medium haul", I wonder whether they ever had regular flights beyond
>> whatever one might call Europe.
>>
>> I flew to Egypt (from Gatwick) with Easyjet, which was perhaps their
>> most far-flung destination ever.
>
>Emirates flies to Stansted. AirAsiaX did for a time from Kuala Lumpur,
>although the original 2009 incarnation was with A340s, which didn't do much
>for the economics. Then they switched to A330s, moved to Gatwick, moved
>back to Stansted, and then cancelled it again. There's talk of them serving
>London again via Stansted, but... A route like that is very sensitive to
>the cost of fuel, so seems like they cancel it when the fuel price gets too
>high (would be better with newer aircraft, but the airline isn't in great
>shape after the pandemic and cancelled their A350 order).
>
For quite some time El Al had Stansted as a stop on its Tel Aviv - New
York service. You knew when it was due by the increase in visible
security.
>Theo

In message <dwE*DjCJy@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>, at 11:01:11 on Sun,
20 Mar 2022, Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> remarked:
>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> I wonder when it has ever been long haul (for pax). I've lost count now
>> of the number of attempts to set up transatlantic services, which then
>> failed (legacy airlines as well as entrepreneurial ones).
>>
>> Without wanting to quibble about the definition of "long haul", versus
>> "medium haul", I wonder whether they ever had regular flights beyond
>> whatever one might call Europe.
>>
>> I flew to Egypt (from Gatwick) with Easyjet, which was perhaps their
>> most far-flung destination ever.
>
>Emirates flies to Stansted.

That's a new one as far as I'm concerned.

Looking at a random day next week they only offer "Stansted area", which
is <drum roll> LHR.

When I was flying more than I am recently, Emirates served only Heathrow
and Birmingham. The latter just once a day I think, but had the
advantage of being exactly when it was most convenient for me.

>AirAsiaX did for a time from Kuala Lumpur, although the original 2009
>incarnation was with A340s, which didn't do much for the economics.
>Then they switched to A330s, moved to Gatwick, moved back to Stansted,
>and then cancelled it again.

That'll be filed under "failed", then.

>There's talk of them serving London again via Stansted, but... A route
>like that is very sensitive to the cost of fuel, so seems like they
>cancel it when the fuel price gets too high (would be better with newer
>aircraft, but the airline isn't in great shape after the pandemic and
>cancelled their A350 order).

--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <dwE*DjCJy@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>, at 11:01:11 on Sun,
> 20 Mar 2022, Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> remarked:
> >Emirates flies to Stansted.
>
> That's a new one as far as I'm concerned.
>
> Looking at a random day next week they only offer "Stansted area", which
> is <drum roll> LHR.

There's been a pandemic on, dontcha know. Flights restart 1 July.

> When I was flying more than I am recently, Emirates served only Heathrow
> and Birmingham. The latter just once a day I think, but had the
> advantage of being exactly when it was most convenient for me.

LHR, LGW, STN, BHX, MAN, GLA, EDI, NCL according to:
https://routemap.emirates.com/ae/english/

Theo

In message <awE*86CJy@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>, at 14:32:16 on Sun,
20 Mar 2022, Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> remarked:
>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <dwE*DjCJy@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>, at 11:01:11 on Sun,
>> 20 Mar 2022, Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> remarked:
>> >Emirates flies to Stansted.
>>
>> That's a new one as far as I'm concerned.
>>
>> Looking at a random day next week they only offer "Stansted area", which
>> is <drum roll> LHR.
>
>There's been a pandemic on, dontcha know. Flights restart 1 July.
>
>> When I was flying more than I am recently, Emirates served only Heathrow
>> and Birmingham. The latter just once a day I think, but had the
>> advantage of being exactly when it was most convenient for me.
>
>LHR, LGW, STN, BHX, MAN, GLA, EDI, NCL according to:
>https://routemap.emirates.com/ae/english/

This week, or are some of those suspended and resuming in the summer?
--
Roland Perry

On 2022-03-18 10:23:41 +0000, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com said:

> On Fri, 18 Mar 2022 10:15:07 +0000
> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>> On 18/03/2022 10:05, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>> On Thu, 17 Mar 2022 17:54:51 +0000
>>> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> On 17/03/2022 16:28, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>>> On Thu, 17 Mar 2022 16:24:29 +0000
>>>>> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>> On 17/03/2022 16:18, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>>>>>> Once the vehicle has an air system for one component you might as well
>> use
>>>>
>>>>>>>> it for other components where it makes life easier - on a bus that's
>>>>>>>> parking brake, doors, brakes, wipers and suspension. On a coach you can
>>>> add
>>>>>>>> luggage lockers, driver's seat and potentially the toilet module?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Lockers?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Modern coaches have remotely operated luggage doors.
>>>>>
>>>>> They do? News to me. Anyway, I thought he meant lockers inside the cabin.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> You don't strike me as the sort of person who travels by coach much :-)
>>>
>>> Coach , damn right. If I need to go long distance its either train or car.
>>> NE is strictly for skint students and cabbage pickers IMO.
>>>
>>>> The National Express coaches for London from Portsmouth stop near my
>>>> local Tescos and I've seen them boarding passengers. The driver presses
>>>> a button and the luggage doors open automagically.
>>>
>>> That could just be like a car boot though - it simply unlocks them and the
>>> struts push it up. I'd be surprised if they close automatically too.
>>>
>>
>> They do, driver presses the other button.
>
> Fair enough. Just sounds like something else to go wrong and delay the service
> though.

It's decades since I've been on a passenger coach with a manual
passenger door, tough they were once commonplace, so obviously the
ability to make reliable opening and closing mechanisms for coach doors
exists to the extent that the manual varieties that used to exist have
been discontinued.

Robin

On Mon, 21 Mar 2022 12:03:17 +0100
Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>On 2022-03-18 10:23:41 +0000, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com said:
>>> They do, driver presses the other button.
>>
>> Fair enough. Just sounds like something else to go wrong and delay the
>service
>> though.
>
>It's decades since I've been on a passenger coach with a manual
>passenger door, tough they were once commonplace, so obviously the
>ability to make reliable opening and closing mechanisms for coach doors
>exists to the extent that the manual varieties that used to exist have
>been discontinued.

We're not talking about a passenger door, we're talking about a luggage
compartment which has to raise a large door gullwing style god knows how
many times a day. The mechanism will be under far more stress than a door
that simply rotates or slides horizontally.

On 21/03/2022 15:45, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
> On Mon, 21 Mar 2022 12:03:17 +0100
> Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>> On 2022-03-18 10:23:41 +0000, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com said:
>>>> They do, driver presses the other button.
>>>
>>> Fair enough. Just sounds like something else to go wrong and delay the
>> service
>>> though.
>>
>> It's decades since I've been on a passenger coach with a manual
>> passenger door, tough they were once commonplace, so obviously the
>> ability to make reliable opening and closing mechanisms for coach doors
>> exists to the extent that the manual varieties that used to exist have
>> been discontinued.
>
> We're not talking about a passenger door, we're talking about a luggage
> compartment which has to raise a large door gullwing style god knows how
> many times a day. The mechanism will be under far more stress than a door
> that simply rotates or slides horizontally.
>
The one's I've seen are more plug doors than gullwing, only vertical
instead of horizontal.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> On 21/03/2022 15:45, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>> On Mon, 21 Mar 2022 12:03:17 +0100
>> Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>>> On 2022-03-18 10:23:41 +0000, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com said:
>>>>> They do, driver presses the other button.
>>>>
>>>> Fair enough. Just sounds like something else to go wrong and delay the
>>> service
>>>> though.
>>>
>>> It's decades since I've been on a passenger coach with a manual
>>> passenger door, tough they were once commonplace, so obviously the
>>> ability to make reliable opening and closing mechanisms for coach doors
>>> exists to the extent that the manual varieties that used to exist have
>>> been discontinued.
>>
>> We're not talking about a passenger door, we're talking about a luggage
>> compartment which has to raise a large door gullwing style god knows how
>> many times a day. The mechanism will be under far more stress than a door
>> that simply rotates or slides horizontally.
>>
> The one's I've seen are more plug doors than gullwing, only vertical
> instead of horizontal.

That seems to be a common design, a parallel movement of the door rather
than rotational. They probably open almost exactly the same number of
times as the passenger doors.

Sam

--
The entity formerly known as Sam.Wilson@ed.ac.uk
Spit the dummy to reply

Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> On 21/03/2022 15:45, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>> On Mon, 21 Mar 2022 12:03:17 +0100
>> Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>>> On 2022-03-18 10:23:41 +0000, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com said:
>>>>> They do, driver presses the other button.
>>>>
>>>> Fair enough. Just sounds like something else to go wrong and delay the
>>> service
>>>> though.
>>>
>>> It's decades since I've been on a passenger coach with a manual
>>> passenger door, tough they were once commonplace, so obviously the
>>> ability to make reliable opening and closing mechanisms for coach doors
>>> exists to the extent that the manual varieties that used to exist have
>>> been discontinued.
>>
>> We're not talking about a passenger door, we're talking about a luggage
>> compartment which has to raise a large door gullwing style god knows how
>> many times a day. The mechanism will be under far more stress than a door
>> that simply rotates or slides horizontally.
>>
> The one's I've seen are more plug doors than gullwing, only vertical
> instead of horizontal.
>

Yes, that's a good description, and they work well. I've been on lots of
coaches, all over the world, and the hold doors have always worked just
fine.

Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> wrote:
> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>> On 21/03/2022 15:45, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>> On Mon, 21 Mar 2022 12:03:17 +0100
>>> Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>>>> On 2022-03-18 10:23:41 +0000, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com said:
>>>>>> They do, driver presses the other button.
>>>>>
>>>>> Fair enough. Just sounds like something else to go wrong and delay the
>>>> service
>>>>> though.
>>>>
>>>> It's decades since I've been on a passenger coach with a manual
>>>> passenger door, tough they were once commonplace, so obviously the
>>>> ability to make reliable opening and closing mechanisms for coach doors
>>>> exists to the extent that the manual varieties that used to exist have
>>>> been discontinued.
>>>
>>> We're not talking about a passenger door, we're talking about a luggage
>>> compartment which has to raise a large door gullwing style god knows how
>>> many times a day. The mechanism will be under far more stress than a door
>>> that simply rotates or slides horizontally.
>>>
>> The one's I've seen are more plug doors than gullwing, only vertical
>> instead of horizontal.
>
> That seems to be a common design, a parallel movement of the door rather
> than rotational. They probably open almost exactly the same number of
> times as the passenger doors.
>

No, much less often. Coaches only carry bags in the hold on a minority of
trips.

On 21/03/2022 17:24, Recliner wrote:
> Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> wrote:
>> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>> On 21/03/2022 15:45, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 21 Mar 2022 12:03:17 +0100
>>>> Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>>>>> On 2022-03-18 10:23:41 +0000, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com said:
>>>>>>> They do, driver presses the other button.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Fair enough. Just sounds like something else to go wrong and delay the
>>>>> service
>>>>>> though.
>>>>>
>>>>> It's decades since I've been on a passenger coach with a manual
>>>>> passenger door, tough they were once commonplace, so obviously the
>>>>> ability to make reliable opening and closing mechanisms for coach doors
>>>>> exists to the extent that the manual varieties that used to exist have
>>>>> been discontinued.
>>>>
>>>> We're not talking about a passenger door, we're talking about a luggage
>>>> compartment which has to raise a large door gullwing style god knows how
>>>> many times a day. The mechanism will be under far more stress than a door
>>>> that simply rotates or slides horizontally.
>>>>
>>> The one's I've seen are more plug doors than gullwing, only vertical
>>> instead of horizontal.
>>
>> That seems to be a common design, a parallel movement of the door rather
>> than rotational. They probably open almost exactly the same number of
>> times as the passenger doors.
>>
>
> No, much less often. Coaches only carry bags in the hold on a minority of
> trips.

The driver checks in the passengers on the Reading Heathrow rail air
buses whilst another operative or two places the bags into the hold.
The operatives inform the driver when they've finished and the latter
remotely closes the hold doors.

<martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
> On 21/03/2022 17:24, Recliner wrote:
>> Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> wrote:
>>> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> On 21/03/2022 15:45, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, 21 Mar 2022 12:03:17 +0100
>>>>> Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On 2022-03-18 10:23:41 +0000, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com said:
>>>>>>>> They do, driver presses the other button.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Fair enough. Just sounds like something else to go wrong and delay the
>>>>>> service
>>>>>>> though.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's decades since I've been on a passenger coach with a manual
>>>>>> passenger door, tough they were once commonplace, so obviously the
>>>>>> ability to make reliable opening and closing mechanisms for coach doors
>>>>>> exists to the extent that the manual varieties that used to exist have
>>>>>> been discontinued.
>>>>>
>>>>> We're not talking about a passenger door, we're talking about a luggage
>>>>> compartment which has to raise a large door gullwing style god knows how
>>>>> many times a day. The mechanism will be under far more stress than a door
>>>>> that simply rotates or slides horizontally.
>>>>>
>>>> The one's I've seen are more plug doors than gullwing, only vertical
>>>> instead of horizontal.
>>>
>>> That seems to be a common design, a parallel movement of the door rather
>>> than rotational. They probably open almost exactly the same number of
>>> times as the passenger doors.
>>>
>>
>> No, much less often. Coaches only carry bags in the hold on a minority of
>> trips.
>
> The driver checks in the passengers on the Reading Heathrow rail air
> buses whilst another operative or two places the bags into the hold.
> The operatives inform the driver when they've finished and the latter
> remotely closes the hold doors.
>

Sure, but plenty of coaches operate day trips, when the hold isn't used, as
well as trips when passengers do have luggage. I've just returned from a
Spanish holiday like that.

On 21/03/2022 17:24, Recliner wrote:
> Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> wrote:
>> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>> On 21/03/2022 15:45, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 21 Mar 2022 12:03:17 +0100
>>>> Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>>>>> On 2022-03-18 10:23:41 +0000, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com said:
>>>>>>> They do, driver presses the other button.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Fair enough. Just sounds like something else to go wrong and delay the
>>>>> service
>>>>>> though.
>>>>>
>>>>> It's decades since I've been on a passenger coach with a manual
>>>>> passenger door, tough they were once commonplace, so obviously the
>>>>> ability to make reliable opening and closing mechanisms for coach doors
>>>>> exists to the extent that the manual varieties that used to exist have
>>>>> been discontinued.
>>>>
>>>> We're not talking about a passenger door, we're talking about a luggage
>>>> compartment which has to raise a large door gullwing style god knows how
>>>> many times a day. The mechanism will be under far more stress than a door
>>>> that simply rotates or slides horizontally.
>>>>
>>> The one's I've seen are more plug doors than gullwing, only vertical
>>> instead of horizontal.
>>
>> That seems to be a common design, a parallel movement of the door rather
>> than rotational. They probably open almost exactly the same number of
>> times as the passenger doors.
>>
>
> No, much less often. Coaches only carry bags in the hold on a minority of
> trips.
>
>

Depends on the coach, the NatEx ones probably carry luggage a greater
proportion of the time than a tour coach on a day trip from a cruise ship.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

On 21/03/2022 18:03, Graeme Wall wrote:
> On 21/03/2022 17:24, Recliner wrote:
>> Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> wrote:
>>> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> On 21/03/2022 15:45, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, 21 Mar 2022 12:03:17 +0100
>>>>> Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On 2022-03-18 10:23:41 +0000, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com said:
>>>>>>>> They do, driver presses the other button.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Fair enough. Just sounds like something else to go wrong and
>>>>>>> delay the
>>>>>> service
>>>>>>> though.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's decades since I've been on a passenger coach with a manual
>>>>>> passenger door, tough they were once commonplace, so obviously the
>>>>>> ability to make reliable opening and closing mechanisms for coach
>>>>>> doors
>>>>>> exists to the extent that the manual varieties that used to exist
>>>>>> have
>>>>>> been discontinued.
>>>>>
>>>>> We're not talking about a passenger door, we're talking about a
>>>>> luggage
>>>>> compartment which has to raise a large door gullwing style god
>>>>> knows how
>>>>> many times a day. The mechanism will be under far more stress than
>>>>> a door
>>>>> that simply rotates or slides horizontally.
>>>>>
>>>> The one's I've seen are more plug doors than gullwing, only vertical
>>>> instead of horizontal.
>>>
>>> That seems to be a common design, a parallel movement of the door rather
>>> than rotational.  They probably open almost exactly the same number of
>>> times as the passenger doors.
>>>
>>
>> No, much less often. Coaches only carry bags in the hold on a minority of
>> trips.
>>
>>
>
> Depends on the coach, the NatEx ones probably carry luggage a greater
> proportion of the time than a tour coach on a day trip from a cruise ship.
>
I've had so many horror journeys on fail replacement buses that my motto
is "if I cannot get there by train I don't go." Unless it's a NAT bus
or coach whose drivers dive impeccably.

Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> On 21/03/2022 17:24, Recliner wrote:
>> Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> wrote:
>>> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> On 21/03/2022 15:45, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, 21 Mar 2022 12:03:17 +0100
>>>>> Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On 2022-03-18 10:23:41 +0000, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com said:
>>>>>>>> They do, driver presses the other button.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Fair enough. Just sounds like something else to go wrong and delay the
>>>>>> service
>>>>>>> though.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's decades since I've been on a passenger coach with a manual
>>>>>> passenger door, tough they were once commonplace, so obviously the
>>>>>> ability to make reliable opening and closing mechanisms for coach doors
>>>>>> exists to the extent that the manual varieties that used to exist have
>>>>>> been discontinued.
>>>>>
>>>>> We're not talking about a passenger door, we're talking about a luggage
>>>>> compartment which has to raise a large door gullwing style god knows how
>>>>> many times a day. The mechanism will be under far more stress than a door
>>>>> that simply rotates or slides horizontally.
>>>>>
>>>> The one's I've seen are more plug doors than gullwing, only vertical
>>>> instead of horizontal.
>>>
>>> That seems to be a common design, a parallel movement of the door rather
>>> than rotational. They probably open almost exactly the same number of
>>> times as the passenger doors.
>>>
>>
>> No, much less often. Coaches only carry bags in the hold on a minority of
>> trips.
>>
>>
>
> Depends on the coach, the NatEx ones probably carry luggage a greater
> proportion of the time than a tour coach on a day trip from a cruise ship.
>

Yes, I was talking about general purpose coaches, rather than dedicated
long distance express coaches.

On 21/03/2022 21:54, Recliner wrote:
> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>> On 21/03/2022 17:24, Recliner wrote:
>>> Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> On 21/03/2022 15:45, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>>>> On Mon, 21 Mar 2022 12:03:17 +0100
>>>>>> Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2022-03-18 10:23:41 +0000, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com said:
>>>>>>>>> They do, driver presses the other button.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Fair enough. Just sounds like something else to go wrong and delay the
>>>>>>> service
>>>>>>>> though.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It's decades since I've been on a passenger coach with a manual
>>>>>>> passenger door, tough they were once commonplace, so obviously the
>>>>>>> ability to make reliable opening and closing mechanisms for coach doors
>>>>>>> exists to the extent that the manual varieties that used to exist have
>>>>>>> been discontinued.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We're not talking about a passenger door, we're talking about a luggage
>>>>>> compartment which has to raise a large door gullwing style god knows how
>>>>>> many times a day. The mechanism will be under far more stress than a door
>>>>>> that simply rotates or slides horizontally.
>>>>>>
>>>>> The one's I've seen are more plug doors than gullwing, only vertical
>>>>> instead of horizontal.
>>>>
>>>> That seems to be a common design, a parallel movement of the door rather
>>>> than rotational. They probably open almost exactly the same number of
>>>> times as the passenger doors.
>>>>
>>>
>>> No, much less often. Coaches only carry bags in the hold on a minority of
>>> trips.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Depends on the coach, the NatEx ones probably carry luggage a greater
>> proportion of the time than a tour coach on a day trip from a cruise ship.
>>
>
> Yes, I was talking about general purpose coaches, rather than dedicated
> long distance express coaches.
>

Whereas I was talking about Nat Ex coaches.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

<Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
> On Mon, 21 Mar 2022 12:03:17 +0100
> Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>> On 2022-03-18 10:23:41 +0000, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com said:
>>>> They do, driver presses the other button.
>>>
>>> Fair enough. Just sounds like something else to go wrong and delay the
>> service
>>> though.
>>
>> It's decades since I've been on a passenger coach with a manual
>> passenger door, tough they were once commonplace, so obviously the
>> ability to make reliable opening and closing mechanisms for coach doors
>> exists to the extent that the manual varieties that used to exist have
>> been discontinued.
>
> We're not talking about a passenger door, we're talking about a luggage
> compartment which has to raise a large door gullwing style god knows how
> many times a day. The mechanism will be under far more stress than a door
> that simply rotates or slides horizontally.
>
>

And yet, every modern coach has them. How strange.

Anna Noyd-Dryver

Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> wrote:
> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>> On 21/03/2022 15:45, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>> On Mon, 21 Mar 2022 12:03:17 +0100
>>> Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>>>> On 2022-03-18 10:23:41 +0000, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com said:
>>>>>> They do, driver presses the other button.
>>>>>
>>>>> Fair enough. Just sounds like something else to go wrong and delay the
>>>> service
>>>>> though.
>>>>
>>>> It's decades since I've been on a passenger coach with a manual
>>>> passenger door, tough they were once commonplace, so obviously the
>>>> ability to make reliable opening and closing mechanisms for coach doors
>>>> exists to the extent that the manual varieties that used to exist have
>>>> been discontinued.
>>>
>>> We're not talking about a passenger door, we're talking about a luggage
>>> compartment which has to raise a large door gullwing style god knows how
>>> many times a day. The mechanism will be under far more stress than a door
>>> that simply rotates or slides horizontally.
>>>
>> The one's I've seen are more plug doors than gullwing, only vertical
>> instead of horizontal.
>
> That seems to be a common design, a parallel movement of the door rather
> than rotational. They probably open almost exactly the same number of
> times as the passenger doors.
>
>

Probably fewer, depending on the use the coach is put to. For example, an
NX service, or airport to many hotels transfer, yes every time. A multiple
day coach trip staying in a different hotel every night, perhaps half the
time. Day trip, or the majority of coach hires (eg school day trips, school
to swimming pool etc), none.

Anna Noyd-Dryver

<martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
> On 21/03/2022 17:24, Recliner wrote:
>> Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> wrote:
>>> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> On 21/03/2022 15:45, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, 21 Mar 2022 12:03:17 +0100
>>>>> Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On 2022-03-18 10:23:41 +0000, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com said:
>>>>>>>> They do, driver presses the other button.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Fair enough. Just sounds like something else to go wrong and delay the
>>>>>> service
>>>>>>> though.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's decades since I've been on a passenger coach with a manual
>>>>>> passenger door, tough they were once commonplace, so obviously the
>>>>>> ability to make reliable opening and closing mechanisms for coach doors
>>>>>> exists to the extent that the manual varieties that used to exist have
>>>>>> been discontinued.
>>>>>
>>>>> We're not talking about a passenger door, we're talking about a luggage
>>>>> compartment which has to raise a large door gullwing style god knows how
>>>>> many times a day. The mechanism will be under far more stress than a door
>>>>> that simply rotates or slides horizontally.
>>>>>
>>>> The one's I've seen are more plug doors than gullwing, only vertical
>>>> instead of horizontal.
>>>
>>> That seems to be a common design, a parallel movement of the door rather
>>> than rotational. They probably open almost exactly the same number of
>>> times as the passenger doors.
>>>
>>
>> No, much less often. Coaches only carry bags in the hold on a minority of
>> trips.
>
> The driver checks in the passengers on the Reading Heathrow rail air
> buses whilst another operative or two places the bags into the hold.
> The operatives inform the driver when they've finished and the latter
> remotely closes the hold doors.
>
>

On a trip like that the luggage hatches will operate often. On many other
uses which coaches get put to, far less frequently.

Anna Noyd-Dryver

On Tue, 22 Mar 2022 10:57:20 -0000 (UTC)
Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
><Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>> On Mon, 21 Mar 2022 12:03:17 +0100
>> Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>>> On 2022-03-18 10:23:41 +0000, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com said:
>>>>> They do, driver presses the other button.
>>>>
>>>> Fair enough. Just sounds like something else to go wrong and delay the
>>> service
>>>> though.
>>>
>>> It's decades since I've been on a passenger coach with a manual
>>> passenger door, tough they were once commonplace, so obviously the
>>> ability to make reliable opening and closing mechanisms for coach doors
>>> exists to the extent that the manual varieties that used to exist have
>>> been discontinued.
>>
>> We're not talking about a passenger door, we're talking about a luggage
>> compartment which has to raise a large door gullwing style god knows how
>> many times a day. The mechanism will be under far more stress than a door
>> that simply rotates or slides horizontally.
>>
>>
>
>And yet, every modern coach has them. How strange.

Well its good to know that ubiquity means reliability.

On Tue, 22 Mar 2022 16:08:29 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:

>On Tue, 22 Mar 2022 10:57:20 -0000 (UTC)
>Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
>><Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>>> On Mon, 21 Mar 2022 12:03:17 +0100
>>> Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>>>> On 2022-03-18 10:23:41 +0000, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com said:
>>>>>> They do, driver presses the other button.
>>>>>
>>>>> Fair enough. Just sounds like something else to go wrong and delay the
>>>> service
>>>>> though.
>>>>
>>>> It's decades since I've been on a passenger coach with a manual
>>>> passenger door, tough they were once commonplace, so obviously the
>>>> ability to make reliable opening and closing mechanisms for coach doors
>>>> exists to the extent that the manual varieties that used to exist have
>>>> been discontinued.
>>>
>>> We're not talking about a passenger door, we're talking about a luggage
>>> compartment which has to raise a large door gullwing style god knows how
>>> many times a day. The mechanism will be under far more stress than a door
>>> that simply rotates or slides horizontally.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>And yet, every modern coach has them. How strange.
>
>Well its good to know that ubiquity means reliability.

They use a simple mechanism, which works reliably. They're much simpler than train doors.