JNugent wrote:

> The mere prospect of a sale should be enough to steer Bernie E

who he?

> towards Sky Sports, Netflix or Amazon.

Sky seem to have live F1 exclusives in most of europe, with local broadcaster
getting their own country's local race

On 15/12/2021 14:45, JNugent wrote:
>
> PS: remember when C4 started, and Jeremy & co announced that it would
> not show any sports?

No, your memory is very faulty. C4 from the very outset showed sports,
sports that BBC and ITV had ignored.
Notably American Football.

Although in 1983 ITV persuaded the IBA to let them palm Horse Racing off
onto them on weekdays, (but it only displaced the test card anyway).

On 15/12/2021 02:51 pm, Andy Burns wrote:

> JNugent wrote:
>
>> The mere prospect of a sale should be enough to steer Bernie E
>
> who he?

Ecclestone?

The one who gave a million pounds to the Labour Party and was exempted
from a tobacco advertising ban. I'm sure there was no connection between
those two things. Oh no, not at all.

He's the one who owns F1, isn't he?

Ah... the internet says "no". He was replaced in 2017.

Well... it was close enough.

>> towards Sky Sports, Netflix or Amazon.
>
> Sky seem to have live F1 exclusives in most of europe, with local
> broadcaster getting their own country's local race

On 15/12/2021 03:07 pm, Mark Carver wrote:

> On 15/12/2021 14:45, JNugent wrote:
>
>> PS: remember when C4 started, and Jeremy & co announced that it would
>> not show any sports?
>
> No, your memory is very faulty. C4 from the very outset showed sports,
> sports that BBC and ITV had ignored.
> Notably American Football.

When did that start? It wasn't in 1982 - was it?

[Fancy "ignoring" American football!]

> Although in 1983 ITV persuaded the IBA to let them palm Horse Racing off
> onto them on weekdays, (but it only displaced the test card anyway).

That was when the ITV companies still had a certain amount of control
over C4, wasn't it?

On 15/12/2021 15:49, JNugent wrote:
> On 15/12/2021 03:07 pm, Mark Carver wrote:
>
>> On 15/12/2021 14:45, JNugent wrote:
>>
>>> PS: remember when C4 started, and Jeremy & co announced that it
>>> would not show any sports?
>>
>> No, your memory is very faulty. C4 from the very outset showed
>> sports, sports that BBC and ITV had ignored.
>> Notably American Football.
>
> When did that start? It wasn't in 1982 - was it?

Nov 2nd 1982
>
> [Fancy "ignoring" American football!]
>
>> Although in 1983 ITV persuaded the IBA to let them palm Horse Racing
>> off onto them on weekdays, (but it only displaced the test card anyway).
>
> That was when the ITV companies still had a certain amount of control
> over C4, wasn't it?

They had to finance C4 from their own pockets. In exchange for that,
they sold and transmitted the ads on C4 in their own regions.
That arrangement lasted until Jan 1993, and in effect it made the
channel  'ITV 2' in all but name (However, still with the IBA waving
their stick)

On 15/12/2021 04:29 pm, Mark Carver wrote:

> On 15/12/2021 15:49, JNugent wrote:
>> On 15/12/2021 03:07 pm, Mark Carver wrote:
>>> On 15/12/2021 14:45, JNugent wrote:
>
>>>> PS: remember when C4 started, and Jeremy & co announced that it
>>>> would not show any sports?
>
>>> No, your memory is very faulty. C4 from the very outset showed
>>> sports, sports that BBC and ITV had ignored.
>>> Notably American Football.
>>
>> When did that start? It wasn't in 1982 - was it?

> Nov 2nd 1982

That was certainly the date that Four started transmissions.

When did they start their American football relays?

>> [Fancy "ignoring" American football!]
>
>>> Although in 1983 ITV persuaded the IBA to let them palm Horse Racing
>>> off onto them on weekdays, (but it only displaced the test card anyway).
>
>> That was when the ITV companies still had a certain amount of control
>> over C4, wasn't it?
>
> They had to finance C4 from their own pockets. In exchange for that,
> they sold and transmitted the ads on C4 in their own regions.
> That arrangement lasted until Jan 1993, and in effect it made the
> channel  'ITV 2' in all but name (However, still with the IBA waving
> their stick)

On 15/12/2021 16:36, JNugent wrote:
> That was certainly the date that Four started transmissions.
>
> When did they start their American football relays?

It was the first weekend that month (Nov 6/7th) I think, but certainly
they started at some point in Nov 1982

The main 'feature' of F1 racing that I've been aware of in recent years has
been the reports wrt the main British driver has been described as
arranging his income and weath to dodge UK tax. Yet gets presented as the
'British' driver to admire.

Maybe the TV presenters do much the same, and see this as part of being
'British'. The ultra-wealthy do seem to treat tax-dodging as a 'sport'. or
'race' to see who can get the most money out of sight as fast as possible.
8-]

Jim

In article <spchl2$3ve$1@dont-email.me>, Brian Gaff \(Sofa\)
<briang1@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:
> Yes I'm waiting for F1 drone racing as we speak, or how about submarine
> racing? Brian

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics https://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scots_Guide/intro/electron.htm
biog http://jcgl.orpheusweb.co.uk/history/ups_and_downs.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

On 15/12/2021 04:49 pm, Mark Carver wrote:

> On 15/12/2021 16:36, JNugent wrote:

>> That was certainly the date that Four started transmissions.
>> When did they start their American football relays?
>
> It was the first weekend that month (Nov 6/7th) I think, but certainly
> they started at some point in Nov 1982

Really?

I am sure that my memory of Mr Isaacs declaring that there would be no
sport on Four is not a faulty one.

In article <j1uo6iFq0doU1@mid.individual.net>,
JNugent <jennings&co@fastmail.fm> wrote:
> On 15/12/2021 04:49 pm, Mark Carver wrote:

> > On 15/12/2021 16:36, JNugent wrote:

> >> That was certainly the date that Four started transmissions.
> >> When did they start their American football relays?
> >
> > It was the first weekend that month (Nov 6/7th) I think, but certainly
> > they started at some point in Nov 1982

> Really?

> I am sure that my memory of Mr Isaacs declaring that there would be no
> sport on Four is not a faulty one.

perhaps American Football isn't a sport?

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

On 15/12/2021 17:50, JNugent wrote:
> On 15/12/2021 04:49 pm, Mark Carver wrote:
>
>> On 15/12/2021 16:36, JNugent wrote:
>
>>> That was certainly the date that Four started transmissions.
>>> When did they start their American football relays?
>>
>> It was the first weekend that month (Nov 6/7th) I think, but
>> certainly they started at some point in Nov 1982
>
> Really?
>
> I am sure that my memory of Mr Isaacs declaring that there would be no
> sport on Four is not a faulty one.

10 seconds worth of ceaseless surfing brings up this :-

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_sport_on_Channel_4

On 15/12/2021 12:00, Jim Lesurf wrote:
> The main 'feature' of F1 racing that I've been aware of in recent years has
> been the reports wrt the main British driver has been described as
> arranging his income and weath to dodge UK tax. Yet gets presented as the
> 'British' driver to admire.
>
> Maybe the TV presenters do much the same, and see this as part of being
> 'British'. The ultra-wealthy do seem to treat tax-dodging as a 'sport'. or
> 'race' to see who can get the most money out of sight as fast as possible.
> 8-]

Nothing wrong with any of that. We all sell our labour to the highest
bidder. At least that's what those of us with any sense do. I think it's
strange that in a capitalist society some people think that individuals
should display philanthropy by voluntarily missing out on opportunities
to amass capital. There's nothing clever or moral about leaving yourself
short.

If I excelled at anything to the extent that I could corner a market I'd
exploit the situation to the max. Then I'd have the option of
philanthropic giving according to my own judgement.

Bill

On Wed, 15 Dec 2021 14:51:46 +0000, Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> wrote:

>JNugent wrote:
>
>> The mere prospect of a sale should be enough to steer Bernie E
>
>who he?
>
>> towards Sky Sports, Netflix or Amazon.
>
>Sky seem to have live F1 exclusives in most of europe, with local broadcaster
>getting their own country's local race

All F1 races are shown live in both The Netherlands and Germany by local
broadcasters.
--

Martin in Zuid Holland

On Wed, 15 Dec 2021 13:57:30 +0000, Mark Carver <mark.carver@invalid.invalid>
wrote:

>On 15/12/2021 13:39, Martin wrote:
>> On Tue, 14 Dec 2021 11:32:33 +0000, alan_m <junk@admac.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> On 14/12/2021 09:39, Martin wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 12 Dec 2021 13:17:46 +0000, Jeff Layman <jmlayman@invalid.invalid>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> For anyone interested, C4 are showing the final GP live. It's on now.
>>>> Channel 4 will show all F1 live in future.
>>>
>>> Only if they pay enough.
>> In The Netherlands next year not only will the biggest cable company, Ziggo,
>> provide full F1 coverage at no extra cost as they did this year, but public
>> service broadcaster NOS will too. Are the Dutch getting a bargain or is somebody
>> UK exaggerating the cost?
>According to this only Ziggo hold the NL rights.

>
>https://www.sportingfree.com/f1/formula-1-tv-channels-list/

That is only for 2021. is part of the basic Ziggo package

>
>Have you got a link to the NOS deal, if they have live FTA coverage, why
>would anybody watch on Ziggo  ?

NOS are doing Zandvoort F! live and summaries of the rest; similar to Channel 4
with British F1. Ziggo are doing all races. I can't explain why NOS are doing
this.

https://www.streamwijzer.nl/nos-f1-zandvoort-2022/
https://www.ziggo.nl/entertainment/sport/formule-1/formule-1-kalender
--

Martin in Zuid Holland

Martin wrote:

> Andy Burns wrote:
>
>> Sky seem to have live F1 exclusives in most of europe, with local broadcaster
>> getting their own country's local race
>
> All F1 races are shown live in both The Netherlands and Germany by local
> broadcasters.

The German RTL used to show all F1 races live on FTA satellite (19E2), but in SD
only, it was supposed to stop last year, except I think Sky threw them a few
crumbs this year.

On 15/12/2021 13:59, MB wrote:
> We were issued with jackets at work with company name held by Velcro so
> it was easy to change each they changed the company name.

Velcro is good if you have a need to change your reg plates frequently.

Bill

On 15/12/2021 16:36, JNugent wrote:
>> Nov 2nd 1982
>
> That was certainly the date that Four started transmissions.

C4 transmitted a test card on ch41 from Emley Moor for a year. The
modulators in VCRs mostly covered that channel, and it was surprising
how many of them used it. A bit chaotic when the test card started.

During that year the guy who had the contract to service the communal TV
systems for one of the local councils went round fitting notch filters
at the head-ends to kill ch41. When programmes started and tenants
complained of poor or no reception of the new channel he charged £15 PER
DWELLING to 'add equipment to enable reception of Channel Four'. Not
bad, £15 x 14 per 14 block, £15 x 60 per 60 block, etc.

Bill

On 16/12/2021 01:49 pm, williamwright wrote:

> On 15/12/2021 16:36, JNugent wrote:

>>> Nov 2nd 1982
>
>> That was certainly the date that Four started transmissions.
>
> C4 transmitted a test card on ch41 from Emley Moor for a year. The
> modulators in VCRs mostly covered that channel, and it was surprising
> how many of them used it. A bit chaotic when the test card started.
>
> During that year the guy who had the contract to service the communal TV
> systems for one of the local councils went round fitting notch filters
> at the head-ends to kill ch41. When programmes started and tenants
> complained of poor or no reception of the new channel he charged £15 PER
> DWELLING to 'add equipment to enable reception of Channel Four'. Not
> bad, £15 x 14 per 14 block, £15 x 60 per 60 block, etc.

I hadn't heard that, though I remember it as a potential problem for
Channel 5 in the run-up to launch. IIRC, Thames Television, recently
having lost their London franchise, decided not to bid for the fifth
channel simply because of the (as it turns out, over-rated) estimates of
cost of efforts to retune VCRs.

Where I lived in south Lancs, I could get a picture (of sorts) from
Elmley Moor. It was a bit snowy, so I concluded that from my location,
it was almost, but not quite, in a straight line behind Winter Hill. But
YTV was quite watchable - handy when they were showing a different film
from the one shown by Granada.

When the first Videostar machine arrived in 1979, there was no problem
with tuning to its output frequency, though Channel 6 on the TV was less
than ideal - the top of a picture used to breakaway to the left, as
though there was interference. That was cured when I changed the TV and
the last numbered channel was tailored for VCR (with undistorted images).

Everything was rented in those days. The VCR cost £19.95 a month.
Equivalent to about £109 in 2021!

And E180 tapes were £18.95 each (equalling about £103 today). I never
bought any at that price. Trident sold them at £10.95.

On 16/12/2021 13:49, williamwright wrote:
> On 15/12/2021 16:36, JNugent wrote:
>>> Nov 2nd 1982
>>
>> That was certainly the date that Four started transmissions.
>
> C4 transmitted a test card on ch41 from Emley Moor for a year. The
> modulators in VCRs mostly covered that channel, and it was surprising
> how many of them used it. A bit chaotic when the test card started.

Also, I gather NRK in Norway contacted the IBA, because it was causing
CCI on the input feed to one of their relays.

On 16/12/2021 11:40, Martin wrote:
>>> In The Netherlands next year not only will the biggest cable company, Ziggo,
>>> provide full F1 coverage at no extra cost as they did this year, but public
>>> service broadcaster NOS will too. Are the Dutch getting a bargain or is somebody
>>> UK exaggerating the cost?
>>
>> Have you got a link to the NOS deal, if they have live FTA coverage, why
>> would anybody watch on Ziggo  ?
>
> NOS are doing Zandvoort F! live and summaries of the rest; similar to Channel 4
> with British F1. Ziggo are doing all races. I can't explain why NOS are doing
> this.
>
Well, that makes far more sense, but I was questioning your original
assertion (made in your post yesterday (15/12/21  13:39 GMT) that NOS
are providing live coverage of ALL F1 races ?

In article <j20kqbF6eqlU1@mid.individual.net>, williamwright
<wrightsaerials@f2s.com> wrote:
> On 15/12/2021 12:00, Jim Lesurf wrote:
> > The main 'feature' of F1 racing that I've been aware of in recent
> > years has been the reports wrt the main British driver has been
> > described as arranging his income and weath to dodge UK tax. Yet gets
> > presented as the 'British' driver to admire.
> >
> > Maybe the TV presenters do much the same, and see this as part of
> > being 'British'. The ultra-wealthy do seem to treat tax-dodging as a
> > 'sport'. or 'race' to see who can get the most money out of sight as
> > fast as possible. 8-]

> Nothing wrong with any of that.

Not if *you're* happy to pay the loss of income for the 'levelling up',
etc, that Tax is used for.

But it seems odd to play up how wonderful they are for 'Britain.

> We all sell our labour to the highest bidder. At least that's what those
> of us with any sense do. I think it's strange that in a capitalist
> society some people think that individuals should display philanthropy
> by voluntarily missing out on opportunities to amass capital. There's
> nothing clever or moral about leaving yourself short.

> If I excelled at anything to the extent that I could corner a market I'd
> exploit the situation to the max. Then I'd have the option of
> philanthropic giving according to my own judgement.

> Bill

I'm sure many drug dealers would agree with you.

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics https://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scots_Guide/intro/electron.htm
biog http://jcgl.orpheusweb.co.uk/history/ups_and_downs.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

On 16/12/2021 16:56, Mark Carver wrote:
> On 16/12/2021 13:49, williamwright wrote:
>> On 15/12/2021 16:36, JNugent wrote:
>>>> Nov 2nd 1982
>>>
>>> That was certainly the date that Four started transmissions.
>>
>> C4 transmitted a test card on ch41 from Emley Moor for a year. The
>> modulators in VCRs mostly covered that channel, and it was surprising
>> how many of them used it. A bit chaotic when the test card started.
>
> Also, I gather NRK in Norway contacted the IBA, because it was causing
> CCI on the input feed to one of their relays.

Yes and that was when the ERP was reduced. Until then it was about 3dB
above the other three, and at the time I was nursing some small systems
that really needed replacement. The extra bit of signal and extra
channel were enough to cause cross-mod because the amps were running
flat out (because the early 1960s networks were very lossy). I had to
reduce the gain which was the last thing you'd want to do on those
systems. Thing is, they were only 14-blocks and the cost of channel
filters was disproportionate since the systems were going to be replaced
anyway when the money became available.

What made it worse was that some of these systems had old Jaybeam
aerials that happened to have a gain curve more-or-less centred on ch41!

Mind you the Norwegians were always a mardy lot. Didn't they have a moan
about Bilsdale at one point?

Bill

On 16/12/2021 17:33, Jim Lesurf wrote:
> Not if*you're* happy to pay the loss of income for the 'levelling up',
> etc, that Tax is used for.

It doesn't matter whether I'm happy or not to the rich guy who's being
tax efficient. It's a characteristic of the left to regard personal
morality as being more important than simple compliance to the tax laws.
If it's wrong what the rich kids do, the law should be changed.

Bill

On 17/12/2021 05:33, williamwright wrote:
>
> Mind you the Norwegians were always a mardy lot. Didn't they have a
> moan about Bilsdale at one point?
>
>
Quite possibly, but then so did Yorkshire TV !

On 17/12/2021 08:07, Mark Carver wrote:
> On 17/12/2021 05:33, williamwright wrote:
>>
>> Mind you the Norwegians were always a mardy lot. Didn't they have a
>> moan about Bilsdale at one point?
>>
>>
> Quite possibly, but then so did Yorkshire TV !
>
>
Yes of course!

Bill