On Thu, 7 Jul 2022 22:46:58 +0100
tony sayer <tony@bancom.co.uk> wrote:
>In article <ta702h$1fsb$1@gioia.aioe.org>, Muttley@dastardlyhq.com
>scribeth thus
>>On Thu, 7 Jul 2022 14:12:19 -0000 (UTC)
>>Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
>>><Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>>>>> How do you think ETCS and CBTC data is transmitted to the moving train?
>>>>
>>>> Well I mentioned radio waves but I guess you think its magic?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>You said that the changeover should be done while stationary because radio
>>>waves couldn't possibly be reliably transmitted to a moving train in a
>>>tunnel; but the entire signalling system for ETCS already relies on radio
>>>waves being continuously transmitted to moving trains, whether in tunnels
>>>or not. So I can't see why you think that would affect changeover on the
>>>move, which isn't done in tunnels anyway (on the EL).
>>
>>There will always be issues with radio signals in tunnels with signal
>>reflections and spots with a lower signal strength. Thats fine if you're
>>already connected to one system since if you miss a packet you retransmit
>>or wait a bit. If however you're on a train doing ~50mph with a changeover
>>window of probably seconds you don't have that luxury especially since the
>>data exchange of logging on to a new system will probably be more complex
>>than the standard "I'm here doing X mph" and missed packets could mean a
>>failed connection will mean a train doing an emergency stop.
>>
>>This is almost certainly one of the reasons why they've had so many issues
>>trying to implement this.
>>
>
>Its not rocket science a cable called RADAIX is run thru the tunnel it
>leaks a controlled amount of signal for transmission and reception.
>
>Its also used in buildings put in vertical risers to provide adequate
>signal field level signals...
>
>
>Reflections shouldn't be a problem with modulation systems such as
>OFDM..

No modulation system is immune to that sort of problem. Some just handle it
better than others.

<Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
> On Thu, 7 Jul 2022 20:13:07 -0000 (UTC)
> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> <Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>>> Fair enough. Point about it being a complex operation still stands and if
>>> they're having those issues outside it rather highlights it.
>>
>> The Met line currently runs on two different signalling systems, apparently
>> without problems.
>
> Last time I checked tripcocks don't require a software handover to start
> working.
>

But the CBTC section does. Admittedly the changeovers there are always done
in a station.

Anna Noyd-Dryver

On Fri, 8 Jul 2022 12:14:40 -0000 (UTC)
Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
><Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>> On Thu, 7 Jul 2022 20:13:07 -0000 (UTC)
>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> <Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>>>> Fair enough. Point about it being a complex operation still stands and if
>>>> they're having those issues outside it rather highlights it.
>>>
>>> The Met line currently runs on two different signalling systems, apparently
>>> without problems.
>>
>> Last time I checked tripcocks don't require a software handover to start
>> working.
>>
>
>But the CBTC section does. Admittedly the changeovers there are always done
>in a station.

On a tangential note, why isn't national rail using CBTC instead of ETCS as
the former seems rather better specced?

<Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 8 Jul 2022 12:14:40 -0000 (UTC)
> Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
>> <Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>>> On Thu, 7 Jul 2022 20:13:07 -0000 (UTC)
>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> <Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>>>>> Fair enough. Point about it being a complex operation still stands and if
>>>>> they're having those issues outside it rather highlights it.
>>>>
>>>> The Met line currently runs on two different signalling systems, apparently
>>>> without problems.
>>>
>>> Last time I checked tripcocks don't require a software handover to start
>>> working.
>>>
>>
>> But the CBTC section does. Admittedly the changeovers there are always done
>> in a station.
>
> On a tangential note, why isn't national rail using CBTC instead of ETCS as
> the former seems rather better specced?
>

CBTC is more than a signalling system. It's a proprietary system for high
intensity metro services, often incorporating ATO. In time, the more
standardised ETCS and ERTMS might offer the same performance and supersede
the various proprietary CBTC systems. But the standard systems weren't yet
able to offer what Crossrail needed at the time that a system had to be
chosen (particularly considering the target 2018 opening date).

See
<https://www.railwaysignalling.eu/cbtc-standardization-mixed-operation-on-shared-lines-in-accordance-with-ertmsetcs-standards>

<Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 8 Jul 2022 12:14:40 -0000 (UTC)
> Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
>> <Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>>> On Thu, 7 Jul 2022 20:13:07 -0000 (UTC)
>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> <Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>>>>> Fair enough. Point about it being a complex operation still stands and if
>>>>> they're having those issues outside it rather highlights it.
>>>>
>>>> The Met line currently runs on two different signalling systems, apparently
>>>> without problems.
>>>
>>> Last time I checked tripcocks don't require a software handover to start
>>> working.
>>>
>>
>> But the CBTC section does. Admittedly the changeovers there are always done
>> in a station.
>
> On a tangential note, why isn't national rail using CBTC instead of ETCS as
> the former seems rather better specced?
>
>

Several reasons, not least that the first two installations in this country
predate Brexit, and changing the project to a different product just
because we're no longer in the EU would probably have been seen as a waste
of money.

Secondly, I can only find evidence of CBTC being used on metro systems;
whereas ETCS can do metro, high speed, rural, and mixed-traffic lines.

Thirdly, as far as I can tell from what I can find online, CBTC appears to
be quite a generic term, with several different companies offering their
own CBTC systems. Are these systems compatible with each other, or would we
have to commit to one supplier's system for the whole country? ETCS on the
other hand is a specification which all manufacturers build their kit to,
and it's theoretically all compatible.

Anna Noyd-Dryver

On Fri, 8 Jul 2022 22:15:24 -0000 (UTC)
Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
><Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>> On a tangential note, why isn't national rail using CBTC instead of ETCS as
>> the former seems rather better specced?
>>
>>
>
>Several reasons, not least that the first two installations in this country
>predate Brexit, and changing the project to a different product just
>because we're no longer in the EU would probably have been seen as a waste
>of money.
>
>Secondly, I can only find evidence of CBTC being used on metro systems;
>whereas ETCS can do metro, high speed, rural, and mixed-traffic lines.

I imagine if a system can cope with metro level of services its not going
to have an issue with a few pacers a day or the odd freight train trundling
along the line. Unless varying train lengths might be an issue.

>have to commit to one supplier's system for the whole country? ETCS on the
>other hand is a specification which all manufacturers build their kit to,
>and it's theoretically all compatible.

Fair point.

<Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 8 Jul 2022 22:15:24 -0000 (UTC)
> Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
>> <Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>>> On a tangential note, why isn't national rail using CBTC instead of ETCS as
>>> the former seems rather better specced?
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Several reasons, not least that the first two installations in this country
>> predate Brexit, and changing the project to a different product just
>> because we're no longer in the EU would probably have been seen as a waste
>> of money.
>>
>> Secondly, I can only find evidence of CBTC being used on metro systems;
>> whereas ETCS can do metro, high speed, rural, and mixed-traffic lines.
>
> I imagine if a system can cope with metro level of services its not going
> to have an issue with a few pacers a day or the odd freight train trundling
> along the line. Unless varying train lengths might be an issue.

CBTC systems are proprietary, fitted to individual high frequency Metro
lines running standard trains. They are not intended for widespread use.

>
>> have to commit to one supplier's system for the whole country? ETCS on the
>> other hand is a specification which all manufacturers build their kit to,
>> and it's theoretically all compatible.
>
> Fair point.
>
>

In message <ta8sr0$mb31$2@dont-email.me>, at 09:19:28 on Fri, 8 Jul
2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <ta3kqv$fdt$2@dont-email.me>, at 09:32:15 on Wed, 6 Jul 2022,
>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> In message <t9n5h8$2a41r$2@dont-email.me>, at 15:57:28 on Fri, 1 Jul
>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>
>>>>>>>> "BARBICAN STATION: From Tuesday 24 May, step-free access to/from
>>>>>>>> the westbound Circle, Hammersmith & City and Metropolitan line
>>>>>>>> platform is available via the Long Lane entrance to Farringdon
>>>>>>>> station, which is open between 0630 and 2300 approximately on
>>>>>>>> Monday to Saturday.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The entrance is on Lindsey Street, and the exit on Hayne
>>>>>>>>> Street. But it's called the Barbican entrance/exit to Farringdon
>>>>>>>>> station.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Didn't I suggest something like that earlier?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> No, only *you* keep calling it the Long Lane entrance,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And TfL (see above). Although I don't think I have called it much other
>>>>>> than the Eastern entrance to Farringdon Station.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> which none of the signs do, as there is no actual entrance on Long
>>>>>>> Lane. It's on Lindsey Street.
>>>>
>>>> Only because they've not opened the sliding door facing Long Lane.
>>>>
>>>>>> The signs just say "Exit towards Barbican" (or words to that effect).
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/52098279748/in/album-721777202
>>>>> 99244348/lightbox/>
>>>>
>>>> And there are similar signs at Canada Wharf which talk of the Cabot
>>>> Square and Canada Square exits. That doesn't mean the station's name is
>>>> either Cabot Square Station or Canada Square Station.
>>>
>>> Where did you get the idea that anyone disputes the name of the Liz
>>> Farringdon station?
>>
>> Your postings at the start of this sorry tale, calling it Barbican.
>
>It's officially Farringdon station's Barbican exit, just as TCR station has
>a Dean St exit and Bond St station will have a Hanover Square exit.

Almost there, it's the Long Lane exit.

>Will you be as confused by those stations as you have consistently been
>about Farringdon?

The so-called confusion at Farringdon Long Lane was started by you
referring to it as Barbican (not even Farringdon - Barbican exit).
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <ta8sr0$mb31$2@dont-email.me>, at 09:19:28 on Fri, 8 Jul
> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <ta3kqv$fdt$2@dont-email.me>, at 09:32:15 on Wed, 6 Jul 2022,
>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> In message <t9n5h8$2a41r$2@dont-email.me>, at 15:57:28 on Fri, 1 Jul
>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "BARBICAN STATION: From Tuesday 24 May, step-free access to/from
>>>>>>>>> the westbound Circle, Hammersmith & City and Metropolitan line
>>>>>>>>> platform is available via the Long Lane entrance to Farringdon
>>>>>>>>> station, which is open between 0630 and 2300 approximately on
>>>>>>>>> Monday to Saturday.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The entrance is on Lindsey Street, and the exit on Hayne
>>>>>>>>>> Street. But it's called the Barbican entrance/exit to Farringdon
>>>>>>>>>> station.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Didn't I suggest something like that earlier?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> No, only *you* keep calling it the Long Lane entrance,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And TfL (see above). Although I don't think I have called it much other
>>>>>>> than the Eastern entrance to Farringdon Station.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> which none of the signs do, as there is no actual entrance on Long
>>>>>>>> Lane. It's on Lindsey Street.
>>>>>
>>>>> Only because they've not opened the sliding door facing Long Lane.
>>>>>
>>>>>>> The signs just say "Exit towards Barbican" (or words to that effect).
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/52098279748/in/album-721777202
>>>>>> 99244348/lightbox/>
>>>>>
>>>>> And there are similar signs at Canada Wharf which talk of the Cabot
>>>>> Square and Canada Square exits. That doesn't mean the station's name is
>>>>> either Cabot Square Station or Canada Square Station.
>>>>
>>>> Where did you get the idea that anyone disputes the name of the Liz
>>>> Farringdon station?
>>>
>>> Your postings at the start of this sorry tale, calling it Barbican.
>>
>> It's officially Farringdon station's Barbican exit, just as TCR station has
>> a Dean St exit and Bond St station will have a Hanover Square exit.
>
> Almost there, it's the Long Lane exit.

Nope, that's just the postal address. There isn't even an exit on Long
Lane, and Crossrail called it the Lindsey Street site. So, if you insist on
using a non-standard term, that's the correct one.

On all the signs, it's the Barbican exit. You obstinately refuse to use
the correct term in a pointless attempt to cover for your ignorance that
it even existed, let alone its location, which i had to help you find by
providing you with its postal address. But, unlike you, I know the
difference.

>
>> Will you be as confused by those stations as you have consistently been
>> about Farringdon?
>
> The so-called confusion at Farringdon Long Lane was started by you
> referring to it as Barbican (not even Farringdon - Barbican exit).

Roland, we know you simply didn't understand the EL double-ended stations.
Only you were confused.

Just admit your confusion and move on. Instead, you feel this desperate
need to 'prove' that you were never wrong.

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <ta8sr0$mb31$2@dont-email.me>, at 09:19:28 on Fri, 8 Jul
> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <ta3kqv$fdt$2@dont-email.me>, at 09:32:15 on Wed, 6 Jul 2022,
>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> In message <t9n5h8$2a41r$2@dont-email.me>, at 15:57:28 on Fri, 1 Jul
>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "BARBICAN STATION: From Tuesday 24 May, step-free access to/from
>>>>>>>>> the westbound Circle, Hammersmith & City and Metropolitan line
>>>>>>>>> platform is available via the Long Lane entrance to Farringdon
>>>>>>>>> station, which is open between 0630 and 2300 approximately on
>>>>>>>>> Monday to Saturday.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The entrance is on Lindsey Street, and the exit on Hayne
>>>>>>>>>> Street. But it's called the Barbican entrance/exit to Farringdon
>>>>>>>>>> station.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Didn't I suggest something like that earlier?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> No, only *you* keep calling it the Long Lane entrance,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And TfL (see above). Although I don't think I have called it much other
>>>>>>> than the Eastern entrance to Farringdon Station.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> which none of the signs do, as there is no actual entrance on Long
>>>>>>>> Lane. It's on Lindsey Street.
>>>>>
>>>>> Only because they've not opened the sliding door facing Long Lane.
>>>>>
>>>>>>> The signs just say "Exit towards Barbican" (or words to that effect).
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/52098279748/in/album-721777202
>>>>>> 99244348/lightbox/>
>>>>>
>>>>> And there are similar signs at Canada Wharf which talk of the Cabot
>>>>> Square and Canada Square exits. That doesn't mean the station's name is
>>>>> either Cabot Square Station or Canada Square Station.
>>>>
>>>> Where did you get the idea that anyone disputes the name of the Liz
>>>> Farringdon station?
>>>
>>> Your postings at the start of this sorry tale, calling it Barbican.
>>
>> It's officially Farringdon station's Barbican exit, just as TCR station has
>> a Dean St exit and Bond St station will have a Hanover Square exit.
>
> Almost there, it's the Long Lane exit.
>

It's signposted within the station as Barbican exit, not Long Lane.

Anna Noyd-Dryver

Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <ta8sr0$mb31$2@dont-email.me>, at 09:19:28 on Fri, 8 Jul
>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> In message <ta3kqv$fdt$2@dont-email.me>, at 09:32:15 on Wed, 6 Jul 2022,
>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>> In message <t9n5h8$2a41r$2@dont-email.me>, at 15:57:28 on Fri, 1 Jul
>>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> "BARBICAN STATION: From Tuesday 24 May, step-free access to/from
>>>>>>>>>> the westbound Circle, Hammersmith & City and Metropolitan line
>>>>>>>>>> platform is available via the Long Lane entrance to Farringdon
>>>>>>>>>> station, which is open between 0630 and 2300 approximately on
>>>>>>>>>> Monday to Saturday.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The entrance is on Lindsey Street, and the exit on Hayne
>>>>>>>>>>> Street. But it's called the Barbican entrance/exit to Farringdon
>>>>>>>>>>> station.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Didn't I suggest something like that earlier?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> No, only *you* keep calling it the Long Lane entrance,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And TfL (see above). Although I don't think I have called it much other
>>>>>>>> than the Eastern entrance to Farringdon Station.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> which none of the signs do, as there is no actual entrance on Long
>>>>>>>>> Lane. It's on Lindsey Street.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Only because they've not opened the sliding door facing Long Lane.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The signs just say "Exit towards Barbican" (or words to that effect).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/52098279748/in/album-721777202
>>>>>>> 99244348/lightbox/>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And there are similar signs at Canada Wharf which talk of the Cabot
>>>>>> Square and Canada Square exits. That doesn't mean the station's name is
>>>>>> either Cabot Square Station or Canada Square Station.
>>>>>
>>>>> Where did you get the idea that anyone disputes the name of the Liz
>>>>> Farringdon station?
>>>>
>>>> Your postings at the start of this sorry tale, calling it Barbican.
>>>
>>> It's officially Farringdon station's Barbican exit, just as TCR station has
>>> a Dean St exit and Bond St station will have a Hanover Square exit.
>>
>> Almost there, it's the Long Lane exit.
>>
>
> It's signposted within the station as Barbican exit, not Long Lane.
>

Roland is determined to keep using what he's well aware is the wrong name
to distract from his embarrassing failure to know about it earlier, and
then to locate it. He kept insisting that the LE Moorgate exit was the
closest to the LU Barbican station on Aldersgate St. I finally had to give
him the postal address to help him find it on Google Maps. He then thought
Thameslink still had platforms at Barbican.

In message <tahiph$1oa0t$1@dont-email.me>, at 16:23:14 on Mon, 11 Jul
2022, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <ta8sr0$mb31$2@dont-email.me>, at 09:19:28 on Fri, 8 Jul
>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> In message <ta3kqv$fdt$2@dont-email.me>, at 09:32:15 on Wed, 6 Jul 2022,
>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>> In message <t9n5h8$2a41r$2@dont-email.me>, at 15:57:28 on Fri, 1 Jul
>>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> "BARBICAN STATION: From Tuesday 24 May, step-free access to/from
>>>>>>>>>> the westbound Circle, Hammersmith & City and Metropolitan line
>>>>>>>>>> platform is available via the Long Lane entrance to Farringdon
>>>>>>>>>> station, which is open between 0630 and 2300 approximately on
>>>>>>>>>> Monday to Saturday.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The entrance is on Lindsey Street, and the exit on Hayne
>>>>>>>>>>> Street. But it's called the Barbican entrance/exit to Farringdon
>>>>>>>>>>> station.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Didn't I suggest something like that earlier?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> No, only *you* keep calling it the Long Lane entrance,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And TfL (see above). Although I don't think I have called it much other
>>>>>>>> than the Eastern entrance to Farringdon Station.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> which none of the signs do, as there is no actual entrance on Long
>>>>>>>>> Lane. It's on Lindsey Street.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Only because they've not opened the sliding door facing Long Lane.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The signs just say "Exit towards Barbican" (or words to that effect).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/52098279748/in/album-721777202
>>>>>>> 99244348/lightbox/>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And there are similar signs at Canada Wharf which talk of the Cabot
>>>>>> Square and Canada Square exits. That doesn't mean the station's name is
>>>>>> either Cabot Square Station or Canada Square Station.
>>>>>
>>>>> Where did you get the idea that anyone disputes the name of the Liz
>>>>> Farringdon station?
>>>>
>>>> Your postings at the start of this sorry tale, calling it Barbican.
>>>
>>> It's officially Farringdon station's Barbican exit, just as TCR station has
>>> a Dean St exit and Bond St station will have a Hanover Square exit.
>>
>> Almost there, it's the Long Lane exit.
>
>It's signposted within the station as Barbican exit, not Long Lane.

While I agree the signage doesn't say "Long Lane", that is nevertheless
what TfL call it in their publications (such as stepless guide).

The signage within the station is "[for] the Barbican", just like exits
at other stations are "[for] $foo tourist destination", without that
causing the station itself to be renamed.
--
Roland Perry

On Tue, 26 Jul 2022 15:01:13 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:

>In message <tahiph$1oa0t$1@dont-email.me>, at 16:23:14 on Mon, 11 Jul
>2022, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <ta8sr0$mb31$2@dont-email.me>, at 09:19:28 on Fri, 8 Jul
>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> In message <ta3kqv$fdt$2@dont-email.me>, at 09:32:15 on Wed, 6 Jul 2022,
>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>> In message <t9n5h8$2a41r$2@dont-email.me>, at 15:57:28 on Fri, 1 Jul
>>>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> "BARBICAN STATION: From Tuesday 24 May, step-free access to/from
>>>>>>>>>>> the westbound Circle, Hammersmith & City and Metropolitan line
>>>>>>>>>>> platform is available via the Long Lane entrance to Farringdon
>>>>>>>>>>> station, which is open between 0630 and 2300 approximately on
>>>>>>>>>>> Monday to Saturday.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> The entrance is on Lindsey Street, and the exit on Hayne
>>>>>>>>>>>> Street. But it's called the Barbican entrance/exit to Farringdon
>>>>>>>>>>>> station.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Didn't I suggest something like that earlier?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> No, only *you* keep calling it the Long Lane entrance,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> And TfL (see above). Although I don't think I have called it much other
>>>>>>>>> than the Eastern entrance to Farringdon Station.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> which none of the signs do, as there is no actual entrance on Long
>>>>>>>>>> Lane. It's on Lindsey Street.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Only because they've not opened the sliding door facing Long Lane.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The signs just say "Exit towards Barbican" (or words to that effect).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> <https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/52098279748/in/album-721777202
>>>>>>>> 99244348/lightbox/>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And there are similar signs at Canada Wharf which talk of the Cabot
>>>>>>> Square and Canada Square exits. That doesn't mean the station's name is
>>>>>>> either Cabot Square Station or Canada Square Station.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Where did you get the idea that anyone disputes the name of the Liz
>>>>>> Farringdon station?
>>>>>
>>>>> Your postings at the start of this sorry tale, calling it Barbican.
>>>>
>>>> It's officially Farringdon station's Barbican exit, just as TCR station has
>>>> a Dean St exit and Bond St station will have a Hanover Square exit.
>>>
>>> Almost there, it's the Long Lane exit.
>>
>>It's signposted within the station as Barbican exit, not Long Lane.
>
>While I agree the signage doesn't say "Long Lane", that is nevertheless
>what TfL call it in their publications (such as stepless guide).

One single publication, which was directing people who needed step-free access to the LU Barbican station to use the EL
Barbican entrance. They helpfully provided the postal address. Do any other publications use that term?

Meanwhile, the 'Barbican' exit name is used in all signage.

>
>The signage within the station is "[for] the Barbican", just like exits
>at other stations are "[for] $foo tourist destination", without that
>causing the station itself to be renamed.

Nobody suggested the station had been renamed. Of course it hasn't. That was purely yet another comprehension failure on
your part.

On Wed, 27 Jul 2022 14:47:01 +0100
Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Tue, 26 Jul 2022 15:01:13 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>While I agree the signage doesn't say "Long Lane", that is nevertheless
>>what TfL call it in their publications (such as stepless guide).
>
>One single publication, which was directing people who needed step-free access
>to the LU Barbican station to use the EL
>Barbican entrance. They helpfully provided the postal address. Do any other
>publications use that term?
>
>Meanwhile, the 'Barbican' exit name is used in all signage.

On the subject of that area - now the liz line is complete why arn't LU
joining up farringdon sidings to the old moorgate tracks?

<Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 27 Jul 2022 14:47:01 +0100
> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Tue, 26 Jul 2022 15:01:13 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> While I agree the signage doesn't say "Long Lane", that is nevertheless
>>> what TfL call it in their publications (such as stepless guide).
>>
>> One single publication, which was directing people who needed step-free access
>> to the LU Barbican station to use the EL
>> Barbican entrance. They helpfully provided the postal address. Do any other
>> publications use that term?
>>
>> Meanwhile, the 'Barbican' exit name is used in all signage.
>
> On the subject of that area - now the liz line is complete why arn't LU
> joining up farringdon sidings to the old moorgate tracks?
>

I don't know, but it may simply be because of the very tight budget
constraints. Basically, TfL has no money for anything but absolutely
essential, urgent projects (and not even for all of those).