Given nobody sensible would claim a phone without the AUX jack is more
functional than a phone without it (as without it, the phone is less
functional by definition)...

And given nobody sensible would claim an FM radio isn't an important safety
feature in a phone during an emergency...

Nor would anyone who understands the power of portable memory disagree that
it's a very handy way to privately move data between devices...

Of the total of 2,548 Android models offered for sale from 2019 to today...
<https://www.gsmarena.com/results.php3?nYearMin=2019&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=2>

For the AUX jack, 1,907 (75%) of current Android models meet this standard.
<https://www.gsmarena.com/results.php3?nYearMin=2019&chk35mm=selected&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=2>

As for FM Radio, 1,257 Androids (50%) have the FM radio emergency feature.
<https://www.gsmarena.com/results.php3?nYearMin=2019&chkFMradio=selected&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=2>

Where 1,163 (46%) have both the emergency FM radio & the standard AUX jack.
<https://www.gsmarena.com/results.php3?nYearMin=2019&chk35mm=selected&chkFMradio=selected&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=2>

Let's look at the 1,801 (71%) with the all-important portable-memory slot.
<https://www.gsmarena.com/results.php3?nYearMin=2019&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=2&idCardslot=1>

But only 112 with a removable battery, which is less than 5% unfortunately.
<https://www.gsmarena.com/search.php3?nYearMin=2019&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=2&idBatRemovable=1>

Compare those choices Android users have to those of the poor Apple user.
AUX <https://www.gsmarena.com/search.php3?nYearMin=2019&chk35mm=selected&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=3>
FM <https://www.gsmarena.com/search.php3?nYearMin=2019&chkFMradio=selected&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=3>
SD <https://www.gsmarena.com/search.php3?nYearMin=2019&chkFMradio=selected&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=3&idCardslot=1>

In summary, the choices for Android are:
a. 75% AUX
b. 50% FM Radio
c. 71% SD SLOT

That's a _lot_ of choices (especially compared to Apple choices):
a. 0% AUX
b. 0% FM Radio
c. 0% SD SLOT
-
My role is to provide the facts, and to confront the morons who only know
the fantastically unbelievable bullshit that Apple MARKETING has fed them.

On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 19:41:16 -0400, Wally J
<walterjones@invalid.nospam> wrote:

>Given nobody sensible would claim a phone without the AUX jack is more
>functional than a phone without it (as without it, the phone is less
>functional by definition)...
>
>And given nobody sensible would claim an FM radio isn't an important safety
>feature in a phone during an emergency...
>
>Nor would anyone who understands the power of portable memory disagree that
>it's a very handy way to privately move data between devices...
>
>Of the total of 2,548 Android models offered for sale from 2019 to today...
> <https://www.gsmarena.com/results.php3?nYearMin=2019&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=2>
>
>For the AUX jack, 1,907 (75%) of current Android models meet this standard.
> <https://www.gsmarena.com/results.php3?nYearMin=2019&chk35mm=selected&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=2>
>
>As for FM Radio, 1,257 Androids (50%) have the FM radio emergency feature.
> <https://www.gsmarena.com/results.php3?nYearMin=2019&chkFMradio=selected&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=2>
>
>Where 1,163 (46%) have both the emergency FM radio & the standard AUX jack.
> <https://www.gsmarena.com/results.php3?nYearMin=2019&chk35mm=selected&chkFMradio=selected&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=2>
>
>Let's look at the 1,801 (71%) with the all-important portable-memory slot.
> <https://www.gsmarena.com/results.php3?nYearMin=2019&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=2&idCardslot=1>
>
>But only 112 with a removable battery, which is less than 5% unfortunately.
> <https://www.gsmarena.com/search.php3?nYearMin=2019&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=2&idBatRemovable=1>
>
>Compare those choices Android users have to those of the poor Apple user.
> AUX <https://www.gsmarena.com/search.php3?nYearMin=2019&chk35mm=selected&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=3>
> FM <https://www.gsmarena.com/search.php3?nYearMin=2019&chkFMradio=selected&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=3>
> SD <https://www.gsmarena.com/search.php3?nYearMin=2019&chkFMradio=selected&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=3&idCardslot=1>
>
>In summary, the choices for Android are:
>a. 75% AUX
>b. 50% FM Radio
>c. 71% SD SLOT
>
>That's a _lot_ of choices (especially compared to Apple choices):
>a. 0% AUX
>b. 0% FM Radio
>c. 0% SD SLOT
>-
>My role is to provide the facts, and to confront the morons who only know
>the fantastically unbelievable bullshit that Apple MARKETING has fed them.

I believe all/most phones require the earphone cable for an antenna.
I don't use an earphone !

KenW

On 17/11/2023 23:54, KenW wrote:
> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 19:41:16 -0400, Wally J
> <walterjones@invalid.nospam> wrote:
>
>> Given nobody sensible would claim a phone without the AUX jack is more
>> functional than a phone without it (as without it, the phone is less
>> functional by definition)...
>>
>> And given nobody sensible would claim an FM radio isn't an important safety
>> feature in a phone during an emergency...
>>
>> Nor would anyone who understands the power of portable memory disagree that
>> it's a very handy way to privately move data between devices...
>>
>> Of the total of 2,548 Android models offered for sale from 2019 to today...
>> <https://www.gsmarena.com/results.php3?nYearMin=2019&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=2>
>>
>> For the AUX jack, 1,907 (75%) of current Android models meet this standard.
>> <https://www.gsmarena.com/results.php3?nYearMin=2019&chk35mm=selected&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=2>
>>
>> As for FM Radio, 1,257 Androids (50%) have the FM radio emergency feature.
>> <https://www.gsmarena.com/results.php3?nYearMin=2019&chkFMradio=selected&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=2>
>>
>> Where 1,163 (46%) have both the emergency FM radio & the standard AUX jack.
>> <https://www.gsmarena.com/results.php3?nYearMin=2019&chk35mm=selected&chkFMradio=selected&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=2>
>>
>> Let's look at the 1,801 (71%) with the all-important portable-memory slot.
>> <https://www.gsmarena.com/results.php3?nYearMin=2019&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=2&idCardslot=1>
>>
>> But only 112 with a removable battery, which is less than 5% unfortunately.
>> <https://www.gsmarena.com/search.php3?nYearMin=2019&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=2&idBatRemovable=1>
>>
>> Compare those choices Android users have to those of the poor Apple user.
>> AUX <https://www.gsmarena.com/search.php3?nYearMin=2019&chk35mm=selected&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=3>
>> FM <https://www.gsmarena.com/search.php3?nYearMin=2019&chkFMradio=selected&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=3>
>> SD <https://www.gsmarena.com/search.php3?nYearMin=2019&chkFMradio=selected&sAvailabilities=1,2&sOSes=3&idCardslot=1>
>>
>> In summary, the choices for Android are:
>> a. 75% AUX
>> b. 50% FM Radio
>> c. 71% SD SLOT
>>
>> That's a _lot_ of choices (especially compared to Apple choices):
>> a. 0% AUX
>> b. 0% FM Radio
>> c. 0% SD SLOT
>> -
>> My role is to provide the facts, and to confront the morons who only know
>> the fantastically unbelievable bullshit that Apple MARKETING has fed them.
>
> I believe all/most phones require the earphone cable for an antenna.
> I don't use an earphone !

And I doubt that many carry wired earphones around. Even if you did,
there are plenty of wireless Android earbuds around. Those would make FM
unusable. I've never tried testing to see if a loose piece of insulated
wire just placed in the earphone socket would act as an antenna and
allow FM radio to be heard over the phone's internal speaker. Perhaps
the coupling would work, but perhaps not if it needs a physical connection.

I rarely use the sockets for anything, but one small advantage to not
having them would be better water resistance. However, I doubt many
people swim or surf with their smartphone on them, and a waterproof bag
would be a more reliable choice (and a considerably cheaper one than an
iPhone).

--

Jeff

On Sat, 18 Nov 2023 08:05:09 +0000, Jeff Layman wrote:

>> I believe all/most phones require the earphone cable for an antenna.
>> I don't use an earphone !
>
> And I doubt that many carry wired earphones around. Even if you did,
> there are plenty of wireless Android earbuds around. Those would make FM
> unusable. I've never tried testing to see if a loose piece of insulated
> wire just placed in the earphone socket would act as an antenna and
> allow FM radio to be heard over the phone's internal speaker. Perhaps
> the coupling would work, but perhaps not if it needs a physical connection.
>
> I rarely use the sockets for anything, but one small advantage to not
> having them would be better water resistance. However, I doubt many
> people swim or surf with their smartphone on them, and a waterproof bag
> would be a more reliable choice (and a considerably cheaper one than an
> iPhone).

It's for emergencies. You don't carry it around.
You use it when needed. Like you use a flashlight.

In a real emergency, you will be frantic to be using that wired headphone.

Not having the radio is like not having a flashlight when you need it.

Oscar Mayer wrote:
> Jeff Layman wrote:

>> I doubt that many carry wired earphones around. Even if you did,
>> there are plenty of wireless Android earbuds around. Those would
>> make FM unusable.

> It's for emergencies. You don't carry it around. You use it when
> needed. Like you use a flashlight.

If you don't carry your wired (FM antenna) earbuds around then the FM
radio built into your phone can only be used at home where you
apparently must keep the earphones?

> In a real emergency, you will be frantic to be using that wired
> headphone.

And if you only use it at home why not just get a real battery operated
FM radio that can do much more in an emergency. I use a Raddy (Google
for models) rechargeable portable shortwave AM/FM/SW/WB radio with NOAA
Alerts. It is smaller (but thicker) than my phone with a telescoping
antenna, built in speaker, and earphone hole. A much better emergency
solution than a phone, don't you think?

> Not having the radio is like not having a flashlight when you need
> it.

Agreed. Especially if your phone's built in FM radio, like mine, no
longer works...

BTW I did a little Googling and found some other Galaxy S10 owners that
said that the NextRadio app worked fine with their phones until a
Samsung update broke it. Perhaps that's my problem too...

On 11/18/2023 9:33 AM, AJL wrote:

> And if you only use it at home why not just get a real battery
> operated FM radio that can do much more in an emergency. I use a
> Raddy ...

If anybody cares here is the model I use:

<https://www.radioddity.com/products/raddy-rf75a>

On 18/11/2023, AJL wrote:

>> It's for emergencies. You don't carry it around. You use it when
>> needed. Like you use a flashlight.
>
> If you don't carry your wired (FM antenna) earbuds around then the FM
> radio built into your phone can only be used at home where you
> apparently must keep the earphones?

Emergencies can happen.

Instead of paying fifty dollars for an emergency radio that will probably
never get used why not stock wired headphones that you can always use?

AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote

> On 11/18/2023 9:33 AM, AJL wrote:
>
>> And if you only use it at home why not just get a real battery
>> operated FM radio that can do much more in an emergency. I use a
>> Raddy ...
>
> If anybody cares here is the model I use:
>
> <https://www.radioddity.com/products/raddy-rf75a>

For about the same footprint, consider keeping a HAM radio on the charger.

I live in the boonies in a high fire danger area with windy mountain roads
and with the San Andreas Fault line within eyesight and we have outages.

While the PG&E power goes out monthly, we only get evacuation orders once
every few decades - but it's going to happen. Again. And again it will.

As a neighborhood, we went down to the local fire station years ago to get
our HAM radio licenses and each of us is tuned to the same repeater freq.

In an emergency, the ability for two-way communication can be important.
And it's about the same cost & footprint as your (rather nice) FM radio.

On 11/18/2023 1:19 PM, Wally J wrote:
> AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote
>
>> On 11/18/2023 9:33 AM, AJL wrote:
>>
>>> And if you only use it at home why not just get a real battery
>>> operated FM radio that can do much more in an emergency. I use a
>>> Raddy ...
>>
>> If anybody cares here is the model I use:
>>
>> <https://www.radioddity.com/products/raddy-rf75a>
>
> For about the same footprint, consider keeping a HAM radio on the
> charger.

I do have an Advanced Class ham ticket but haven't used it in years.
Think the Internet spoiled things...

> I live in the boonies in a high fire danger area with windy mountain
> roads and with the San Andreas Fault line within eyesight and we
> have outages.
>
> While the PG&E power goes out monthly, we only get evacuation orders
> once every few decades - but it's going to happen. Again. And again
> it will.

I live in a gated retirement community with around 8000 homes (will be
10K on buildout) in a metro area of 6M folks. The power hasn't gone out
in over a year. We live in vastly different settings...

> As a neighborhood, we went down to the local fire station years ago
> to get our HAM radio licenses and each of us is tuned to the same
> repeater freq.

> In an emergency, the ability for two-way communication can be
> important. And it's about the same cost & footprint as your (rather
> nice) FM radio.

If you're talking using 2 meter repeaters the handhelds are quite a bit
more than 50 bucks...

On 11/18/2023 12:50 PM, Larry Wolff wrote:
> On 18/11/2023, AJL wrote:

>>> It's for emergencies. You don't carry it around. You use it when
>>> needed. Like you use a flashlight.

>> If you don't carry your wired (FM antenna) earbuds around then the
>> FM radio built into your phone can only be used at home where you
>> apparently must keep the earphones?

> Emergencies can happen.

> Instead of paying fifty dollars for an emergency radio that will
> probably never get used

I use my little FM/SW radio toy most every day but YMMV.

> why not stock wired headphones that you can always use?

I have 5 pair of wired earbuds and use them most everyday too, mostly
for my music and movies. But since my phone doesn't do FM they don't get
used on it for anything much less emergencies...

On 11/18/2023 3:53 PM, Wally J wrote:
> AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote

> I like your FM radio. I was just saying in emergencies, HAM is nice
> too.

Agreed. Having both would be better in an emergency. They both have
their uses. My receiver would be better at receiving the commercial
bands (AM, FM, SW) where most local and national emergency news
broadcasts would be found. And your 2 meter handheld ham transceiver
(with a mountaintop repeater) would serve communications in your local
area with other hams.

> the power goes out two and three times a month in the dry months
> (which, in California, is most of the year) but only about once a
> month on the winter wet season

Things are better here. It's been well over a year since the last power
failure. Usually it's a car or storm taking down a power pole and they
can usually reroute within a couple of hours or so.

> (which started today, by the way, as it's raining).

Yep. Your storm came this way and got my driveway (slightly) wet...

> Of course every one of us (thousands upon thousands of homes in the
> mountains) has a 240VAC generator or two, plus battery backups, etc.

That would be wise considering the conditions you describe...

> We even have special meters from PG&E that we can hook our generators
> up _directly_ to the meter when the power goes out. Fancy that from
> PG&E!

Neat. Here some folks have solar panels with storage batteries so they
can get a few extra hours from the batteries in a power failure.

> _everyone_ in the neighborhood has them [BAOFENG UV-5R]. That's many
> hundreds of people who all have the same HAM radio as I do. What
> happened is one HAM enthusiast aficionado long ago sent out a
> suggestion we all chip in twenty-five bucks each and that would cover
> the radio and the testing

Back in the day (got my first ticket in 1956) you had to pass a written
AND a Morse Code test. Guess not anymore...

Another back in the day story: Some of our original mountaintop
repeaters had autopatches. There was a landline connection at the
repeater site. You could actually call someone using your 2 meter
handheld. This was pre-cellphone days so very handy. Course it wasn't
very private since all of Phoenix hamdom could listen in...

> - which was why those two radios plus two tests cost me only fifty
> bucks (one for my wife and the other for me).

Things are apparently a lot cheaper now, though I did used to get some
pretty good deals at hamfests.

> We have sequential federal Id's (ain't that sweet) where I don't
> remember them so since they have to be used, I write them on the back
> of the radio.

Do you mean licenses with call letters? IIRC California was in the 6th
call district. AZ is in the 7th and my call starts with W7...

> Are those BAOFENG UV-5R radios any good?

Specs look Ok. If they're reliable as is your repeater then they should
work just fine.

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baofeng_UV-5R>

In comp.mobile.android, on Sat, 18 Nov 2023 08:50:42 -0500, Oscar Mayer
<nobody@oscarmayer.com> wrote:

>On Sat, 18 Nov 2023 08:05:09 +0000, Jeff Layman wrote:
>
>>> I believe all/most phones require the earphone cable for an antenna.
>>> I don't use an earphone !
>>
>> And I doubt that many carry wired earphones around. Even if you did,
>> there are plenty of wireless Android earbuds around. Those would make FM
>> unusable. I've never tried testing to see if a loose piece of insulated
>> wire just placed in the earphone socket would act as an antenna and
>> allow FM radio to be heard over the phone's internal speaker. Perhaps
>> the coupling would work, but perhaps not if it needs a physical connection.
>>
>> I rarely use the sockets for anything, but one small advantage to not
>> having them would be better water resistance. However, I doubt many
>> people swim or surf with their smartphone on them, and a waterproof bag
>> would be a more reliable choice (and a considerably cheaper one than an
>> iPhone).
>
>It's for emergencies. You don't carry it around.
>You use it when needed. Like you use a flashlight.

Exactly.

I keep wired earbuds in my car and in my suitcase and in my home. The
last two are sometimes the same ones!

The only problem is when the battery goes dead on the wired earbuds.
Wait! That doesn't happen, like it does to wireless.
>
>In a real emergency, you will be frantic to be using that wired headphone.
>
>Not having the radio is like not having a flashlight when you need it.

On 11/18/2023 9:45 PM, micky wrote:

> I keep wired earbuds in my car and in my suitcase and in my home.
> The last two are sometimes the same ones! The only problem is when
> the battery goes dead on the wired earbuds. Wait! That doesn't
> happen, like it does to wireless.

Yea, but when you gotta go take a crap a wireless headset is a lot
handier...

On 11/18/2023 10:47 PM, Wally J wrote:
> AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote

> we don't normally get rain from about March or April to about now.
> Sometimes we get rivers of rain. Sometimes not. It's fickle.
> Weather.

Things are pretty constant here in the desert, hot and dry...

> I don't know a single person that doesn't have at least one
> generator. Unfortunately, some people use a suicide cord, which is
> just dangerous.

I had to look up 'suicide cord' cause in my last (and final) job I ran
across a few folks who had hung themselves using an electric cord. But
Google set me straight...

>> Back in the day (got my first ticket in 1956) you had to pass a
>> written AND a Morse Code test. Guess not anymore...

> No Morse Code anymore.

Last I listened to the ham CW (Continuous Wave = Morse Code) bands they
were dead. I suspect most all the CW ops I used to work are now dead too...

> But you do have to pass the written test. The way I passed the test
> was I put on my iPad a zillion free HAM radio tests, which contained
> the EXACT QUESTIONS to the exams (so it was easy).

They had study books in the old days, but pretty much the same thing.

> I don't know if the repeater we mostly use has that [autopatch],

Probably not. No reason these days with cell phones.

> but we have gotten people from extremely far away on the radio.

Depends on the repeater location and height. I could work hams in Tucson
from Phoenix cause the repeater was on our South Mountain and had line
of sight to both cities.

> I don't play with it [ham radio] all that much. Mostly I bring it on
> my backcountry hikes, where it's my emergency backup in case I break
> a leg or get bitten by a rattler or whatever.

Depends on the backcountry and where the repeater is cause 2 meter
repeaters generally require line of sight to work.

> An FM radio isn't needed on hikes as much as a HAM radio would be;
> but if there was an emergency

I see no value of an FM radio on a hike. A ham radio and/or cellphone
makes more sense for the type of emergency likely encountered there.

> my call sign is of the KMxxxx type,

I'm gonna guess that your call is KM6xxx if it goes by the old ways I
remember. 6 is for the 6th district which is (was?) CA.

> but some of my neighbors are ABxxx (notice only 5 characters for
> them but 6 for mine).

4 character calls used to be reserved for the Extra Class (highest) ham
license. It was a status symbol. Regular 5 character calls (like mine -
W7xxx) were for everyone else (Technician, General, and Advanced).
Except the Novice license which had an extra "N" inserted until they
upgraded and lost the 'N' (they only had a year to upgrade). They ran
out of the 5 character calls in the 60s IIRC so started the 6 character
licenses. But things are likely different now, and I've not kept up.

> all of us have either a T-Mobile, AT&T or Verizon femtocell
> (connected to the router) or a two-piece cellular repeater (I have
> both) so that our signal strength is perfect inside the house even
> though we're miles from the nearest cell towers.

My Verizon is two bars in the house but I use WiFi calling and that
solves the problem. Calls are then like a landline.

> We are so far in the boonies, that we don't have the option of
> cable, so we get all our Internet over the air from a nearby
> mountaintop too. Which makes us pretty self sufficient in an
> emergency...

My cable is pretty good but when it does go out the WiFi calling is too
dumb to know it. It's apparently programmed to switch to the cell when
it loses the WiFi signal but not when the WiFi is good but the Internet
is gone. So a dead phone IF I don't happen to be online and catch it... :-/

On 18/11/2023 17:00, AJL wrote:
> On 11/18/2023 9:33 AM, AJL wrote:
>
>> And if you only use it at home why not just get a real battery
>> operated FM radio that can do much more in an emergency. I use a
>> Raddy ...
>
> If anybody cares here is the model I use:
>
> <https://www.radioddity.com/products/raddy-rf75a>

Interesting website. I wish I'd known about it when looking for a
replacement for my Sony ICF-SW1 10 years ago (a fabulous little radio,
but the capacitors were unreliable after a dozen years or so)! The RF30
is about the same size, and a fraction of the price I paid in 1991 for
the Sony.

Here in the UK, though, they keep talking about switching off FM. Just
about all commercial broadcasts use DAB/DAB+ now. There /seem/ to be
some DAB radio apps available on the Playstore, but it's not clear if
these are radio or use online streaming.

--

Jeff

On 19/11/2023 07:15, AJL wrote:
> On 11/18/2023 10:47 PM, Wally J wrote:
>> AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote

>> I don't know a single person that doesn't have at least one
>> generator. Unfortunately, some people use a suicide cord, which is
>> just dangerous.
>
> I had to look up 'suicide cord' cause in my last (and final) job I ran
> across a few folks who had hung themselves using an electric cord. But
> Google set me straight...

I guessed what it meant, although that term isn't used in the UK.
However, with 230V AC available, it's even more applicable!

--

Jeff

Oscar Mayer <nobody@oscarmayer.com> wrote:
> On Sat, 18 Nov 2023 08:05:09 +0000, Jeff Layman wrote:
>
>>> I believe all/most phones require the earphone cable for an antenna.
>>> I don't use an earphone !
>>
>> And I doubt that many carry wired earphones around. Even if you did,
>> there are plenty of wireless Android earbuds around. Those would make FM
>> unusable. I've never tried testing to see if a loose piece of insulated
>> wire just placed in the earphone socket would act as an antenna and
>> allow FM radio to be heard over the phone's internal speaker. Perhaps
>> the coupling would work, but perhaps not if it needs a physical connection.
>>
>> I rarely use the sockets for anything, but one small advantage to not
>> having them would be better water resistance. However, I doubt many
>> people swim or surf with their smartphone on them, and a waterproof bag
>> would be a more reliable choice (and a considerably cheaper one than an
>> iPhone).
>
> It's for emergencies. You don't carry it around.
> You use it when needed. Like you use a flashlight.
>
> In a real emergency, you will be frantic to be using that wired headphone.
>
> Not having the radio is like not having a flashlight when you need it.

What "real emergency" do you envisage where the *ONLY* source of
information on your smartphone is the FM radio?

In comp.mobile.android, on Sun, 19 Nov 2023 12:22:43 -0000 (UTC), Chris
<ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:

>Oscar Mayer <nobody@oscarmayer.com> wrote:
>> On Sat, 18 Nov 2023 08:05:09 +0000, Jeff Layman wrote:
>>
>>>> I believe all/most phones require the earphone cable for an antenna.
>>>> I don't use an earphone !
>>>
>>> And I doubt that many carry wired earphones around. Even if you did,
>>> there are plenty of wireless Android earbuds around. Those would make FM
>>> unusable. I've never tried testing to see if a loose piece of insulated
>>> wire just placed in the earphone socket would act as an antenna and
>>> allow FM radio to be heard over the phone's internal speaker. Perhaps
>>> the coupling would work, but perhaps not if it needs a physical connection.
>>>
>>> I rarely use the sockets for anything, but one small advantage to not
>>> having them would be better water resistance. However, I doubt many
>>> people swim or surf with their smartphone on them, and a waterproof bag
>>> would be a more reliable choice (and a considerably cheaper one than an
>>> iPhone).
>>
>> It's for emergencies. You don't carry it around.
>> You use it when needed. Like you use a flashlight.
>>
>> In a real emergency, you will be frantic to be using that wired headphone.
>>
>> Not having the radio is like not having a flashlight when you need it.
>
>What "real emergency" do you envisage where the *ONLY* source of
>information on your smartphone is the FM radio?

I actually had one. I was coming back from Pennsyslvania on election
day night in 2016 and I wanted to hear election results. I was on a bus
with other volunteers, so there was no dashboard radio I could turn on,
or hear. I had my phone and my wired earbuds and they worked pretty
well even when I got out of range of one station and into another.

I guess I could volunteer again in 2024, but short of that, I don't
expect this to happen again.
>

On Sun, 19 Nov 2023 10:50:24 -0500, micky wrote:

>>What "real emergency" do you envisage where the *ONLY* source of
>>information on your smartphone is the FM radio?
>
> I actually had one. I was coming back from Pennsyslvania on election
> day night in 2016 and I wanted to hear election results. I was on a bus
> with other volunteers, so there was no dashboard radio I could turn on,
> or hear. I had my phone and my wired earbuds and they worked pretty
> well even when I got out of range of one station and into another.

It's not that it's the only source of information, but that it's a source
of information, just like a flashlight is a source of light and just like a
smart watch is a source of medical information and just like a loaf of
bread is a source of food and just like a blanket is a source of warmth.

Anyone arguing to not have them when you could use them is going to have to
claim they provide no benefits at all during an emergency situation.

It's safer with the radio than it is without the radio, and anyone who says
otherwise has to claim that a radio provides no useful information at all.

On 11/19/2023 12:12 PM, Wolf Greenblatt wrote:
> On Sun, 19 Nov 2023 10:50:24 -0500, micky wrote:

>> I had my phone and my wired earbuds and they worked pretty well
>> even when I got out of range of one station and into another.

> Anyone arguing to not have them when you could use them is going to
> have to claim they provide no benefits at all during an emergency
> situation.

I would argue that the hassle of carrying wired earbuds around just to
use your phone's internal FM chip in an EMERGENCY is an unnecessary PITA...

> It's safer with the radio than it is without the radio, and anyone
> who says otherwise has to claim that a radio provides no useful
> information at all.

But I have a radio. I have hundreds (thousands?) of available AM/FM/SW
stations with me on my phone's radio apps that could be used in such an
emergency, no wired earbuds needed. That's pretty safe...

And if your emergency takes out the cell system it could just as well
take out the over-the-air FM stations...

In comp.mobile.android, on Sun, 19 Nov 2023 14:21:03 -0700, AJL
<noemail@none.com> wrote:

>On 11/19/2023 12:12 PM, Wolf Greenblatt wrote:
>> On Sun, 19 Nov 2023 10:50:24 -0500, micky wrote:
>
>>> I had my phone and my wired earbuds and they worked pretty well
>>> even when I got out of range of one station and into another.
>
>> Anyone arguing to not have them when you could use them is going to
>> have to claim they provide no benefits at all during an emergency
>> situation.
>
>I would argue that the hassle of carrying wired earbuds around just to
>use your phone's internal FM chip in an EMERGENCY is an unnecessary PITA...

FTR, it's not just for emergencies. You save data if you listen to
actual radio instead of webradio.
If your earpiece is wireless, bluetooth you never know when the
battery will be drained. I talk 5 days a week to a friend and it's
amazing how often her wireless whatever has a dead battery.

But all in all this is the kind of silly discussion tha internet is
famous for. If you want to carry wired, do so, and if you don't, well
your safe, no one will bother you, no one will tell you what to do,
until the CSA of 2022 goes into effect. The Communications Security act
of 2022 will require everyone to carry wired earbuds on their person,
unless there is a pair in their own car which is no more than 150 feet
away.

>> It's safer with the radio than it is without the radio, and anyone
>> who says otherwise has to claim that a radio provides no useful
>> information at all.
>
>But I have a radio. I have hundreds (thousands?) of available AM/FM/SW
>stations with me on my phone's radio apps that could be used in such an
>emergency, no wired earbuds needed. That's pretty safe...
>
>And if your emergency takes out the cell system it could just as well
>take out the over-the-air FM stations...
>
>

On 2023-11-19 14:14, micky wrote:
> In comp.mobile.android, on Sun, 19 Nov 2023 14:21:03 -0700, AJL
> <noemail@none.com> wrote:
>
>> On 11/19/2023 12:12 PM, Wolf Greenblatt wrote:
>>> On Sun, 19 Nov 2023 10:50:24 -0500, micky wrote:
>>
>>>> I had my phone and my wired earbuds and they worked pretty well
>>>> even when I got out of range of one station and into another.
>>
>>> Anyone arguing to not have them when you could use them is going to
>>> have to claim they provide no benefits at all during an emergency
>>> situation.
>>
>> I would argue that the hassle of carrying wired earbuds around just to
>> use your phone's internal FM chip in an EMERGENCY is an unnecessary PITA...
>
> FTR, it's not just for emergencies. You save data if you listen to
> actual radio instead of webradio.

But how much?

> If your earpiece is wireless, bluetooth you never know when the
> battery will be drained. I talk 5 days a week to a friend and it's
> amazing how often her wireless whatever has a dead battery.

Actually, you can check the state of charge with AirPods.

>
> But all in all this is the kind of silly discussion tha internet is
> famous for. If you want to carry wired, do so, and if you don't, well
> your safe, no one will bother you, no one will tell you what to do,
> until the CSA of 2022 goes into effect. The Communications Security act
> of 2022 will require everyone to carry wired earbuds on their person,
> unless there is a pair in their own car which is no more than 150 feet
> away.

Cite, please!

On micky wrote:
> AJL wrote:

>> I would argue that the hassle of carrying wired earbuds around
>> just to use your phone's internal FM chip in an EMERGENCY is an
>> unnecessary PITA...

> FTR, it's not just for emergencies.

Yup. I agree. That's why I put "EMERGENCY" in all caps above. So folks
would understand that I meant carrying earbuds for emergency ONLY...

> You save data if you listen to actual radio instead of webradio.

I don't. Cause I never listen to the radio when out. And even if I did
my earbuds wouldn't pick up my favorite station: Bloomberg Boston some
2500 miles away. But your reason is valid so you have my permission...

> If your earpiece is wireless, bluetooth you never know when the
> battery will be drained. I talk 5 days a week to a friend and it's
> amazing how often her wireless whatever has a dead battery.

I haven't used Bluetooth headphones in recent years. But I have a
favorite pair of (gasp) earbuds for movies and music on my tablets.

> But all in all this is the kind of silly discussion that internet is
> famous for.

You mean like someone commenting that earbuds have batteries, no wait
they don't...

On 11/19/2023 2:42 PM, Wally J wrote:
> AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote

> Do you have a well out there in the desert?

My water company uses both wells and Colorado river water.

> BTW, a generator is like an FM radio out here in that it's nice to
> have when you need it, and, unfortunately, even PG&E says that we
> need it.

I actually have 2 FM radios. My other one can use AA batteries and AC.
So I'm set. Ironically during our last power failure (emergency?) I
consulted our power company APP on my PHONE to see when power would be
restored...

> Hmmm.... that's EXACTLY the point on the FM radio, isn't it? *It's
> better to have it for when you need it than to not have it at all!*

Can't argue with that. Fortunately I've not NEEDED it in the last 60
years or so but you never know...

> I never listened on CW and I listened a bit in the very beginning to
> the repeater traffic but now it's only there for emergency or hiking
> use.

To listen to CW you need a receiver with a BFO (beat frequency
oscillator) to turn the whoosh whoosh sound in a beep beep sound. I
never learned to read the clicks of the old telegraphs though.

> now the FCC knows EXACTLY who I am and where I live! :)

Yup. And it's now public information too to be spread across the
Internet... 8-O

> In the beginning they were doing radio checks where they got people
> on the other side of the valley - which is a good 30 or 40 miles.

With a good repeater location 100+ miles should be possible. And when
the sunspots are at a peak sometimes 2 meters can have an opening
(bouncing the signal off the ionized sky) and you could find yourself
talking to someone in the next state...

> Most mountains out here are about 3,000 to 4,000 feet, and much like
> it is in Phoenix,

Our mountains are much lower.

> the mountains are surrounded by the valleys

We're labeled the 'Valley of the Sun' for our tourists. We call them
snowbirds cause they come here in the winter to flee the snow back home.

> You bring up a good point that when we hike, it's so mountainous and
> riven with gullies, gulches and steep ravines, that I liken hiking
> to a war.

Yup. I'm watching Private Ryan right now while doing my 45 minutes on
the treadmill every day so know what you mean about war...

> The only reason I wanted the HAM radio was for emergency purposes.

With me it was a hobby. I built my own stuff using (gasp) tubes in the
old days. Ran a 1000 watts to a 3 element beam. The whole world was my
oyster. Yes those were fun days...

> As always, anyone who knows more about those [Android] settings
> should let the rest of us learn from them as I don't know which ones
> to set at what myself.

I've reset my phone and started from scratch more than once after I
screwed up the settings and couldn't get back...

Jeff Layman <Jeff@invalid.invalid> wrote

> And I doubt that many carry wired earphones around.

In an emergency, you would. We have, for example, in our earthquake kit
(which almost everyone in California keeps handy, by the way), an old spare
Android with 12VDC battery charge clamps.... and.... a headphone set!

> Even if you did, there are plenty of wireless Android earbuds around.
> Those would make FM unusable.

Those earbuds will be useless for FM radio in an emergency situation.

What I find revealing is Apple "claims" that they care about your safety in
an emergency (e.g., satellite SOS subscriptions), but Apple doesn't really
care about your safety in their actions. Apple cares only in their words.

> I've never tried testing to see if a loose piece of insulated
> wire just placed in the earphone socket would act as an antenna and
> allow FM radio to be heard over the phone's internal speaker. Perhaps
> the coupling would work, but perhaps not if it needs a physical connection.

Since all my Androids have the three basic necessities (aux,fm,sd), I don't
have any earphones (nor would I want them, what with the puny batteries).

But remember, a phone without the headphone jack is ALWAYS worse than one
with it (all else being equal, of course).

Everyone who claims "sound is better" is ignoring that there's nothing a
phone without the headphone jack can do that a phone with it can't do.

> I rarely use the sockets for anything, but one small advantage to not
> having them would be better water resistance.

A lot of people try to make that assessment but it's just dead wrong.
That's like saying black-walled tires have better traction than whitewalls.
Some do. Some don't. And whether they do or not has nothing to do with it.

> However, I doubt many
> people swim or surf with their smartphone on them, and a waterproof bag
> would be a more reliable choice (and a considerably cheaper one than an
> iPhone).

Again, the IP rating is independent of the aux jack just like the IP rating
is independent of the color of the phone.

The _only_ reason Apple, Samsung, Google, et al. remove the three basic
hardware necessities is that they can then better control your recovery.

A phone with the three basic hardware necessities is _always_ better than
one without them (all other things being equal) as there's _nothing_ the
phone without them can do that the phone with them can't do.

This is basic logic.
--
I wonder how many people on this newsgroup actuall took logic in college.
I did.