On 2/25/2024 8:27 AM, Wolfgang Strobl wrote:
> Am Wed, 21 Feb 2024 10:59:36 -0500 schrieb Frank Krygowski
> <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net>:
>
>> On 2/21/2024 8:54 AM, Wolfgang Strobl wrote:
>
>>> Wearing clothing neccessary for longer or more strenuous commutes,
>>> including a reasonabble way to shower and/or change at the workplace is
>>> valid concern for many people.
>>
>> I know that many worry about that. I've always showered in the morning.
>> While I was often a little sweaty on arrival, there was no problem with
>> odor or anything else.
>
> My commute was uphill in the morning, after crossing a crowded inner
> city during rushhour. You can try to do this without arriving dripping
> wet, but it simply doesn't work in summer at the latest.
>
> Ignoring a valid problem doesn't make it go away. The fact that many
> people blame a problem they in fact don't have doesn't change that.
>
>

I've only worked in one place in my entire career that didn't have a
shower (it was a start-up in an office condo). Even there I would
completely wash up in the bathroom when I got to work. I use my commutes
as workouts, so like you, the only times I wouldn't arrive at work
completely soaked with sweat is in very cold mornings, and even then
depending on my training schedule...let's just say it wasn't a good idea
to stop for very long or else get a chill to the bone.

zen cycle <funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On 2/25/2024 8:27 AM, Wolfgang Strobl wrote:
>> Am Wed, 21 Feb 2024 10:59:36 -0500 schrieb Frank Krygowski
>> <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net>:
>>
>>> On 2/21/2024 8:54 AM, Wolfgang Strobl wrote:
>>
>>>> Wearing clothing neccessary for longer or more strenuous commutes,
>>>> including a reasonabble way to shower and/or change at the workplace is
>>>> valid concern for many people.
>>>
>>> I know that many worry about that. I've always showered in the morning.
>>> While I was often a little sweaty on arrival, there was no problem with
>>> odor or anything else.
>>
>> My commute was uphill in the morning, after crossing a crowded inner
>> city during rushhour. You can try to do this without arriving dripping
>> wet, but it simply doesn't work in summer at the latest.
>>
>> Ignoring a valid problem doesn't make it go away. The fact that many
>> people blame a problem they in fact don't have doesn't change that.
>>
>>
>
> I've only worked in one place in my entire career that didn't have a
> shower (it was a start-up in an office condo). Even there I would
> completely wash up in the bathroom when I got to work. I use my commutes
> as workouts, so like you, the only times I wouldn't arrive at work
> completely soaked with sweat is in very cold mornings, and even then
> depending on my training schedule...let's just say it wasn't a good idea
> to stop for very long or else get a chill to the bone.
>

I don’t use it as a training ride or do any training at all I get fit as
byproduct but it’s not my aim!

I generally try to take it reasonably gentle to work helped by being parks
and the cycleway, which are calm places and parks at least have walkers etc
so need to keep the speeds low.

Though it doesn’t make that much difference would seem to time what ever
effort I put in.

Roger Merriman

Wolfgang Strobl <news5@mystrobl.de> wrote:
> Am Wed, 21 Feb 2024 15:28:43 GMT schrieb Roger Merriman
> <roger@sarlet.com>:
>
>> Wolfgang Strobl <news5@mystrobl.de> wrote:
>>> Am Tue, 20 Feb 2024 21:56:46 -0500 schrieb Joy Beeson
>>> <jbeeson@invalid.net.invalid>:
>>>
>>>
>>>> And then I realized that clipless pedals are not compatible with
>>>> walking shoes.
>>>
>>> Not necessarily.
>>>
>>> <https://www.mystrobl.de/Plone/radfahren/technik/komponenten/m323/m323lo.jpeg>
>>> <https://www.mystrobl.de/Plone/radfahren/technik/komponenten/m323/m323lu.jpeg>
>>> <https://www.mystrobl.de/Plone/radfahren/technik/komponenten/m323/1999-0716-070935AA.jpeg>
>>>
>>> I bought these with a racing bike (Panasonic PR 3000) in 1995 and used
>>> these for years, on a bicycle used for touring and during winter. AFAIK,
>>> similar products still exist.
>>>
>>> Unfortunately, these pedals limited the lean angle when using the SPD
>>> side. This can be dangerous if you're not used to it. After riding with
>>> SPD pedals that can be used on both sides in the summer, I touched the
>>> ground quite heavily a few times in a curve and replaced these pedals as
>>> a result.
>>>
>>>
>> Broadly similar experience, I found that the clips being one sided where
>> always in the wrong side, and the flat part wasn’t very good either, mind
>> you compared them to MTB flats ie stuff like this!
>>
>> https://www.dmrbikes.com/Catalogue/Pedals/V12-2/V12
>>
>> In fairness about the same as a road flats ie pedals with or without the
>> clips.
>>
>> So I used the M520 for number of years
>>
>> https://bike.shimano.com/en-EU/product/component/deore-m6000/PD-M520.html
>>
>> Which worked fine you can get it or rather SPD or similar with a cage
>> around it so easier to pedal not clipped in.
>
> I bought a pair of those for the bike I built in early 2023 for my wife.
> For mine I simply moved a pair of Garmin XC 200 over from the old bike
> I bought in 2010.
>
> <https://www.garmin.com/en-US/p/658594/>
>
> That old bike got its original pedals again (Shimano SPD from 2010,
> similar to PD-M520, too lazy to look it up). It currently gets used on
> the indoor trainer only, but could serve as a fallback.
>
>
>>
>> https://bike.shimano.com/en-EU/product/component/shimano/PD-M647.html
>>
>> Which apparently will give one more support and will work with out being
>> clipped in, though I never used them or similar pedals, as eventually I
>> moved back to the Flat pedals and shoes which I prefer the feel of and
>> performance.
>
> PD-M520 do work without being clipped in, too, good enough for picking
> up bread rolls while on vacation. At home, we just switch to our
> bicycles with flat pedals for shopping.
>
> By the way, what about SH-SD501? I have a pair of those too, but have
> only rarely used them when it was very hot in the summer. There is a
> wide range of SPD shoes suitable for walking, not just from Shimano.
>

I used SPD shoes for a while on the commute as for most part worked okay at
both, though there vents made them cold in winter, which is another reason
the MTB flats are better for me.

But yes lots of options out there.

I realised that while SPD where fine I preferred the flats proper MTB
shoes/pedals and could be used very easily for work.

I do have more heavy weight pair for the Gravel/MTB which are stiffer
soled.

Roger Merriman

On 2/25/2024 8:43 AM, zen cycle wrote:
>
> I've only worked in one place in my entire career that didn't have a
> shower (it was a start-up in an office condo). Even there I would
> completely wash up in the bathroom when I got to work. I use my commutes
> as workouts, so like you, the only times I wouldn't arrive at work
> completely soaked with sweat is in very cold mornings, and even then
> depending on my training schedule...let's just say it wasn't a good idea
> to stop for very long or else get a chill to the bone.

For me, the workout was the ride home. As I've described, my method
depended on traffic lights. I started my stopwatch as I began riding
home. If I caught the first few lights green, I tried for a fast elapsed
time. If I caught a couple red lights, I made it an easier day - but I
still had the climb out of the valley. I arrived home sweaty no matter
what.

I haven't put a stopwatch on that ride for over ten years now. I shudder
to think how my present times would compare. :-(

--
- Frank Krygowski

On 2/25/2024 2:52 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
> On 2/25/2024 8:43 AM, zen cycle wrote:
>>
>> I've only worked in one place in my entire career that didn't have a
>> shower (it was a start-up in an office condo). Even there I would
>> completely wash up in the bathroom when I got to work. I use my
>> commutes as workouts, so like you, the only times I wouldn't arrive at
>> work completely soaked with sweat is in very cold mornings, and even
>> then depending on my training schedule...let's just say it wasn't a
>> good idea to stop for very long or else get a chill to the bone.
>
> For me, the workout was the ride home. As I've described, my method
> depended on traffic lights. I started my stopwatch as I began riding
> home. If I caught the first few lights green, I tried for a fast elapsed
> time. If I caught a couple red lights, I made it an easier day - but I
> still had the climb out of the valley. I arrived home sweaty no matter
> what.
>
> I haven't put a stopwatch on that ride for over ten years now. I shudder
> to think how my present times would compare.  :-(
>

I know its just me, but I have a _Really_ hard time taking easy during
my morning commutes. I read somewhere long ago that morning workouts for
men usually result in larger gains, partially due to the replenishment
of testosterone during sleep cycles, who knows how that 'science' may
have changed over time. I would use my rides home for Long Steady
Distance workouts - I can do a 2-3 hour ride on the way home, and not
worry about being late for a meeting:
https://www.strava.com/activities/9359583882

zen cycle <funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On 2/25/2024 2:52 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>> On 2/25/2024 8:43 AM, zen cycle wrote:
>>>
>>> I've only worked in one place in my entire career that didn't have a
>>> shower (it was a start-up in an office condo). Even there I would
>>> completely wash up in the bathroom when I got to work. I use my
>>> commutes as workouts, so like you, the only times I wouldn't arrive at
>>> work completely soaked with sweat is in very cold mornings, and even
>>> then depending on my training schedule...let's just say it wasn't a
>>> good idea to stop for very long or else get a chill to the bone.
>>
>> For me, the workout was the ride home. As I've described, my method
>> depended on traffic lights. I started my stopwatch as I began riding
>> home. If I caught the first few lights green, I tried for a fast elapsed
>> time. If I caught a couple red lights, I made it an easier day - but I
>> still had the climb out of the valley. I arrived home sweaty no matter
>> what.
>>
>> I haven't put a stopwatch on that ride for over ten years now. I shudder
>> to think how my present times would compare.  :-(
>>
>
> I know its just me, but I have a _Really_ hard time taking easy during
> my morning commutes. I read somewhere long ago that morning workouts for
> men usually result in larger gains, partially due to the replenishment
> of testosterone during sleep cycles, who knows how that 'science' may
> have changed over time. I would use my rides home for Long Steady
> Distance workouts - I can do a 2-3 hour ride on the way home, and not
> worry about being late for a meeting:
> https://www.strava.com/activities/9359583882
>
I don’t have such a competitive interest, though I worked quite hard this
morning against a fairly stiff headwind, the commute bike has a rather
upright position which doesn’t help!

Though this was more strength than heart work out to be honest!

Roger Merriman