On 10-Aug-22 6:27 am, pnn calmagorod wrote:
> https://neolegesmotus.com/2022/08/09/first-independent-replica-of-pnn-thruster/

"With these conditions Jeremiah unfortunately hasn’t achieved any thrust
so far and he then asked Laureti for some tips."

He hasn't achieved any thrust, because it doesn't work.

The best tip would be "You misunderstood, this is about making money,
not making thrust."

Sylvia.

On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 11:57:10 +1000, Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid>
wrote:

>On 10-Aug-22 6:27 am, pnn calmagorod wrote:
>> https://neolegesmotus.com/2022/08/09/first-independent-replica-of-pnn-thruster/
>
>"With these conditions Jeremiah unfortunately hasn’t achieved any thrust
>so far and he then asked Laureti for some tips."
>
>He hasn't achieved any thrust, because it doesn't work.
>
>The best tip would be "You misunderstood, this is about making money,
>not making thrust."
>
>Sylvia.

you are a troll.

On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 11:57:10 +1000, Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid>
wrote:

>On 10-Aug-22 6:27 am, pnn calmagorod wrote:
>> https://neolegesmotus.com/2022/08/09/first-independent-replica-of-pnn-thruster/
>
>"With these conditions Jeremiah unfortunately hasn’t achieved any thrust
>so far and he then asked Laureti for some tips."
>
>He hasn't achieved any thrust, because it doesn't work.
>
>The best tip would be "You misunderstood, this is about making money,
>not making thrust."
>
>Sylvia.

you write nothing except when denigrating the pnn

you are a troll

every time pnn calmagorod writes you show up with your nonsense
comments.

you are a troll.

Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid> wrote:

> On 10-Aug-22 6:27 am, pnn calmagorod wrote:
>> https://neolegesmotus.com/2022/08/09/first-independent-replica-of-pnn-thruster/
>
> "With these conditions Jeremiah unfortunately hasn’t achieved any
> thrust so far and he then asked Laureti for some tips."
>
> He hasn't achieved any thrust, because it doesn't work.

I suspect the addition of cooling fins is dissipating the heat more
effectively than in the ASPS model and thus removing the thermal effects
which were causing the illusion of thrust.

--
/* * * Otto J. Makela <om@iki.fi> * * * * * * * * * */
/* Phone: +358 40 765 5772, ICBM: N 60 10' E 24 55' */
/* Mail: Mechelininkatu 26 B 27, FI-00100 Helsinki */
/* * * Computers Rule 01001111 01001011 * * * * * * */

On Aug/10/2022 at 05:31, Otto J. Makela wrote :
> Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid> wrote:
>
>> On 10-Aug-22 6:27 am, pnn calmagorod wrote:
>>> https://neolegesmotus.com/2022/08/09/first-independent-replica-of-pnn-thruster/
>>
>> "With these conditions Jeremiah unfortunately hasn’t achieved any
>> thrust so far and he then asked Laureti for some tips."
>>
>> He hasn't achieved any thrust, because it doesn't work.
>
> I suspect the addition of cooling fins is dissipating the heat more
> effectively than in the ASPS model and thus removing the thermal effects
> which were causing the illusion of thrust.

You haven't worded that right. Thermal effects can produce real thrust,
not just illusion of thrust. Of course such thrust disappears in a vacuum.

From the above web site: "the ferrites temperature in ASPS setup rises
above 220°C". That's hot, quite hot enough to produce the observed
thrust by thermal effect.

Alain Fournier

On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 09:17:59 -0400, Alain Fournier
<alain245@videotron.ca> wrote:

>On Aug/10/2022 at 05:31, Otto J. Makela wrote :
>> Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> On 10-Aug-22 6:27 am, pnn calmagorod wrote:
>>>> https://neolegesmotus.com/2022/08/09/first-independent-replica-of-pnn-thruster/
>>>
>>> "With these conditions Jeremiah unfortunately hasn’t achieved any
>>> thrust so far and he then asked Laureti for some tips."
>>>
>>> He hasn't achieved any thrust, because it doesn't work.
>>
>> I suspect the addition of cooling fins is dissipating the heat more
>> effectively than in the ASPS model and thus removing the thermal effects
>> which were causing the illusion of thrust.
>
>You haven't worded that right. Thermal effects can produce real thrust,
>not just illusion of thrust. Of course such thrust disappears in a vacuum.
>
> From the above web site: "the ferrites temperature in ASPS setup rises
>above 220°C". That's hot, quite hot enough to produce the observed
>thrust by thermal effect.
>
>
>Alain Fournier

prrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

you are obsessed by thermal effect at the point that you are blind.

Alain Fournier <alain245@videotron.ca> wrote:

> You haven't worded that right. Thermal effects can produce real
> thrust, not just illusion of thrust. Of course such thrust disappears
> in a vacuum.

Indeed, you are correct. Sorry for the inaccuracy.

--
/* * * Otto J. Makela <om@iki.fi> * * * * * * * * * */
/* Phone: +358 40 765 5772, ICBM: N 60 10' E 24 55' */
/* Mail: Mechelininkatu 26 B 27, FI-00100 Helsinki */
/* * * Computers Rule 01001111 01001011 * * * * * * */

On 10-Aug-22 11:42 pm, Doctor Who wrote:
> On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 09:17:59 -0400, Alain Fournier
> <alain245@videotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> On Aug/10/2022 at 05:31, Otto J. Makela wrote :
>>> Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 10-Aug-22 6:27 am, pnn calmagorod wrote:
>>>>> https://neolegesmotus.com/2022/08/09/first-independent-replica-of-pnn-thruster/
>>>>
>>>> "With these conditions Jeremiah unfortunately hasn’t achieved any
>>>> thrust so far and he then asked Laureti for some tips."
>>>>
>>>> He hasn't achieved any thrust, because it doesn't work.
>>>
>>> I suspect the addition of cooling fins is dissipating the heat more
>>> effectively than in the ASPS model and thus removing the thermal effects
>>> which were causing the illusion of thrust.
>>
>> You haven't worded that right. Thermal effects can produce real thrust,
>> not just illusion of thrust. Of course such thrust disappears in a vacuum.
>>
>> From the above web site: "the ferrites temperature in ASPS setup rises
>> above 220°C". That's hot, quite hot enough to produce the observed
>> thrust by thermal effect.
>>
>>
>> Alain Fournier
>
> prrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
>
> you are obsessed by thermal effect at the point that you are blind.
>

Exactly who is blind? Laureti has been at this for years, but still
hasn't produced a device that shows any compelling evidence of thrust at
a level that cannot be explained as the result of known thermal and
radiative effects.

It would be nice if this thing worked as advertised, but it would be
violating the known laws of physics if it did, and nothing has been
shown yet that would makes us suspect those laws are wrong.

Sylvia.

Alain Fournier <alain245@videotron.ca> wrote:

> You haven't worded that right. Thermal effects can produce real
> thrust, not just illusion of thrust. Of course such thrust disappears
> in a vacuum.

Indeed, you are correct. Sorry for the inaccuracy, I should have said
"thermal effects, which produce the illusion of a reactionless drive".

--
/* * * Otto J. Makela <om@iki.fi> * * * * * * * * * */
/* Phone: +358 40 765 5772, ICBM: N 60 10' E 24 55' */
/* Mail: Mechelininkatu 26 B 27, FI-00100 Helsinki */
/* * * Computers Rule 01001111 01001011 * * * * * * */

On Thu, 11 Aug 2022 00:10:18 +1000, Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid>
wrote:

>On 10-Aug-22 11:42 pm, Doctor Who wrote:
>> On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 09:17:59 -0400, Alain Fournier
>> <alain245@videotron.ca> wrote:
>>
>>> On Aug/10/2022 at 05:31, Otto J. Makela wrote :
>>>> Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 10-Aug-22 6:27 am, pnn calmagorod wrote:
>>>>>> https://neolegesmotus.com/2022/08/09/first-independent-replica-of-pnn-thruster/
>>>>>
>>>>> "With these conditions Jeremiah unfortunately hasn’t achieved any
>>>>> thrust so far and he then asked Laureti for some tips."
>>>>>
>>>>> He hasn't achieved any thrust, because it doesn't work.
>>>>
>>>> I suspect the addition of cooling fins is dissipating the heat more
>>>> effectively than in the ASPS model and thus removing the thermal effects
>>>> which were causing the illusion of thrust.
>>>
>>> You haven't worded that right. Thermal effects can produce real thrust,
>>> not just illusion of thrust. Of course such thrust disappears in a vacuum.
>>>
>>> From the above web site: "the ferrites temperature in ASPS setup rises
>>> above 220°C". That's hot, quite hot enough to produce the observed
>>> thrust by thermal effect.
>>>
>>>
>>> Alain Fournier
>>
>> prrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
>>
>> you are obsessed by thermal effect at the point that you are blind.
>>
>
>Exactly who is blind? Laureti has been at this for years, but still
>hasn't produced a device that shows any compelling evidence of thrust at
>a level that cannot be explained as the result of known thermal and
>radiative effects.
>
>It would be nice if this thing worked as advertised, but it would be
>violating the known laws of physics if it did, and nothing has been
>shown yet that would makes us suspect those laws are wrong.
>
>Sylvia.

you are a troll

prrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 17:42:09 +0300, om@iki.fi (Otto J. Makela) wrote:

>Alain Fournier <alain245@videotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> You haven't worded that right. Thermal effects can produce real
>> thrust, not just illusion of thrust. Of course such thrust disappears
>> in a vacuum.
>
>Indeed, you are correct. Sorry for the inaccuracy, I should have said
>"thermal effects, which produce the illusion of a reactionless drive".

which isn't our case!

On Thu, 11 Aug 2022 00:10:18 +1000, Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid>
wrote:

>On 10-Aug-22 11:42 pm, Doctor Who wrote:
>> On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 09:17:59 -0400, Alain Fournier
>> <alain245@videotron.ca> wrote:
>>
>>> On Aug/10/2022 at 05:31, Otto J. Makela wrote :
>>>> Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 10-Aug-22 6:27 am, pnn calmagorod wrote:
>>>>>> https://neolegesmotus.com/2022/08/09/first-independent-replica-of-pnn-thruster/
>>>>>
>>>>> "With these conditions Jeremiah unfortunately hasn’t achieved any
>>>>> thrust so far and he then asked Laureti for some tips."
>>>>>
>>>>> He hasn't achieved any thrust, because it doesn't work.
>>>>
>>>> I suspect the addition of cooling fins is dissipating the heat more
>>>> effectively than in the ASPS model and thus removing the thermal effects
>>>> which were causing the illusion of thrust.
>>>
>>> You haven't worded that right. Thermal effects can produce real thrust,
>>> not just illusion of thrust. Of course such thrust disappears in a vacuum.
>>>
>>> From the above web site: "the ferrites temperature in ASPS setup rises
>>> above 220°C". That's hot, quite hot enough to produce the observed
>>> thrust by thermal effect.
>>>
>>>
>>> Alain Fournier
>>
>> prrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
>>
>> you are obsessed by thermal effect at the point that you are blind.
>>
>
>Exactly who is blind? Laureti has been at this for years, but still
>hasn't produced a device that shows any compelling evidence of thrust at
>a level that cannot be explained as the result of known thermal and
>radiative effects.
>
>It would be nice if this thing worked as advertised, but it would be
>violating the known laws of physics if it did, and nothing has been
>shown yet that would makes us suspect those laws are wrong.
>
>Sylvia.

we never said those laws a re wrong but that they can be violated.

that's another thing for you indigestible.

Doctor Who <doc@tardis.org> wrote:

> On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 17:42:09 +0300, om@iki.fi (Otto J. Makela) wrote:
>>Alain Fournier <alain245@videotron.ca> wrote:
>>> You haven't worded that right. Thermal effects can produce real
>>> thrust, not just illusion of thrust. Of course such thrust
>>> disappears in a vacuum.
>>
>> Indeed, you are correct. Sorry for the inaccuracy, I should have said
>> "thermal effects, which produce the illusion of a reactionless drive".
>
> which isn't our case!

Unfortunately, still to be proven. We'll be suitably impressed once
you are able to reproduce the claimed thrust effects in a vacuum.

--
/* * * Otto J. Makela <om@iki.fi> * * * * * * * * * */
/* Phone: +358 40 765 5772, ICBM: N 60 10' E 24 55' */
/* Mail: Mechelininkatu 26 B 27, FI-00100 Helsinki */
/* * * Computers Rule 01001111 01001011 * * * * * * */

On Aug/10/2022 at 11:20, pnn calmagorod wrote :
> Il giorno mercoledì 10 agosto 2022 alle 16:49:06 UTC+2 Otto J. Makela ha scritto:
>> Doctor Who <d...@tardis.org> wrote:
>>
>>> On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 17:42:09 +0300, o...@iki.fi (Otto J. Makela) wrote:
>>>> Alain Fournier <alai...@videotron.ca> wrote:
>>>>> You haven't worded that right. Thermal effects can produce real
>>>>> thrust, not just illusion of thrust. Of course such thrust
>>>>> disappears in a vacuum.
>>>>
>>>> Indeed, you are correct. Sorry for the inaccuracy, I should have said
>>>> "thermal effects, which produce the illusion of a reactionless drive".
>>>
>>> which isn't our case!
>> Unfortunately, still to be proven. We'll be suitably impressed once
>> you are able to reproduce the claimed thrust effects in a vacuum.
>
> H.Lorentz obtained nobel prize for his Lorentz force without no experiments in vacuum :-)
>
> more i never seem the measures of gold weight on a scale under vacuum :-)
>
> You dont't want see the elementary facts then invent ridicoulus and very expensive for us conditions.
> Then why with your allucinan theories don't reply to this? :
>
> with Asps PNN (with batteries .. and remote control) if on a scale we have thrust in a direction ... at 180 degree we have ANTI thrust :-)
> we repeat this many times :-)
> so you must invent something of realistic to explain such MANY facts :-)

If you heat one side of your gizmo more than the other side you will
push air molecules harder on one side than on the other side. This will
give you some thrust. If you turn your gizmo 180 degrees, you will have
thrust in the other direction. You can repeat that as many times as you
want. That is not non-Newtonian propulsion.

Alain Fournier

On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 12:43:12 -0400, Alain Fournier
<alain245@videotron.ca> wrote:

>On Aug/10/2022 at 11:20, pnn calmagorod wrote :
>> Il giorno mercoledì 10 agosto 2022 alle 16:49:06 UTC+2 Otto J. Makela ha scritto:
>>> Doctor Who <d...@tardis.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 17:42:09 +0300, o...@iki.fi (Otto J. Makela) wrote:
>>>>> Alain Fournier <alai...@videotron.ca> wrote:
>>>>>> You haven't worded that right. Thermal effects can produce real
>>>>>> thrust, not just illusion of thrust. Of course such thrust
>>>>>> disappears in a vacuum.
>>>>>
>>>>> Indeed, you are correct. Sorry for the inaccuracy, I should have said
>>>>> "thermal effects, which produce the illusion of a reactionless drive".
>>>>
>>>> which isn't our case!
>>> Unfortunately, still to be proven. We'll be suitably impressed once
>>> you are able to reproduce the claimed thrust effects in a vacuum.
>>
>> H.Lorentz obtained nobel prize for his Lorentz force without no experiments in vacuum :-)
>>
>> more i never seem the measures of gold weight on a scale under vacuum :-)
>>
>> You dont't want see the elementary facts then invent ridicoulus and very expensive for us conditions.
>> Then why with your allucinan theories don't reply to this? :
>>
>> with Asps PNN (with batteries .. and remote control) if on a scale we have thrust in a direction ... at 180 degree we have ANTI thrust :-)
>> we repeat this many times :-)
>> so you must invent something of realistic to explain such MANY facts :-)
>
>If you heat one side of your gizmo more than the other side you will
>push air molecules harder on one side than on the other side. This will
>give you some thrust. If you turn your gizmo 180 degrees, you will have
>thrust in the other direction. You can repeat that as many times as you
>want. That is not non-Newtonian propulsion.
>
>
>Alain Fournier

we insist that the thrust is due to the electromagnetic impulse, no
thermal effect can achieve such a thrust measured on a scale in both
directions (up and down).

On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 10:42:51 -0700 (PDT), pnn calmagorod
<calmagorod@gmail.com> wrote:

>Il giorno mercoledì 10 agosto 2022 alle 18:48:34 UTC+2 Doctor Who ha scritto:
>> On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 12:43:12 -0400, Alain Fournier
>> <alai...@videotron.ca> wrote:
>>
>> >On Aug/10/2022 at 11:20, pnn calmagorod wrote :
>> >> Il giorno mercoledì 10 agosto 2022 alle 16:49:06 UTC+2 Otto J. Makela ha scritto:
>> >>> Doctor Who <d...@tardis.org> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>> On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 17:42:09 +0300, o...@iki.fi (Otto J. Makela) wrote:
>> >>>>> Alain Fournier <alai...@videotron.ca> wrote:
>> >>>>>> You haven't worded that right. Thermal effects can produce real
>> >>>>>> thrust, not just illusion of thrust. Of course such thrust
>> >>>>>> disappears in a vacuum.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Indeed, you are correct. Sorry for the inaccuracy, I should have said
>> >>>>> "thermal effects, which produce the illusion of a reactionless drive".
>> >>>>
>> >>>> which isn't our case!
>> >>> Unfortunately, still to be proven. We'll be suitably impressed once
>> >>> you are able to reproduce the claimed thrust effects in a vacuum.
>> >>
>> >> H.Lorentz obtained nobel prize for his Lorentz force without no experiments in vacuum :-)
>> >>
>> >> more i never seem the measures of gold weight on a scale under vacuum :-)
>> >>
>> >> You dont't want see the elementary facts then invent ridicoulus and very expensive for us conditions.
>> >> Then why with your allucinan theories don't reply to this? :
>> >>
>> >> with Asps PNN (with batteries .. and remote control) if on a scale we have thrust in a direction ... at 180 degree we have ANTI thrust :-)
>> >> we repeat this many times :-)
>> >> so you must invent something of realistic to explain such MANY facts :-)
>> >
>> >If you heat one side of your gizmo more than the other side you will
>> >push air molecules harder on one side than on the other side. This will
>> >give you some thrust. If you turn your gizmo 180 degrees, you will have
>> >thrust in the other direction. You can repeat that as many times as you
>> >want. That is not non-Newtonian propulsion.
>> >
>> >
>> >Alain Fournier
>> we insist that the thrust is due to the electromagnetic impulse, no
>> thermal effect can achieve such a thrust measured on a scale in both
>> directions (up and down).
>
>Secondo questo imbecille col botto uno scaldino a batterie e con telecomando si alleggerisce o appesantisce su una bilancia ...
>per la variazione di massa dovrebbe essere una bomba atomica :-)
>Non c'è utilità a parlare con questi deficienti TOTALI
>
>e lallo

infatti, arragliano come i gotha, io li inserirei nella gothalist
majalagarden!

e lallo

Il giorno mercoledì 10 agosto 2022 alle 13:42, pnn calmagorod ha scritto :
> Il giorno mercoledì 10 agosto 2022 alle 18:48:34 UTC+2 Doctor Who ha scritto:
>> On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 12:43:12 -0400, Alain Fournier
>> <alai...@videotron.ca> wrote:
>>
>>> On Aug/10/2022 at 11:20, pnn calmagorod wrote :
>>>> Il giorno mercoledì 10 agosto 2022 alle 16:49:06 UTC+2 Otto J. Makela ha scritto:
>>>>> Doctor Who <d...@tardis.org> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 17:42:09 +0300, o...@iki.fi (Otto J. Makela) wrote:
>>>>>>> Alain Fournier <alai...@videotron.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>>> You haven't worded that right. Thermal effects can produce real
>>>>>>>> thrust, not just illusion of thrust. Of course such thrust
>>>>>>>> disappears in a vacuum.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Indeed, you are correct. Sorry for the inaccuracy, I should have said
>>>>>>> "thermal effects, which produce the illusion of a reactionless drive".
>>>>>>
>>>>>> which isn't our case!
>>>>> Unfortunately, still to be proven. We'll be suitably impressed once
>>>>> you are able to reproduce the claimed thrust effects in a vacuum.
>>>>
>>>> H.Lorentz obtained nobel prize for his Lorentz force without no experiments in vacuum :-)
>>>>
>>>> more i never seem the measures of gold weight on a scale under vacuum :-)
>>>>
>>>> You dont't want see the elementary facts then invent ridicoulus and very expensive for us conditions.
>>>> Then why with your allucinan theories don't reply to this? :
>>>>
>>>> with Asps PNN (with batteries .. and remote control) if on a scale we have thrust in a direction ... at 180 degree we have ANTI thrust :-)
>>>> we repeat this many times :-)
>>>> so you must invent something of realistic to explain such MANY facts :-)
>>>
>>> If you heat one side of your gizmo more than the other side you will
>>> push air molecules harder on one side than on the other side. This will
>>> give you some thrust. If you turn your gizmo 180 degrees, you will have
>>> thrust in the other direction. You can repeat that as many times as you
>>> want. That is not non-Newtonian propulsion.
>>>
>>>
>>> Alain Fournier
>> we insist that the thrust is due to the electromagnetic impulse, no
>> thermal effect can achieve such a thrust measured on a scale in both
>> directions (up and down).
>
> Secondo questo imbecille col botto uno scaldino a batterie e con telecomando si alleggerisce o appesantisce su una bilancia ...
> per la variazione di massa dovrebbe essere una bomba atomica :-)
> Non c'è utilità a parlare con questi deficienti TOTALI
>
> e lallo

Potresti provare a riscaldare un lato con una fiamma ossidrica per
vedere se il PNN è spinto in quel modo. (Non è bello dire che sono
imbecille.)

Alain Fournier

pnn calmagorod <calmagorod@gmail.com> wrote:

> Il giorno mercoledì 10 agosto 2022 alle 16:49:06 UTC+2 Otto J. Makela ha scritto:
>> Doctor Who <d...@tardis.org> wrote:
>> > On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 17:42:09 +0300, o...@iki.fi (Otto J. Makela) wrote:
>> >> "thermal effects, which produce the illusion of a reactionless drive".
>> > which isn't our case!
>> Unfortunately, still to be proven. We'll be suitably impressed once
>> you are able to reproduce the claimed thrust effects in a vacuum.
>
> H.Lorentz obtained nobel prize for his Lorentz force without no
> experiments in vacuum :-)

Lorentz shared the 1902 Nobel Prize in Physics with Pieter Zeeman for
the discovery and theoretical explanation of the Zeeman effect, which is
the effect of splitting of a spectral line into several components in
the presence of a static magnetic field.

The Nobel prize was not awarded for the the eponymous Lorentz force
which is the combination of electric and magnetic force on a point
charge due to electromagnetic fields.

Alas, to wear the mantle of Galileo is not enough that you will
be persecuted by an unkind establishment, you must also be right.
-- Robert L. Park: Voodoo Science, 2000
--
/* * * Otto J. Makela <om@iki.fi> * * * * * * * * * */
/* Phone: +358 40 765 5772, ICBM: N 60 10' E 24 55' */
/* Mail: Mechelininkatu 26 B 27, FI-00100 Helsinki */
/* * * Computers Rule 01001111 01001011 * * * * * * */

On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 21:21:09 -0700 (PDT), pnn calmagorod
<calmagorod@gmail.com> wrote:

>Il giorno mercoledì 10 agosto 2022 alle 22:32:36 UTC+2 Otto J. Makela ha scritto:
>> pnn calmagorod <calma...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > Il giorno mercoled? 10 agosto 2022 alle 16:49:06 UTC+2 Otto J. Makela ha scritto:
>> >> Doctor Who <d...@tardis.org> wrote:
>> >> > On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 17:42:09 +0300, o...@iki.fi (Otto J. Makela) wrote:
>> >> >> "thermal effects, which produce the illusion of a reactionless drive".
>> >> > which isn't our case!
>> >> Unfortunately, still to be proven. We'll be suitably impressed once
>> >> you are able to reproduce the claimed thrust effects in a vacuum.
>> >
>> > H.Lorentz obtained nobel prize for his Lorentz force without no
>> > experiments in vacuum :-)
>> Lorentz shared the 1902 Nobel Prize in Physics with Pieter Zeeman for
>> the discovery and theoretical explanation of the Zeeman effect, which is
>> the effect of splitting of a spectral line into several components in
>> the presence of a static magnetic field.
>>
>> The Nobel prize was not awarded for the the eponymous Lorentz force
>> which is the combination of electric and magnetic force on a point
>> charge due to electromagnetic fields.
>>
>> Alas, to wear the mantle of Galileo is not enough that you will
>> be persecuted by an unkind establishment, you must also be right.
>> -- Robert L. Park: Voodoo Science, 2000
>
>You don't want see the elementary facts then invent ridicoulus and very expensive for us conditions.
>Then why with your hallucinatory theories don't reply elementari facts :
>
>with Asps PNN (with batteries .. and remote control) if on a scale we have thrust in a direction ... at 180 degree we have ANTI thrust :-)
>we repeat this many times :-)
>so you must invent and DO something of realistic to explain such MANY facts ................. such the follow two days ago : With more than 15 minutes of power Sub321n4 reach on scale more than 20 grams of thrust ... reproduce this this "thermal effect" with a coax cable that power a dummy load :-))))
>the pnn only needs time to take off and of course an adequate system of solar panels. The thrust curve is similar to this
> http://www.asps.it/trustgra1.jpg.
>All newtonian and realativistic theories are comic and have no meaning in the PNN field :-)
>
>E.Laureti
>
>
>> --
>> /* * * Otto J. Makela <o...@iki.fi> * * * * * * * * * */
>> /* Phone: +358 40 765 5772, ICBM: N 60 10' E 24 55' */
>> /* Mail: Mechelininkatu 26 B 27, FI-00100 Helsinki */
>> /* * * Computers Rule 01001111 01001011 * * * * * * */

I think this says it all: reproduce this "thermal effect" with a dummy
load.

On Aug/12/2022 at 04:53, Doctor Who wrote :
> On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 21:21:09 -0700 (PDT), pnn calmagorod
> <calmagorod@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Il giorno mercoledì 10 agosto 2022 alle 22:32:36 UTC+2 Otto J. Makela ha scritto:
>>> pnn calmagorod <calma...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Il giorno mercoled? 10 agosto 2022 alle 16:49:06 UTC+2 Otto J. Makela ha scritto:
>>>>> Doctor Who <d...@tardis.org> wrote:
>>>>>> On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 17:42:09 +0300, o...@iki.fi (Otto J. Makela) wrote:
>>>>>>> "thermal effects, which produce the illusion of a reactionless drive".
>>>>>> which isn't our case!
>>>>> Unfortunately, still to be proven. We'll be suitably impressed once
>>>>> you are able to reproduce the claimed thrust effects in a vacuum.
>>>>
>>>> H.Lorentz obtained nobel prize for his Lorentz force without no
>>>> experiments in vacuum :-)
>>> Lorentz shared the 1902 Nobel Prize in Physics with Pieter Zeeman for
>>> the discovery and theoretical explanation of the Zeeman effect, which is
>>> the effect of splitting of a spectral line into several components in
>>> the presence of a static magnetic field.
>>>
>>> The Nobel prize was not awarded for the the eponymous Lorentz force
>>> which is the combination of electric and magnetic force on a point
>>> charge due to electromagnetic fields.
>>>
>>> Alas, to wear the mantle of Galileo is not enough that you will
>>> be persecuted by an unkind establishment, you must also be right.
>>> -- Robert L. Park: Voodoo Science, 2000
>>
>> You don't want see the elementary facts then invent ridicoulus and very expensive for us conditions.
>> Then why with your hallucinatory theories don't reply elementari facts :
>>
>> with Asps PNN (with batteries .. and remote control) if on a scale we have thrust in a direction ... at 180 degree we have ANTI thrust :-)
>> we repeat this many times :-)
>> so you must invent and DO something of realistic to explain such MANY facts ................. such the follow two days ago : With more than 15 minutes of power Sub321n4 reach on scale more than 20 grams of thrust ... reproduce this this "thermal effect" with a coax cable that power a dummy load :-))))
>> the pnn only needs time to take off and of course an adequate system of solar panels. The thrust curve is similar to this
>> http://www.asps.it/trustgra1.jpg.
>> All newtonian and realativistic theories are comic and have no meaning in the PNN field :-)
>>
>> E.Laureti
>>
>>
>>> --
>>> /* * * Otto J. Makela <o...@iki.fi> * * * * * * * * * */
>>> /* Phone: +358 40 765 5772, ICBM: N 60 10' E 24 55' */
>>> /* Mail: Mechelininkatu 26 B 27, FI-00100 Helsinki */
>>> /* * * Computers Rule 01001111 01001011 * * * * * * */
>
>
> I think this says it all: reproduce this "thermal effect" with a dummy
> load.

I reproduce that frequently. When I open the door of a hot oven and let
the door ajar, I feel a hot wind coming out. This wind from the oven has
more force than your PNN. The oven does not need to be any hotter than
your PNN gets.

Alain Fournier

On Fri, 12 Aug 2022 05:47:13 -0400, Alain Fournier
<alain245@videotron.ca> wrote:

>On Aug/12/2022 at 04:53, Doctor Who wrote :
>> On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 21:21:09 -0700 (PDT), pnn calmagorod
>> <calmagorod@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Il giorno mercoledì 10 agosto 2022 alle 22:32:36 UTC+2 Otto J. Makela ha scritto:
>>>> pnn calmagorod <calma...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Il giorno mercoled? 10 agosto 2022 alle 16:49:06 UTC+2 Otto J. Makela ha scritto:
>>>>>> Doctor Who <d...@tardis.org> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 17:42:09 +0300, o...@iki.fi (Otto J. Makela) wrote:
>>>>>>>> "thermal effects, which produce the illusion of a reactionless drive".
>>>>>>> which isn't our case!
>>>>>> Unfortunately, still to be proven. We'll be suitably impressed once
>>>>>> you are able to reproduce the claimed thrust effects in a vacuum.
>>>>>
>>>>> H.Lorentz obtained nobel prize for his Lorentz force without no
>>>>> experiments in vacuum :-)
>>>> Lorentz shared the 1902 Nobel Prize in Physics with Pieter Zeeman for
>>>> the discovery and theoretical explanation of the Zeeman effect, which is
>>>> the effect of splitting of a spectral line into several components in
>>>> the presence of a static magnetic field.
>>>>
>>>> The Nobel prize was not awarded for the the eponymous Lorentz force
>>>> which is the combination of electric and magnetic force on a point
>>>> charge due to electromagnetic fields.
>>>>
>>>> Alas, to wear the mantle of Galileo is not enough that you will
>>>> be persecuted by an unkind establishment, you must also be right.
>>>> -- Robert L. Park: Voodoo Science, 2000
>>>
>>> You don't want see the elementary facts then invent ridicoulus and very expensive for us conditions.
>>> Then why with your hallucinatory theories don't reply elementari facts :
>>>
>>> with Asps PNN (with batteries .. and remote control) if on a scale we have thrust in a direction ... at 180 degree we have ANTI thrust :-)
>>> we repeat this many times :-)
>>> so you must invent and DO something of realistic to explain such MANY facts ................. such the follow two days ago : With more than 15 minutes of power Sub321n4 reach on scale more than 20 grams of thrust ... reproduce this this "thermal effect" with a coax cable that power a dummy load :-))))
>>> the pnn only needs time to take off and of course an adequate system of solar panels. The thrust curve is similar to this
>>> http://www.asps.it/trustgra1.jpg.
>>> All newtonian and realativistic theories are comic and have no meaning in the PNN field :-)
>>>
>>> E.Laureti
>>>
>>>
>>>> --
>>>> /* * * Otto J. Makela <o...@iki.fi> * * * * * * * * * */
>>>> /* Phone: +358 40 765 5772, ICBM: N 60 10' E 24 55' */
>>>> /* Mail: Mechelininkatu 26 B 27, FI-00100 Helsinki */
>>>> /* * * Computers Rule 01001111 01001011 * * * * * * */
>>
>>
>> I think this says it all: reproduce this "thermal effect" with a dummy
>> load.
>
>I reproduce that frequently. When I open the door of a hot oven and let
>the door ajar, I feel a hot wind coming out. This wind from the oven has
>more force than your PNN. The oven does not need to be any hotter than
>your PNN gets.
>
>
>Alain Fournier

that is not a valid comparison, we don't put pnn into an oven. But
again, reproduce this thrust with a coax cable that powers a dummy
load so that you can say that "thermal effects" move the prototype,
and you have to reproduce that on a milligrams scale in both
directions up and down.
Go!

On Aug/12/2022 at 06:13, Doctor Who wrote :
> On Fri, 12 Aug 2022 05:47:13 -0400, Alain Fournier
> <alain245@videotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> On Aug/12/2022 at 04:53, Doctor Who wrote :
>>> On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 21:21:09 -0700 (PDT), pnn calmagorod
>>> <calmagorod@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Il giorno mercoledì 10 agosto 2022 alle 22:32:36 UTC+2 Otto J. Makela ha scritto:
>>>>> pnn calmagorod <calma...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Il giorno mercoled? 10 agosto 2022 alle 16:49:06 UTC+2 Otto J. Makela ha scritto:
>>>>>>> Doctor Who <d...@tardis.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 17:42:09 +0300, o...@iki.fi (Otto J. Makela) wrote:
>>>>>>>>> "thermal effects, which produce the illusion of a reactionless drive".
>>>>>>>> which isn't our case!
>>>>>>> Unfortunately, still to be proven. We'll be suitably impressed once
>>>>>>> you are able to reproduce the claimed thrust effects in a vacuum.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> H.Lorentz obtained nobel prize for his Lorentz force without no
>>>>>> experiments in vacuum :-)
>>>>> Lorentz shared the 1902 Nobel Prize in Physics with Pieter Zeeman for
>>>>> the discovery and theoretical explanation of the Zeeman effect, which is
>>>>> the effect of splitting of a spectral line into several components in
>>>>> the presence of a static magnetic field.
>>>>>
>>>>> The Nobel prize was not awarded for the the eponymous Lorentz force
>>>>> which is the combination of electric and magnetic force on a point
>>>>> charge due to electromagnetic fields.
>>>>>
>>>>> Alas, to wear the mantle of Galileo is not enough that you will
>>>>> be persecuted by an unkind establishment, you must also be right.
>>>>> -- Robert L. Park: Voodoo Science, 2000
>>>>
>>>> You don't want see the elementary facts then invent ridicoulus and very expensive for us conditions.
>>>> Then why with your hallucinatory theories don't reply elementari facts :
>>>>
>>>> with Asps PNN (with batteries .. and remote control) if on a scale we have thrust in a direction ... at 180 degree we have ANTI thrust :-)
>>>> we repeat this many times :-)
>>>> so you must invent and DO something of realistic to explain such MANY facts ................. such the follow two days ago : With more than 15 minutes of power Sub321n4 reach on scale more than 20 grams of thrust ... reproduce this this "thermal effect" with a coax cable that power a dummy load :-))))
>>>> the pnn only needs time to take off and of course an adequate system of solar panels. The thrust curve is similar to this
>>>> http://www.asps.it/trustgra1.jpg.
>>>> All newtonian and realativistic theories are comic and have no meaning in the PNN field :-)
>>>>
>>>> E.Laureti
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> /* * * Otto J. Makela <o...@iki.fi> * * * * * * * * * */
>>>>> /* Phone: +358 40 765 5772, ICBM: N 60 10' E 24 55' */
>>>>> /* Mail: Mechelininkatu 26 B 27, FI-00100 Helsinki */
>>>>> /* * * Computers Rule 01001111 01001011 * * * * * * */
>>>
>>>
>>> I think this says it all: reproduce this "thermal effect" with a dummy
>>> load.
>>
>> I reproduce that frequently. When I open the door of a hot oven and let
>> the door ajar, I feel a hot wind coming out. This wind from the oven has
>> more force than your PNN. The oven does not need to be any hotter than
>> your PNN gets.
>>
>>
>> Alain Fournier
>
>
> that is not a valid comparison, we don't put pnn into an oven. But
> again, reproduce this thrust with a coax cable that powers a dummy
> load so that you can say that "thermal effects" move the prototype,
> and you have to reproduce that on a milligrams scale in both
> directions up and down.
> Go!

Is there any reason why the oven has that thermal effect, but your PNN
that you heat to 220˚C would not have a thermal effect?

Alain Fournier

On Fri, 12 Aug 2022 06:54:22 -0400, Alain Fournier
<alain245@videotron.ca> wrote:

>On Aug/12/2022 at 06:13, Doctor Who wrote :
>> On Fri, 12 Aug 2022 05:47:13 -0400, Alain Fournier
>> <alain245@videotron.ca> wrote:
>>
>>> On Aug/12/2022 at 04:53, Doctor Who wrote :
>>>> On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 21:21:09 -0700 (PDT), pnn calmagorod
>>>> <calmagorod@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Il giorno mercoledì 10 agosto 2022 alle 22:32:36 UTC+2 Otto J. Makela ha scritto:
>>>>>> pnn calmagorod <calma...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> Il giorno mercoled? 10 agosto 2022 alle 16:49:06 UTC+2 Otto J. Makela ha scritto:
>>>>>>>> Doctor Who <d...@tardis.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 17:42:09 +0300, o...@iki.fi (Otto J. Makela) wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> "thermal effects, which produce the illusion of a reactionless drive".
>>>>>>>>> which isn't our case!
>>>>>>>> Unfortunately, still to be proven. We'll be suitably impressed once
>>>>>>>> you are able to reproduce the claimed thrust effects in a vacuum.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> H.Lorentz obtained nobel prize for his Lorentz force without no
>>>>>>> experiments in vacuum :-)
>>>>>> Lorentz shared the 1902 Nobel Prize in Physics with Pieter Zeeman for
>>>>>> the discovery and theoretical explanation of the Zeeman effect, which is
>>>>>> the effect of splitting of a spectral line into several components in
>>>>>> the presence of a static magnetic field.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The Nobel prize was not awarded for the the eponymous Lorentz force
>>>>>> which is the combination of electric and magnetic force on a point
>>>>>> charge due to electromagnetic fields.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Alas, to wear the mantle of Galileo is not enough that you will
>>>>>> be persecuted by an unkind establishment, you must also be right.
>>>>>> -- Robert L. Park: Voodoo Science, 2000
>>>>>
>>>>> You don't want see the elementary facts then invent ridicoulus and very expensive for us conditions.
>>>>> Then why with your hallucinatory theories don't reply elementari facts :
>>>>>
>>>>> with Asps PNN (with batteries .. and remote control) if on a scale we have thrust in a direction ... at 180 degree we have ANTI thrust :-)
>>>>> we repeat this many times :-)
>>>>> so you must invent and DO something of realistic to explain such MANY facts ................. such the follow two days ago : With more than 15 minutes of power Sub321n4 reach on scale more than 20 grams of thrust ... reproduce this this "thermal effect" with a coax cable that power a dummy load :-))))
>>>>> the pnn only needs time to take off and of course an adequate system of solar panels. The thrust curve is similar to this
>>>>> http://www.asps.it/trustgra1.jpg.
>>>>> All newtonian and realativistic theories are comic and have no meaning in the PNN field :-)
>>>>>
>>>>> E.Laureti
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> /* * * Otto J. Makela <o...@iki.fi> * * * * * * * * * */
>>>>>> /* Phone: +358 40 765 5772, ICBM: N 60 10' E 24 55' */
>>>>>> /* Mail: Mechelininkatu 26 B 27, FI-00100 Helsinki */
>>>>>> /* * * Computers Rule 01001111 01001011 * * * * * * */
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I think this says it all: reproduce this "thermal effect" with a dummy
>>>> load.
>>>
>>> I reproduce that frequently. When I open the door of a hot oven and let
>>> the door ajar, I feel a hot wind coming out. This wind from the oven has
>>> more force than your PNN. The oven does not need to be any hotter than
>>> your PNN gets.
>>>
>>>
>>> Alain Fournier
>>
>>
>> that is not a valid comparison, we don't put pnn into an oven. But
>> again, reproduce this thrust with a coax cable that powers a dummy
>> load so that you can say that "thermal effects" move the prototype,
>> and you have to reproduce that on a milligrams scale in both
>> directions up and down.
>> Go!
>
>Is there any reason why the oven has that thermal effect, but your PNN
>that you heat to 220?C would not have a thermal effect?
>
>
>Alain Fournier

yes, first, the thrust is growing with a particular graph
http://www.asps.it/trustgra1.jpg

This graphic means the thrust grows at parity of power.

no thermal effect can achieve that.

On Aug/12/2022 at 07:56, Doctor Who wrote :
> On Fri, 12 Aug 2022 06:54:22 -0400, Alain Fournier
> <alain245@videotron.ca> wrote:

>> Is there any reason why the oven has that thermal effect, but your PNN
>> that you heat to 220?C would not have a thermal effect?
>>
>>
>> Alain Fournier
>
> yes, first, the thrust is growing with a particular graph
> http://www.asps.it/trustgra1.jpg
>
> This graphic means the thrust grows at parity of power.
>
> no thermal effect can achieve that.

I already told you, that graph looks very much to what one would expect
if the thrust is from a thermal effect. The thrust increases with time
after putting the power on, that seems to be because once power is on,
the heat increases with time. Then with power off, you still have some
thrust. After cutting off power you have thrust that decreases with
time. That seems to be because the thing is still hot but cooling down.
Why would your thruster keep on providing thrust with the power off.
When I cut off the power to the engine of my car, I get zero thrust, the
thrust doesn't decrease with time, it goes to zero (I have an electric
car, the engine does not run at a lower regime when I release the
accelerator). And if I give let's say 20 kW of power to my engine, I get
constant thrust from the moment I give it 20 kW, it does not increase
with time at a constant power level.

Alain Fournier

Doctor Who <doc@tardis.org> wrote:

> On Fri, 12 Aug 2022 06:54:22 -0400, Alain Fournier
> <alain245@videotron.ca> wrote:
>> Is there any reason why the oven has that thermal effect, but your
>> PNN that you heat to 220°C would not have a thermal effect?
>
> yes, first, the thrust is growing with a particular graph
> http://www.asps.it/trustgra1.jpg
>
> This graphic means the thrust grows at parity of power.
> no thermal effect can achieve that.

I'd like to point out that the fact that the "thrust" slowly grows up
after power is switched on, and then slowly ramps down after power is
switched off looks very much like a thermal effect.

--
/* * * Otto J. Makela <om@iki.fi> * * * * * * * * * */
/* Phone: +358 40 765 5772, ICBM: N 60 10' E 24 55' */
/* Mail: Mechelininkatu 26 B 27, FI-00100 Helsinki */
/* * * Computers Rule 01001111 01001011 * * * * * * */