>My t-Mobile puts them in a folder of deleted messages and I think it is
>30 days until they're gone.

I have T-Mobile through Ting, but never even looked for anything VM. I
only have it for emergencies. I took everything off if it would cost
me something.

KenW

>> My t-Mobile puts them in a folder of deleted messages and I think it is
>> 30 days until they're gone.
>
> I have T-Mobile through Ting, but never even looked for anything VM. I
> only have it for emergencies. I took everything off if it would cost
> me something.

Oh, OK thanks. That was helpful, I'm sure.

KenW <ken1943@invalid.net> wrote:

> VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> wrote:
>
>> KenW <ken1943@invalid.net> wrote:
>>
>>> VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I wish they had a key for deleting ALL messages, and without having
>>>> to start playback. If there are, say, 20 messages, you have to
>>>> begin the playback of each to hit 7, 3, or whatever to delete just
>>>> that message. Then repeat 19 more times for delete all the other
>>>> messages, but one at a time. It's a tiresome task. They really
>>>> need a key that will empty the entire voicemail inbox at once of all
>>>> messages with no playback.
>>>
>>> What to do if deleted everything by accident ? Oh! that is another
>>> key.
>>
>> Not sure it is a feature of all voicemail systems, but mine (with
>> AT&T through an MVNO) has the option to undelete. I don't know how
>> long the undelete cache is kept alive, though. Of course, they
>> could implement a 2-key scheme: one key to delete all, and a
>> followup key to confirm the all-delete action.
>
> I repaired Voice Mail Systems as a part of my job. I do not remember
> any undo code there either. I do not get many VMs on my home phone and
> have them turned off on my cell.

https://www.att.com/support/article/wireless/KM1009101/
Recover deleted message: 1 then 9.

Alas, there is no delete-all action. Those I delete hang around in an
undo (recover) queue for a while.

While the voicemail prompts let you hit keys to commit actions, the web
portal to your voicemail often has more features, like selecting
multiple or all messages, and applying a action on all the selected
messages, like deleting them all.

I use an MVNO which assigns me to AT&T. I have an account at the MVNO.
I do NOT have an account at the actual carrier (AT&T). There is no web
portal to AT&T's voicemail service through the MVNO. And I don't have
an account at AT&T to use their web portal to more robustly manage my
account that I don't have with them. MVNO: No access to service config
with the actual carrier. Carrier: Don't have an account there to use
their web portal. Tis the price of using cheaper services with an MVNO.

Verizon says to call a phone number to contact their assistant to change
the flag in the deletion queue to make it an active message again. Once
a message has been deleted from the queue, they cannot recover it, so
you have to call before messages expire in the deletion queue. Verizon
says their delete queue expiration is 24 hours, but some users report
the delete queue entries are purged after 12 hours.

Some phone apps have the option to undelete, because they save in a
local cache. You go into the app's settings, select Delete Voicemails,
and get a list of deleted voicemails that have not yet expired. Not all
voicemail apps have a recover option, but they still may have a delete
cache. There are tools that can scan your phone to see if old
voicemails can be found. For example, Easus has their MobiSaver scanner
to see if old voicemails can be found. You connect your phone to your
Windows host using USB, and select Voicemails as the data type for
MobiSaver to scan for.

I found the following article which says Verizon does offer an undelete
option via their voicemail prompts. You call in, and hit 9 to get a
list of delete voicemails still in their delete queue.

https://xtrium.com/recover-deleted-verizon-voicemail/

I use AT&T, and know they have an undelete option. Looks like Verizon
also had an undelete option. Apparently those "voice mail systems"
(plural) that you worked on didn't have a recover queue to allow
undeleting old deleted messages within some time frame.

Am 22.04.23 um 19:52 schrieb VanguardLH:
> Joerg Lorenz <hugybear@gmx.ch> wrote:
>> Why do you think this NG can solve your social issues?
> Hey, micky, does your bro also ignore texts from you, too?

Isn't the answer very obvious?

--
Gutta cavat lapidem (Ovid)

Joerg Lorenz <hugybear@gmx.ch> wrote:
> Am 22.04.23 um 07:39 schrieb VanguardLH:
> > Joerg Lorenz <hugybear@gmx.ch> wrote:
> >
> >> Am 22.04.23 um 02:09 schrieb VanguardLH:
> >>> micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Usilng voice-mail on Mint Mobile, if one wants to delete a voicemail, he
> >>>> taps 7.
> >>>>
> >>>> Do all cellular companies use 7 for deleting?
> >>>
> >>> Mint Mobile is an MVNO.
> >>>
> >>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_virtual_network_operator
> >>
> >> Irrelevant.
> >
> > The point is NOT to contact the MVNO to ask how their voicemail works,
> > because they don't provide voicemail. The actual carrier they assign to
> > you is where you get voicemail service, so find out from the actual
> > carrier what they say, or what their online help says, if available.
>
> Voicemail is a part of the service package that is sold to the user
> by the MVNO. MVNO does not mean no service or support.

Exactly. The instructions on how to use voicemail are on my MVNO's
website [1]. I've never any contact with the carrier for service or
support.

BTW, 3 for delete seems to be common for Europe (at least sofar for
the UK, Switzerland and The Netherlands).

[1] I had to look it up, because voicemail is sooo last century! :-) [2]

[2] To be [f|F]rank, voicemail is switched on on our 'landline' (because
there it at least still makes some sense), but there it's a function of
the phone, not of the service provider.

On 4/24/23 8:12 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:

> The instructions on how to use voicemail are on my MVNO's
>website [1].

An annoying lady built into my voicemail tells me what to do. Fortunately I
can just push the key to shut her up.

>I've never had any contact with the carrier for service or
>support.

Except for changing phones, me neither. That's one reason I've stuck with
them for 20+ years.

>[1] I had to look it up, because voicemail is sooo last century! :-)
>
>[2] To be [f|F]rank, voicemail is switched on on our 'landline' (because
>there it at least still makes some sense), but there it's a function of
>the phone, not of the service provider.

You have a landline?? That's sooo last century... ;)

AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:

> You have a landline?? That's sooo last century... ;)

Nice to have a phone line that outlasts a long power outage. >;-o

On 4/24/23 8:51 AM, VanguardLH wrote:
>AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:
>
>> You have a landline?? That's sooo last century... ;)
>
>Nice to have a phone line that outlasts a long power outage. >;-o

I have one. My cell. It'll charge off my laptop batterys (4). And if the
laptops run out I have 2 car batteries (attached to cars) that should hold
me for a few months...

Am 24.04.23 um 17:40 schrieb AJL:
> On 4/24/23 8:12 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
>> [1] I had to look it up, because voicemail is sooo last century! :-)
>>
>> [2] To be [f|F]rank, voicemail is switched on on our 'landline' (because
>> there it at least still makes some sense), but there it's a function of
>> the phone, not of the service provider.
>
> You have a landline?? That's sooo last century... ;)

+1; but I promise you the guys with a phone even in the toilet will
appear immediately ...

--
Gutta cavat lapidem (Ovid)

Am 24.04.23 um 17:51 schrieb VanguardLH:
> AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:
>
>> You have a landline?? That's sooo last century... ;)
>
> Nice to have a phone line that outlasts a long power outage. >;-o

Bullshit. Today's IP-telephony does not outlast anything. Au contraire:
Many mobile providers learnt from the criminal Russian attackers in the
Ukraine how important a at least temproray independent energy supply is.

--
Gutta cavat lapidem (Ovid)

Am 24.04.23 um 18:21 schrieb AJL:
> On 4/24/23 8:51 AM, VanguardLH wrote:
>> AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:
>>
>>> You have a landline?? That's sooo last century... ;)
>>
>> Nice to have a phone line that outlasts a long power outage. >;-o
>
> I have one. My cell. It'll charge off my laptop batterys (4). And if the
> laptops run out I have 2 car batteries (attached to cars) that should hold
> me for a few months...

The problem is not your end. To keep the network up is much more of a
challenge.

--
Gutta cavat lapidem (Ovid)

On Mon, 24 Apr 2023 18:54:16 +0200, Joerg Lorenz <hugybear@gmx.ch>
wrote:

>Am 24.04.23 um 17:40 schrieb AJL:
>> On 4/24/23 8:12 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
>>> [1] I had to look it up, because voicemail is sooo last century! :-)
>>>
>>> [2] To be [f|F]rank, voicemail is switched on on our 'landline' (because
>>> there it at least still makes some sense), but there it's a function of
>>> the phone, not of the service provider.
>>
>> You have a landline?? That's sooo last century... ;)
>
>+1; but I promise you the guys with a phone even in the toilet will
>appear immediately ...

Wet phones usually don't work very well.

AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:
> On 4/24/23 8:12 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
>
> > The instructions on how to use voicemail are on my MVNO's
> >website [1].
>
> An annoying lady built into my voicemail tells me what to do. Fortunately I
> can just push the key to shut her up.

I (well, SWMBO) probably also have a built-in annoying lady, but as I
mentioned, we don't use voicemail on the mobile(s).

> >I've never had any contact with the carrier for service or
> >support.
>
> Except for changing phones, me neither. That's one reason I've stuck with
> them for 20+ years.

I meant the actual carrier, i.e. the one who runs the real/non-virtual
network. 'Contact' with the MVNO is via the web/surface-mail: We order a
SIM, they send one, case closed! :-)

> >[1] I had to look it up, because voicemail is sooo last century! :-)
> >
> >[2] To be [f|F]rank, voicemail is switched on on our 'landline' (because
> >there it at least still makes some sense), but there it's a function of
> >the phone, not of the service provider.
>
> You have a landline?? That's sooo last century... ;)

Yes, it is, but it's part of the TV/Internet/phone package and getting
only TV/Internet is more expensive. (Did I mention that we're Dutch!?
:-)) But the main reason is that they offer a better unlimited calls
deal than our pre-paid mobile providers. Also the quality of the calls
is often better, mainly because the handset has a better speaker than a
mobile phone has/can_have.

But indeed, on our recent trip to Oz, we didn't take the landline with
us.

VanguardLH <V@nguard.lh> wrote:
> AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:
>
> > You have a landline?? That's sooo last century... ;)
>
> Nice to have a phone line that outlasts a long power outage. >;-o

Sadly no. It uses our ISPs modem, so if the power goes, so goes the
landline. (And then I can use my (laptop and) mobile phone to check what
the heck is going on.)

AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:
> On 4/24/23 8:51 AM, VanguardLH wrote:
> >AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:
> >
> >> You have a landline?? That's sooo last century... ;)
> >
> >Nice to have a phone line that outlasts a long power outage. >;-o
>
> I have one. My cell. It'll charge off my laptop batterys (4). And if the
> laptops run out I have 2 car batteries (attached to cars) that should hold
> me for a few months...

Same [1] here and, if needed, I can charge the laptop from the car
battery.

[1] Well, 1 car. The other one is in Oz, which makes it a tad hard to
use in this scenario.

Ken Blake <Ken@invalid.news.com> wrote:
> On Mon, 24 Apr 2023 18:54:16 +0200, Joerg Lorenz <hugybear@gmx.ch>
> wrote:
>
> >Am 24.04.23 um 17:40 schrieb AJL:
> >> On 4/24/23 8:12 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
> >>> [1] I had to look it up, because voicemail is sooo last century! :-)
> >>>
> >>> [2] To be [f|F]rank, voicemail is switched on on our 'landline' (because
> >>> there it at least still makes some sense), but there it's a function of
> >>> the phone, not of the service provider.
> >>
> >> You have a landline?? That's sooo last century... ;)
> >
> >+1; but I promise you the guys with a phone even in the toilet will
> >appear immediately ...
>
>
> Wet phones usually don't work very well.

Well, on this/Joerg's/my side of the pond, a phone can be in the
toilet without getting wet and so can its owner. At least I manage to do
so most of the time. OTOH, we find it a strange place to rest.

On 4/24/2023 10:40 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
> AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:

>> You have a landline?? That's sooo last century... ;)

> Yes, it is, but it's part of the TV/Internet/phone package and
> getting only TV/Internet is more expensive. (Did I mention that we're
> Dutch!? :-)) But the main reason is that they offer a better
> unlimited calls deal than our pre-paid mobile providers. Also the
> quality of the calls is often better, mainly because the handset has
> a better speaker than a mobile phone has/can_have.

Probably depends on the equipment. As I recall my landline cordless
phone system wasn't all that great at fidelity. But since my hearing
isn't what it used to be, loudness is my main goal these days...

And then there's the wife who never uses her cell phone at home. She
talks to her iPad (that's hooked to the cell)...

On 4/24/2023 9:58 AM, Joerg Lorenz wrote:
> Am 24.04.23 um 18:21 schrieb AJL:
>> On 4/24/23 8:51 AM, VanguardLH wrote:
>>> AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> You have a landline?? That's sooo last century... ;)
>>>
>>> Nice to have a phone line that outlasts a long power outage.
>>>> ;-o
>>
>> I have one. My cell. It'll charge off my laptop batterys (4). And
>> if the laptops run out I have 2 car batteries (attached to cars)
>> that should hold me for a few months...
>
> The problem is not your end. To keep the network up is much more of a
> challenge.

Agreed. A wide area disaster might affect both cell and/or landline.

A few years back a storm took down some major power lines and I was out
for around 20 hours, though the local cell system stayed up. I was able
to keep track of the power company's repair progress and estimated power
restore time through their app. Very handy. I had the laptops ready for
charging the phone but it turned out I didn't need them. Perhaps one
advantage of overnight charging and starting the day at a %100 charge...

On 4/21/2023 4:32 PM, micky wrote:
> Usilng voice-mail on Mint Mobile, if one wants to delete a voicemail, he
> taps 7.
>
> Do all cellular companies use 7 for deleting?

PagePlus/Verizon, and Tello/TMobile both use 7.

Am 24.04.23 um 19:23 schrieb Ken Blake:
> On Mon, 24 Apr 2023 18:54:16 +0200, Joerg Lorenz <hugybear@gmx.ch>
> wrote:
>
>> Am 24.04.23 um 17:40 schrieb AJL:
>>> On 4/24/23 8:12 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
>>>> [1] I had to look it up, because voicemail is sooo last century! :-)
>>>>
>>>> [2] To be [f|F]rank, voicemail is switched on on our 'landline' (because
>>>> there it at least still makes some sense), but there it's a function of
>>>> the phone, not of the service provider.
>>>
>>> You have a landline?? That's sooo last century... ;)
>>
>> +1; but I promise you the guys with a phone even in the toilet will
>> appear immediately ...
>
>
> Wet phones usually don't work very well.

They even work without electricity ...

--
De gustibus non est disputandum

Am 24.04.23 um 19:55 schrieb Frank Slootweg:
> Ken Blake <Ken@invalid.news.com> wrote:
>> Wet phones usually don't work very well.
>
> Well, on this/Joerg's/my side of the pond, a phone can be in the
> toilet without getting wet and so can its owner. At least I manage to do
> so most of the time. OTOH, we find it a strange place to rest.

this time +1

--
De gustibus non est disputandum

Joerg Lorenz <hugybear@gmx.ch> wrote:

> VanguardLH:
>
>> AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:
>>
>>> You have a landline?? That's sooo last century... ;)
>>
>> Nice to have a phone line that outlasts a long power outage. >;-o
>
> Bullshit. Today's IP-telephony does not outlast anything. Au contraire:
> Many mobile providers learnt from the criminal Russian attackers in the
> Ukraine how important a at least temproray independent energy supply is.

Are cellular providers in your area legislated (mandated by law) to
operate backup power sources (battery, generators)? If so, for how
long?

In my area, cell towers are not mandated to have backup power. Many do,
like for 8 to 72 hours, but they are not legislated to do so. 72 hours
sounds like a long time, but we've had power outages lasting many days.
The landline stayed up while we long ran out of power to charge our cell
phone batteries. My 20K maH power bank only gives 2-1/2 charges to a
cell phone. As a consequence, I bought a car booster with USB ports.
That works to start the car (the maker claims the vampire drain is
normal) in the winter when it won't start after sitting 6 days, but also
can charge the cell phones and even use with USB lights for so long that
I've yet to have a power outage last longer than the car booster. But
that's me spending money on a workaround for lack of power to charge
cell phones in a long power outage. With long power outages, I've also
been unable to connect to cell towers in the affected area after 1 to 3
days. The ran out of power, so me having a huge car booster to
repeatedly charge my cell phone is overkill since I can keep the cell
phone charged, but the towers disappear.

In my area, telcos have long been legislated to provide backup power, so
their service remains up during power outages. They have huge batteries
along with gas generators that cover a couple city blocks. The ones at
cell towers look like little sheds. With landlines, the phone company
supplies their power to energize your phones in your house (for corded
phones, not for bases of cordless phones that run on line power, so you
should have, at least, 1 corded phone).
I'm not talking about some VOIP or near-telco service through my ISP
using their voice+modem box. The backup battery in their voice+modem
only lasts 4 hours (when new) when I'm /not/ using that phone, and I
have to buy the battery. I've put a UPS on the voice+modem, but that
lasts a little over a day. The ISP's voice service goes down, too, in
power outages, so keeping the voice+modem powered up doesn't ensure I
have VOIP service with the ISP. Meanwhile, the telco remains up for
well longer than any power outage we've had. We lose power when the
lines ice up, or a transformer blows, or someone plows into a power
pole. The underground POTS lines stay alive.

Oh, I've tried those solar-powered cell phone chargers. In less than 1
summer, they went into the trash. We get a lot more cloudy days than
sunny days. When it's sunny, we remark, "Oh look, it's the Sun. Well,
I think that's what is called the Sun." Why would I kill my car's
battery during a long power outage to charge cell phones? Wonder what
electric car owners do when they get home, have used up their car's
battery, and there's no power at home to charge the car.

I'm not talking about power outages that are a few minutes long, a
couple hours long, or even a couple days long. We get about 6 power
outages per year that last 3 days, or longer. We get more power
outages, but short ones are not memorable. The longest we had was 9
days. The buried POTS was protected while the power poles got stamped
flat over a 26-mile length that looked like Paul Bunyan stomped his way
across the northern suburbs just half a mile away from me. Hey, Marge,
we got that new dishwasher you wanted, and most of someone else's shed,
too. We've had wind speeds rip through the metro that toppled trains,
obliterated malls, and stripped neighborhoods of trees (boy, they looked
nude for many years after). Hey, I don't remember parking my car at 90
degrees in the car port. Repairs took long because of all the trees
blocking the roads. That power got "restored" only means when they
started, not when they restored in your area. We'd hear about power
restoration, but waited and waited. Meanwhile the police were blocking
off major roads, and the National Guard got called in (I managed to get
to my mother's house to check for damage, take snapshots, and squirrel
out of the area around the police barricades just before the National
Guard showed up).

Yeah, that's an extreme scenario. Most power outages we get per year
only last under 8 to 12 hours. That's short enough to keep the cell
towers powered, and your cell phones charged (if you have a power bank,
car booster, or other means), but there have been longer outages. One
outage was long enough the cell towers went dead, but we had a land line
to call the restaurants to see who was open to gauge the extent of the
damage, and go somewhere to eat. I've got a heavy task of chainsawing
lots of huge branches bigger than my obese waist in the yard from the
last wind storms we had this Spring. It's rained so much that the yard
is too soggy to walk on. I think our back shed got hit, but can't get
to it to check.

Not all power outages are due to weather. We've had the transformer
blow several times in our backyard that supplies the neighborhood.
Luckily the oil didn't blast out, but you could hear the big thud when
it blew. Had a squirrel commit suicide. Heavy icing downed trees that
snapped power lines. High winds have blown down power poles. Another
time was during an summer heat wave with an an overload from all the
A/Cs running. However, we've had so many long power outages that got us
to figure out what to do with food in the fridge (winter or summer),
emergency lighting, and even propane heaters and proper ventilation for
winter time since the furnace blower is electric. We looked into home
generators, but don't like to keep a depot of gas cans stored in a metal
shed away from the house. Natural gas fueled home generators sound like
a good solution until you find out the pressure wanes after 3 days,
because the natural gas suppliers need electricity to pressurize the gas
to overcome pipe friction and provide the proper pressure at your home.

Am 25.04.23 um 06:16 schrieb VanguardLH:
> Joerg Lorenz <hugybear@gmx.ch> wrote:
>
>> VanguardLH:
>>
>>> AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> You have a landline?? That's sooo last century... ;)
>>>
>>> Nice to have a phone line that outlasts a long power outage. >;-o
>>
>> Bullshit. Today's IP-telephony does not outlast anything. Au contraire:
>> Many mobile providers learnt from the criminal Russian attackers in the
>> Ukraine how important a at least temproray independent energy supply is.
>
> Are cellular providers in your area legislated (mandated by law) to
> operate backup power sources (battery, generators)? If so, for how
> long?

Unfortunately they are not and AFAIK most of them have no back-up power
supply. That seems to change at the moment.

--
Gutta cavat lapidem (Ovid)