On May 23, 2023, sms wrote
(in article<news:u4j7lv$2m7mm$1@dont-email.me>):

> Hmm. I turned off precise location (called "Improve Location Accuracy"
> by using Wi-Fi, mobile networks, and sensors) on my Pixel 7 Pro (running
> Android 13) and Google Maps still works for navigation. No nag screens.

I suspect you aren't testing what I'm testing, so please check settings.
Make sure you are not logged into Google at any time you try this.

In Settings | Location | Location services, turn everything off.
Specifically make sure three things are off that are important.
Google Location Accuracy
Wi-Fi scanning
Bluetooth scanning

Then go to Settings | Location | App permissions & find "Maps."
Make sure the only setting turned on is "Allow only while using this app."
Specifically make sure "Use precise location" is definitely turned off!

Then turn ONLY the GPS (blue marker) on (Settings | Location | On).
Now try to route in Maps from your current position to any other location.

When you start maps (remember, you're not logged into Google at any time),
you can press the bullseye to find your current location (it will complain
on the bottom that "Precise location denied" with a link to "Settings").

If you don't get that warning, then go back and check that you didn't
enable it for Maps because that warning is what forces precise location.

Then in the Google Maps search box, enter somewhere a few miles away.
You'll get the normal half screen of map and half screen of pictures.

Press the blue "Directions" button and you'll get the white "Choose start
location" box, which when you press it, you get a choice of "Your location"
or "Choose on map" so you select the "Your location" option.

You will again get the "Precise location denied" warning, with a link to
"Settings" which if you don't allow - you can't route anymore.

My Google Maps version is 11.22.2 and the device is Android 12.
I can show you all the screenshots if you need them.

> Why would you think that GPS-only is only "approximate location?"

That's not me thinking that. It's nospam. GPS alone is fine for driving.

> In
> reality it's the other way around, Wi-Fi, mobile networks, and sensors
> give you only an approximate location, while GPS is accurate to 4-5
> meters. Wi-Fi is 15-45 meters. Cell tower accuracy can be off by more
> than 500 meters. NFC sensors could be more accurate though.

It was nospam who made those absurd remarks about GPS because he needed a
wall to hide behind because he doesn't know what he's talking about.

Ron, the humblest guy in town.

In article <x4r14n7j6w98$.dlg@news.solani.org>, RonTheGuy
<ron@null.invalid> wrote:

>
> > Why would you think that GPS-only is only "approximate location?"
>
> That's not me thinking that. It's nospam. GPS alone is fine for driving.

you are lying again.

nobody said that.

On 5/23/2023 1:09 PM, RonTheGuy wrote:

<snip>

> Why do you hide behind a wall of insults because you had no idea that
> Android Google Maps recently switched to requiring precise location when
> the question was whether the iOS Google Maps made the same switch?

I can answer that for you since nospam is not familiar with how location
services work on Android and iOS.

Unless I missed it, on iOS there is no separate option in Location
Services for GPS versus "GPS plus Wi-Fi, cell tower, and Bluetooth." You
cannot use only the GPS when determining location.

Here is a photo of screenshots from my iPhone 11 and my Pixel 7 Pro:
<https://i.imgur.com/AkKioH2.jpeg>.

On my Pixel 7 Pro, running Android 13, it is not necessary to have
"Improve Location Accuracy" turned on in order for Google Maps
navigation to work. I am using version 11.79.0301, updated on May 10,
2023, which I believe is the latest version. What phone, and what
version of Android and Google Maps, are you using that requires you to
have this turned on?

So why would you ever want to turn off "Improve Location Accuracy?" on
Android? First, there's no need for it when you're in a place where the
satellite GPS works because the GPS gives you much greater accuracy than
cell towers, Wi-Fi, or Bluetooth. Second, it measurably reduces battery
drain on Android. I can't comment on iPhone since it's not possible to
prevent the device from using those other radios.

If you want Location Services to work, on Android, when you're deep
inside a building then you should turn on "Improve Location Accuracy,"
otherwise keep it off. Interestingly, Android used to have a setting to
use only cell towers, Bluetooth, and Wi-Fi for Location Services,
turning off the GPS to reduce battery drain, but that does not appear to
be a standard feature of Android anymore.

I added this as 226a on page 112 of the document: "Ability to disable
the use of cell towers, Bluetooth, and Wi-Fi when determining location."
See
<docs.google.com/document/d/1JznrWfGJDA8CYVfjSnPTwfVy8-gAC0kPyaApuJTcUNE/#bookmark=id.x2kgnof1c08p>

<snip>

--
“If you are not an expert on a subject, then your opinions about it
really do matter less than the opinions of experts. It's not
indoctrination nor elitism. It's just that you don't know as much as
they do about the subject.”—Tin Foil Awards

In article <u4jivm$2ndr0$1@dont-email.me>, sms
<scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:

> I can answer that for you since nospam is not familiar with how location
> services work on Android and iOS.

accusations are confessions.

> Unless I missed it, on iOS there is no separate option in Location
> Services for GPS versus "GPS plus Wi-Fi, cell tower, and Bluetooth." You
> cannot use only the GPS when determining location.

further proof that you don't understand how location services works.

On May 23, 2023, sms wrote
(in article<news:u4jivm$2ndr0$1@dont-email.me>):

> I can answer that for you since nospam is not familiar with how location
> services work on Android and iOS.

I could tell nospam didn't have any idea how they worked when he hid behind
a wall of insults (and when he made absurd claims about precise location).

> Unless I missed it, on iOS there is no separate option in Location
> Services for GPS versus "GPS plus Wi-Fi, cell tower, and Bluetooth." You
> cannot use only the GPS when determining location.

If what you said is correct, iOS lacks the functionality that Android has
of being able to route with just GPS and not Wi-Fi or cell or Bluetooth.

> Here is a photo of screenshots from my iPhone 11 and my Pixel 7 Pro:
> <https://i.imgur.com/AkKioH2.jpeg>.

I agree those images appear to show that the iPhone 11 can't do what your
Pixel 7 Pro (and all Android phones) can do, which is use only GPS for
location (instead of the combo of GPS, Wi-Fi, cellular and Bluetooth).

> On my Pixel 7 Pro, running Android 13, it is not necessary to have
> "Improve Location Accuracy" turned on in order for Google Maps
> navigation to work. I am using version 11.79.0301, updated on May 10,
> 2023, which I believe is the latest version. What phone, and what
> version of Android and Google Maps, are you using that requires you to
> have this turned on?

We're in agreement that there should be no need to turn on what Google
calls "Location Accuracy" so maybe what I'll do is update the Maps app.

> So why would you ever want to turn off "Improve Location Accuracy?" on
> Android? First, there's no need for it when you're in a place where the
> satellite GPS works because the GPS gives you much greater accuracy than
> cell towers, Wi-Fi, or Bluetooth. Second, it measurably reduces battery
> drain on Android.

I think you meant to ask why would you ever NOT want to turn off "Improve
Location Accuracy", didn't you? GPS alone is good enough for driving.

> I can't comment on iPhone since it's not possible to
> prevent the device from using those other radios.

Thank you for letting me know the iPhone can't turn these off separately.

That's probably why nospam kept hiding behind layered walls of insults.
He didn't want to say that the iPhone isn't capable of turning them off.

> If you want Location Services to work, on Android, when you're deep
> inside a building then you should turn on "Improve Location Accuracy,"
> otherwise keep it off.

I do not want to turn on Google's location accuracy. I only want GPS.

I was asking if iOS Google Maps needed it turned on, but when you said iOS
can't turn it off in iOS, that explains why nospam was hurling his insults.

> Interestingly, Android used to have a setting to
> use only cell towers, Bluetooth, and Wi-Fi for Location Services,
> turning off the GPS to reduce battery drain, but that does not appear to
> be a standard feature of Android anymore.

I looked and I don't see it in Android 12. What I see you can turn off is
Settings > Location > Location services > Google Location Accuracy.

That's an on/off switch saying "Improve Location Accuracy" which says this.

"Google's location service improves location accuracy by using Wi-Fi,
mobile networks and sensors to help estimate your location. Google may
collect location data periodically and use this data in an anonymous way to
improve location accuracy and location-based services. Turning this off
will result in your device only using GPS for location."

That last sentence shows that Android can use just GPS even if iOS can't.
It's pretty bad if iOS can't decouple Google's data collection from GPS.

> I added this as 226a on page 112 of the document: "Ability to disable
> the use of cell towers, Bluetooth, and Wi-Fi when determining location."
> See
> <docs.google.com/document/d/1JznrWfGJDA8CYVfjSnPTwfVy8-gAC0kPyaApuJTcUNE/#bookmark=id.x2kgnof1c08p>

Thank you for adding that as it explains why nospam was trying so hard to
hide behind multiple walls of insults to avoid answering that question.

Your description of that is nice where the first sentence explains it good.

"On Android, you can turn off the ability of Location Services to use cell
towers, Bluetooth, and Wi-Fi networks when determining the location of the
device, see Manage your Android device's location settings. On iOS this is
not possible (unless you turn off cellular, Bluetooth, and Wi-Fi)."

If you want, you can also mention Google says it can use "sensors" too.

Also you might want to mention my Android 12 decouples not only GPS but
even the Bluetooth and Wi-Fi scanning have their own decoupling switches in
Settings > Location > Location services > Improve Accuracy

Wi-Fi scanning
"Let apps use Wi-Fi for more accurate location detection,
*even when Wi-Fi is off*."

Bluetooth scanning
"Let apps use Bluetooth for more accurate location detection,
*even when Bluetooth is off*."

You mention in your description a couple of reasons WHY you want to
decouple Bluetooth and Wi-Fi scanning but you didn't mention this reason,
which is that by allowing them to stay on (even when they look like they're
turned off!), they are what allows Google to collect data all around you.

Why should you work on behalf of Google as their own personal street car
hoovering up all the Bluetooth & Wi-Fi around you when you don't need it.

If iOS can't decouple these from GPS, that's why nospam was hiding behind
multiple walls of insults - he didn't want to say iOS can't decouple them.

Ron, the humblest guy in town.

On May 23, 2023, nospam wrote
(in article<news:230520231853119482%nospam@nospam.invalid>):

>>> Why would you think that GPS-only is only "approximate location?"
>>
>> That's not me thinking that. It's nospam. GPS alone is fine for driving.
>
> you are lying again.
>
> nobody said that.

You don't matter anymore because sms reported that iOS can't decouple the
GPS from the Wi-Fi & Bluetooth while Android has switches to decouple them.

Ron, the humblest guy in town.

In article <1he8nwy6wxcql$.dlg@news.solani.org>, RonTheGuy
<ron@null.invalid> wrote:

> >>> Why would you think that GPS-only is only "approximate location?"
> >>
> >> That's not me thinking that. It's nospam. GPS alone is fine for driving.
> >
> > you are lying again.
> >
> > nobody said that.
>
> You don't matter anymore because sms reported that iOS can't decouple the
> GPS from the Wi-Fi & Bluetooth while Android has switches to decouple them.

you're moving the goalposts yet again, and further proving that neither
of you understand how any of it works.

On Tue, 23 May 2023 13:28:45 -0700, sms wrote:
> Hmm. I turned off precise location (called "Improve Location Accuracy"
> by using Wi-Fi, mobile networks, and sensors) on my Pixel 7 Pro (running
> Android 13) and Google Maps still works for navigation. No nag screens.

I think he said you have to disable precise location at least twice.
Once in the Android Location settings. Again in the Google Maps settings.

You may have tested it only with the precise location turned off for
Android but not also turning it off for the Google Maps app setup.

I ran a search whose results imply Google may have changed things recently.

Google Maps now requires WiFi scanning to use navigation [April 4, 2023]

https://www.deceptive.design/articles/google-maps-now-requires-wifi-scanning-to-use-navigation
https://www.reddit.com/r/hackernews/comments/si6wx2/google_maps_now_requires_wifi_scanning_to_use/
https://twitter.com/darkpatterns/status/1488641697227624448
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30167865
https://gigazine.net/gsc_news/en/20220204-google-map-wi-fi-gps/

"Now, enter a new update. I can no longer navigate with Google Maps, unless
full location tracking is on. Comments in Play Store indicate others hit
the same wall."

"a further update to Google Maps will prevent navigation on Google Maps
without fully allowing location tracking."

The app description says it can't use only GPS anymore also.
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.google.android.apps.maps

There are only two choices now, none of them are GPS only anymore.
Location Permission is only "precise location (GPS and network-based)" and
"approximate location (network-based)."

There no longer seems to be an option in Google Maps for GPS only location.

On May 23, 2023, nospam wrote
(in article<news:230520232231308591%nospam@nospam.invalid>):

>>>>> Why would you think that GPS-only is only "approximate location?"
>>>>
>>>> That's not me thinking that. It's nospam. GPS alone is fine for driving.
>>>
>>> you are lying again.
>>>
>>> nobody said that.
>>
>> You don't matter anymore because sms reported that iOS can't decouple the
>> GPS from the Wi-Fi & Bluetooth while Android has switches to decouple them.
>
> you're moving the goalposts yet again, and further proving that neither
> of you understand how any of it works.

You repeatedly hid behind a wall of insults because you didn't want it
known that iOS can't decouple the GPS from the Wi-Fi/BT & Android can.

Ron, the humblest guy in town.

On Tue, 23 May 2023 12:22:42 -0700, sms wrote:

> According to
> <https://www.antlabs.com/advisories/advisory-ios-14-and-android-10-how-do-randomized-mac-addresses-affect-your-network/>
> the "24 hour" feature was only in some iOS 14 beta versions and was not
> present in the final release of iOS 14.

Then iOS is three years (& counting) behind Android on mac address privacy.

> I'm not sure what the upside is of generating a new randomized MAC
> address when reconnecting to a previously connected to Wi-Fi network.
> Android does give you that option though. I suppose it does provide some
> additional anti-tracking security when reconnecting to public hotspots.

Each approach confers a different level of privacy for the Android user.

The first level of privacy is randomization of the mac while probing.
The second level of privacy is mac randomization for each access point.
An even greater level of privacy is to randomize for each connection.

The additional privacy upside for each level should be obvious to anyone.

An example is if you visit a hotspot three times in the same day, or ten
times in the same week or even twice in the same year, why should that
hotspot be able to connect repeat visits to your (randomized) mac address?

In article <1hrju23khyh4.dlg@news.solani.org>, RonTheGuy
<ron@null.invalid> wrote:

> You repeatedly hid behind a wall of insults

the only person with a 'wall of insults' is you

On Mon, 22 May 2023 19:40:44 -0700, sms wrote:

> I just tried it, on both iOS and Android, at work where we have four
> different Wi-Fi networks and it remembers the MAC address when you
> switch back and forth between networks, without "re-randomizing." This
> is for both iOS and Android.

It seems even the experts are unclear how it all works as shown in this
22-page "Analysis of MAC Randomization Schemes in Wi-Fi Clients" by Arista.

https://wifihelp.arista.com/post/analysis-of-mac-randomization-schemes-in-wifi-clients/?pdf=1551

At least they show their steps for how they tested iOS 14 & Android 11,
(but you'll likely be surprised what they say about the 24 hour period).

On May 24, 2023, nospam wrote
(in article<news:240520230729331806%nospam@nospam.invalid>):

>> You repeatedly hid behind a wall of insults
>
> the only person with a 'wall of insults' is you

Not only did you respond to questions only with a wall of insults, but you
hid behind them because you didn't want it known that iOS does NOT change
the random mac per connection (not even every 24 hours, apparently).

At least that's what sms has reported - so at this point the iOS 24-hour
randomization is a probably revoked beta feature that was tested by Apple
(unless someone can show Apple iOS 16 cites supporting the 24-hour claim).
https://levl.tech/resources/mac-address-is-going-away-now-what

That's in addition to you hiding behind those insults because you didn't
want it to be known iOS can't decouple the GPS from the Wi-Fi & Bluetooth.

Ron, the humblest guy in town.

On 5/23/2023 3:25 PM, RonTheGuy wrote:

> I suspect you aren't testing what I'm testing, so please check settings.
> Make sure you are not logged into Google at any time you try this.
>
> In Settings | Location | Location services, turn everything off.
> Specifically make sure three things are off that are important.
> Google Location Accuracy
> Wi-Fi scanning
> Bluetooth scanning
>
> Then go to Settings | Location | App permissions & find "Maps."
> Make sure the only setting turned on is "Allow only while using this app."
> Specifically make sure "Use precise location" is definitely turned off!

Here are my settings now: <https://i.imgur.com/UftQRGr.png>.

Google Maps Navigation still works.

Maybe your version of Android on your device is different.

--
“If you are not an expert on a subject, then your opinions about it
really do matter less than the opinions of experts. It's not
indoctrination nor elitism. It's just that you don't know as much as
they do about the subject.”—Tin Foil Awards

On 5/23/2023 6:43 PM, RonTheGuy wrote:

<snip>

> If what you said is correct, iOS lacks the functionality that Android has
> of being able to route with just GPS and not Wi-Fi or cell or Bluetooth.

Not true. iPhones route just fine when you're in an area with no cell
service, no Wi-Fi (or Wi-Fi is off), and when no Bluetooth is present or
Bluetooth is off. There's just no way to turn them off just for GPS.

<snip>

> I think you meant to ask why would you ever NOT want to turn off "Improve
> Location Accuracy", didn't you? GPS alone is good enough for driving.

For driving, that's true. But sometimes you're deep inside a building
with no GPS access, and you want to use Google Maps.

>
>> I can't comment on iPhone since it's not possible to
>> prevent the device from using those other radios.
>
> Thank you for letting me know the iPhone can't turn these off separately.
>
> That's probably why nospam kept hiding behind layered walls of insults.
> He didn't want to say that the iPhone isn't capable of turning them off.

Correct.

> I was asking if iOS Google Maps needed it turned on, but when you said iOS
> can't turn it off in iOS, that explains why nospam was hurling his insults.

Correct.

<snip>

> If iOS can't decouple these from GPS, that's why nospam was hiding behind
> multiple walls of insults - he didn't want to say iOS can't decouple them.

That's the reason.

<snip>

--
“If you are not an expert on a subject, then your opinions about it
really do matter less than the opinions of experts. It's not
indoctrination nor elitism. It's just that you don't know as much as
they do about the subject.”—Tin Foil Awards

socialite <spam@nospam.net> wrote:
>> I just tried it, on both iOS and Android, at work where we have four
>> different Wi-Fi networks and it remembers the MAC address when you
>> switch back and forth between networks, without "re-randomizing." This
>> is for both iOS and Android.
>
> It seems even the experts are unclear how it all works as shown in this
> 22-page "Analysis of MAC Randomization Schemes in Wi-Fi Clients" by Arista.
>
> https://wifihelp.arista.com/post/analysis-of-mac-randomization-schemes-in-wifi-clients/?pdf=1551
>
> At least they show their steps for how they tested iOS 14 & Android 11,
> (but you'll likely be surprised what they say about the 24 hour period).

It gets even more confusing when you look at what Apple does NOT say.
https://support.apple.com/guide/security/wi-fi-privacy-secb9cb3140c/web

There's nothing I found in there about any 24-hour randomization period.
https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT211227

Even during the iOS 14 beta period companies had problems reproducing it.
https://www.techrepublic.com/article/how-to-manage-or-disable-mac-randomization-in-ios-and-ipados-14/

If I were to guess based on the data, I suspect Apple briefly tested the
24-hour period in the iOS 14 beta, dropped it - and never added it back.
https://www.extremenetworks.com/extreme-networks-blog/wi-fi-mac-randomization-privacy-and-collateral-damage/

The result would be that in the latest iOS the SSID randomization is rigid.

On 5/22/2023 7:40 PM, sms wrote:

<snip>

> Even forgetting a network then re-entering credentials, did not change
> the randomized MAC address, nor did powering the device down then up
> then reconnecting to the same network. I'll try on Wednesday morning
> which will be more than 24 hours.

After 24 hours, with the iPhone powered-off then powered on, one of the
MAC addresses on one Wi-Fi network remained the same, and one of the MAC
addresses on another Wi-Fi network changed. Doubt if it is relevant but
the one that remained the same was on a 2.4GHz network and the one that
changed was on a 5GHz network.

On the Pixel 7 Pro, also powered off then on, both MAC addresses
remained the same after 24 hours.

--
“If you are not an expert on a subject, then your opinions about it
really do matter less than the opinions of experts. It's not
indoctrination nor elitism. It's just that you don't know as much as
they do about the subject.”—Tin Foil Awards

On 24-05-2023 17:58 sms <scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:

>> Even forgetting a network then re-entering credentials, did not change
>> the randomized MAC address, nor did powering the device down then up
>> then reconnecting to the same network. I'll try on Wednesday morning
>> which will be more than 24 hours.
>
> After 24 hours, with the iPhone powered-off then powered on, one of the
> MAC addresses on one Wi-Fi network remained the same, and one of the MAC
> addresses on another Wi-Fi network changed. Doubt if it is relevant but
> the one that remained the same was on a 2.4GHz network and the one that
> changed was on a 5GHz network.
>
> On the Pixel 7 Pro, also powered off then on, both MAC addresses
> remained the same after 24 hours.

Very nice testing. I don't have the iPhone but I can run Android 12 tests.
My router has two APs with different SSIDs, one is 2.5GHz & one is 5GHz.

I turned on Enhanced Wi-Fi MAC randomization in Developer Options.
To start fresh, I pressed Forget for the home WI-Fi 5GHz AP.

Then I shut down the phone after turning off both cellular data & Wi-Fi.
And started it back up (I guess I could have just hit the restart button).

I turned on Wi-Fi & pressed the Add network plus sign.
I added the access point & noted MAC address type = Randomized MAC.
Because it's considered a new connection, I had to type the credentials.
To give me control of when it connects, I set Autoreconnect to off.

I clicked on the setup above to make that new connection to my 5GHz AP.
Pressing the gear icon & then View more & scrolling shows the MAC address.

a6:b5:4c:f1:80:1f was the random MAC address assigned to the connection.

I'm not sure what to do next, but the simplest thing to do is to shut off
the Wi-Fi, wait a minute or two and turn it back on and check the MAC.

Since I had autoreconnect off, I had to click on the existing connection.

When I turned the Wi-Fi back on, it connected to the 2GHz AP (which had
autoreconnect set to on) so I disconnected from that & connected to 5GHz.

It kept the same random a6:b5:4c:f1:80:1f MAC address as it had before.
This means it did not change the MAC on each connection attempt.

I connected & disconnected between the 2.4GHz and 5GHz access point.
It still kept the same a6:b5:4c:f1:80:1f MAC address for the 5GHz AP.

I turned off Wi-Fi and turned it back on & reconnected to the 5GHz AP.
I powered off the phone and powered it back on in a minute or two.

Since autoreconnect was off, I tapped on the connection for 5GHz.
c6:98:54:17:70:4c was the new MAC address assigned to the connection.

This means it changed the MAC address when the phone was turned off/on.
Next I used the restart button instead of shutting the phone completely.

I forgot to turn off the Wi-Fi but with autoreconnect off it didn't connect
to anything (since I also turned off the autoreconnect to the 2.4GHz AP).

2a:9a:c4:e8:a4:6c was the new MAC address, so a reboot works as well.
I went into Developer Options and turned off the enhanced randomization.

I pressed the restart button & when it restarted I tapped the connection.
This gave me a surprise since I had expected to keep the same MAC address.

But 16:5a:c1:ab:c5:7c was the new MAC address for the 5GHz connection.
I again tapped the restart button to check if it changed when rebooted.

This time it kept the 16:5a:c1:ab:c5:7c MAC address for the 5GHz AP.
You tell me what you make of these tests or if you want more tests done.

I went back to Developer Options and turned on enhanced randomization.
I restarted and reconnected to the 5GHz AP to check the MAC address.

Again I was surprised as I had expected the same MAC but it changed.
06:1c:1d:9d:2f:c7 was the new MAC address assigned to the connection.

Normally I don't disconnect from the Wi-Fi but what I did was disconnect
from the 5GHz AP & instead connected to the 2.4GHz AP on the same router.

I'll write both MAC addresses here so that I can check in 24 hours.
06:1c:1d:9d:2f:c7 is the MAC address assigned to the 5GHz connection.
3a:b3:b5:47:bf:02 is the MAC address assigned to the 2.4GHz connection.

Any other (easy!) tests requested?

On 25-05-2023 00:59 Oscar Mayer <nobody@oscarmayer.com> wrote:

> I'll write both MAC addresses here so that I can check in 24 hours.
> 06:1c:1d:9d:2f:c7 is the MAC address assigned to the 5GHz connection.
> 3a:b3:b5:47:bf:02 is the MAC address assigned to the 2.4GHz connection.
>
> Any other (easy!) tests requested?

Try it without turning off the phone but just turning on and off the
enhanced wi-fi randomization since that changed it each time for you.