Pink! With flowers!

https://nypost.com/2021/10/07/nyc-thief-steals-10-year-olds-phone/
--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 8:24:54 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
> Pink! With flowers!
>
> https://nypost.com/2021/10/07/nyc-thief-steals-10-year-olds-phone/

Not a word about him probably being an illegal alien flown to NYC by Joe Biden's orders.

On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 10:33:59 AM UTC-5, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 8:24:54 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
> > Pink! With flowers!
> >
> > https://nypost.com/2021/10/07/nyc-thief-steals-10-year-olds-phone/
> Not a word about him probably being an illegal alien flown to NYC by Joe Biden's orders.

Nooooo Tommy. He was probably one of the many illegal immigrants working at Trump's Mar a Lago resort that got fired when Trump was too cheap to pay them below minimum wage.

Now I admit to not being up to date with kids and such. But I find it a little odd that a 10 year old kid has a cellular phone to steal. Or lose. That is 4th grade elementary school. I guess kids have become much more responsible now. They need phones and internet and such to call up Mom and Dad and tell them when they expect to be picked up from school and make sure supper is ready when they want it. And calling all their vast network of friends and associates to set up meetings to discuss homework assignments. Very responsible 10 year old kids today that need high tech communication devices. I seem to recall we still had a black and white TV when I was in 4th grade. One TV in the whole house in the living room. No TV in every room like today. One wired to the wall phone in the whole house too. 3 maybe 4 channels on the TV. The bad old days.

On Thu, 7 Oct 2021 21:55:55 -0700 (PDT), "russellseaton1@yahoo.com"
<ritzannaseaton@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 10:33:59 AM UTC-5, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 8:24:54 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
>> > Pink! With flowers!
>> >
>> > https://nypost.com/2021/10/07/nyc-thief-steals-10-year-olds-phone/
>> Not a word about him probably being an illegal alien flown to NYC by Joe Biden's orders.
>
>Nooooo Tommy. He was probably one of the many illegal immigrants working at Trump's Mar a Lago resort that got fired when Trump was too cheap to pay them below minimum wage.
>
>Now I admit to not being up to date with kids and such. But I find it a little odd that a 10 year old kid has a cellular phone to steal. Or lose. That is 4th grade elementary school. I guess kids have become much more responsible now. They need phones and internet and such to call up Mom and Dad and tell them when they expect to be picked up from school and make sure supper is ready when they want it. And calling all their vast network of friends and associates to set up meetings to discuss homework assignments. Very responsible 10 year old kids today that need high tech communication devices. I seem to recall we still had a black and white TV when I was in 4th grade. One TV in the whole house in the living room. No TV in every room like today. One wired to the wall phone in the whole house too. 3 maybe 4 channels on the TV. The bad old days.

Goodness, you must be some sort of old fuddy-duddy when it comes to
phones. I just read that
"A recent study finds that more than half of all kids have a
smartphone by the time the age of 12, but it’s not uncommon to see
children much younger who have their own device. In fact, according to
Common Sense, about one in five kids have a phone by age eight."
https://www.androidguys.com/tips-tools/what-age-should-children-get-their-first-phone/

And on another site an "expert" advises that "children 6 years old and
younger really don't require a hand phone".
--
Cheers,

John B.

Why did your phone have to be wired to the wall, Russell? Was it such a crime-ridden neighborhood you feared it would be stolen? What good would a phone from those days be once detached from the network? Surely there wasn't enough copper in it to get a junkie a fix? Just asking, since you claim to have answers for everything, and you always insist yours are the only right answers, but you don't always make sense. -- Andre Jute

On Friday, October 8, 2021 at 5:55:57 AM UTC+1, russellseaton1@yahoo.com wrote:
>I seem to recall we still had a black and white TV when I was in 4th grade.. One TV in the whole house in the living room. No TV in every room like today. One wired to the wall phone in the whole house too. 3 maybe 4 channels on the TV. The bad old days.<

On Friday, October 8, 2021 at 1:45:53 AM UTC-5, John B. wrote:
> On Thu, 7 Oct 2021 21:55:55 -0700 (PDT), "russell...@yahoo.com"
> <ritzann...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 10:33:59 AM UTC-5, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
> >> On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 8:24:54 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
> >> > Pink! With flowers!
> >> >
> >> > https://nypost.com/2021/10/07/nyc-thief-steals-10-year-olds-phone/
> >> Not a word about him probably being an illegal alien flown to NYC by Joe Biden's orders.
> >
> >Nooooo Tommy. He was probably one of the many illegal immigrants working at Trump's Mar a Lago resort that got fired when Trump was too cheap to pay them below minimum wage.
> >
> >Now I admit to not being up to date with kids and such. But I find it a little odd that a 10 year old kid has a cellular phone to steal. Or lose. That is 4th grade elementary school. I guess kids have become much more responsible now. They need phones and internet and such to call up Mom and Dad and tell them when they expect to be picked up from school and make sure supper is ready when they want it. And calling all their vast network of friends and associates to set up meetings to discuss homework assignments. Very responsible 10 year old kids today that need high tech communication devices. I seem to recall we still had a black and white TV when I was in 4th grade. One TV in the whole house in the living room. No TV in every room like today. One wired to the wall phone in the whole house too. 3 maybe 4 channels on the TV. The bad old days.
> Goodness, you must be some sort of old fuddy-duddy when it comes to
> phones. I just read that
> "A recent study finds that more than half of all kids have a
> smartphone by the time the age of 12, but it’s not uncommon to see
> children much younger who have their own device. In fact, according to
> Common Sense, about one in five kids have a phone by age eight."
> https://www.androidguys.com/tips-tools/what-age-should-children-get-their-first-phone/
>
> And on another site an "expert" advises that "children 6 years old and
> younger really don't require a hand phone".

Well at least we have one expert thinking Kindergarten age kids and pre-school kids should not have phones. Its been way too long ago to remember, but I don't recall being sharp enough to know how to use a phone when I was that old. But I suspect kids today are much, much smarter than me.

> --
> Cheers,
>
> John B.

On Fri, 8 Oct 2021 00:15:44 -0700 (PDT), "russellseaton1@yahoo.com"
<ritzannaseaton@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Friday, October 8, 2021 at 1:45:53 AM UTC-5, John B. wrote:
>> On Thu, 7 Oct 2021 21:55:55 -0700 (PDT), "russell...@yahoo.com"
>> <ritzann...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> >On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 10:33:59 AM UTC-5, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
>> >> On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 8:24:54 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
>> >> > Pink! With flowers!
>> >> >
>> >> > https://nypost.com/2021/10/07/nyc-thief-steals-10-year-olds-phone/
>> >> Not a word about him probably being an illegal alien flown to NYC by Joe Biden's orders.
>> >
>> >Nooooo Tommy. He was probably one of the many illegal immigrants working at Trump's Mar a Lago resort that got fired when Trump was too cheap to pay them below minimum wage.
>> >
>> >Now I admit to not being up to date with kids and such. But I find it a little odd that a 10 year old kid has a cellular phone to steal. Or lose. That is 4th grade elementary school. I guess kids have become much more responsible now. They need phones and internet and such to call up Mom and Dad and tell them when they expect to be picked up from school and make sure supper is ready when they want it. And calling all their vast network of friends and associates to set up meetings to discuss homework assignments. Very responsible 10 year old kids today that need high tech communication devices. I seem to recall we still had a black and white TV when I was in 4th grade. One TV in the whole house in the living room. No TV in every room like today. One wired to the wall phone in the whole house too. 3 maybe 4 channels on the TV. The bad old days.
>> Goodness, you must be some sort of old fuddy-duddy when it comes to
>> phones. I just read that
>> "A recent study finds that more than half of all kids have a
>> smartphone by the time the age of 12, but it’s not uncommon to see
>> children much younger who have their own device. In fact, according to
>> Common Sense, about one in five kids have a phone by age eight."
>> https://www.androidguys.com/tips-tools/what-age-should-children-get-their-first-phone/
>>
>> And on another site an "expert" advises that "children 6 years old and
>> younger really don't require a hand phone".
>
>Well at least we have one expert thinking Kindergarten age kids
and pre-school kids should not have phones. Its been way too long ago
to remember, but I don't recall being sharp enough to know how to use
a phone when I was that old. But I suspect kids today are much, much
smarter than me.

I remember we did a lot of skiing in the winter and swimming in the
summer.

Funny how you remember some things and not others. I can remember my
mother taking me swimming and telling me that when I could swim across
the creek, climb up and jump of a big rock on that side and swim back
I could go swimming all alone. As big a milestone as getting my
driver's license at 16.
--
Cheers,

John B.

On 10/7/2021 9:55 PM, russellseaton1@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 10:33:59 AM UTC-5, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 8:24:54 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
>>> Pink! With flowers!
>>>
>>> https://nypost.com/2021/10/07/nyc-thief-steals-10-year-olds-phone/
>> Not a word about him probably being an illegal alien flown to NYC by Joe Biden's orders.
>
> Nooooo Tommy. He was probably one of the many illegal immigrants working at Trump's Mar a Lago resort that got fired when Trump was too cheap to pay them below minimum wage.

There are soon going to be a lot more minimum-wage workers entering the
labor force: <https://i.imgur.com/OzcaUwc.jpeg>.

Article at
<https://www.nj.com/opinion/2021/10/unmasked-unvaxxed-unemployed-sheneman.html>.

On 10/8/2021 3:15 AM, russellseaton1@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Friday, October 8, 2021 at 1:45:53 AM UTC-5, John B. wrote:
>> On Thu, 7 Oct 2021 21:55:55 -0700 (PDT), "russell...@yahoo.com"
>> <ritzann...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 10:33:59 AM UTC-5, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>> On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 8:24:54 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
>>>>> Pink! With flowers!
>>>>>
>>>>> https://nypost.com/2021/10/07/nyc-thief-steals-10-year-olds-phone/
>>>> Not a word about him probably being an illegal alien flown to NYC by Joe Biden's orders.
>>>
>>> Nooooo Tommy. He was probably one of the many illegal immigrants working at Trump's Mar a Lago resort that got fired when Trump was too cheap to pay them below minimum wage.
>>>
>>> Now I admit to not being up to date with kids and such. But I find it a little odd that a 10 year old kid has a cellular phone to steal. Or lose. That is 4th grade elementary school. I guess kids have become much more responsible now. They need phones and internet and such to call up Mom and Dad and tell them when they expect to be picked up from school and make sure supper is ready when they want it. And calling all their vast network of friends and associates to set up meetings to discuss homework assignments. Very responsible 10 year old kids today that need high tech communication devices. I seem to recall we still had a black and white TV when I was in 4th grade. One TV in the whole house in the living room. No TV in every room like today. One wired to the wall phone in the whole house too. 3 maybe 4 channels on the TV. The bad old days.
>> Goodness, you must be some sort of old fuddy-duddy when it comes to
>> phones. I just read that
>> "A recent study finds that more than half of all kids have a
>> smartphone by the time the age of 12, but it’s not uncommon to see
>> children much younger who have their own device. In fact, according to
>> Common Sense, about one in five kids have a phone by age eight."
>> https://www.androidguys.com/tips-tools/what-age-should-children-get-their-first-phone/
>>
>> And on another site an "expert" advises that "children 6 years old and
>> younger really don't require a hand phone".
>
> Well at least we have one expert thinking Kindergarten age kids and pre-school kids should not have phones. Its been way too long ago to remember, but I don't recall being sharp enough to know how to use a phone when I was that old. But I suspect kids today are much, much smarter than me.

Here's a weird side effect: Back in the days of phones tied to the wall,
a grandparent, uncle or aunt could call the house, a kid as young as age
four could pick up the phone, and the kid and adult could have a nice
conversation.

Now the kid's parents each have a personal cell phone, which many of
them drop on the counter as soon as they enter the house. If a relative
else calls hoping to talk to a kid, it doesn't work. The kid isn't
allowed to answer Mom's or Dad's personal phone. One can leave a
message, but the call gets returned only when the parent is not busy -
often after the kids are in bed.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On Fri, 08 Oct 2021 11:19:55 -0400, Frank Krygowski scribed:

> Here's a weird side effect: Back in the days of phones tied to the wall,
> a grandparent, uncle or aunt could call the house, a kid as young as age
> four could pick up the phone, and the kid and adult could have a nice
> conversation.

Party lines were good and bad. The good part was winding the ringer
allowed you to tell all on the line that a scrub fire had broken out and
various people could arrange fore the fire tender, various community
assistance if bad, etc.

On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 9:55:57 PM UTC-7, russellseaton1@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 10:33:59 AM UTC-5, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 8:24:54 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
> > > Pink! With flowers!
> > >
> > > https://nypost.com/2021/10/07/nyc-thief-steals-10-year-olds-phone/
> > Not a word about him probably being an illegal alien flown to NYC by Joe Biden's orders.
> Nooooo Tommy. He was probably one of the many illegal immigrants working at Trump's Mar a Lago resort that got fired when Trump was too cheap to pay them below minimum wage.
>
> Now I admit to not being up to date with kids and such. But I find it a little odd that a 10 year old kid has a cellular phone to steal. Or lose. That is 4th grade elementary school. I guess kids have become much more responsible now. They need phones and internet and such to call up Mom and Dad and tell them when they expect to be picked up from school and make sure supper is ready when they want it. And calling all their vast network of friends and associates to set up meetings to discuss homework assignments. Very responsible 10 year old kids today that need high tech communication devices. I seem to recall we still had a black and white TV when I was in 4th grade. One TV in the whole house in the living room. No TV in every room like today. One wired to the wall phone in the whole house too. 3 maybe 4 channels on the TV. The bad old days.

Little Russy doesn't even see what the hell he wrote. Trump fired the workers he was supposedly paying less than minimum wage because he was too cheap to pay them below minimum wage. Little Russy can't help himself from showing an ignorance that would even embarrass John. Then he wants to pretend that the Dollar is strong because other forms of exchange are dropping faster.. It is mind boggling that this guy has presented himself as college educated in economics when EVERYONE that has tried to buy anything has watched the rapid deflation of the American dollar. We are suppose to think like he, that the Chinese Yen which is falling like a rock because of their real estate speculation in the USA, or the Euro or English Lb that are falling because they stopped their means of production and have to buy everything from the US now, is surprising in the least. This so-called educated turd, doesn't even know that the UNIT OF EXCHANGE ALWAYS moves slower than those that are not. Being stupid because you like being stupid really does demonstrate a certain lack of intellectual capacity.

On Friday, October 8, 2021 at 12:02:36 AM UTC-7, Andre Jute wrote:
> Why did your phone have to be wired to the wall, Russell? Was it such a crime-ridden neighborhood you feared it would be stolen? What good would a phone from those days be once detached from the network? Surely there wasn't enough copper in it to get a junkie a fix? Just asking, since you claim to have answers for everything, and you always insist yours are the only right answers, but you don't always make sense. -- Andre Jute
> On Friday, October 8, 2021 at 5:55:57 AM UTC+1, russell...@yahoo.com wrote:
> >I seem to recall we still had a black and white TV when I was in 4th grade. One TV in the whole house in the living room. No TV in every room like today. One wired to the wall phone in the whole house too. 3 maybe 4 channels on the TV. The bad old days.<
Land lines now require so little power that wiring a large building like I was partner in a business doing, now uses wire about half the gauge as before. For skyscrapers like I used to wire, this is a savings in the tens of thousands of dollars. Though I wonder if you could hang those fine interconnect wires down from the 30th story without then tearing themselves from the weight of the copper.

On Friday, October 8, 2021 at 8:20:01 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
> On 10/8/2021 3:15 AM, russell...@yahoo.com wrote:
> > On Friday, October 8, 2021 at 1:45:53 AM UTC-5, John B. wrote:
> >> On Thu, 7 Oct 2021 21:55:55 -0700 (PDT), "russell...@yahoo.com"
> >> <ritzann...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>> On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 10:33:59 AM UTC-5, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
> >>>> On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 8:24:54 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
> >>>>> Pink! With flowers!
> >>>>>
> >>>>> https://nypost.com/2021/10/07/nyc-thief-steals-10-year-olds-phone/
> >>>> Not a word about him probably being an illegal alien flown to NYC by Joe Biden's orders.
> >>>
> >>> Nooooo Tommy. He was probably one of the many illegal immigrants working at Trump's Mar a Lago resort that got fired when Trump was too cheap to pay them below minimum wage.
> >>>
> >>> Now I admit to not being up to date with kids and such. But I find it a little odd that a 10 year old kid has a cellular phone to steal. Or lose.. That is 4th grade elementary school. I guess kids have become much more responsible now. They need phones and internet and such to call up Mom and Dad and tell them when they expect to be picked up from school and make sure supper is ready when they want it. And calling all their vast network of friends and associates to set up meetings to discuss homework assignments. Very responsible 10 year old kids today that need high tech communication devices. I seem to recall we still had a black and white TV when I was in 4th grade. One TV in the whole house in the living room. No TV in every room like today. One wired to the wall phone in the whole house too. 3 maybe 4 channels on the TV. The bad old days.
> >> Goodness, you must be some sort of old fuddy-duddy when it comes to
> >> phones. I just read that
> >> "A recent study finds that more than half of all kids have a
> >> smartphone by the time the age of 12, but it’s not uncommon to see
> >> children much younger who have their own device. In fact, according to
> >> Common Sense, about one in five kids have a phone by age eight."
> >> https://www.androidguys.com/tips-tools/what-age-should-children-get-their-first-phone/
> >>
> >> And on another site an "expert" advises that "children 6 years old and
> >> younger really don't require a hand phone".
> >
> > Well at least we have one expert thinking Kindergarten age kids and pre-school kids should not have phones. Its been way too long ago to remember, but I don't recall being sharp enough to know how to use a phone when I was that old. But I suspect kids today are much, much smarter than me.
> Here's a weird side effect: Back in the days of phones tied to the wall,
> a grandparent, uncle or aunt could call the house, a kid as young as age
> four could pick up the phone, and the kid and adult could have a nice
> conversation.
>
> Now the kid's parents each have a personal cell phone, which many of
> them drop on the counter as soon as they enter the house. If a relative
> else calls hoping to talk to a kid, it doesn't work. The kid isn't
> allowed to answer Mom's or Dad's personal phone. One can leave a
> message, but the call gets returned only when the parent is not busy -
> often after the kids are in bed.

And this is entirely aside from the fact that using the phone uses pretty powerful RF that is increasing the rates of brain cancer in young kids. This isn't something you should do with developing kids. Now, of course using Google or some such isn't destructive since it is only receiving. But as I pointed out elsewhere, almost every site on Google is OPINION and you can see the effect of that from Johnny and Russy who merely look for a "reference" that agrees with their opinions and then presents that as fact.

As a teacher do you believe that kids should be exposed to opinions like this or generally agreed upon facts that are used in textbooks?

On Friday, October 8, 2021 at 4:27:32 PM UTC-7, News 2021 wrote:
> On Fri, 08 Oct 2021 11:19:55 -0400, Frank Krygowski scribed:
> > Here's a weird side effect: Back in the days of phones tied to the wall,
> > a grandparent, uncle or aunt could call the house, a kid as young as age
> > four could pick up the phone, and the kid and adult could have a nice
> > conversation.
> Party lines were good and bad. The good part was winding the ringer
> allowed you to tell all on the line that a scrub fire had broken out and
> various people could arrange fore the fire tender, various community
> assistance if bad, etc.

Please stop talking. Over 60,000 firemen are injured or killed every year but you think that sheer amateurs should be involved in things that they couldn't begin to understand.

On Sat, 9 Oct 2021 15:00:54 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
<cyclintom@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Friday, October 8, 2021 at 8:20:01 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>> On 10/8/2021 3:15 AM, russell...@yahoo.com wrote:
>> > On Friday, October 8, 2021 at 1:45:53 AM UTC-5, John B. wrote:
>> >> On Thu, 7 Oct 2021 21:55:55 -0700 (PDT), "russell...@yahoo.com"
>> >> <ritzann...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 10:33:59 AM UTC-5, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
>> >>>> On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 8:24:54 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
>> >>>>> Pink! With flowers!
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> https://nypost.com/2021/10/07/nyc-thief-steals-10-year-olds-phone/
>> >>>> Not a word about him probably being an illegal alien flown to NYC by Joe Biden's orders.
>> >>>
>> >>> Nooooo Tommy. He was probably one of the many illegal immigrants working at Trump's Mar a Lago resort that got fired when Trump was too cheap to pay them below minimum wage.
>> >>>
>> >>> Now I admit to not being up to date with kids and such. But I find it a little odd that a 10 year old kid has a cellular phone to steal. Or lose. That is 4th grade elementary school. I guess kids have become much more responsible now. They need phones and internet and such to call up Mom and Dad and tell them when they expect to be picked up from school and make sure supper is ready when they want it. And calling all their vast network of friends and associates to set up meetings to discuss homework assignments. Very responsible 10 year old kids today that need high tech communication devices. I seem to recall we still had a black and white TV when I was in 4th grade. One TV in the whole house in the living room. No TV in every room like today. One wired to the wall phone in the whole house too. 3 maybe 4 channels on the TV. The bad old days.
>> >> Goodness, you must be some sort of old fuddy-duddy when it comes to
>> >> phones. I just read that
>> >> "A recent study finds that more than half of all kids have a
>> >> smartphone by the time the age of 12, but it’s not uncommon to see
>> >> children much younger who have their own device. In fact, according to
>> >> Common Sense, about one in five kids have a phone by age eight."
>> >> https://www.androidguys.com/tips-tools/what-age-should-children-get-their-first-phone/
>> >>
>> >> And on another site an "expert" advises that "children 6 years old and
>> >> younger really don't require a hand phone".
>> >
>> > Well at least we have one expert thinking Kindergarten age kids and pre-school kids should not have phones. Its been way too long ago to remember, but I don't recall being sharp enough to know how to use a phone when I was that old. But I suspect kids today are much, much smarter than me.
>> Here's a weird side effect: Back in the days of phones tied to the wall,
>> a grandparent, uncle or aunt could call the house, a kid as young as age
>> four could pick up the phone, and the kid and adult could have a nice
>> conversation.
>>
>> Now the kid's parents each have a personal cell phone, which many of
>> them drop on the counter as soon as they enter the house. If a relative
>> else calls hoping to talk to a kid, it doesn't work. The kid isn't
>> allowed to answer Mom's or Dad's personal phone. One can leave a
>> message, but the call gets returned only when the parent is not busy -
>> often after the kids are in bed.
>
>And this is entirely aside from the fact that using the phone uses pretty powerful RF that is increasing the rates of brain cancer in young kids. This isn't something you should do with developing kids. Now, of course using Google or some such isn't destructive since it is only receiving. But as I pointed out elsewhere, almost every site on Google is OPINION and you can see the effect of that from Johnny and Russy who merely look for a "reference" that agrees with their opinions and then presents that as fact.
>
>As a teacher do you believe that kids should be exposed to opinions like this or generally agreed upon facts that are used in textbooks?

Ah well, Facts. Lets start out with your "fact" that hand phones are
causing brain cancer in kids.
And no youtube, or wild eyed news posting. Real, actual, published,
fact, from an authoritative source.
--
Cheers,

John B.

On Sat, 09 Oct 2021 15:03:51 -0700, Tom Kunich scribed:

> On Friday, October 8, 2021 at 4:27:32 PM UTC-7, News 2021 wrote:
>> On Fri, 08 Oct 2021 11:19:55 -0400, Frank Krygowski scribed:
>> > Here's a weird side effect: Back in the days of phones tied to the
>> > wall,
>> > a grandparent, uncle or aunt could call the house, a kid as young as
>> > age four could pick up the phone, and the kid and adult could have a
>> > nice conversation.
>> Party lines were good and bad. The good part was winding the ringer
>> allowed you to tell all on the line that a scrub fire had broken out
>> and various people could arrange fore the fire tender, various
>> community assistance if bad, etc.
>
> Please stop talking. Over 60,000 firemen are injured or killed every
> year but you think that sheer amateurs should be involved in things that
> they couldn't begin to understand.

Wow, does the USA have no work and safety standards?
FWIW, Australia has managed to involve volunteers as the major aource of
fire fighters since it was discovered/founded/created. That is why we
(mostly) manage our 'bush fires so well.

On Saturday, October 9, 2021 at 11:28:51 PM UTC-5, News 2021 wrote:
> On Sat, 09 Oct 2021 15:03:51 -0700, Tom Kunich scribed:
> > On Friday, October 8, 2021 at 4:27:32 PM UTC-7, News 2021 wrote:
> >> On Fri, 08 Oct 2021 11:19:55 -0400, Frank Krygowski scribed:
> >> > Here's a weird side effect: Back in the days of phones tied to the
> >> > wall,
> >> > a grandparent, uncle or aunt could call the house, a kid as young as
> >> > age four could pick up the phone, and the kid and adult could have a
> >> > nice conversation.
> >> Party lines were good and bad. The good part was winding the ringer
> >> allowed you to tell all on the line that a scrub fire had broken out
> >> and various people could arrange fore the fire tender, various
> >> community assistance if bad, etc.
> >
> > Please stop talking. Over 60,000 firemen are injured or killed every
> > year but you think that sheer amateurs should be involved in things that
> > they couldn't begin to understand.
> Wow, does the USA have no work and safety standards?
> FWIW, Australia has managed to involve volunteers as the major aource of
> fire fighters since it was discovered/founded/created. That is why we
> (mostly) manage our 'bush fires so well.

I would guess the reason volunteer firefighters are used in Australia and not in the USA is due to where the fires are. Australia has the fires in the outback I assume. Wide open spaces with nothing except grass at most. So uneducated volunteers can make, dig, fire breaks. And with the wide open areas, its easy to get vulnerable people in and out if necessary. Whereas, in the USA, the wildfires are in timber and mountain areas. So getting volunteers into and out of these areas is difficult and dangerous. And making fire breaks in forests and mountains requires far more technical skill. Such as setting a fire to burn the fuel before the wildfire gets to the area. Volunteers cannot be used where USA wildfires occur. You need people who know everything about fires to do the work. Not uneducated volunteers. They would just be fuel for the fire to consume.

On 10/10/2021 1:16 AM, russellseaton1@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Saturday, October 9, 2021 at 11:28:51 PM UTC-5, News 2021 wrote:
>> On Sat, 09 Oct 2021 15:03:51 -0700, Tom Kunich scribed:
>>> On Friday, October 8, 2021 at 4:27:32 PM UTC-7, News 2021 wrote:
>>>> On Fri, 08 Oct 2021 11:19:55 -0400, Frank Krygowski scribed:
>>>>> Here's a weird side effect: Back in the days of phones tied to the
>>>>> wall,
>>>>> a grandparent, uncle or aunt could call the house, a kid as young as
>>>>> age four could pick up the phone, and the kid and adult could have a
>>>>> nice conversation.
>>>> Party lines were good and bad. The good part was winding the ringer
>>>> allowed you to tell all on the line that a scrub fire had broken out
>>>> and various people could arrange fore the fire tender, various
>>>> community assistance if bad, etc.
>>>
>>> Please stop talking. Over 60,000 firemen are injured or killed every
>>> year but you think that sheer amateurs should be involved in things that
>>> they couldn't begin to understand.
>> Wow, does the USA have no work and safety standards?
>> FWIW, Australia has managed to involve volunteers as the major aource of
>> fire fighters since it was discovered/founded/created. That is why we
>> (mostly) manage our 'bush fires so well.
>
> I would guess the reason volunteer firefighters are used in Australia and not in the USA is due to where the fires are. Australia has the fires in the outback I assume. Wide open spaces with nothing except grass at most. So uneducated volunteers can make, dig, fire breaks. And with the wide open areas, its easy to get vulnerable people in and out if necessary. Whereas, in the USA, the wildfires are in timber and mountain areas. So getting volunteers into and out of these areas is difficult and dangerous. And making fire breaks in forests and mountains requires far more technical skill. Such as setting a fire to burn the fuel before the wildfire gets to the area. Volunteers cannot be used where USA wildfires occur. You need people who know everything about fires to do the work. Not uneducated volunteers. They would just be fuel for the fire to consume.
>

USA has plenty of VFD; There's a volunteer Fire Department
next to our store:
https://arlingtonfiredept.com/

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On Sat, 9 Oct 2021 15:03:51 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
<cyclintom@gmail.com> wrote:

> Over 60,000 firemen are injured or killed every year but you think that sheer amateurs should be involved in things that they couldn't begin to understand.

Volunteer firemen are a *long* way from uneducated and untrained.

One aspect of the training applies to bicycle safety: they practice
simple things that anybody could figure out in two seconds over and
over and over again, so that when you've been toned out at three in
the morning after you'd just gotten to sleep after getting home late,
and it's dark and raining and people are screaming in terror and smoke
is in your eyes and the chief yells "connect that hose coupling", that
hose coupling gets connected exactly the right way without a moment of
thought on your part.

For the same reason, never touch your brake levers without getting
into the position that you want to be in when you slam the brakes on
after a car swerves into your path. When startled, you will brake the
way you always brake.

--
Joy Beeson
joy beeson at centurylink dot net

On Sunday, October 10, 2021 at 9:14:19 AM UTC-5, AMuzi wrote:
> On 10/10/2021 1:16 AM, russell...@yahoo.com wrote:
> > On Saturday, October 9, 2021 at 11:28:51 PM UTC-5, News 2021 wrote:
> >> On Sat, 09 Oct 2021 15:03:51 -0700, Tom Kunich scribed:
> >>> On Friday, October 8, 2021 at 4:27:32 PM UTC-7, News 2021 wrote:
> >>>> On Fri, 08 Oct 2021 11:19:55 -0400, Frank Krygowski scribed:
> >>>>> Here's a weird side effect: Back in the days of phones tied to the
> >>>>> wall,
> >>>>> a grandparent, uncle or aunt could call the house, a kid as young as
> >>>>> age four could pick up the phone, and the kid and adult could have a
> >>>>> nice conversation.
> >>>> Party lines were good and bad. The good part was winding the ringer
> >>>> allowed you to tell all on the line that a scrub fire had broken out
> >>>> and various people could arrange fore the fire tender, various
> >>>> community assistance if bad, etc.
> >>>
> >>> Please stop talking. Over 60,000 firemen are injured or killed every
> >>> year but you think that sheer amateurs should be involved in things that
> >>> they couldn't begin to understand.
> >> Wow, does the USA have no work and safety standards?
> >> FWIW, Australia has managed to involve volunteers as the major aource of
> >> fire fighters since it was discovered/founded/created. That is why we
> >> (mostly) manage our 'bush fires so well.
> >
> > I would guess the reason volunteer firefighters are used in Australia and not in the USA is due to where the fires are. Australia has the fires in the outback I assume. Wide open spaces with nothing except grass at most. So uneducated volunteers can make, dig, fire breaks. And with the wide open areas, its easy to get vulnerable people in and out if necessary. Whereas, in the USA, the wildfires are in timber and mountain areas. So getting volunteers into and out of these areas is difficult and dangerous. And making fire breaks in forests and mountains requires far more technical skill. Such as setting a fire to burn the fuel before the wildfire gets to the area. Volunteers cannot be used where USA wildfires occur. You need people who know everything about fires to do the work. Not uneducated volunteers. They would just be fuel for the fire to consume.
> >
> USA has plenty of VFD; There's a volunteer Fire Department
> next to our store:
> https://arlingtonfiredept.com/
> --
> Andrew Muzi
> <www.yellowjersey.org/>
> Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Andy, when I saw VFD, I thought why are we talking about Variable Frequency Drive in a bicycling forum? VFDs are used in machinery, such as woodworking, to provide variable speed and to take single phase input of 220 volt, and change it into three phase electricity. That gets the variable speed and allows single phase input to power 5, 7.5, 10 HP three phase motors. More Power!!!!!!!

But maybe VFD can also mean Volunteer Fire Department. My Uncle, now deceased, was part of the volunteer fire department in the small community he used to live in. Back in the 70s and 80s.

On Sunday, October 10, 2021 at 9:51:12 PM UTC-5, Joy Beeson wrote:
> On Sat, 9 Oct 2021 15:03:51 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
> <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Over 60,000 firemen are injured or killed every year but you think that sheer amateurs should be involved in things that they couldn't begin to understand.
> Volunteer firemen are a *long* way from uneducated and untrained.
>

My apologies for seeming to denigrate volunteer firefighters. I am not. But forest fires are different than fires in buildings in an urban area. No hydrant hookups for water. No paved roads to get close to the fire. No ambulances standing by to haul off injured people. No firetrucks with hoses and ladders and other rescue supplies. So training for one is completely nonapplicable to the other. But maybe the state of California and/or the federal government has developed volunteer firefighters for forest fires. Just seems extra dangerous job to have volunteers and not dedicated professionals.

> One aspect of the training applies to bicycle safety: they practice
> simple things that anybody could figure out in two seconds over and
> over and over again, so that when you've been toned out at three in
> the morning after you'd just gotten to sleep after getting home late,
> and it's dark and raining and people are screaming in terror and smoke
> is in your eyes and the chief yells "connect that hose coupling", that
> hose coupling gets connected exactly the right way without a moment of
> thought on your part.
>
> For the same reason, never touch your brake levers without getting
> into the position that you want to be in when you slam the brakes on
> after a car swerves into your path. When startled, you will brake the
> way you always brake.
>
> --
> Joy Beeson
> joy beeson at centurylink dot net

On Sat, 09 Oct 2021 23:16:46 -0700, russellseaton1@yahoo.com scribed:

> On Saturday, October 9, 2021 at 11:28:51 PM UTC-5, News 2021 wrote:
>> On Sat, 09 Oct 2021 15:03:51 -0700, Tom Kunich scribed:
>> > On Friday, October 8, 2021 at 4:27:32 PM UTC-7, News 2021 wrote:
>> >> On Fri, 08 Oct 2021 11:19:55 -0400, Frank Krygowski scribed:
>> >> > Here's a weird side effect: Back in the days of phones tied to the
>> >> > wall,
>> >> > a grandparent, uncle or aunt could call the house, a kid as young
>> >> > as age four could pick up the phone, and the kid and adult could
>> >> > have a nice conversation.
>> >> Party lines were good and bad. The good part was winding the ringer
>> >> allowed you to tell all on the line that a scrub fire had broken out
>> >> and various people could arrange fore the fire tender, various
>> >> community assistance if bad, etc.
>> >
>> > Please stop talking. Over 60,000 firemen are injured or killed every
>> > year but you think that sheer amateurs should be involved in things
>> > that they couldn't begin to understand.
>> Wow, does the USA have no work and safety standards?
>> FWIW, Australia has managed to involve volunteers as the major aource
>> of fire fighters since it was discovered/founded/created. That is why
>> we (mostly) manage our 'bush fires so well.
>
> I would guess the reason volunteer firefighters are used in Australia
> and not in the USA is due to where the fires are.

Basically, it has to be a large town to have paid fire fighters. Some
have volunteer bridges, usually rural fire service in this state. My
house sits midway between a paid fire bridgade(built areas) a voluinteer
brigade (scrub, bush and forest).

Both are professional in that they are trained.

>Australia has the fires in the outback I assume. Wide open spaces with
nothing except grass at most.

Apart from outback grass/scrub fires lit by lightning, most 'bush fires'
are corrollated(sp?) with population.

>So uneducated volunteers can make, dig, fire breaks.
Err, no. they have to be trained and rarely "dig' breaks. They might
clear a break through a forest with a bull dozer and run a drip line(lit
petrol drip) to burn a strip, then extinguish one side(water and or fire
hoe) allowing the other side to spread and burn the easily combustable
stuff.

> And with the wide open areas, its easy to get vulnerable people in and
> out if necessary. Whereas, in the USA, the wildfires are in timber and
> mountain areas. So getting volunteers into and out of these areas is
> difficult and dangerous. And making fire breaks in forests and
> mountains requires far more technical skill. Such as setting a fire to
> burn the fuel before the wildfire gets to the area.

This is standard practise here, but we have a major problem that our
forest launch fire balls for hundreds of metres/yard or more ahead. so
anyone near the fire front can suddenly find they have fires all around.

They are trying to get more water bombing aircraft to counter that, but
now that northern and southern hemisphere fire seasons have large
overlaps, the old practice of professional fire bombers moving with the
season doesn't work.

> Volunteers cannot be used where USA wildfires occur.

Well, basically ours are all trained volunteers. Only RFS head office is
professional staff. Note, we have a parallel town fire service. Some
state have attempted mergers to greater and lessor success.

> You need people who know everything about fires to do the work.

No, you just need trained and respected people at the top. Has worked
here for a long time. It really is a case of some guys wrestling
crocodile while other attempts te remember WTF that were trying to do.

> Not uneducated volunteers. They would just
> be fuel for the fire to consume.

It is the job of the police to intercept the fire lunatics and waste
their time trying to keep the moths from the flames.

On Sun, 10 Oct 2021 20:09:25 -0700, russellseaton1@yahoo.com scribed:

> On Sunday, October 10, 2021 at 9:51:12 PM UTC-5, Joy Beeson wrote:
>> On Sat, 9 Oct 2021 15:03:51 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich <cycl...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > Over 60,000 firemen are injured or killed every year but you think
>> > that sheer amateurs should be involved in things that they couldn't
>> > begin to understand.
>> Volunteer firemen are a *long* way from uneducated and untrained.
>>
>>
> My apologies for seeming to denigrate volunteer firefighters. I am not.
> But forest fires are different than fires in buildings in an urban
> area. No hydrant hookups for water. No paved roads to get close to the
> fire.

Yep, that Australia just about everywhere.

> No ambulances standing by to haul off injured people. No
> firetrucks with hoses and ladders and other rescue supplies.

IME, you only need rescue appliance for buildings and cars.
Interestingly, we have a volunteer resue service that goes into assist
the police/firies/ambos cut 'people' out of crashed cars. Not as many
now as fire trucks have mostly been equiped with some of the gear
developed by volunteer rescue squads.

> training for one is completely nonapplicable to the other. But maybe
> the state of California and/or the federal government has developed
> volunteer firefighters for forest fires. Just seems extra dangerous job
> to have volunteers and not dedicated professionals.

Taxes?

On 10/10/2021 9:58 PM, russellseaton1@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Sunday, October 10, 2021 at 9:14:19 AM UTC-5, AMuzi wrote:
>> On 10/10/2021 1:16 AM, russell...@yahoo.com wrote:
>>> On Saturday, October 9, 2021 at 11:28:51 PM UTC-5, News 2021 wrote:
>>>> On Sat, 09 Oct 2021 15:03:51 -0700, Tom Kunich scribed:
>>>>> On Friday, October 8, 2021 at 4:27:32 PM UTC-7, News 2021 wrote:
>>>>>> On Fri, 08 Oct 2021 11:19:55 -0400, Frank Krygowski scribed:
>>>>>>> Here's a weird side effect: Back in the days of phones tied to the
>>>>>>> wall,
>>>>>>> a grandparent, uncle or aunt could call the house, a kid as young as
>>>>>>> age four could pick up the phone, and the kid and adult could have a
>>>>>>> nice conversation.
>>>>>> Party lines were good and bad. The good part was winding the ringer
>>>>>> allowed you to tell all on the line that a scrub fire had broken out
>>>>>> and various people could arrange fore the fire tender, various
>>>>>> community assistance if bad, etc.
>>>>>
>>>>> Please stop talking. Over 60,000 firemen are injured or killed every
>>>>> year but you think that sheer amateurs should be involved in things that
>>>>> they couldn't begin to understand.
>>>> Wow, does the USA have no work and safety standards?
>>>> FWIW, Australia has managed to involve volunteers as the major aource of
>>>> fire fighters since it was discovered/founded/created. That is why we
>>>> (mostly) manage our 'bush fires so well.
>>>
>>> I would guess the reason volunteer firefighters are used in Australia and not in the USA is due to where the fires are. Australia has the fires in the outback I assume. Wide open spaces with nothing except grass at most. So uneducated volunteers can make, dig, fire breaks. And with the wide open areas, its easy to get vulnerable people in and out if necessary. Whereas, in the USA, the wildfires are in timber and mountain areas. So getting volunteers into and out of these areas is difficult and dangerous. And making fire breaks in forests and mountains requires far more technical skill. Such as setting a fire to burn the fuel before the wildfire gets to the area. Volunteers cannot be used where USA wildfires occur. You need people who know everything about fires to do the work. Not uneducated volunteers. They would just be fuel for the fire to consume.
>>>
>> USA has plenty of VFD; There's a volunteer Fire Department
>> next to our store:
>> https://arlingtonfiredept.com/
>> --
>> Andrew Muzi
>> <www.yellowjersey.org/>
>> Open every day since 1 April, 1971
>
> Andy, when I saw VFD, I thought why are we talking about Variable Frequency Drive in a bicycling forum? VFDs are used in machinery, such as woodworking, to provide variable speed and to take single phase input of 220 volt, and change it into three phase electricity. That gets the variable speed and allows single phase input to power 5, 7.5, 10 HP three phase motors. More Power!!!!!!!
>
> But maybe VFD can also mean Volunteer Fire Department. My Uncle, now deceased, was part of the volunteer fire department in the small community he used to live in. Back in the 70s and 80s.
>

In my area their vehicles are marked 'Arlington VFD',
'Doylestown VFD' etc

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On 10/10/2021 10:09 PM, russellseaton1@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Sunday, October 10, 2021 at 9:51:12 PM UTC-5, Joy Beeson wrote:
>> On Sat, 9 Oct 2021 15:03:51 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
>> <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Over 60,000 firemen are injured or killed every year but you think that sheer amateurs should be involved in things that they couldn't begin to understand.
>> Volunteer firemen are a *long* way from uneducated and untrained.
>>
>
> My apologies for seeming to denigrate volunteer firefighters. I am not. But forest fires are different than fires in buildings in an urban area. No hydrant hookups for water. No paved roads to get close to the fire. No ambulances standing by to haul off injured people. No firetrucks with hoses and ladders and other rescue supplies. So training for one is completely nonapplicable to the other. But maybe the state of California and/or the federal government has developed volunteer firefighters for forest fires. Just seems extra dangerous job to have volunteers and not dedicated professionals.
>
>
>
>
>> One aspect of the training applies to bicycle safety: they practice
>> simple things that anybody could figure out in two seconds over and
>> over and over again, so that when you've been toned out at three in
>> the morning after you'd just gotten to sleep after getting home late,
>> and it's dark and raining and people are screaming in terror and smoke
>> is in your eyes and the chief yells "connect that hose coupling", that
>> hose coupling gets connected exactly the right way without a moment of
>> thought on your part.
>>
>> For the same reason, never touch your brake levers without getting
>> into the position that you want to be in when you slam the brakes on
>> after a car swerves into your path. When startled, you will brake the
>> way you always brake.
>>
>> --
>> Joy Beeson
>> joy beeson at centurylink dot net

I am not an ex[pert but there's a long history of convicts
used against wildfires. If there was some significant
problem with that it would have stopped.

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971