Ok, I have a project I've been wanting to do for a little while. Making
a short series of videos on making some useful injection molds using a
small manual milling machine. Something basically at the bottom of the
heap. A machine in the X2 class. Harbor Freight, Little machine shop,
Klutch, Wen, Eastwood and many others all sell a machine in about this
class.

There are a couple issues. I have absolutely no use for this machine
beyond the video series I want to make, so I don't want to spend a grand
(give or take) on it for six (maybe a couple more) mold making videos
and then just throw it on a shelf. All of them have mind numbingly slow
spindles for aluminum machining. Usually peaking around 2500-2800 RPM.

I could do the video series with my South Bend SB1028F, but I'm sure I
would get criticism for using a $24K machine with power feeds and DROs.
I want to show that some useful things can be done with a low end manual
count the turns machine. I may show the same mold being made on both
machines, but the goal is to show useful work being done on a POS
countertop milling machine.

Now before anybody say "you can't" or "its not worth it," well I
actually have a lower end (in some ways) milling machine that has got
the entire shop back up and running in a pinch. I've got a Harbor
Freight 42976. Its a round column mill/drill much smaller than the
RF30/31 with all the failings of a round column mill and it doesn't even
have a fine feed on the quill. Just a crappy side collar drill stop and
a quill lock. I was able to do actual milling with it when I had no
choice because every other milling machine in the shop required air to
operate and I needed to making an adapter plate for a new pump on the
compressor. I used stacks of gage blocks to set the depth on the stop,
and then used the quill lock. I can make parts with it, but that's a
kind of torture even somebody with an X2 class machine won't and
shouldn't have to deal with.

I did contact a few companies to see if they wanted to partner on the
idea. One tried to sell me a mill outside the scope of what I wanted to
use. (Three times out of the scope) Harbor Freight never responds to
me so I didn't even try to contact them. Well, I did, but after looking
through their contact options I couldn't find anything that sounded
right. One company sent me an email saying they were forwarding the
idea to their marketing department. None of the rest I contacted even
responded, which is about what I expected.

The thing is I am not in the video business. I don't get paid for
creating video content. Nobody pays me to *tutor them. I don't want to
spend a grand on a machine that other than this short videos series I
have no use for. I just want to make this series of videos as a
personal challenge and maybe to help somebody else along. I'm inspired
to do it. Not motivated by making money to do it. It may (probably
not) even cost me some business.

*I actually have been contacted a couple times by people who want to pay
me to tutor them on some subjects, but I'm not really as qualified as I
sometimes appear.

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On 3/24/2022 3:25 PM, Bob La Londe wrote:
> Ok, I have a project I've been wanting to do for a little while.  Making
> a short series of videos on making some useful injection molds using a
> small manual milling machine.  Something basically at the bottom of the
> heap.  A machine in the X2 class.  Harbor Freight, Little machine shop,
> Klutch, Wen, Eastwood and many others all sell a machine in about this
> class.
>
> There are a couple issues.  I have absolutely no use for this machine
> beyond the video series I want to make, so I don't want to spend a grand
> (give or take) on it for six (maybe a couple more) mold making videos
> and then just throw it on a shelf.  All of them have mind numbingly slow
> spindles for aluminum machining.  Usually peaking around 2500-2800 RPM.
>
> I could do the video series with my South Bend SB1028F, but I'm sure I
> would get criticism for using a $24K machine with power feeds and DROs.
> I want to show that some useful things can be done with a low end manual
> count the turns machine.  I may show the same mold being made on both
> machines, but the goal is to show useful work being done on a POS
> countertop milling machine.
>
> Now before anybody say "you can't" or "its not worth it," well I
> actually have a lower end (in some ways) milling machine that has got
> the entire shop back up and running in a pinch.  I've got a Harbor
> Freight 42976.  Its a round column mill/drill much smaller than the
> RF30/31 with all the failings of a round column mill and it doesn't even
> have a fine feed on the quill.  Just a crappy side collar drill stop and
> a quill lock.  I was able to do actual milling with it when I had no
> choice because every other milling machine in the shop required air to
> operate and I needed to making an adapter plate for a new pump on the
> compressor.  I used stacks of gage blocks to set the depth on the stop,
> and then used the quill lock.  I can make parts with it, but that's a
> kind of torture even somebody with an X2 class machine won't and
> shouldn't have to deal with.
>
> I did contact a few companies to see if they wanted to partner on the
> idea.  One tried to sell me a mill outside the scope of what I wanted to
> use.  (Three times out of the scope)  Harbor Freight never responds to
> me so I didn't even try to contact them.  Well, I did, but after looking
> through their contact options I couldn't find anything that sounded
> right.  One company sent me an email saying they were forwarding the
> idea to their marketing department.  None of the rest I contacted even
> responded, which is about what I expected.
>
> The thing is I am not in the video business.  I don't get paid for
> creating video content.  Nobody pays me to *tutor them.  I don't want to
> spend a grand on a machine that other than this short videos series I
> have no use for.  I just want to make this series of videos as a
> personal challenge and maybe to help somebody else along.  I'm inspired
> to do it.  Not motivated by making money to do it.  It may (probably
> not) even cost me some business.
>
> *I actually have been contacted a couple times by people who want to pay
> me to tutor them on some subjects, but I'm not really as qualified as I
> sometimes appear.
>

My original idea was to just make some fishing related molds this way.
Something somebody who was modestly intelligent and capable could follow
along with, but I've been considering a couple ideas for other things
like small plastic sorting trays someboy could crank out on a simple
injection machine like a Buster Beagle or an LNS Technologies.

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"Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:t1ir47$vs0$1@dont-email.me...

Ok, I have a project I've been wanting to do for a little while. Making
a short series of videos on making some useful injection molds using a
small manual milling machine. Something basically at the bottom of the
heap. A machine in the X2 class. Harbor Freight, Little machine shop,
Klutch, Wen, Eastwood and many others all sell a machine in about this
class. ...

You should have mentioned that earlier so I could have considered it during
my last root canal.

I don't know how to explain manual feeds to a student without telling them
to copy what I just did, i.e. in person. I learned that on a Bridgeport by
breaking an endmill.

When I took night classes at first I couldn't distinguish problems with my
technique from misadjustments of the machine, like loose gibs or chips in
the chuck mount.

On my Clausing I drew diagonal arrows beside the dials to relate handle
rotation to table motion.

"Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:t1irht$3h0$1@dont-email.me...

My original idea was to just make some fishing related molds this way.
Something somebody who was modestly intelligent and capable could follow
along with, but I've been considering a couple ideas for other things
like small plastic sorting trays someboy could crank out on a simple
injection machine like a Buster Beagle or an LNS Technologies.

------------------------

It's challenging enough to mill an accurately sized rectangular cutout on a
dial-only mill with backlash.

On 3/24/2022 4:15 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
> "Bob La Londe"  wrote in message news:t1ir47$vs0$1@dont-email.me...
>
> Ok, I have a project I've been wanting to do for a little while.  Making
> a short series of videos on making some useful injection molds using a
> small manual milling machine.  Something basically at the bottom of the
> heap.  A machine in the X2 class.  Harbor Freight, Little machine shop,
> Klutch, Wen, Eastwood and many others all sell a machine in about this
> class. ...
>
> You should have mentioned that earlier so I could have considered it
> during my last root canal.
>
> I don't know how to explain manual feeds to a student without telling
> them to copy what I just did, i.e. in person. I learned that on a
> Bridgeport by breaking an endmill.
>
> When I took night classes at first I couldn't distinguish problems with
> my technique from misadjustments of the machine, like loose gibs or
> chips in the chuck mount.
>
> On my Clausing I drew diagonal arrows beside the dials to relate handle
> rotation to table motion.
>

HA! I've got a buddy who is a modestly intelligent self taught
machinist. Like myself with the help of several million pepple on the
Internet. One day some years ago I noticed on the old milling machine
he used to have he had used a paint marker to write climb and
conventional with direction arrows on the side of the table.

After I stopped laughing I took the time to explain it to him.

Yep, I have some ideas about how to get backlash and other fundamentals
across. I used to tutor computer programming and economics in college.
I found that those who want to learn are much easier to teach than
those who wanted me to do their assignment for them. The latter were
not very happy with me.

*** Tangent Alert ***

Speaking of tutoring. One day in the computer lab I was reading a book
when an older student came in. She came over to me and said she was
told I was the guy to look for if she wanted help. I sat down and
proceeded to explain each problem she was facing and give her several
examples of how it was tackled. Then I would say let me know when you
hit another problem and I would go back to my book. After about the
third time I very carefully worked her through how to tackle the same
problem and made up another teaching example on the fly she asked,
"Where is this in my assignment."

I told her it wasn't. It wasn't my job to do her home work. It was my
job to teach her how. "Would you like me to show you another example?
Is there a point of how to do this you don't understand that you need
explained again or differently?"

I could tell she wasn't very happy when she said, "Do you know who I am?
My husband is the mayor of 'some town I never lived in.'"

I told her I was giving her the same help I give everybody who asks for
help. Explanations of how things work, and examples that match both the
assignments and my explanation. "I'm more than happy to teach you, but
I'm not going to do your work for you."

She poked at the keyboard for a few more minutes in a huff, before I
went back to my book. I think all her bodily orifices were puckered
when she stormed out a few minutes later. The visible ones certainly
were. I went back to my book and then another student came over to ask
me for some help. They said that the explanations they had overheard
had helped them with their work, but there was still something they
would like explained. I went to work.

My next shift in the computer lab one of the instructors in the
department let me know that Mrs 1st Lady to the Mayor had reported me to
the head of the department for refusing to help her, and that I just sat
there reading my book. I let her know I had in fact gone out of my way
to help even to the point of explaining it several times and giving
multiple examples of the application. I even pulled up my computer log
and showed the code snippets I had written to demo the application.
Miss upwardly mobile instructor said, "Don't you know her husband is the
mayor of 'some town I never lived in?'"

"Yep. She told me that when she made it clear she didn't want to learn.
That she just wanted me to do her assignments."

When my shift was over I headed over to the dean of Students office and
reported Mrs 1st Lady to the Mayor for trying to get somebody else to do
her homework. Then I headed over to the Deans office to report Miss
Upwardly Mobile Instructor for trying to intimidate me over it. I
ordinarily blew off students (and instructors) who didn't want to do
their job, but that sounded like it could come back to bite me. I never
saw Mrs 1st Lady To The Mayor in the computer lab again, and Miss
Upwardly Mobile was very very polite and always addressed me in a very
civil tone as Mr La Londe after that. Like maybe she was afraid of me?
I guess because I wore leather jacket and rode a motorcycle she hadn't
realized I was smart enough to go cover my ass if people got stupid.

Yes I remember their names, but it was a long time ago, and how anybody
treats them today should be about how they act today, not something
stupid they did 30 years ago.

--
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On 3/24/2022 4:23 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
> "Bob La Londe"  wrote in message news:t1irht$3h0$1@dont-email.me...
>
> My original idea was to just make some fishing related molds this way.
> Something somebody who was modestly intelligent and capable could follow
> along with, but I've been considering a couple ideas for other things
> like small plastic sorting trays someboy could crank out on a simple
> injection machine like a Buster Beagle or an LNS Technologies.
>
> ------------------------
>
> It's challenging enough to mill an accurately sized rectangular cutout
> on a dial-only mill with backlash.
>

Yes. Yes it is.

--
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"Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:t1j1nh$elr$1@dont-email.me...

On 3/24/2022 4:15 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
> "Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:t1ir47$vs0$1@dont-email.me...
>
> Ok, I have a project I've been wanting to do for a little while. Making
> a short series of videos on making some useful injection molds using a
> small manual milling machine. Something basically at the bottom of the
> heap. A machine in the X2 class. Harbor Freight, Little machine shop,
> Klutch, Wen, Eastwood and many others all sell a machine in about this
> class. ...
>
> You should have mentioned that earlier so I could have considered it
> during my last root canal.
>
> I don't know how to explain manual feeds to a student without telling them
> to copy what I just did, i.e. in person. I learned that on a Bridgeport by
> breaking an endmill.
>
> When I took night classes at first I couldn't distinguish problems with my
> technique from misadjustments of the machine, like loose gibs or chips in
> the chuck mount.
>
> On my Clausing I drew diagonal arrows beside the dials to relate handle
> rotation to table motion.
>

HA! I've got a buddy who is a modestly intelligent self taught
machinist. Like myself with the help of several million pepple on the
Internet. One day some years ago I noticed on the old milling machine
he used to have he had used a paint marker to write climb and
conventional with direction arrows on the side of the table.

After I stopped laughing I took the time to explain it to him.

--------------------------
It's easy enough to remember the motion transformations when I have nothing
else to do, but not when I'm fully absorbed in solving a problem.
--------------------------

Yep, I have some ideas about how to get backlash and other fundamentals
across. I used to tutor computer programming and economics in college.
I found that those who want to learn are much easier to teach than
those who wanted me to do their assignment for them. The latter were
not very happy with me.

*** Tangent Alert ***

Speaking of tutoring. One day in the computer lab I was reading a book
when an older student came in. She came over to me and said she was
told I was the guy to look for if she wanted help. I sat down and
proceeded to explain each problem she was facing and give her several
examples of how it was tackled. Then I would say let me know when you
hit another problem and I would go back to my book. After about the
third time I very carefully worked her through how to tackle the same
problem and made up another teaching example on the fly she asked,
"Where is this in my assignment."

I told her it wasn't. It wasn't my job to do her home work. It was my
job to teach her how. "Would you like me to show you another example?
Is there a point of how to do this you don't understand that you need
explained again or differently?"

I could tell she wasn't very happy when she said, "Do you know who I am?
My husband is the mayor of 'some town I never lived in.'"

I told her I was giving her the same help I give everybody who asks for
help. Explanations of how things work, and examples that match both the
assignments and my explanation. "I'm more than happy to teach you, but
I'm not going to do your work for you."

She poked at the keyboard for a few more minutes in a huff, before I
went back to my book. I think all her bodily orifices were puckered
when she stormed out a few minutes later. The visible ones certainly
were. I went back to my book and then another student came over to ask
me for some help. They said that the explanations they had overheard
had helped them with their work, but there was still something they
would like explained. I went to work.

My next shift in the computer lab one of the instructors in the
department let me know that Mrs 1st Lady to the Mayor had reported me to
the head of the department for refusing to help her, and that I just sat
there reading my book. I let her know I had in fact gone out of my way
to help even to the point of explaining it several times and giving
multiple examples of the application. I even pulled up my computer log
and showed the code snippets I had written to demo the application.
Miss upwardly mobile instructor said, "Don't you know her husband is the
mayor of 'some town I never lived in?'"

"Yep. She told me that when she made it clear she didn't want to learn.
That she just wanted me to do her assignments."

When my shift was over I headed over to the dean of Students office and
reported Mrs 1st Lady to the Mayor for trying to get somebody else to do
her homework. Then I headed over to the Deans office to report Miss
Upwardly Mobile Instructor for trying to intimidate me over it. I
ordinarily blew off students (and instructors) who didn't want to do
their job, but that sounded like it could come back to bite me. I never
saw Mrs 1st Lady To The Mayor in the computer lab again, and Miss
Upwardly Mobile was very very polite and always addressed me in a very
civil tone as Mr La Londe after that. Like maybe she was afraid of me?
I guess because I wore leather jacket and rode a motorcycle she hadn't
realized I was smart enough to go cover my ass if people got stupid.

Yes I remember their names, but it was a long time ago, and how anybody
treats them today should be about how they act today, not something
stupid they did 30 years ago.

--------------------------
Nice story. I sympathize with you because I had to herd co-op engineering
students through CAD schematic design and quietly suffer the damage Ph.Ds
did in my company machine shop. Fortunately I had my own machines at home,
and permission to charge for time on them. I was also a black leather biker
who was presumed stupid and hostile until proven otherwise.

The worst was when I was presumed to be stupid, hostile and French Canadien
because I didn't realize I had passed from Quebec into New Brunswick and
spoke to a store clerk in French. She was sooo glad to find I was USian,
which wasn't usually the case.

On 3/25/2022 4:34 AM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
>
> The worst was when I was presumed to be stupid, hostile and French
> Canadien because I didn't realize I had passed from Quebec into New
> Brunswick and spoke to a store clerk in French. She was sooo glad to
> find I was USian, which wasn't usually the case.
>
>

Oh, French Canadian!!! That's unforgivable outside Quebec. LOL. As
I've mentioned before I was a contractor for a while. Here in sunny
South West Arizona we get a fair share of snowbirds. A fair number of
them Canadian, and a decent percentage are French Canadian. There is a
certain reputation for bluntness breaking over into rudeness. I found
as a contractor installing alarm systems, home theater, and satellite TV
systems my best response was to be blunt bordering on rude right back.
I also quickly discovered I had better be right. LOL.

--
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"Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:t1kk17$173d$1@gioia.aioe.org...

On 3/25/2022 4:34 AM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
>
> The worst was when I was presumed to be stupid, hostile and French
> Canadien because I didn't realize I had passed from Quebec into New
> Brunswick and spoke to a store clerk in French. She was sooo glad to find
> I was USian, which wasn't usually the case.
>
>

Oh, French Canadian!!! That's unforgivable outside Quebec. LOL. As
I've mentioned before I was a contractor for a while. Here in sunny
South West Arizona we get a fair share of snowbirds. A fair number of
them Canadian, and a decent percentage are French Canadian. There is a
certain reputation for bluntness breaking over into rudeness. I found
as a contractor installing alarm systems, home theater, and satellite TV
systems my best response was to be blunt bordering on rude right back.
I also quickly discovered I had better be right. LOL.

----------------------------

They come by rudeness honestly:
https://www.eurocheapo.com/blog/are-parisians-rude-5-tips-to-minimize-bad-treatment.html

I may need to find someone with your experience locally for hands-on help
with this:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08DTQKB52/ref=ask_ql_qh_dp_hza

I couldn't resist the price and features. So far I can make it be a WiFi
hotspot and connect to it, but that's all. Some of the problem may be the
nearly obsolete laptop and cell phone I have to connect with, and some my
unfamiliarity with networking, which was IT's guarded fiefdom. More work is
required.

On 3/25/2022 10:09 AM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
> "Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:t1kk17$173d$1@gioia.aioe.org...
>
> On 3/25/2022 4:34 AM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
>>
>> The worst was when I was presumed to be stupid, hostile and French
>> Canadien because I didn't realize I had passed from Quebec into New
>> Brunswick and spoke to a store clerk in French. She was sooo glad to
>> find I was USian, which wasn't usually the case.
>>
>>
>
> Oh, French Canadian!!! That's unforgivable outside Quebec. LOL. As
> I've mentioned before I was a contractor for a while. Here in sunny
> South West Arizona we get a fair share of snowbirds. A fair number of
> them Canadian, and a decent percentage are French Canadian. There is a
> certain reputation for bluntness breaking over into rudeness. I found
> as a contractor installing alarm systems, home theater, and satellite TV
> systems my best response was to be blunt bordering on rude right back.
> I also quickly discovered I had better be right. LOL.
>
> ----------------------------
>
> They come by rudeness honestly:
>
https://www.eurocheapo.com/blog/are-parisians-rude-5-tips-to-minimize-bad-treatment.html

>
>
> I may need to find someone with your experience locally for hands-on
> help with this:
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08DTQKB52/ref=ask_ql_qh_dp_hza
>
> I couldn't resist the price and features. So far I can make it be a WiFi
> hotspot and connect to it, but that's all. Some of the problem may be
> the nearly obsolete laptop and cell phone I have to connect with, and
> some my unfamiliarity with networking, which was IT's guarded fiefdom.
> More work is required.

Typically an IP camera, DVR or NVR is used on a LAN whether wired or
WiFi. Sometimes you can connect directly to some of those types of
devices using WiFi or Blue Tooth. That is a local direct connection.

For remote access you typically connect it to a LAN with a router. The
router interfaces between a broadband source and the local area network.
Then you go into the router setup and use port forwarding (or a DMZ
setting) to direct outside access to that device. Then on a cell phone
or computer with Internet access you might either be able to connect to
the device either by standard browser or using an application from the
device manufacturer.

If your LAN is setup for dynamic DNS its best to also set static IP
addresses for those devices so you can actually find them. Some routers
will run both static and dynamic IP addresses. Others will reserve an
IP address for a mac address.

Even locally some devices will require ports to be set and reserved for
them. Others will not. You can just connect to them locally with their
local IP address.

Locally you might connect using using something that looks like this:
192.168.1.183 or 192.168.1.183:80

Remotely you would have a port (or ports) assigned to forward to that IP
address. Then with your remote device you would connect to your LAN
using the public IP address using something like this:
74.231.7.43:3200

If your network is setup with a a DMZ and you have placed your device in
the DMZ you might just enter:
74.231.7.43

Most likely that will not work because the device is expecting it to
come from a port, but some will work.

Lastly its possible your device may have the ability to use an outside
third party server. It pings the outside server periodically to check
to see if there is a request to communicate. Kind of like using an
instant messenger program or some social media sites. There is 2 way
contact often enough that it seems like continuous communication. If
this is the case that third part could monitor or have access to your
communication with your device. Its also possible there may be a cost
associated with that third party (or manufacturer's) server. It allows
you to communicate without knowing how to setup your network, but it has
its risks or costs.

Now the other issue. Most commercial business broad band services come
with a static public IP address. Most residential broad band services
do not unless you pay extra for it. Usually they are dynamic, but
persistent. That means they are reserved for you, but if you are
offline and another device comes online your IP address "could" be
assign to another customer. Sometimes your public IP address changes
all the time. Its dynamic and anytime you go offline and come back on
it could be different. This can make it from difficult to impossible to
connect. You don't know what the public IP address is. There are
several ways to deal with that. The third party server with constant
communication is one. A dyndns server is another, but they usually
require a notification ap to be constantly running in the background on
a device on the network. Some DVR and NVRs have their own ability to
work with a DYNDNS service built in. There are free DYDNDNS services,
but the usually require monthly direct validations. There are paid
DYNDNS services that won't require you to logon and validate your
account. These do not give access to your device on your LAN. They
just accept a periodic ping from the application running on your network
that tells them what your current public IP address is. Then they
associate a name with that IP address through their server. Instead of
entering an IP address in your browser or video viewing application you
would enter something like:
JimWilkinsVideo.dyddns.org:3200

If your cellphone is your broadband device for your LAN then you will
not be able to connect remotely with your cell phone. Your LAN won't
have a broadband service while your are sunning yourself on the river in
Yuma. Fracking snowbird!

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"Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:t1l6fk$3ot$1@dont-email.me...

Typically an IP camera, DVR or NVR is used on a LAN whether wired or
WiFi. Sometimes you can connect directly to some of those types of
devices using WiFi or Blue Tooth. That is a local direct connection.

-------------------
I think the local direct connection to a spare cellphone is what I want. I
would have it alarm if it detects motion, and keep the phone nearby in the
house. The camera has 128GB to record video internally. I just acquired a
pre-5G Xfinity cell phone to use (risk) for this.

I don't turn on my iPhone to enable the data-limited cellular Internet
connection unless I'm using it, and run as much as possible on machines
without Net access. This laptop's hard drive has been completely backed up
off-line with Seagate DiscWizard (Acronis) which can restore the bootable
system to another hard drive if this one dies or is compromised. Beware the
Bear.

"Sheenwang Seller:
If without wifi, you could use the AP mode to connect the camera bulb with
your phone. Here is the way to setup: Press the rest button 3 times, the
camera will emit a WiFi hotspot named "camera_xxxx", the mobile phone
connect to this hotspot. Open the APP "iCSee", choose the "AP direct
connection". In this way you could view and record with a memory card only
within 30 meters."

But the hotspot has a different SSID and requires a password I found
elsewhere. iCSee gets bad reviews and isn't going on my precious iPhone. The
PC version of it was "file not found". A substitute didn't see the camera.
More work required.

This is not at the top of the spring to-do list. Are highly visible but
disconnected driveway cameras effective theft deterrents?

On 3/25/2022 4:08 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:>> Are highly visible but
disconnected driveway cameras effective theft deterrents?
Some people seem to think so. I had probably 20 or 30 people over the
years call me up and ask me for my bad cameras. Usually it went
something like this:

RING RING:

Me: The Security Consultant, how can I help you?

Them: Do you have any broken cameras?

Me: No. What good would that do m?

Them: Well I want to put them up to scare people off.

Me: Oh, I can order you some good looking dummy cameras.

Them: I was just hoping you had some cameras that weren't any good that
I could get.

Me: Why would I save broken cameras?

Them: Well people might want to use them to scare people off.

Me: Would those people be willing to pay for them?

Them: No they aren't any good. You would just throw them away.

Me: Um, yes. I threw them away.

Them: So could you save them for me and give me a call when you get some?

Me: Would you be willing to pay for my time and shelf space to do that?

Them: Why would I pay for hem. They are broken.

Me: Exactly. They are broken. I threw them away.

Them: Well could you save them for me?

Me: I could, but that would take time and shelf space to inventory them
for you and you have made it clear you won't pay for my time.

Them: You are just going to throw them away!!!

Me: Yes. It takes less time to toss them in a nearby dumpster than to
put them in the truck, haul them back to the shop, clear a space on the
shelf in the stock room, and call you. Then because you want them for
free you won't value my time and I may have to store them for you for an
indeterminate amount of time if its not convenient for you.

Them: You are an asshole!

Me: My customers don't think so.

Them: Yeah, well I will never be your customer.

Me: I know. You said that at the very beginning. I was just being
polite in case you might change your mind.

Them: Screw you.

Me: Hold on a second. I need your address.

Them: Huh! Why?

Me: I need to know where to send the invoice for this ten minute phone
support call.

CLICK

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com

On 3/25/2022 8:12 PM, Bob La Londe wrote:
> On 3/25/2022 4:08 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:>>  Are highly visible but
> disconnected driveway cameras effective theft deterrents?
> Some people seem to think so.  I had probably 20 or 30 people over the
> years call me up and ask me for my bad cameras.  Usually it went
> something like this:
>
>
> RING RING:
>
> Me: The Security Consultant, how can I help you?
>
> Them:  Do you have any broken cameras?
>
> Me:  No.  What good would that do m?
>
> Them:  Well I want to put them up to scare people off.
>
> Me:  Oh, I can order you some good looking dummy cameras.
>
> Them:  I was just hoping you had some cameras that weren't any good that
> I could get.
>
> Me:  Why would I save broken cameras?
>
> Them:  Well people might want to use them to scare people off.
>
> Me:  Would those people be willing to pay for them?
>
> Them:  No they aren't any good.  You would just throw them away.
>
> Me:  Um, yes.  I threw them away.
>
> Them: So could you save them for me and give me a call when you get some?
>
> Me:  Would you be willing to pay for my time and shelf space to do that?
>
> Them:  Why would I pay for hem.  They are broken.
>
> Me:  Exactly.  They are broken.  I threw them away.
>
> Them:  Well could you save them for me?
>
> Me:  I could, but that would take time and shelf space to inventory them
> for you and you have made it clear you won't pay for my time.
>
> Them:  You are just going to throw them away!!!
>
> Me:  Yes.  It takes less time to toss them in a nearby dumpster than to
> put them in the truck, haul them back to the shop, clear a space on the
> shelf in the stock room, and call you.  Then because you want them for
> free you won't value my time and I may have to store them for you for an
> indeterminate amount of time if its not convenient for you.
>
> Them:  You are an asshole!
>
> Me:  My customers don't think so.
>
> Them:  Yeah, well I will never be your customer.
>
> Me:  I know.  You said that at the very beginning.  I was just being
> polite in case you might change your mind.
>
> Them:  Screw you.
>
> Me:  Hold on a second.  I need your address.
>
> Them: Huh!  Why?
>
> Me:  I need to know where to send the invoice for this ten minute phone
> support call.
>
>
> CLICK
>
>

Have you noticed that those who vote democrat are the same ones who
are more likely to want sumpin for nuffin ?
--
Snag
My rights don't end
where your fear begins .

"Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:t1lp9f$1oma$1@gioia.aioe.org...

On 3/25/2022 4:08 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:>> Are highly visible but
disconnected driveway cameras effective theft deterrents?
Some people seem to think so. I had probably 20 or 30 people over the
years call me up and ask me for my bad cameras. Usually it went
something like this:

RING RING:

Me: The Security Consultant, how can I help you?

Them: Do you have any broken cameras?
----------------

I appreciate your position, however that question brings results often
enough to be worth asking. There may be stuff they haven't cleaned out of
the truck or store room yet, like the replaced-on-schedule Kong descender a
cable repairman gave me. (I prefer a Prusik unless the rope is icy.)

I built my bucket loader attachment from cheap used hydraulics that needed
new seals, and my sawmill largely from second-hand steel at $0.25/Lb. The
solar panels that power my freezer had been salvaged from old parking
kiosks. A large fraction of the pressure-treated wood in my firewood sheds
came from a contractor's scrap pile. He was happy to save the dumpster cost,
and it bothers me to see useful things go into landfills when I can
repurpose them into something I want. I don't collect junk but I'll fix
something once to gain the knowledge.

My washing machine is a 1960's nearly bullet-proof Maytag that I found
dumped in the woods where I was logging. A little rubber parts swapping with
another cured its leak and then I stripped out the automatic controls to
make it more suited to alternate energy, specifically water heated on the
wood stove instead of with electricity. Most of what I have is old enough to
be all steel and maintainable, like the Maytag. Since Accounting isn't
pressing me to cut costs I can make it better than new. If I can fix and
modify my things I own them instead of them owning me.

Modern computerized equipment can be impossible to repair even when I work
for the company that made it, if the PROM is locked and original programmer
didn't leave the source code when he quit. I've had to recover (FDISK /MBR)
a hard drive that the former programmer booby-trapped to wipe its boot
sector, and then reconstruct and revise the code on it. He was demanding
$600 an hour to consult. I did sympathize with him, but managed to fix
everything myself and avoid a fight.

I realize that you can trade time for money earned while I can trade only
for money saved. When I was working and could charge overtime the make/buy
balance was different, however during downturns startups fail and industrial
R&D jobs vanish and I had free time to cut firewood and fix things, or take
interesting jobs like the Renaissance Fair.

"Snag" wrote in message news:t1n0de$9cm$1@dont-email.me...

Have you noticed that those who vote democrat are the same ones who
are more likely to want sumpin for nuffin ?
--------------------
Well, I'm not a Democrat, not "entitled", and end that conversation very
quickly with "I won't know unless I ask." Yankee thrift is more about not
wasting things or overspending to satisfy your ego.
http://archive.boston.com/business/personalfinance/articles/2009/03/08/yankee_thrift_personified/

On Fri, 25 Mar 2022 19:08:12 -0400
"Jim Wilkins" <muratlanne@gmail.com> wrote:

<snip>
>I think the local direct connection to a spare cellphone is what I want. I
>would have it alarm if it detects motion, and keep the phone nearby in the
>house. The camera has 128GB to record video internally. I just acquired a
>pre-5G Xfinity cell phone to use (risk) for this.

I read some of the reviews for your camera yesterday. Not so good...

Did you find this reddit page yet? May give you some clues...

https://www.reddit.com/r/selfhosted/comments/ndjn4a/is_it_possible_to_connect_p2p_cameras_without/

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI

"Leon Fisk" wrote in message news:t1n72r$qfd$1@dont-email.me...

On Fri, 25 Mar 2022 19:08:12 -0400
"Jim Wilkins" <muratlanne@gmail.com> wrote:

<snip>
>I think the local direct connection to a spare cellphone is what I want. I
>would have it alarm if it detects motion, and keep the phone nearby in the
>house. The camera has 128GB to record video internally. I just acquired a
>pre-5G Xfinity cell phone to use (risk) for this.

I read some of the reviews for your camera yesterday. Not so good...

Did you find this reddit page yet? May give you some clues...

https://www.reddit.com/r/selfhosted/comments/ndjn4a/is_it_possible_to_connect_p2p_cameras_without/

------------------

Thanks. For the price I can accept it being only a scarecrow, but it appears
functional and is worth some effort. The cell phone's owner discovered that
the store can copy his stuff onto his new phone so he needs it back for a
while.

On Sat, 26 Mar 2022 10:52:10 -0400
"Jim Wilkins" <muratlanne@gmail.com> wrote:

<snip>
>Thanks. For the price I can accept it being only a scarecrow, but it appears
>functional and is worth some effort. The cell phone's owner discovered that
>the store can copy his stuff onto his new phone so he needs it back for a
>while.

I buy stuff with that thought in mind too. It usually works out okay,
but for the times it doesn't I'm not surprised nor out much $. For me
it's way more fun than going to a Casino where I already KNOW they are
out to screw you ;-)

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI

On 3/26/2022 5:20 AM, Snag wrote:
> On 3/25/2022 8:12 PM, Bob La Londe wrote:
>> On 3/25/2022 4:08 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:>>  Are highly visible but
>> disconnected driveway cameras effective theft deterrents?
>> Some people seem to think so.  I had probably 20 or 30 people over the
>> years call me up and ask me for my bad cameras.  Usually it went
>> something like this:
>>
>>
>> RING RING:
>>
>> Me: The Security Consultant, how can I help you?
>>
>> Them:  Do you have any broken cameras?
>>
>> Me:  No.  What good would that do m?
>>
>> Them:  Well I want to put them up to scare people off.
>>
>> Me:  Oh, I can order you some good looking dummy cameras.
>>
>> Them:  I was just hoping you had some cameras that weren't any good
>> that I could get.
>>
>> Me:  Why would I save broken cameras?
>>
>> Them:  Well people might want to use them to scare people off.
>>
>> Me:  Would those people be willing to pay for them?
>>
>> Them:  No they aren't any good.  You would just throw them away.
>>
>> Me:  Um, yes.  I threw them away.
>>
>> Them: So could you save them for me and give me a call when you get some?
>>
>> Me:  Would you be willing to pay for my time and shelf space to do that?
>>
>> Them:  Why would I pay for hem.  They are broken.
>>
>> Me:  Exactly.  They are broken.  I threw them away.
>>
>> Them:  Well could you save them for me?
>>
>> Me:  I could, but that would take time and shelf space to inventory
>> them for you and you have made it clear you won't pay for my time.
>>
>> Them:  You are just going to throw them away!!!
>>
>> Me:  Yes.  It takes less time to toss them in a nearby dumpster than
>> to put them in the truck, haul them back to the shop, clear a space on
>> the shelf in the stock room, and call you.  Then because you want them
>> for free you won't value my time and I may have to store them for you
>> for an indeterminate amount of time if its not convenient for you.
>>
>> Them:  You are an asshole!
>>
>> Me:  My customers don't think so.
>>
>> Them:  Yeah, well I will never be your customer.
>>
>> Me:  I know.  You said that at the very beginning.  I was just being
>> polite in case you might change your mind.
>>
>> Them:  Screw you.
>>
>> Me:  Hold on a second.  I need your address.
>>
>> Them: Huh!  Why?
>>
>> Me:  I need to know where to send the invoice for this ten minute
>> phone support call.
>>
>>
>> CLICK
>>
>>
>
>   Have you noticed that those who vote democrat are the same ones who
> are more likely to want sumpin for nuffin ?

Honestly. No. I have not noticed a political relationship. Atleast
not in people around my age (+/- 10-15 years).

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com

On 3/26/2022 6:07 AM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
> "Bob La Londe"  wrote in message news:t1lp9f$1oma$1@gioia.aioe.org...
>
> On 3/25/2022 4:08 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:>>  Are highly visible but
> disconnected driveway cameras effective theft deterrents?
> Some people seem to think so.  I had probably 20 or 30 people over the
> years call me up and ask me for my bad cameras.  Usually it went
> something like this:
>
>
> RING RING:
>
> Me: The Security Consultant, how can I help you?
>
> Them:  Do you have any broken cameras?
> ----------------
>
> I appreciate your position,

Do you really? You do realize that the editorial caller in my scenario
that was played out many times in reality was saying, "WORK FOR ME FOR
FREE SO I CAN HAVE SOMETHING FOR FREE. Do not spend that time working
working for paying customers so you can pay your bills keep your home
and feed your family." I also was never an office/desk manager. Usually
I would receive that call while crawling through an attic pulling wire
or hanging off the side of a building mounting a camera. I carried my
cell phone at all times so customers could always reach me. CUSTOMERS.

I have nothing against being cheap, frugal, or thrifty. I do have an
issue with shitting on the value of my time. Time is the only commodity
I have that is not renewable or replaceable.

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com

"Leon Fisk" wrote in message news:t1n9kg$svp$1@dont-email.me...

On Sat, 26 Mar 2022 10:52:10 -0400
"Jim Wilkins" <muratlanne@gmail.com> wrote:

<snip>
>Thanks. For the price I can accept it being only a scarecrow, but it
>appears
>functional and is worth some effort. The cell phone's owner discovered that
>the store can copy his stuff onto his new phone so he needs it back for a
>while.

I buy stuff with that thought in mind too. It usually works out okay,
but for the times it doesn't I'm not surprised nor out much $. For me
it's way more fun than going to a Casino where I already KNOW they are
out to screw you ;-)

-----------------------------

Most of the battery charge/discharge meters I've bought from Amazon have
soon failed and been a waste of (not much) money. This one still works but
needs recalibration.
https://www.amazon.com/Digital-Multimeter-Charge-Discharge-Battery-Tester/dp/B07ST89G8L

Meters that measure unipolar current through a grounded shunt have generally
been fine, the problem is with measuring bipolar current against a reference
that's above the negative power rail.

"Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:t1nbd0$1ug4$1@gioia.aioe.org...

On 3/26/2022 6:07 AM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
> "Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:t1lp9f$1oma$1@gioia.aioe.org...
>
> On 3/25/2022 4:08 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:>> Are highly visible but
> disconnected driveway cameras effective theft deterrents?
> Some people seem to think so. I had probably 20 or 30 people over the
> years call me up and ask me for my bad cameras. Usually it went
> something like this:
>
>
> RING RING:
>
> Me: The Security Consultant, how can I help you?
>
> Them: Do you have any broken cameras?
> ----------------
>
> I appreciate your position,

Do you really? You do realize that the editorial caller in my scenario
that was played out many times in reality was saying, "WORK FOR ME FOR
FREE SO I CAN HAVE SOMETHING FOR FREE. Do not spend that time working
working for paying customers so you can pay your bills keep your home
and feed your family." I also was never an office/desk manager. Usually
I would receive that call while crawling through an attic pulling wire
or hanging off the side of a building mounting a camera. I carried my
cell phone at all times so customers could always reach me. CUSTOMERS.

I have nothing against being cheap, frugal, or thrifty. I do have an
issue with shitting on the value of my time. Time is the only commodity
I have that is not renewable or replaceable.
--------------------------

I'm surprised you spend time answering me.

On 3/26/2022 10:35 AM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
> "Bob La Londe"  wrote in message news:t1nbd0$1ug4$1@gioia.aioe.org...
> On 3/26/2022 6:07 AM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
>> "Bob La Londe"  wrote in message news:t1lp9f$1oma$1@gioia.aioe.org...
>>
>> On 3/25/2022 4:08 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:>>  Are highly visible but
>> disconnected driveway cameras effective theft deterrents?
>> Some people seem to think so.  I had probably 20 or 30 people over the
>> years call me up and ask me for my bad cameras.  Usually it went
>> something like this:
>>
>>
>> RING RING:
>>
>> Me: The Security Consultant, how can I help you?
>>
>> Them:  Do you have any broken cameras?
>> ----------------
>>
>> I appreciate your position,
>
> Do you really?  You do realize that the editorial caller in my scenario
> that was played out many times in reality was saying, "WORK FOR ME FOR
> FREE SO I CAN HAVE SOMETHING FOR FREE.  Do not spend that time working
> working for paying customers so you can pay your bills keep your home
> and feed your family." I also was never an office/desk manager.  Usually
> I would receive that call while crawling through an attic pulling wire
> or hanging off the side of a building mounting a camera.  I carried my
> cell phone at all times so customers could always reach me.  CUSTOMERS.
>
> I have nothing against being cheap, frugal, or thrifty.  I do have an
> issue with shitting on the value of my time.  Time is the only commodity
> I have that is not renewable or replaceable.
> --------------------------
>
> I'm surprised you spend time answering me.

I get something back from you.

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com

On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 6:25:14 PM UTC-4, Bob La Londe wrote:
> Ok, I have a project I've been wanting to do for a little while. Making
> a short series of videos on making some useful injection molds using a
> small manual milling machine. Something basically at the bottom of the
> heap. A machine in the X2 class. Harbor Freight, Little machine shop,
> Klutch, Wen, Eastwood and many others all sell a machine in about this
> class.
>
> There are a couple issues. I have absolutely no use for this machine
> beyond the video series I want to make, so I don't want to spend a grand
> (give or take) on it for six (maybe a couple more) mold making videos
> and then just throw it on a shelf. All of them have mind numbingly slow
> spindles for aluminum machining. Usually peaking around 2500-2800 RPM.
>
> I could do the video series with my South Bend SB1028F, but I'm sure I
> would get criticism for using a $24K machine with power feeds and DROs.
> I want to show that some useful things can be done with a low end manual
> count the turns machine. I may show the same mold being made on both
> machines, but the goal is to show useful work being done on a POS
> countertop milling machine.
>
> Now before anybody say "you can't" or "its not worth it," well I
> actually have a lower end (in some ways) milling machine that has got
> the entire shop back up and running in a pinch. I've got a Harbor
> Freight 42976. Its a round column mill/drill much smaller than the
> RF30/31 with all the failings of a round column mill and it doesn't even
> have a fine feed on the quill. Just a crappy side collar drill stop and
> a quill lock. I was able to do actual milling with it when I had no
> choice because every other milling machine in the shop required air to
> operate and I needed to making an adapter plate for a new pump on the
> compressor. I used stacks of gage blocks to set the depth on the stop,
> and then used the quill lock. I can make parts with it, but that's a
> kind of torture even somebody with an X2 class machine won't and
> shouldn't have to deal with.
>
> I did contact a few companies to see if they wanted to partner on the
> idea. One tried to sell me a mill outside the scope of what I wanted to
> use. (Three times out of the scope) Harbor Freight never responds to
> me so I didn't even try to contact them. Well, I did, but after looking
> through their contact options I couldn't find anything that sounded
> right. One company sent me an email saying they were forwarding the
> idea to their marketing department. None of the rest I contacted even
> responded, which is about what I expected.
>
> The thing is I am not in the video business. I don't get paid for
> creating video content. Nobody pays me to *tutor them. I don't want to
> spend a grand on a machine that other than this short videos series I
> have no use for. I just want to make this series of videos as a
> personal challenge and maybe to help somebody else along. I'm inspired
> to do it. Not motivated by making money to do it. It may (probably
> not) even cost me some business.
>
> *I actually have been contacted a couple times by people who want to pay
> me to tutor them on some subjects, but I'm not really as qualified as I
> sometimes appear.
>
> --
> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> https://www.avg.com

I would continue to pursue Harbor Freight. It seems that every year or so I get email from their President extolling himself (perhaps rightfully) for making huge donations of tools & equipment to public school shop classes. Surely they'd be interested in your project - I know I would like to see the videos.

https://www.harborfreight.com/about-us/eric-smidt-bio.html

On 3/29/2022 12:47 PM, rangerssuck wrote:
> On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 6:25:14 PM UTC-4, Bob La Londe wrote:
>> Ok, I have a project I've been wanting to do for a little while. Making
>> a short series of videos on making some useful injection molds using a
>> small manual milling machine. Something basically at the bottom of the
>> heap. A machine in the X2 class. Harbor Freight, Little machine shop,
>> Klutch, Wen, Eastwood and many others all sell a machine in about this
>> class.
>>
>> There are a couple issues. I have absolutely no use for this machine
>> beyond the video series I want to make, so I don't want to spend a grand
>> (give or take) on it for six (maybe a couple more) mold making videos
>> and then just throw it on a shelf. All of them have mind numbingly slow
>> spindles for aluminum machining. Usually peaking around 2500-2800 RPM.
>>
>> I could do the video series with my South Bend SB1028F, but I'm sure I
>> would get criticism for using a $24K machine with power feeds and DROs.
>> I want to show that some useful things can be done with a low end manual
>> count the turns machine. I may show the same mold being made on both
>> machines, but the goal is to show useful work being done on a POS
>> countertop milling machine.
>>
>> Now before anybody say "you can't" or "its not worth it," well I
>> actually have a lower end (in some ways) milling machine that has got
>> the entire shop back up and running in a pinch. I've got a Harbor
>> Freight 42976. Its a round column mill/drill much smaller than the
>> RF30/31 with all the failings of a round column mill and it doesn't even
>> have a fine feed on the quill. Just a crappy side collar drill stop and
>> a quill lock. I was able to do actual milling with it when I had no
>> choice because every other milling machine in the shop required air to
>> operate and I needed to making an adapter plate for a new pump on the
>> compressor. I used stacks of gage blocks to set the depth on the stop,
>> and then used the quill lock. I can make parts with it, but that's a
>> kind of torture even somebody with an X2 class machine won't and
>> shouldn't have to deal with.
>>
>> I did contact a few companies to see if they wanted to partner on the
>> idea. One tried to sell me a mill outside the scope of what I wanted to
>> use. (Three times out of the scope) Harbor Freight never responds to
>> me so I didn't even try to contact them. Well, I did, but after looking
>> through their contact options I couldn't find anything that sounded
>> right. One company sent me an email saying they were forwarding the
>> idea to their marketing department. None of the rest I contacted even
>> responded, which is about what I expected.
>>
>> The thing is I am not in the video business. I don't get paid for
>> creating video content. Nobody pays me to *tutor them. I don't want to
>> spend a grand on a machine that other than this short videos series I
>> have no use for. I just want to make this series of videos as a
>> personal challenge and maybe to help somebody else along. I'm inspired
>> to do it. Not motivated by making money to do it. It may (probably
>> not) even cost me some business.
>>
>> *I actually have been contacted a couple times by people who want to pay
>> me to tutor them on some subjects, but I'm not really as qualified as I
>> sometimes appear.
>>
>> --
>> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
>> https://www.avg.com
>
> I would continue to pursue Harbor Freight. It seems that every year or so I get email from their President extolling himself (perhaps rightfully) for making huge donations of tools & equipment to public school shop classes. Surely they'd be interested in your project - I know I would like to see the videos.
>
> https://www.harborfreight.com/about-us/eric-smidt-bio.html

Ok, I sent a request off through corporate media to HF. We shall see if
that goes anywhere. PM was gungho to sell me a machine, but Matt didn't
even offer a discount. Of course he doesn't even have one in that
class. Jet said they would forward my request to media relations.
Nobody else I have contacted has responded. If worse comes to worse,
I'll buy one, strip it down, and repaint the colored bits a nice neutral
green chartreuse so nobody knows what it is. Then when I am done I'll
figure out how I want to dispose of it. LOL.