from https://www.cyclingweekly.com/products/pinarello-creates-impossible-3d-printed-alloy-bike-to-help-filippo-ganna-break-the-hour-record

Pinarello has developed an alloy 3D printed frame allow the design to be custom tweaked to Filippo Ganna. "Aerodynamic performance, power transmission and comfort, all designed around Ganna’s “unique anatomy”, were the primary goals. "

All hail technology......

On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 4:15:29 PM UTC-4, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
> from https://www.cyclingweekly.com/products/pinarello-creates-impossible-3d-printed-alloy-bike-to-help-filippo-ganna-break-the-hour-record
>
> Pinarello has developed an alloy 3D printed frame allow the design to be custom tweaked to Filippo Ganna. "Aerodynamic performance, power transmission and comfort, all designed around Ganna’s “unique anatomy”, were the primary goals. "
>
> All hail technology......

There's an odd sentence in the final paragraph: "While the unusual shape of the handlebars create a ‘drag
penalty’, they also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater amount.." Does the 'drag penalty' refer to drag of the
naked bike? If so, it's irrelevant. Drag of bike+rider is what matters.

- Frank Krygowski

On Tue, 4 Oct 2022 20:24:40 -0700 (PDT), Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 4:15:29 PM UTC-4, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
>> from https://www.cyclingweekly.com/products/pinarello-creates-impossible-3d-printed-alloy-bike-to-help-filippo-ganna-break-the-hour-record
>>
>> Pinarello has developed an alloy 3D printed frame allow the design to be custom tweaked to Filippo Ganna. "Aerodynamic performance, power transmission and comfort, all designed around Ganna’s “unique anatomy”, were the primary goals. "
>>
>> All hail technology......
>
>There's an odd sentence in the final paragraph: "While the unusual shape of the handlebars create a ‘drag
>penalty’, they also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater amount." Does the 'drag penalty' refer to drag of the
>naked bike? If so, it's irrelevant. Drag of bike+rider is what matters.

Clearly, that was the point the writer was making..

>- Frank Krygowski

BTW, Drag isn't much of an issue at the speeds you can ride, Frank.

On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 11:24:42 PM UTC-4, frkr...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 4:15:29 PM UTC-4, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > from https://www.cyclingweekly.com/products/pinarello-creates-impossible-3d-printed-alloy-bike-to-help-filippo-ganna-break-the-hour-record
> >
> > Pinarello has developed an alloy 3D printed frame allow the design to be custom tweaked to Filippo Ganna. "Aerodynamic performance, power transmission and comfort, all designed around Ganna’s “unique anatomy”, were the primary goals. "
> >
> > All hail technology......
> There's an odd sentence in the final paragraph: "While the unusual shape of the handlebars create a ‘drag
> penalty’, they also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater amount." Does the 'drag penalty' refer to drag of the
> naked bike?

That's a reasonable assumption, can't really tell without further details.

> If so, it's irrelevant. Drag of bike+rider is what matters.

Yes, I'm pretty sure that's what they meant when they wrote "the handlebars create a ‘drag penalty’, they also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater amount."

AFAIC the more intersecting aspect of the article is the implication of 3d printing a frame capable of the highest level of performance. If this is viable, custom 3d frame printing for the mass market seems inevitable. I personally know of several riders who have problems getting comfortable fits with standard frame geometries. Imagine getting measured for a frame, selecting optimitztion for either time trialing, long distance touring, etc, then having a frame delivered to your door. It wouldn't be hard to imagine the economy of such a program being competitive with the cost of high-end standard offerings. I'm sure Andrew remembers the panasonic PICS custom frame program from the late 80's?

BTW, let's try to keep the responses to troll defecations to a minimum, at least in this thread....

On Wednesday, October 5, 2022 at 10:35:45 AM UTC+1, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
> BTW, let's try to keep the responses to troll defecations to a minimum, at least in this thread....
>
Oh, now the anonymous, cowardly scum ball, who told us he wrecked our threads because he liked it, wants his own little thread to be immune. That's the best joke in months on a notably humourless group, which means it is just the usual hypocrisy of the RBT Gang of Thugs, i.e. not funny at all.
>
Unsigned out of contempt for cowardly scum hiding behind a pseudonym.
>

On 10/4/2022 10:24 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 4:15:29 PM UTC-4, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
>> from https://www.cyclingweekly.com/products/pinarello-creates-impossible-3d-printed-alloy-bike-to-help-filippo-ganna-break-the-hour-record
>>
>> Pinarello has developed an alloy 3D printed frame allow the design to be custom tweaked to Filippo Ganna. "Aerodynamic performance, power transmission and comfort, all designed around Ganna’s “unique anatomy”, were the primary goals. "
>>
>> All hail technology......
>
> There's an odd sentence in the final paragraph: "While the unusual shape of the handlebars create a ‘drag
> penalty’, they also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater amount." Does the 'drag penalty' refer to drag of the
> naked bike? If so, it's irrelevant. Drag of bike+rider is what matters.
>
> - Frank Krygowski
>

Speaking of 3D printing, we're again reminded of humans'
endless creativity and innovation:

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2022/oct/4/new-york-changes-buyback-rules-after-man-prints-3d/

Which intimates that a firearms ban here would work
something like nuclear nonproliferation (which is to say not
at all)

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On Wed, 05 Oct 2022 08:40:28 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:

>On 10/4/2022 10:24 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 4:15:29 PM UTC-4, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>> from https://www.cyclingweekly.com/products/pinarello-creates-impossible-3d-printed-alloy-bike-to-help-filippo-ganna-break-the-hour-record
>>>
>>> Pinarello has developed an alloy 3D printed frame allow the design to be custom tweaked to Filippo Ganna. "Aerodynamic performance, power transmission and comfort, all designed around Ganna’s “unique anatomyâ€?, were the primary goals. "
>>>
>>> All hail technology......
>>
>> There's an odd sentence in the final paragraph: "While the unusual shape of the handlebars create a ‘drag
>> penalty’, they also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater amount." Does the 'drag penalty' refer to drag of the
>> naked bike? If so, it's irrelevant. Drag of bike+rider is what matters.
>>
>> - Frank Krygowski
>>
>
>
>Speaking of 3D printing, we're again reminded of humans'
>endless creativity and innovation:
>
>https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2022/oct/4/new-york-changes-buyback-rules-after-man-prints-3d/
>
>Which intimates that a firearms ban here would work
>something like nuclear nonproliferation (which is to say not
>at all)

In my humble opinion, technology has tendancy to ruin things. It so
often drives small independant low budget competitors out. I remember
watching the Can Am auto racing series die as a result of Porsche's
big money technology. It's happening in all forms of auto racing and
apparently bicycle racing, too. I see more and more of those swoopy
looking racer bikes out on my bike rides and I think they're as ugly
as the modern day Formula 1 cars. I guess I'm just an old fashion guy.

On 10/5/2022 9:18 AM, Catrike Rider wrote:
> On Wed, 05 Oct 2022 08:40:28 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>
>> On 10/4/2022 10:24 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 4:15:29 PM UTC-4, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>> from https://www.cyclingweekly.com/products/pinarello-creates-impossible-3d-printed-alloy-bike-to-help-filippo-ganna-break-the-hour-record
>>>>
>>>> Pinarello has developed an alloy 3D printed frame allow the design to be custom tweaked to Filippo Ganna. "Aerodynamic performance, power transmission and comfort, all designed around Ganna’s “unique anatomy�, were the primary goals. "
>>>>
>>>> All hail technology......
>>>
>>> There's an odd sentence in the final paragraph: "While the unusual shape of the handlebars create a ‘drag
>>> penalty’, they also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater amount." Does the 'drag penalty' refer to drag of the
>>> naked bike? If so, it's irrelevant. Drag of bike+rider is what matters.
>>>
>>> - Frank Krygowski
>>>
>>
>>
>> Speaking of 3D printing, we're again reminded of humans'
>> endless creativity and innovation:
>>
>> https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2022/oct/4/new-york-changes-buyback-rules-after-man-prints-3d/
>>
>> Which intimates that a firearms ban here would work
>> something like nuclear nonproliferation (which is to say not
>> at all)
>
> In my humble opinion, technology has tendancy to ruin things. It so
> often drives small independant low budget competitors out. I remember
> watching the Can Am auto racing series die as a result of Porsche's
> big money technology. It's happening in all forms of auto racing and
> apparently bicycle racing, too. I see more and more of those swoopy
> looking racer bikes out on my bike rides and I think they're as ugly
> as the modern day Formula 1 cars. I guess I'm just an old fashion guy.
>

meh. Goes both ways.

In SCCA the Corvairs were still racing well against big
budget new machines in 1980. And no one pines for 'the good
old days' of gathering firewood and drawing a pail of water
to make the morning coffee.

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On 10/5/2022 5:35 AM, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 11:24:42 PM UTC-4, frkr...@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 4:15:29 PM UTC-4, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>> from https://www.cyclingweekly.com/products/pinarello-creates-impossible-3d-printed-alloy-bike-to-help-filippo-ganna-break-the-hour-record
>>>
>>> Pinarello has developed an alloy 3D printed frame allow the design to be custom tweaked to Filippo Ganna. "Aerodynamic performance, power transmission and comfort, all designed around Ganna’s “unique anatomy”, were the primary goals. "
>>>
>>> All hail technology......
>> There's an odd sentence in the final paragraph: "While the unusual shape of the handlebars create a ‘drag
>> penalty’, they also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater amount." Does the 'drag penalty' refer to drag of the
>> naked bike?
>
> That's a reasonable assumption, can't really tell without further details.
>
>> If so, it's irrelevant. Drag of bike+rider is what matters.
>
> Yes, I'm pretty sure that's what they meant when they wrote "the handlebars create a ‘drag penalty’, they also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater amount."
>
> AFAIC the more intersecting aspect of the article is the implication of 3d printing a frame capable of the highest level of performance. If this is viable, custom 3d frame printing for the mass market seems inevitable. I personally know of several riders who have problems getting comfortable fits with standard frame geometries. Imagine getting measured for a frame, selecting optimitztion for either time trialing, long distance touring, etc, then having a frame delivered to your door.

It sounds nice, although I may be too tolerant to benefit much. I feel
quite comfortable on all my bikes, except perhaps the now seldom ridden
mountain bike. (That was built up piece by piece from a frame intended
for a different family member.) Two of the bikes were custom built, but
I still think I benefit from very average body dimensions.

But rather than manufacturing technology, I wonder if we need better
science in determining what bike fit actually works best for various
riders. I have one friend who paid a pretty high price for a fitting
session (Fit Kit or something similar) but wasn't extremely happy with
the result. And we have Tom, who seems to be constantly fiddling with
frame dimensions, handlebar, stems, etc. trying to get really
comfortable. It's always Tom's _next_ bike that's going to finally be
right.

> BTW, let's try to keep the responses to troll defecations to a minimum, at least in this thread....

Good idea. I see they're already here.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On 10/5/2022 12:37 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
> On 10/5/2022 5:35 AM, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
>> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 11:24:42 PM UTC-4,
>> frkr...@gmail.com wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 4:15:29 PM UTC-4,
>>> funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>> from
>>>> https://www.cyclingweekly.com/products/pinarello-creates-impossible-3d-printed-alloy-bike-to-help-filippo-ganna-break-the-hour-record
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Pinarello has developed an alloy 3D printed frame allow
>>>> the design to be custom tweaked to Filippo Ganna.
>>>> "Aerodynamic performance, power transmission and
>>>> comfort, all designed around Ganna’s “unique
>>>> anatomy”, were the primary goals. "
>>>>
>>>> All hail technology......
>>> There's an odd sentence in the final paragraph: "While
>>> the unusual shape of the handlebars create a ‘drag
>>> penalty’, they also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater
>>> amount." Does the 'drag penalty' refer to drag of the
>>> naked bike?
>>
>> That's a reasonable assumption, can't really tell without
>> further details.
>>
>>> If so, it's irrelevant. Drag of bike+rider is what matters.
>>
>> Yes, I'm pretty sure that's what they meant when they
>> wrote "the handlebars create a ‘drag penalty’, they
>> also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater amount."
>>
>> AFAIC the more intersecting aspect of the article is the
>> implication of 3d printing a frame capable of the highest
>> level of performance. If this is viable, custom 3d frame
>> printing for the mass market seems inevitable. I
>> personally know of several riders who have problems
>> getting comfortable fits with standard frame geometries.
>> Imagine getting measured for a frame, selecting
>> optimitztion for either time trialing, long distance
>> touring, etc, then having a frame delivered to your door.
>
> It sounds nice, although I may be too tolerant to benefit
> much. I feel quite comfortable on all my bikes, except
> perhaps the now seldom ridden mountain bike. (That was built
> up piece by piece from a frame intended for a different
> family member.) Two of the bikes were custom built, but I
> still think I benefit from very average body dimensions.
>
> But rather than manufacturing technology, I wonder if we
> need better science in determining what bike fit actually
> works best for various riders. I have one friend who paid a
> pretty high price for a fitting session (Fit Kit or
> something similar) but wasn't extremely happy with the
> result. And we have Tom, who seems to be constantly fiddling
> with frame dimensions, handlebar, stems, etc. trying to get
> really comfortable. It's always Tom's _next_ bike that's
> going to finally be right.
>
>> BTW, let's try to keep the responses to troll defecations
>> to a minimum, at least in this thread....
>
> Good idea. I see they're already here.
>

You're on to something there.

Humans are dynamic and skeletal dimension analysis can fall
far short of a 'comfortable fit' for many riders.

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On Wednesday, October 5, 2022 at 3:18:36 PM UTC+1, Catrike Rider wrote:
> On Wed, 05 Oct 2022 08:40:28 -0500, AMuzi <a...@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>
> >On 10/4/2022 10:24 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
> >> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 4:15:29 PM UTC-4, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
> >>> from https://www.cyclingweekly.com/products/pinarello-creates-impossible-3d-printed-alloy-bike-to-help-filippo-ganna-break-the-hour-record
> >>>
> >>> Pinarello has developed an alloy 3D printed frame allow the design to be custom tweaked to Filippo Ganna. "Aerodynamic performance, power transmission and comfort, all designed around Ganna’s “unique anatomy�€?, were the primary goals. "
> >>>
> >>> All hail technology......
> >>
> >> There's an odd sentence in the final paragraph: "While the unusual shape of the handlebars create a ‘drag
> >> penalty’, they also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater amount." Does the 'drag penalty' refer to drag of the
> >> naked bike? If so, it's irrelevant. Drag of bike+rider is what matters..
> >>
> >> - Frank Krygowski
> >>
> >
> >
> >Speaking of 3D printing, we're again reminded of humans'
> >endless creativity and innovation:
> >
> >https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2022/oct/4/new-york-changes-buyback-rules-after-man-prints-3d/
> >
> >Which intimates that a firearms ban here would work
> >something like nuclear nonproliferation (which is to say not
> >at all)
> In my humble opinion, technology has tendancy to ruin things. It so
> often drives small independant low budget competitors out. I remember
> watching the Can Am auto racing series die as a result of Porsche's
> big money technology. It's happening in all forms of auto racing and
> apparently bicycle racing, too. I see more and more of those swoopy
> looking racer bikes out on my bike rides and I think they're as ugly
> as the modern day Formula 1 cars. I guess I'm just an old fashion guy.
>
You're not alone. -- AJ

On Wednesday, October 5, 2022 at 1:23:54 PM UTC+1, Andre Jute wrote:
> On Wednesday, October 5, 2022 at 10:35:45 AM UTC+1, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
> >
> > BTW, let's try to keep the responses to troll defecations to a minimum, at least in this thread....
> >
> Oh, now the anonymous, cowardly scum ball, who told us he wrecked our threads because he liked it, wants his own little thread to be immune. That's the best joke in months on a notably humourless group, which means it is just the usual hypocrisy of the RBT Gang of Thugs, i.e. not funny at all.
> >
> Unsigned out of contempt for cowardly scum hiding behind a pseudonym.
> >
And here is the little anonymous shithead's complete retort, in his usual vicious, malicious, lying lack of style complete with spittle-spraying misspellings:
>
*****
On Wednesday, October 5, 2022 at 2:33:59 PM UTC+1, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
> in https://groups.google.com/g/rec.bicycles.tech/c/Lf38EE45_bM/m/_nooIPjjAQAJ
>
> First off, let's just say how satisfying it is to see you realize any "contribution" from you solidly qualifies as troll shit.
>
> RBTs Defecator-in-cheif wrote:
>
> "Oh, now the anonymous, cowardly scum ball, who told us he wrecked our threads because he liked it, wants his own little thread to be immune."
>
> Tell me, you pathetic shitstain, Exactly when and where have I _ever_ in this forum stated I "enjoy wrecking threads", or even wrote anything that remotely implies it? Seems to me that has been explicitly stated by you on several occasions, and was most recently stated by an anonymous tricycle rider - whom you curiously don't seem to mind being anonymous.
>
> And speaking of being anonymous and cowardly, Why don't you post under your real name? What are you afraid of? (yes, everyone, Andre Jute is not his legal name)
>
> > That's the best joke in months on a notably humourless group, which
> > means it is just the usual hypocrisy of the RBT Gang of Thugs, i.e.
> > not funny at all. "
>
> Sure, the hypocrisy lies with a topical post to RBT, but not with you polluting this group with your inane, vapid, and many times unintelligible political rants in both your OPs and responses, or with you criticizing an anonymous handle while you don't post under your real name, or with you constantly criticizing American Democratic social policies while living off the social welfare system of Ireland.
>
> You're the joke here. You're an old pathetic fool who had some past minor glory as an obscure author decades ago, and seeks some bizarre form validation from the only place that your written word isn't refused.
>
> You're already dead to this world, you're just too stupid and arrogant to recognize it.
*****
>
I've been wished dead by bigger and better men than you, armed with better training and weapons than you can even imagine, you silly little nobody hiding behind a pseudonym, and I sent them home to a life of eating their meals through a tube, as a warning to their masters, or in boxes when their masters didn't take my unsubtle warning, and then in a single phone call frightened the man who sent them so shitless that he called my mother to beg for mercy.
>
And that leads us to your latest attempt to accuse me of what you do every day. Andre Jute is the name on my birth certificate and I have lived my life transparently in public. You're just too dumb and unconnected to discover who I am, which is why you fabricate lies so transparent I generally can't be bothered to repudiate them. Can you say the same, you anonymous shortass failure, Flunkmeister?
>
Unsigned out of contempt for a poor fool who can't even manage to intimidate an elderly bespectacled retiree.
>
Heh-heh!
>

On Wednesday, October 5, 2022 at 2:02:48 PM UTC-4, AMuzi wrote:
> On 10/5/2022 12:37 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
> > On 10/5/2022 5:35 AM, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
> >> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 11:24:42 PM UTC-4,
> >> frkr...@gmail.com wrote:
> >>> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 4:15:29 PM UTC-4,
> >>> funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
> >>>> from
> >>>> https://www.cyclingweekly.com/products/pinarello-creates-impossible-3d-printed-alloy-bike-to-help-filippo-ganna-break-the-hour-record
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Pinarello has developed an alloy 3D printed frame allow
> >>>> the design to be custom tweaked to Filippo Ganna.
> >>>> "Aerodynamic performance, power transmission and
> >>>> comfort, all designed around Ganna’s “unique
> >>>> anatomy†, were the primary goals. "
> >>>>
> >>>> All hail technology......
> >>> There's an odd sentence in the final paragraph: "While
> >>> the unusual shape of the handlebars create a ‘drag
> >>> penalty’, they also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater
> >>> amount." Does the 'drag penalty' refer to drag of the
> >>> naked bike?
> >>
> >> That's a reasonable assumption, can't really tell without
> >> further details.
> >>
> >>> If so, it's irrelevant. Drag of bike+rider is what matters.
> >>
> >> Yes, I'm pretty sure that's what they meant when they
> >> wrote "the handlebars create a ‘drag penalty’, they
> >> also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater amount."
> >>
> >> AFAIC the more intersecting aspect of the article is the
> >> implication of 3d printing a frame capable of the highest
> >> level of performance. If this is viable, custom 3d frame
> >> printing for the mass market seems inevitable. I
> >> personally know of several riders who have problems
> >> getting comfortable fits with standard frame geometries.
> >> Imagine getting measured for a frame, selecting
> >> optimitztion for either time trialing, long distance
> >> touring, etc, then having a frame delivered to your door.
> >
> > It sounds nice, although I may be too tolerant to benefit
> > much. I feel quite comfortable on all my bikes, except
> > perhaps the now seldom ridden mountain bike. (That was built
> > up piece by piece from a frame intended for a different
> > family member.) Two of the bikes were custom built, but I
> > still think I benefit from very average body dimensions.
> >
> > But rather than manufacturing technology, I wonder if we
> > need better science in determining what bike fit actually
> > works best for various riders. I have one friend who paid a
> > pretty high price for a fitting session (Fit Kit or
> > something similar) but wasn't extremely happy with the
> > result. And we have Tom, who seems to be constantly fiddling
> > with frame dimensions, handlebar, stems, etc. trying to get
> > really comfortable. It's always Tom's _next_ bike that's
> > going to finally be right.
> >
> >> BTW, let's try to keep the responses to troll defecations
> >> to a minimum, at least in this thread....
> >
> > Good idea. I see they're already here.
> >
> You're on to something there.
>
> Humans are dynamic and skeletal dimension analysis can fall
> far short of a 'comfortable fit' for many riders.
> --

Yes, dimensional analysis doesn't always translate well. It can't predict biomechanical issues. It's just as necessary to watch some actually riding (much like analyzing a runners gait in order to get the orthotics correct). Still, for people without significant issues, I think something like a custom 3D frame could work well.

And here is the Flunkmeister's full response, including a promise to show us how "viscous" he can get, presumably referring to the slimy trail His Sluggishness leaves wherever he goes:
>
On Wednesday, October 5, 2022 at 10:02:55 PM UTC+1, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
> And here is Andre McCoys vapid attempt at digging himself out of his own pile of shit (dragging his whiney little ass back here):
>
> > And here is the little anonymous shithead's complete retort, in his usual vicious, malicious, lying lack of style complete with spittle-spraying misspellings:
>
> No lies or misspellings. If you insist there are please list them. Plenty of invective, though you haven't even begun to experience just how viscous I can get.
>
> >
> <snipped copied post (showing his complete lack of imagination, as usual)>
> >
> > I've been wished dead by bigger and better men than you, armed with better training
> > and weapons than you can even imagine, you silly little nobody hiding behind a pseudonym,
> > and I sent them home to a life of eating their meals through a tube, as a warning to their masters,
> > or in boxes when their masters didn't take my unsubtle warning, and then in a single phone call
> > frightened the man who sent them so shitless that he called my mother to beg for mercy.
>
> I'm soooo fucking scared...just frightened to tears! Yes, I'm about as afraid of you as I am kunich. IOW, fuck off you demented old half-wit. It's no wonder no one wants to publish you any more, you pathetic has-been (if indeed, ever was). That little missive was about as entertaining as a refrigerator magnet, and like as true.
>
> >
> > And that leads us to your latest attempt to accuse me of what you do every day.
>
> I'm not hiding from anyone. My identity is cleverly hidden in plain sight.. It's a pity you haven't the acumen or even common sense to figure it out.
>
> > Andre Jute is the name on my birth certificate
>
> Partially.....
>
> > and I have
> > lived my life transparently in public.
>
> Bullshit:
> https://sf-encyclopedia.com/entry/mccoy_andrew
> André Jute McCoy born Oudtshoorn, South Africa: 1945
>
> What's the matter andre, did daddy not love you enough to let you keep his name? or did he simply run out on you because he knew what a useless little bastard you'd turn out to be?
>
> > You're just too dumb and unconnected to discover who I am, which is why you fabricate lies so
> > transparent I generally can't be bothered to repudiate them.
>
> You can't repudiate _any_ thing I've written, because you're a fucking fraud, mccoy.
>
> > Can you say the same,
>
> Yes, I can, with one small correction. You're just too dumb and unconnected to discover who I am, which is why you fabricate lies so transparent that repudiation is like fishing with dynamite.
>
> > you anonymous shortass failure, Flunkmeister?
>
> <snicker> I'm not the one hiding in Ireland living off social welfare. I have a big hose, large yard, rather substantial retirement nest egg, loving family, and lots of friends. It's a pity we know you can't say the same, you derelict.
>
> > Unsigned out of contempt for a poor fool who can't even manage to intimidate an elderly bespectacled retiree.
> >
> > Heh-heh!
> >
>
> No one's laughing with you, mccoy, we're laughing _at_ you.
>
Delighted to hear that, Flunky. I wanted to be a standup comedian, but I wasn't common enough. Now you, you wouldn't have cut it as a standup comedian either. For a start, you don't have any wit, but in the main, you're just too, too common.
>
Unsigned out of contempt for a fool who tells us more about himself than about me every time he opens his fat mouth.
>
Heh-heh!
>

On Wed, 05 Oct 2022 11:31:05 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:

>On 10/5/2022 9:18 AM, Catrike Rider wrote:
>> On Wed, 05 Oct 2022 08:40:28 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>>
>>> On 10/4/2022 10:24 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>>>> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 4:15:29 PM UTC-4, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>>> from https://www.cyclingweekly.com/products/pinarello-creates-impossible-3d-printed-alloy-bike-to-help-filippo-ganna-break-the-hour-record
>>>>>
>>>>> Pinarello has developed an alloy 3D printed frame allow the design to be custom tweaked to Filippo Ganna. "Aerodynamic performance, power transmission and comfort, all designed around Ganna’s “unique anatomyâ€?, were the primary goals. "
>>>>>
>>>>> All hail technology......
>>>>
>>>> There's an odd sentence in the final paragraph: "While the unusual shape of the handlebars create a ‘drag
>>>> penalty’, they also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater amount." Does the 'drag penalty' refer to drag of the
>>>> naked bike? If so, it's irrelevant. Drag of bike+rider is what matters.
>>>>
>>>> - Frank Krygowski
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Speaking of 3D printing, we're again reminded of humans'
>>> endless creativity and innovation:
>>>
>>> https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2022/oct/4/new-york-changes-buyback-rules-after-man-prints-3d/
>>>
>>> Which intimates that a firearms ban here would work
>>> something like nuclear nonproliferation (which is to say not
>>> at all)
>>
>> In my humble opinion, technology has tendancy to ruin things. It so
>> often drives small independant low budget competitors out. I remember
>> watching the Can Am auto racing series die as a result of Porsche's
>> big money technology. It's happening in all forms of auto racing and
>> apparently bicycle racing, too. I see more and more of those swoopy
>> looking racer bikes out on my bike rides and I think they're as ugly
>> as the modern day Formula 1 cars. I guess I'm just an old fashion guy.
>>
>
>meh. Goes both ways.
>
>In SCCA the Corvairs were still racing well against big
>budget new machines in 1980.

Yenko?

> And no one pines for 'the good
>old days' of gathering firewood and drawing a pail of water
>to make the morning coffee.

Not everyday, anyway..

On Wed, 05 Oct 2022 13:02:43 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:

>On 10/5/2022 12:37 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>> On 10/5/2022 5:35 AM, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 11:24:42 PM UTC-4,
>>> frkr...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 4:15:29 PM UTC-4,
>>>> funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>>> from
>>>>> https://www.cyclingweekly.com/products/pinarello-creates-impossible-3d-printed-alloy-bike-to-help-filippo-ganna-break-the-hour-record
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Pinarello has developed an alloy 3D printed frame allow
>>>>> the design to be custom tweaked to Filippo Ganna.
>>>>> "Aerodynamic performance, power transmission and
>>>>> comfort, all designed around Ganna’s “unique
>>>>> anatomy�, were the primary goals. "
>>>>>
>>>>> All hail technology......
>>>> There's an odd sentence in the final paragraph: "While
>>>> the unusual shape of the handlebars create a ‘drag
>>>> penalty’, they also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater
>>>> amount." Does the 'drag penalty' refer to drag of the
>>>> naked bike?
>>>
>>> That's a reasonable assumption, can't really tell without
>>> further details.
>>>
>>>> If so, it's irrelevant. Drag of bike+rider is what matters.
>>>
>>> Yes, I'm pretty sure that's what they meant when they
>>> wrote "the handlebars create a ‘drag penalty’, they
>>> also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater amount."
>>>
>>> AFAIC the more intersecting aspect of the article is the
>>> implication of 3d printing a frame capable of the highest
>>> level of performance. If this is viable, custom 3d frame
>>> printing for the mass market seems inevitable. I
>>> personally know of several riders who have problems
>>> getting comfortable fits with standard frame geometries.
>>> Imagine getting measured for a frame, selecting
>>> optimitztion for either time trialing, long distance
>>> touring, etc, then having a frame delivered to your door.
>>
>> It sounds nice, although I may be too tolerant to benefit
>> much. I feel quite comfortable on all my bikes, except
>> perhaps the now seldom ridden mountain bike. (That was built
>> up piece by piece from a frame intended for a different
>> family member.) Two of the bikes were custom built, but I
>> still think I benefit from very average body dimensions.
>>
>> But rather than manufacturing technology, I wonder if we
>> need better science in determining what bike fit actually
>> works best for various riders. I have one friend who paid a
>> pretty high price for a fitting session (Fit Kit or
>> something similar) but wasn't extremely happy with the
>> result. And we have Tom, who seems to be constantly fiddling
>> with frame dimensions, handlebar, stems, etc. trying to get
>> really comfortable. It's always Tom's _next_ bike that's
>> going to finally be right.
>>
>>> BTW, let's try to keep the responses to troll defecations
>>> to a minimum, at least in this thread....
>>
>> Good idea. I see they're already here.
>>
>
>You're on to something there.
>
>Humans are dynamic and skeletal dimension analysis can fall
>far short of a 'comfortable fit' for many riders.

Continuously seeking the ideal is human nature. Muscles change, joints
change, attitudes change, and bicycle components change.

On 10/5/2022 5:25 PM, Catrike Rider wrote:
> On Wed, 05 Oct 2022 11:31:05 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>
>> On 10/5/2022 9:18 AM, Catrike Rider wrote:
>>> On Wed, 05 Oct 2022 08:40:28 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 10/4/2022 10:24 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>>>>> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 4:15:29 PM UTC-4, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>>>> from https://www.cyclingweekly.com/products/pinarello-creates-impossible-3d-printed-alloy-bike-to-help-filippo-ganna-break-the-hour-record
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Pinarello has developed an alloy 3D printed frame allow the design to be custom tweaked to Filippo Ganna. "Aerodynamic performance, power transmission and comfort, all designed around Ganna’s “unique anatomy�, were the primary goals. "
>>>>>>
>>>>>> All hail technology......
>>>>>
>>>>> There's an odd sentence in the final paragraph: "While the unusual shape of the handlebars create a ‘drag
>>>>> penalty’, they also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater amount." Does the 'drag penalty' refer to drag of the
>>>>> naked bike? If so, it's irrelevant. Drag of bike+rider is what matters.
>>>>>
>>>>> - Frank Krygowski
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Speaking of 3D printing, we're again reminded of humans'
>>>> endless creativity and innovation:
>>>>
>>>> https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2022/oct/4/new-york-changes-buyback-rules-after-man-prints-3d/
>>>>
>>>> Which intimates that a firearms ban here would work
>>>> something like nuclear nonproliferation (which is to say not
>>>> at all)
>>>
>>> In my humble opinion, technology has tendancy to ruin things. It so
>>> often drives small independant low budget competitors out. I remember
>>> watching the Can Am auto racing series die as a result of Porsche's
>>> big money technology. It's happening in all forms of auto racing and
>>> apparently bicycle racing, too. I see more and more of those swoopy
>>> looking racer bikes out on my bike rides and I think they're as ugly
>>> as the modern day Formula 1 cars. I guess I'm just an old fashion guy.
>>>
>>
>> meh. Goes both ways.
>>
>> In SCCA the Corvairs were still racing well against big
>> budget new machines in 1980.
>
> Yenko?
>
>> And no one pines for 'the good
>> old days' of gathering firewood and drawing a pail of water
>> to make the morning coffee.
>
> Not everyday, anyway..
>

Yes, Yenkos although Don Yenko himself had moved on to other
projects well before then. I talked with him once in the
early 1990s. He was selling Hondas. (and hung up on me when
I asked about Corsa cam lift and duration)

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On Wed, 05 Oct 2022 17:41:17 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:

>On 10/5/2022 5:25 PM, Catrike Rider wrote:
>> On Wed, 05 Oct 2022 11:31:05 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>>
>>> On 10/5/2022 9:18 AM, Catrike Rider wrote:
>>>> On Wed, 05 Oct 2022 08:40:28 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 10/4/2022 10:24 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>>>>>> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 4:15:29 PM UTC-4, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>>>>> from https://www.cyclingweekly.com/products/pinarello-creates-impossible-3d-printed-alloy-bike-to-help-filippo-ganna-break-the-hour-record
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Pinarello has developed an alloy 3D printed frame allow the design to be custom tweaked to Filippo Ganna. "Aerodynamic performance, power transmission and comfort, all designed around Ganna’s “unique anatomyâ€?, were the primary goals. "
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> All hail technology......
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There's an odd sentence in the final paragraph: "While the unusual shape of the handlebars create a ‘drag
>>>>>> penalty’, they also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater amount." Does the 'drag penalty' refer to drag of the
>>>>>> naked bike? If so, it's irrelevant. Drag of bike+rider is what matters.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> - Frank Krygowski
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Speaking of 3D printing, we're again reminded of humans'
>>>>> endless creativity and innovation:
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2022/oct/4/new-york-changes-buyback-rules-after-man-prints-3d/
>>>>>
>>>>> Which intimates that a firearms ban here would work
>>>>> something like nuclear nonproliferation (which is to say not
>>>>> at all)
>>>>
>>>> In my humble opinion, technology has tendancy to ruin things. It so
>>>> often drives small independant low budget competitors out. I remember
>>>> watching the Can Am auto racing series die as a result of Porsche's
>>>> big money technology. It's happening in all forms of auto racing and
>>>> apparently bicycle racing, too. I see more and more of those swoopy
>>>> looking racer bikes out on my bike rides and I think they're as ugly
>>>> as the modern day Formula 1 cars. I guess I'm just an old fashion guy.
>>>>
>>>
>>> meh. Goes both ways.
>>>
>>> In SCCA the Corvairs were still racing well against big
>>> budget new machines in 1980.
>>
>> Yenko?
>>
>>> And no one pines for 'the good
>>> old days' of gathering firewood and drawing a pail of water
>>> to make the morning coffee.
>>
>> Not everyday, anyway..
>>
>
>
>Yes, Yenkos although Don Yenko himself had moved on to other
>projects well before then. I talked with him once in the
>early 1990s. He was selling Hondas. (and hung up on me when
>I asked about Corsa cam lift and duration)

I owned a 66 Corvair 2 dr, 140 HP.. Loved that car.

On 10/5/2022 5:57 PM, Catrike Rider wrote:
> On Wed, 05 Oct 2022 17:41:17 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>
>> On 10/5/2022 5:25 PM, Catrike Rider wrote:
>>> On Wed, 05 Oct 2022 11:31:05 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 10/5/2022 9:18 AM, Catrike Rider wrote:
>>>>> On Wed, 05 Oct 2022 08:40:28 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 10/4/2022 10:24 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>>>>>>> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 4:15:29 PM UTC-4, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>>>>>> from https://www.cyclingweekly.com/products/pinarello-creates-impossible-3d-printed-alloy-bike-to-help-filippo-ganna-break-the-hour-record
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Pinarello has developed an alloy 3D printed frame allow the design to be custom tweaked to Filippo Ganna. "Aerodynamic performance, power transmission and comfort, all designed around Ganna’s “unique anatomy�, were the primary goals. "
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> All hail technology......
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> There's an odd sentence in the final paragraph: "While the unusual shape of the handlebars create a ‘drag
>>>>>>> penalty’, they also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater amount." Does the 'drag penalty' refer to drag of the
>>>>>>> naked bike? If so, it's irrelevant. Drag of bike+rider is what matters.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> - Frank Krygowski
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Speaking of 3D printing, we're again reminded of humans'
>>>>>> endless creativity and innovation:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2022/oct/4/new-york-changes-buyback-rules-after-man-prints-3d/
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Which intimates that a firearms ban here would work
>>>>>> something like nuclear nonproliferation (which is to say not
>>>>>> at all)
>>>>>
>>>>> In my humble opinion, technology has tendancy to ruin things. It so
>>>>> often drives small independant low budget competitors out. I remember
>>>>> watching the Can Am auto racing series die as a result of Porsche's
>>>>> big money technology. It's happening in all forms of auto racing and
>>>>> apparently bicycle racing, too. I see more and more of those swoopy
>>>>> looking racer bikes out on my bike rides and I think they're as ugly
>>>>> as the modern day Formula 1 cars. I guess I'm just an old fashion guy.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> meh. Goes both ways.
>>>>
>>>> In SCCA the Corvairs were still racing well against big
>>>> budget new machines in 1980.
>>>
>>> Yenko?
>>>
>>>> And no one pines for 'the good
>>>> old days' of gathering firewood and drawing a pail of water
>>>> to make the morning coffee.
>>>
>>> Not everyday, anyway..
>>>
>>
>>
>> Yes, Yenkos although Don Yenko himself had moved on to other
>> projects well before then. I talked with him once in the
>> early 1990s. He was selling Hondas. (and hung up on me when
>> I asked about Corsa cam lift and duration)
>
> I owned a 66 Corvair 2 dr, 140 HP.. Loved that car.
>

Nice ride. I've owned many and just started a new project
after wrecking a nice one last summer.

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On 10/5/2022 8:11 PM, AMuzi wrote:
> On 10/5/2022 5:57 PM, Catrike Rider wrote:
>>
>>
>> I owned a 66 Corvair 2 dr, 140 HP..  Loved that car.
>>
>
> Nice ride. I've owned many and just started a new project after wrecking
> a nice one last summer.

Damn! That's a real shame.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On Wednesday, October 5, 2022 at 5:11:26 PM UTC-4, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
> On Wednesday, October 5, 2022 at 2:02:48 PM UTC-4, AMuzi wrote:
> > On 10/5/2022 12:37 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
> > > On 10/5/2022 5:35 AM, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > >> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 11:24:42 PM UTC-4,
> > >> frkr...@gmail.com wrote:
> > >>> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 4:15:29 PM UTC-4,
> > >>> funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > >>>> from
> > >>>> https://www.cyclingweekly.com/products/pinarello-creates-impossible-3d-printed-alloy-bike-to-help-filippo-ganna-break-the-hour-record
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Pinarello has developed an alloy 3D printed frame allow
> > >>>> the design to be custom tweaked to Filippo Ganna.
> > >>>> "Aerodynamic performance, power transmission and
> > >>>> comfort, all designed around Ganna’s “unique
> > >>>> anatomy†, were the primary goals. "
> > >>>>
> > >>>> All hail technology......
> > >>> There's an odd sentence in the final paragraph: "While
> > >>> the unusual shape of the handlebars create a ‘drag
> > >>> penalty’, they also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater
> > >>> amount." Does the 'drag penalty' refer to drag of the
> > >>> naked bike?
> > >>
> > >> That's a reasonable assumption, can't really tell without
> > >> further details.
> > >>
> > >>> If so, it's irrelevant. Drag of bike+rider is what matters.
> > >>
> > >> Yes, I'm pretty sure that's what they meant when they
> > >> wrote "the handlebars create a ‘drag penalty’, they
> > >> also reduce Ganna’s drag by a greater amount."
> > >>
> > >> AFAIC the more intersecting aspect of the article is the
> > >> implication of 3d printing a frame capable of the highest
> > >> level of performance. If this is viable, custom 3d frame
> > >> printing for the mass market seems inevitable. I
> > >> personally know of several riders who have problems
> > >> getting comfortable fits with standard frame geometries.
> > >> Imagine getting measured for a frame, selecting
> > >> optimitztion for either time trialing, long distance
> > >> touring, etc, then having a frame delivered to your door.
> > >
> > > It sounds nice, although I may be too tolerant to benefit
> > > much. I feel quite comfortable on all my bikes, except
> > > perhaps the now seldom ridden mountain bike. (That was built
> > > up piece by piece from a frame intended for a different
> > > family member.) Two of the bikes were custom built, but I
> > > still think I benefit from very average body dimensions.
> > >
> > > But rather than manufacturing technology, I wonder if we
> > > need better science in determining what bike fit actually
> > > works best for various riders. I have one friend who paid a
> > > pretty high price for a fitting session (Fit Kit or
> > > something similar) but wasn't extremely happy with the
> > > result. And we have Tom, who seems to be constantly fiddling
> > > with frame dimensions, handlebar, stems, etc. trying to get
> > > really comfortable. It's always Tom's _next_ bike that's
> > > going to finally be right.
> > >
> > >> BTW, let's try to keep the responses to troll defecations
> > >> to a minimum, at least in this thread....
> > >
> > > Good idea. I see they're already here.
> > >
> > You're on to something there.
> >
> > Humans are dynamic and skeletal dimension analysis can fall
> > far short of a 'comfortable fit' for many riders.
> > --
> Yes, dimensional analysis doesn't always translate well. It can't predict biomechanical issues. It's just as necessary to watch some actually riding (much like analyzing a runners gait in order to get the orthotics correct).. Still, for people without significant issues, I think something like a custom 3D frame could work well.

I just found out there is a category of software known as pose estimation that can infer a skeleton of joint motion from a video. There are a bunch of tutorials on OpenPose out there on youtube. I would like to use this for my disc golf throw but the software setup is a bit intimidating.

On Thursday, October 6, 2022 at 12:07:12 PM UTC-4, timoth...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Wednesday, October 5, 2022 at 5:11:26 PM UTC-4, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:

> > Yes, dimensional analysis doesn't always translate well. It can't predict biomechanical issues. It's just as necessary to watch some actually riding (much like analyzing a runners gait in order to get the orthotics correct). Still, for people without significant issues, I think something like a custom 3D frame could work well.
> I just found out there is a category of software known as pose estimation that can infer a skeleton of joint motion from a video. There are a bunch of tutorials on OpenPose out there on youtube. I would like to use this for my disc golf throw but the software setup is a bit intimidating.

I'd imagine you need a relatively good camera as well. I was bit by the Disc Golf bug a few years ago. I'm fortunate that there are quite literally a dozen courses within a half hour drive from me. The Clement Farm course (Haverhill, MA) is two miles from my house, an excellent course that hosts tournaments on a regular basis. I'm not very good at it, but really enjoy it. I have a few regular friends I go with and we play "bogey" golf - that is, we consider it a successful game if we shoot 18 over par. IOW - we all really suck at it, but we have a good time.

On 10/6/2022 2:26 PM, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
> On Thursday, October 6, 2022 at 12:07:12 PM UTC-4, timoth...@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Wednesday, October 5, 2022 at 5:11:26 PM UTC-4, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
>>> Yes, dimensional analysis doesn't always translate well. It can't predict biomechanical issues. It's just as necessary to watch some actually riding (much like analyzing a runners gait in order to get the orthotics correct). Still, for people without significant issues, I think something like a custom 3D frame could work well.
>> I just found out there is a category of software known as pose estimation that can infer a skeleton of joint motion from a video. There are a bunch of tutorials on OpenPose out there on youtube. I would like to use this for my disc golf throw but the software setup is a bit intimidating.
>
> I'd imagine you need a relatively good camera as well. I was bit by the Disc Golf bug a few years ago. I'm fortunate that there are quite literally a dozen courses within a half hour drive from me. The Clement Farm course (Haverhill, MA) is two miles from my house, an excellent course that hosts tournaments on a regular basis. I'm not very good at it, but really enjoy it. I have a few regular friends I go with and we play "bogey" golf - that is, we consider it a successful game if we shoot 18 over par. IOW - we all really suck at it, but we have a good time.

Disc golf hasn't taken off much around here. It exists, but I don't know
many who play. What's soared is Pickleball. Our club's multi-year high
club mileage winner (over 10,000 miles in several years counting only
club rides, not individual rides) now rarely shows up for rides. He's
playing pickleball instead.

Interestingly, the injury frequency of our club members from Pickleball
is greatly exceeding that from bicycling. Falls, muscle problems, joint
problems, connective tissue injuries (tendonitis, plantar fascitis) etc.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On Thursday, October 6, 2022 at 4:21:37 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
> On 10/6/2022 2:26 PM, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > On Thursday, October 6, 2022 at 12:07:12 PM UTC-4, timoth...@gmail.com wrote:
> >> On Wednesday, October 5, 2022 at 5:11:26 PM UTC-4, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
> >
> >>> Yes, dimensional analysis doesn't always translate well. It can't predict biomechanical issues. It's just as necessary to watch some actually riding (much like analyzing a runners gait in order to get the orthotics correct). Still, for people without significant issues, I think something like a custom 3D frame could work well.
> >> I just found out there is a category of software known as pose estimation that can infer a skeleton of joint motion from a video. There are a bunch of tutorials on OpenPose out there on youtube. I would like to use this for my disc golf throw but the software setup is a bit intimidating.
> >
> > I'd imagine you need a relatively good camera as well. I was bit by the Disc Golf bug a few years ago. I'm fortunate that there are quite literally a dozen courses within a half hour drive from me. The Clement Farm course (Haverhill, MA) is two miles from my house, an excellent course that hosts tournaments on a regular basis. I'm not very good at it, but really enjoy it. I have a few regular friends I go with and we play "bogey" golf - that is, we consider it a successful game if we shoot 18 over par. IOW - we all really suck at it, but we have a good time.
> Disc golf hasn't taken off much around here. It exists, but I don't know
> many who play. What's soared is Pickleball. Our club's multi-year high
> club mileage winner (over 10,000 miles in several years counting only
> club rides, not individual rides) now rarely shows up for rides. He's
> playing pickleball instead.
>
> Interestingly, the injury frequency of our club members from Pickleball
> is greatly exceeding that from bicycling. Falls, muscle problems, joint
> problems, connective tissue injuries (tendonitis, plantar fascitis) etc.
>
> --
> - Frank Krygowski

Disc golf is much more gentle on the body overall, though some of the more technical courses could cause problems for people who have some mobility issues. Most of the courses around here are in heavily wooded areas and most have a few 'holes' that have very steep hills up or down to the baskets.

On 10/7/2022 9:39 AM, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
> On Thursday, October 6, 2022 at 4:21:37 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>>
>> Disc golf hasn't taken off much around here. It exists, but I don't know
>> many who play. What's soared is Pickleball. Our club's multi-year high
>> club mileage winner (over 10,000 miles in several years counting only
>> club rides, not individual rides) now rarely shows up for rides. He's
>> playing pickleball instead.
>>
>> Interestingly, the injury frequency of our club members from Pickleball
>> is greatly exceeding that from bicycling. Falls, muscle problems, joint
>> problems, connective tissue injuries (tendonitis, plantar fascitis) etc.
>>
>> --
>> - Frank Krygowski
>
> Disc golf is much more gentle on the body overall, though some of the more technical courses could cause problems for people who have some mobility issues. Most of the courses around here are in heavily wooded areas and most have a few 'holes' that have very steep hills up or down to the baskets.

More on pickleball: Late yesterday evening the 10,000 mile guy I
mentioned above visited us on our back patio along with his girlfriend.
Talk turned to pickleball injuries. He listed many more injuries he'd
seen among people I don't know, some injuries quite serious. He saw one
person fall and break a hip, another fell and broke both wrists, etc.

I'm sticking with nice, safe bicycling!

--
- Frank Krygowski