Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> wrote:
> Le 10/12/2021 à 19:14, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>
>>>> It is trivial.
>
>> Very well, v = 0.384c.
>
> Right answer.
>
> R.H.
>

Frankly I don’t think you’re able to assess whether it’s right or not.

--
Odd Bodkin -- maker of fine toys, tools, tables

Le 10/12/2021 à 20:38, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
> Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> wrote:
>> Le 10/12/2021 à 19:14, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>>
>>>>> It is trivial.
>>
>>> Very well, v = 0.384c.
>>
>> Right answer.
>>
>> R.H.
>>
>
> Frankly I don’t think you’re able to assess whether it’s right or not.

Continue to answer the question I asked earlier, and when you have
answered, I will show you what my level is by asking you one last
question.

R.H.

Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> wrote:
> Le 10/12/2021 à 20:38, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>> Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> wrote:
>>> Le 10/12/2021 à 19:14, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>>>
>>>>>> It is trivial.
>>>
>>>> Very well, v = 0.384c.
>>>
>>> Right answer.
>>>
>>> R.H.
>>>
>>
>> Frankly I don’t think you’re able to assess whether it’s right or not.
>
> Continue to answer the question I asked earlier, and when you have
> answered, I will show you what my level is by asking you one last
> question.
>
> R.H.
>

That’s a bad bluff. You show what your level is by ANSWERING questions, not
by asking them.

--
Odd Bodkin -- maker of fine toys, tools, tables

Le 10/12/2021 à 21:27, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
> Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> wrote:
>> Le 10/12/2021 à 20:38, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>>> Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> wrote:
>>>> Le 10/12/2021 à 19:14, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>>>>
>>>>>>> It is trivial.
>>>>
>>>>> Very well, v = 0.384c.
>>>>
>>>> Right answer.
>>>>
>>>> R.H.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Frankly I don’t think you’re able to assess whether it’s right or not.
>>
>> Continue to answer the question I asked earlier, and when you have
>> answered, I will show you what my level is by asking you one last
>> question.
>>
>> R.H.
>>
>
> That’s a bad bluff. You show what your level is by ANSWERING questions, not
> by asking them.

LOL.

R.H.

Le 10/12/2021 à 20:08, Richard Hachel a écrit :
> Le 10/12/2021 à 19:14, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>
>> 1.15*10^8 m/s.
>
> Yes.
>
> Certainly.
>
> But now let's go further.
>
> Assuming the beep returned exactly 5 seconds after leaving, where was the rocket
> the instant it received the beep?
> To answer, we assume that the observable speed of light is Vo = c.
> And quickly, we get d = t * 2c.
> Let d = 750.10 ^ 6m
>
> Let's go even further:
> We ask for the apparent size of the rocket at this moment seen from the earth,
> in case a sufficiently powerful telescope could have spotted it.
> We then ask for the apparent size of this rocket for an observer who, in the
> terrestrial inertial frame of reference, let us assume placed at the level of
> Jupiter, would observe the rocket heading in its direction.
> For help, we give v = 0.385c, or sqrt(1+v/c)/(1-v/c) = 1.5
> and also 1/1.05 = 0.666
>
> Good luck.

If anyone wants to help our sympathetic opponent, he is obviously welcome.

R.H.

Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> wrote:
> Le 10/12/2021 à 21:27, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>> Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> wrote:
>>> Le 10/12/2021 à 20:38, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>>>> Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> wrote:
>>>>> Le 10/12/2021 à 19:14, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It is trivial.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Very well, v = 0.384c.
>>>>>
>>>>> Right answer.
>>>>>
>>>>> R.H.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Frankly I don’t think you’re able to assess whether it’s right or not.
>>>
>>> Continue to answer the question I asked earlier, and when you have
>>> answered, I will show you what my level is by asking you one last
>>> question.
>>>
>>> R.H.
>>>
>>
>> That’s a bad bluff. You show what your level is by ANSWERING questions, not
>> by asking them.
>
> LOL.
>
> R.H.
>

I think folks here know you can’t.

--
Odd Bodkin -- maker of fine toys, tools, tables

Le 10/12/2021 à 23:30, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
> Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> wrote:
>> Le 10/12/2021 à 21:27, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>>> Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> wrote:
>>>> Le 10/12/2021 à 20:38, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>>>>> Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> wrote:
>>>>>> Le 10/12/2021 à 19:14, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> It is trivial.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Very well, v = 0.384c.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Right answer.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> R.H.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Frankly I don’t think you’re able to assess whether it’s right or not.
>>>>
>>>> Continue to answer the question I asked earlier, and when you have
>>>> answered, I will show you what my level is by asking you one last
>>>> question.
>>>>
>>>> R.H.
>>>>
>>>
>>> That’s a bad bluff. You show what your level is by ANSWERING questions, not
>>> by asking them.
>>
>> LOL.
>>
>> R.H.
>>
>
> I think folks here know you can’t.

And I think I can answer the questions I ask.
I also think you are an excellent contributor, and that is why I would
like you to answer the question I ask you regarding the apparent length of
the rocket for earth, and the apparent length of that same rocket, for an
observer placed on the other side, that is to say for example, at the
level of Jupiter (which we will suppose to be more or less in the
terrestrial frame of reference).

R.H.

Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> wrote:
> Le 10/12/2021 à 23:30, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>> Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> wrote:
>>> Le 10/12/2021 à 21:27, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>>>> Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> wrote:
>>>>> Le 10/12/2021 à 20:38, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>>>>>> Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> wrote:
>>>>>>> Le 10/12/2021 à 19:14, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> It is trivial.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Very well, v = 0.384c.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Right answer.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> R.H.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Frankly I don’t think you’re able to assess whether it’s right or not.
>>>>>
>>>>> Continue to answer the question I asked earlier, and when you have
>>>>> answered, I will show you what my level is by asking you one last
>>>>> question.
>>>>>
>>>>> R.H.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> That’s a bad bluff. You show what your level is by ANSWERING questions, not
>>>> by asking them.
>>>
>>> LOL.
>>>
>>> R.H.
>>>
>>
>> I think folks here know you can’t.
>
> And I think I can answer the questions I ask.
> I also think you are an excellent contributor, and that is why I would
> like you to answer the question I ask you regarding the apparent length of
> the rocket for earth,

That was RIGHT there in the equation I started with, which I also described
in words. Do you not see it?

And now that you have v, are you unable to calculate gamma? (That is a hint
where to look in the equation.).

Let’s see if you can calculate anything. Not just a claim, but a result. A
number in meters.

> and the apparent length of that same rocket, for an
> observer placed on the other side, that is to say for example, at the
> level of Jupiter (which we will suppose to be more or less in the
> terrestrial frame of reference).
>
> R.H.
>

--
Odd Bodkin -- maker of fine toys, tools, tables

Le 11/12/2021 à 00:11, Odd Bodkin a écrit :

> Let’s see if you can calculate anything. Not just a claim, but a result. A
> number in meters.

I like it when people talk to me like that. It is concrete, direct,
powerful.
It's nice.

R.H.

Richard Hachel wrote:

> Hello my little chips.

FOAD.

> An extraterrestrial rocket crosses in the outskirts of the earth and the
> terrestrial command, who knows that this rocket is at maximum speed, due
> to the spying of our secret services, would like to know this speed
> possible by their technology.
> Aliens obviously don't mean anything. It's secret defense.
> By any means, Véronique Affoinez managed to penetrate the rocket to
> deposit two small electromagnetic spy mirrors during a stopover by
> foreigners on earth.
> These two tiny mirrors which escaped the vigilance of the surveillance
> services are placed one at the front of the rocket, the other at the rear.
> The rocket is about 85 meters long, and the mirrors are 80 meters apart.
> The rocket fleeing the earth at high speed, an isolated electromagnetic
> signal is sent which will strike the two mirrors.
> Obviously, we obtain two responses separated by 0.80µs.

How did you get that idea?

PointedEars
--
Heisenberg is out for a drive when he's stopped by a traffic cop.
The officer asks him "Do you know how fast you were going?"
Heisenberg replies "No, but I know where I am."
(from: WolframAlpha)

Richard Hachel wrote:

> If anyone wants to help our sympathetic opponent, he is obviously welcome.

You have an obnoxious character. Probably someone has told you this before.

PointedEars
--
Q: Where are offenders sentenced for light crimes?
A: To a prism.

(from: WolframAlpha)

Le 11/12/2021 à 01:08, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn a écrit :
> Richard Hachel wrote:
>
>> If anyone wants to help our sympathetic opponent, he is obviously welcome.
>
> You have an obnoxious character.

? ? ?
>
>
> PointedEars

R.H.

On 09-Dec-21 10:47 pm, Richard Hachel wrote:
> Hello my little chips.
> An extraterrestrial rocket crosses in the outskirts of the earth and the
> terrestrial command, who knows that this rocket is at maximum speed, due
> to the spying of our secret services, would like to know this speed
> possible by their technology.
> Aliens obviously don't mean anything. It's secret defense.
> By any means, Véronique Affoinez managed to penetrate the rocket to
> deposit two small electromagnetic spy mirrors during a stopover by
> foreigners on earth.
> These two tiny mirrors which escaped the vigilance of the surveillance
> services are placed one at the front of the rocket, the other at the
> rear. The rocket is about 85 meters long, and the mirrors are 80 meters
> apart.
> The rocket fleeing the earth at high speed, an isolated electromagnetic
> signal is sent which will strike the two mirrors.
> Obviously, we obtain two responses separated by 0.80µs.
> We conclude that Véronique did her job well, and we slash the champagne.
> She is promoted to sergeant.
>
> R.H.

As Odd Bodkin has observed, determining the speed of the spacecraft
relative to Earth is trivial.

Why would you think we're interested?

Sylvia.

Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> wrote:
> Le 11/12/2021 à 00:11, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>
>> Let’s see if you can calculate anything. Not just a claim, but a result. A
>> number in meters.
>
> I like it when people talk to me like that. It is concrete, direct,
> powerful.
> It's nice.
>
> R.H.
>

And still no results. Says a lot, doesn’t it?

--
Odd Bodkin -- maker of fine toys, tools, tables

Le 11/12/2021 à 00:11, Odd Bodkin a écrit :

> Let’s see if you can calculate anything. Not just a claim, but a result. A
> number in meters.

In the relativistic problem that I gave, we have a rocket which measures
80 meters at rest in the terrestrial frame of reference. We said that an
electromagnetic signal from the earth was sent and then returned by two
kinds of electromagnetic mirrors, one placed at the front, the other at
the rear of the rocket, and that the difference received by the
terrestrial detector was 0.80µs.

A friendly surfer then gave the speed of the rocket.
V = 0.385c

He asks me how I get this result.

Well.

I don't do the same, but obviously I get the same result.
In my way of seeing things, I first calculate the apparent length of the
rocket for a VIRTUAL observer placed in the terrestrial inertial frame of
reference, but placed not behind the rocket, but in front of the rocket,
and who sees it arriving towards him .
This VIRTUAL observer for which the speed of light is instantaneous, will
see the terrestrial beep start, its arrival on the two mirrors, and the
perception of all this by him in the same simultaneity.
Now, this observer knows that, for him, the escape speed of light is 0.5c.
when she returns (the return departures are obviously simultaneous for
him)
He also knows that t = 800 ns.
The length of the rocket is therefore for him the = 0.5.3.10 ^ 8 * 80.10 ^
-8 = 120m.
We know that l '= l.sqrt [(1 + v / c) / (1-v / c)] for an observer placed
in front of an object (cosµ = -1).
Hence v = 5 / 13c.
v ~ 0.3846c

R.H.

Richard Hachel wrote:

> Le 11/12/2021 à 00:11, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>> Let’s see if you can calculate anything. Not just a claim, but a result.
>> A number in meters.
>
> In the relativistic problem that I gave, we have a rocket which measures
> 80 meters at rest in the terrestrial frame of reference.

You are continuing to use terms without (knowing/defining their) meaning.
“Terrestrial reference frame” is a particular nonsensical notion with a
*rocket*

*IN* *OUTER* *SPACE**!*

PointedEars
--
Q: What did the female magnet say to the male magnet?
A: From the back, I found you repulsive, but from the front
I find myself very attracted to you.
(from: WolframAlpha)

Le 11/12/2021 à 01:25, Sylvia Else a écrit :
> As Odd Bodkin has observed, determining the speed of the spacecraft
> relative to Earth is trivial.
>
> Why would you think we're interested?
>
> Sylvia.

You are interested because you love science, and great ideas like mine can
only interest you.
Make no mistake, in my trivial ways I'm a lot stronger than you might
think, and I haven't finished my little SR problem.
I still have something to deal with that will confuse you. Do not think
that it amuses me to play the monkey on the forums of physics. If I do, it
is because I cannot do otherwise. Not because of me, but because of your
unbelief and slowness. So, I'll explain (if you don't mind) why I'm so
seemingly trivial.

R.H.

On 11-Dec-21 12:05 pm, Richard Hachel wrote:
> Le 11/12/2021 à 01:25, Sylvia Else a écrit :
>> As Odd Bodkin has observed, determining the speed of the spacecraft
>> relative to Earth is trivial.
>>
>> Why would you think we're interested?
>>
>> Sylvia.
>
> You are interested because you love science, and great ideas like mine
> can only interest you.

It's comments like that that make it clear that you're outright delusional.

Fortunately, treatment is available.

https://www.healthline.com/health/mental-health/delusions-of-grandeur

Sylvia.

Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> wrote:
> Le 11/12/2021 à 00:11, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>
>> Let’s see if you can calculate anything. Not just a claim, but a result. A
>> number in meters.
>
> In the relativistic problem that I gave, we have a rocket which measures
> 80 meters at rest in the terrestrial frame of reference. We said that an
> electromagnetic signal from the earth was sent and then returned by two
> kinds of electromagnetic mirrors, one placed at the front, the other at
> the rear of the rocket, and that the difference received by the
> terrestrial detector was 0.80µs.
>
> A friendly surfer then gave the speed of the rocket.
> V = 0.385c
>
> He asks me how I get this result.
>
> Well.
>
> I don't do the same, but obviously I get the same result.
> In my way of seeing things, I first calculate the apparent length of the
> rocket for a VIRTUAL observer placed in the terrestrial inertial frame of
> reference, but placed not behind the rocket, but in front of the rocket,
> and who sees it arriving towards him .
> This VIRTUAL observer for which the speed of light is instantaneous, will
> see the terrestrial beep start, its arrival on the two mirrors, and the
> perception of all this by him in the same simultaneity.
> Now, this observer knows that, for him, the escape speed of light is 0.5c.
> when she returns (the return departures are obviously simultaneous for
> him)
> He also knows that t = 800 ns.
> The length of the rocket is therefore for him the = 0.5.3.10 ^ 8 * 80.10 ^
> -8 = 120m.

Completely wrong.

> We know that l '= l.sqrt [(1 + v / c) / (1-v / c)] for an observer placed
> in front of an object (cosµ = -1).
> Hence v = 5 / 13c.
> v ~ 0.3846c
>
> R.H.
>

--
Odd Bodkin -- maker of fine toys, tools, tables

Le 11/12/2021 à 01:55, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
> Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> wrote:
>> Le 11/12/2021 à 00:11, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>>
>>> Let’s see if you can calculate anything. Not just a claim, but a result. A
>>> number in meters.
>>
>> I like it when people talk to me like that. It is concrete, direct,
>> powerful.
>> It's nice.
>>
>> R.H.
>>
>
> And still no results. Says a lot, doesn’t it?

I'm not done with my little relativistic problem.
You still have to answer the question asked about the apparent lengths of
the rocket observed in front of and behind it.
Just a small measure (I have already half answered in the thread for that
matter). Next, I'm going to ask you a question of vital interest to show
you why I stoop to playing the monkey with you and why I have no other
choice.

R.H.

On Friday, December 10, 2021 at 12:59:05 PM UTC-5, Richard Hachel wrote:
> Le 10/12/2021 à 16:46, rotchm a écrit :
> > On Thursday, December 9, 2021 at 2:47:43 PM UTC-5, Richard Hachel wrote:
> >
> >> I ask a question, it is simple.
> >
> > No you are/have not. Nowhere have you asked any questions.
> > You need to learn how to write.
> > Rewrite your whole original scenario in one small paragraph. Be clear and
> > concise.
> The question is asked in the first post of the thread.
> We ask to find the speed of the rocket in space.
> A surfer tried it, but he's having problems with his calculator.
> l = 80 (at rest)
> t = 0.80µs

State the scenario & question clearly & w/o word salad. One small paragraph..

Le 11/12/2021 à 02:11, Sylvia Else a écrit :
> On 11-Dec-21 12:05 pm, Richard Hachel wrote:
>> Le 11/12/2021 à 01:25, Sylvia Else a écrit :
>>> As Odd Bodkin has observed, determining the speed of the spacecraft
>>> relative to Earth is trivial.
>>>
>>> Why would you think we're interested?
>>>
>>> Sylvia.
>>
>> You are interested because you love science, and great ideas like mine
>> can only interest you.
>
> It's comments like that that make it clear that you're outright delusional.
>
> Fortunately, treatment is available.

Give me another five minutes, and answer my last quick question about the
apparent lengths of the rocket.

> Sylvia.

R.H.

Le 11/12/2021 à 02:13, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
> Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> wrote:
>> Le 11/12/2021 à 00:11, Odd Bodkin a écrit :
>>
>>> Let’s see if you can calculate anything. Not just a claim, but a result. A
>>> number in meters.
>>
>> In the relativistic problem that I gave, we have a rocket which measures
>> 80 meters at rest in the terrestrial frame of reference. We said that an
>> electromagnetic signal from the earth was sent and then returned by two
>> kinds of electromagnetic mirrors, one placed at the front, the other at
>> the rear of the rocket, and that the difference received by the
>> terrestrial detector was 0.80µs.
>>
>> A friendly surfer then gave the speed of the rocket.
>> V = 0.385c
>>
>> He asks me how I get this result.
>>
>> Well.
>>
>> I don't do the same, but obviously I get the same result.
>> In my way of seeing things, I first calculate the apparent length of the
>> rocket for a VIRTUAL observer placed in the terrestrial inertial frame of
>> reference, but placed not behind the rocket, but in front of the rocket,
>> and who sees it arriving towards him .
>> This VIRTUAL observer for which the speed of light is instantaneous, will
>> see the terrestrial beep start, its arrival on the two mirrors, and the
>> perception of all this by him in the same simultaneity.
>> Now, this observer knows that, for him, the escape speed of light is 0.5c.
>> when she returns (the return departures are obviously simultaneous for
>> him)
>> He also knows that t = 800 ns.
>> The length of the rocket is therefore for him the = 0.5.3.10 ^ 8 * 80.10 ^
>> -8 = 120m.
>
> Completely wrong.
>
>> We know that l '= l.sqrt [(1 + v / c) / (1-v / c)] for an observer placed
>> in front of an object (cosµ = -1).
>> Hence v = 5 / 13c.
>> v ~ 0.3846c
>>
>> R.H.
>>

No, this is not wrong.
Obviously this is not wrong.
It is you who do not understand what I am writing.
And there, if you do not make any effort, we are very badly for the rest.

R.H.

On 11-Dec-21 12:20 pm, Richard Hachel wrote:
> Le 11/12/2021 à 02:11, Sylvia Else a écrit :
>> On 11-Dec-21 12:05 pm, Richard Hachel wrote:
>>> Le 11/12/2021 à 01:25, Sylvia Else a écrit :
>>>> As Odd Bodkin has observed, determining the speed of the spacecraft
>>>> relative to Earth is trivial.
>>>>
>>>> Why would you think we're interested?
>>>>
>>>> Sylvia.
>>>
>>> You are interested because you love science, and great ideas like
>>> mine can only interest you.
>>
>> It's comments like that that make it clear that you're outright
>> delusional.
>>
>> Fortunately, treatment is available.
>
> Give me another five minutes, and answer my last quick question about
> the apparent lengths of the rocket.
>

Why?

Sylvia.

Le 11/12/2021 à 02:24, Sylvia Else a écrit :
> On 11-Dec-21 12:20 pm, Richard Hachel wrote:
>> Le 11/12/2021 à 02:11, Sylvia Else a écrit :
>>> On 11-Dec-21 12:05 pm, Richard Hachel wrote:
>>>> Le 11/12/2021 à 01:25, Sylvia Else a écrit :
>>>>> As Odd Bodkin has observed, determining the speed of the spacecraft
>>>>> relative to Earth is trivial.
>>>>>
>>>>> Why would you think we're interested?
>>>>>
>>>>> Sylvia.
>>>>
>>>> You are interested because you love science, and great ideas like
>>>> mine can only interest you.
>>>
>>> It's comments like that that make it clear that you're outright
>>> delusional.
>>>
>>> Fortunately, treatment is available.
>>
>> Give me another five minutes, and answer my last quick question about
>> the apparent lengths of the rocket.
>>
>
> Why?
>
> Sylvia.

Because it is extremely important for the correct understanding of the
theory of relativity.
But there must be no blockage between my thoughts and yours.
There, already, I see that Odd Bokin blocks when I tell him that the speed
of the rocket will be 0.385c (which he nevertheless correctly calculated)
and that the apparent length of the rocket will be 120 meters for a placed
observer. in front of the rocket and who sees it coming at him.
It's very important to understand that, if you don't understand that, you
get stuck, when something amazing to understand is going to happen next.
Something that I cannot explain to you if you do not have the basis of
understanding that the apparent length of the rocket will be 120
meters for the observer placed in front of it.
I'm surprised that no one can understand that, and that on the other hand,
people allow themselves to insult me ​​and call me an idiot.

R.H.
<http://news2.nemoweb.net/?DataID=lJEvAvMoOja0J9oqy7BBWD4NPVA@jntp>