On 3/3/2022 11:30 PM, russellseaton1@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Thursday, March 3, 2022 at 7:31:29 PM UTC-6, AMuzi wrote:
>> On 3/3/2022 6:36 PM, John B. wrote:
>>> On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 13:53:32 -0500, Frank Krygowski
>>> <frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 3/2/2022 8:45 PM, John B. wrote:
>>>>> On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 19:16:55 -0500, Frank Krygowski
>>>>> <frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 3/2/2022 12:37 PM, AMuzi wrote:
>>>>>>> On 3/2/2022 10:10 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 3/1/2022 8:40 PM, John B. wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 1 Mar 2022 19:40:29 -0500, Frank Krygowski
>>>>>>>>> <frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On 3/1/2022 4:34 PM, AMuzi wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On 3/1/2022 2:52 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> On 3/1/2022 3:44 PM, AMuzi wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 3/1/2022 1:40 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 3/1/2022 11:47 AM, AMuzi wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 3/1/2022 10:04 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> When you explain to me _why_ you think Canadians
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are ...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> inherently? genetically? ... more civilized than
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Americans,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you'll have a point.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> BTW, your explanation should also apply to Brits,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Irish,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> French, Swedes and so many other countries that
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have far
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> fewer gun deaths than the U.S. (Since you brought
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> up the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> subject, I'll rely on you to look up their rates of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rape and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> other violent crimes.)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Until you come up with a better explanation, I'm
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> going to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> assume that differences in gun death rates have a lot
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to do
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with their national policies, as implemented by their
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> laws,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> etc.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Briefly, my view is that national policies make a big
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> difference in how people behave.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Your view is, apparently, "Americans are just bad."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Feel free to restate your view if it's different. And
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> don't
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> change the subject, John. This is what we are talking
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> about
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> _now_.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> When Andrew Cuomo was Mr Cinton's HUD Secretary, he
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> announced a firearm buyback program for residents of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> public housing. Reporter asked if firearms made public
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> housing dangerous or if residents felt a need to arm
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> themselves for  protection because their
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> hallways and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> neighborhoods had become more dangerous.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Which doesn't address John's implication that
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Americans are
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> just fundamentally evil. I guess that's his way of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> saying
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that laws and policies make no difference.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> But I wonder what those public housing residents are
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> afraid
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of? Is it punks with slingshots? Or punks with some
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> different weaponry?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> What do people in violent neighborhoods fear? Knives,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> beatings, assaults of various severity and yes firearms.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Get rid of firearms and you have the same vicious people
>>>>>>>>>>>>> then add in an incitement to tyranny of an unarmed
>>>>>>>>>>>>> population.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> For an elderly woman with some guy coming through her
>>>>>>>>>>>>> bedroom window, a knife or club is of limited utility.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> When seconds matter, 911 is just twenty minutes away.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> As usual, I wonder about other countries. Do they not have
>>>>>>>>>>>> the problems you describe to the degree Americans do? If
>>>>>>>>>>>> they don't, why not? Is it genetics? Or is it laws and
>>>>>>>>>>>> policies?
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> If they do have the problems, how do they manage them
>>>>>>>>>>>> without every elderly woman owning an AR rifle or rapid
>>>>>>>>>>>> fire
>>>>>>>>>>>> handgun?
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> What do you mean by 'rapid fire' ? Typical home defense
>>>>>>>>>>> pistols are
>>>>>>>>>>> revolvers and striker type 9mm (or .380 /.40). Those all
>>>>>>>>>>> fire at the
>>>>>>>>>>> same speed[1].
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I'll bet you can't find even one police or news report
>>>>>>>>>>> in the past year
>>>>>>>>>>> in USA where a full-auto pistol was used for home
>>>>>>>>>>> self-defense.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I did not say "full auto." And I'd say even nine rounds
>>>>>>>>>> at two rounds
>>>>>>>>>> per second qualifies as "rapid fire." Hunters don't do
>>>>>>>>>> that. Target
>>>>>>>>>> shooters do that only if they're pretending to be in combat.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> OTOH which of these scenarios would you prefer for your
>>>>>>>>>>> relative or
>>>>>>>>>>> yourself?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> A)Â This common crime?
>>>>>>>>>>> https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/breaking/ct-wordle-mother-saved-lincolnwood-20220211-ecz5istdfrhvzdin4kibdwyrmi-story.html
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> B) or more like this?
>>>>>>>>>>> https://www.foxnews.com/us/elderly-man-shoots-kills-half-naked-home-intruder-who-assaulted-his-wife
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> "Common crime"?? Talk about a "Danger! Danger!" statement!
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Somehow, the universe I live in is not nearly so scary,
>>>>>>>>>> at least to me
>>>>>>>>>> and mine.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> But yet again: Why is it necessary for each U.S.
>>>>>>>>>> household to be armed
>>>>>>>>>> for protection? Why is it not necessary in Canada,
>>>>>>>>>> Britain, Norway,
>>>>>>>>>> Portugal...
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> {1} in the real world.
>>>>>>>>>>> In TeeVee world, firearms are magic lead-spraying
>>>>>>>>>>> devices which always
>>>>>>>>>>> hit the intended target such as the bad guy's wrist when
>>>>>>>>>>> wielded by good
>>>>>>>>>>> guy. Bad guy firearms also spray huge quantities just
>>>>>>>>>>> over good guy's
>>>>>>>>>>> head with magic sound effects.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I'm well aware of that silly glorification of gun culture.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Well, I read that from 1949 to 2021 there were some 512
>>>>>>>>> homicides in
>>>>>>>>> mass shootings and from 1949 until 2018 there were 51,403
>>>>>>>>> killed on
>>>>>>>>> bicycles.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Benefits vs. detriments, John. Benefits vs. detriments. I
>>>>>>>> can list the benefits of bicycling (again!) if necessary.
>>>>>>>> They've repeatedly been shown to tremendously outweigh the
>>>>>>>> detriments.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> What are the practical benefits of letting any macho nutcase
>>>>>>>> buy things like AR rifles? I don't believe you've ever
>>>>>>>> answered that question!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> You also haven't answered the closely related question of
>>>>>>>> how you manage to get by without owning one. ISTM that's
>>>>>>>> proof these guns are far from essential.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> For a roughly similar price range and a roughly similar installed base
>>>>>>> of both products ( bicycles and firearms) your personal bias seems at
>>>>>>> least out of step with general USA opinion. Which is fine, but you're
>>>>>>> not the arbiter and a large number of people see the problem differently.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That statement avoided answering the question. What are the practical
>>>>>> benefits of letting any macho nutcase by things like AR rifles? After
>>>>>> all, we can count the detriments, starting with body counts.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Yup, what is the benefit???
>>>>>
>>>>> For a TV?
>>>>> For living room furniture?
>>>>> For a bed?
>>>>> For a pet dog?
>>>>> For a bottle of beer
>>>>> or a glass of whiskey
>>>>> Or even a wife
>>>>
>>>> Wow - from the guy who accused ME of changing the subject!
>>>>
>>>> We're not talking about those things, John. And none of those have the
>>>> disadvantage of abetting mass murder of schoolkids.
>>>
>>> Frank... you stated above, "What are the practical
>>> benefits" in fact you mentioned it at least twice in this series of
>>> posts.
>>>
>>> I'm simply point out that your claim to "benefits" is simply that,
>>> another argument and that "benefits" in the U.S. apply largely to
>>> things that are really not required. "Luxuries" one might say.
>>>
>>> But Frank, do tell us about the "benefits" of the $30 hand bags.
>>>
>> I'm with you generally but it seems to have been a long
>> while since you were buying 'girlfriend food' for an
>> American woman. A '$30 handbag' is something one finds at a
>> thrift store. A '$30 handbag' is not suitable as a gift.
>>
>
> I'm going to go way out on a limb and say you are WRONG Andy. Wrong about $30 handbags at thrift stores. I have been in thrift stores. Salvation Army store. Never looked at the handbag section of course. But $30 for a handbag at a thrift store seems outrageously expensive. Crazy expensive. Now belts I do look at in thrift stores. Men's belts. I buy them for a $1 in the thrift store. Great, great belts. Almost like brand new. I have 5 or 6 in reserve now. Belts that probably cost $20 or $30 new. But only $1 at the thrift store. Yeah!!! I am going to bet women's handbags are just like men's belts at the thrift store. They get lots of them and sell them for a buck or two to get rid of them fast. No $30 handbags at the thrift store.
>
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>> https://duckduckgo.com/?q=genuine+new+fendi+bag&t=h_&ia=web
>>
>> https://duckduckgo.com/?q=genuine+new+prada+handbag&t=h_&ia=web

I'm with Ms Slocumb on this. No man in his right mind would
give a woman a $30 handbag.

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971