Bach, Schubert etc are all wonderful but I hardly see any posts about Debussy, Ravel, Stravinsky, Bartok etc, let alone more modern music.

This huge emphasis on classical/romantic leaves me not wanting to participate much - my usual listening repertoire is more modern.

Andy Evans schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:20:35 UTC+2:
> Bach, Schubert etc are all wonderful but I hardly see any posts about Debussy, Ravel, Stravinsky, Bartok etc, let alone more modern music.
>
> This huge emphasis on classical/romantic leaves me not wanting to participate much - my usual listening repertoire is more modern.

Because they suck, mate... I don't like romantic too much as well though... Webern and Berg and interesting composers thereafter are all welcome... I don't seem to like Schoenberg (for all his genius) that much anymore, same with Brahms... I'd certainly rate Schumann above both of them... Brahms and Schoenberg can get tiresome really fast... imo... in different ways... Schoenberg just too expressive, and Brahms just too dense...just not my aesthetic preference, same with Mahler... it's difficult for me to rate them, because they fall out completely, I just don't liek the aesthetic... - just as Debussy, Ravel etc...

For now only Bach, Mozart and Schubert; and sometimes a bit of Webern, Berg and newer things... and sometimes I still have Beethoven in the back of my mind... but ya that's probably it for now... thanks for listening.

Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:45:48 UTC+2:
> Andy Evans schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:20:35 UTC+2:
> > Bach, Schubert etc are all wonderful but I hardly see any posts about Debussy, Ravel, Stravinsky, Bartok etc, let alone more modern music.
> >
> > This huge emphasis on classical/romantic leaves me not wanting to participate much - my usual listening repertoire is more modern.
> Because they suck, mate... I don't like romantic too much as well though.... Webern and Berg and interesting composers thereafter are all welcome... I don't seem to like Schoenberg (for all his genius) that much anymore, same with Brahms... I'd certainly rate Schumann above both of them... Brahms and Schoenberg can get tiresome really fast... imo... in different ways... Schoenberg just too expressive, and Brahms just too dense...just not my aesthetic preference, same with Mahler... it's difficult for me to rate them, because they fall out completely, I just don't liek the aesthetic... - just as Debussy, Ravel etc...
>
> For now only Bach, Mozart and Schubert; and sometimes a bit of Webern, Berg and newer things... and sometimes I still have Beethoven in the back of my mind... but ya that's probably it for now... thanks for listening.

Even Schumann falls out of my preference, but with Beethoven probably my top 5... Thinking abut Berg I don't liek to listen to him as much as I do to Webern (at least I didnt)... but I don't feel this type of music is my thing... so only Bach, Mozart and Schubert (w Beethoven at the back of my mind)... and some intersting new composers are ofc always welcome.

Feel free andy to post about anything you like - except for Al Jazeera links - thanks

On Tuesday, May 16, 2023 at 9:20:35 AM UTC-7, Andy Evans wrote:
> Bach, Schubert etc are all wonderful but I hardly see any posts about Debussy, Ravel, Stravinsky, Bartok etc, let alone more modern music.
>
> This huge emphasis on classical/romantic leaves me not wanting to participate much - my usual listening repertoire is more modern.

What about R. Strauss?

Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:50:57 UTC+2:
> Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:45:48 UTC+2:
> > Andy Evans schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:20:35 UTC+2:
> > > Bach, Schubert etc are all wonderful but I hardly see any posts about Debussy, Ravel, Stravinsky, Bartok etc, let alone more modern music.
> > >
> > > This huge emphasis on classical/romantic leaves me not wanting to participate much - my usual listening repertoire is more modern.
> > Because they suck, mate... I don't like romantic too much as well though... Webern and Berg and interesting composers thereafter are all welcome.... I don't seem to like Schoenberg (for all his genius) that much anymore, same with Brahms... I'd certainly rate Schumann above both of them... Brahms and Schoenberg can get tiresome really fast... imo... in different ways... Schoenberg just too expressive, and Brahms just too dense...just not my aesthetic preference, same with Mahler... it's difficult for me to rate them, because they fall out completely, I just don't liek the aesthetic... - just as Debussy, Ravel etc...
> >
> > For now only Bach, Mozart and Schubert; and sometimes a bit of Webern, Berg and newer things... and sometimes I still have Beethoven in the back of my mind... but ya that's probably it for now... thanks for listening.
> Even Schumann falls out of my preference, but with Beethoven probably my top 5... Thinking abut Berg I don't liek to listen to him as much as I do to Webern (at least I didnt)... but I don't feel this type of music is my thing... so only Bach, Mozart and Schubert (w Beethoven at the back of my mind)... and some intersting new composers are ofc always welcome.

*thinking about it I would rate Schumann and Mahler above Brahms (who I don't like at all anymore), Schoenberg (similar to Brahms), Berg and Webern and all the other composeres that exist, but below the four mentioned. After them... hmm... probably Berg and Webern...

Na... can't say who comes after them (the "i don't like Brahms at all comment" must be seen into relation to my top 6 composers)... but after them the only ones for me of interest in any way, if it would come down to it (and I'm not even that interested in Schumann and Mahler) would be Brahms, Schoenberg, Berg and Webern...

So: Bach, Mozart , Schubert (maybe Beethoven ---- maybe Schumann, Mahler ---- Brahms, Schoenberg, Webern, Berg --- big gap... I don't know... Scriabin, Wagner, Liszt, Chopin, Tchaikovsky, Rachmaninov?)

Again: Thank you for listening...

>
> Feel free andy to post about anything you like - except for Al Jazeera links - thanks

Op dinsdag 16 mei 2023 om 18:20:35 UTC+2 schreef Andy Evans:
> Bach, Schubert etc are all wonderful but I hardly see any posts about Debussy, Ravel, Stravinsky, Bartok etc, let alone more modern music.
>
> This huge emphasis on classical/romantic leaves me not wanting to participate much - my usual listening repertoire is more modern.

No problem at all - if it is not avant-garde and has a piano in it.

Bartok's piano concerto #3 is my favourite concerto. His Out of doors is one of my favourite pieces for piano solo.

There are quite a few 'young' Russian composers I followed at the beginning of this century. The recordings seldom do full justice to the composition performed. I'd love to have more versions of Boris Tchaikovsky's piano concerto, for example, instead of more versions of Rachmaninoff's 3d - although this one is in many way perfect (far better than the composer's own version):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTBTJmYLvM0

Henk

On Tuesday, May 16, 2023 at 5:20:35 PM UTC+1, Andy Evans wrote:
> Bach, Schubert etc are all wonderful but I hardly see any posts about Debussy, Ravel, Stravinsky, Bartok etc, let alone more modern music.
>
> This huge emphasis on classical/romantic leaves me not wanting to participate much - my usual listening repertoire is more modern.

Have you heard the Francois Xavier Roth Jeux - I love it.

Anyone here explored recordings of Symphony of Winds?

In article <a129f85d-c644-49a7-90e9-49db129905e7n@googlegroups.com>,
HT <hvtuijl@xs4all.nl> wrote:
>No problem at all - if it is not avant-garde and has a piano in it.

I'm more interested in the opposite. Actually contemporary music,
and I'm sick of the piano.

Op dinsdag 16 mei 2023 om 19:46:12 UTC+2 schreef Todd M. McComb:

> I'm more interested in the opposite. Actually contemporary music,
> and I'm sick of the piano.

Yes, I'm aware of that. We won't have much to discuss - and therefore little to disagree about. Being opposites has its advantages.

Henk

Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 19:26:52 UTC+2:
> Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:50:57 UTC+2:
> > Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:45:48 UTC+2:
> > > Andy Evans schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:20:35 UTC+2:
> > > > Bach, Schubert etc are all wonderful but I hardly see any posts about Debussy, Ravel, Stravinsky, Bartok etc, let alone more modern music.
> > > >
> > > > This huge emphasis on classical/romantic leaves me not wanting to participate much - my usual listening repertoire is more modern.
> > > Because they suck, mate... I don't like romantic too much as well though... Webern and Berg and interesting composers thereafter are all welcome.... I don't seem to like Schoenberg (for all his genius) that much anymore, same with Brahms... I'd certainly rate Schumann above both of them... Brahms and Schoenberg can get tiresome really fast... imo... in different ways.... Schoenberg just too expressive, and Brahms just too dense...just not my aesthetic preference, same with Mahler... it's difficult for me to rate them, because they fall out completely, I just don't liek the aesthetic... - just as Debussy, Ravel etc...
> > >
> > > For now only Bach, Mozart and Schubert; and sometimes a bit of Webern, Berg and newer things... and sometimes I still have Beethoven in the back of my mind... but ya that's probably it for now... thanks for listening.
> > Even Schumann falls out of my preference, but with Beethoven probably my top 5... Thinking abut Berg I don't liek to listen to him as much as I do to Webern (at least I didnt)... but I don't feel this type of music is my thing... so only Bach, Mozart and Schubert (w Beethoven at the back of my mind)... and some intersting new composers are ofc always welcome.
> *thinking about it I would rate Schumann and Mahler above Brahms (who I don't like at all anymore), Schoenberg (similar to Brahms), Berg and Webern and all the other composeres that exist, but below the four mentioned. After them... hmm... probably Berg and Webern...
>
> Na... can't say who comes after them (the "i don't like Brahms at all comment" must be seen into relation to my top 6 composers)... but after them the only ones for me of interest in any way, if it would come down to it (and I'm not even that interested in Schumann and Mahler) would be Brahms, Schoenberg, Berg and Webern...
>
> So: Bach, Mozart , Schubert (maybe Beethoven ---- maybe Schumann, Mahler ---- Brahms, Schoenberg, Webern, Berg --- big gap... I don't know... Scriabin, Wagner, Liszt, Chopin, Tchaikovsky, Rachmaninov?)

Hmmm... I was wrong... I also forgot about a few works when I was thinking about it...

*--- Schumann, Schoenberg, Webern, Berg - not really interested in Brahms and Mahler...

>
> Again: Thank you for listening...
> >
> > Feel free andy to post about anything you like - except for Al Jazeera links - thanks

Francois Xavier Roth also did a very worthwhile Daphnis and Cloe, possibly the only one I can tolerate (because somehow not as kitsch as the rest.)

In article <ac27ca66-718a-4b2f-a345-3f701697a3edn@googlegroups.com>,
HT <hvtuijl@xs4all.nl> wrote:
>We won't have much to discuss - and therefore little to disagree
>about. Being opposites has its advantages.

Or put another way, there's an audience -- albeit small -- here for
anything!

Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 20:11:55 UTC+2:
> Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 19:26:52 UTC+2:
> > Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:50:57 UTC+2:
> > > Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:45:48 UTC+2:
> > > > Andy Evans schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:20:35 UTC+2:
> > > > > Bach, Schubert etc are all wonderful but I hardly see any posts about Debussy, Ravel, Stravinsky, Bartok etc, let alone more modern music.
> > > > >
> > > > > This huge emphasis on classical/romantic leaves me not wanting to participate much - my usual listening repertoire is more modern.
> > > > Because they suck, mate... I don't like romantic too much as well though... Webern and Berg and interesting composers thereafter are all welcome... I don't seem to like Schoenberg (for all his genius) that much anymore, same with Brahms... I'd certainly rate Schumann above both of them... Brahms and Schoenberg can get tiresome really fast... imo... in different ways... Schoenberg just too expressive, and Brahms just too dense...just not my aesthetic preference, same with Mahler... it's difficult for me to rate them, because they fall out completely, I just don't liek the aesthetic... - just as Debussy, Ravel etc...
> > > >
> > > > For now only Bach, Mozart and Schubert; and sometimes a bit of Webern, Berg and newer things... and sometimes I still have Beethoven in the back of my mind... but ya that's probably it for now... thanks for listening.
> > > Even Schumann falls out of my preference, but with Beethoven probably my top 5... Thinking abut Berg I don't liek to listen to him as much as I do to Webern (at least I didnt)... but I don't feel this type of music is my thing... so only Bach, Mozart and Schubert (w Beethoven at the back of my mind)... and some intersting new composers are ofc always welcome.
> > *thinking about it I would rate Schumann and Mahler above Brahms (who I don't like at all anymore), Schoenberg (similar to Brahms), Berg and Webern and all the other composeres that exist, but below the four mentioned. After them... hmm... probably Berg and Webern...
> >
> > Na... can't say who comes after them (the "i don't like Brahms at all comment" must be seen into relation to my top 6 composers)... but after them the only ones for me of interest in any way, if it would come down to it (and I'm not even that interested in Schumann and Mahler) would be Brahms, Schoenberg, Berg and Webern...
> >
> > So: Bach, Mozart , Schubert (maybe Beethoven ---- maybe Schumann, Mahler ---- Brahms, Schoenberg, Webern, Berg --- big gap... I don't know... Scriabin, Wagner, Liszt, Chopin, Tchaikovsky, Rachmaninov?)
> Hmmm... I was wrong... I also forgot about a few works when I was thinking about it...
>
> *--- Schumann, Schoenberg, Webern, Berg - not really interested in Brahms and Mahler...

ya pretty sure... my favourite composers are:

1) Mozart
2) Bach
3) Schubert
4) Beethoven
5) Schoenberg (after remembering some more works and rethinking it a bit...)

and then it gets more difficult... certainly Schumann comes to mind though.... pretty certain these are my 5 favourite though...

> >
> > Again: Thank you for listening...
> > >
> > > Feel free andy to post about anything you like - except for Al Jazeera links - thanks

Op dinsdag 16 mei 2023 om 20:21:52 UTC+2 schreef Todd M. McComb:
> In article <ac27ca66-718a-4b2f...@googlegroups.com>,
> HT <hvt...@xs4all.nl> wrote:
> >We won't have much to discuss - and therefore little to disagree
> >about. Being opposites has its advantages.
> Or put another way, there's an audience -- albeit small -- here for
> anything!

Another advantage!

Henk

I tremendously enjoyed Jorg Widmann's 2nd Violin Concerto, performed by and dedicated to his sister Carolin, premiered five years ago.

Shades of Alban Berg...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vfKQ8IXDuo&t=1485s

On 16 May 2023 Andy Evans wrote:

> Bach, Schubert etc are all wonderful but I hardly see any posts about
> Debussy, Ravel, Stravinsky, Bartok etc, let alone more modern music.
>
> This huge emphasis on classical/romantic leaves me not wanting to
> participate much - my usual listening repertoire is more modern.

Later than Brahms (1833-1897)?

Debussy, Ravel and Stravinsky, yes. Perhaps also Saint-Saëns (1835-1921),
Bruch (1838-1920), Dvorák (1845-1904), Fauré (1845-1924), Janácek
(1854-1928), Elgar (1857-1934), Mahler (1860-1911), Nielsen (1865-1931),
Sibelius (1865-1957)?

The rest is noise ;-)

Chris

Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 20:22:19 UTC+2:
> Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 20:11:55 UTC+2:
> > Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 19:26:52 UTC+2:
> > > Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:50:57 UTC+2:
> > > > Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:45:48 UTC+2:
> > > > > Andy Evans schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:20:35 UTC+2:
> > > > > > Bach, Schubert etc are all wonderful but I hardly see any posts about Debussy, Ravel, Stravinsky, Bartok etc, let alone more modern music.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > This huge emphasis on classical/romantic leaves me not wanting to participate much - my usual listening repertoire is more modern.
> > > > > Because they suck, mate... I don't like romantic too much as well though... Webern and Berg and interesting composers thereafter are all welcome... I don't seem to like Schoenberg (for all his genius) that much anymore, same with Brahms... I'd certainly rate Schumann above both of them... Brahms and Schoenberg can get tiresome really fast... imo... in different ways... Schoenberg just too expressive, and Brahms just too dense...just not my aesthetic preference, same with Mahler... it's difficult for me to rate them, because they fall out completely, I just don't liek the aesthetic... - just as Debussy, Ravel etc...
> > > > >
> > > > > For now only Bach, Mozart and Schubert; and sometimes a bit of Webern, Berg and newer things... and sometimes I still have Beethoven in the back of my mind... but ya that's probably it for now... thanks for listening.
> > > > Even Schumann falls out of my preference, but with Beethoven probably my top 5... Thinking abut Berg I don't liek to listen to him as much as I do to Webern (at least I didnt)... but I don't feel this type of music is my thing... so only Bach, Mozart and Schubert (w Beethoven at the back of my mind)... and some intersting new composers are ofc always welcome.
> > > *thinking about it I would rate Schumann and Mahler above Brahms (who I don't like at all anymore), Schoenberg (similar to Brahms), Berg and Webern and all the other composeres that exist, but below the four mentioned. After them... hmm... probably Berg and Webern...
> > >
> > > Na... can't say who comes after them (the "i don't like Brahms at all comment" must be seen into relation to my top 6 composers)... but after them the only ones for me of interest in any way, if it would come down to it (and I'm not even that interested in Schumann and Mahler) would be Brahms, Schoenberg, Berg and Webern...
> > >
> > > So: Bach, Mozart , Schubert (maybe Beethoven ---- maybe Schumann, Mahler ---- Brahms, Schoenberg, Webern, Berg --- big gap... I don't know... Scriabin, Wagner, Liszt, Chopin, Tchaikovsky, Rachmaninov?)
> > Hmmm... I was wrong... I also forgot about a few works when I was thinking about it...
> >
> > *--- Schumann, Schoenberg, Webern, Berg - not really interested in Brahms and Mahler...
> ya pretty sure... my favourite composers are:
>
> 1) Mozart
> 2) Bach
> 3) Schubert
> 4) Beethoven
> 5) Schoenberg (after remembering some more works and rethinking it a bit....)
>
> and then it gets more difficult... certainly Schumann comes to mind though... pretty certain these are my 5 favourite though...

and I'm very certain I don't need Mahler and Brahms; same with Berg and Webern... thing is though that I sometimes still listen to Webern, and thinking about relistening to Berg too... but Mahler and Brahsm I don't want to hear again for quite a while... maybe never.

So my favourite composers continued:

6) Schumann or Berg or Webern... (certainly not Brahms and Mahler who I don'T want to listen to ever again... even though they had some beautiful moments. Maybe Mendelssohn actually... he comes to mind... oh right and Haydn.... ya...)

so 6 is actually:

6) Schumann or Webern or Berg or Mendelssohn or Haydn

> > >
> > > Again: Thank you for listening...
> > > >
> > > > Feel free andy to post about anything you like - except for Al Jazeera links - thanks

On 5/16/23 12:44 PM, Mandryka wrote:
> On Tuesday, May 16, 2023 at 5:20:35 PM UTC+1, Andy Evans wrote:
>> Bach, Schubert etc are all wonderful but I hardly see any posts
>> about Debussy, Ravel, Stravinsky, Bartok etc, let alone more modern
>> music.

>> This huge emphasis on classical/romantic leaves me not wanting to
>> participate much - my usual listening repertoire is more modern.
>
> Have you heard the Francois Xavier Roth Jeux - I love it.
>
> Anyone here explored recordings of Symphony of Winds?

Not systematically, but I enjoy the Dutoit Montreal recording (I once
heard a band conductor praise its intonation) and the Boulez New York in
immersive quad on a Dutton hybrid cd reissue.

A Roth-led performance with early 20th century French instruments would
be intriguing.

Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 20:46:02 UTC+2:
> Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 20:22:19 UTC+2:
> > Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 20:11:55 UTC+2:
> > > Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 19:26:52 UTC+2:
> > > > Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:50:57 UTC+2:
> > > > > Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:45:48 UTC+2:
> > > > > > Andy Evans schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:20:35 UTC+2:
> > > > > > > Bach, Schubert etc are all wonderful but I hardly see any posts about Debussy, Ravel, Stravinsky, Bartok etc, let alone more modern music.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > This huge emphasis on classical/romantic leaves me not wanting to participate much - my usual listening repertoire is more modern.
> > > > > > Because they suck, mate... I don't like romantic too much as well though... Webern and Berg and interesting composers thereafter are all welcome... I don't seem to like Schoenberg (for all his genius) that much anymore, same with Brahms... I'd certainly rate Schumann above both of them.... Brahms and Schoenberg can get tiresome really fast... imo... in different ways... Schoenberg just too expressive, and Brahms just too dense...just not my aesthetic preference, same with Mahler... it's difficult for me to rate them, because they fall out completely, I just don't liek the aesthetic.... - just as Debussy, Ravel etc...
> > > > > >
> > > > > > For now only Bach, Mozart and Schubert; and sometimes a bit of Webern, Berg and newer things... and sometimes I still have Beethoven in the back of my mind... but ya that's probably it for now... thanks for listening.
> > > > > Even Schumann falls out of my preference, but with Beethoven probably my top 5... Thinking abut Berg I don't liek to listen to him as much as I do to Webern (at least I didnt)... but I don't feel this type of music is my thing... so only Bach, Mozart and Schubert (w Beethoven at the back of my mind)... and some intersting new composers are ofc always welcome.
> > > > *thinking about it I would rate Schumann and Mahler above Brahms (who I don't like at all anymore), Schoenberg (similar to Brahms), Berg and Webern and all the other composeres that exist, but below the four mentioned.. After them... hmm... probably Berg and Webern...
> > > >
> > > > Na... can't say who comes after them (the "i don't like Brahms at all comment" must be seen into relation to my top 6 composers)... but after them the only ones for me of interest in any way, if it would come down to it (and I'm not even that interested in Schumann and Mahler) would be Brahms, Schoenberg, Berg and Webern...
> > > >
> > > > So: Bach, Mozart , Schubert (maybe Beethoven ---- maybe Schumann, Mahler ---- Brahms, Schoenberg, Webern, Berg --- big gap... I don't know... Scriabin, Wagner, Liszt, Chopin, Tchaikovsky, Rachmaninov?)
> > > Hmmm... I was wrong... I also forgot about a few works when I was thinking about it...
> > >
> > > *--- Schumann, Schoenberg, Webern, Berg - not really interested in Brahms and Mahler...
> > ya pretty sure... my favourite composers are:
> >
> > 1) Mozart
> > 2) Bach
> > 3) Schubert
> > 4) Beethoven
> > 5) Schoenberg (after remembering some more works and rethinking it a bit...)
> >
> > and then it gets more difficult... certainly Schumann comes to mind though... pretty certain these are my 5 favourite though...
> and I'm very certain I don't need Mahler and Brahms; same with Berg and Webern... thing is though that I sometimes still listen to Webern, and thinking about relistening to Berg too... but Mahler and Brahsm I don't want to hear again for quite a while... maybe never.
>
> So my favourite composers continued:
>
> 6) Schumann or Berg or Webern... (certainly not Brahms and Mahler who I don'T want to listen to ever again... even though they had some beautiful moments. Maybe Mendelssohn actually... he comes to mind... oh right and Haydn.... ya...)

*no mendelssohn

>
> so 6 is actually:
>
> 6) Schumann or Webern or Berg or Mendelssohn or Haydn
> > > >
> > > > Again: Thank you for listening...
> > > > >
> > > > > Feel free andy to post about anything you like - except for Al Jazeera links - thanks

Herman schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 20:28:20 UTC+2:
> I tremendously enjoyed Jorg Widmann's 2nd Violin Concerto, performed by and dedicated to his sister Carolin, premiered five years ago.
>
> Shades of Alban Berg...
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vfKQ8IXDuo&t=1485s

I listened to it, it had interesting moments maybe... but it felt so full of cliches... like... modern music made easy to listen to; well, nothing against modern music that is fairly easy to lsiten to (some of Webern's pieces, also some of Berg's and schoenberg's were quite easy on my ears - others ofc not)... but this is just not modern is it... it's just recycled, that's sort of how it sounds like and in a bad way... pseudo-avantgarde... the problem is really the arts schools in europe these days... it seems...

Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 20:46:02 UTC+2:
> Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 20:22:19 UTC+2:
> > Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 20:11:55 UTC+2:
> > > Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 19:26:52 UTC+2:
> > > > Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:50:57 UTC+2:
> > > > > Marc S schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:45:48 UTC+2:
> > > > > > Andy Evans schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 18:20:35 UTC+2:
> > > > > > > Bach, Schubert etc are all wonderful but I hardly see any posts about Debussy, Ravel, Stravinsky, Bartok etc, let alone more modern music.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > This huge emphasis on classical/romantic leaves me not wanting to participate much - my usual listening repertoire is more modern.
> > > > > > Because they suck, mate... I don't like romantic too much as well though... Webern and Berg and interesting composers thereafter are all welcome... I don't seem to like Schoenberg (for all his genius) that much anymore, same with Brahms... I'd certainly rate Schumann above both of them.... Brahms and Schoenberg can get tiresome really fast... imo... in different ways... Schoenberg just too expressive, and Brahms just too dense...just not my aesthetic preference, same with Mahler... it's difficult for me to rate them, because they fall out completely, I just don't liek the aesthetic.... - just as Debussy, Ravel etc...
> > > > > >
> > > > > > For now only Bach, Mozart and Schubert; and sometimes a bit of Webern, Berg and newer things... and sometimes I still have Beethoven in the back of my mind... but ya that's probably it for now... thanks for listening.
> > > > > Even Schumann falls out of my preference, but with Beethoven probably my top 5... Thinking abut Berg I don't liek to listen to him as much as I do to Webern (at least I didnt)... but I don't feel this type of music is my thing... so only Bach, Mozart and Schubert (w Beethoven at the back of my mind)... and some intersting new composers are ofc always welcome.
> > > > *thinking about it I would rate Schumann and Mahler above Brahms (who I don't like at all anymore), Schoenberg (similar to Brahms), Berg and Webern and all the other composeres that exist, but below the four mentioned.. After them... hmm... probably Berg and Webern...
> > > >
> > > > Na... can't say who comes after them (the "i don't like Brahms at all comment" must be seen into relation to my top 6 composers)... but after them the only ones for me of interest in any way, if it would come down to it (and I'm not even that interested in Schumann and Mahler) would be Brahms, Schoenberg, Berg and Webern...
> > > >
> > > > So: Bach, Mozart , Schubert (maybe Beethoven ---- maybe Schumann, Mahler ---- Brahms, Schoenberg, Webern, Berg --- big gap... I don't know... Scriabin, Wagner, Liszt, Chopin, Tchaikovsky, Rachmaninov?)
> > > Hmmm... I was wrong... I also forgot about a few works when I was thinking about it...
> > >
> > > *--- Schumann, Schoenberg, Webern, Berg - not really interested in Brahms and Mahler...
> > ya pretty sure... my favourite composers are:
> >
> > 1) Mozart
> > 2) Bach
> > 3) Schubert
> > 4) Beethoven
> > 5) Schoenberg (after remembering some more works and rethinking it a bit...)
> >
> > and then it gets more difficult... certainly Schumann comes to mind though... pretty certain these are my 5 favourite though...
> and I'm very certain I don't need Mahler and Brahms; same with Berg and Webern... thing is though that I sometimes still listen to Webern, and thinking about relistening to Berg too... but Mahler and Brahsm I don't want to hear again for quite a while... maybe never.
>
> So my favourite composers continued:
>
> 6) Schumann or Berg or Webern... (certainly not Brahms and Mahler who I don'T want to listen to ever again... even though they had some beautiful moments. Maybe Mendelssohn actually... he comes to mind... oh right and Haydn.... ya...)
>
> so 6 is actually:
>
> 6) Schumann or Webern or Berg or Mendelssohn or Haydn
> > > >
> > > > Again: Thank you for listening...
> > > > >
> > > > > Feel free andy to post about anything you like - except for Al Jazeera links - thanks

I think also no Haydn... he gets tiresome quite fast... this time honestly as opposed to what I said about Schoenberg before. Never really looked into his quartets (which ofc I should one day, but... hmmm... all the other major stuff left me quite cold)

So:

1) Mozart
2) Bach
3) Schubert
4) Beethoven
5) Schoenberg
6) Schumann, Webern or Berg

The rest of the composers including Widman I don't care about...

On Tuesday, May 16, 2023 at 9:20:35 AM UTC-7, Andy Evans wrote:
>
> Bach, Schubert etc are all wonderful but I hardly
> see any posts about Debussy, Ravel, Stravinsky,
> Bartok etc, let alone more modern music.

Because this ng is dominated by folks who believe
German composers are the only ones worth hearing.

> This huge emphasis on classical/romantic leaves
> me not wanting to participate much - my usual
> listening repertoire is more modern.

I wouldn't describe it as "emphasis on classical/
romantic" as there were plenty of classical and
romantic composers outside Germany. I would
describe it as cultural and racial prejudice.

dk

Dan Koren schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 23:28:03 UTC+2:
> On Tuesday, May 16, 2023 at 9:20:35 AM UTC-7, Andy Evans wrote:
> >
> > Bach, Schubert etc are all wonderful but I hardly
> > see any posts about Debussy, Ravel, Stravinsky,
> > Bartok etc, let alone more modern music.
> Because this ng is dominated by folks who believe
> German composers are the only ones worth hearing.

I can't see anything wrong with this.

> > This huge emphasis on classical/romantic leaves
> > me not wanting to participate much - my usual
> > listening repertoire is more modern.
> I wouldn't describe it as "emphasis on classical/
> romantic" as there were plenty of classical and
> romantic composers outside Germany. I would
> describe it as cultural and racial prejudice.

I would just describe it as the truth: Austro-German music is the best.

>
> dk

On Tuesday, May 16, 2023 at 11:46:03 AM UTC-7, Chris J. wrote:
> On 16 May 2023 Andy Evans wrote:
>
> > Bach, Schubert etc are all wonderful but I hardly see any posts about
> > Debussy, Ravel, Stravinsky, Bartok etc, let alone more modern music.
> >
> > This huge emphasis on classical/romantic leaves me not wanting to
> > participate much - my usual listening repertoire is more modern.
>
> Later than Brahms (1833-1897)?
>
> Debussy, Ravel and Stravinsky, yes. Perhaps also Saint-Saëns (1835-1921),
> Bruch (1838-1920), Dvorák (1845-1904), Fauré (1845-1924), Janácek
> (1854-1928), Elgar (1857-1934), Mahler (1860-1911), Nielsen (1865-1931),
> Sibelius (1865-1957)?
>
> The rest is noise ;-)
>

Tchaikovsky, Mussorgsky, Borodin, Rimsky-Korsakov, Scriabin,
Rachmaninov, Prokofiev are "noise"? Albeniz, Granados, De Falla
are "noise"? Poulenc and Respighi are "noise"?

Where do you buy your gas?

dk

On Tuesday, May 16, 2023 at 2:31:25 PM UTC-7, Marc S wrote:
> Dan Koren schrieb am Dienstag, 16. Mai 2023 um 23:28:03 UTC+2:
> > On Tuesday, May 16, 2023 at 9:20:35 AM UTC-7, Andy Evans wrote:
> > >
> > > Bach, Schubert etc are all wonderful but I hardly
> > > see any posts about Debussy, Ravel, Stravinsky,
> > > Bartok etc, let alone more modern music.
> >
> > Because this ng is dominated by folks who believe
> > German composers are the only ones worth hearing.
>
> I can't see anything wrong with this.

I see everything wrong with one style of music and one
mindset being proclaimed as "norma;" or "superior".

> > > This huge emphasis on classical/romantic leaves
> > > me not wanting to participate much - my usual
> > > listening repertoire is more modern.
> >
> > I wouldn't describe it as "emphasis on classical/
> > romantic" as there were plenty of classical and
> > romantic composers outside Germany. I would
> > describe it as cultural and racial prejudice.
>
> I would just describe it as the truth: Austro-German
> music is the best.

Austro-German music is pretentious pedantic shit.
It is craft, not art. Just like German cars.

dk