Fredxx <fredxx@spam.uk> wrote
> On 25/04/2022 13:30, williamwright wrote:
>> On 25/04/2022 11:24, mechanic wrote:
>>> On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 12:44:21 +1000, Jock wrote:
>>>
>>>> Or you could get real radical and tell him how to do it and make
>>>> sure that he does it the way you tell him to do it.
>>>
>>> Yes, training apprentices, there's a radical thought!
>> But this isn't a training issue. Training is concerned with the
>> special knowledge required to perform a task. This is simply a matter
>> of sheer common sense. Anyone in employment should come ready-equipped
>> with a smattering at least of common sense. It shouldn't be necessary
>> -- indeed it's probably impossible -- to inculcate common sense.

> Common sense comes with usage and experience.

Not really true in the dust sheet situation.

> That is one purpose of an apprenticeship.

Yes.

> Otherwise they would be doing an engineering degree.

That isn't really true either. It is mostly the dregs of the labour
market that end up as apprenticies now and a few who decide
that that work is what they want to do.

>> Adam didn't instruct the boy to not tip the rubbish on the floor
>> because it would never occur to him that the boy could be so lacking in
>> basic common sense. Why should it?
>
> Yet common sense could suggest that someone is expected to clean up
> after them, like mummy. At least he had the sense to look for a brush.
>
>> These boys are training to be electricians, dealing with hazardous
>> stuff like volts and amps. Anyone so lacking in basic metal capacity as
>> to do what this boy did should never have got the job, instead they
>> should be in a cage somewhere eating bananas.
>
> Clearly the apprentice didn't understand what was required. If, after
> suitable instruction, he does the same again, that would be the time I
> would probably sack him.

Not clear how easy it is to sack an apprentice for that reason tho.

On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 03:13:45 +1000, ARW <adamwadsworth@blueyonder.co.uk>
wrote:

> On 25/04/2022 11:24, mechanic wrote:
>> On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 12:44:21 +1000, Jock wrote:
>>
>>> Or you could get real radical and tell him how to do it and make
>>> sure that he does it the way you tell him to do it.

>> Yes, training apprentices, there's a radical thought!

> I would prefer not to to the arse wiping.

But you get to do worse when he fucks up like that.

> There parents should have taught them how to do that.

But even you should have noticed that the dregs of the parents
don't and you should allow for that to avoid that sort of fuckup.

On 25/04/2022 18:52, Owain Lastname wrote:
> On Monday, 25 April 2022 at 12:16:41 UTC+1, AnthonyL wrote:
>> Reminds me somewhat of the cleaner in the library re-arranging all the
>> books neatly on the shelves by size.
>
> Or, as is popular in some charity shops, in 'colour blocks'

Pink female section?

Lezzas action allowed in a threesome with me?

Richard <smithski@btinternet.com.invalid> wrote

> FUCK OFF

GO AND FUCK YOURSELF, DICK

On 25/04/2022 15:53, Fredxx wrote:
> Common sense comes with usage and experience.

Experience of life, coupled with a reasonable degree of intelligence.
Training is specific to an occupation.

Bill

On 25/04/2022 19:26, Jock wrote:
>> Common sense comes with usage and experience.
>
> Not really true in the dust sheet situation.

I think that might be true of someone brought up with servants, but not
otherwise.

Bill

On 25/04/2022 18:37, Jock wrote:
>> But this isn't a training issue.
>
> Of course it is. Apprentices are being trained, they
> aren't just cheaper labor. That's what labourers are for.

I'd expect a labourer on the national minimum to have the common sense
to clean up efficiently.

>
>> Training is concerned with the special knowledge required to perform a
>> task.
>
> And in this case the specific task is cleaning
> up after dush sheets have been used.

No that isn't special knowledge. Cleaning up happens in all walks of
life and occupations.

>
>> This is simply a matter of sheer common sense.
>
> Bullshit.

Ah, you don't have an argument.

> The reality is that it is only the dregs of the labour market
> that become an apprentice now

There are lots of occupations lower in status and pay than apprenticeships.

Bill

On 25/04/2022 18:13, ARW wrote:
> On 25/04/2022 11:24, mechanic wrote:
>> On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 12:44:21 +1000, Jock wrote:
>>
>>> Or you could get real radical and tell him how to do it and make
>>> sure that he does it the way you tell him to do it.
>>
>> Yes, training apprentices, there's a radical thought!
>
> I would prefer not to to the arse wiping.
>
> There parents should have taught them how to do that.

Exactly. This is just the same as the situation in the schools, where
the teachers are there to teach yet some kids are sent to school with no
knowledge of the basics of civilised life, and thus the teachers have to
toilet train them.

Bill

On 25/04/2022 19:41, Jock wrote:

> But even you should have noticed

You are gratuitously rude when you're on your keyboard. I bet you don't
date be like that face to face.

Bill

On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 04:49:31 +1000, williamwright <wrightsaerials@f2s.com>
wrote:

> On 25/04/2022 15:53, Fredxx wrote:
>> Common sense comes with usage and experience.
>
> Experience of life,

Which most apprentices don't have much of, particularly
with males and dust sheets and cleaning.

> coupled with a reasonable degree of intelligence.

Which so many apprentices don't have much of
because the individuals who have quite a bit of
that now mostly end up not being apprentices
and end up as engineers etc instead.

> Training is specific to an occupation.

And the occupation of electrician always involves cleaning up.

On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 04:51:27 +1000, williamwright <wrightsaerials@f2s.com>
wrote:

> On 25/04/2022 19:26, Jock wrote:
>>> Common sense comes with usage and experience.
>> Not really true in the dust sheet situation.
>
> I think that might be true of someone brought up with servants, but not
> otherwise.

I doubt most apprentices have ever used a dust sheet at home.

And few male apprentices would have done much cleaning at home either.

The most most of they would have done is washing their car if they have
one.

I never washed my used cars at that age.

On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 04:54:46 +1000, williamwright <wrightsaerials@f2s.com>
wrote:

> On 25/04/2022 18:37, Jock wrote:
>>> But this isn't a training issue.
>> Of course it is. Apprentices are being trained, they
>> aren't just cheaper labor. That's what labourers are for.
>
> I'd expect a labourer on the national minimum to have the common sense
> to clean up efficiently.

I wouldn't with males of the age that Adam's apprentices are.

Females, sure.

>>> Training is concerned with the special knowledge required to perform a
>>> task.
>> And in this case the specific task is cleaning
>> up after dush sheets have been used.
>
> No that isn't special knowledge.

Yes it is with whether it makes any sense to tip the dust
sheet onto the floor and then go and hunt up a broom.

> Cleaning up happens in all walks of life and occupations.

Not so much tho with male apprentices. Few would have done
much of that at all, at most washing their car if they have one.

>>
>>> This is simply a matter of sheer common sense.
>> Bullshit.
>
> Ah, you don't have an argument.

The rest of the post was the argument, fuckwit.

>> The reality is that it is only the dregs of the labour market
>> that become an apprentice now
>
> There are lots of occupations lower in status and pay than
> apprenticeships.

Irrelevant to who ends up as an apprentice now.

Adam has only ever had one or two who had much of a clue or intelligence.

On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 04:56:50 +1000, williamwright <wrightsaerials@f2s.com>
wrote:

> On 25/04/2022 18:13, ARW wrote:
>> On 25/04/2022 11:24, mechanic wrote:
>>> On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 12:44:21 +1000, Jock wrote:
>>>
>>>> Or you could get real radical and tell him how to do it and make
>>>> sure that he does it the way you tell him to do it.
>>>
>>> Yes, training apprentices, there's a radical thought!
>> I would prefer not to to the arse wiping.
>> There parents should have taught them how to do that.
>
> Exactly. This is just the same as the situation in the schools, where
> the teachers are there to teach yet some kids are sent to school with no
> knowledge of the basics of civilised life, and thus the teachers have to
> toilet train them.

But the reality is that lots of parents are like that and always have been.
so teachers and those who train apprentices have to do that stuff.

Just been reading the memoirs very similar to yours of a yank born
just after the war in a very small one industry Pensivania town. His
first full time job was cleaning up in the only bakery in town. He had
to be told what the job involved.

On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 04:58:35 +1000, williamwright <wrightsaerials@f2s.com>
wrote:

> On 25/04/2022 19:41, Jock wrote:
>
>> But even you should have noticed
>
> You are gratuitously rude when you're on your keyboard. I bet you don't
> date be like that face to face.

You have just lost that bet. You can pay using paypal.

And you are never gratuitously rude, eh ?

ARW <adamwadsworth@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:
> And by paying no attention and not listening I really mean that. Myself
> and a college discussed how we would nail his Mother in a threesome in
> front of him (the discussion was in front of him - we were not
> discussing actually having a threesome and him standing there and
> watching us nail her). Never cottoned on even when we used her name and
> what street she lives on.

Or, being in the presence of some dickhead authority types
determined to try to embarrass and/or humiliate, had the good
sense to pretend not to hear anything. It seems to me that you
could have use almost any sort of reasonable reaction by them to
protest as a lever to amplify the effect of the insult. And
if any formal process of complaint was followed, you would -
I presume - have just denied everything and then made sure they
were got rid of on some pretext or other.

Bullying a 16 year old. What a hero.

#Paul

On 25/04/2022 20:42, Jock wrote:
> The rest of the post was the argument, fuckwit.

I win.

Bill

On Monday, 25 April 2022 at 13:23:04 UTC+1, wrights...@f2s.com wrote:
> On 25/04/2022 03:44, Jock wrote:
> > On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 09:49:19 +1000, williamwright
> > <wrights...@f2s.com> wrote:
> >
> >> On 23/04/2022 17:40, Jock wrote:
> >>> That's adam. Personally I would watch what the apprentice
> >>> was doing when he started to do the cleanup and tell him he
> >>> is doing it wrong if the starts doing the cleanup that stupidly.
> >
> >> Yes but you'd need eyes in the back of your head.
> >
> > Nope.
> What do you mean, 'Nope' you annoying person? I was replying to the
> general concept of watching apprentices, not to the specific case Adam
> mentioned. Please think before you contradict.
>
> Bill

It has long since proven it isn't able to think.

On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 12:06:27 +1000, williamwright <wrightsaerials@f2s.com>
wrote:

> On 25/04/2022 20:42, Jock wrote:
>> The rest of the post was the argument, fuckwit.
>
> I win.

Only in your pathetic little drug crazed drunken narcissistic fantasyland.

On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 12:40:29 +1000, Animal <tabbypurr@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Monday, 25 April 2022 at 13:23:04 UTC+1, wrights...@f2s.com wrote:
>> On 25/04/2022 03:44, Jock wrote:
>> > On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 09:49:19 +1000, williamwright
>> > <wrights...@f2s.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> On 23/04/2022 17:40, Jock wrote:
>> >>> That's adam. Personally I would watch what the apprentice
>> >>> was doing when he started to do the cleanup and tell him he
>> >>> is doing it wrong if the starts doing the cleanup that stupidly.
>> >
>> >> Yes but you'd need eyes in the back of your head.
>> >
>> > Nope.
>> What do you mean, 'Nope' you annoying person? I was replying to the
>> general concept of watching apprentices, not to the specific case Adam
>> mentioned. Please think before you contradict.
>>
>> Bill
>
> It has long since proven it isn't able to think.

Just like you with your stupid claim that magnesium is a 100% cure for
migraine.

I wobbled with laughing!

--
For full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/uk-diy/dust-sheets-and-apprentice-3199165-.htm

Adrian TODD <e39c3dac195f9ce4c01152b4e0f4bf8f@example.com> wrote

> I wobbled with laughing!

Then you need a bra.

On 25/04/2022 20:34, Jock wrote:
> On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 04:51:27 +1000, williamwright
> <wrightsaerials@f2s.com> wrote:
>
>> On 25/04/2022 19:26, Jock wrote:
>>>> Common sense comes with usage and experience.
>>>  Not really true in the dust sheet situation.
>>
>> I think that might be true of someone brought up with servants, but
>> not otherwise.
>
> I doubt most apprentices have ever used a dust sheet at home.
>
> And few male apprentices would have done much cleaning at home either.
>
> The most most of they would have done is washing their car if they have
> one.

For once I agree with you. However you are seen to lose the argument
every time you resort to abuse. I guess you will never learn, hopefully
ARW's apprentices will.

My mother and family members did the washing and cooking. I had
interests in anything mechanical and electrical, but that is even less
likely these days.

I was inept at 16, and yet managed to go to uni.

You have to treat an apprentice as a schoolboy, where he has to be
spoon-fed at every stage until it becomes second nature, what we would
call common sense.

> I never washed my used cars at that age.

I didn't have a car at 16.

On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 18:49:49 +1000, Fredxx <fredxx@spam.uk> wrote:

> On 25/04/2022 20:34, Jock wrote:
>> On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 04:51:27 +1000, williamwright
>> <wrightsaerials@f2s.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 25/04/2022 19:26, Jock wrote:
>>>>> Common sense comes with usage and experience.
>>>> Not really true in the dust sheet situation.
>>>
>>> I think that might be true of someone brought up with servants, but
>>> not otherwise.
>> I doubt most apprentices have ever used a dust sheet at home.
>> And few male apprentices would have done much cleaning at home either.

>> The most most of they would have done is washing their car if they
>> have one.

> For once I agree with you. However you are seen to lose the argument
> every time you resort to abuse.

More of your mindless bullshit;

> I guess you will never learn, hopefully ARW's apprentices will.

Not a chance given the dregs most of them are.

> My mother and family members did the washing and cooking.

> I had interests in anything mechanical and electrical, but that is even
> less likely these days.

Bullshit.

> I was inept at 16,

I wasn't, I was doing all the electrical and mechanical repairs at that
age.

> and yet managed to go to uni.

I did too.

> You have to treat an apprentice as a schoolboy,

Depends entirely on the individual.

> where he has to be spoon-fed at every stage until it becomes second
> nature,

Not with the best of them.

> what we would call common sense.

Only fools do that.

>> I never washed my used cars at that age.

> I didn't have a car at 16.

I did, an ancient Fiat 500. the 4 stroke one. that was given to me by
what used to be called my maiden aunts when they stopped using it.

On 26/04/2022 10:51, Jock wrote:
> On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 18:49:49 +1000, Fredxx <fredxx@spam.uk> wrote:
>
>> On 25/04/2022 20:34, Jock wrote:
>>> On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 04:51:27 +1000, williamwright
>>> <wrightsaerials@f2s.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 25/04/2022 19:26, Jock wrote:
>>>>>> Common sense comes with usage and experience.
>>>>>  Not really true in the dust sheet situation.
>>>>
>>>> I think that might be true of someone brought up with servants, but
>>>> not otherwise.
>>>  I doubt most apprentices have ever used a dust sheet at home.
>>>  And few male apprentices would have done much cleaning at home either.
>
>>>  The most most of they would have done is washing their car if they
>>> have one.
>
>> For once I agree with you. However you are seen to lose the argument
>> every time you resort to abuse.
>
> More of your mindless bullshit;

Another lost argument.

On 25/04/2022 11:24, mechanic wrote:
> On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 12:44:21 +1000, Jock wrote:
>
>> Or you could get real radical and tell him how to do it and make
>> sure that he does it the way you tell him to do it.
>
> Yes, training apprentices, there's a radical thought!

Cannot get reliable ones.
1Hr 15min in

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p0bzn992