No surprise here.

https://www.mylondon.news/lifestyle/travel/crossrail-new-elizabeth-line-central-23971729

hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> No surprise here.
>
> https://www.mylondon.news/lifestyle/travel/crossrail-new-elizabeth-line-central-23971729

That's a bit of a strong headline for closing on one Saturday.

"Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:t60tn7$i4n$1@dont-email.me...
> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>> No surprise here.
>>
>> https://www.mylondon.news/lifestyle/travel/crossrail-new-elizabeth-line-central-23971729
>
> That's a bit of a strong headline for closing on one Saturday.

The decision not to run rail-replacement buses sounds sensible given that
there are other routes... until you read that "the District line is
part-suspended and the Hammersmith & City line is entirely closed, adding to
the disruption" on 11 June, day that the Liz Line is closed.

NY <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
> "Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:t60tn7$i4n$1@dont-email.me...
>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>> No surprise here.
>>>
>>> https://www.mylondon.news/lifestyle/travel/crossrail-new-elizabeth-line-central-23971729
>>
>> That's a bit of a strong headline for closing on one Saturday.
>
> The decision not to run rail-replacement buses sounds sensible given that
> there are other routes... until you read that "the District line is
> part-suspended and the Hammersmith & City line is entirely closed, adding to
> the disruption" on 11 June, day that the Liz Line is closed.
>

The Central line would be the main substitute for Central Liz, plus there's
lots of normal bus routes in that area.

On Tue, 17 May 2022 21:20:36 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
<recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:

>NY <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>> "Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:t60tn7$i4n$1@dont-email.me...
>>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> No surprise here.
>>>>
>>>> https://www.mylondon.news/lifestyle/travel/crossrail-new-elizabeth-line-central-23971729
>>>
>>> That's a bit of a strong headline for closing on one Saturday.
>>
>> The decision not to run rail-replacement buses sounds sensible given that
>> there are other routes... until you read that "the District line is
>> part-suspended and the Hammersmith & City line is entirely closed, adding to
>> the disruption" on 11 June, day that the Liz Line is closed.
>>
>
>The Central line would be the main substitute for Central Liz, plus there's
>lots of normal bus routes in that area.
>
Various other lines can also soak up those whose destination is not
actually on the CrossRail route rather than off to one side on an
existing line. Until new travel patterns are established, CrossRail is
the effective "substitute" for existing traffic.

Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 17 May 2022 21:20:36 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
> <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> NY <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>>> "Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:t60tn7$i4n$1@dont-email.me...
>>>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> No surprise here.
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.mylondon.news/lifestyle/travel/crossrail-new-elizabeth-line-central-23971729
>>>>
>>>> That's a bit of a strong headline for closing on one Saturday.
>>>
>>> The decision not to run rail-replacement buses sounds sensible given that
>>> there are other routes... until you read that "the District line is
>>> part-suspended and the Hammersmith & City line is entirely closed, adding to
>>> the disruption" on 11 June, day that the Liz Line is closed.
>>>
>>
>> The Central line would be the main substitute for Central Liz, plus there's
>> lots of normal bus routes in that area.
>>
> Various other lines can also soak up those whose destination is not
> actually on the CrossRail route rather than off to one side on an
> existing line. Until new travel patterns are established, CrossRail is
> the effective "substitute" for existing traffic.
>

Yes, that's very true.

On 17/05/2022 22:20, Recliner wrote:
> NY <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>> "Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:t60tn7$i4n$1@dont-email.me...
>>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> No surprise here.
>>>>
>>>> https://www.mylondon.news/lifestyle/travel/crossrail-new-elizabeth-line-central-23971729
>>>
>>> That's a bit of a strong headline for closing on one Saturday.
>>
>> The decision not to run rail-replacement buses sounds sensible given that
>> there are other routes... until you read that "the District line is
>> part-suspended and the Hammersmith & City line is entirely closed, adding to
>> the disruption" on 11 June, day that the Liz Line is closed.
>>
>
> The Central line would be the main substitute for Central Liz, plus there's
> lots of normal bus routes in that area.
>
What is the colloquial for the Elizabeth Line -- the Lizzie, the Lizard?

Is there any consensus on this?

On 2022-05-17 19:48:47 +0000, NY said:

> "Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:t60tn7$i4n$1@dont-email.me...
>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>> No surprise here.
>>>
>>> https://www.mylondon.news/lifestyle/travel/crossrail-new-elizabeth-line-central-23971729
>>>
>>
>> That's a bit of a strong headline for closing on one Saturday.
>
> The decision not to run rail-replacement buses sounds sensible given
> that there are other routes... until you read that "the District line
> is part-suspended and the Hammersmith & City line is entirely closed,
> adding to the disruption" on 11 June, day that the Liz Line is closed.

The only station where these closures will "interact" will be
Whitechapel, for most journeys there pretty good alternatives already.
THe H&C is only "closed" in the sense that services branded as such
will not operate, the Circle and the the District west of West Ham will
still run.

Robin

On Tue, 17 May 2022 23:58:19 -0000 (UTC)
Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com> wrote:
>> On Tue, 17 May 2022 21:20:36 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
>> <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> NY <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>>>> "Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:t60tn7$i4n$1@dont-email.me...
>>>>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>> No surprise here.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>https://www.mylondon.news/lifestyle/travel/crossrail-new-elizabeth-line-central
>-23971729
>>>>>
>>>>> That's a bit of a strong headline for closing on one Saturday.
>>>>
>>>> The decision not to run rail-replacement buses sounds sensible given that
>>>> there are other routes... until you read that "the District line is
>>>> part-suspended and the Hammersmith & City line is entirely closed, adding
>to
>>>> the disruption" on 11 June, day that the Liz Line is closed.
>>>>
>>>
>>> The Central line would be the main substitute for Central Liz, plus there's
>>> lots of normal bus routes in that area.
>>>
>> Various other lines can also soak up those whose destination is not
>> actually on the CrossRail route rather than off to one side on an
>> existing line. Until new travel patterns are established, CrossRail is
>> the effective "substitute" for existing traffic.
>>
>
>Yes, that's very true.

Doesn't change the fact that this is utterly farcical. But entirely expected
I suppose.

hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> On 17/05/2022 22:20, Recliner wrote:
>> NY <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>>> "Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:t60tn7$i4n$1@dont-email.me...
>>>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> No surprise here.
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.mylondon.news/lifestyle/travel/crossrail-new-elizabeth-line-central-23971729
>>>>
>>>> That's a bit of a strong headline for closing on one Saturday.
>>>
>>> The decision not to run rail-replacement buses sounds sensible given that
>>> there are other routes... until you read that "the District line is
>>> part-suspended and the Hammersmith & City line is entirely closed, adding to
>>> the disruption" on 11 June, day that the Liz Line is closed.
>>>
>>
>> The Central line would be the main substitute for Central Liz, plus there's
>> lots of normal bus routes in that area.
>>
> What is the colloquial for the Elizabeth Line -- the Lizzie, the Lizard?
>
> Is there any consensus on this?
>

Not yet, and perhaps there never will be? Personally, I prefer the single
syllable Liz, to go with the Met, Picc and Vic. But I suppose it'll be the
tabloid press that gets to decide.

"Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:t62cdg$shn$1@dont-email.me...
> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>> On 17/05/2022 22:20, Recliner wrote:
>>> NY <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>>>> "Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:t60tn7$i4n$1@dont-email.me...
>>>>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>> No surprise here.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.mylondon.news/lifestyle/travel/crossrail-new-elizabeth-line-central-23971729
>>>>>
>>>>> That's a bit of a strong headline for closing on one Saturday.
>>>>
>>>> The decision not to run rail-replacement buses sounds sensible given
>>>> that
>>>> there are other routes... until you read that "the District line is
>>>> part-suspended and the Hammersmith & City line is entirely closed,
>>>> adding to
>>>> the disruption" on 11 June, day that the Liz Line is closed.
>>>>
>>>
>>> The Central line would be the main substitute for Central Liz, plus
>>> there's
>>> lots of normal bus routes in that area.
>>>
>> What is the colloquial for the Elizabeth Line -- the Lizzie, the Lizard?
>>
>> Is there any consensus on this?
>>
>
> Not yet, and perhaps there never will be? Personally, I prefer the single
> syllable Liz, to go with the Met, Picc and Vic. But I suppose it'll be the

It is interesting that current signage refers to "ELIZABETH LINE" whereas
all the other lines are referred to as "VICTORIA", "METROPOLITAN" etc (no
"LINE") on signs. Presumably that word "LINE" is added to avoid confusion
with the name of the current queen. I wonder if it will one day be removed,
when Charles or William is king. I wonder if Charles or William will get
lines named after them if a new line is built during their reign. Maybe
Elizabeth is a special case because she had reigned for over 60 years when
Crossrail was renamed Elizabeth (Line). It will be a long time before we
have another monarch who reigns so long, unless a monarch dies so young that
his/her successor reigns from as young an age as Elizabeth.

NY <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
> "Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:t62cdg$shn$1@dont-email.me...
>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>> On 17/05/2022 22:20, Recliner wrote:
>>>> NY <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>>>>> "Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:t60tn7$i4n$1@dont-email.me...
>>>>>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>> No surprise here.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://www.mylondon.news/lifestyle/travel/crossrail-new-elizabeth-line-central-23971729
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That's a bit of a strong headline for closing on one Saturday.
>>>>>
>>>>> The decision not to run rail-replacement buses sounds sensible given
>>>>> that
>>>>> there are other routes... until you read that "the District line is
>>>>> part-suspended and the Hammersmith & City line is entirely closed,
>>>>> adding to
>>>>> the disruption" on 11 June, day that the Liz Line is closed.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The Central line would be the main substitute for Central Liz, plus
>>>> there's
>>>> lots of normal bus routes in that area.
>>>>
>>> What is the colloquial for the Elizabeth Line -- the Lizzie, the Lizard?
>>>
>>> Is there any consensus on this?
>>>
>>
>> Not yet, and perhaps there never will be? Personally, I prefer the single
>> syllable Liz, to go with the Met, Picc and Vic. But I suppose it'll be the
>
> It is interesting that current signage refers to "ELIZABETH LINE" whereas
> all the other lines are referred to as "VICTORIA", "METROPOLITAN" etc (no
> "LINE") on signs.

The Elizabeth Line isn't equivalent to the Victoria or Metropolitan lines.
It's on the same level as the Underground, Overground, DLR, London Buses
and London Trams. That's why it has its own purple roundel.

I think Crossrail was a much better name, but Mayor Johnson decided to
change the name for purely political reasons.

> Presumably that word "LINE" is added to avoid confusion
> with the name of the current queen. I wonder if it will one day be removed,
> when Charles or William is king. I wonder if Charles or William will get
> lines named after them if a new line is built during their reign.

I very much doubt it. Neither will have a long reign, and nor will they be
nearly as popular and uncontroversial as the current monarch. HS2 will open
during Brian's reign, but I can't see it being named after him.

> Maybe Elizabeth is a special case because she had reigned for over 60 years when
> Crossrail was renamed Elizabeth (Line). It will be a long time before we
> have another monarch who reigns so long, unless a monarch dies so young that
> his/her successor reigns from as young an age as Elizabeth.

Yes, probably not in this century (thanks to the demise of smoking).

On 2022-05-18 09:06:08 +0000, NY said:

> "Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:t62cdg$shn$1@dont-email.me...
>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>> On 17/05/2022 22:20, Recliner wrote:
>>>> NY <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>>>>> "Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:t60tn7$i4n$1@dont-email.me...
>>>>>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>> No surprise here.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://www.mylondon.news/lifestyle/travel/crossrail-new-elizabeth-line-central-23971729
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That's a bit of a strong headline for closing on one Saturday.
>>>>>
>>>>> The decision not to run rail-replacement buses sounds sensible given that
>>>>> there are other routes... until you read that "the District line is
>>>>> part-suspended and the Hammersmith & City line is entirely closed, adding to
>>>>> the disruption" on 11 June, day that the Liz Line is closed.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The Central line would be the main substitute for Central Liz, plus there's
>>>> lots of normal bus routes in that area.
>>>>
>>> What is the colloquial for the Elizabeth Line -- the Lizzie, the Lizard?
>>>
>>> Is there any consensus on this?
>>>
>>
>> Not yet, and perhaps there never will be? Personally, I prefer the single
>> syllable Liz, to go with the Met, Picc and Vic. But I suppose it'll be the
>
> It is interesting that current signage refers to "ELIZABETH LINE"
> whereas all the other lines are referred to as "VICTORIA",
> "METROPOLITAN" etc (no "LINE") on signs. Presumably that word "LINE" is
> added to avoid confusion with the name of the current queen. I wonder
> if it will one day be removed, when Charles or William is king. I
> wonder if Charles or William will get lines named after them if a new
> line is built during their reign. Maybe Elizabeth is a special case
> because she had reigned for over 60 years when Crossrail was renamed
> Elizabeth (Line). It will be a long time before we have another monarch
> who reigns so long, unless a monarch dies so young that his/her
> successor reigns from as young an age as Elizabeth.

The whole branding of Crossrail is a mess. TfL has stated they do not
regard it as part of the Underground, and it is administered and
operated as part of the national rail network in the same way as the
Overground, though with a different contract. My view is they ought to
create a unfied branding approach for Crossrail, Thameslink and the
Overground, with line names and prepresentation on the map. On other
social media people are taking to refering to it as the Elizabeth line
line (like Battersea Power Station station).

Robin

In message <t62f5c$gia$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:44:12 on Wed, 18 May
2022, Bob <email@domain.com> remarked:
>On 2022-05-18 09:06:08 +0000, NY said:
>
>> "Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>news:t62cdg$shn$1@dont-email.me...
>>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> On 17/05/2022 22:20, Recliner wrote:
>>>>> NY <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>> "Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>>> news:t60tn7$i4n$1@dont-email.me...
>>>>>>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>> No surprise here.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>https://www.mylondon.news/lifestyle/travel/crossrail-new-elizabet
>>>>>>>>h-line-central-23971729
>>>>>>> That's a bit of a strong headline for closing on one Saturday.
>>>>>> The decision not to run rail-replacement buses sounds sensible
>>>>>>given that
>>>>>> there are other routes... until you read that "the District line is
>>>>>> part-suspended and the Hammersmith & City line is entirely
>>>>>>closed, adding to
>>>>>> the disruption" on 11 June, day that the Liz Line is closed.
>>>>>>
>>>>> The Central line would be the main substitute for Central Liz,
>>>>>plus there's
>>>>> lots of normal bus routes in that area.
>>>>>
>>>> What is the colloquial for the Elizabeth Line -- the Lizzie, the
>>>>Lizard?
>>>> Is there any consensus on this?
>>>>
>>> Not yet, and perhaps there never will be? Personally, I prefer the
>>>single
>>> syllable Liz, to go with the Met, Picc and Vic. But I suppose it'll be the
>> It is interesting that current signage refers to "ELIZABETH LINE"
>>whereas all the other lines are referred to as "VICTORIA",
>>"METROPOLITAN" etc (no "LINE") on signs. Presumably that word "LINE"
>>is added to avoid confusion with the name of the current queen. I
>>wonder if it will one day be removed, when Charles or William is
>>king. I wonder if Charles or William will get lines named after them
>>if a new line is built during their reign. Maybe Elizabeth is a
>>special case because she had reigned for over 60 years when Crossrail
>>was renamed Elizabeth (Line). It will be a long time before we have
>>another monarch who reigns so long, unless a monarch dies so young
>>that his/her successor reigns from as young an age as Elizabeth.
>
>The whole branding of Crossrail is a mess. TfL has stated they do not
>regard it as part of the Underground, and it is administered and
>operated as part of the national rail network in the same way as the
>Overground, though with a different contract. My view is they ought to
>create a unfied branding approach for Crossrail, Thameslink and the
>Overground, with line names and prepresentation on the map.

Let's try not to encourage the Mayor to make a power-grab for everything
between Peterborough and Brighton. Although I'm sure he's tempted (or
was, until the money ran out).

>On other social media people are taking to refering to it as the
>Elizabeth line line (like Battersea Power Station station).
>
>Robin
>

--
Roland Perry

"Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:t62ek7$csq$1@dont-email.me...

>> It is interesting that current signage refers to "ELIZABETH LINE" whereas
>> all the other lines are referred to as "VICTORIA", "METROPOLITAN" etc (no
>> "LINE") on signs.
>
> The Elizabeth Line isn't equivalent to the Victoria or Metropolitan lines.
> It's on the same level as the Underground, Overground, DLR, London Buses
> and London Trams. That's why it has its own purple roundel.

Ah, I didn't know that. I thought it was an additional "Underground" line.
But now you mention it, it does have a separate all-purple roundel, and not
the standard red circle with the dark blue name-stripe. I suppose it makes
sense because at the western end it extends a lot further than an
Underground line which has surface running in the outskirts (eg Met line
extending to Amersham).

Looking at the "new" London Tube Map" (09 2021 - maybe there's a newer one)
I see that parts of the Liz Line are shown as "TfL Rail". Also, I see that
Thameslink now extends to Gravesend via Greenwich and to Sevenoaks/Orpington
via Peckham Rye and Catford. Last time I looked (which may have been some
time ago!) Thameslink just operated the service to Brighton, and the
Sutton/Mitcham/Wimbledon loop).

> I think Crossrail was a much better name, but Mayor Johnson decided to
> change the name for purely political reasons.

I wonder how many people will continue to refer to it as Crossrail. My
feeling with names is "get it right first time, then you'll never need to
change it". If they wanted to call it the Elizabeth Line, they should have
used that name from the outset, or else they should have left it as
Crossrail. Changing an established name (Opal Fruits->Starburst,
Marathon->Snickers, Jif->Cif) is never a good idea.

Did the name change as long ago as when Boris was London Mayor? I hadn't
realised that.

"Roland Perry" <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote in message
news:NM6m1IT+GMhiFAK2@perry.uk...

>>The whole branding of Crossrail is a mess. TfL has stated they do not
>>regard it as part of the Underground, and it is administered and operated
>>as part of the national rail network in the same way as the Overground,
>>though with a different contract. My view is they ought to create a
>>unfied branding approach for Crossrail, Thameslink and the Overground,
>>with line names and prepresentation on the map.

I'd say they ought to have top-level divisions of rail and bus, with all
TfL-operated rail services (Underground, Overground, DLR, Tramlink, Liz
Line) grouped together for ticketing, branding and mapping purposes. Maybe
even include the central section of Thameslink, for some suitable north and
south boundary stations.

> Let's try not to encourage the Mayor to make a power-grab for everything
> between Peterborough and Brighton. Although I'm sure he's tempted (or was,
> until the money ran out).

I suppose it would only like BR's Network SouthEast branding which extended
as far west as services to Weymouth, IIRC.

In message <t62n7r$t3o$1@dont-email.me>, at 12:54:14 on Wed, 18 May
2022, NY <me@privacy.invalid> remarked:
>"Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
>news:t62ek7$csq$1@dont-email.me...
>
>>> It is interesting that current signage refers to "ELIZABETH LINE" whereas
>>> all the other lines are referred to as "VICTORIA", "METROPOLITAN" etc (no
>>> "LINE") on signs.
>>
>> The Elizabeth Line isn't equivalent to the Victoria or Metropolitan lines.
>> It's on the same level as the Underground, Overground, DLR, London Buses
>> and London Trams. That's why it has its own purple roundel.
>
>Ah, I didn't know that. I thought it was an additional "Underground"
>line. But now you mention it, it does have a separate all-purple
>roundel, and not the standard red circle with the dark blue
>name-stripe. I suppose it makes sense because at the western end it
>extends a lot further than an Underground line which has surface
>running in the outskirts (eg Met line extending to Amersham).
>
>Looking at the "new" London Tube Map" (09 2021 - maybe there's a newer
>one) I see that parts of the Liz Line are shown as "TfL Rail".

Yes, like the sections in East London/Essex, that was the temporary
name.

>Also, I see that Thameslink now extends to Gravesend via Greenwich and
>to Sevenoaks/Orpington via Peckham Rye and Catford. Last time I looked
>(which may have been some time ago!) Thameslink just operated the
>service to Brighton, and the Sutton/Mitcham/Wimbledon loop).

They've been bolting on extra destinations as a result of the connection
to the ECML opening.

>> I think Crossrail was a much better name, but Mayor Johnson decided to
>> change the name for purely political reasons.
>
>I wonder how many people will continue to refer to it as Crossrail. My
>feeling with names is "get it right first time, then you'll never need
>to change it". If they wanted to call it the Elizabeth Line, they
>should have used that name from the outset, or else they should have
>left it as Crossrail. Changing an established name (Opal
>Fruits->Starburst, Marathon->Snickers, Jif->Cif) is never a good idea.
>
>Did the name change as long ago as when Boris was London Mayor? I
>hadn't realised that.

It doesn't actually change until this month. But the decision to change
it was some time ago.
--
Roland Perry

In message <t62nj3$vot$1@dont-email.me>, at 13:07:56 on Wed, 18 May
2022, NY <me@privacy.invalid> remarked:
>"Roland Perry" <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:NM6m1IT+GMhiFAK2@perry.uk...
>
>>>The whole branding of Crossrail is a mess. TfL has stated they do
>>>not regard it as part of the Underground, and it is administered and
>>>operated as part of the national rail network in the same way as the
>>>Overground, though with a different contract. My view is they ought
>>>to create a unfied branding approach for Crossrail, Thameslink and
>>>the Overground, with line names and prepresentation on the map.
>
>I'd say they ought to have top-level divisions of rail and bus, with
>all TfL-operated rail services (Underground, Overground, DLR, Tramlink,
>Liz Line) grouped together for ticketing, branding and mapping
>purposes. Maybe even include the central section of Thameslink, for
>some suitable north and south boundary stations.
>
>> Let's try not to encourage the Mayor to make a power-grab for
>>everything between Peterborough and Brighton. Although I'm sure he's
>>tempted (or was, until the money ran out).
>
>I suppose it would only like BR's Network SouthEast branding which
>extended as far west as services to Weymouth, IIRC.

Yes, but a service run by the Mayor, through the offices of TfL, to
Weymouth, would be as equally absurd as Peterborough (which is further
north than Birmingham).
--
Roland Perry

On Wed, 18 May 2022 12:54:14 +0100, "NY" <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:

>"Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
>news:t62ek7$csq$1@dont-email.me...
>
>>> It is interesting that current signage refers to "ELIZABETH LINE" whereas
>>> all the other lines are referred to as "VICTORIA", "METROPOLITAN" etc (no
>>> "LINE") on signs.
>>
>> The Elizabeth Line isn't equivalent to the Victoria or Metropolitan lines.
>> It's on the same level as the Underground, Overground, DLR, London Buses
>> and London Trams. That's why it has its own purple roundel.
>
>Ah, I didn't know that. I thought it was an additional "Underground" line.
>But now you mention it, it does have a separate all-purple roundel, and not
>the standard red circle with the dark blue name-stripe. I suppose it makes
>sense because at the western end it extends a lot further than an
>Underground line which has surface running in the outskirts (eg Met line
>extending to Amersham).
>
>Looking at the "new" London Tube Map" (09 2021 - maybe there's a newer one)
>I see that parts of the Liz Line are shown as "TfL Rail".

The existing lines that TfL took over from 2015, which were planned to be incorporated into Crossrail, were immediately
rebranded as TfL Rail. The new name was reserved for when the central section opened (then expected to be in 2018).
That's still their official name till next Tuesday, though many signs have already been changed.

<https://www.romfordrecorder.co.uk/news/local-council/tfl-to-take-over-abellio-greater-anglia-lines-from-may-3027204>

> Also, I see that
>Thameslink now extends to Gravesend via Greenwich and to Sevenoaks/Orpington
>via Peckham Rye and Catford. Last time I looked (which may have been some
>time ago!) Thameslink just operated the service to Brighton, and the
>Sutton/Mitcham/Wimbledon loop).

Those extensions happened some years ago.

>
>> I think Crossrail was a much better name, but Mayor Johnson decided to
>> change the name for purely political reasons.
>
>I wonder how many people will continue to refer to it as Crossrail. My
>feeling with names is "get it right first time, then you'll never need to
>change it". If they wanted to call it the Elizabeth Line, they should have
>used that name from the outset, or else they should have left it as
>Crossrail. Changing an established name (Opal Fruits->Starburst,
>Marathon->Snickers, Jif->Cif) is never a good idea.

They wanted to call it Crossrail, and probably still do. But Mayor Johnson overrode the sensible people.

>
>Did the name change as long ago as when Boris was London Mayor? I hadn't
>realised that.

<https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/feb/23/crossrail-named-elizabeth-line-honour-of-the-queen>

It's ironic that HM visited the one station in 2016 that wouldn't in fact be ready for the official opening this month.

On 2022-05-18 11:54:14 +0000, NY said:

> "Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:t62ek7$csq$1@dont-email.me...
>
>>> It is interesting that current signage refers to "ELIZABETH LINE" whereas
>>> all the other lines are referred to as "VICTORIA", "METROPOLITAN" etc (no
>>> "LINE") on signs.
>>
>> The Elizabeth Line isn't equivalent to the Victoria or Metropolitan lines.
>> It's on the same level as the Underground, Overground, DLR, London Buses
>> and London Trams. That's why it has its own purple roundel.
>
> Ah, I didn't know that. I thought it was an additional "Underground"
> line. But now you mention it, it does have a separate all-purple
> roundel, and not the standard red circle with the dark blue
> name-stripe. I suppose it makes sense because at the western end it
> extends a lot further than an Underground line which has surface
> running in the outskirts (eg Met line extending to Amersham).
>
> Looking at the "new" London Tube Map" (09 2021 - maybe there's a newer
> one) I see that parts of the Liz Line are shown as "TfL Rail". Also, I
> see that Thameslink now extends to Gravesend via Greenwich and to
> Sevenoaks/Orpington via Peckham Rye and Catford. Last time I looked
> (which may have been some time ago!) Thameslink just operated the
> service to Brighton, and the Sutton/Mitcham/Wimbledon loop).

Thameslink has run a Luton-Rainham (Kent) via Greenwich and Gravesend
service for a couple of years (at least) now. It replaced the half
hour semi-fast Charing Cross to Gillingham trains.

Robin

Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>
> ... On other
> social media people are taking to refering to it as the Elizabeth line
> line (like Battersea Power Station station).

Is there a station at Battersea Power Station?

Sam

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Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> wrote:
> Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>>
>> ... On other
>> social media people are taking to refering to it as the Elizabeth line
>> line (like Battersea Power Station station).
>
> Is there a station at Battersea Power Station?
>

Yes, a rather splendid new one:
<https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/51500330575/in/album-72157719933713810/>

<https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/51500117494/in/album-72157719933713810/lightbox/>

Surely it's been discussed here?

In message <t6332r$qij$1@dont-email.me>, at 15:24:11 on Wed, 18 May
2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> wrote:
>> Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> ... On other
>>> social media people are taking to refering to it as the Elizabeth line
>>> line (like Battersea Power Station station).
>>
>> Is there a station at Battersea Power Station?
>>
>
>Yes, a rather splendid new one:
><https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/51500330575/in/album-72157719933
>713810/>
>
><https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/51500117494/in/album-72157719933
>713810/lightbox/>
>
>Surely it's been discussed here?

utl, last August.
--
Roland Perry

On 2022-05-18 14:41:04 +0000, Sam Wilson said:

> Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>>
>> ... On other
>> social media people are taking to refering to it as the Elizabeth line
>> line (like Battersea Power Station station).
>
> Is there a station at Battersea Power Station?

The Northern line was extended to Nine Elms and Battersea Power
Station, opening 20 Sept 2021.

Robin

Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
> On 2022-05-18 14:41:04 +0000, Sam Wilson said:
>
>> Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> ... On other
>>> social media people are taking to refering to it as the Elizabeth line
>>> line (like Battersea Power Station station).
>>
>> Is there a station at Battersea Power Station?
>
> The Northern line was extended to Nine Elms and Battersea Power
> Station, opening 20 Sept 2021.

Thank you, and to Recliner for the photos. Battersea Power Station station
is a perfectly valid locution, then, unlike Elizabeth Line line, unless one
is referring to some line that the Elizabeth line follows or is bounded by
or somesuch. :-)

Sam

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