On 2021-09-17, RonTheGuy <ron@null.invalid> wrote:
> On Sep 17, 2021, Jolly Roger wrote
> (in article<news:iqk5v6Forn9U7@mid.individual.net>):
>>>> For the so called laws endorcement it is quite easy to blackmail
>>>> Apple. And they will obey immediately. They already do.
>>>
>>> Wasn't it Apple's own Tim Cook who said they obey all the laws of the
>>> land?
>>
>> You still haven't been able to show a single law that requires Apple to
>> report non-CSAM photos to authorities of any country.
>
> laws will be made in the future

"Donkeys will fly, y'all. Trust me!"

> Ron, the drunkest guy in town.

Clearly.

--
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JR

On 2021-09-17, RonTheGuy <ron@null.invalid> wrote:
> On Sep 17, 2021, Joerg Lorenz wrote
> (in article<news:si2qpf$fit$1@dont-email.me>):
>>>> iCloud encryption is nothing that really matters. It is PR-bullshit.
>>>
>>> Does Apple give governments your encrypted files or your unencrypted files?
>>
>> What would be the difference? None.
>
> iCloud end to end encryption is only PR.

False.

> Ron, the most dishonest guy in town.

Yup.

--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
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In article <slrnska0fu.2j62.g.kreme@m1mini.local>, Lewis
<g.kreme@kreme.dont-email.me> wrote:

> > * only vouchers that are reviewed and verified by a human being to be
> > actual child abuse material are forwarded to authorities
>
> And the images that are viewed by an Apple employee are NOT the CSAM
> images, nor the user's image. They are VERY low resolution versions that
> are just enough that a human can tell there is probably a match (or
> not).

that brings up a very interesting legal question for which i've not yet
seen a good answer.

what amount (and type) of degradation is sufficient such that a illegal
image is no longer considered illegal, yet still recognizable so that
it can accurately be matched to an actual illegal csam image?

i've seen all sorts of speculation, but nothing that is particularly
convincing.

while the usual idiots are babbling about backdoors and various other
things they don't understand, they are completely oblivious to what is
actually a potential issue with the system.

presumably apple has a very good answer, but i've yet to see it.

>
> I know a lot of adults (mostly women) who would very much like to opt-in
> their own accounts for this AI/ML scanning of photos, but it's only for
> children's accounts.

that is unfortunately true.

In article <1018x3s5if8rq.dlg@news.solani.org>, RonTheGuy
<ron@null.invalid> wrote:

> > apple's csam system was designed so that it *can't* violate the privacy
> > of their users and so that governments *can't* demand access to such
> > features either.
>
> Once these new back doors are in billions of devices they can't be closed.

there are no backdoors. stop using words you do not understand.

> Then how does Apple prevent a government from passing laws like China did?

already explained. you aren't interested learning how.

> And how does Apple prevent malware actors from exploiting these back doors?

already explained. you aren't interested learning how.
>
> Ron, the dumbest guy in town.

ftfy

In article <1abkudaeje3yq.dlg@news.solani.org>, RonTheGuy
<ron@null.invalid> wrote:

> > And the parent is ONLY notified if the child confirms TWICE that they
> > want to view the image, and then the image is sent from the child's
> > phone to the parents, with the knowledge of the kid. Again, this is an
> > opt-in feature and no one gets secret messages forward to anyone.
>
> How can you still be so unaware of the real issue here with bad parents?

who decides whether parents are good or bad?

how is that even apple's problem? should apple require parenting
classes as a prerequisite for buying an iphone?

is that the world you want?

In article <1yrpsjnjor3w$.dlg@news.solani.org>, RonTheGuy
<ron@null.invalid> wrote:

>
> Why is it all your responses are based on awareness and mine are all not?

ftfy

In article <11wxn7lo1vtvl.dlg@news.solani.org>, RonTheGuy
<ron@null.invalid> wrote:

>
> >> Did you disagree with the "holding it wrong" accusation from Steve Jobs?
> >
> > i disagree with the claim that it's only the iphone 4 that had a
> > problem.
>
> How did I know you would agree with everything about Apple Jobs ever said?

i didn't.

you asked a specific question about the 'antennagate' issue and i
answered it.

you don't like being proven wrong, so you resort to attacks.

you snipped the explanation why and also chose to not answer my
question about being provided with extensive additional evidence to
further prove just how very wrong you are (and you are very, very
wrong).

it's clear that you are fully aware that you're in well over your head,
yet you continue to babble about things you do not understand.

On Sep 17, 2021, Jolly Roger wrote
(in article<news:iqko6jFsmruU3@mid.individual.net>):
>> iCloud end to end encryption is only PR.
>
> False.

Does Apple give governments the encrypted files or the unencrypted files?

Ron, the humblest guy in town.

On 9/17/2021 4:16 PM, RonTheGuy wrote:

<snip>

> Is it only Lewis who is still unaware both types of on the phone scanning
> were to be released by Apple under the same public relations blitz campaign?

No, he, as well as all the others trying to defend this, are well aware
that what they are saying is untrue.

In article <si3ao8$pmv$1@dont-email.me>, sms
<scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:

> No, he, as well as all the others trying to defend this, are well aware
> that what they I am saying is untrue.

ftfy

On Sep 17, 2021, nospam wrote
(in article<news:170920212006332324%nospam@nospam.invalid>):
> there are no backdoors.

How can you still be unaware of everything all the experts have said?

Apple Adds a Backdoor to iMessage and iCloud Storage
https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2021/08/apple-adds-a-backdoor-to-imesssage-and-icloud-storage.html

>> Then how does Apple prevent a government from passing laws like China did?
>
> already explained. you aren't interested learning how.

How can you still be unaware Apple doesn't control how back doors are used?

>> And how does Apple prevent malware actors from exploiting these back doors?
>
> already explained. you aren't interested learning how.

How can you still be unaware these new back doors aren't in Apple's control?

Ron, the humblest guy in town.

In article <f2au8m5g3dr7.dlg@news.solani.org>, RonTheGuy
<ron@null.invalid> wrote:

> How can you still be unaware of everything all the experts have said?

logical fallacy.

On 9/17/2021 4:25 PM, RonTheGuy wrote:
> On Sep 17, 2021, badgolferman wrote
> (in article<news:si2jlb$pvp$1@dont-email.me>):
>>> Can anybody make sense of why that "small group of people" accept
>>> anything Jobs said or Cook says "as gospel" & then they get upset
>>> when others don't?
>>
>> Apple is a religion, much like environmentalism and many other social
>> positions today.
>
> Don't most religious accept that others should be allowed to have privacy?

Have you never encountered evangelical Christians, Mormons, or Jehovah's
witnesses. Part of their belief system is to proselytize.

Some religions explicitly don't proselytize, i.e. Hinduism, Buddhism,
Judaism, but accept people that choose to convert of their own accord.
> What is it about their religion that makes people like Lewis call us "cunts"
> for caring about our privacy?

They behave like that because of their own insecurities. They are
lashing out, not realizing that lying is not the way to convert others
to their point of view.

On 9/17/2021 4:28 PM, RonTheGuy wrote:
> On Sep 17, 2021, nospam wrote
> (in article<news:170920211604371367%nospam@nospam.invalid>):
>> apple's csam system was designed so that it *can't* violate the privacy
>> of their users and so that governments *can't* demand access to such
>> features either.
>
> Once these new back doors are in billions of devices they can't be closed.
> Then how does Apple prevent a government from passing laws like China did?
> And how does Apple prevent malware actors from exploiting these back doors?

Yes, that's the precise concern of human rights groups, child advocates,
the LGBTQ+ community, and privacy advocates.

On Sep 17, 2021, nospam wrote
(in article<news:170920212006362518%nospam@nospam.invalid>):
> you don't like being proven wrong, so you resort to attacks.

You think that's a sort of "attack" to know you would have agreed with Jobs?

Ron, the humblest guy in town.

On Sep 17, 2021, nospam wrote
(in article<news:170920212010547958%nospam@nospam.invalid>):
>> No, he, as well as all the others trying to defend this, are well aware
>> that what they I am saying is untrue.
>
> ftfy

What did Lewis and nospam hope to gain by denying both types of on the phone
scanning were to be released under the same public relations blitz campaign?

Ron, the humblest guy in town.

In article <si3b4h$343$1@dont-email.me>, sms
<scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:

>
> Have you never encountered evangelical Christians, Mormons, or Jehovah's
> witnesses. Part of their belief system is to proselytize.

which one of those are you?

> They behave like that because of their own insecurities. They are
> lashing out, not realizing that lying is not the way to convert others
> to their point of view.

then why do you continue to lie?

just about everything you say about apple and their products is easily
shown to be false.

one could claim ignorance, except that you've been told that they're
false and with extensive proof, yet you continue to say the same
things, thereby making it deliberate intentional lies.

In article <1kvqojb6ht5mu$.dlg@news.solani.org>, RonTheGuy
<ron@null.invalid> wrote:

> > you don't like being proven wrong, so you resort to attacks.
>
> You think that's a sort of "attack" to know you would have agreed with Jobs?

you asked a question and i gave an extensive answer which showed you to
be wrong, which you snipped and continued attacking.

In article <1btm2dof5nyjb$.dlg@news.solani.org>, RonTheGuy
<ron@null.invalid> wrote:

> What did Lewis and nospam hope to gain by denying both types of on the phone
> scanning were to be released under the same public relations blitz campaign?

nobody denied that.

> Ron, the most dishonest guy in town.

ftfy

On Sep 17, 2021, sms wrote
(in article<news:si3b4h$343$1@dont-email.me>):
>> What is it about their religion that makes people like Lewis call us "cunts"
>> for caring about our privacy?
>
> They behave like that because of their own insecurities. They are
> lashing out, not realizing that lying is not the way to convert others
> to their point of view.

Can Lewis still be unaware that a hundred unique privacy organizations &
thousands of experts are who we have based our stated opinions upon?

How does it make sense for Lewis to call anyone "cunts" for wanting privacy?

Ron, the humblest guy in town.

On Sep 17, 2021, nospam wrote
(in article<news:170920212012535114%nospam@nospam.invalid>):
>> How can you still be unaware of everything all the experts have said?
>
> logical fallacy.

What do you gain by calling a hundred different privacy organizations wrong?

Ron, the humblest guy in town.

On Sep 17, 2021, sms wrote
(in article<news:si3b80$343$2@dont-email.me>):
>> On Sep 17, 2021, nospam wrote
>>> apple's csam system was designed so that it *can't* violate the privacy
>>> of their users and so that governments *can't* demand access to such
>>> features either.
>>
>> Once these new back doors are in billions of devices they can't be closed.
>> Then how does Apple prevent a government from passing laws like China did?
>> And how does Apple prevent malware actors from exploiting these back doors?
>
> Yes, that's the precise concern of human rights groups, child advocates,
> the LGBTQ+ community, and privacy advocates.

What does nospam gain by saying everyone who disagrees with Apple is wrong?

Ron, the humblest guy in town.

On Sep 17, 2021, nospam wrote
(in article<news:170920212006342387%nospam@nospam.invalid>):
> how is that even apple's problem? should apple require parenting
> classes as a prerequisite for buying an iphone?

How can you still be unaware that a privacy problem is bad parents exist?

Ron, the humblest guy in town.

On Sep 17, 2021, nospam wrote
(in article<news:170920212025189811%nospam@nospam.invalid>):
>>>> On Sep 17, 2021, Lewis wrote
>>>> And once again, you show your total ignorance of the Messages system
>>>> which has NOTHING to do with the CSAM system at all,
>>>>
>>> Why do you think Apple was planning on simultaneously releasing CSAM &
>>> iMessage on-phone scans under the same timed Public Relations blitz?
>>>
>> On Sep 17, 2021, nospam wrote
>> What did Lewis and nospam hope to gain by denying both types of on the phone
>> scanning were to be released under the same public relations blitz campaign?
>
> nobody denied that.

Do you at least now understand Apple released both campaigns simultaneously?

Ron, the humblest guy in town.

On Sep 17, 2021, nospam wrote
(in article<news:170920212024025273%nospam@nospam.invalid>):
>>> you don't like being proven wrong, so you resort to attacks.
>>
>> You think that's a sort of "attack" to know you would have agreed with Jobs?
>
> you asked a question and i gave an extensive answer which showed you to
> be wrong, which you snipped and continued attacking.

How does you agreeing with Jobs (as I said you would) "prove me wrong?"

Ron, the humblest guy in town.