In article <suef23$1ljo$1@gioia.aioe.org>, Andy Burnelli
<spam@nospam.com> wrote:

> I probably don't have much more than an average intelligence,

oh, you definitely don't. i'd be surprised if it was even that high.

On 14/02/2022 20:34, Andy Burnelli wrote:
> On Mon, 14 Feb 2022 18:56:39 -0000 (UTC), Chris wrote:
>
>>> Long ago I gave you the chart from January 26th 2022 of the deaths broken
>>> down by age group, from the CDC itself; I'm well aware of the statistics.
>>
>> Why do you pretend otherwise and focus on 0.0002%, then?
>
> I never "pretended", you moron.

I asked you three straightforward questions. You've chosen, instead, to
attack the messenger. Not much of an "erudite discussion" is it?

On 2/14/2022 10:56 AM, Chris wrote:

<snip>

> Whereas denying the vulnerable good health and risking their lives is
> clearly a breach of their human rights.

The facts on Covid-19 infections and deaths can't be denied.

For the U.S.:
The official infection total: 79,406,567
The official number of deaths: 944,435
The official mortality rate: 1.2%

In the U.S., the actual number of Covid deaths is about 25% higher than
the official count. For the world, The Economist's models show Covid
deaths as 2x-4x the official count. However the number of infections is
also much higher than the officially reported number since many people
either don't get tested or do a self-test whose results is never reported.

For the alt-right, screaming about "freedom" and "human rights" when
neither has actually been at risk during the pandemic, is routine. Those
signs being held at the U.S.-Canada border last week highlighted the
need for our educational systems to teach critical thinking skills so we
don't end up with another generation of people that don't understand
math and science. In Silicon Valley it's often easy to forget that not
all parts of the country have the benefit of science-based education.

It used to be that uneducated people were embarrassed to reveal their
lack of knowledge. Now their mantra is "my ignorance is just as good as
your knowledge." They don't believe in science or statistics. They rely
on "alternative facts," to justify their behavior.

Fortunately, while the alt-right makes a lot of noise, the actual number
of people that fall for their rhetoric is relatively small.
Unfortunately, it doesn't take a great many super-spreader events to
cause an exponential increase in infections and deaths, so their
ignorance often has a disproportionate negative effect.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
“The Greatest Shortcoming of the Human Race Is Man’s Inability To
Understand the Exponential Function.” ― Albert A. Bartlett

“Too bad that so many people are making so much noise just to hear
themselves that no one is listening anymore.” — William Matthew Kelllert
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In message <suef7h$1nr8$1@gioia.aioe.org>
Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> wrote:

> Every word out of Steve's mouth is to demonize people who think logically.
>
> He can't control fact-based people by fear alone.
> He can only control them by taking away their rights.
>
> You don't see this?

No, I don't.

Nor do I see much evidence that you think logically.

You just keep spouting things like "Fear" and "Taking away their rights",
as if they're slogans that must be mindlessly repeated.

David

On 2/14/2022 2:47 PM, David Higton wrote:

<snip>

> You just keep spouting things like "Fear" and "Taking away their rights",
> as if they're slogans that must be mindlessly repeated.
>
> David

My advice to Arlen/Harry/Andy is to try to understand that lying about
the realities about the Covid-19 pandemic, vaccinations, masks, etc., is
not serving him well.

When you have the best scientists, epidemiologists, infectious disease
specialists, and statisticians, contradicting every alternative fact
that he comes up with, it doesn't make sense for him to continue to push
a fact-free political agenda. Arlen/Harry/Andy should gracefully admit
his mistakes, move on, and confine his posts to things that he understands.

No one's human rights have been taken away or violated. The only freedom
that's been lost is the freedom to act irresponsibly during a global
health crisis.

If Fox News, OAN, the New York Post, etc. _and_ the Internet, were
around the 1950s we'd still be fighting Polio.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
“Sometimes people don't want to hear the truth because they don't want
their illusions destroyed.” ― Friedrich Nietzsche
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Am 14.02.22 um 22:58 schrieb sms:
> On 2/14/2022 10:56 AM, Chris wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
>> Whereas denying the vulnerable good health and risking their lives is
>> clearly a breach of their human rights.
>
> The facts on Covid-19 infections and deaths can't be denied.

You are stupid Troll. What is the connection of your post to Android or
mobile OSes in general?

--
De gustibus non est disputandum

On Mon, 14 Feb 2022 22:47:55 GMT, David Higton wrote:

> Nor do I see much evidence that you think logically.

And yet it's _you_ who hasn't provided even a _single_ cite for your claims.
Not me.
You.

BTW, I get it that you're likely just "Steve" pretending to be David Higton.
(Same as "joe" which allows Steve to then _respond_ to his own posts.)

But it doesn't matter since the fact remains as I have stated it logically:
*Not once in this thread have you (aka David Higton) provided a cite*

Not even once.
Everything you've claimed, so far, is pure bullshit.

And that is proven by the fact I asked you for cites, & you never gave any.
Because it's _you_ who can't back up your outlandish claims.

You demonize anyone who disagrees with your purely imaginary belief systems.
You _hate_ me because you have no adult response to the facts I provided.

In fact, you _hate_ me because I _do_ think logically.
You base your entire belief system on fear and fear alone.

And you _hate_ that you can't _control_ people like me, Steve, on pure fear.

On Mon, 14 Feb 2022 15:18:25 -0800, sms wrote:

> try to understand that lying about
> the realities about the Covid-19 pandemic, vaccinations, masks, etc., is
> not serving him well.

You demonize anyone who disagrees with your purely imaginary belief systems.
You _hate_ me because you have no _adult_ response to the facts I provided.

*Every single response from you to facts is to outright deny they exist.*

I happen to base my belief systems on facts and logic, Steve.
You base yours only on ignorance and fear.

You even denied that Einstein's special relativity exists, Steve!
And, you can't even figure out how the DK effect works, Steve.

Who the hell is _that_ ignorant, but people like you, Steve?

You hate me because I'm _not_ ignorant, Steve.
In fact, you _hate_ me because I _do_ think logically.

You can only control people who base their beliefs on fear and fear alone.
And you _hate_ that you can't _control_ people like me, Steve, on pure fear.

That is why you're so desperate to take away our rights, Steve.
*My Body* *My Choice*

On Mon, 14 Feb 2022 13:58:19 -0800, sms wrote:

> The facts on Covid-19 infections and deaths can't be denied.

And yet you bullshit.

What's the Crude Mortality Rate of Covid, Steve?
No bullshit.

What's the Crude Mortality Rate, Steve.
Do you even know it?

The fact remains the Crude Mortality Rate is the "typical" rate, for all
pandemics, which, in layman's terms, is the risk of an as-yet-unexposed
person dying.
*Choosing the right COVID-19 indicator*
<https://www.nature.com/articles/s41599-021-01032-0>

That's how pandemics are measured typically.
Not by the risk of death from someone who has _already_ gotten infected.

That's a _different_ rate.
It doesn't tell you anything about the risk of a pandemic.

Steve doesn't want to quote the rate that _always_ is the pertinent rate.
*Crude Mortality Rate*

Because that rate is so low that the real facts aren't "scary" enough.
And Steve _needs_ you to be scared shitless out of pure ignorance.

Without fear, Steve can't control you.

The only way Steve can control you if you aren't scared enough...
*Is to take away your rights*

That is why Steve is so desperate to take away the rights of people who are
logical, sensible, and who are not ignorant of the facts.

The rate that is quoted for _all_ pandemics, is the death rate for people
not yet exposed. Not the death rate of people already half dead from the
disease.

Steve is so ignorant, he doesn't even _understand_ that fact.
Or, if he does, he _hates_ that fact.

And yet, it's the typical fact quoted for _all_ pandemics.

On Mon, 14 Feb 2022 21:21:09 +0000, Chris wrote:

> I asked you three straightforward questions. You've chosen, instead, to
> attack the messenger. Not much of an "erudite discussion" is it?

Chris,
You are the only one on this newsgroup who even read the cites.
SO you're _different_ from people like Steve.

Steve still denies the facts we both agree on that came from the CDC.
Who is _that_ stupid but ignorant (highly political) wackos like Steve?
Unfortunately, Steve opened this thread, so I'm responding to it.

My stance has never wavered, and, in fact, both you & Chris prove me right.

There isn't a common CDC fact about Covid you can point to that I didn't
know about _before_ this thread was even opened by Steve, Chris.

I gave you the cite for the number of deaths, from the CDC as of Jan 22.
I gave you the cite for the number of people in the USA, running tally.
I gave you the math for calculating the Crude Mortality Rate in fact.
I even gave you the cite for the CMR at every age level.

I even said it was around 3 or so percent at age 60 and then it _doubles_
for every decade after that, Chris.

I know what the dangers are, Chris.
My belief systems are based on knowledge and logic, not ignorance & fear.

My issue start with understanding most people are ignorant of Covid, Chris.
And you are no exception.
Steve is even more ignorant than you are.

You are desperate to try to prove that I'm ignorant, and you can't.
Because you don't know anything I didn't know long ago Chris.
Most of what you don't know I learned _decades_ ago, Chris.

And that's fine.
You might know something I don't know in plenty of other fields, Chris.
But not in {genetics,virology,immunology} you don't.

And that's OK.
What is _not_ OK, and which is direct to the SUBJECT of this thread, is:
*The most ignorant people are those most wanting to take away our rights*
Why?
*Because they are afraid of us*

They can't control intelligent people with their ignorance & fear, Chris.
*Steve can only control intelligent people by taking away their rights*

My stance has never wavered, and, in fact, both you & Chris prove me right.

On Tue, 15 Feb 2022 15:38:06 -0000 (UTC), Andy Burnelli wrote:

> My stance has never wavered, and, in fact, both you & Chris prove me right.

I type these up off the cuff so I apologize for mixing up Steve & Chris.

Chris, to his credit, at least _read_ the cites.
Chris, to his credit, at least _understood_ the different metrics.
Chris, to his credit, is trying to get me to agree to _his_ metrics.

I already agree to Chris' metrics because they're from the CDC.
I don't disagree with a single metric from the CDC on the Covid facts.

Steve on the other hand, not only disagreed with _every_ fact that was
presented in this thread, but Steve brazenly denied the facts even exist.

Why?
I don't know why.

I suspect Steve can't control people if they are aware of the facts.

Why not?
Because Steve's arguments stoke only ignorance and fear, not logic & reason.

Looking at the SUBJECT, why does Steve promote forcing the shot then?
Because Steve can't control logical people and he _hates_ that he can't.

How does Steve propose he "control" sensible people?
*By taking away their rights*

That's my point.
And Steve proved it in spades.

Chris, to his credit, at least acknowledged the facts.
(Although Chris played kindergarten games over common terminology.)

On Mon, 14 Feb 2022 16:17:31 -0500, nospam wrote:

>> I probably don't have much more than an average intelligence,
>
> oh, you definitely don't. i'd be surprised if it was even that high.

iKooks always respond with kindergarten giggles instead of adult content.

On 15/02/2022 15:38, Andy Burnelli wrote:
> On Mon, 14 Feb 2022 21:21:09 +0000, Chris wrote:
>
>> I asked you three straightforward questions. You've chosen, instead, to
>> attack the messenger. Not much of an "erudite discussion" is it?

[ snip still not answering the questions ]

On Tue, 15 Feb 2022 17:39:12 +0000, Chris wrote:

> [ snip still not answering the questions ]

Chris,

I've been busy adding value on the Windows group for spelltesters,
and I've been busy on the Android group where we're checking if it's true
that Google is now seamlessly updating the Android core forever.

Remind me please.
What CDC statistic are you claiming I have been disputing, Chris.

You're the only one who even _looked_ at the cites before denying them.
So you deserve more respect than do the others, like Steve, who didn't.

If all you want me to do is repeat what we both already know about the CDC
statistics, that adds no value, Chris because I already agree with them.

What more do you want from me?

Once in a while the CDC and, more often, the WHO, but in general, only a
fool would dispute the value of the CDC statistics, Chris.

Certainly I do not dispute any fact unless I have reason to believe they're
wrong, but I didn't say _any_ specific CDC statistics were incorrect, Chris.

Did I?

On Tue, 15 Feb 2022 18:49:06 -0000 (UTC), Andy Burnelli wrote:

> Once in a while the CDC and, more often, the WHO, but in general, only a
> fool would dispute the value of the CDC statistics, Chris.

Typo...

Once in a while I know of better statistics than that from the CDC and,
more often, the WHO, but in general, only a fool would dispute the value
of the CDC statistics, Chris.

And I'm no fool.

a. Only a fool disputes facts (facts are funny that way).
b. But adults can differ on assessments (people are funny that way).

I agree, a priori, with _any_ CDC statistic being accurate that you can dig
up (if it's recent). If I dispute it, I'll first find a reliable cite that
provides the facts which I would use to dispute it.

That's how _educated_ people do things, Chris.

Only a fool disagrees with facts (that's why they're fools).
But you have to understand the difference between a fact and an assessment.

EXAMPLE of a FACT:
<https://i.postimg.cc/7hZrrSwc/treble01.jpg> My phone is Treble supported
EXAMPLE of an ASSESSMENT OF THAT FACT:
<https://i.postimg.cc/Kv4h9793/treble02.jpg> MediaTek updates my firmware

Notice that the facts are that my phone is "treble supported", but even that
fact can be in error, but most people would believe that fact without
endless arguments (like Alan Baker did on Usenet headers, the moron).

The assessment is a bit different from the fact, since the fact my phone
firmware "can" be updated over the net by Google without me knowing about it
is one thing, but whether or not MediaTek is doing that is another.

If I had corroborating evidence that MediaTek _does_ that, then, for
example, I would have more evidence for that assessment that my firmware is
updated automatically by Google over Google Play System Updates.

But then, it might be that MediaTek updates _some_ firmware, and not others,
so again, the assessment is always more fluid than the facts.

So don't say I get my facts wrong if you're arguing about my assessments.
a. Only a fool disputes facts (facts are funny that way).
b. But adults can differ on assessments (people are funny that way).

In message <sufhmk$1cvt$1@gioia.aioe.org>
Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> wrote:

> On Mon, 14 Feb 2022 22:47:55 GMT, David Higton wrote:
>
> > Nor do I see much evidence that you think logically.
>
> And yet it's _you_ who hasn't provided even a _single_ cite for your
> claims. Not me. You.
>
> BTW, I get it that you're likely just "Steve" pretending to be David
> Higton. (Same as "joe" which allows Steve to then _respond_ to his own
> posts.)
>
> But it doesn't matter since the fact remains as I have stated it logically:
> *Not once in this thread have you (aka David Higton) provided a cite*
>
> Not even once. Everything you've claimed, so far, is pure bullshit.
>
> And that is proven by the fact I asked you for cites, & you never gave any.
> Because it's _you_ who can't back up your outlandish claims.
>
> You demonize anyone who disagrees with your purely imaginary belief
> systems. You _hate_ me because you have no adult response to the facts I
> provided.
>
> In fact, you _hate_ me because I _do_ think logically. You base your entire
> belief system on fear and fear alone.
>
> And you _hate_ that you can't _control_ people like me, Steve, on pure
> fear.

My "belief system" is called Science.

I utterly fail to understand why you say "You base your entire belief
system on fear and fear alone." There is no truth in what you say, of
course.

I worry about the possibility of catching diseases with potentially
serious consequences, of course. I hope everyone does. But I don't
just spend my time worrying about them - if there is a reasonable
chance that I might get one, I get vaccinated, i.e. I follow the
science, as put forward by the scientists; then I get on with my
life.

I also urge others to get vaccinated against Covid. I consider it my
civic duty to do so, just as I consider it everyone's civic duty to
get vaccinated. Or, if they (contrary to logic) cannot be convinced
to do so, that they should largely keep themselves hidden away from
society so as not to endanger anyone (or themselves).

It's interesting that Novak Djokovic has just given an interview on
the BBC, in which he states he doesn't want to be vaccinated, and
that he accepts the consequences.

David

On Tue, 15 Feb 2022 19:47:37 GMT, David Higton wrote:

> My "belief system" is called Science.

And still, out of all your posts, not a single cite of actual science facts.

> I utterly fail to understand why you say "You base your entire belief
> system on fear and fear alone." There is no truth in what you say, of
> course.

Everything you've claimed is pure clickbait emotion; not science.
> I worry about the possibility of catching diseases with potentially
> serious consequences, of course. I hope everyone does. But I don't
> just spend my time worrying about them - if there is a reasonable
> chance that I might get one, I get vaccinated, i.e. I follow the
> science, as put forward by the scientists; then I get on with my
> life.

You're clearly driven by ignorance & fear; not science, nor logic.
> I also urge others to get vaccinated against Covid. I consider it my
> civic duty to do so, just as I consider it everyone's civic duty to
> get vaccinated. Or, if they (contrary to logic) cannot be convinced
> to do so, that they should largely keep themselves hidden away from
> society so as not to endanger anyone (or themselves).

People like you can't control people if you can't scare them enough first.

> It's interesting that Novak Djokovic has just given an interview on
> the BBC, in which he states he doesn't want to be vaccinated, and
> that he accepts the consequences.

A single bit of off-the-wall anecdotal evidence is not science.
--
The less people know about Covid, the more thay are driven by their fears.

On 2/15/2022 11:47 AM, David Higton wrote:

<snip>

> It's interesting that Novak Djokovic has just given an interview on
> the BBC, in which he states he doesn't want to be vaccinated, and
> that he accepts the consequences.

That is a reasonable response, as long as he also agrees to isolate
until the pandemic is over.

No one cares if someone refuses to be vaccinated, as long as they don't
spread the disease to the general population. As we've seen, Covid
vaccinations reduce the severity of the disease, and they reduce
morbidity, but they are not 100% effective at preventing the disease.

Same with masks. No need to wear a mask when you're by yourself, just
don't go maskless into the general population.

You have the freedom to make bad choices as long as you're willing to
accept the consequences.

On 2/14/2022 2:47 PM, David Higton wrote:

<snip>

> You just keep spouting things like "Fear" and "Taking away their rights",
> as if they're slogans that must be mindlessly repeated.

If you watched coverage of what transpired in Canada last week, you'd
understand that in fact it _is_ required that those slogans be
mindlessly (and endlessly) repeated. Get a big flag, make a sign that
says "Freedom" and drive around (or park) honking your horn like a moron.

The counter-protester's signs were much more clever:
"HONK IF YOU FAILED SCIENCE...AND SOCIAL STUDIES...AND MATH..."
"FREE DUMB CONVOY"
"MAKE OTTAWA BORING AGAIN"
"MANDATE CRITICAL THINKING"

It's estimated that the protesting truckers cost the economy $1 billion
(combined between the U.S. and Canada), causing thousands of workers to
lose pay as factories shut down due to supply chain disruptions.

The whole alt-right movement is based on mindlessly and endlessly
chanting slogans and spreading fake information. Thankfully, even though
they make a lot of noise, they still represent a very tiny percentage of
U.S. (and Canadian) residents.

On Tue, 15 Feb 2022 12:44:53 -0800, sms wrote:

> You have the freedom to make bad choices as long as you're willing to
> accept the consequences.

Adult question...

Why is the choice that Steve makes (out of ignorance) the "good" choice.
And yet, _everyone_ else (out of knowledge, perhaps?) makes a "bad" choice?

Given Steve is completely ignorant of Covid, what gives him the right to
claim that the only good choice is the choice _he_ made?

(out of ignorance & fear alone)

On Tue, 15 Feb 2022 19:47:37 GMT, David Higton <dave@davehigton.me.uk>
wrote:

>In message <sufhmk$1cvt$1@gioia.aioe.org>
> Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 14 Feb 2022 22:47:55 GMT, David Higton wrote:
>>
>> > Nor do I see much evidence that you think logically.
>>
>> And yet it's _you_ who hasn't provided even a _single_ cite for your
>> claims. Not me. You.
>>
>> BTW, I get it that you're likely just "Steve" pretending to be David
>> Higton. (Same as "joe" which allows Steve to then _respond_ to his own
>> posts.)
>>
>> But it doesn't matter since the fact remains as I have stated it logically:
>> *Not once in this thread have you (aka David Higton) provided a cite*
>>
>> Not even once. Everything you've claimed, so far, is pure bullshit.
>>
>> And that is proven by the fact I asked you for cites, & you never gave any.
>> Because it's _you_ who can't back up your outlandish claims.
>>
>> You demonize anyone who disagrees with your purely imaginary belief
>> systems. You _hate_ me because you have no adult response to the facts I
>> provided.
>>
>> In fact, you _hate_ me because I _do_ think logically. You base your entire
>> belief system on fear and fear alone.
>>
>> And you _hate_ that you can't _control_ people like me, Steve, on pure
>> fear.
>
>My "belief system" is called Science.
>
>I utterly fail to understand why you say "You base your entire belief
>system on fear and fear alone." There is no truth in what you say, of
>course.

Because he's a troll. Please don't reply to trolls. Killfile them.

In message <suh3c6$ceq$1@dont-email.me>
sms <scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:

> On 2/15/2022 11:47 AM, David Higton wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
> > It's interesting that Novak Djokovic has just given an interview on the
> > BBC, in which he states he doesn't want to be vaccinated, and that he
> > accepts the consequences.
>
> That is a reasonable response, as long as he also agrees to isolate until
> the pandemic is over.
>
> No one cares if someone refuses to be vaccinated, as long as they don't
> spread the disease to the general population. As we've seen, Covid
> vaccinations reduce the severity of the disease, and they reduce
> morbidity, but they are not 100% effective at preventing the disease.
>
> Same with masks. No need to wear a mask when you're by yourself, just
> don't go maskless into the general population.
>
> You have the freedom to make bad choices as long as you're willing to
> accept the consequences.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-60391876

David

Andy Burnelli <spam@nospam.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 15 Feb 2022 19:47:37 GMT, David Higton wrote:
>
>> It's interesting that Novak Djokovic has just given an interview on
>> the BBC, in which he states he doesn't want to be vaccinated, and
>> that he accepts the consequences.
>
> A single bit of off-the-wall anecdotal evidence is not science.

It demonstrates that no-one is being forced. Everyone has a choice. The
reasonable reaction to not getting vaccinated is to accept the
consequences.

On 15/02/2022 18:49, Andy Burnelli wrote:
> On Tue, 15 Feb 2022 17:39:12 +0000, Chris wrote:
>
>> [ snip still not answering the questions ]
>
> Chris,
>
> I've been busy adding value on the Windows group for spelltesters,
> and I've been busy on the Android group where we're checking if it's true
> that Google is now seamlessly updating the Android core forever.
>
> Remind me please.

Added below...

>> That's a false assertion. The 0.0002% are irrelevant as you're so
>> keen to point out. It's the 10-20% we need to really be careful
>> about or even the 0.1-1%.
>
> Long ago I gave you the chart from January 26th 2022 of the deaths
> broken down by age group, from the CDC itself; I'm well aware of the
> statistics.

Why do you pretend otherwise and focus on 0.0002%, then?

>> Society is about protecting the most vulnerable, not "I won't do
>> X because it has no benefit to me."
>
> We have to weigh how many freedoms won in battle are we going to
> revoke because ignorant people like Steve are scared out of their
> minds, Chris.

Remind me. Which battle was won for the right to reject vaccines?

>> Or do you deny that ~1m Americans were killed by COVID?
>
> Now you are just using a kindergarten argument Chris. Stop that.
Just answer the question. You're continually trying to diminish the
seriousness of COVID by focusing on the minutiae. It's an utterly
relevant question.

> What CDC statistic are you claiming I have been disputing, Chris.

That's not what I'm "claiming". Not that I'm claiming anything.

On Wed, 16 Feb 2022 08:01:04 -0000 (UTC), Chris wrote:

> It demonstrates that no-one is being forced. Everyone has a choice. The
> reasonable reaction to not getting vaccinated is to accept the
> consequences.

Chris,

If I have to teach you that anecdotes aren't science, then you're long lost.
I had been hoping that there was at least one intelligent person on this ng.

You already showed promise, Chris, in that you did two very adult things:
1. You _read_ the cites! (almost nobody on this newsgroup does that Chris)
2. You added value! (almost nobody on this newsgroup added cites either!)

Given there is hope for you yet...

Let's move on to the _more important_ adult concepts, instead, shall we.
The most ignorant people are the ones _forcing_ others to be like they are.

Let's be honest with each other as this is a very adult concept below:
a. *Some people are _scared shitless_ of covid*
b. *Some are not*

That's huge if you can comprehend that, but what's even huger is:
a. Those who are scared shitless, are almost completely ignorant
b. So are most of those who are not

Now, let's make that far worse with this observation, shall we:
a. Those who are scared, for some reason, tend to be wacko Democrats
b. Those who are not, for whatever reason, tend to be wacko Republicans

Bear in mind I'm an enlightened educated liberal, in that I believe everyone
should be free to make their own voluntary medical choices.

The "educated" part is that anyone who tells me that being forced to endure
a medical injection at the risk of losing your job is _not_ voluntary.

People like Steve will lie to claim that it is, but that just proves the
next point (which is the reason for the SUBJECT of this thread isn't it).

a. The Democrats will {lie,cheat,steal,etc} to _force_ you to get shot up
b. The Republicans will {lie,cheat,steal,etc} to be allowed _not_ to be shot

How in the world did a rather simple voluntary medical decision turn into a
hugely politicized destruction of the rights and freedoms Americans had?

I know why.
Do you?

HINT: (go back to the very first a/b that I listed in this post).
--
The most ignorant people are the ones _forcing_ others to be like they are.