I have a transatlantic flight scheduled soon and I got an email from
Delta with information.

Part of it says "You can also message for free from your smartphone via
iMessage, Facebook Messenger or WhatsApp (limited to text and emojis,
SMS unavailable)."

How is SMS unavailable if you can do all the things listed? I thought,
for example, that Whatsapp texting *was* SMS.

BTW, you can also "book, change, or check the status of your flight on
delta.com, all without purchasing a Wi-Fi pass". That's good.

(You can buy a subscription even when you're already in the air. A
monthly domestic plan is $50 (and includes Mexico and Canada!) and a
monthly global plan is 70. You can use either provider, and I wonder if
there is a plan that works on several airlines at once, not that I would
ever need one.)

In article <mda00h9mn1m1598esa5im0leqso4r422vi@4ax.com>, micky
<NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:

> I have a transatlantic flight scheduled soon and I got an email from
> Delta with information.

anywhere interesting?

> Part of it says "You can also message for free from your smartphone via
> iMessage, Facebook Messenger or WhatsApp (limited to text and emojis,
> SMS unavailable)."
>
> How is SMS unavailable if you can do all the things listed?

the messaging apps use the internet via in-flight wifi.

sms uses cellular, which is not available in flight (although some
airlines have tested picocells for in-flight calls).

> I thought,
> for example, that Whatsapp texting *was* SMS.

it isn't. it's completely separate.

> BTW, you can also "book, change, or check the status of your flight on
> delta.com, all without purchasing a Wi-Fi pass". That's good.

it can be quite useful if there are delays.

> (You can buy a subscription even when you're already in the air. A
> monthly domestic plan is $50 (and includes Mexico and Canada!) and a
> monthly global plan is 70. You can use either provider, and I wonder if
> there is a plan that works on several airlines at once, not that I would
> ever need one.)

there are plans that work across multiple airlines, plus some credit
cards offer complimentary passes as a benefit.

On 2022-02-06 21:12, micky wrote:
> I have a transatlantic flight scheduled soon and I got an email from
> Delta with information.
>
> Part of it says "You can also message for free from your smartphone via
> iMessage, Facebook Messenger or WhatsApp (limited to text and emojis,
> SMS unavailable)."
>
> How is SMS unavailable if you can do all the things listed? I thought,
> for example, that Whatsapp texting *was* SMS.

No, it is not.

Ah, I see nospam has explained why, I did not catch this was inside a plane.

I wonder how they can limit messaging to text and emojis, though.

--
Cheers, Carlos.

In article <avq5di-nmv.ln1@Telcontar.valinor>, Carlos E.R.
<robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:

> > I have a transatlantic flight scheduled soon and I got an email from
> > Delta with information.
> >
> > Part of it says "You can also message for free from your smartphone via
> > iMessage, Facebook Messenger or WhatsApp (limited to text and emojis,
> > SMS unavailable)."
> >
> > How is SMS unavailable if you can do all the things listed? I thought,
> > for example, that Whatsapp texting *was* SMS.
>
> No, it is not.
>
> Ah, I see nospam has explained why, I did not catch this was inside a plane.
>
> I wonder how they can limit messaging to text and emojis, though.

by allowing/denying access to specific sites, ports and/or protocols.

Am 06.02.22 um 22:34 schrieb nospam:
> In article <avq5di-nmv.ln1@Telcontar.valinor>, Carlos E.R.
> <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:
>
>>> I have a transatlantic flight scheduled soon and I got an email from
>>> Delta with information.
>>>
>>> Part of it says "You can also message for free from your smartphone via
>>> iMessage, Facebook Messenger or WhatsApp (limited to text and emojis,
>>> SMS unavailable)."
>>>
>>> How is SMS unavailable if you can do all the things listed? I thought,
>>> for example, that Whatsapp texting *was* SMS.
>>
>> No, it is not.
>>
>> Ah, I see nospam has explained why, I did not catch this was inside a plane.
>>
>> I wonder how they can limit messaging to text and emojis, though.
>
> by allowing/denying access to specific sites, ports and/or protocols.

Allowing/denying transfer of certain file types/protocols probably
because of capacity constraints.

--
De gustibus non est disputandum

On 2022-02-06 22:41, Joerg Lorenz wrote:
> Am 06.02.22 um 22:34 schrieb nospam:
>> In article <avq5di-nmv.ln1@Telcontar.valinor>, Carlos E.R.
>> <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>>> I have a transatlantic flight scheduled soon and I got an email from
>>>> Delta with information.
>>>>
>>>> Part of it says "You can also message for free from your smartphone via
>>>> iMessage, Facebook Messenger or WhatsApp (limited to text and emojis,
>>>> SMS unavailable)."
>>>>
>>>> How is SMS unavailable if you can do all the things listed? I thought,
>>>> for example, that Whatsapp texting *was* SMS.
>>>
>>> No, it is not.
>>>
>>> Ah, I see nospam has explained why, I did not catch this was inside a plane.
>>>
>>> I wonder how they can limit messaging to text and emojis, though.
>>
>> by allowing/denying access to specific sites, ports and/or protocols.

It is just one site, port, and protocol.

> Allowing/denying transfer of certain file types/protocols probably
> because of capacity constraints.

That's _why_ they do it, not _how_ they do it.

--
Cheers, Carlos.

In article <mt66di-g6d.ln1@Telcontar.valinor>, Carlos E.R.
<robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:

> >>> I wonder how they can limit messaging to text and emojis, though.
> >>
> >> by allowing/denying access to specific sites, ports and/or protocols.
>
> It is just one site, port, and protocol.

it's more than just messaging.

for example, everyone has access to gogo's website to be able to
purchase access. the airline's website is also available for flight
status or to book a new ticket or change an existing ticket.

for those who purchase access, most things will work as expected,
although they will throttle (and in some cases block) streaming, block
voip and there is usually content filtering to block porn and malicious
sites. some other things may be restricted or blocked.

it's not just airlines. just about all public hotspots have various
restrictions. it's a very rare exception to find one that is completely
unrestricted.

<https://content.gogoair.com/terms/?lang=en_US#sec-acceptable-use-and-co
nduct>
...It may use a variety of tools and techniques to effectuate its
network management activities and any Service limitations, and to
ensure that your use of the Service is consistent with this Agreement
(e.g., Section 2, restricting the use of voice applications and
Section 7.k., prohibiting knowing distribution of viruses and
malware).  These tools and techniques may include blocking or
otherwise restricting access to specific websites due to their
restricted content (e.g., VoIP applications), and using technologies
that can help us identify the activity involved, type of content
being transmitted, application being used (e.g., VoIP applications),
or the potential impact on our network.  Gogo also uses content
filtering (for adult-oriented material, for instance) at the request
of certain airlines.  Any additional restrictions on the Service,
including any cap on your total usage of the Service, will be
disclosed prior to purchase (or for users accessing the Service via
a promotion code, prior to entering the promotion code).
....
USERS OF THE MESSAGING PASS:  The Messaging Pass is intended to
provide access to pre-installed messaging apps on your smartphone or
mobile device.  Web browsing or use of other applications is not
supported on the Messaging Pass.  Pictures, videos, attachments, and
SMS texting are also not supported on the Messaging Pass.

In comp.mobile.android, on Sun, 6 Feb 2022 22:25:30 +0100, "Carlos E.R."
<robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:

>On 2022-02-06 21:12, micky wrote:
>> I have a transatlantic flight scheduled soon and I got an email from
>> Delta with information.
>>
>> Part of it says "You can also message for free from your smartphone via
>> iMessage, Facebook Messenger or WhatsApp (limited to text and emojis,
>> SMS unavailable)."
>>
>> How is SMS unavailable if you can do all the things listed? I thought,
>> for example, that Whatsapp texting *was* SMS.
>
>No, it is not.

I learn something new every day!
>
>Ah, I see nospam has explained why, I did not catch this was inside a plane.

Unless the plane is very late, and the screen on the seat back doesn't
say where it is, I won't be using the part where you make or change
airline reservations and check status. But I'm sure I'll send a couple
texts just so I can say I did that.

>I wonder how they can limit messaging to text and emojis, though.

If you don't know, I don't know!

On 2/6/2022 1:41 PM, Joerg Lorenz wrote:

<snip>

> Allowing/denying transfer of certain file types/protocols probably
> because of capacity constraints.

A lot of airlines now have free Wi-Fi that can be used to stream their
own entertainment content but doesn't connect to the Internet. Delta's
messaging capability takes that a little further.

The last flight I took was a cross-country (U.S.) flight on JetBlue
which offers free Wi-Fi. During the pre-flight announcements they
explicitly stated that it was forbidden to use any VOIP service with the
Wi-Fi, though I don't know how they would enforce this is someone was
using a VPN. I could SMS on JetBlue using Google Voice, but that's
because of the free Wi-Fi, which Delta does not offer.

Also note that an iPhone with a data-only connection will send an
iMessage to an Android device as an SMS and if the Android user responds
then the iMessage server will convert the SMS to an iMessage, and send
it over Wi-Fi to iMessage.

RCS would solve all of this, a common messaging platform that will work
over data connections. While most people that I know in the U.S. and
Europe have WhatsApp accounts, the people in the U.S. don't always pay
attention to their WhatsApp messages, they either use iMessage or SMS.

On 2/6/2022 12:12 PM, micky wrote:
> I have a transatlantic flight scheduled soon and I got an email from
> Delta with information.
>
> Part of it says "You can also message for free from your smartphone via
> iMessage, Facebook Messenger or WhatsApp (limited to text and emojis,
> SMS unavailable)."
>
> How is SMS unavailable if you can do all the things listed? I thought,
> for example, that Whatsapp texting *was* SMS.
>
>
> BTW, you can also "book, change, or check the status of your flight on
> delta.com, all without purchasing a Wi-Fi pass". That's good.
>
>
> (You can buy a subscription even when you're already in the air. A
> monthly domestic plan is $50 (and includes Mexico and Canada!) and a
> monthly global plan is 70. You can use either provider, and I wonder if
> there is a plan that works on several airlines at once, not that I would
> ever need one.)

Another advantage of WhatsApp is that if you are traveling outside the
U.S., and want to buy a prepaid SIM card, data-only SIM cards and eSIM
profiles are much more available and lower cost than a SIM with a phone
number but you won't have a phone number to receive SMS. You can always
send and receive SMS with Google Voice, but WhatsApp is more convenient,
especially in Europe and India where it is the predominant messaging
platform. One, now defunct, global SIM provider used to include WhatsApp
access without using up your data
<https://www.engadget.com/2016-11-09-knowroaming-free-whatsapp.html>.

On 2022-02-07 09:09, sms wrote:
> On 2/6/2022 1:41 PM, Joerg Lorenz wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
>> Allowing/denying transfer of certain file types/protocols probably
>> because of capacity constraints.
>
> A lot of airlines now have free Wi-Fi that can be used to stream their
> own entertainment content but doesn't connect to the Internet. Delta's
> messaging capability takes that a little further.
>
>
> The last flight I took was a cross-country (U.S.) flight on JetBlue
> which offers free Wi-Fi. During the pre-flight announcements they
> explicitly stated that it was forbidden to use any VOIP service with the
> Wi-Fi, though I don't know how they would enforce this is someone was
> using a VPN. I could SMS on JetBlue using Google Voice, but that's
> because of the free Wi-Fi, which Delta does not offer.
>
> Also note that an iPhone with a data-only connection will send an
> iMessage to an Android device as an SMS and if the Android user responds
> then the iMessage server will convert the SMS to an iMessage, and send
> it over Wi-Fi to iMessage.
>
> RCS would solve all of this, a common messaging platform that will work
> over data connections. While most people that I know in the U.S. and
> Europe have WhatsApp accounts, the people in the U.S. don't always pay
> attention to their WhatsApp messages, they either use iMessage or SMS.

That I have noticed, people with wasap taking a week or more to reply.

--
Cheers, Carlos.

On 2022-02-07 02:27, nospam wrote:
> In article <mt66di-g6d.ln1@Telcontar.valinor>, Carlos E.R.
> <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:
>
>>>>> I wonder how they can limit messaging to text and emojis, though.
>>>>
>>>> by allowing/denying access to specific sites, ports and/or protocols.
>>
>> It is just one site, port, and protocol.
>
> it's more than just messaging.
>
> for example, everyone has access to gogo's website to be able to
> purchase access. the airline's website is also available for flight
> status or to book a new ticket or change an existing ticket.
>
> for those who purchase access, most things will work as expected,
> although they will throttle (and in some cases block) streaming, block
> voip and there is usually content filtering to block porn and malicious
> sites. some other things may be restricted or blocked.
>
> it's not just airlines. just about all public hotspots have various
> restrictions. it's a very rare exception to find one that is completely
> unrestricted.

I don't know, I have not used hotspots in many years.

>
> <https://content.gogoair.com/terms/?lang=en_US#sec-acceptable-use-and-co
> nduct>
> ...It may use a variety of tools and techniques to effectuate its
> network management activities and any Service limitations, and to
> ensure that your use of the Service is consistent with this Agreement
> (e.g., Section 2, restricting the use of voice applications and
> Section 7.k., prohibiting knowing distribution of viruses and
> malware).  These tools and techniques may include blocking or
> otherwise restricting access to specific websites due to their
> restricted content (e.g., VoIP applications), and using technologies
> that can help us identify the activity involved, type of content
> being transmitted, application being used (e.g., VoIP applications),
> or the potential impact on our network.  Gogo also uses content
> filtering (for adult-oriented material, for instance) at the request
> of certain airlines.  Any additional restrictions on the Service,
> including any cap on your total usage of the Service, will be
> disclosed prior to purchase (or for users accessing the Service via
> a promotion code, prior to entering the promotion code).
> ...
> USERS OF THE MESSAGING PASS:  The Messaging Pass is intended to
> provide access to pre-installed messaging apps on your smartphone or
> mobile device.  Web browsing or use of other applications is not
> supported on the Messaging Pass.  Pictures, videos, attachments, and
> SMS texting are also not supported on the Messaging Pass.

--
Cheers, Carlos.

On 2022-02-07 06:52, micky wrote:
> In comp.mobile.android, on Sun, 6 Feb 2022 22:25:30 +0100, "Carlos E.R."
> <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:
>
>> On 2022-02-06 21:12, micky wrote:
>>> I have a transatlantic flight scheduled soon and I got an email from
>>> Delta with information.
>>>
>>> Part of it says "You can also message for free from your smartphone via
>>> iMessage, Facebook Messenger or WhatsApp (limited to text and emojis,
>>> SMS unavailable)."
>>>
>>> How is SMS unavailable if you can do all the things listed? I thought,
>>> for example, that Whatsapp texting *was* SMS.
>>
>> No, it is not.
>
> I learn something new every day!
>>
>> Ah, I see nospam has explained why, I did not catch this was inside a plane.
>
> Unless the plane is very late, and the screen on the seat back doesn't
> say where it is, I won't be using the part where you make or change
> airline reservations and check status. But I'm sure I'll send a couple
> texts just so I can say I did that.

:-D

>> I wonder how they can limit messaging to text and emojis, though.
>
> If you don't know, I don't know!

They don't publish details about their system, so it is difficult to
know. Maybe someone has investigated and published details.

It is even possible that airlines have an agreement with WhatsApp and
thus have a way to block what they want (heavy transmissions).

--
Cheers, Carlos.

In article <3pi8di-nm6.ln1@Telcontar.valinor>, Carlos E.R.
<robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:

>
> They don't publish details about their system, so it is difficult to
> know. Maybe someone has investigated and published details.

they do publish details.

originally gogo used ground base stations, later adding satellite
connectivity for overseas flights.

when it first began, they gave out free coupons to get people hooked.

they restrict certain types of activity, which they outline in their
terms of service, because the bandwidth to a single plane is very
limited.

> It is even possible that airlines have an agreement with WhatsApp and
> thus have a way to block what they want (heavy transmissions).

although that's technically possible, it is not the case. messaging is
very low bandwidth and there is also a separate messaging pass. note
that they also block attachments with that pass.

Am 07.02.22 um 23:20 schrieb Carlos E.R.:
> On 2022-02-07 02:27, nospam wrote:
>> it's not just airlines. just about all public hotspots have various
>> restrictions. it's a very rare exception to find one that is completely
>> unrestricted.
>
> I don't know, I have not used hotspots in many years.

Today's contracts/arrangements (Americans call it plans) offer flat
data. Why use restricted Hotspots that are usually hardly maintained and
inscure? In addition public hotspots are usually not very fast and 4G is
at least as fast. Not to mention 5G.

--
De gustibus non est disputandum

In article <stt50k$2bn$1@dont-email.me>, Joerg Lorenz <hugybear@gmx.ch>
wrote:

> >> it's not just airlines. just about all public hotspots have various
> >> restrictions. it's a very rare exception to find one that is completely
> >> unrestricted.
> >
> > I don't know, I have not used hotspots in many years.
>
> Today's contracts/arrangements (Americans call it plans) offer flat
> data. Why use restricted Hotspots that are usually hardly maintained and
> inscure? In addition public hotspots are usually not very fast and 4G is
> at least as fast. Not to mention 5G.

wifi-only tablets and laptops.

Am 07.02.22 um 09:09 schrieb sms:
> Also note that an iPhone with a data-only connection will send an
> iMessage to an Android device as an SMS and if the Android user responds
> then the iMessage server will convert the SMS to an iMessage, and send
> it over Wi-Fi to iMessage.
>
> RCS would solve all of this, a common messaging platform that will work
> over data connections. While most people that I know in the U.S. and
> Europe have WhatsApp accounts, the people in the U.S. don't always pay
> attention to their WhatsApp messages, they either use iMessage or SMS.

It is unbelievable how you are bullshitting again. Learn to accept that
RCS is dead for years.

The response-time of US-users of WA has to do with the low penetration
of WA in the US. They are simply not used to WA because they have
usually max. a handful of contacts and they live overseas in most cases.
Our friends and relatives in the US even resisted to add another
messenger in some cases.

SMS is almost dead for communication between individuals and iMsg is
restricted to Apple devices.

You pretend to understand things which you have no clue about.

--
De gustibus non est disputandum

Am 08.02.22 um 08:18 schrieb nospam:
> In article <stt50k$2bn$1@dont-email.me>, Joerg Lorenz <hugybear@gmx.ch>
> wrote:
>
>>>> it's not just airlines. just about all public hotspots have various
>>>> restrictions. it's a very rare exception to find one that is completely
>>>> unrestricted.
>>>
>>> I don't know, I have not used hotspots in many years.
>>
>> Today's contracts/arrangements (Americans call it plans) offer flat
>> data. Why use restricted Hotspots that are usually hardly maintained and
>> inscure? In addition public hotspots are usually not very fast and 4G is
>> at least as fast. Not to mention 5G.
>
> wifi-only tablets and laptops.

Are you serious?
I use my phone als hotspot for computers and tablets. Much faster and
more secure.

--
De gustibus non est disputandum

On 2022-02-08 00:46, nospam wrote:
> In article <3pi8di-nm6.ln1@Telcontar.valinor>, Carlos E.R.
> <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:
>
>>
>> They don't publish details about their system, so it is difficult to
>> know. Maybe someone has investigated and published details.
>
> they do publish details.

By "they" I meant WhatsApp.

>
> originally gogo used ground base stations, later adding satellite
> connectivity for overseas flights.
>
> when it first began, they gave out free coupons to get people hooked.
>
> they restrict certain types of activity, which they outline in their
> terms of service, because the bandwidth to a single plane is very
> limited.
>
>> It is even possible that airlines have an agreement with WhatsApp and
>> thus have a way to block what they want (heavy transmissions).
>
> although that's technically possible, it is not the case. messaging is
> very low bandwidth and there is also a separate messaging pass. note
> that they also block attachments with that pass.

You still have not explained how exactly they do it, only that it is not
as I hypothesize.

--
Cheers, Carlos.

On 2022-02-08 08:18, nospam wrote:
> In article <stt50k$2bn$1@dont-email.me>, Joerg Lorenz <hugybear@gmx.ch>
> wrote:
>
>>>> it's not just airlines. just about all public hotspots have various
>>>> restrictions. it's a very rare exception to find one that is completely
>>>> unrestricted.
>>>
>>> I don't know, I have not used hotspots in many years.
>>
>> Today's contracts/arrangements (Americans call it plans) offer flat
>> data. Why use restricted Hotspots that are usually hardly maintained and
>> inscure? In addition public hotspots are usually not very fast and 4G is
>> at least as fast. Not to mention 5G.
>
> wifi-only tablets and laptops.

I use tethering from the phone.

--
Cheers, Carlos.

On 2022-02-08 08:10, Joerg Lorenz wrote:
> Am 07.02.22 um 23:20 schrieb Carlos E.R.:
>> On 2022-02-07 02:27, nospam wrote:
>>> it's not just airlines. just about all public hotspots have various
>>> restrictions. it's a very rare exception to find one that is completely
>>> unrestricted.
>>
>> I don't know, I have not used hotspots in many years.
>
> Today's contracts/arrangements (Americans call it plans) offer flat
> data. Why use restricted Hotspots that are usually hardly maintained and
> inscure? In addition public hotspots are usually not very fast and 4G is
> at least as fast. Not to mention 5G.

Exactly :-)

--
Cheers, Carlos.

In article <stted2$lu9$1@dont-email.me>, Joerg Lorenz <hugybear@gmx.ch>
wrote:

> >>
> >> Today's contracts/arrangements (Americans call it plans) offer flat
> >> data. Why use restricted Hotspots that are usually hardly maintained and
> >> inscure? In addition public hotspots are usually not very fast and 4G is
> >> at least as fast. Not to mention 5G.
> >
> > wifi-only tablets and laptops.
>
> Are you serious?

yes.

> I use my phone als hotspot for computers and tablets. Much faster and
> more secure.

that's not always an option, sometimes inconvenient when it is an
option, and not everyone has unlimited bandwidth.

In article <6as9di-o0q.ln1@Telcontar.valinor>, Carlos E.R.
<robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:

>
>
> You still have not explained how exactly they do it, only that it is not
> as I hypothesize.

yes i did. they qos/block specific sites/ip addresses, ports and/or
protocols, depending on what it is they want to block or throttle. just
about all public hotspots have some level of restriction.

i posted the link to their terms of service, which lists some of what
they do not allow. basically, they throttle or block anything that can
adversely affect their network and overall performance, such as video
streaming, or is unacceptable for a plane, such as voip calls or adult
content.

On 2/8/2022 12:10 AM, Joerg Lorenz wrote:

> Why use restricted Hotspots that are usually hardly maintained and
> insecure?

There is a 3rd type of hotspot in my area. My ISP (Cox) company supplied
modems have a built in hotspot. Any nearby Cox subscriber can enter his
password to use any of these modem hotspots. Since Cox is a large
company there are thousands of these small hotspots available. (Cox also
has larger ranging company hotspots in the commercial areas.)

> In addition public hotspots are usually not very fast

Subscribers (usually) get their contracted Cox speed at these hotspots.

> and 4G is at least as fast. Not to mention 5G.

I normally just use my phone when out even when a hotspot is nearby. For
my kill-time reading, speed is not necessary. But if I needed to use my
tablet or laptop when out they would be very handy.

BTW Cox subscribers can opt out of having their own modem be a hotspot.
I did but am not sure why. Paranoia likely.

BTW2 I've only used the hotspots twice. Once my modem was being updated
at an inconvenient time so I used a neighbors hotspot. Another I was
babysitting for grandkids at their house and discovered I had poor phone
service. So I just signed into their Cox modem's hotspot and all was well...

Am 08.02.22 um 16:48 schrieb AJL:
> On 2/8/2022 12:10 AM, Joerg Lorenz wrote:
>> and 4G is at least as fast. Not to mention 5G.
> BTW Cox subscribers can opt out of having their own modem be a hotspot.
> I did but am not sure why. Paranoia likely.

Many subscriber simply do not accept other users on their
infrastructure. I wouldn't.

In urban areas this mesh networks make sense. It is common practice
among incumbent telecom operators.

> BTW2 I've only used the hotspots twice. Once my modem was being updated
> at an inconvenient time so I used a neighbors hotspot. Another I was
> babysitting for grandkids at their house and discovered I had poor phone
> service. So I just signed into their Cox modem's hotspot and all was well...

Cox is a professional operator. No reason to be suspicious. But it
is/can be useful to be careful with shares on computers.

--
De gustibus non est disputandum