https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385

Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.
Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.

As Africa and Asia advance and electrify, copper might be a limiting
resource. Solar and wind power need a lot of copper for power
gathering too. The numbers there could be interesting, lots of long
runs at relatively low voltage and power, used at low duty cycle.

On 7/15/2022 11:09 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
>
> https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385
>
> Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
> could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.
> Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.
>
> As Africa and Asia advance and electrify, copper might be a limiting
> resource. Solar and wind power need a lot of copper for power
> gathering too. The numbers there could be interesting, lots of long
> runs at relatively low voltage and power, used at low duty cycle.
>

It's unfortunate that adding copper to aluminum (most abundant metal) or
aluminum to copper basically makes either one way worse than if you'd
left it pure.

Like you'd think by adding say 10% aluminum to copper you'd get a wire
that was some small percentage less conductive than copper but still
retained most of copper's other nice properties, but IIRC it basically
ruins it and above some pretty low percentage aluminum you can't pull a
copper/aluminum alloy into a wire, anyway.

jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
>
> https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385
>
> Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
> could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.
> Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.
>
> As Africa and Asia advance and electrify, copper might be a limiting
> resource. Solar and wind power need a lot of copper for power
> gathering too. The numbers there could be interesting, lots of long
> runs at relatively low voltage and power, used at low duty cycle.
>

You could probably put DC-DC converters on, and run the collecting feeds
sort of like 70V audio line, only backwards and at HV DC. There would
be some safety issues, for sure.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

On 2022/07/15 8:09 a.m., jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
>
> https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385
>
> Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
> could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.
> Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.
>
> As Africa and Asia advance and electrify, copper might be a limiting
> resource. Solar and wind power need a lot of copper for power
> gathering too. The numbers there could be interesting, lots of long
> runs at relatively low voltage and power, used at low duty cycle.
>

Time to invest in copper mines I guess...and humans will simply have to
adapt.

Or some genius will notice something we've been overlooking.

Or at some point it will become cost effective to mine the asteroids.

Like we've been doing since our distant ancestors left the trees!

John :-#)#

On Friday, July 15, 2022 at 8:09:57 AM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
> https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385
>
> Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
> could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.
> Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.

If you only consider big-scale projects, superconducting motors and
generators are small, with low copper content, and kilohertz transformers are likewise
compact and need less wire volume. Copper's ductility, however,
and wire-drawing technology, are always going to be engineering assets.

"Gold is for the mistress, silver for the maid, copper for the craftsman, cunning at his trade..."

whit3rd wrote:
> On Friday, July 15, 2022 at 8:09:57 AM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
>> https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385
>>
>> Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
>> could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.
>> Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.
>
> If you only consider big-scale projects, superconducting motors and
> generators are small, with low copper content,

Powered by clean fusion power, no doubt. ;)

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

On Fri, 15 Jul 2022 12:32:51 -0400, Phil Hobbs
<pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

>jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
>>
>> https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385
>>
>> Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
>> could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.
>> Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.
>>
>> As Africa and Asia advance and electrify, copper might be a limiting
>> resource. Solar and wind power need a lot of copper for power
>> gathering too. The numbers there could be interesting, lots of long
>> runs at relatively low voltage and power, used at low duty cycle.
>>
>
>You could probably put DC-DC converters on, and run the collecting feeds
> sort of like 70V audio line, only backwards and at HV DC. There would
>be some safety issues, for sure.
>
>Cheers
>
>Phil Hobbs

The USA is blessed. We have coal, copper, lead, tin, uranium,
molybdenum, lithium, nickel, phosphates, silver, rare earth elements,
bauxite, gold, iron, mercury, zinc, potash, tungsten, salt, oil,
natural gas, water, sand, trees, grass, and girls.

On 7/15/22 11:09, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
>
> https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385
>
> Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
> could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.
> Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.
>
> As Africa and Asia advance and electrify, copper might be a limiting
> resource. Solar and wind power need a lot of copper for power
> gathering too. The numbers there could be interesting, lots of long
> runs at relatively low voltage and power, used at low duty cycle.
>

If so, now may be the time to consider speculating and go long. A few
days ago the Washington Examiner had a article saying copper has fallen
28% since peaking in March, and that it is historically a leading
indicator of a recession
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/policy/economy/copper-prices-warning-recession
.. Apparently one problem with recessions is that you have to either
already be out of one or almost there before you can actually tell that
one happened, but according to them copper seems to fall right at the
start and keeps dropping at least until it's over, maybe longer. They
have a plot of copper price overlaid with recessions, and it seems to me
that recessions happened at maybe half of the major price drops, so I'm
not sold on the usefulness. Back in 2018 Bloomberg had an article
claiming that copper fails miserably as a harbinger of recession
https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2018-08-28/copper-prices-fail-miserably-as-recession-indicator#xj4y7vzkg
(behind a paywall). Don't look at me, ya pays yer money, ya takes yer
chances :-).

--
Regards,
Carl

On 7/15/2022 4:11 PM, John Larkin wrote:
> On Fri, 15 Jul 2022 12:32:51 -0400, Phil Hobbs
> <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:
>
>> jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
>>>
>>> https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385
>>>
>>> Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
>>> could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.
>>> Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.
>>>
>>> As Africa and Asia advance and electrify, copper might be a limiting
>>> resource. Solar and wind power need a lot of copper for power
>>> gathering too. The numbers there could be interesting, lots of long
>>> runs at relatively low voltage and power, used at low duty cycle.
>>>
>>
>> You could probably put DC-DC converters on, and run the collecting feeds
>> sort of like 70V audio line, only backwards and at HV DC. There would
>> be some safety issues, for sure.
>>
>> Cheers
>>
>> Phil Hobbs
>
> The USA is blessed. We have coal, copper, lead, tin, uranium,
> molybdenum, lithium, nickel, phosphates, silver, rare earth elements,
> bauxite, gold, iron, mercury, zinc, potash, tungsten, salt, oil,
> natural gas, water, sand, trees, grass, and girls.
>

Well, you couldn't make them any less beautiful:

<https://www.wboy.com/news/west-virginia/legislation-passed-to-turn-former-coalfields-into-solar-farms/>

Bingham Canyon Mine:

<https://youtu.be/Qgd2ggcL7EQ>

A relative of mine used to work there, in his opinion it all kind of
went to shit once Rio Tinto bought it out and their management came in;
lots of perks for the execs while the little guy got extra shifts and
pay cuts, the usual. Doing truck maintenance for UPS was a much better gig

On 7/15/2022 2:57 PM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
> whit3rd wrote:
>> On Friday, July 15, 2022 at 8:09:57 AM UTC-7,
>> jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
>>> https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385
>>>
>>>
>>> Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
>>> could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.
>>> Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.
>>
>> If you only consider big-scale projects, superconducting motors and
>> generators are small, with low copper content,
>
> Powered by clean fusion power, no doubt. ;)
>
> Cheers
>
> Phil Hobbs
>

Yeah, well, you're the physicist here what are y'all even doing. You
guys put a man on the moon, thought there was a whole team just thinking
shit up and then another team of men backing them up:

<https://youtu.be/_B7MzBmjaJ8>

On 2022-07-15, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:
> On 7/15/2022 11:09 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
>>
>> https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385
>>
>> Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
>> could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.
>> Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.
>>
>> As Africa and Asia advance and electrify, copper might be a limiting
>> resource. Solar and wind power need a lot of copper for power
>> gathering too. The numbers there could be interesting, lots of long
>> runs at relatively low voltage and power, used at low duty cycle.
>>
>
> It's unfortunate that adding copper to aluminum (most abundant metal) or
> aluminum to copper basically makes either one way worse than if you'd
> left it pure.
>
> Like you'd think by adding say 10% aluminum to copper you'd get a wire
> that was some small percentage less conductive than copper but still
> retained most of copper's other nice properties, but IIRC it basically
> ruins it and above some pretty low percentage aluminum you can't pull a
> copper/aluminum alloy into a wire, anyway.

So don't mix, CCA works quite well for many tasks.

--
Jasen.

On Friday, July 15, 2022 at 11:49:40 AM UTC-4, bitrex wrote:
> On 7/15/2022 11:09 AM, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
> >
> > https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385
> >
> > Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
> > could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.
> > Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.
> >
> > As Africa and Asia advance and electrify, copper might be a limiting
> > resource. Solar and wind power need a lot of copper for power
> > gathering too. The numbers there could be interesting, lots of long
> > runs at relatively low voltage and power, used at low duty cycle.
> >
> It's unfortunate that adding copper to aluminum (most abundant metal) or
> aluminum to copper basically makes either one way worse than if you'd
> left it pure.
>
> Like you'd think by adding say 10% aluminum to copper you'd get a wire
> that was some small percentage less conductive than copper but still
> retained most of copper's other nice properties, but IIRC it basically
> ruins it and above some pretty low percentage aluminum you can't pull a
> copper/aluminum alloy into a wire, anyway.

You mean like adding an impurity to a substance lowers the melting point no matter the melting point of the impurity? Yeah, it's like that. That's why they can use the melting point as a quick measure of purity.

--

Rick C.

- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

On 7/15/2022 11:29 PM, Ricky wrote:
> On Friday, July 15, 2022 at 11:49:40 AM UTC-4, bitrex wrote:
>> On 7/15/2022 11:09 AM, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
>>>
>>> https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385
>>>
>>> Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
>>> could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.
>>> Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.
>>>
>>> As Africa and Asia advance and electrify, copper might be a limiting
>>> resource. Solar and wind power need a lot of copper for power
>>> gathering too. The numbers there could be interesting, lots of long
>>> runs at relatively low voltage and power, used at low duty cycle.
>>>
>> It's unfortunate that adding copper to aluminum (most abundant metal) or
>> aluminum to copper basically makes either one way worse than if you'd
>> left it pure.
>>
>> Like you'd think by adding say 10% aluminum to copper you'd get a wire
>> that was some small percentage less conductive than copper but still
>> retained most of copper's other nice properties, but IIRC it basically
>> ruins it and above some pretty low percentage aluminum you can't pull a
>> copper/aluminum alloy into a wire, anyway.
>
> You mean like adding an impurity to a substance lowers the melting point no matter the melting point of the impurity? Yeah, it's like that. That's why they can use the melting point as a quick measure of purity.
>

A paper on the conductivity of copper aluminum alloys, from the good ol'
days (1937):

<https://digitalcommons.mtech.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1071&context=bach_theses>

It sez when alloying aluminum with copper at just 7.7% aluminum the
conductivity is down to 16% of pure copper

On Fri, 15 Jul 2022 08:09:50 -0700, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com
wrote:

>
>https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385
>
>Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
>could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.

What is wrong with aluminium cables ? The electric conductivity is
only slightly worse than in copper, just make the cables somewhat
thicker (and also save some mass).

Get rid of the bulky 51/60 Hz AC distribution (which needs bulky
transformers) and replace it with HVDC/MVDC/LVDC distribution with
small high frequency transformers.

For LVDC distribution, standardize some voltages, such as:

- 1500 Vdc: fits into the EU LV directive and a lot of LVD certified
electric components can be used

- 400 Vdc: Common in EV and in fast chargers. Also 380 Vdc (+/-190
Vdc) is a common voltage in data centers and also increasingly in
telecom centers

- 48 Vdc, common telecom voltage. Also PoE

>Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.

Are these used for anything else than electric clocks driven by AC
mains ?

>As Africa and Asia advance and electrify, copper might be a limiting
>resource. Solar and wind power need a lot of copper for power
>gathering too. The numbers there could be interesting, lots of long
>runs at relatively low voltage and power, used at low duty cycle.

In India, they make TVs, computers and kitchen utilities that operate
from 48 Vdc. These are intended for small local village nets driven by
solar panels (e.g. four 12 V panels). This avoids much of the DC/AC/DC
conversion losses.

On Fri, 15 Jul 2022 11:49:32 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

>On 7/15/2022 11:09 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
>>
>> https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385
>>
>> Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
>> could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.
>> Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.
>>
>> As Africa and Asia advance and electrify, copper might be a limiting
>> resource. Solar and wind power need a lot of copper for power
>> gathering too. The numbers there could be interesting, lots of long
>> runs at relatively low voltage and power, used at low duty cycle.
>>
>
>It's unfortunate that adding copper to aluminum (most abundant metal) or
>aluminum to copper basically makes either one way worse than if you'd
>left it pure.
>
>Like you'd think by adding say 10% aluminum to copper you'd get a wire
>that was some small percentage less conductive than copper but still
>retained most of copper's other nice properties, but IIRC it basically
>ruins it and above some pretty low percentage aluminum you can't pull a
>copper/aluminum alloy into a wire, anyway.

You can get solid plated copper wire from Amazon or ebay. It's
intended for jewelry makers, is very hard, and a terrible electrical
and thermal conductor. Real copper bus wire is soft and much more
expensive.

On Fri, 15 Jul 2022 19:33:11 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

>On 7/15/2022 4:11 PM, John Larkin wrote:
>> On Fri, 15 Jul 2022 12:32:51 -0400, Phil Hobbs
>> <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:
>>
>>> jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
>>>>
>>>> https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385
>>>>
>>>> Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
>>>> could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.
>>>> Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.
>>>>
>>>> As Africa and Asia advance and electrify, copper might be a limiting
>>>> resource. Solar and wind power need a lot of copper for power
>>>> gathering too. The numbers there could be interesting, lots of long
>>>> runs at relatively low voltage and power, used at low duty cycle.
>>>>
>>>
>>> You could probably put DC-DC converters on, and run the collecting feeds
>>> sort of like 70V audio line, only backwards and at HV DC. There would
>>> be some safety issues, for sure.
>>>
>>> Cheers
>>>
>>> Phil Hobbs
>>
>> The USA is blessed. We have coal, copper, lead, tin, uranium,
>> molybdenum, lithium, nickel, phosphates, silver, rare earth elements,
>> bauxite, gold, iron, mercury, zinc, potash, tungsten, salt, oil,
>> natural gas, water, sand, trees, grass, and girls.
>>
>
>Well, you couldn't make them any less beautiful:
>
><https://www.wboy.com/news/west-virginia/legislation-passed-to-turn-former-coalfields-into-solar-farms/>
>
>Bingham Canyon Mine:
>
><https://youtu.be/Qgd2ggcL7EQ>
>
>A relative of mine used to work there, in his opinion it all kind of
>went to shit once Rio Tinto bought it out and their management came in;
>lots of perks for the execs while the little guy got extra shifts and
>pay cuts, the usual. Doing truck maintenance for UPS was a much better gig
>

When a better gig is available, take it. We outlawed slavery in 1865.

I've wondered why various minerals are concentrated in smallish clumps
here and there. Copper here, uranium there, gold somewhere else. We're
very lucky that it's not all uniformly distributed, PPMs or PPBs of
important stuff uniformly in the rocks everywhere.

Nice planet.

On Fri, 15 Jul 2022 10:30:57 -0700, John Robertson <spam@flippers.com>
wrote:

>
>On 2022/07/15 8:09 a.m., jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
>>
>> https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385
>>
>> Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
>> could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.
>> Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.
>>
>> As Africa and Asia advance and electrify, copper might be a limiting
>> resource. Solar and wind power need a lot of copper for power
>> gathering too. The numbers there could be interesting, lots of long
>> runs at relatively low voltage and power, used at low duty cycle.
>>
>
>Time to invest in copper mines I guess...and humans will simply have to
>adapt.
>
>Or some genius will notice something we've been overlooking.
>
>Or at some point it will become cost effective to mine the asteroids.

That sounds tricky. If there were tons of gold or diamonds on
asteroids or on the moon, would it be worth harvesting?

Of course, getting lots of diamonds would crash the price of diamonds.

>
>Like we've been doing since our distant ancestors left the trees!

The cost is low but the drama high with that method.

On Fri, 15 Jul 2022 11:49:11 -0700 (PDT), whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com>
wrote:

>On Friday, July 15, 2022 at 8:09:57 AM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
>> https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385
>>
>> Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
>> could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.
>> Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.
>
>If you only consider big-scale projects, superconducting motors and
>generators are small, with low copper content, and kilohertz transformers are likewise
>compact and need less wire volume. Copper's ductility, however,
>and wire-drawing technology, are always going to be engineering assets.
>
>"Gold is for the mistress, silver for the maid, copper for the craftsman, cunning at his trade..."

These are cool:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/08w3pg72wml0eac/PL300.jpg?raw=1

Kapton pcb windings. Good for 300 watts, more with some air.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ed8o1h3v8gptvul/SER2918.jpg?raw=1

How can they wind that inductor?

lørdag den 16. juli 2022 kl. 16.15.34 UTC+2 skrev jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com:
> On Fri, 15 Jul 2022 11:49:11 -0700 (PDT), whit3rd <whi...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >On Friday, July 15, 2022 at 8:09:57 AM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
> >> https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385
> >>
> >> Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
> >> could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.
> >> Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.
> >
> >If you only consider big-scale projects, superconducting motors and
> >generators are small, with low copper content, and kilohertz transformers are likewise
> >compact and need less wire volume. Copper's ductility, however,
> >and wire-drawing technology, are always going to be engineering assets.
> >
> >"Gold is for the mistress, silver for the maid, copper for the craftsman, cunning at his trade..."
> These are cool:
>
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/08w3pg72wml0eac/PL300.jpg?raw=1
>
> Kapton pcb windings. Good for 300 watts, more with some air.
>
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/ed8o1h3v8gptvul/SER2918.jpg?raw=1
>
> How can they wind that inductor?

soft wire and constraint it from bending any other way than you want it to

https://youtu.be/rsbfOWiA420

On Sat, 16 Jul 2022 15:17:47 +0300, upsidedown@downunder.com wrote:

>On Fri, 15 Jul 2022 08:09:50 -0700, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com
>wrote:
>
>>
>>https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385
>>
>>Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
>>could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.
>
>What is wrong with aluminium cables ? The electric conductivity is
>only slightly worse than in copper, just make the cables somewhat
>thicker (and also save some mass).
>
>Get rid of the bulky 51/60 Hz AC distribution (which needs bulky
>transformers) and replace it with HVDC/MVDC/LVDC distribution with
>small high frequency transformers.
>
>For LVDC distribution, standardize some voltages, such as:
>
>- 1500 Vdc: fits into the EU LV directive and a lot of LVD certified
>electric components can be used
>
>- 400 Vdc: Common in EV and in fast chargers. Also 380 Vdc (+/-190
>Vdc) is a common voltage in data centers and also increasingly in
>telecom centers
>
>- 48 Vdc, common telecom voltage. Also PoE

We use 48v as the prime DC power in some of our products, starting
with a kilowatt of MeanWell boxed power supply or a Phihong wart.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/gr57bhafemypi63/P940_box_9.jpg?raw=1

The first step is to get it down to something friendlier for the small
stuff, like 12 or 24 volts, and then sub-regulate. LM2576HV-ADJ is
klunky but reliable.

SRH05S12 is a cool little part. I have some test data.

>
>>Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.
>
>Are these used for anything else than electric clocks driven by AC
>mains ?

Are there electrostatic motor clocks? Cool. One could maybe make a
million RPM electrostatic motor just for fun.

>
>
>>As Africa and Asia advance and electrify, copper might be a limiting
>>resource. Solar and wind power need a lot of copper for power
>>gathering too. The numbers there could be interesting, lots of long
>>runs at relatively low voltage and power, used at low duty cycle.
>
>In India, they make TVs, computers and kitchen utilities that operate
>from 48 Vdc. These are intended for small local village nets driven by
>solar panels (e.g. four 12 V panels). This avoids much of the DC/AC/DC
>conversion losses.
>

Yeah, 48 is great.

In article <b3h5dhlvkucvi0cuh87nnaaa2vk1sgejoa@4ax.com>,
jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com says...
>
> That sounds tricky. If there were tons of gold or diamonds on
> asteroids or on the moon, would it be worth harvesting?
>
> Of course, getting lots of diamonds would crash the price of diamonds.
>
>
>

There are plenty of diamons. For a long time the DeBeers have had a
strangle hold on them. Almost all diamonds worth anything had to go
through them. They only let so many out to keep the price up.

lørdag den 16. juli 2022 kl. 17.18.32 UTC+2 skrev Ralph Mowery:
> In article <b3h5dhlvkucvi0cuh...@4ax.com>,
> jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com says...
> >
> > That sounds tricky. If there were tons of gold or diamonds on
> > asteroids or on the moon, would it be worth harvesting?
> >
> > Of course, getting lots of diamonds would crash the price of diamonds.
> >
> >
> >
> There are plenty of diamons. For a long time the DeBeers have had a
> strangle hold on them. Almost all diamonds worth anything had to go
> through them. They only let so many out to keep the price up.

and convinced people that "used" diamonds are not good enough,
you have to get a new one

On 2022/07/16 7:03 a.m., jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
> On Fri, 15 Jul 2022 10:30:57 -0700, John Robertson <spam@flippers.com>
> wrote:
>
>>
>> On 2022/07/15 8:09 a.m., jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
>>>
>>> https://gizmodo.com/a-copper-shortage-is-likely-coming-for-the-energy-trans-1849178385
>>>
>>> Motor and transformer design are pretty advanced. I wonder if they
>>> could be made with more electronics and less copper somehow.
>>> Electrostatic motors miss by an enormous factor.
>>>
>>> As Africa and Asia advance and electrify, copper might be a limiting
>>> resource. Solar and wind power need a lot of copper for power
>>> gathering too. The numbers there could be interesting, lots of long
>>> runs at relatively low voltage and power, used at low duty cycle.
>>>
>>
>> Time to invest in copper mines I guess...and humans will simply have to
>> adapt.
>>
>> Or some genius will notice something we've been overlooking.
>>
>> Or at some point it will become cost effective to mine the asteroids.
>
> That sounds tricky. If there were tons of gold or diamonds on
> asteroids or on the moon, would it be worth harvesting?

I doubt people would mine the moon/asteroids for gold, they might for
copper if it got too expensive on Earth.
You'd need Heinlein's shipping method to make it worth while - and
copper can be pushed in a magnetic accelerator...

John :-#)#

On Saturday, July 16, 2022 at 7:15:34 AM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
> On Fri, 15 Jul 2022 11:49:11 -0700 (PDT), whit3rd <whi...@gmail.com>
> wrote:

> > ... Copper's ductility, however,
> >and wire-drawing technology, are always going to be engineering assets.
> >
> >"Gold is for the mistress, silver for the maid, copper for the craftsman, cunning at his trade..."

> These are cool:
>
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/08w3pg72wml0eac/PL300.jpg?raw=1
>
> Kapton pcb windings. Good for 300 watts, more with some air.
>
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/ed8o1h3v8gptvul/SER2918.jpg?raw=1
>
> How can they wind that inductor?

Wire drawing takes multiple passes, with annealing and capstans between the dies, to eventually
neck down a rod to wire. A big hydraulic press can instantly stamp sheet into complex shapes,
as evidenced by each old solid-copper one cent coin. The windings look like stampings.

lørdag den 16. juli 2022 kl. 20.21.50 UTC+2 skrev whit3rd:
> On Saturday, July 16, 2022 at 7:15:34 AM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
> > On Fri, 15 Jul 2022 11:49:11 -0700 (PDT), whit3rd <whi...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > > ... Copper's ductility, however,
> > >and wire-drawing technology, are always going to be engineering assets..
> > >
> > >"Gold is for the mistress, silver for the maid, copper for the craftsman, cunning at his trade..."
>
> > These are cool:
> >
> > https://www.dropbox.com/s/08w3pg72wml0eac/PL300.jpg?raw=1
> >
> > Kapton pcb windings. Good for 300 watts, more with some air.
> >
> > https://www.dropbox.com/s/ed8o1h3v8gptvul/SER2918.jpg?raw=1
> >
> > How can they wind that inductor?
> Wire drawing takes multiple passes, with annealing and capstans between the dies, to eventually
> neck down a rod to wire. A big hydraulic press can instantly stamp sheet into complex shapes,
> as evidenced by each old solid-copper one cent coin. The windings look like stampings.

https://youtu.be/rsbfOWiA420