Vindo (riverbend) Romanic not Celtic (pure/white)

https://www.academia.edu/62075734/Vindo_in_Early_Place_Names?email_work_card=view-paper
cf pintal@Mly, trendel@Grm
___

On Saturday, September 19, 2020 at 11:27:23 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:
> On Saturday, January 11, 2020 at 5:07:47 PM UTC+5:30, Daud Deden wrote:
> > https://googleweblight.com/i?u=https%3A%2F%2Fen.m.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FDreidel&geid=NSTNR
> >
> >
> > According to some scholars, the dreidel developed from an Irish or English top introduced into Germany known as a teetotum
> >
> > In German this came to be called a trendel,
> >
> > The Yiddish word dreydl comes from the word dreyen ("to turn", compare to drehen, meaning the same in German). The Hebrew word sevivon comes from the Semitic root sbb ("to turn") Hayyim Nahman Bialik used a different word, kirkar (from the root krkr – "to spin")
> >
> > Trendel@Grm: spinning top
> > Dreydl@Yid: to turn
> > Krkr@Hbr: to spin
>
> I've also seen gilgul.
>
> In Hebrew, the word gilgul means "cycle" or "wheel"
> https://g.co/kgs/NAXsXa
>
> Looks similar to circle, and kirkar too looks similar.
>
> > Tletl@Azt: firedrill
> > Pintal@Mly: spin twist fiber
> > Gasing@Mly: spinning top

Duro/durum (doorway/interior\exterior ~ in two direction duo@Ltn, dua@Mly, ro(t)und, [upright?], rumah@Mly, domus, endura@Mbuti = Ndula: interior, doro@Gaulish: entrance; reflects the change from portable domeshields (tilted, borne) to larger family-sized sedentary dome huts (doorway, hearth)

https://www.academia.edu/49662031/Duro_in_early_place_names

"My own preference of translating Duro- as ‘crossing’ (and related to, or influenced by, Dutch door and German durch ‘through’) may also be less than ideal: it suggests that name elements associated with Duro- mostly refer to a river or its banks." [DD: not originally referring to river crossing, but entering-exiting-lifting-setting domeshield.]
- Hmm, this reminds me of room/doom/gloom puzzle, I think doom and gloom both had a middle 'r' later lost, room/do(r)om/glo(r)om; this would better match Mbuti mongolu dome ~ Malay mengelap darken and Grk mela.

> Vindo (riverbend) Romanic not Celtic (pure/white)
>
> https://www.academia.edu/62075734/Vindo_in_Early_Place_Names?email_work_card=view-paper
> cf pintal@Mly, trendel@Grm
> ___

On 20.01.2022 17:30, Daud Deden wrote:

>>>In German this came to be called a trendel,

Trendel a.k.a. Trendler
= Kreisel & Drehkreisel (AFAIK, the highest
frequency in occurrence/use in the Germ. lingu. area)
= Dradiwabberl/Dradiwawwel (esp. in Southern German, esp. Austrian
dialects) < regional Drahdiwabberl = in standard High German
"dreh dich, Wabberl!" (spin, swivel, turn, rotate)
(and "dreh dich um" = "turn around!")

In Austrian German additional meanings

dra(h) di (standard: dreh dich):
- hurry up!
- buzz off/naff off/f*ck off
Dradiwabberl/Dradiwawal:
- a coup d'etat, putch, revolution
- bankruptcy, bust

OTOH, words containing Dreh- generally mean "rotating, turn(ing),
spin(ing)", e.g. Drehbank "lathe; Drehscheibe "turning disk(shaped
object/stage); Drehbühne; Drehbuch "film/movie script" (because
shooting a movie is said "einen Film ... drehen" in German); Drehpunkt;
Drehmoment "(angular or rotation) momentum".

>>>The Yiddish word dreydl comes from the word dreyen ("to turn", compare to drehen, meaning the same in German).

Not merely "compare to", but it is the same word. Only that the
yiddish transliteration rendering "dreyen" shows an ...
adaption for a lighter pronunciation, with the help of the
semivowel -y-, /'drejəː(r)/, because the standard German
pronunciation /'dre-əː(r)/ is might be difficult (unusual,
"unnatural") to certain regional speakers (not only in
Yiddish, but also in various regional German dialects). Even
in standard Hochdeutsch-German, the -h-, which usually has
to be mute, is still written, and it makes sense: at least
in the declamatory, emphatic stage (theater, Church & the
like) speech, this -h- is even pronounced thus playing the
similar ... "helping" role: to ease the pronunciation: /'dreː-hən/
and the noun /'dre:-hə/. (The y-helper function would be
preferred rather by Romance and Slavik native speakers (IMHO).)

And this pan-German DREH- /dre:/ (-en being the verb, incl.
the infinitival suffix) already has most of the relevant meanings:

"turn, spin, swivel, revolve, rotate".

Being also used in many figurative, extending, idiomatic circum-
stances; e.g. "im Handumdrehen" means "very quickly", as quickly
as one would turn his hand => idiomatically "sleight-of-hand"
would be an fitting equivalent. Dreh as a noun can also have the
meanings "know-how, how-it's done, trick, knack, ability, particular
skill". OTOH, the figurative sense 'making "circles", "spinnings",
"swiveling"' as idiomatic expressions in some other languages
too, not only in German (e.g. "andrehen") mean "rip-off, fraudulent
actions/tricks by swindlers, quacks & pedlars who sell "snakeoil".

>The Hebrew word sevivon comes from the Semitic root sbb ("to turn") Hayyim Nahman Bialik used a different word, kirkar >(from the root krkr – "to spin")
But English swivel, along with swathe, swoop, swift < verb swifan
seems rather to have had such IE "parents" as *sweip- < *swei- "bend;
turn" (whether sbb belonged to their kinship or not).

OTOH, spin < Middle Engl. spinnen (as in modern German spinnen "weave")
< rather IE *(s)pen(d)- "pull; draw; spin". Kinship: Lithuanian
spendžiu ("I decide" (??)) and Latin pendere "hang"

Tim

On 20.01.2022 18:20, Daud Deden wrote:

>"My own preference of translating Duro- as ‘crossing’
>(and related to, or influenced by, Dutch door and German durch
>‘through’)
>durch, through & thorough: kinship => Gael. Þair, IE *ter-, *tr "through"

And not only Dutch for "door", but also in German: die Tür, Türe, Dür,
Düre, Low German Döör /dœɐ̯ (??)/, Tia, Dia /tɪə, dɪə/ - or in a seeming-
ly more appropriate, narrow transcription /tiɐ̯, diɐ̯/, depending on
regional Germ. pronunciations. The standard German pronunciation Tür
/tyːɐ̯/.

The pronunciation of the final -r- /r/ and /ʁ/ is rare; rather usual
in some areas of Southern (Alemanian-Suebian) and Northern Germany, and
esp. in Switzerland Alemanian and some (also Alemanian) areas of
Austria, as well as in the German regional varieties of still existing
German exclaves in Eastern Europe and ex-USSR.

- cf. the medieval painting celebrity Albrecht Dürer (Durer, Duerer)
from Nuremberg, his name would be a verbatim "'doorer', doorman" in
Engl.; and was the mere translation from Hungarian Ajtós(i)
/'ɔɪtoːʃ(ɪ)/, i.e., his Hungarian father's surname

So Engl. door also has German kinship, basicly Tür/Dür/Döör.

>Hmm, this reminds me of room/doom/gloom puzzle, I think doom
>and gloom both had a middle 'r' later lost, room/do(r)om>/glo(r)om;
>this would better match Mbuti mongolu dome ~ Malay mengelap darken
>and Grk mela.

NB: the usage of room in English has a restricted/limited range,
as compared with the usage of its German kin _Raum_, which
in general means "space" and "spaciousness".

Even the adjective (which today is rarer and specialized, restricted
in use) raum "spacious, open" (in forests) & "wide" (in sailors' jargon)
<= Old High German rumi "spacious, wide"; cf. Goth. rums "spacious"
<= Germanic *ruma "spacious", IE *reu- "wide, distant"

another (modern) German adj. geräumig "spacious".

noun Raum means
- various types of "rooms" & "halls"
- "space" (all kinds of it) in general;
- "the outer space" = "Cosmos" (with its German synonym ... _All_).
(along with "spatial") e.g. Raum & Zeit "Space and Time."

As well as the noun Räumlichkeit, plural Räumlichkeiten, for
the meaning "room, hall" etc, whenever it is not specified
(usually in housing & realtors' contexts) what kind of
dwelling, bureau, industrial roomings/spaces/halls. Any kind of
them. (Also based on the old ... Raum. And the /au/ in it has
been the development out of a long /u:/, e.g. very old German
/rumi/ and the Raum (after the appropriate sound shift), which
in English hasn't yet been diphtonged, /ru:m/ :-))

As for drom-, look up the Greek word dromos/δρόμος (as well the Romani
(Gypsy) equivalent thereof: drom), meaning "way, road, path(way),
street, route, track."

Tim

On Thursday, January 20, 2022 at 3:49:56 PM UTC-5, Tim Lang wrote:
> On 20.01.2022 18:20, Daud Deden wrote:
>
> >"My own preference of translating Duro- as ‘crossing’
> >(and related to, or influenced by, Dutch door and German durch
> >‘through’)
> >durch, through & thorough: kinship => Gael. Þair, IE *ter-, *tr "through"
>
> And not only Dutch for "door", but also in German: die Tür, Türe, Dür,
> Düre, Low German Döör /dœɐ̯ (??)/, Tia, Dia /tɪə, dɪə/ - or in a seeming-
> ly more appropriate, narrow transcription /tiɐ̯, diɐ̯/, depending on
> regional Germ. pronunciations. The standard German pronunciation Tür
> /tyːɐ̯/.
>
> The pronunciation of the final -r- /r/ and /ʁ/ is rare; rather usual
> in some areas of Southern (Alemanian-Suebian) and Northern Germany, and
> esp. in Switzerland Alemanian and some (also Alemanian) areas of
> Austria, as well as in the German regional varieties of still existing
> German exclaves in Eastern Europe and ex-USSR.
>
> - cf. the medieval painting celebrity Albrecht Dürer (Durer, Duerer)
> from Nuremberg, his name would be a verbatim "'doorer', doorman" in
> Engl.; and was the mere translation from Hungarian Ajtós(i)
> /'ɔɪtoːʃ(ɪ)/, i.e., his Hungarian father's surname
>
> So Engl. door also has German kinship, basicly Tür/Dür/Döör.
> >Hmm, this reminds me of room/doom/gloom puzzle, I think doom
> >and gloom both had a middle 'r' later lost, room/do(r)om>/glo(r)om;
> >this would better match Mbuti mongolu dome ~ Malay mengelap darken
> >and Grk mela.
> NB: the usage of room in English has a restricted/limited range,
> as compared with the usage of its German kin _Raum_, which
> in general means "space" and "spaciousness".

Very interesting, in Mbuti endu = in, endura = interior (space), internal (place). I've translated -ra as area, volume...
-ra + um (Grm: around) => raum ~ roominess (geodesic dome spatial geometry)

> Even the adjective (which today is rarer and specialized, restricted
> in use) raum "spacious, open" (in forests)

There, similar to xyuam 'through opening(s)' and 'with sieve' cf com- co-, and Mbuti njama '(through) thicket' and wamba womb.

& "wide" (in sailors' jargon)
> <= Old High German rumi "spacious, wide"; cf. Goth. rums "spacious"
> <= Germanic *ruma "spacious", IE *reu- "wide, distant"

Roomy. Ruminate?

> another (modern) German adj. geräumig "spacious".
>
> noun Raum means
> - various types of "rooms" & "halls"
> - "space" (all kinds of it) in general;
> - "the outer space" = "Cosmos" (with its German synonym ... _All_).
> (along with "spatial") e.g. Raum & Zeit "Space and Time."
>
> As well as the noun Räumlichkeit, plural Räumlichkeiten, for
> the meaning "room, hall" etc, whenever it is not specified
> (usually in housing & realtors' contexts) what kind of
> dwelling, bureau, industrial roomings/spaces/halls. Any kind of
> them. (Also based on the old ... Raum. And the /au/ in it has
> been the development out of a long /u:/, e.g. very old German
> /rumi/

Roomy. Possibly tummy, stoma.ta, tumescence?

and the Raum (after the appropriate sound shift), which
> in English hasn't yet been diphtonged, /ru:m/ :-))
>
> As for drom-, look up the Greek word dromos/δρόμος (as well the Romani
> (Gypsy) equivalent thereof: drom), meaning "way, road, path(way),
> street, route, track."

En.dura.m ~ in.to.ur.um ~ in.drom

>
> Tim
Thanks!

On Thursday, January 20, 2022 at 2:56:15 PM UTC-5, Tim Lang wrote:
> On 20.01.2022 17:30, Daud Deden wrote:
>
> >>>In German this came to be called a trendel,
> Trendel a.k.a. Trendler
> = Kreisel & Drehkreisel (AFAIK, the highest
> frequency in occurrence/use in the Germ. lingu. area)
> = Dradiwabberl/Dradiwawwel (esp. in Southern German, esp. Austrian
> dialects) < regional Drahdiwabberl = in standard High German
> "dreh dich, Wabberl!" (spin, swivel, turn, rotate)
> (and "dreh dich um" = "turn around!")

> In Austrian German additional meanings
>
> dra(h) di (standard: dreh dich):
> - hurry up!
> - buzz off/naff off/f*ck off
> Dradiwabberl/Dradiwawal:
> - a coup d'etat, putch, revolution
> - bankruptcy, bust
>
> OTOH, words containing Dreh- generally mean "rotating, turn(ing),
> spin(ing)", e.g. Drehbank "lathe; Drehscheibe "turning disk(shaped
> object/stage); Drehbühne; Drehbuch "film/movie script" (because
> shooting a movie is said "einen Film ... drehen" in German); Drehpunkt;
> Drehmoment "(angular or rotation) momentum".
> >>>The Yiddish word dreydl comes from the word dreyen ("to turn", compare to drehen, meaning the same in German).
> Not merely "compare to", but it is the same word. Only that the
> yiddish transliteration rendering "dreyen" shows an ...
> adaption for a lighter pronunciation, with the help of the
> semivowel -y-, /'drejəː(r)/, because the standard German
> pronunciation /'dre-əː(r)/ is might be difficult (unusual,
> "unnatural") to certain regional speakers (not only in
> Yiddish, but also in various regional German dialects). Even
> in standard Hochdeutsch-German, the -h-, which usually has
> to be mute, is still written, and it makes sense: at least
> in the declamatory, emphatic stage (theater, Church & the
> like) speech, this -h- is even pronounced thus playing the
> similar ... "helping" role: to ease the pronunciation: /'dreː-hən/
> and the noun /'dre:-hə/. (The y-helper function would be
> preferred rather by Romance and Slavik native speakers (IMHO).)
>
> And this pan-German DREH- /dre:/ (-en being the verb, incl.
> the infinitival suffix) already has most of the relevant meanings:
>
> "turn, spin, swivel, revolve, rotate".

Swive.l, sway, sweep, s.wipe follows an arc back & forth eg. To spin a dreidel or firestick (tletl@Azt), hand arcs like a rocker or swing while the path etched is circular.

> Being also used in many figurative, extending, idiomatic circum-
> stances; e.g. "im Handumdrehen" means "very quickly", as quickly
> as one would turn his hand => idiomatically "sleight-of-hand"
> would be an fitting equivalent. Dreh as a noun can also have the
> meanings "know-how, how-it's done, trick, knack, ability, particular
> skill". OTOH, the figurative sense 'making "circles", "spinnings",
> "swiveling"' as idiomatic expressions in some other languages
> too, not only in German (e.g. "andrehen") mean "rip-off, fraudulent
> actions/tricks by swindlers, quacks & pedlars who sell "snakeoil".
> >The Hebrew word sevivon comes from the Semitic root sbb ("to turn") Hayyim Nahman Bialik used a different word, kirkar >(from the root krkr – "to spin")
> But English swivel, along with swathe, swoop, swift < verb swifan
> seems rather to have had such IE "parents" as *sweip- < *swei- "bend;
> turn" (whether sbb belonged to their kinship or not).

Swivel, sway, swoon follow an arc, not a full circle (domeshield).
a pin/spine/spindle vs swindle
hinge pintle pintu@Mly: door pendulum suspense

> OTOH, spin < Middle Engl. spinnen (as in modern German spinnen "weave")
> < rather IE *(s)pen(d)- "pull; draw; spin". Kinship: Lithuanian
> spendžiu ("I decide" (??)) and Latin pendere "hang"

> Tim

On Friday, January 21, 2022 at 1:20:13 AM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> On Thursday, January 20, 2022 at 2:56:15 PM UTC-5, Tim Lang wrote:
> > On 20.01.2022 17:30, Daud Deden wrote:
> >
> > >>>In German this came to be called a trendel,
> > Trendel a.k.a. Trendler
> > = Kreisel & Drehkreisel (AFAIK, the highest
> > frequency in occurrence/use in the Germ. lingu. area)
> > = Dradiwabberl/Dradiwawwel (esp. in Southern German, esp. Austrian
> > dialects) < regional Drahdiwabberl = in standard High German
> > "dreh dich, Wabberl!" (spin, swivel, turn, rotate)
> > (and "dreh dich um" = "turn around!")
>
> > In Austrian German additional meanings
> >
> > dra(h) di (standard: dreh dich):
> > - hurry up!
> > - buzz off/naff off/f*ck off

Likely "lift off" pick up your shield and get going!

> > Dradiwabberl/Dradiwawal:
> > - a coup d'etat, putch, revolution
> > - bankruptcy, bust
> >
> > OTOH, words containing Dreh- generally mean "rotating, turn(ing),
> > spin(ing)", e.g. Drehbank "lathe; Drehscheibe "turning disk(shaped
> > object/stage); Drehbühne; Drehbuch "film/movie script" (because
> > shooting a movie is said "einen Film ... drehen" in German); Drehpunkt;
> > Drehmoment "(angular or rotation) momentum".
> > >>>The Yiddish word dreydl comes from the word dreyen ("to turn", compare to drehen, meaning the same in German).
> > Not merely "compare to", but it is the same word. Only that the
> > yiddish transliteration rendering "dreyen" shows an ...
> > adaption for a lighter pronunciation, with the help of the
> > semivowel -y-, /'drejəː(r)/, because the standard German
> > pronunciation /'dre-əː(r)/ is might be difficult (unusual,
> > "unnatural") to certain regional speakers (not only in
> > Yiddish, but also in various regional German dialects). Even
> > in standard Hochdeutsch-German, the -h-, which usually has
> > to be mute, is still written, and it makes sense: at least
> > in the declamatory, emphatic stage (theater, Church & the
> > like) speech, this -h- is even pronounced thus playing the
> > similar ... "helping" role: to ease the pronunciation: /'dreː-hən/
> > and the noun /'dre:-hə/. (The y-helper function would be
> > preferred rather by Romance and Slavik native speakers (IMHO).)
> >
> > And this pan-German DREH- /dre:/ (-en being the verb, incl.
> > the infinitival suffix) already has most of the relevant meanings:
> >
> > "turn, spin, swivel, revolve, rotate".
> Swive.l, sway, sweep, s.wipe follows an arc back & forth eg. To spin a dreidel or firestick (tletl@Azt), hand arcs like a rocker or swing while the path etched is circular.
> > Being also used in many figurative, extending, idiomatic circum-
> > stances; e.g. "im Handumdrehen" means "very quickly", as quickly
> > as one would turn his hand => idiomatically "sleight-of-hand"
> > would be an fitting equivalent. Dreh as a noun can also have the
> > meanings "know-how, how-it's done, trick, knack, ability, particular
> > skill". OTOH, the figurative sense 'making "circles", "spinnings",
> > "swiveling"' as idiomatic expressions in some other languages
> > too, not only in German (e.g. "andrehen") mean "rip-off, fraudulent
> > actions/tricks by swindlers, quacks & pedlars who sell "snakeoil".
> > >The Hebrew word sevivon comes from the Semitic root sbb ("to turn") Hayyim Nahman Bialik used a different word, kirkar >(from the root krkr – "to spin")
> > But English swivel, along with swathe, swoop, swift < verb swifan
> > seems rather to have had such IE "parents" as *sweip- < *swei- "bend;
> > turn" (whether sbb belonged to their kinship or not).
> Swivel, sway, swoon follow an arc, not a full circle (domeshield).
> a pin/spine/spindle vs swindle

She swiveled her hips walking straight vs she spun around dancing
She bent over to lift the domeshield edge vs she walked around the dome hut..

> hinge pintle pintu@Mly: door pendulum suspense
> > OTOH, spin < Middle Engl. spinnen (as in modern German spinnen "weave")
> > < rather IE *(s)pen(d)- "pull; draw; spin". Kinship: Lithuanian
> > spendžiu ("I decide" (??)) and Latin pendere "hang"
>
> > Tim

Distinction between around (dome, um), and, the (swinging door) arc of drawing/dropping the domeshield for access or to tilt it up for a shade

On Friday, January 21, 2022 at 12:55:44 AM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> On Thursday, January 20, 2022 at 3:49:56 PM UTC-5, Tim Lang wrote:
> > On 20.01.2022 18:20, Daud Deden wrote:
> >
> > >"My own preference of translating Duro- as ‘crossing’
> > >(and related to, or influenced by, Dutch door and German durch
> > >‘through’)
> > >durch, through & thorough: kinship => Gael. Þair, IE *ter-, *tr "through"
> >
> > And not only Dutch for "door", but also in German: die Tür, Türe, Dür,
> > Düre, Low German Döör /dœɐ̯ (??)/, Tia, Dia /tɪə, dɪə/ - or in a seeming-
> > ly more appropriate, narrow transcription /tiɐ̯, diɐ̯/, depending on
> > regional Germ. pronunciations. The standard German pronunciation Tür
> > /tyːɐ̯/.
> >
> > The pronunciation of the final -r- /r/ and /ʁ/ is rare; rather usual
> > in some areas of Southern (Alemanian-Suebian) and Northern Germany, and
> > esp. in Switzerland Alemanian and some (also Alemanian) areas of
> > Austria, as well as in the German regional varieties of still existing
> > German exclaves in Eastern Europe and ex-USSR.
> >
> > - cf. the medieval painting celebrity Albrecht Dürer (Durer, Duerer)
> > from Nuremberg, his name would be a verbatim "'doorer', doorman" in
> > Engl.; and was the mere translation from Hungarian Ajtós(i)
> > /'ɔɪtoːʃ(ɪ)/, i.e., his Hungarian father's surname
> >
> > So Engl. door also has German kinship, basicly Tür/Dür/Döör.
> > >Hmm, this reminds me of room/doom/gloom puzzle, I think doom
> > >and gloom both had a middle 'r' later lost, room/do(r)om>/glo(r)om;
> > >this would better match Mbuti mongolu dome ~ Malay mengelap darken
> > >and Grk mela.
> > NB: the usage of room in English has a restricted/limited range,
> > as compared with the usage of its German kin _Raum_, which
> > in general means "space" and "spaciousness".
> Very interesting, in Mbuti endu = in, endura = interior (space), internal (place). I've translated -ra as area, volume...
> -ra + um (Grm: around) => raum ~ roominess (geodesic dome spatial geometry)
> > Even the adjective (which today is rarer and specialized, restricted
> > in use) raum "spacious, open" (in forests)
> There, similar to xyuam 'through opening(s)' and 'with sieve' cf com- co-, and Mbuti njama '(through) thicket' and wamba womb.
> & "wide" (in sailors' jargon)
> > <= Old High German rumi "spacious, wide"; cf. Goth. rums "spacious"
> > <= Germanic *ruma "spacious", IE *reu- "wide, distant"
> Roomy. Ruminate?

:~} yes, ruminate! To turn over (from open bowl-basket to closed domeshield)

https://www.etymonline.com/word/ruminate

roomy rim (edge of shield: grip/crimp/clam.p shell)
doom dim doum palm: used to build dome huts at Red Sea
gloomy glum sombre.ro<sub.umbra shaded area

> > another (modern) German adj. geräumig "spacious".
> >
> > noun Raum means
> > - various types of "rooms" & "halls"
> > - "space" (all kinds of it) in general;
> > - "the outer space" = "Cosmos" (with its German synonym ... _All_).
> > (along with "spatial") e.g. Raum & Zeit "Space and Time."
> >
> > As well as the noun Räumlichkeit, plural Räumlichkeiten, for
> > the meaning "room, hall" etc, whenever it is not specified
> > (usually in housing & realtors' contexts) what kind of
> > dwelling, bureau, industrial roomings/spaces/halls. Any kind of
> > them. (Also based on the old ... Raum. And the /au/ in it has
> > been the development out of a long /u:/, e.g. very old German
> > /rumi/
> Roomy. Possibly tummy, stoma.ta, tumescence?
> and the Raum (after the appropriate sound shift), which
> > in English hasn't yet been diphtonged, /ru:m/ :-))
> >
> > As for drom-, look up the Greek word dromos/δρόμος (as well the Romani
> > (Gypsy) equivalent thereof: drom), meaning "way, road, path(way),
> > street, route, track."
> En.dura.m ~ in.to.ur.um ~ in.drom
>
> >
> > Tim
> Thanks!

On 21.01.2022 06:55, Daud Deden wrote:

>Roomy. Ruminate?

AFAIK, Latin rumen "gullet"; and hence ruminare (with the noun
ruminatio): "to ruminate".

>tumescence?

Result of tumesco, tumescere: "to begin to swell; swell up;"
along with tume-facio "to make/cause to swell, to tumefy."
Cf. English tumefaction "swelling" or "tumor".

Tim

On 2022-01-20, Tim Lang <me@privacy.net> wrote:

["drehen"]
> Even in standard Hochdeutsch-German, the -h-, which usually has
> to be mute, is still written, and it makes sense: at least
> in the declamatory, emphatic stage (theater, Church & the
> like) speech, this -h- is even pronounced thus playing the
> similar ... "helping" role: to ease the pronunciation: /'dreː-hən/
> and the noun /'dre:-hə/.

I suspect the hyperarticulated /h/ is a hypercorrection derived
from the spelling.

--
Christian "naddy" Weisgerber naddy@mips.inka.de

On 2022-01-20, Tim Lang <me@privacy.net> wrote:

> So Engl. door also has German kinship, basicly Tür/Dür/Döör.

According to Pfeifer, there are two closely related Germanic words,
one giving rise to German "Tür", Dutch "deur", Swedisch "dörr", and
the other one to English "door", German "Tor".
https://www.dwds.de/wb/etymwb/T%C3%BCr

--
Christian "naddy" Weisgerber naddy@mips.inka.de

On Friday, January 21, 2022 at 4:30:08 PM UTC-5, Christian Weisgerber wrote:
> On 2022-01-20, Tim Lang <m...@privacy.net> wrote:
> > So Engl. door also has German kinship, basicly Tür/Dür/Döör.
> According to Pfeifer, there are two closely related Germanic words,
> one giving rise to German "Tür", Dutch "deur", Swedisch "dörr", and
> the other one to English "door", German "Tor".
> https://www.dwds.de/wb/etymwb/T%C3%BCr
> --
> Christian "naddy" Weisgerber na...@mips.inka.de

I wondered about the etymology of gate, also Germanic source.

Gate (n.)
"opening, entrance," Old English geat (plural geatu) "gate, door, opening, passage, hinged framework barrier," from Proto-Germanic *gatan (source also of Old Norse gat "opening, passage," Old Saxon gat "eye of a needle, hole," Old Frisian gat "hole, opening," Dutch gat "gap, hole, breach," German Gasse "street, lane, alley"), of unknown origin.

I suspect related to gather (open arms [gap] get & close/clasp) & aligns with mate/grid-grate/eat-ate, probably term for "doorway"?

njambuanGDuaTlua?

On Friday, January 21, 2022 at 5:47:41 PM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> On Friday, January 21, 2022 at 4:30:08 PM UTC-5, Christian Weisgerber wrote:
> > On 2022-01-20, Tim Lang <m...@privacy.net> wrote:
> > > So Engl. door also has German kinship, basicly Tür/Dür/Döör.
> > According to Pfeifer, there are two closely related Germanic words,
> > one giving rise to German "Tür", Dutch "deur", Swedisch "dörr", and
> > the other one to English "door", German "Tor".
> > https://www.dwds.de/wb/etymwb/T%C3%BCr
> > --
> > Christian "naddy" Weisgerber na...@mips.inka.de
> I wondered about the etymology of gate, also Germanic source.
>
> Gate (n.)
> "opening, entrance," Old English geat (plural geatu) "gate, door, opening, passage, hinged framework barrier," from Proto-Germanic *gatan (source also of Old Norse gat "opening, passage," Old Saxon gat "eye of a needle, hole," Old Frisian gat "hole, opening," Dutch gat "gap, hole, breach," German Gasse "street, lane, alley"), of unknown origin.
>
> I suspect related to gather (open arms [gap] get & close/clasp) & aligns with mate/grid-grate/eat-ate, probably term for "doorway"?
>
> njambuanGDuaTlua?
Rather njuambuanGduATluA (thru.borne.hole, woambelle)
xyuambGATlachya (G insertion atypical, replaced u?, cf generate bereshit)

On Saturday, January 22, 2022 at 9:23:18 AM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> On Friday, January 21, 2022 at 5:47:41 PM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> > On Friday, January 21, 2022 at 4:30:08 PM UTC-5, Christian Weisgerber wrote:
> > > On 2022-01-20, Tim Lang <m...@privacy.net> wrote:
> > > > So Engl. door also has German kinship, basicly Tür/Dür/Döör.
> > > According to Pfeifer, there are two closely related Germanic words,
> > > one giving rise to German "Tür", Dutch "deur", Swedisch "dörr", and
> > > the other one to English "door", German "Tor".
> > > https://www.dwds.de/wb/etymwb/T%C3%BCr
> > > --
> > > Christian "naddy" Weisgerber na...@mips.inka.de
> > I wondered about the etymology of gate, also Germanic source.
> >
> > Gate (n.)
> > "opening, entrance," Old English geat (plural geatu) "gate, door, opening, passage, hinged framework barrier," from Proto-Germanic *gatan (source also of Old Norse gat "opening, passage," Old Saxon gat "eye of a needle, hole," Old Frisian gat "hole, opening," Dutch gat "gap, hole, breach," German Gasse "street, lane, alley"), of unknown origin.
> >
> > I suspect related to gather (open arms [gap] get & close/clasp) & aligns with mate/grid-grate/eat-ate, probably term for "doorway"?
> >
> > njambuanGDuaTlua?
> Rather njuambuanGduATluA (thru.borne.hole, woambelle)
> xyuambGATlachya (G insertion atypical, replaced u?, cf generate bereshit)

Aside
Cogenerate cognate cognition gnate gate grate mate date late
mata@Mly: eye, stigmata, , stomata

On Saturday, January 22, 2022 at 9:34:54 AM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> On Saturday, January 22, 2022 at 9:23:18 AM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> > On Friday, January 21, 2022 at 5:47:41 PM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> > > On Friday, January 21, 2022 at 4:30:08 PM UTC-5, Christian Weisgerber wrote:
> > > > On 2022-01-20, Tim Lang <m...@privacy.net> wrote:
> > > > > So Engl. door also has German kinship, basicly Tür/Dür/Döör.
> > > > According to Pfeifer, there are two closely related Germanic words,
> > > > one giving rise to German "Tür", Dutch "deur", Swedisch "dörr", and
> > > > the other one to English "door", German "Tor".
> > > > https://www.dwds.de/wb/etymwb/T%C3%BCr
> > > > --
> > > > Christian "naddy" Weisgerber na...@mips.inka.de
> > > I wondered about the etymology of gate, also Germanic source.
> > >
> > > Gate (n.)
> > > "opening, entrance," Old English geat (plural geatu) "gate, door, opening, passage, hinged framework barrier," from Proto-Germanic *gatan (source also of Old Norse gat "opening, passage," Old Saxon gat "eye of a needle, hole," Old Frisian gat "hole, opening," Dutch gat "gap, hole, breach," German Gasse "street, lane, alley"), of unknown origin.
> > >
> > > I suspect related to gather (open arms [gap] get & close/clasp) & aligns with mate/grid-grate/eat-ate, probably term for "doorway"?
> > >
> > > njambuanGDuaTlua?
> > Rather njuambuanGduATluA (thru.borne.hole, woambelle)
> > xyuambGATlachya (G insertion atypical, replaced u?, cf generate bereshit)
> Aside
> Cogenerate cognate cognition gnate gate grate mate date late
> mata@Mly: eye, stigmata, , stomata

Congeneric
Abstract
Despite the remarkable developments in molecular biology over the past three decades, anthropological genetics has had only limited impact on systematics in human evolution. Genetics offers the opportunity to objectively test taxonomies based on morphology and may be used to supplement conventional approaches to hominid systematics. Our analyses, examining chromosomes and 46 estimates of genetic distance, indicate there may have been only around 4 species on the direct line to modern humans and 5 species in total. This contrasts with current taxonomies recognising up to 23 species. The genetic proximity of humans and chimpanzees has been used to suggest these species are congeneric.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12733395/

On Friday, January 21, 2022 at 5:47:41 PM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> On Friday, January 21, 2022 at 4:30:08 PM UTC-5, Christian Weisgerber wrote:
> > On 2022-01-20, Tim Lang <m...@privacy.net> wrote:
> > > So Engl. door also has German kinship, basicly Tür/Dür/Döör.
> > According to Pfeifer, there are two closely related Germanic words,
> > one giving rise to German "Tür", Dutch "deur", Swedisch "dörr", and
> > the other one to English "door", German "Tor".
> > https://www.dwds.de/wb/etymwb/T%C3%BCr
> > --
> > Christian "naddy" Weisgerber na...@mips.inka.de
> I wondered about the etymology of gate, also Germanic source.
>
> Gate (n.)
> "opening, entrance," Old English geat (plural geatu) "gate, door, opening, passage, hinged framework barrier," from Proto-Germanic *gatan (source also of Old Norse gat "opening, passage," Old Saxon gat "eye of a needle, hole," Old Frisian gat "hole, opening," Dutch gat "gap, hole, breach," German Gasse "street, lane, alley"), of unknown origin.
>
> I suspect related to gather (open arms [gap] get & close/clasp) & aligns with mate/grid-grate/eat-ate, probably term for "doorway"?
>
> njambuanGDuaTlua?

Doorway@egl
Ulaz, vrata@croatian
Embrasure de porte@Frc
Atarian@Bsq
Albaabka@Somali
Madkhal@Arb
门口
Ménkǒu@Chn
oviaukko@Fin
ánoigma tis pórtas@Grk
gapi@Turkmen (gap?)
gonhi@Shona
dhoka@Nepali
Kofar gida@Hausa (cover gate?)
qhov rooj@Hmong
umuryango@Kinyarwanda (um?)
Lawang@Jav

On Thursday, January 20, 2022 at 3:49:56 PM UTC-5, Tim Lang wrote:
> On 20.01.2022 18:20, Daud Deden wrote:
>

Compare dear to door

Dear, precious, valued, expensive
Dorogo@Rus: dear
Duur@Dut: dear
Teuer@Ger: dear
Dyr@Dan: dear

> >"My own preference of translating Duro- as ‘crossing’
> >(and related to, or influenced by, Dutch door and German durch
> >‘through’)
> >durch, through & thorough: kinship => Gael. Þair, IE *ter-, *tr "through"
>
> And not only Dutch for "door", but also in German: die Tür, Türe, Dür,
> Düre, Low German Döör /dœɐ̯ (??)/, Tia, Dia /tɪə, dɪə/ - or in a seeming-
> ly more appropriate, narrow transcription /tiɐ̯, diɐ̯/, depending on
> regional Germ. pronunciations. The standard German pronunciation Tür
> /tyːɐ̯/.
>
> The pronunciation of the final -r- /r/ and /ʁ/ is rare; rather usual
> in some areas of Southern (Alemanian-Suebian) and Northern Germany, and
> esp. in Switzerland Alemanian and some (also Alemanian) areas of
> Austria, as well as in the German regional varieties of still existing
> German exclaves in Eastern Europe and ex-USSR.
>
> - cf. the medieval painting celebrity Albrecht Dürer (Durer, Duerer)
> from Nuremberg, his name would be a verbatim "'doorer', doorman" in
> Engl.; and was the mere translation from Hungarian Ajtós(i)
> /'ɔɪtoːʃ(ɪ)/, i.e., his Hungarian father's surname
>
> So Engl. door also has German kinship, basicly Tür/Dür/Döör.
> >Hmm, this reminds me of room/doom/gloom puzzle, I think doom
> >and gloom both had a middle 'r' later lost, room/do(r)om>/glo(r)om;
> >this would better match Mbuti mongolu dome ~ Malay mengelap darken
> >and Grk mela.
> NB: the usage of room in English has a restricted/limited range,
> as compared with the usage of its German kin _Raum_, which
> in general means "space" and "spaciousness".
>
> Even the adjective (which today is rarer and specialized, restricted
> in use) raum "spacious, open" (in forests) & "wide" (in sailors' jargon)
> <= Old High German rumi "spacious, wide"; cf. Goth. rums "spacious"
> <= Germanic *ruma "spacious", IE *reu- "wide, distant"
>
> another (modern) German adj. geräumig "spacious".
>
> noun Raum means
> - various types of "rooms" & "halls"
> - "space" (all kinds of it) in general;
> - "the outer space" = "Cosmos" (with its German synonym ... _All_).
> (along with "spatial") e.g. Raum & Zeit "Space and Time."
>
> As well as the noun Räumlichkeit, plural Räumlichkeiten, for
> the meaning "room, hall" etc, whenever it is not specified
> (usually in housing & realtors' contexts) what kind of
> dwelling, bureau, industrial roomings/spaces/halls. Any kind of
> them. (Also based on the old ... Raum. And the /au/ in it has
> been the development out of a long /u:/, e.g. very old German
> /rumi/ and the Raum (after the appropriate sound shift), which
> in English hasn't yet been diphtonged, /ru:m/ :-))
>
> As for drom-, look up the Greek word dromos/δρόμος (as well the Romani
> (Gypsy) equivalent thereof: drom), meaning "way, road, path(way),
> street, route, track."
>
> Tim

On Saturday, January 22, 2022 at 9:34:54 AM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> On Saturday, January 22, 2022 at 9:23:18 AM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> > On Friday, January 21, 2022 at 5:47:41 PM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> > > On Friday, January 21, 2022 at 4:30:08 PM UTC-5, Christian Weisgerber wrote:
> > > > On 2022-01-20, Tim Lang <m...@privacy.net> wrote:
> > > > > So Engl. door also has German kinship, basicly Tür/Dür/Döör.
> > > > According to Pfeifer, there are two closely related Germanic words,
> > > > one giving rise to German "Tür", Dutch "deur", Swedisch "dörr", and
> > > > the other one to English "door", German "Tor".
> > > > https://www.dwds.de/wb/etymwb/T%C3%BCr
> > > > --
> > > > Christian "naddy" Weisgerber na...@mips.inka.de
> > > I wondered about the etymology of gate, also Germanic source.
> > >
> > > Gate (n.)
> > > "opening, entrance," Old English geat (plural geatu) "gate, door, opening, passage, hinged framework barrier," from Proto-Germanic *gatan (source also of Old Norse gat "opening, passage," Old Saxon gat "eye of a needle, hole," Old Frisian gat "hole, opening," Dutch gat "gap, hole, breach," German Gasse "street, lane, alley"), of unknown origin.
> > >
> > > I suspect related to gather (open arms [gap] get & close/clasp) & aligns with mate/grid-grate/eat-ate, probably term for "doorway"?
> > >
> > > njambuanGDuaTlua?
> > Rather njuambuanGduATluA (thru.borne.hole, woambelle)
> > xyuambGATlachya (G insertion atypical, replaced u?, cf generate bereshit)
> Aside
> Cogenerate cognate cognition gnate gate grate mate date late
> mata@Mly: eye, stigmata, , stomata

Very interesting link between genus/genesis, (co)gnate, genu (knee) paternal version of generation has son touching father's knee, maternal version has birth.
https://oldeuropeanculture.blogspot.com/2022/01/si-amun.html

"In it I talked about the fact that the word for generation and the word for knee have the same root in many languages. Why?
Because of this: The English etymological dictionary says something interesting about the etymology of the word genus: "...could come from Latin genu (knee) from a supposed ancient custom of a father acknowledging paternity of a newborn by placing it on his knee..."

On Monday, January 24, 2022 at 6:43:18 PM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> On Saturday, January 22, 2022 at 9:34:54 AM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> > On Saturday, January 22, 2022 at 9:23:18 AM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> > > On Friday, January 21, 2022 at 5:47:41 PM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> > > > On Friday, January 21, 2022 at 4:30:08 PM UTC-5, Christian Weisgerber wrote:
> > > > > On 2022-01-20, Tim Lang <m...@privacy.net> wrote:
> > > > > > So Engl. door also has German kinship, basicly Tür/Dür/Döör.
> > > > > According to Pfeifer, there are two closely related Germanic words,
> > > > > one giving rise to German "Tür", Dutch "deur", Swedisch "dörr", and
> > > > > the other one to English "door", German "Tor".
> > > > > https://www.dwds.de/wb/etymwb/T%C3%BCr
> > > > > --
> > > > > Christian "naddy" Weisgerber na...@mips.inka.de
> > > > I wondered about the etymology of gate, also Germanic source.
> > > >
> > > > Gate (n.)
> > > > "opening, entrance," Old English geat (plural geatu) "gate, door, opening, passage, hinged framework barrier," from Proto-Germanic *gatan (source also of Old Norse gat "opening, passage," Old Saxon gat "eye of a needle, hole," Old Frisian gat "hole, opening," Dutch gat "gap, hole, breach," German Gasse "street, lane, alley"), of unknown origin.
> > > >
> > > > I suspect related to gather (open arms [gap] get & close/clasp) & aligns with mate/grid-grate/eat-ate, probably term for "doorway"?
> > > >
> > > > njambuanGDuaTlua?
> > > Rather njuambuanGduATluA (thru.borne.hole, woambelle)
> > > xyuambGATlachya (G insertion atypical, replaced u?, cf generate bereshit)
> > Aside
> > Cogenerate cognate cognition gnate gate grate mate date late
> > mata@Mly: eye, stigmata, , stomata
> Very interesting link between genus/genesis, (co)gnate, genu (knee) paternal version of generation has son touching father's knee, maternal version has birth.
> https://oldeuropeanculture.blogspot.com/2022/01/si-amun.html
>
> "In it I talked about the fact that the word for generation and the word for knee have the same root in many languages. Why?
> Because of this: The English etymological dictionary says something interesting about the etymology of the word genus: "...could come from Latin genu (knee) from a supposed ancient custom of a father acknowledging paternity of a newborn by placing it on his knee..."

https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/cognatus#Latin
Kinsman, sibling, co-generate

On Saturday, January 29, 2022 at 7:01:33 PM UTC-8, daud....@gmail.com wrote:
> On Monday, January 24, 2022 at 6:43:18 PM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> > On Saturday, January 22, 2022 at 9:34:54 AM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> > > On Saturday, January 22, 2022 at 9:23:18 AM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> > > > On Friday, January 21, 2022 at 5:47:41 PM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> > > > > On Friday, January 21, 2022 at 4:30:08 PM UTC-5, Christian Weisgerber wrote:
> > > > > > On 2022-01-20, Tim Lang <m...@privacy.net> wrote:
> > > > > > > So Engl. door also has German kinship, basicly Tür/Dür/Döör.
> > > > > > According to Pfeifer, there are two closely related Germanic words,
> > > > > > one giving rise to German "Tür", Dutch "deur", Swedisch "dörr", and
> > > > > > the other one to English "door", German "Tor".
> > > > > > https://www.dwds.de/wb/etymwb/T%C3%BCr
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > Christian "naddy" Weisgerber na...@mips.inka.de
> > > > > I wondered about the etymology of gate, also Germanic source.
> > > > >
> > > > > Gate (n.)
> > > > > "opening, entrance," Old English geat (plural geatu) "gate, door, opening, passage, hinged framework barrier," from Proto-Germanic *gatan (source also of Old Norse gat "opening, passage," Old Saxon gat "eye of a needle, hole," Old Frisian gat "hole, opening," Dutch gat "gap, hole, breach," German Gasse "street, lane, alley"), of unknown origin.
> > > > >
> > > > > I suspect related to gather (open arms [gap] get & close/clasp) & aligns with mate/grid-grate/eat-ate, probably term for "doorway"?
> > > > >
> > > > > njambuanGDuaTlua?
> > > > Rather njuambuanGduATluA (thru.borne.hole, woambelle)
> > > > xyuambGATlachya (G insertion atypical, replaced u?, cf generate bereshit)
> > > Aside
> > > Cogenerate cognate cognition gnate gate grate mate date late
> > > mata@Mly: eye, stigmata, , stomata
> > Very interesting link between genus/genesis, (co)gnate, genu (knee) paternal version of generation has son touching father's knee, maternal version has birth.
> > https://oldeuropeanculture.blogspot.com/2022/01/si-amun.html
> >
> > "In it I talked about the fact that the word for generation and the word for knee have the same root in many languages. Why?
> > Because of this: The English etymological dictionary says something interesting about the etymology of the word genus: "...could come from Latin genu (knee) from a supposed ancient custom of a father acknowledging paternity of a newborn by placing it on his knee..."
> https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/cognatus#Latin
> Kinsman, sibling, co-generate

This all seems stupid.

On Sunday, January 23, 2022 at 10:40:30 PM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> On Thursday, January 20, 2022 at 3:49:56 PM UTC-5, Tim Lang wrote:
> > On 20.01.2022 18:20, Daud Deden wrote:
> >
> Compare dear to door
>
> Dear, precious, valued, expensive
> Dorogo@Rus: dear
> Duur@Dut: dear
> Teuer@Grm: dear
> Dyr@Dan: dear

Is there an ancient tie-in between door and dear?

Yes likely, via the number two, 2 (s)ways, 2 mates
2 duo@Ltn, dua@Mly, zwei@Grm, two@Egl
Door@Egl, pin.tu@Mly, pintle@OE

> > >"My own preference of translating Duro- as ‘crossing’
> > >(and related to, or influenced by, Dutch door and German durch
> > >‘through’)
> > >durch, through & thorough: kinship => Gael. Þair, IE *ter-, *tr "through"
> >
> > And not only Dutch for "door", but also in German: die Tür, Türe, Dür,
> > Düre, Low German Döör /dœɐ̯ (??)/, Tia, Dia /tɪə, dɪə/ - or in a seeming-
> > ly more appropriate, narrow transcription /tiɐ̯, diɐ̯/, depending on
> > regional Germ. pronunciations. The standard German pronunciation Tür
> > /tyːɐ̯/.
> >
> > The pronunciation of the final -r- /r/ and /ʁ/ is rare; rather usual
> > in some areas of Southern (Alemanian-Suebian) and Northern Germany, and
> > esp. in Switzerland Alemanian and some (also Alemanian) areas of
> > Austria, as well as in the German regional varieties of still existing
> > German exclaves in Eastern Europe and ex-USSR.
> >
> > - cf. the medieval painting celebrity Albrecht Dürer (Durer, Duerer)
> > from Nuremberg, his name would be a verbatim "'doorer', doorman" in
> > Engl.; and was the mere translation from Hungarian Ajtós(i)
> > /'ɔɪtoːʃ(ɪ)/, i.e., his Hungarian father's surname
> >
> > So Engl. door also has German kinship, basicly Tür/Dür/Döör.
> > >Hmm, this reminds me of room/doom/gloom puzzle, I think doom
> > >and gloom both had a middle 'r' later lost, room/do(r)om>/glo(r)om;
> > >this would better match Mbuti mongolu dome ~ Malay mengelap darken
> > >and Grk mela.
> > NB: the usage of room in English has a restricted/limited range,
> > as compared with the usage of its German kin _Raum_, which
> > in general means "space" and "spaciousness".
> >
> > Even the adjective (which today is rarer and specialized, restricted
> > in use) raum "spacious, open" (in forests) & "wide" (in sailors' jargon)
> > <= Old High German rumi "spacious, wide"; cf. Goth. rums "spacious"
> > <= Germanic *ruma "spacious", IE *reu- "wide, distant"
> >
> > another (modern) German adj. geräumig "spacious".
> >
> > noun Raum means
> > - various types of "rooms" & "halls"
> > - "space" (all kinds of it) in general;
> > - "the outer space" = "Cosmos" (with its German synonym ... _All_).
> > (along with "spatial") e.g. Raum & Zeit "Space and Time."
> >
> > As well as the noun Räumlichkeit, plural Räumlichkeiten, for
> > the meaning "room, hall" etc, whenever it is not specified
> > (usually in housing & realtors' contexts) what kind of
> > dwelling, bureau, industrial roomings/spaces/halls. Any kind of
> > them. (Also based on the old ... Raum. And the /au/ in it has
> > been the development out of a long /u:/, e.g. very old German
> > /rumi/ and the Raum (after the appropriate sound shift), which
> > in English hasn't yet been diphtonged, /ru:m/ :-))
> >
> > As for drom-, look up the Greek word dromos/δρόμος (as well the Romani
> > (Gypsy) equivalent thereof: drom), meaning "way, road, path(way),
> > street, route, track."
> >
> > Tim

On Wednesday, February 2, 2022 at 4:37:55 PM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> On Sunday, January 23, 2022 at 10:40:30 PM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> > On Thursday, January 20, 2022 at 3:49:56 PM UTC-5, Tim Lang wrote:
> > > On 20.01.2022 18:20, Daud Deden wrote:
> > >
> > Compare dear to door
> >
> > Dear, precious, valued, expensive
> > Dorogo@Rus: dear
> > Duur@Dut: dear
> > Teuer@Grm: dear
> > Dyr@Dan: dear
>
> Is there an ancient tie-in between door and dear?
>
> Yes likely, via the number two, 2 (s)ways, 2 mates
> 2 duo@Ltn, dua@Mly, zwei@Grm, two@Egl
> Door@Egl, pin.tu@Mly, pintle@OE, puerto/portal

Shoji@Jpn: paper sliding door
Fusama@Jpn: sliding door

Tsukeshoin (a built-in table); this is also simply called 'shoin.'
Depth is created by the style of bay window, and shoin ranma (transom) and shoji (a paper sliding door) are placed in the back. Tokowaki: a space created at the opposite side of tsukeshoin across toko. Tokowakidana (decorative shelve arranged in the recess next to the decorative alcove) and fukurotodana (a small cupboard on the wall of a tokonoma) (shelve with fusuma, a sliding door) are placed

> > > >"My own preference of translating Duro- as ‘crossing’
> > > >(and related to, or influenced by, Dutch door and German durch
> > > >‘through’)
> > > >durch, through & thorough: kinship => Gael. Þair, IE *ter-, *tr "through"
> > >
> > > And not only Dutch for "door", but also in German: die Tür, Türe, Dür,
> > > Düre, Low German Döör /dœɐ̯ (??)/, Tia, Dia /tɪə, dɪə/ - or in a seeming-
> > > ly more appropriate, narrow transcription /tiɐ̯, diɐ̯/, depending on
> > > regional Germ. pronunciations. The standard German pronunciation Tür
> > > /tyːɐ̯/.
> > >
> > > The pronunciation of the final -r- /r/ and /ʁ/ is rare; rather usual
> > > in some areas of Southern (Alemanian-Suebian) and Northern Germany, and
> > > esp. in Switzerland Alemanian and some (also Alemanian) areas of
> > > Austria, as well as in the German regional varieties of still existing
> > > German exclaves in Eastern Europe and ex-USSR.
> > >
> > > - cf. the medieval painting celebrity Albrecht Dürer (Durer, Duerer)
> > > from Nuremberg, his name would be a verbatim "'doorer', doorman" in
> > > Engl.; and was the mere translation from Hungarian Ajtós(i)
> > > /'ɔɪtoːʃ(ɪ)/, i.e., his Hungarian father's surname
> > >
> > > So Engl. door also has German kinship, basicly Tür/Dür/Döör.
> > > >Hmm, this reminds me of room/doom/gloom puzzle, I think doom
> > > >and gloom both had a middle 'r' later lost, room/do(r)om>/glo(r)om;
> > > >this would better match Mbuti mongolu dome ~ Malay mengelap darken
> > > >and Grk mela.
> > > NB: the usage of room in English has a restricted/limited range,
> > > as compared with the usage of its German kin _Raum_, which
> > > in general means "space" and "spaciousness".
> > >
> > > Even the adjective (which today is rarer and specialized, restricted
> > > in use) raum "spacious, open" (in forests) & "wide" (in sailors' jargon)
> > > <= Old High German rumi "spacious, wide"; cf. Goth. rums "spacious"
> > > <= Germanic *ruma "spacious", IE *reu- "wide, distant"
> > >
> > > another (modern) German adj. geräumig "spacious".
> > >
> > > noun Raum means
> > > - various types of "rooms" & "halls"
> > > - "space" (all kinds of it) in general;
> > > - "the outer space" = "Cosmos" (with its German synonym ... _All_).
> > > (along with "spatial") e.g. Raum & Zeit "Space and Time."
> > >
> > > As well as the noun Räumlichkeit, plural Räumlichkeiten, for
> > > the meaning "room, hall" etc, whenever it is not specified
> > > (usually in housing & realtors' contexts) what kind of
> > > dwelling, bureau, industrial roomings/spaces/halls. Any kind of
> > > them. (Also based on the old ... Raum. And the /au/ in it has
> > > been the development out of a long /u:/, e.g. very old German
> > > /rumi/ and the Raum (after the appropriate sound shift), which
> > > in English hasn't yet been diphtonged, /ru:m/ :-))
> > >
> > > As for drom-, look up the Greek word dromos/δρόμος (as well the Romani
> > > (Gypsy) equivalent thereof: drom), meaning "way, road, path(way),
> > > street, route, track."
> > >
> > > Tim

On Wednesday, February 2, 2022 at 4:37:55 PM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> On Sunday, January 23, 2022 at 10:40:30 PM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> > On Thursday, January 20, 2022 at 3:49:56 PM UTC-5, Tim Lang wrote:
> > > On 20.01.2022 18:20, Daud Deden wrote:
> > >
> > Compare dear to door
> >
> > Dear, precious, valued, expensive
> > Dorogo@Rus: dear
> > Duur@Dut: dear
> > Teuer@Grm: dear
> > Dyr@Dan: dear
>
> Is there an ancient tie-in between door and dear?
>
> Yes likely, via the number two, 2 (s)ways, 2 mates
> 2 duo@Ltn, dua@Mly, zwei@Grm, two@Egl
> Door@Egl, pin.tu@Mly, pintle@OE

to some scholars, the dreidel developed from an Irish or English top introduced into Germany known as a teetotum
>
> In German this came to be called a trendel,
>
> The Yiddish word dreydl comes from the word dreyen ("to turn", compare to drehen, meaning the same in German). The Hebrew word sevivon comes from the Semitic root sbb ("to turn")[swivel] Hayyim Nahman Bialik used a different word, kirkar (from the root krkr – "to spin")
>
> Trendel@Grm: spinning top
> Dreydl@Yid: to turn
> Krkr@Hbr: to spin

In Hebrew, the word gilgul means "cycle" or "wheel"
https://g.co/kgs/NAXsXa

Looks similar to circle, and kirkar too looks similar.

> Tletl@Azt: firedrill Tla/flame + tl/dial drill twill
Spindle ~ ex + in/ndula@Mbuti: interior-enter
> Pintal@Mly: spin twist fiber

Hinged door swings in/out, turns left/right

> > > >"My own preference of translating Duro- as ‘crossing’
> > > >(and related to, or influenced by, Dutch door and German durch
> > > >‘through’)
> > > >durch, through & thorough: kinship => Gael. Þair, IE *ter-, *tr "through"
> > >
> > > And not only Dutch for "door", but also in German: die Tür, Türe, Dür,
> > > Düre, Low German Döör /dœɐ̯ (??)/, Tia, Dia /tɪə, dɪə/ - or in a seeming-
> > > ly more appropriate, narrow transcription /tiɐ̯, diɐ̯/, depending on
> > > regional Germ. pronunciations. The standard German pronunciation Tür
> > > /tyːɐ̯/.
> > >
> > > The pronunciation of the final -r- /r/ and /ʁ/ is rare; rather usual
> > > in some areas of Southern (Alemanian-Suebian) and Northern Germany, and
> > > esp. in Switzerland Alemanian and some (also Alemanian) areas of
> > > Austria, as well as in the German regional varieties of still existing
> > > German exclaves in Eastern Europe and ex-USSR.
> > >
> > > - cf. the medieval painting celebrity Albrecht Dürer (Durer, Duerer)
> > > from Nuremberg, his name would be a verbatim "'doorer', doorman" in
> > > Engl.; and was the mere translation from Hungarian Ajtós(i)
> > > /'ɔɪtoːʃ(ɪ)/, i.e., his Hungarian father's surname
> > >
> > > So Engl. door also has German kinship, basicly Tür/Dür/Döör.
> > > >Hmm, this reminds me of room/doom/gloom puzzle, I think doom
> > > >and gloom both had a middle 'r' later lost, room/do(r)om>/glo(r)om;
> > > >this would better match Mbuti mongolu dome ~ Malay mengelap darken
> > > >and Grk mela.
> > > NB: the usage of room in English has a restricted/limited range,
> > > as compared with the usage of its German kin _Raum_, which
> > > in general means "space" and "spaciousness".
> > >
> > > Even the adjective (which today is rarer and specialized, restricted
> > > in use) raum "spacious, open" (in forests) & "wide" (in sailors' jargon)
> > > <= Old High German rumi "spacious, wide"; cf. Goth. rums "spacious"
> > > <= Germanic *ruma "spacious", IE *reu- "wide, distant"
> > >
> > > another (modern) German adj. geräumig "spacious".
> > >
> > > noun Raum means
> > > - various types of "rooms" & "halls"
> > > - "space" (all kinds of it) in general;
> > > - "the outer space" = "Cosmos" (with its German synonym ... _All_).
> > > (along with "spatial") e.g. Raum & Zeit "Space and Time."
> > >
> > > As well as the noun Räumlichkeit, plural Räumlichkeiten, for
> > > the meaning "room, hall" etc, whenever it is not specified
> > > (usually in housing & realtors' contexts) what kind of
> > > dwelling, bureau, industrial roomings/spaces/halls. Any kind of
> > > them. (Also based on the old ... Raum. And the /au/ in it has
> > > been the development out of a long /u:/, e.g. very old German
> > > /rumi/ and the Raum (after the appropriate sound shift), which
> > > in English hasn't yet been diphtonged, /ru:m/ :-))
> > >
> > > As for drom-, look up the Greek word dromos/δρόμος (as well the Romani
> > > (Gypsy) equivalent thereof: drom), meaning "way, road, path(way),
> > > street, route, track."
> > >
> > > Tim

On Friday, February 4, 2022 at 10:56:15 PM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> On Wednesday, February 2, 2022 at 4:37:55 PM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> > On Sunday, January 23, 2022 at 10:40:30 PM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> > > On Thursday, January 20, 2022 at 3:49:56 PM UTC-5, Tim Lang wrote:
> > > > On 20.01.2022 18:20, Daud Deden wrote:
> > > >
> > > Compare dear to door
> > >
> > > Dear, precious, valued, expensive
> > > Dorogo@Rus: dear
> > > Duur@Dut: dear
> > > Teuer@Grm: dear
> > > Dyr@Dan: dear
> >
> > Is there an ancient tie-in between door and dear?
> >
> > Yes likely, via the number two, 2 (s)ways, 2 mates
> > 2 duo@Ltn, dua@Mly, zwei@Grm, two@Egl
> > Door@Egl, pin.tu@Mly, pintle@OE
> to some scholars, the dreidel developed from an Irish or English top introduced into Germany known as a teetotum
> >
> > In German this came to be called a trendel,
> >
> > The Yiddish word dreydl comes from the word dreyen ("to turn", compare to drehen, meaning the same in German). The Hebrew word sevivon comes from the Semitic root sbb ("to turn")[swivel] Hayyim Nahman Bialik used a different word, kirkar (from the root krkr – "to spin")
> >
> > Trendel@Grm: spinning top
> > Dreydl@Yid: to turn
> > Krkr@Hbr: to spin
> In Hebrew, the word gilgul means "cycle" or "wheel"
> https://g.co/kgs/NAXsXa
>
> Looks similar to circle, and kirkar too looks similar.
> > Tletl@Azt: firedrill Tla/flame + tl/dial drill twill
> Spindle ~ ex + in/ndula@Mbuti: interior-enter
> > Pintal@Mly: spin twist fiber
>
> Hinged door swings in/out, turns left/right

Is it coincidence that pintu can split as p(ivot) + into?

Is it coincidence that pintal can split as pin + tal/dalam: interior

Is it coincidence that 'pindah rumah' means to move (into) house?

Most likely a shared etymology, perhaps with -pend-.

> > > > >"My own preference of translating Duro- as ‘crossing’
> > > > >(and related to, or influenced by, Dutch door and German durch
> > > > >‘through’)
> > > > >durch, through & thorough: kinship => Gael. Þair, IE *ter-, *tr "through"
> > > >
> > > > And not only Dutch for "door", but also in German: die Tür, Türe, Dür,
> > > > Düre, Low German Döör /dœɐ̯ (??)/, Tia, Dia /tɪə, dɪə/ - or in a seeming-
> > > > ly more appropriate, narrow transcription /tiɐ̯, diɐ̯/, depending on
> > > > regional Germ. pronunciations. The standard German pronunciation Tür
> > > > /tyːɐ̯/.
> > > >
> > > > The pronunciation of the final -r- /r/ and /ʁ/ is rare; rather usual
> > > > in some areas of Southern (Alemanian-Suebian) and Northern Germany, and
> > > > esp. in Switzerland Alemanian and some (also Alemanian) areas of
> > > > Austria, as well as in the German regional varieties of still existing
> > > > German exclaves in Eastern Europe and ex-USSR.
> > > >
> > > > - cf. the medieval painting celebrity Albrecht Dürer (Durer, Duerer)
> > > > from Nuremberg, his name would be a verbatim "'doorer', doorman" in
> > > > Engl.; and was the mere translation from Hungarian Ajtós(i)
> > > > /'ɔɪtoːʃ(ɪ)/, i.e., his Hungarian father's surname
> > > >
> > > > So Engl. door also has German kinship, basicly Tür/Dür/Döör.
> > > > >Hmm, this reminds me of room/doom/gloom puzzle, I think doom
> > > > >and gloom both had a middle 'r' later lost, room/do(r)om>/glo(r)om;
> > > > >this would better match Mbuti mongolu dome ~ Malay mengelap darken
> > > > >and Grk mela.
> > > > NB: the usage of room in English has a restricted/limited range,
> > > > as compared with the usage of its German kin _Raum_, which
> > > > in general means "space" and "spaciousness".
> > > >
> > > > Even the adjective (which today is rarer and specialized, restricted
> > > > in use) raum "spacious, open" (in forests) & "wide" (in sailors' jargon)
> > > > <= Old High German rumi "spacious, wide"; cf. Goth. rums "spacious"
> > > > <= Germanic *ruma "spacious", IE *reu- "wide, distant"
> > > >
> > > > another (modern) German adj. geräumig "spacious".
> > > >
> > > > noun Raum means
> > > > - various types of "rooms" & "halls"
> > > > - "space" (all kinds of it) in general;
> > > > - "the outer space" = "Cosmos" (with its German synonym ... _All_).
> > > > (along with "spatial") e.g. Raum & Zeit "Space and Time."
> > > >
> > > > As well as the noun Räumlichkeit, plural Räumlichkeiten, for
> > > > the meaning "room, hall" etc, whenever it is not specified
> > > > (usually in housing & realtors' contexts) what kind of
> > > > dwelling, bureau, industrial roomings/spaces/halls. Any kind of
> > > > them. (Also based on the old ... Raum. And the /au/ in it has
> > > > been the development out of a long /u:/, e.g. very old German
> > > > /rumi/ and the Raum (after the appropriate sound shift), which
> > > > in English hasn't yet been diphtonged, /ru:m/ :-))
> > > >
> > > > As for drom-, look up the Greek word dromos/δρόμος (as well the Romani
> > > > (Gypsy) equivalent thereof: drom), meaning "way, road, path(way),
> > > > street, route, track."
> > > >
> > > > Tim

On Sunday, January 23, 2022 at 10:40:30 PM UTC-5, Daud Deden wrote:
> On Thursday, January 20, 2022 at 3:49:56 PM UTC-5, Tim Lang wrote:
> > On 20.01.2022 18:20, Daud Deden wrote:
> >
> Compare dear to door
>
> Dear, precious, valued, expensive
> Dorogo@Rus: dear
> Duur@Dut: dear
> Teuer@Ger: dear
> Dyr@Dan: dear

Tear(drip) vs tear(rip)(riparian?)
through/trough/trench/drench/drainage/dry/drought/draught/draft

> > >"My own preference of translating Duro- as ‘crossing’
> > >(and related to, or influenced by, Dutch door and German durch
> > >‘through’)
> > >durch, through & thorough: kinship => Gael. Þair, IE *ter-, *tr "through"
> >
> > And not only Dutch for "door", but also in German: die Tür, Türe, Dür,
> > Düre, Low German Döör /dœɐ̯ (??)/, Tia, Dia /tɪə, dɪə/ - or in a seeming-
> > ly more appropriate, narrow transcription /tiɐ̯, diɐ̯/, depending on
> > regional Germ. pronunciations. The standard German pronunciation Tür
> > /tyːɐ̯/.
> >
> > The pronunciation of the final -r- /r/ and /ʁ/ is rare; rather usual
> > in some areas of Southern (Alemanian-Suebian) and Northern Germany, and
> > esp. in Switzerland Alemanian and some (also Alemanian) areas of
> > Austria, as well as in the German regional varieties of still existing
> > German exclaves in Eastern Europe and ex-USSR.
> >
> > - cf. the medieval painting celebrity Albrecht Dürer (Durer, Duerer)
> > from Nuremberg, his name would be a verbatim "'doorer', doorman" in
> > Engl.; and was the mere translation from Hungarian Ajtós(i)
> > /'ɔɪtoːʃ(ɪ)/, i.e., his Hungarian father's surname
> >
> > So Engl. door also has German kinship, basicly Tür/Dür/Döör.
> > >Hmm, this reminds me of room/doom/gloom puzzle, I think doom
> > >and gloom both had a middle 'r' later lost, room/do(r)om>/glo(r)om;
> > >this would better match Mbuti mongolu dome ~ Malay mengelap darken
> > >and Grk mela.
> > NB: the usage of room in English has a restricted/limited range,
> > as compared with the usage of its German kin _Raum_, which
> > in general means "space" and "spaciousness".
> >
> > Even the adjective (which today is rarer and specialized, restricted
> > in use) raum "spacious, open" (in forests) & "wide" (in sailors' jargon)
> > <= Old High German rumi "spacious, wide"; cf. Goth. rums "spacious"
> > <= Germanic *ruma "spacious", IE *reu- "wide, distant"
> >
> > another (modern) German adj. geräumig "spacious".
> >
> > noun Raum means
> > - various types of "rooms" & "halls"
> > - "space" (all kinds of it) in general;
> > - "the outer space" = "Cosmos" (with its German synonym ... _All_).
> > (along with "spatial") e.g. Raum & Zeit "Space and Time."
> >
> > As well as the noun Räumlichkeit, plural Räumlichkeiten, for
> > the meaning "room, hall" etc, whenever it is not specified
> > (usually in housing & realtors' contexts) what kind of
> > dwelling, bureau, industrial roomings/spaces/halls. Any kind of
> > them. (Also based on the old ... Raum. And the /au/ in it has
> > been the development out of a long /u:/, e.g. very old German
> > /rumi/ and the Raum (after the appropriate sound shift), which
> > in English hasn't yet been diphtonged, /ru:m/ :-))
> >
> > As for drom-, look up the Greek word dromos/δρόμος (as well the Romani
> > (Gypsy) equivalent thereof: drom), meaning "way, road, path(way),
> > street, route, track."
> >
> > Tim