For quite a while I've been trying to sort out lots of issues with a
Toyota 3SGE Beams engine fitted to a Lotus 7 replica.
It was down on power and has a misfire at light throttle around
2500-3000rpm.
We found and fixed the low power problem which was a combination of a
faulty exhaust VVT actuator and a restricted exhaust and now its making
pretty much specified power but the miss still exists.
At WOT it pulls like a train and performs very well but at part throttle
it runs rough.
Compression and leak down tests all good and it has new spark plugs.
It has coil on plug ignition and a Link aftermarket ECU which isn't
showing any fault codes.
I have my own theory as to the cause of the problem but I want other
opinions, hint if I'm right the cost of the fix will be about $500.

--
Daryl

On 30/01/2022 7:43 pm, Daryl wrote:
> For quite a while I've been trying to sort out lots of issues with a
> Toyota 3SGE Beams engine fitted to a Lotus 7 replica.

Sounds like you need a good mechanic.

> It was down on power and has a misfire at light throttle around
> 2500-3000rpm.
> We found and fixed the low power problem which was a combination of a
> faulty exhaust VVT actuator and a restricted exhaust and now its making
> pretty much specified power but the miss still exists.
> At WOT it pulls like a train and performs very well but at part throttle
> it runs rough.
> Compression and leak down tests all good and it has new spark plugs.
> It has coil on plug ignition and a Link aftermarket ECU which isn't
> showing any fault codes.
> I have my own theory as to the cause of the problem but I want other
> opinions, hint if I'm right the cost of the fix will be about $500.
>
>

Not a lot of detail on the setup. MAF sensor?

On 30/01/2022 10:43 pm, Daryl wrote:

> For quite a while I've been trying to sort out lots of issues with a
> Toyota 3SGE Beams engine fitted to a Lotus 7 replica.
> It was down on power and has a misfire at light throttle around
> 2500-3000rpm.
> We found and fixed the low power problem which was a combination of a
> faulty exhaust VVT actuator and a restricted exhaust and now its making
> pretty much specified power but the miss still exists.
> At WOT it pulls like a train and performs very well but at part throttle
> it runs rough.
> Compression and leak down tests all good and it has new spark plugs.
> It has coil on plug ignition and a Link aftermarket ECU which isn't
> showing any fault codes.
> I have my own theory as to the cause of the problem but I want other
> opinions, hint if I'm right the cost of the fix will be about $500.

Difficult to say based on the somewhat limited amount of information.

When you say it has a "misfire", does it feel like an irregular
combustion stumble or one of the spark dropping out completely?

Does it do it all the time or just under load?

What do the plugs look like?

Presumably you've had test equipment on the injectors to make sure the
pulse pattern is okay.

I'm not familiar with the engine so it's a little hard to say without
being there putting my hands on it. Perhaps we should ask Krypsis? He's
the resident expert of all things automotive :)

No Googling now Kryppy :)

--
--
--
Regards,
Noddy.

On 31/1/22 7:50 am, Noddy wrote:
> On 30/01/2022 10:43 pm, Daryl wrote:
>
>> For quite a while I've been trying to sort out lots of issues with a
>> Toyota 3SGE Beams engine fitted to a Lotus 7 replica.
>> It was down on power and has a misfire at light throttle around
>> 2500-3000rpm.
>> We found and fixed the low power problem which was a combination of a
>> faulty exhaust VVT actuator and a restricted exhaust and now its
>> making pretty much specified power but the miss still exists.
>> At WOT it pulls like a train and performs very well but at part
>> throttle it runs rough.
>> Compression and leak down tests all good and it has new spark plugs.
>> It has coil on plug ignition and a Link aftermarket ECU which isn't
>> showing any fault codes.
>> I have my own theory as to the cause of the problem but I want other
>> opinions, hint if I'm right the cost of the fix will be about $500.
>
> Difficult to say based on the somewhat limited amount of information.
>
> When you say it has a "misfire", does it feel like an irregular
> combustion stumble or one of the spark dropping out completely?

Difficult to tell, I'm thinking its spark related.
>
> Does it do it all the time or just under load?

Generally light load, light throttle.
>
> What do the plugs look like?

Haven't looked recently but previously one plug looks darker than the
others, early in the piece we replaced one coil pack.
Moving the coil pack changed which plug was dark but its firing on all
cylinders at WOT.

>
> Presumably you've had test equipment on the injectors to make sure the
> pulse pattern is okay.

Injectors have been removed, cleaned and tested.
>
> I'm not familiar with the engine so it's a little hard to say without
> being there putting my hands on it. Perhaps we should ask Krypsis? He's
> the resident expert of all things automotive :)
>
> No Googling now Kryppy :)

What's interesting is that it was a genuine real question and only you
replied with helpful ideas/questions, I wonder why that is so:-)

--
Daryl

On 31/01/2022 11:41 am, Daryl wrote:
> On 31/1/22 7:50 am, Noddy wrote:
>> On 30/01/2022 10:43 pm, Daryl wrote:
>>
>>> For quite a while I've been trying to sort out lots of issues with a
>>> Toyota 3SGE Beams engine fitted to a Lotus 7 replica.
>>> It was down on power and has a misfire at light throttle around
>>> 2500-3000rpm.
>>> We found and fixed the low power problem which was a combination of a
>>> faulty exhaust VVT actuator and a restricted exhaust and now its
>>> making pretty much specified power but the miss still exists.
>>> At WOT it pulls like a train and performs very well but at part
>>> throttle it runs rough.
>>> Compression and leak down tests all good and it has new spark plugs.
>>> It has coil on plug ignition and a Link aftermarket ECU which isn't
>>> showing any fault codes.
>>> I have my own theory as to the cause of the problem but I want other
>>> opinions, hint if I'm right the cost of the fix will be about $500.
>>
>> Difficult to say based on the somewhat limited amount of information.
>>
>> When you say it has a "misfire", does it feel like an irregular
>> combustion stumble or one of the spark dropping out completely?
>
> Difficult to tell, I'm thinking its spark related.
>>
>> Does it do it all the time or just under load?
>
> Generally light load, light throttle.
>>
>> What do the plugs look like?
>
> Haven't looked recently but previously one plug looks darker than the
> others, early in the piece we replaced one coil pack.
> Moving the coil pack changed which plug was dark but its firing on all
> cylinders at WOT.

A plug colour that follows an ignition coil sounds like a situation that
needs further investigating.

Where are the gaps at?

>> I'm not familiar with the engine so it's a little hard to say without
>> being there putting my hands on it. Perhaps we should ask Krypsis?
>> He's the resident expert of all things automotive :)
>>
>> No Googling now Kryppy :)
>
> What's interesting is that it was a genuine real question and only you
> replied with helpful ideas/questions, I wonder why that is so:-)

I would imagine it has a lot to do with the resident FLC experts being
too busy doing complex work like fitting snorkels and mudflaps while
they contemplate the idea of plastic coated windscreens, or sitting in
their little house garage having detailed conversations with their
collection of tupperware containers while they invent fictitious
"workshop foremen" to spend time helping out with a genuine automotive
question :)

Anyway, getting back to the car. You mentioned that it has an
after-market ECU, and I was wondering if it allows you to change the
fuel map over a given rev range? A lot of low rpm stumbles are caused by
lean conditions, and that's especially so in cases where engines get on
the cam pretty hard. As I said earlier I'm not familiar with this
particular engine, but one thing I would try if you're able to is to
fatten the injector pulse a little in the rpm range where the problem
occurs and see what effect it has.

Another thing I would try is to pull the plug gaps back a little bit to
see if that helps with a possible marginal coil output. I know you said
the thing is running pretty much on song in the top end, but their may
just be a particular cycle down lower that the coil doesn't like. You
don't need to go far. 2 to 4 thousandths would be enough if it's going
to do anything.

--
--
--
Regards,
Noddy.

On Mon, 31 Jan 2022 11:41:31 +1100, Daryl wrote:

>
> What's interesting is that it was a genuine real question and only you
> replied with helpful ideas/questions, I wonder why that is so:-)

The source of Matt Groening's inspiration for Homer Simpson is revealed...

alvey

--
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

On 31/1/22 12:23 pm, Noddy wrote:
> On 31/01/2022 11:41 am, Daryl wrote:
>> On 31/1/22 7:50 am, Noddy wrote:
>>> On 30/01/2022 10:43 pm, Daryl wrote:
>>>
>>>> For quite a while I've been trying to sort out lots of issues with a
>>>> Toyota 3SGE Beams engine fitted to a Lotus 7 replica.
>>>> It was down on power and has a misfire at light throttle around
>>>> 2500-3000rpm.
>>>> We found and fixed the low power problem which was a combination of
>>>> a faulty exhaust VVT actuator and a restricted exhaust and now its
>>>> making pretty much specified power but the miss still exists.
>>>> At WOT it pulls like a train and performs very well but at part
>>>> throttle it runs rough.
>>>> Compression and leak down tests all good and it has new spark plugs.
>>>> It has coil on plug ignition and a Link aftermarket ECU which isn't
>>>> showing any fault codes.
>>>> I have my own theory as to the cause of the problem but I want other
>>>> opinions, hint if I'm right the cost of the fix will be about $500.
>>>
>>> Difficult to say based on the somewhat limited amount of information.
>>>
>>> When you say it has a "misfire", does it feel like an irregular
>>> combustion stumble or one of the spark dropping out completely?
>>
>> Difficult to tell, I'm thinking its spark related.
>>>
>>> Does it do it all the time or just under load?
>>
>> Generally light load, light throttle.
>>>
>>> What do the plugs look like?
>>
>> Haven't looked recently but previously one plug looks darker than the
>> others, early in the piece we replaced one coil pack.
>> Moving the coil pack changed which plug was dark but its firing on all
>> cylinders at WOT.
>
> A plug colour that follows an ignition coil sounds like a situation that
> needs further investigating.
>
> Where are the gaps at?
>
>>> I'm not familiar with the engine so it's a little hard to say without
>>> being there putting my hands on it. Perhaps we should ask Krypsis?
>>> He's the resident expert of all things automotive :)
>>>
>>> No Googling now Kryppy :)
>>
>> What's interesting is that it was a genuine real question and only you
>> replied with helpful ideas/questions, I wonder why that is so:-)
>
> I would imagine it has a lot to do with the resident FLC experts being
> too busy doing complex work like fitting snorkels and mudflaps while
> they contemplate the idea of plastic coated windscreens, or sitting in
> their little house garage having detailed conversations with their
> collection of tupperware containers while they invent fictitious
> "workshop foremen" to spend time helping out with a genuine automotive
> question :)

LOL.
>
> Anyway, getting back to the car. You mentioned that it has an
> after-market ECU, and I was wondering if it allows you to change the
> fuel map over a given rev range?

Yes, everything is adjustable.

A lot of low rpm stumbles are caused by
> lean conditions, and that's especially so in cases where engines get on
> the cam pretty hard. As I said earlier I'm not familiar with this
> particular engine, but one thing I would try if you're able to is to
> fatten the injector pulse a little in the rpm range where the problem
> occurs and see what effect it has.

The VVT on the Beams engine is constantly variable through most of the
rev range unlike a Honda Vtec which only works at higher RPM.
Because most people who race those engines remove the VVT we were able
to get plenty of VVT bits for nothing, when it was dynoed the first time
the tuner commented that he didn't think teh exhaust cam was doing what
it supposed to which is why we changed it.
Because there are 7 things the T belt goes around its also possible that
I may have installed the T belt one tooth out, its a PITA to get right
but its making the correct power numbers now so that's all good.
It was on a dyno on a week or so ago and it was lean in a few spots
which was corrected but the problem persists.
>
> Another thing I would try is to pull the plug gaps back a little bit to
> see if that helps with a possible marginal coil output. I know you said
> the thing is running pretty much on song in the top end, but their may
> just be a particular cycle down lower that the coil doesn't like. You
> don't need to go far. 2 to 4 thousandths would be enough if it's going
> to do anything.
>
Good idea with the plug gaps, I will give that a try.

--
Daryl

On 31/01/2022 1:10 pm, Daryl wrote:
> On 31/1/22 12:23 pm, Noddy wrote:

> The VVT on the Beams engine is constantly variable through most of the
> rev range unlike a Honda Vtec which only works at higher RPM.
> Because most people who race those engines remove the VVT we were able
> to get plenty of VVT bits for nothing, when it was dynoed the first time
> the tuner commented that he didn't think teh exhaust cam was doing what
> it supposed to which is why we changed it.
> Because there are 7 things the T belt goes around its also possible that
> I may have installed the T belt one tooth out, its a PITA to get right
> but its making the correct power numbers now so that's all good.

Might be worth checking that just in case, but I doubt that it's the
cause of the problem.

> It was on a dyno on a week or so ago and it was lean in a few spots
> which was corrected but the problem persists.

Okay, well that pretty much lets the fuel system off the hook.

>> Another thing I would try is to pull the plug gaps back a little bit
>> to see if that helps with a possible marginal coil output. I know you
>> said the thing is running pretty much on song in the top end, but
>> their may just be a particular cycle down lower that the coil doesn't
>> like. You don't need to go far. 2 to 4 thousandths would be enough if
>> it's going to do anything.
>>
> Good idea with the plug gaps, I will give that a try.

No guarantee that it'll be the fix, but it's worth checking nonetheless.
Especially in light of your comment about a dark plug following a
suspect coil around.

--
--
--
Regards,
Noddy.

On 31/01/2022 10:01 am, alvey wrote:
> On Mon, 31 Jan 2022 11:41:31 +1100, Daryl wrote:
>
>>
>> What's interesting is that it was a genuine real question and only you
>> replied with helpful ideas/questions, I wonder why that is so:-)
>
> The source of Matt Groening's inspiration for Homer Simpson is revealed...
>
>
>
> alvey
>

Talk about 'Dumb and Dumber' personified.

From a mechanics perspective I can only laugh at these two clueless
twits fumbling around in the dark looking for a clue :-)

On 31/01/2022 3:13 pm, Clocky wrote:
> On 31/01/2022 10:01 am, alvey wrote:
>> On Mon, 31 Jan 2022 11:41:31 +1100, Daryl wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> What's interesting is that it was a genuine real question and only you
>>> replied with helpful ideas/questions, I wonder why that is so:-)
>>
>> The source of Matt Groening's inspiration for Homer Simpson is
>> revealed...
>>
>>
>>
>> alvey
>>
>
> Talk about 'Dumb and Dumber' personified.
>
> From a mechanics perspective I can only laugh at these two clueless
> twits fumbling around in the dark looking for a clue :-)

Yet instead of helping like a decent human being you choose the low
path. Shows your character really well.

So as the brilliant mechanic you think you are, what are your
suggestions of issues that might be causing the issue, or do you need a
scan tool to diagnose it...

On 31/1/2022 4:37 pm, Grumpy Tech wrote:
> On 31/01/2022 3:13 pm, Clocky wrote:
>> On 31/01/2022 10:01 am, alvey wrote:
>>> On Mon, 31 Jan 2022 11:41:31 +1100, Daryl wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> What's interesting is that it was a genuine real question and only you
>>>> replied with helpful ideas/questions, I wonder why that is so:-)
>>>
>>> The source of Matt Groening's inspiration for Homer Simpson is
>>> revealed...
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> alvey
>>>
>>
>> Talk about 'Dumb and Dumber' personified.
>>
>>  From a mechanics perspective I can only laugh at these two clueless
>> twits fumbling around in the dark looking for a clue :-)
>
> Yet instead of helping like a decent human being you choose the low
> path. Shows your character really well.
>
> So as the brilliant mechanic you think you are, what are your
> suggestions of issues that might be causing the issue, or do you need a
> scan tool to diagnose it...

The car is in Daryl's hands. Anyone else not present and with scant
information and no access will just be guessing. Daryl knows what the
car is equipped with. He knows what mods have been made. He knows what
has been tested thus far. He can do the requisite tests and obtain
relevant results. He has the new you beaut $800 scan tool he recently
bought so he has the gear to do in-depth testing. What he doesn't have
is the depth of theoretical understanding that is a prerequisite for
understanding what said $800 scan tool is telling him. What he should
also have on hand is a digital oscilloscope and a wideband O2 sensor -
just for a start. Then he could trundle on down the road and *see* what
is going on in that engine. As it is, all he is doing is *guessing*.
Trying to diagnose a car without comprehensive test equipment is just
fumbling in the dark and leaves you having to swap parts out one by one.
Having the test equipment and not knowing what it is telling you - well,
that's just plain stupid. It seems like "stupid" is a contagious disease
in the Bacchus Marsh area, lots of it going round over there. Worse than
Covid - because it appears to be *lifelong*.

--
Xeno

Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)

On 31/01/2022 4:37 pm, Grumpy Tech wrote:
> On 31/01/2022 3:13 pm, Clocky wrote:

>>  From a mechanics perspective I can only laugh at these two clueless
>> twits fumbling around in the dark looking for a clue :-)
>
> Yet instead of helping like a decent human being you choose the low
> path. Shows your character really well.

Laughing is about all he can do, as there is little else he's capable of.

> So as the brilliant mechanic you think you are, what are your
> suggestions of issues that might be causing the issue, or do you need a
> scan tool to diagnose it...

That'd be about it. He's typical of today's stream of "dealer techs". No
idea what to do unless he can plug the car into a computer and have it
tell him what's wrong.

This is why very little gets repaired any more.

--
--
--
Regards,
Noddy.

On Monday, 31 January 2022 at 17:04:47 UTC+11, Xeno wrote:
> On 31/1/2022 4:37 pm, Grumpy Tech wrote:
> > On 31/01/2022 3:13 pm, Clocky wrote:
> >> On 31/01/2022 10:01 am, alvey wrote:
> >>> On Mon, 31 Jan 2022 11:41:31 +1100, Daryl wrote:
> >>>
> >>>>
> >>>> What's interesting is that it was a genuine real question and only you
> >>>> replied with helpful ideas/questions, I wonder why that is so:-)
> >>>
> >>> The source of Matt Groening's inspiration for Homer Simpson is
> >>> revealed...
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> alvey
> >>>
> >>
> >> Talk about 'Dumb and Dumber' personified.
> >>
> >> From a mechanics perspective I can only laugh at these two clueless
> >> twits fumbling around in the dark looking for a clue :-)
> >
> > Yet instead of helping like a decent human being you choose the low
> > path. Shows your character really well.
> >
> > So as the brilliant mechanic you think you are, what are your
> > suggestions of issues that might be causing the issue, or do you need a
> > scan tool to diagnose it...
> The car is in Daryl's hands. Anyone else not present and with scant
> information and no access will just be guessing. Daryl knows what the
> car is equipped with. He knows what mods have been made. He knows what
> has been tested thus far. He can do the requisite tests and obtain
> relevant results. He has the new you beaut $800 scan tool he recently
> bought so he has the gear to do in-depth testing. What he doesn't have
> is the depth of theoretical understanding that is a prerequisite for
> understanding what said $800 scan tool is telling him. What he should
> also have on hand is a digital oscilloscope and a wideband O2 sensor -
> just for a start. Then he could trundle on down the road and *see* what
> is going on in that engine. As it is, all he is doing is *guessing*.
> Trying to diagnose a car without comprehensive test equipment is just
> fumbling in the dark and leaves you having to swap parts out one by one.
> Having the test equipment and not knowing what it is telling you - well,
> that's just plain stupid. It seems like "stupid" is a contagious disease
> in the Bacchus Marsh area, lots of it going round over there. Worse than
> Covid - because it appears to be *lifelong*.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Come in spinner!.......Right on cue. Hahahaha..
>
> --
> Xeno
>
>
> Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
> (with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)

On 31/1/22 4:37 pm, Grumpy Tech wrote:
> On 31/01/2022 3:13 pm, Clocky wrote:
>> On 31/01/2022 10:01 am, alvey wrote:
>>> On Mon, 31 Jan 2022 11:41:31 +1100, Daryl wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> What's interesting is that it was a genuine real question and only you
>>>> replied with helpful ideas/questions, I wonder why that is so:-)
>>>
>>> The source of Matt Groening's inspiration for Homer Simpson is
>>> revealed...
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> alvey
>>>
>>
>> Talk about 'Dumb and Dumber' personified.
>>
>>  From a mechanics perspective I can only laugh at these two clueless
>> twits fumbling around in the dark looking for a clue :-)
>
> Yet instead of helping like a decent human being you choose the low
> path. Shows your character really well.

Sad but true.
If he had a clue he could just offer a suggestion or he could just be a
dick, too bad he choose the later.
>
> So as the brilliant mechanic you think you are, what are your
> suggestions of issues that might be causing the issue, or do you need a
> scan tool to diagnose it...

I'd like to see him try and plug in his scan tool into the car in
question, there is a USB cable in the glove box that connects to the ECU
but no OBD2 port.
I can connect to the ECU because I have the correct tool and there are
no fault codes.

--
Daryl

On 31/01/2022 5:04 pm, Xeno wrote:
> On 31/1/2022 4:37 pm, Grumpy Tech wrote:
>> On 31/01/2022 3:13 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>> On 31/01/2022 10:01 am, alvey wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 31 Jan 2022 11:41:31 +1100, Daryl wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> What's interesting is that it was a genuine real question and only
>>>>> you
>>>>> replied with helpful ideas/questions, I wonder why that is so:-)
>>>>
>>>> The source of Matt Groening's inspiration for Homer Simpson is
>>>> revealed...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> alvey
>>>>
>>>
>>> Talk about 'Dumb and Dumber' personified.
>>>
>>>  From a mechanics perspective I can only laugh at these two clueless
>>> twits fumbling around in the dark looking for a clue :-)
>>
>> Yet instead of helping like a decent human being you choose the low
>> path. Shows your character really well.
>>
>> So as the brilliant mechanic you think you are, what are your
>> suggestions of issues that might be causing the issue, or do you need
>> a scan tool to diagnose it...
>
> The car is in Daryl's hands. Anyone else not present and with scant
> information and no access will just be guessing. Daryl knows what the
> car is equipped with. He knows what mods have been made. He knows what
> has been tested thus far. He can do the requisite tests and obtain
> relevant results. He has the new you beaut $800 scan tool he recently
> bought so he has the gear to do in-depth testing. What he doesn't have
> is the depth of theoretical understanding that is a prerequisite for
> understanding what said $800 scan tool is telling him. What he should
> also have on hand is a digital oscilloscope and a wideband O2 sensor -
> just for a start. Then he could trundle on down the road and *see*
> what is going on in that engine. As it is, all he is doing is
> *guessing*. Trying to diagnose a car without comprehensive test
> equipment is just fumbling in the dark and leaves you having to swap
> parts out one by one. Having the test equipment and not knowing what
> it is telling you - well, that's just plain stupid. It seems like
> "stupid" is a contagious disease in the Bacchus Marsh area, lots of it
> going round over there. Worse than Covid - because it appears to be
> *lifelong*.
>

I don't disagree.  however, it's possible there may be lifelong
consequences from covid. we just don't know yet. possibly the virus may
remain in your body like some others do.

--
https://tinyurl.com/Yosemite-Sam
"my own words are irrelevant"
-noddy 5/08/2017 4:12 PM

On 31/1/22 5:29 pm, jonz@ nothere.com wrote:
> On Monday, 31 January 2022 at 17:04:47 UTC+11, Xeno wrote:
>> On 31/1/2022 4:37 pm, Grumpy Tech wrote:
>>> On 31/01/2022 3:13 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>>> On 31/01/2022 10:01 am, alvey wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, 31 Jan 2022 11:41:31 +1100, Daryl wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What's interesting is that it was a genuine real question and only you
>>>>>> replied with helpful ideas/questions, I wonder why that is so:-)
>>>>>
>>>>> The source of Matt Groening's inspiration for Homer Simpson is
>>>>> revealed...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> alvey
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Talk about 'Dumb and Dumber' personified.
>>>>
>>>> From a mechanics perspective I can only laugh at these two clueless
>>>> twits fumbling around in the dark looking for a clue :-)
>>>
>>> Yet instead of helping like a decent human being you choose the low
>>> path. Shows your character really well.
>>>
>>> So as the brilliant mechanic you think you are, what are your
>>> suggestions of issues that might be causing the issue, or do you need a
>>> scan tool to diagnose it...
>> The car is in Daryl's hands. Anyone else not present and with scant
>> information and no access will just be guessing. Daryl knows what the
>> car is equipped with. He knows what mods have been made. He knows what
>> has been tested thus far. He can do the requisite tests and obtain
>> relevant results. He has the new you beaut $800 scan tool he recently
>> bought so he has the gear to do in-depth testing. What he doesn't have
>> is the depth of theoretical understanding that is a prerequisite for
>> understanding what said $800 scan tool is telling him. What he should
>> also have on hand is a digital oscilloscope and a wideband O2 sensor -
>> just for a start. Then he could trundle on down the road and *see* what
>> is going on in that engine. As it is, all he is doing is *guessing*.
>> Trying to diagnose a car without comprehensive test equipment is just
>> fumbling in the dark and leaves you having to swap parts out one by one.
>> Having the test equipment and not knowing what it is telling you - well,
>> that's just plain stupid. It seems like "stupid" is a contagious disease
>> in the Bacchus Marsh area, lots of it going round over there. Worse than
>> Covid - because it appears to be *lifelong*.
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Come in spinner!.......Right on cue. Hahahaha..

He has no clue so the best he can do is ignore the question and have a
go at me for asking, pathetic really.
I already said that I had good idea what the problem is but the car is
back with the owner so I can't even test my theory.
I'll help Xeno out, imagine a similar issue on an engine that was pre
electronics, you can still use a scope on older engines but few people
had them so they just used their brains, a multi meter will be the only
tool you need to find the problem.

--
Daryl

On 31/01/2022 5:29 pm, jonz@ nothere.com wrote:
> On Monday, 31 January 2022 at 17:04:47 UTC+11, Xeno wrote:
>> On 31/1/2022 4:37 pm, Grumpy Tech wrote:
>>> On 31/01/2022 3:13 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>>> On 31/01/2022 10:01 am, alvey wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, 31 Jan 2022 11:41:31 +1100, Daryl wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What's interesting is that it was a genuine real question and only you
>>>>>> replied with helpful ideas/questions, I wonder why that is so:-)
>>>>>
>>>>> The source of Matt Groening's inspiration for Homer Simpson is
>>>>> revealed...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> alvey
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Talk about 'Dumb and Dumber' personified.
>>>>
>>>> From a mechanics perspective I can only laugh at these two clueless
>>>> twits fumbling around in the dark looking for a clue :-)
>>>
>>> Yet instead of helping like a decent human being you choose the low
>>> path. Shows your character really well.
>>>
>>> So as the brilliant mechanic you think you are, what are your
>>> suggestions of issues that might be causing the issue, or do you need a
>>> scan tool to diagnose it...
>> The car is in Daryl's hands. Anyone else not present and with scant
>> information and no access will just be guessing. Daryl knows what the
>> car is equipped with. He knows what mods have been made. He knows what
>> has been tested thus far. He can do the requisite tests and obtain
>> relevant results. He has the new you beaut $800 scan tool he recently
>> bought so he has the gear to do in-depth testing. What he doesn't have
>> is the depth of theoretical understanding that is a prerequisite for
>> understanding what said $800 scan tool is telling him. What he should
>> also have on hand is a digital oscilloscope and a wideband O2 sensor -
>> just for a start. Then he could trundle on down the road and *see* what
>> is going on in that engine. As it is, all he is doing is *guessing*.
>> Trying to diagnose a car without comprehensive test equipment is just
>> fumbling in the dark and leaves you having to swap parts out one by one.
>> Having the test equipment and not knowing what it is telling you - well,
>> that's just plain stupid. It seems like "stupid" is a contagious disease
>> in the Bacchus Marsh area, lots of it going round over there. Worse than
>> Covid - because it appears to be *lifelong*.
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Come in spinner!.......Right on cue. Hahahaha..

Yep. *lots* of noise, but zero substance. About all you'd expect from an
attention seeking personality complex who has been completely irrelevant
to *anything* for the last 25 years :)

--
--
--
Regards,
Noddy.

On 31/01/2022 4:34 pm, Daryl wrote:
> On 31/1/22 4:37 pm, Grumpy Tech wrote:
>> On 31/01/2022 3:13 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>> On 31/01/2022 10:01 am, alvey wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 31 Jan 2022 11:41:31 +1100, Daryl wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> What's interesting is that it was a genuine real question and only you
>>>>> replied with helpful ideas/questions, I wonder why that is so:-)
>>>>
>>>> The source of Matt Groening's inspiration for Homer Simpson is
>>>> revealed...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> alvey
>>>>
>>>
>>> Talk about 'Dumb and Dumber' personified.
>>>
>>>  From a mechanics perspective I can only laugh at these two clueless
>>> twits fumbling around in the dark looking for a clue :-)
>>
>> Yet instead of helping like a decent human being you choose the low
>> path. Shows your character really well.
>
> Sad but true.
> If he had a clue he could just offer a suggestion or he could just be a
> dick, too bad he choose the later.

Well he always claims to be the 'better' person so here's his chance to
prove it.
>>
>> So as the brilliant mechanic you think you are, what are your
>> suggestions of issues that might be causing the issue, or do you need
>> a scan tool to diagnose it...
>
> I'd like to see him try and plug in his scan tool into the car in
> question, there is a USB cable in the glove box that connects to the ECU
> but no OBD2 port.
> I can connect to the ECU because I have the correct tool and there are
> no fault codes.

I'm amazed at some of the new control systems that are coming out where
they have sensors everywhere. Even with those they can have issues not
showing in the systems. There's Haltech, HP Tuners, and Holley that I've
seen on the channels I watch, I'm sure there's others as well.

On 31/01/2022 1:37 pm, Grumpy Tech wrote:
> On 31/01/2022 3:13 pm, Clocky wrote:
>> On 31/01/2022 10:01 am, alvey wrote:
>>> On Mon, 31 Jan 2022 11:41:31 +1100, Daryl wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> What's interesting is that it was a genuine real question and only you
>>>> replied with helpful ideas/questions, I wonder why that is so:-)
>>>
>>> The source of Matt Groening's inspiration for Homer Simpson is
>>> revealed...
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> alvey
>>>
>>
>> Talk about 'Dumb and Dumber' personified.
>>
>>  From a mechanics perspective I can only laugh at these two clueless
>> twits fumbling around in the dark looking for a clue :-)
>
> Yet instead of helping like a decent human being you choose the low
> path. Shows your character really well.
>

Continue your character assassination and defamation all you want, it's
all on record pal.

Consider this which I posted before anyone else did and then read
Daryl's and Noddy's attack.

"Not a lot of detail on the setup. MAF sensor?"

> So as the brilliant mechanic you think you are,

It's not what I think that matters, it's what my customers think that
matters.

what are your
> suggestions of issues that might be causing the issue,
> or do you need a
> scan tool to diagnose it...

I don't need a scan tool to know that is a backfire, that's for certain.
A scan tool is just a tool like any other tool a mechanic uses to fix
cars. How do you propose a mechanic reads and captures live data to aid
in diagnosis without one for instance?

On 31/01/2022 7:54 pm, Clocky wrote:
> On 31/01/2022 1:37 pm, Grumpy Tech wrote:
>> On 31/01/2022 3:13 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>> On 31/01/2022 10:01 am, alvey wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 31 Jan 2022 11:41:31 +1100, Daryl wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> What's interesting is that it was a genuine real question and only you
>>>>> replied with helpful ideas/questions, I wonder why that is so:-)
>>>>
>>>> The source of Matt Groening's inspiration for Homer Simpson is
>>>> revealed...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> alvey
>>>>
>>>
>>> Talk about 'Dumb and Dumber' personified.
>>>
>>>  From a mechanics perspective I can only laugh at these two clueless
>>> twits fumbling around in the dark looking for a clue :-)
>>
>> Yet instead of helping like a decent human being you choose the low
>> path. Shows your character really well.
>>
>
> Continue your character assassination and defamation all you want, it's
> all on record pal.
>
> Consider this which I posted before anyone else did and then read
> Daryl's and Noddy's attack.
>
> "Not a lot of detail on the setup. MAF sensor?"
>
>> So as the brilliant mechanic you think you are,
>
> It's not what I think that matters, it's what my customers think that
> matters.
>
> what are your
>> suggestions of issues that might be causing the issue, or do you need
>> a scan tool to diagnose it...
>
> I don't need a scan tool to know that is a backfire, that's for certain.
> A scan tool is just a tool like any other tool a mechanic uses to fix
> cars. How do you propose a mechanic reads and captures live data to aid
> in diagnosis without one for instance?
>

Apparently with a laptop and software from what I see lately. USB
connection to an engine management system in the car which is fitted
with multiple sensors. Note he mentions a Link ECU module.

Yes you did post "Not a lot of detail..." That was right after you
posted " Sounds like you need a good mechanic." Seems like you were not
being nice.

He states it is a "misfire", not a "backfire" at light throttle.

On 31/01/2022 9:09 pm, Grumpy Tech wrote:
> On 31/01/2022 7:54 pm, Clocky wrote:

>> I don't need a scan tool to know that is a backfire, that's for
>> certain. A scan tool is just a tool like any other tool a mechanic
>> uses to fix cars. How do you propose a mechanic reads and captures
>> live data to aid in diagnosis without one for instance?
>>
>
> Apparently with a laptop and software from what I see lately. USB
> connection to an engine management system in the car which is fitted
> with multiple sensors. Note he mentions a Link ECU module.
>
> Yes you did post "Not a lot of detail..." That was right after you
> posted " Sounds like you need a good mechanic." Seems like you were not
> being nice.
>
> He states it is a "misfire", not a "backfire" at light throttle.

He did indeed, but apparently Jerky the perpetual victim can't tell the
difference. He should stick to something a little less taxing, like
fitting mudflaps and towbars.

--
--
--
Regards,
Noddy.

On 31/1/22 6:44 pm, Grumpy Tech wrote:
> On 31/01/2022 4:34 pm, Daryl wrote:
>> On 31/1/22 4:37 pm, Grumpy Tech wrote:
>>> On 31/01/2022 3:13 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>>> On 31/01/2022 10:01 am, alvey wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, 31 Jan 2022 11:41:31 +1100, Daryl wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What's interesting is that it was a genuine real question and only
>>>>>> you
>>>>>> replied with helpful ideas/questions, I wonder why that is so:-)
>>>>>
>>>>> The source of Matt Groening's inspiration for Homer Simpson is
>>>>> revealed...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> alvey
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Talk about 'Dumb and Dumber' personified.
>>>>
>>>>  From a mechanics perspective I can only laugh at these two clueless
>>>> twits fumbling around in the dark looking for a clue :-)
>>>
>>> Yet instead of helping like a decent human being you choose the low
>>> path. Shows your character really well.
>>
>> Sad but true.
>> If he had a clue he could just offer a suggestion or he could just be
>> a dick, too bad he choose the later.
>
> Well he always claims to be the 'better' person so here's his chance to
> prove it.

We can only hope.
>>>
>>> So as the brilliant mechanic you think you are, what are your
>>> suggestions of issues that might be causing the issue, or do you need
>>> a scan tool to diagnose it...
>>
>> I'd like to see him try and plug in his scan tool into the car in
>> question, there is a USB cable in the glove box that connects to the
>> ECU but no OBD2 port.
>> I can connect to the ECU because I have the correct tool and there are
>> no fault codes.
>
> I'm amazed at some of the new control systems that are coming out where
> they have sensors everywhere. Even with those they can have issues not
> showing in the systems. There's Haltech, HP Tuners, and Holley that I've
> seen on the channels I watch, I'm sure there's others as well.
>

I have software on my laptop to setup and tune, Link, Haltech and Motec.
I'm told by experts that Motec is the best as far as tune ability goes
but IMHO their interface on the laptop is pretty ordinary.
Mates race cars both run Motec, we priced a replacement for one of them
and it was over $7000.00, by comparison the Link was cheap at $2800.00
and the base model Haltech for the 3cyl Daihatsu was under $2000.
In my limited experience Haltech has by far the best tech support,
several times when I was setting my sons Daihatsu with the Haltech I
called them for help and they just connected to the ECU via my laptop
and sorted it out.
That was an interesting exercise in that they have firmware and setup
data for many popular cars but nothing for the Daihatsu so they wrote a
new firmware for my sons car, they were very helpful.
The Holley Sniper EFI system that we fitted to mates sons Torana with
the Chev 383 is a great bit of kit, very easy to tune, 480hp in a road
registered Torana is a very interesting drive:-)

--
Daryl

On 31/1/22 9:09 pm, Grumpy Tech wrote:
> On 31/01/2022 7:54 pm, Clocky wrote:
>> On 31/01/2022 1:37 pm, Grumpy Tech wrote:
>>> On 31/01/2022 3:13 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>>> On 31/01/2022 10:01 am, alvey wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, 31 Jan 2022 11:41:31 +1100, Daryl wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What's interesting is that it was a genuine real question and only
>>>>>> you
>>>>>> replied with helpful ideas/questions, I wonder why that is so:-)
>>>>>
>>>>> The source of Matt Groening's inspiration for Homer Simpson is
>>>>> revealed...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> alvey
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Talk about 'Dumb and Dumber' personified.
>>>>
>>>>  From a mechanics perspective I can only laugh at these two clueless
>>>> twits fumbling around in the dark looking for a clue :-)
>>>
>>> Yet instead of helping like a decent human being you choose the low
>>> path. Shows your character really well.
>>>
>>
>> Continue your character assassination and defamation all you want,
>> it's all on record pal.
>>
>> Consider this which I posted before anyone else did and then read
>> Daryl's and Noddy's attack.
>>
>> "Not a lot of detail on the setup. MAF sensor?"

No MAF but the Link has a built in MAP.
I did forget to mention that the stock inlet manifold has been replaced
with quad throttle bodies.

>>
>>> So as the brilliant mechanic you think you are,
>>
>> It's not what I think that matters, it's what my customers think that
>> matters.
>>
>> what are your
>>> suggestions of issues that might be causing the issue, or do you need
>>> a scan tool to diagnose it...
>>
>> I don't need a scan tool to know that is a backfire, that's for
>> certain. A scan tool is just a tool like any other tool a mechanic
>> uses to fix cars. How do you propose a mechanic reads and captures
>> live data to aid in diagnosis without one for instance?
>>
>
> Apparently with a laptop and software from what I see lately. USB
> connection to an engine management system in the car which is fitted
> with multiple sensors. Note he mentions a Link ECU module.
>
> Yes you did post "Not a lot of detail..." That was right after you
> posted " Sounds like you need a good mechanic." Seems like you were not
> being nice.
>
> He states it is a "misfire", not a "backfire" at light throttle.
>
That I did.
I have have experienced similar symptoms on pre electronics cars and the
fault was always easy to find so any "mechanic" who worked on those
early cars should know straight away what the problem is.
If I was a trade school teacher the only one who would have passed the
exam is Noddy:-)

--
Daryl

On 31/01/2022 11:06 pm, Daryl wrote:
> On 31/1/22 9:09 pm, Grumpy Tech wrote:

>> He states it is a "misfire", not a "backfire" at light throttle.
>>
> That I did.
> I have have experienced similar symptoms on pre electronics cars and the
> fault was always easy to find so any "mechanic" who worked on those
> early cars should know straight away what the problem is.
> If I was a trade school teacher the only one who would have passed the
> exam is Noddy:-)

You complete cunt. You'll have them salivating like wild dogs with that
comment :)

--
--
--
Regards,
Noddy.

On 31/01/2022 10:50 pm, Daryl wrote:
> On 31/1/22 6:44 pm, Grumpy Tech wrote:

>> I'm amazed at some of the new control systems that are coming out
>> where they have sensors everywhere. Even with those they can have
>> issues not showing in the systems. There's Haltech, HP Tuners, and
>> Holley that I've seen on the channels I watch, I'm sure there's others
>> as well.
>>
>
> I have software on my laptop to setup and tune, Link, Haltech and Motec.
> I'm told by experts that Motec is the best as far as tune ability goes
> but IMHO their interface on the laptop is pretty ordinary.
> Mates race cars both run Motec, we priced a replacement for one of them
> and it was over $7000.00, by comparison the Link was cheap at $2800.00
> and the base model Haltech for the 3cyl Daihatsu was under $2000.
> In my limited experience Haltech has by far the best tech support,
> several times when I was setting my sons Daihatsu with the Haltech I
> called them for help and they just connected to the ECU via my laptop
> and sorted it out.
> That was an interesting exercise in that they have firmware and setup
> data for many popular cars but nothing for the Daihatsu so they wrote a
> new firmware for my sons car, they were very helpful.
> The Holley Sniper EFI system that we fitted to mates sons Torana with
> the Chev 383 is a great bit of kit, very easy to tune, 480hp in a road
> registered Torana is a very interesting drive:-)

I'm sure it is :)

The Holley Sniper is an amazing piece of kit, and I'm thinking about
putting one on the F100 when I put the Windsor in it.

--
--
--
Regards,
Noddy.