In article <un8uoh$g4q$30@dont-email.me>,
Jethro_uk <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 12:19:03 +0000, Chris Hogg wrote:

> > On Fri, 5 Jan 2024 09:56:02 -0000 (UTC), Jethro_uk
> > <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com> wrote:
> >
> >>I recently read a suggestion that some potholes in the UK may be due to
> >>the action of EV acceleration.
> >>
> >>If true it's a good reason to tax them more.
> >
> > As a side issue but still on the topic of EV's, how do the batteries
> > survive being immersed in flood water for a couple of days?

> I thought generally a submerged car is a write off. You will never get
> the smell out. Certainly that was the story I was told when a customers
> car got submerged when they parked too close to a tidal part of the
> Thames (can't remember where now).

it's usually in Richmond

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England - sent from my RISC OS 4té²
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

On 05/01/2024 14:19, Theo wrote:
> Often they develop by water ingress into the road surface and then
> freeze-thaw weathering, which is why they're worse after snowy/frozen
> weather and at the side of the road where water collects.

Finally someone who understand potholes.
In scandinavia they have gravel roads, because tarmac doesn't last

--
I would rather have questions that cannot be answered...
....than to have answers that cannot be questioned

Richard Feynman

On 05/01/2024 13:04, Jethro_uk wrote:
> On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 12:19:03 +0000, Chris Hogg wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 5 Jan 2024 09:56:02 -0000 (UTC), Jethro_uk
>> <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I recently read a suggestion that some potholes in the UK may be due to
>>> the action of EV acceleration.
>>>
>>> If true it's a good reason to tax them more.
>>
>> As a side issue but still on the topic of EV's, how do the batteries
>> survive being immersed in flood water for a couple of days?
>
> I thought generally a submerged car is a write off. You will never get
> the smell out. Certainly that was the story I was told when a customers
> car got submerged when they parked too close to a tidal part of the
> Thames (can't remember where now).
They are effectively BER for two reasons - the first being that flood
water is deemed unhygienic, and thefore total replacement of interiors
is needed, the second being that flooded electrical connectors will
corrode over time , so a guaranteed repair involves replacing all the
wiring looms etc.
Then there is likely to be water in the engine and in the transmission.
So a total drain strip inspect rebuild replace on that.

It's simply too much work to be cost effective.

--
I would rather have questions that cannot be answered...
....than to have answers that cannot be questioned

Richard Feynman

On 05/01/2024 14:44, Colin Bignell wrote:
> On 05/01/2024 09:56, Jethro_uk wrote:
>> I recently read a suggestion that some potholes in the UK may be due to
>> the action of EV acceleration.
>>
>> If true it's a good reason to tax them more.
>
> I've not found any reports that support that, but have seen a claim by
> the suppliers of asphalt that unclassified roads could be in danger from
> the weight. Classified roads are already built to withstand the weight
> of HGVs, but unclassified roads, which account for about 60% of the
> network, are not built to the same standards and some could be at risk
> from the weight.
>
>
This is true: Ultimately the tyre exerts a pressure equal to what its
pumped up to, so about 60psi max. But that isn't what makes potholes.
It's the total weight over a much larger area that is transferred by the
road covering to the substrate. My drive is about 6" of MOT type one and
it still bends down when a 30 tonner delivers ... motorways have about a
foot or more of substrate. And there is still flexure.
So what mostly matters is total weight per wheel set. And what is
underneath the road both in terms of soil and in terms of road base.

Flexure creates cracks, cracks let in water, water freezes and lifts out
a whole section of road.

--
“Ideas are inherently conservative. They yield not to the attack of
other ideas but to the massive onslaught of circumstance"

- John K Galbraith

On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 15:45:15 +0000, charles wrote:

> In article <un8uoh$g4q$30@dont-email.me>,
> Jethro_uk <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com> wrote:
>> On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 12:19:03 +0000, Chris Hogg wrote:
>
>> > On Fri, 5 Jan 2024 09:56:02 -0000 (UTC), Jethro_uk
>> > <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >>I recently read a suggestion that some potholes in the UK may be due
>> >>to the action of EV acceleration.
>> >>
>> >>If true it's a good reason to tax them more.
>> >
>> > As a side issue but still on the topic of EV's, how do the batteries
>> > survive being immersed in flood water for a couple of days?
>
>> I thought generally a submerged car is a write off. You will never get
>> the smell out. Certainly that was the story I was told when a customers
>> car got submerged when they parked too close to a tidal part of the
>> Thames (can't remember where now).
>
> it's usually in Richmond

I recall an alley that was basically a slipway into the river. The silly
sods parked too far down and that was that.

Many years ago on a boating holiday in the broads, we tied our boat up at
the moorings for "The Pub with No Road" around 6pm. When we got about
around midnight, the tide had risen a good 2m and the boat was close to
45 degrees. I'll never know how the locals knew we had never boated
before ....

On 05 Jan 2024 at 18:03:36 GMT, "Jethro_uk" <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com> wrote:

> On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 15:45:15 +0000, charles wrote:
>
>> In article <un8uoh$g4q$30@dont-email.me>,
>> Jethro_uk <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com> wrote:
>>> On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 12:19:03 +0000, Chris Hogg wrote:
>>
>>>> On Fri, 5 Jan 2024 09:56:02 -0000 (UTC), Jethro_uk
>>>> <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I recently read a suggestion that some potholes in the UK may be due
>>>>> to the action of EV acceleration.
>>>>>
>>>>> If true it's a good reason to tax them more.
>>>>
>>>> As a side issue but still on the topic of EV's, how do the batteries
>>>> survive being immersed in flood water for a couple of days?
>>
>>> I thought generally a submerged car is a write off. You will never get
>>> the smell out. Certainly that was the story I was told when a customers
>>> car got submerged when they parked too close to a tidal part of the
>>> Thames (can't remember where now).
>>
>> it's usually in Richmond
>
> I recall an alley that was basically a slipway into the river. The silly
> sods parked too far down and that was that.
>
> Many years ago on a boating holiday in the broads, we tied our boat up at
> the moorings for "The Pub with No Road" around 6pm. When we got about
> around midnight, the tide had risen a good 2m and the boat was close to
> 45 degrees. I'll never know how the locals knew we had never boated
> before ....

Try that in a lock and you'll get some dusty responses - assuming you're still
alive.

--
What you must understand is that, for today's left intellectuals, education is useful only to the extent that it endorses their prejudices. Beyond that, they refuse to go.

Roger Scruton

On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 21:24:48 +1100, maus <maus@deb2.org> wrote:

> On 2024-01-05, GB <NOTsomeone@microsoft.invalid> wrote:
>> On 05/01/2024 09:56, Jethro_uk wrote:
>>> I recently read a suggestion that some potholes in the UK may be due to
>>> the action of EV acceleration.
>>>
>>> If true it's a good reason to tax them more.
>>
>> How many potholes? Unless you can put figures on the cost of repair, you
>> have no idea how much extra to tax them. It could just be a fraction of
>> a penny.

> We do not even know what causes potholes.

Yes we do. The road surface is breached/cracks and that
allows rain to get thru and eroder the substructure.

> Problems with the subtarmac surface?.

A defect in the road surface that lets the rain get in.

On 1/5/2024 4:56 AM, Jethro_uk wrote:
> I recently read a suggestion that some potholes in the UK may be due to
> the action of EV acceleration.
>
> If true it's a good reason to tax them more.
>

There is a math formula, that relates axle weight to road damage.

https://www.insidescience.org/news/how-much-damage-do-heavy-trucks-do-our-roads

W1
(----) to the fourth power
W2

So yes, it's a concern, for vehicles like the GM Hummer EV.
(They made around 300 of those, this year? A massive quantity.
And 10 Tesla Cybertrucks were delivered. )

Eventually, with a little consultation with the car companies,
this will be addressed at some point. We cannot afford to
have a 100% fleet of Hummer-mass vehicles on the road. Or
asphalt will no longer be adequate for road surfaces, and
it will require something else (some Romans on vacation
to fix it).

Who knows, when vehicles are eventually rationed, they
will no longer be SUV-sized.

Paul

On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 21:58:22 +1100, Clive Page <usenet@page2.eu> wrote:

> On 05/01/2024 09:56, Jethro_uk wrote:
>> I recently read a suggestion that some potholes in the UK may be due to
>> the action of EV acceleration.
>> If true it's a good reason to tax them more.

> It seems to be well established that damage to roads is roughly
> proportional to the fourth power of the weight of the vehicle.

That is a different issue to what causes pot holes.

> I can't find a good estimate of the average weight of an electric
> vehicle compared to one with a petrol/diesel engine,

Jethro's stupid claim was about the ACCELERATION of the vehicle, not the
weight.

> but I have seen figures that they are around 30% heavier because of the
> battery. This would make the road damage 2.8 times higher.

> Of course governments everywhere have chosen to ignore this when taxing
> 40 ton trucks, otherwise they would pay about 2.5 million times as much
> as a one-ton car for the road damage element of their tax.

On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 23:57:48 +1100, Jethro_uk <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com>
wrote:

> On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 10:58:22 +0000, Clive Page wrote:
>
>> On 05/01/2024 09:56, Jethro_uk wrote:
>>> [quoted text muted]
>>
>> It seems to be well established that damage to roads is roughly
>> proportional to the fourth power of the weight of the vehicle.
>
> That's one factor. The force of acceleration is another. It creates a
> shear force surely ?

The problem with that line is that while an EV CAN accelerate
faster than an ICE, the reality is that EV drivers don't actually
do that in reality so it can't actually produce more potholes.

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On Sat, 06 Jan 2024 03:04:52 +1100, The Natural Philosopher
<tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:

> On 05/01/2024 13:04, Jethro_uk wrote:
>> On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 12:19:03 +0000, Chris Hogg wrote:
>>
>>> On Fri, 5 Jan 2024 09:56:02 -0000 (UTC), Jethro_uk
>>> <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I recently read a suggestion that some potholes in the UK may be due
>>>> to
>>>> the action of EV acceleration.
>>>>
>>>> If true it's a good reason to tax them more.
>>>
>>> As a side issue but still on the topic of EV's, how do the batteries
>>> survive being immersed in flood water for a couple of days?
>> I thought generally a submerged car is a write off. You will never get
>> the smell out. Certainly that was the story I was told when a customers
>> car got submerged when they parked too close to a tidal part of the
>> Thames (can't remember where now).

> They are effectively BER for two reasons - the first being that flood
> water is deemed unhygienic, and thefore total replacement of interiors
> is needed,

BULLSHIT.

> the second being that flooded electrical connectors will corrode over
> time , so a guaranteed repair involves replacing all the wiring looms
> etc.

BULLSHIT.

> Then there is likely to be water in the engine and in the transmission.

BULLSHIT.

> So a total drain strip inspect rebuild replace on that.

> It's simply too much work to be cost effective.

On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 18:13:59 +0000, Tim Streater wrote:

> On 05 Jan 2024 at 18:03:36 GMT, "Jethro_uk" <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 15:45:15 +0000, charles wrote:
>>
>>> In article <un8uoh$g4q$30@dont-email.me>,
>>> Jethro_uk <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com> wrote:
>>>> On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 12:19:03 +0000, Chris Hogg wrote:
>>>
>>>>> On Fri, 5 Jan 2024 09:56:02 -0000 (UTC), Jethro_uk
>>>>> <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I recently read a suggestion that some potholes in the UK may be
>>>>>> due to the action of EV acceleration.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If true it's a good reason to tax them more.
>>>>>
>>>>> As a side issue but still on the topic of EV's, how do the batteries
>>>>> survive being immersed in flood water for a couple of days?
>>>
>>>> I thought generally a submerged car is a write off. You will never
>>>> get the smell out. Certainly that was the story I was told when a
>>>> customers car got submerged when they parked too close to a tidal
>>>> part of the Thames (can't remember where now).
>>>
>>> it's usually in Richmond
>>
>> I recall an alley that was basically a slipway into the river. The
>> silly sods parked too far down and that was that.
>>
>> Many years ago on a boating holiday in the broads, we tied our boat up
>> at the moorings for "The Pub with No Road" around 6pm. When we got
>> about around midnight, the tide had risen a good 2m and the boat was
>> close to 45 degrees. I'll never know how the locals knew we had never
>> boated before ....
>
> Try that in a lock and you'll get some dusty responses - assuming you're
> still alive.

We were down the pub when the boat was levitating ... luckily somehow
we'd used proper hitches on the moorings and were able to slacken the
mooring ropes with some sage advice. Which I think may have been given in
between laughs ...

It was a good lesson in how dangerous tides can be.

On 05/01/2024 18:34, Rod Speed wrote:
> On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 23:57:48 +1100, Jethro_uk <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 10:58:22 +0000, Clive Page wrote:
>>
>>> On 05/01/2024 09:56, Jethro_uk wrote:
>>>> [quoted text muted]
>>>
>>> It seems to be well established that damage to roads is roughly
>>> proportional to the fourth power of the weight of the vehicle.
>>
>> That's one factor. The force of acceleration is another. It creates a
>> shear force surely ?
>
> The problem with that line is that while an EV CAN accelerate
> faster than an ICE, the reality is that EV drivers don't actually
> do that in reality so it can't actually produce more potholes.

I've always wondered, can the driver configure a maximum acceleration,
especially when setting off from rest, which is lower than the maximum
that the vehicle can achieve, to avoid accidentally excessive forces? In
an ICE car, there is a physical limit which varies with engine power but
in most cases is less than what an EV can achieve if not subject to a
drover's preferred limit.

Or do EVs have an acceleration profile which starts off low and
gradually increases, despite constant accelerator position? I ask
because we have an electric wheelbarrow and this take that concept to
excess. If you happen to release the twist-grip throttle as you are
walking along behind it, you risk impaling yourself on the handlebars
because a) the barrow stops *very* quickly, and b) it takes a second or
so for it to even *start* to pick up speed again; both of these mean
that you have to actually stop rather than just adjusting your walking
speed a bit.

I suppose it is easier with an EV than an ICE car to building all sorts
of things like S-shaped acceleration profiles and artificially limited
maximum acceleration.

On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 20:21:28 +0000, NY wrote:

> On 05/01/2024 18:34, Rod Speed wrote:
>> On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 23:57:48 +1100, Jethro_uk
>> <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 10:58:22 +0000, Clive Page wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 05/01/2024 09:56, Jethro_uk wrote:
>>>>> [quoted text muted]
>>>>
>>>> It seems to be well established that damage to roads is roughly
>>>> proportional to the fourth power of the weight of the vehicle.
>>>
>>> That's one factor. The force of acceleration is another. It creates a
>>> shear force surely ?
>>
>> The problem with that line is that while an EV CAN accelerate faster
>> than an ICE, the reality is that EV drivers don't actually do that in
>> reality so it can't actually produce more potholes.
>
> I've always wondered, can the driver configure a maximum acceleration,
> especially when setting off from rest, which is lower than the maximum
> that the vehicle can achieve, to avoid accidentally excessive forces? In
> an ICE car, there is a physical limit which varies with engine power but
> in most cases is less than what an EV can achieve if not subject to a
> drover's preferred limit.
>
> Or do EVs have an acceleration profile which starts off low and
> gradually increases, despite constant accelerator position? I ask
> because we have an electric wheelbarrow and this take that concept to
> excess. If you happen to release the twist-grip throttle as you are
> walking along behind it, you risk impaling yourself on the handlebars
> because a) the barrow stops *very* quickly, and b) it takes a second or
> so for it to even *start* to pick up speed again; both of these mean
> that you have to actually stop rather than just adjusting your walking
> speed a bit.
>
> I suppose it is easier with an EV than an ICE car to building all sorts
> of things like S-shaped acceleration profiles and artificially limited
> maximum acceleration.

No idea what is programmed in but I think there is some shaping of the
torque on starting off, nevertheless on mine it is quite easy to lose
adhesion on the front wheels on pulling away sharply, even for a little
Zoe. It corrects and controls the slip but you can still hear or feel it.

On the other hand, I find the electric car fits driving smoothly and
economically. I nearly always have mine in "ECO" mode which limits the
power to I think about 1/3 of maximum and only very occasionally use the
kick-down or mode switches to get a bit of a kick for overtaking.

nib

On 1/5/2024 9:19 AM, Theo wrote:
> Jethro_uk <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com> wrote:
>> On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 10:58:22 +0000, Clive Page wrote:
>>
>>> On 05/01/2024 09:56, Jethro_uk wrote:
>>>> [quoted text muted]
>>>
>>> It seems to be well established that damage to roads is roughly
>>> proportional to the fourth power of the weight of the vehicle.
>>
>> That's one factor. The force of acceleration is another. It creates a
>> shear force surely ?
>
> Are these potholes on stretches of road where people regularly do 0 to 60?
> Do they have burnt rubber type tracks on them?
>
> Many potholes are in the traffic lane where people are proceeding at a
> constant-ish speed, ie acceleration = 0.
>
> Often they develop by water ingress into the road surface and then
> freeze-thaw weathering, which is why they're worse after snowy/frozen
> weather and at the side of the road where water collects.
>
> Theo
>

The fourth order equation, the purpose of the formula, is to give
a rough idea of dimension, rather than "compute a repair bill".

It's meant to inform the need to review axle weight limits for future vehicles.

If we don't say something, they'll make vehicles that weigh more
than the GM Hummer EV. And a personal chariot does not need to be
that heavy. Shirley a vehicle to haul your ass around town, does
not need to weigh 9000 pounds. Why not drive a fucking steam roller...

*******

The public transit bus collector road near me, is a good example
of a potholed mess. After the buses turn off at depot, the road
after that is fine. The "OK section" is not perfect, but you could
drive a bicycle along it, without a big concern. The potholes in the
bad section, are all across the surface, and not restricted to
"just wheel ruts".

They did re-pave it once (used the machine to scrape off the wearing
layer and re-pave), but that didn't last very long at all.

Looking at all the roads in that area, I would guess it's the
sheer number of buses per day, that leads to the mess. Roads with
buses, but not quite as many, don't seem to break up at nearly
the same rate. Just the very edge of the road is chipped and damaged.

When the bus drivers see the potholes on the edge of the road, they
do offset the bus and drive a bit into the next lane. And this is
part of the reason the damage spreads across the entire lane the buses
use. If you were to record how the road was used with surveillance cameras,
all of the damage would make sense. The damage is not defying some
law of physics.

The city cannot do civil engineering worth a damn, which is
why I'm not offering any clever suggestions as to how to fix it :-)
They never make a good substrate for a road -- why should the
finish on the top of the road, the icing, get all the glory ?

I can tell you though, the section of town now filled
with Bailey Bridges, the steel in those it really works.
Impressive, those bridges. When I heard they were fitting
those kinds of bridges, I was expecting a rickety mess. They're
as solid and dependable as can be. Substantial steel structures.
Good support underneath. (No sound effects give away details
of the construction. The bridge is silent when a heavy vehicle
passes. No clanging of plates.) Just don't brake hard on a
frosty day. At least you cannot pothole those.

Paul

On 05/01/2024 10:58, Clive Page wrote:
> On 05/01/2024 09:56, Jethro_uk wrote:
>> I recently read a suggestion that some potholes in the UK may be due to
>> the action of EV acceleration.
>>
>> If true it's a good reason to tax them more.
>
> It seems to be well established that damage to roads is roughly
> proportional to the fourth power of the weight of the vehicle.  I can't
> find a good estimate of the average weight of an electric vehicle
> compared to one with a petrol/diesel engine, but I have seen figures
> that they are around 30% heavier because of the battery.  This would
> make the road damage 2.8 times higher.

Our EV (MG4) is less than 15% heavier than our Zafira.

> Of course governments everywhere have chosen to ignore this when taxing
> 40 ton trucks, otherwise they would pay about 2.5 million times as much
> as a one-ton car for the road damage element of their tax.

Many years ago, Tomorrows World showed a test, which revealed that one
badly loaded 32-tonner did as much damage as 125,000 cars.

On Sat, 06 Jan 2024 05:49:00 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

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On 1/5/2024 9:37 AM, Chris Hogg wrote:
> On 05 Jan 2024 14:28:24 +0000 (GMT), Theo
> <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
>
>> Jethro_uk <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com> wrote:
>>> On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 12:19:03 +0000, Chris Hogg wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Fri, 5 Jan 2024 09:56:02 -0000 (UTC), Jethro_uk
>>>> <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I recently read a suggestion that some potholes in the UK may be due to
>>>>> the action of EV acceleration.
>>>>>
>>>>> If true it's a good reason to tax them more.
>>>>
>>>> As a side issue but still on the topic of EV's, how do the batteries
>>>> survive being immersed in flood water for a couple of days?
>>
>> The batteries are sealed, exposed to the underside of the car and with a
>> water cooling loop, so they are already protected against liquid damage from
>> both inside and outside. You won't know if the seals were good until you
>> try them, and other electrical parts like motors may have been damaged in
>> the flood. It is quite possible the car detected the floodwaters and blew a
>> pyro fuse to protect the battery, which would make the car inert until
>> somebody replaces the pyro (often inside the battery itself).
>>
>>> I thought generally a submerged car is a write off. You will never get
>>> the smell out. Certainly that was the story I was told when a customers
>>> car got submerged when they parked too close to a tidal part of the
>>> Thames (can't remember where now).
>>
>> There's so many places the water could go and cause mischief, in any car,
>> it's not worth the insurance company's time to find out - they'll just write
>> it off. Then it goes off to Copart etc auction and some salvage yard buys
>> it and either takes it to bits to dry it all out or tears it apart for parts
>> (those which are usable) or scrap.
>>
>> Theo
>
> OK, thanks. So EV's are at no greater risk of being written off than
> any other type of vehicle. I wondered if the battery was more likely
> to fail in some fashion if immersed, needing expensive replacement,
> compared to say an ICE. Apparently not.
>

One of the insults the battery needs protection from, is
being penetrated from the road side.

https://www.tesla.com/en_ca/blog/tesla-adds-titanium-underbody-shield-and-aluminum-deflector-plates-model-s

While that's a bit of over-reaction, it's also a bit of marketing.
The other car companies, this is just one of many design issues.
The titanium plate was "part of the theater involved".

Some electric vehicles, the battery slab is considered a
structural component. They're not wasting the rigidity they're
adding, and they're making it do additional work. But the techniques
for doing this, are turning the car into a "throwaway item".
Some companies have a better grip on this, than others. They're
doing structural at the module level. A bad module can still be
replaced, but it's not going to be easy. Whereas others, their
assembly method is one-time-only and has no repair strategy at all.
(All the materials are bonded together.)

Paul

On 05/01/2024 10:45, Andy Burns wrote:
> alan_m wrote:
>
>> It's just a matter of time until EVs will be taxed to make up for the
>> loss of fuel duty.
>
> They start paying next year, I think?

No, that's just VED, not an equivalent to fuel duty.

On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 20:21:28 +0000, NY wrote:

> On 05/01/2024 18:34, Rod Speed wrote:
>> [quoted text muted]
>
> I've always wondered, can the driver configure a maximum acceleration,
> especially when setting off from rest, which is lower than the maximum
> that the vehicle can achieve, to avoid accidentally excessive forces? In
> an ICE car, there is a physical limit which varies with engine power but
> in most cases is less than what an EV can achieve if not subject to a
> drover's preferred limit.

Electric *buses* can take off like a jet ....

On 05/01/2024 14:44, Colin Bignell wrote:
> On 05/01/2024 09:56, Jethro_uk wrote:
>> I recently read a suggestion that some potholes in the UK may be due to
>> the action of EV acceleration.
>>
>> If true it's a good reason to tax them more.
>
> I've not found any reports that support that, but have seen a claim by
> the suppliers of asphalt that unclassified roads could be in danger from
> the weight. Classified roads are already built to withstand the weight
> of HGVs, but unclassified roads, which account for about 60% of the
> network, are not built to the same standards and some could be at risk
> from the weight.

Or MG4 is less than 15% heavier than our Zafira, that should have little
effect on any properly built and maintained road.

Yes, it's acceleration is better, but not exessive ... and how often do
you suddenly floor a car, from standstill, in normal driving?

NY <me@privacy.net> wrote:
> On 05/01/2024 18:34, Rod Speed wrote:
>> On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 23:57:48 +1100, Jethro_uk <jethro_uk@hotmailbin.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On Fri, 05 Jan 2024 10:58:22 +0000, Clive Page wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 05/01/2024 09:56, Jethro_uk wrote:
>>>>> [quoted text muted]
>>>>
>>>> It seems to be well established that damage to roads is roughly
>>>> proportional to the fourth power of the weight of the vehicle.
>>>
>>> That's one factor. The force of acceleration is another. It creates a
>>> shear force surely ?
>>
>> The problem with that line is that while an EV CAN accelerate
>> faster than an ICE, the reality is that EV drivers don't actually
>> do that in reality so it can't actually produce more potholes.
>
> I've always wondered, can the driver configure a maximum acceleration,
> especially when setting off from rest, which is lower than the maximum
> that the vehicle can achieve, to avoid accidentally excessive forces?

Yes. There’s an adjustable pedal on the floor to the right of the brake
pedal.

Tim

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