On Mon, 14 Jun 2021 20:04:16 +0100
"NY" <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>"Andy Burns" <usenet@andyburns.uk> wrote in message
>news:iipl1mFsb74U1@mid.individual.net...
>> TonyGamble wrote:
>>
>>> but why isn't Mr Neil or someone at the station picky as well? It does
>>> matter.
>>
>> The presenters seem to be taking the piss out of the technical quality.
>
>I predict one of two things will happen.
>
>Either GB News will take off and become a respected and lasting news
>broadcaster - and they'll have a retrospective in 20 years' time looking
>back on all the technical cock-ups of the first few days before it had found
>its feet.
>
>Or GB News will vanish without trace within a month or so.

London Live is still going after god knows how many years with apparently
an audience of 3 people and a bored dog so there's hope for GBNews yet.

On 15/06/2021 in message <u4jgcg9a03vdgaldlktii42bqf0rftca5g@4ax.com>
Roderick Stewart wrote:

>Presenters of live shows usually have discreet earphones fed with
>gallery talkback, which will be a cacophony of everything that is
>going on in the gallery,

I have never experienced that live but I enjoyed the TV series "The
Newsroom" which managed to get a lot of the excitement across, as well as
having some very attractive females in it!

--
Jeff Gaines Wiltshire UK
There is absolutely no substitute for a genuine lack of preparation

On 15/06/2021 08:39 am, MrSpook_h1At@ik4n3jafg.ac.uk wrote:
> On Tue, 15 Jun 2021 00:34:20 +0100
> NY <me@privacy.net> wrote:
>> On 14/06/2021 22:21, Woody wrote:
>>> The bit that is getting me is not the poor {enter your own choice here}
>>> but more the abysmally low sound. We normally have our TV sound at about
>>> 35 on BBC News Channel or Sky but we need to go to 50 or more (out of
>>> 60!!) to even hear GBN!
>>
>> I've just compared GBN against Sky News, BBC News Channel and BBC One,
>> all in SD on satellite. And the sound levels seem pretty similar to me.
>
> Is there some kind of one upmanship going on here with sources? Why TF would
> anyone watch it on satellite when its available on Freeview?

If you have Sky, you tend to watch everything on that, mainly because it
only requires the use of one remote control.

MrSpook_h1At@ik4n3jafg.ac.uk wrote:

> Why TF would
> anyone watch it on satellite when its available on Freeview?

On terrestrial it's SD, on satellite it's HD.

On 14/06/2021 19:31, TonyGamble wrote:
>> The presenters seem to be taking the piss out of the technical quality.
> Once the presenters adopt that attitude the channel is doomed.

I wonder if there will be any early resignations?

On 14/06/2021 08:16, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
> Andrew Neil is far too full of himself of late, presenting his views as the
> one true way a lot more than he used to.
> Brian

I have thought that for some time, he is very overrated.

I gave up watching the late night This Week programme because it was the
same unfunny people with very corny gags every week. Too cosy.

<MrSpook_h1At@ik4n3jafg.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:sa9lg0$1uf0$1@gioia.aioe.org...
> On Tue, 15 Jun 2021 00:34:20 +0100
> NY <me@privacy.net> wrote:
>>On 14/06/2021 22:21, Woody wrote:
>>> The bit that is getting me is not the poor {enter your own choice here}
>>> but more the abysmally low sound. We normally have our TV sound at about
>>> 35 on BBC News Channel or Sky but we need to go to 50 or more (out of
>>> 60!!) to even hear GBN!
>>
>>I've just compared GBN against Sky News, BBC News Channel and BBC One,
>>all in SD on satellite. And the sound levels seem pretty similar to me.
>
> Is there some kind of one upmanship going on here with sources? Why TF
> would
> anyone watch it on satellite when its available on Freeview?

Because a) my satellite reception is better than my Freeview reception, and
b) GB News is HD on satellite but sub-SD (only 544x576) on terrestrial.

<MrSpook_c607@w4851tef.gov> wrote in message
news:sa9lar$1s2j$1@gioia.aioe.org...
> On Mon, 14 Jun 2021 16:15:06 +0100
> "NY" <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>>Looking again critically at the pictures of my HD satellite recordings of
>>Welcome to GB News and Tonight Live with Dan Wootton, I'm wondering
>>whether
>
> I do wonder how the target audience of GBNews will take to a slightly camp
> kiwi.

"Slightly"?

On 14/06/2021 14:17, MrSpook_srea3012k@5tf2vh.biz wrote:
> Given how many TV channels there are these days with only a certain pool of
> professionals to go around, you might not be far from the truth.

Perhaps they have been throwing around so much money to get big names
and not enough left for the rest?

On 14/06/2021 08:14, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
> Seriously though, it should be simple with modern kit to have a time
> signature that could effectively make sure they were delayed so they agreed.
> The old problems tended to be when the audio and video got separated or had
> different delays for som reason.
> Brian

Not so sure, I believe there are things that can happen with digital
signals to affect lip sync.

Years ago our Freeview here was out of lip sync, it took ages to get
someone to investigate. NTL switched transmitters whilst speaking to me
on the phone.

They locked it onto the good side until someone could go and change the
unit.

Usual case that if there are no alarms then everything must be OK!

On 14/06/2021 16:42, Andy Burns wrote:
> Are the reflections real, or could it be a virtual studio with
> reflections added to virtual surfaces?

Is anything real in modern studios! Certainly much of the "talent"
don't seem to be.

On Tue, 15 Jun 2021 00:50:52 +0100
williamwright <wrightsaerials@f2s.com> wrote:

> On 14/06/2021 22:21, Woody wrote:
> > The bit that is getting me is not the poor {enter your own choice
> > here} but more the abysmally low sound. We normally have our TV
> > sound at about 35 on BBC News Channel or Sky but we need to go to
> > 50 or more (out of 60!!) to even hear GBN!
>
> I had it on in the workshop and on the ordinary telly I couldn't get
> it loud enough to hear properly. In the end I tuned it in on a
> Freeview box that is connected to an audio amp and listen to it that
> way.
>
> On satellite, a couple of hours ago the sound was still low, but it's
> OK now, level-wise at least. But at 0042 everything except the ticker
> thingy went dead for a minute or so.
>
> Bill

I was watching on Freeview at about 9:20 this morning, and had the
sound at a comfortable level, low enough to not wake 'er asleep in the
room above. Then they switched to adverts, and I was blasted back in my
chair, and just managed to lower the volume to a reasonable level
before she woke up. Then when the programme came back on, I could hardly
hear a thing.

--
Davey.

"Bob Latham" <bob@sick-of-spam.invalid> wrote in message
news:593c1a16ffbob@sick-of-spam.invalid...
> In article <xn0mz3ki22s67ed007@news.individual.net>,
> Jeff Gaines <jgaines_newsid@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> Watching on Sky 515, it's the only channel I've seen for years with
>> lip sync problems, anybody else seeing this?
>
> Same on Freeview and variable sound levels.

I don't have variable sound

I have barely audible sound

so much so that it's impossible to watch

(Not that I was impressed with the 5 minutes that I did wade through)

"From what I can gather from various sources, the technical set up is
woefully inadequate for what they are trying to do. In fact it would be
inadequate for a simple shopping channel............."

I feel sorry for the presenters, many of whom, unlike Andrew Neil, are still trying to build their careers.

It is so unfair for them to be let down so often by amateurish technology.

I wonder when they will get complaints from the advertisers for running the commercials in a smaller (framed) screen.

In article <13818778-7cc4-445b-8422-aaa9e0226e91n@googlegroups.com>,
TonyGamble <tonygamble@compuserve.com> wrote:
> "From what I can gather from various sources, the technical set up is
> woefully inadequate for what they are trying to do. In fact it would be
> inadequate for a simple shopping channel............."

> I feel sorry for the presenters, many of whom, unlike Andrew Neil, are
> still trying to build their careers.

> It is so unfair for them to be let down so often by amateurish technology.

Does the problem lie with the purseholders? If you can buy a webcam from
Morgans for £25, why do you need to spend any more?

> I wonder when they will get complaints from the advertisers for running
> the commercials in a smaller (framed) screen.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

On Tue, 15 Jun 2021 09:49:27 +0100, MB <MB@nospam.net> wrote:

>On 14/06/2021 08:14, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
>> Seriously though, it should be simple with modern kit to have a time
>> signature that could effectively make sure they were delayed so they agreed.
>> The old problems tended to be when the audio and video got separated or had
>> different delays for som reason.
>> Brian
>
>Not so sure, I believe there are things that can happen with digital
>signals to affect lip sync.
>
>Years ago our Freeview here was out of lip sync, it took ages to get
>someone to investigate. NTL switched transmitters whilst speaking to me
>on the phone.
>
>They locked it onto the good side until someone could go and change the
>unit.
>
>Usual case that if there are no alarms then everything must be OK!
>

Lip sync was never a problem on television until we invented it. Then
we had to invent solutions for it. Before everything went digital it
would have required extra effort to get the sound and picture out of
sync unless you were using film. Now it's so commonplace that we just
get used to it unless it's really bad.

Luckily gadgets to correct it are now a standard item of hi-fi
equipment. Search for "lip sync corrector" or "audio delay".

https://www.amazon.co.uk/LINDY-70449-Lip-Sync-Corrector/dp/B005ZRWWJ0/ref=sr_1_3?dchild=1&keywords=lip+sync+corrector&qid=1623753710&sr=8-3

I have one of these connected in the "tape monitor" circuit of a hi-fi
amplifier so I can switch it in and out of circuit with a single
button as required. There is absolutely no audible change in volume or
quality. The delay time can be adjusted, but I find that a permanent
delay of 100ms seems to suit most sources closely enough and I only
occasionally need to switch it out.

Rod.

> Does the problem lie with the purseholders? If you can buy a webcam from
> Morgans for £25, why do you need to spend any more?

Probably.

I say that as a beancounter who left the profession to learn how to be a manager by working in commercial television.

On Tue, 15 Jun 2021 08:13:14 +0100, Mark Carver
<mark.carver@invalid.invalid> wrote:

> From what I can gather from various sources, the technical set up is
>woefully inadequate for what they are trying to do. In fact it would be
>inadequate for a simple shopping channel.
>For instance it seems they may only be using an 8 input audio mixer !
>
>It's just been thrown together by a bunch of well meaning I'm genuinely
>sure, but inexperienced technical staff. I don't think the channel has
>an Engineering Director ?

Every professional sound engineer I've met has a story about somebody
who decided to shoot something on the cheap, with the sound being done
as an afterthought by a friend who "knows about sound" or "knows about
electronics" but with no broadcast experience, because they think
recording sound is easy. In the worst case they can end up with days
or weeks worth of material which has no useable sound or none at all.
It's an expensive lesson, usually even more expensive than it would
have been to pay a professional to do it properly.

Rod.

On Tue, 15 Jun 2021 09:33:48 +0100, "NY" <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:

><MrSpook_h1At@ik4n3jafg.ac.uk> wrote in message
>news:sa9lg0$1uf0$1@gioia.aioe.org...
>> On Tue, 15 Jun 2021 00:34:20 +0100
>> NY <me@privacy.net> wrote:
>>>On 14/06/2021 22:21, Woody wrote:
>>>> The bit that is getting me is not the poor {enter your own choice here}
>>>> but more the abysmally low sound. We normally have our TV sound at about
>>>> 35 on BBC News Channel or Sky but we need to go to 50 or more (out of
>>>> 60!!) to even hear GBN!
>>>
>>>I've just compared GBN against Sky News, BBC News Channel and BBC One,
>>>all in SD on satellite. And the sound levels seem pretty similar to me.
>>
>> Is there some kind of one upmanship going on here with sources? Why TF
>> would
>> anyone watch it on satellite when its available on Freeview?
>
>Because a) my satellite reception is better than my Freeview reception, and
>b) GB News is HD on satellite but sub-SD (only 544x576) on terrestrial.

You can also stream it online from their website. It's hard to tell if
it's HD or SD, but in any case this would only apply to the studio
content. Most of the actual news material has the usual "mobile phone
on location" look that nearly everything beyond a studio has now.

Rod.

In article <bn1hcgpo63its7rrbdj56h5rf7qjf37p3e@4ax.com>,
Roderick Stewart <rjfs@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
> On Tue, 15 Jun 2021 08:13:14 +0100, Mark Carver
> <mark.carver@invalid.invalid> wrote:

> > From what I can gather from various sources, the technical set up is
> >woefully inadequate for what they are trying to do. In fact it would be
> >inadequate for a simple shopping channel.
> >For instance it seems they may only be using an 8 input audio mixer !
> >
> >It's just been thrown together by a bunch of well meaning I'm genuinely
> >sure, but inexperienced technical staff. I don't think the channel has
> >an Engineering Director ?

> Every professional sound engineer I've met has a story about somebody
> who decided to shoot something on the cheap, with the sound being done
> as an afterthought by a friend who "knows about sound" or "knows about
> electronics" but with no broadcast experience, because they think
> recording sound is easy. In the worst case they can end up with days
> or weeks worth of material which has no useable sound or none at all.
> It's an expensive lesson, usually even more expensive than it would
> have been to pay a professional to do it properly.

Some years ago, I was involved in play where a piano had to be played. The
actor couldn't play, so the piano had to be set so that the audience
couldn't see the keyboard. The diector handed me a cassette! and said "a
friend recorded this" I listened (automatic level control & it sounded as
though it was done in a bathroom) and said I needed the music score which
I eventually got. Then visited a friend with a Steinway, taking my trusty
Revox. We only did one take and most of the audience thought the actor was
playing live.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

On 14/06/2021 17:28, Brian Gregory wrote:
> On 14/06/2021 08:51, Jeff Gaines wrote:
>>>
>>> Why was Andrew Neil in semi darkness, so much so that he looked
>>> really grainy.
>>
>> Thank heavens for small mercies, he looks better in the dark :-)
>>
>
> I was watching in HD on satellite.
> It was fascinating watching the snow dance on his face.
> It didn't quite look like normal low light graininess though, it kind of
> formed a few weird swirly patterns that persisted for a moment, like
> maybe there was heavy digital processing of some kind going on.
>

Bad decision to have such dark backgrounds IMO, especially in news. And
I don't rate their graphics; the logos, news strap font look like they
were designed by a Sixth Form media class. That's the sort of thing
which creates an impression right away.

--

Chris

On 14/06/2021 20:56, NY wrote:
> "Roderick Stewart" <rjfs@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:0ebfcgl61uu2gd3g9pcm3el7afnj4sbvst@4ax.com...
>> On Mon, 14 Jun 2021 19:58:55 +0100, "NY" <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> "TonyGamble" <tonygamble@compuserve.com> wrote in message
>>> news:c7807054-a21e-472a-ab61-0470973951ben@googlegroups.com...
>>>> The number of times that Dubery woman looked at the wrong camera
>>>> between
>>>> 6.30 and 7.00 is pathetic. Is there no floor manager?. Are they
>>>> saving red
>>>> bulbs on the top of the cameras?
>>>
>>> Does a floor manager usually indicate to the presenter which is
>>> *going to
>>> be* the next camera (ie a few seconds in advance), so the presenter
>>> can be
>>> prepared for the change, rather than the helpless looking around "the
>>> red
>>> light on the camera I was using has gone out - which camera has a light
>>> now?".
>>>
>>> If so, how does a floor manager indicate this? Do they walk from one
>>> camera
>>> to the next and give a hand signal to say "this will be the next one
>>> - but
>>> wait for the light".
>>
>> Unless they've changed it since I used to work in studios (admittedly
>> not recently) it's the Production Assistant who calls the shots from
>> the gallery, so anyone with talkback will hear it.
>
> Yes but does the presenter hear that, or is it filtered out so as to
> present them with only the most crucial comments from the director?

If there is an FM, which isn't necessarily so, he/she will indicate the
next camera and stand beside it if possible. If the presenter is looking
to the wrong camera, the FM will signal to the presenter that they
should be on another camera.

News presenters usually listen to production talkback in my experience
as there is a considerable amount of information flowing between
presenter and gallery during a live, fast moving programme.

--

Chris

On 15/06/2021 08:36, MrSpook_c607@w4851tef.gov wrote:
> On Mon, 14 Jun 2021 16:15:06 +0100
> "NY" <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>> Looking again critically at the pictures of my HD satellite recordings of
>> Welcome to GB News and Tonight Live with Dan Wootton, I'm wondering whether
>
> I do wonder how the target audience of GBNews will take to a slightly camp
> kiwi.
>
>
So you equate a preference for news that isn't slanted to the left with
homophobia and xenophobia?

Bill

On Tue, 15 Jun 2021 14:41:50 +0100
williamwright <wrightsaerials@f2s.com> wrote:
>On 15/06/2021 08:36, MrSpook_c607@w4851tef.gov wrote:
>> On Mon, 14 Jun 2021 16:15:06 +0100
>> "NY" <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>>> Looking again critically at the pictures of my HD satellite recordings of
>>> Welcome to GB News and Tonight Live with Dan Wootton, I'm wondering whether
>>
>> I do wonder how the target audience of GBNews will take to a slightly camp
>> kiwi.
>>
>>
>So you equate a preference for news that isn't slanted to the left with
>homophobia and xenophobia?

You don't have to be homophobic to be turned off by some guy mincing about
and with an accent that could break glass. Plus he's crap - I listened to him
occasionally on talkRadio and he couldn't argue his way out of a wet paper
bag. He should have stuck to showbiz reporting.

On 15/06/2021 10:01, Davey wrote:
>
> I was watching on Freeview at about 9:20 this morning, and had the
> sound at a comfortable level, low enough to not wake 'er asleep in the
> room above. Then they switched to adverts, and I was blasted back in my
> chair, and just managed to lower the volume to a reasonable level
> before she woke up. Then when the programme came back on, I could hardly
> hear a thing.

The Naked Scientists on BBC Radio Cambridgeshire has started doing that
with their f*king loud jingles, so I've decided to stop listening to it.
Most of it is repeated, with less extreme abuse of its audience, on 5
Live Science anyway.

WTF can't these people manage such a simple thing as to have a
consistent audio level throughout a single broadcast?

--

Fake news kills!

I may be contacted via the contact address given on my website:
www.macfh.co.uk