Champ wrote:

> > I never got my head round wh some kids, including at least one of my
> > brothers, would bother painting airfkx models, let alone toy
> > soldiers. Sure, I'd stick the transfers on, but painting them just
> > seemed like faff for the sake of faff.
>
> Eh? Painting was part of the job, and the fun.
>
> I even used to try and create a 'skin tone' colour to paint the face
> of the pilot in the plane.

The bulk of the painting was done whilst it was still in the frames.

--
Simon

On 7 Sep 2021 09:07:25 GMT, "sweller" <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk>
wrote:

>Champ wrote:
>
>> > I never got my head round wh some kids, including at least one of my
>> > brothers, would bother painting airfkx models, let alone toy
>> > soldiers. Sure, I'd stick the transfers on, but painting them just
>> > seemed like faff for the sake of faff.
>>
>> Eh? Painting was part of the job, and the fun.
>>
>> I even used to try and create a 'skin tone' colour to paint the face
>> of the pilot in the plane.
>
>The bulk of the painting was done whilst it was still in the frames.

I would never have had been able to resist getting started on the
assembly. Even reading the instructions was (and still is, thinking
flat-pack furniture) a step to be avoided if at all possible or at
least minimised to the extreme.

--
Ace
http://www.chaletbeauroc.com/

On 06/09/2021 22:02, Mike Fleming wrote:
>On 06/09/2021 11:00, Champ wrote:
>> On Sun, 5 Sep 2021 12:14:47 -0700, Turby <xsurf@xmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>> This is our local cliff. ~100'. The photo is from 1898. There's another
>>>> photo from an early western movie of a cowboy on a horse doing the same
>>>> jump. Now, >100 years later, after so much erosion, at a very low tide
>>>> the rocks at the landing spot are sometimes dry.
>>
>>> https://library.ucsd.edu/dc/object/bb60762875
>>
>> Wow! That guys certainly has cojones
>
>Only if he landed right.

Hah ha yes, reminds me of the old joke about the last thing to go through a
fly's mind when it hits a windscreen...

--
XV750SE & GS550T

On 7 Sep 2021 09:07:25 GMT, "sweller" <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk>
wrote:

>Champ wrote:
>
>> > I never got my head round wh some kids, including at least one of my
>> > brothers, would bother painting airfkx models, let alone toy
>> > soldiers. Sure, I'd stick the transfers on, but painting them just
>> > seemed like faff for the sake of faff.
>>
>> Eh? Painting was part of the job, and the fun.
>>
>> I even used to try and create a 'skin tone' colour to paint the face
>> of the pilot in the plane.

>The bulk of the painting was done whilst it was still in the frames.

Yes!
--
Champ
neal at champ dot org dot uk

I don't know, but I been told
You never slow down, you never grow old

Turby wrote:

> > Or you could survive just long enough to make your last minutes a
> > living hell.
> >
> This. Helium is painless.

Why is helium painless?

I would have thought you would still be gripped by panic and fight for
breath?

--
simon

On 10 Sep 2021 08:09:59 GMT, "sweller" <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk>
wrote:

>Turby wrote:
>
>> > Or you could survive just long enough to make your last minutes a
>> > living hell.
>> >
>> This. Helium is painless.
>
>Why is helium painless?
>
>I would have thought you would still be gripped by panic and fight for
>breath?

No, it's not lack of oxygen that causes you to breath hard, but excess
carbon dioxide. So your breathing will remain pretty much normal,
you'll simply fall uncoscious and die.

--
Ace
http://www.chaletbeauroc.com/

Ace wrote:

> >> > Or you could survive just long enough to make your last minutes a
> >> > living hell.
> >> >
> >> This. Helium is painless.
> >
> > Why is helium painless?
> >
> > I would have thought you would still be gripped by panic and fight
> > for breath?
>
> No, it's not lack of oxygen that causes you to breath hard, but excess
> carbon dioxide. So your breathing will remain pretty much normal,
> you'll simply fall uncoscious and die.

Didn't know that.

--
Simon

On 10 Sep 2021 10:50:20 GMT, "sweller" <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk>
wrote:

>Ace wrote:

>> >> This. Helium is painless.
>> >
>> > Why is helium painless?
>> >
>> > I would have thought you would still be gripped by panic and fight
>> > for breath?
>> No, it's not lack of oxygen that causes you to breath hard, but excess
>> carbon dioxide. So your breathing will remain pretty much normal,
>> you'll simply fall uncoscious and die.

>Didn't know that.

Me neither.

--
Champ
neal at champ dot org dot uk

I don't know, but I been told
You never slow down, you never grow old

On Fri, 10 Sep 2021 12:51:47 +0100, Champ <neal@champ.org.uk> wrote:

>On 10 Sep 2021 10:50:20 GMT, "sweller" <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk>
>wrote:
>
>>Ace wrote:
>
>>> >> This. Helium is painless.
>>> >
>>> > Why is helium painless?
>>> >
>>> > I would have thought you would still be gripped by panic and fight
>>> > for breath?
>
>>> No, it's not lack of oxygen that causes you to breath hard, but excess
>>> carbon dioxide. So your breathing will remain pretty much normal,
>>> you'll simply fall uncoscious and die.
>
>>Didn't know that.
>
>Me neither.

+1

--
Colin Irvine
FJR1300A

On Fri, 10 Sep 2021 17:08:03 +0100, Colin Irvine
<look@colinandpat.co.uk> wrote:

>On Fri, 10 Sep 2021 12:51:47 +0100, Champ <neal@champ.org.uk> wrote:
>
>>On 10 Sep 2021 10:50:20 GMT, "sweller" <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>Ace wrote:
>>>> No, it's not lack of oxygen that causes you to breath hard, but excess
>>>> carbon dioxide. So your breathing will remain pretty much normal,
>>>> you'll simply fall uncoscious and die.
>>
>>>Didn't know that.
>>
>>Me neither.
>
>+1

There was that Lear jet that crashed after the cabin lost pressure as
it was climbing to cruise altitude: everyone on board simply fell
unconscious. The CVR recorded that cabin pressurisation alarm was
sounding in the last thirty minutes of flight.

The theory was that the cabin pressure checklist was so convoluted
that the crew passed out while trying to follow it. Apparently the
NTSB recommendation from that was that the first line should read "Put
on oxygen mask", among other things.

--

-Pip

"sweller" <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in news:iq0rjcF30biU1
@mid.individual.net:

> Ace wrote:
>
>> >> > Or you could survive just long enough to make your last minutes a
>> >> > living hell.
>> >> >
>> >> This. Helium is painless.
>> >
>> > Why is helium painless?
>> >
>> > I would have thought you would still be gripped by panic and fight
>> > for breath?
>>
>> No, it's not lack of oxygen that causes you to breath hard, but excess
>> carbon dioxide. So your breathing will remain pretty much normal,
>> you'll simply fall uncoscious and die.
>
> Didn't know that.
>

similar with nitrogen.

When I was in electronics we had a nitrogen blanket over the flow solder
pot to stop oxidation. When the maintenance crew had the hatches open they
had to wear breathing apparatus as they would have little warning if there
was a nitrogen leak, just pass out. The cold formerly compressed nitrogen
would sink to the floor where it would finish you off.

On 10/09/2021 19:16, wessie wrote:
> "sweller" <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in news:iq0rjcF30biU1
> @mid.individual.net:
>
>> Ace wrote:
>>
>>>>>> Or you could survive just long enough to make your last minutes a
>>>>>> living hell.
>>>>>>
>>>>> This. Helium is painless.
>>>>
>>>> Why is helium painless?
>>>>
>>>> I would have thought you would still be gripped by panic and fight
>>>> for breath?
>>>
>>> No, it's not lack of oxygen that causes you to breath hard, but excess
>>> carbon dioxide. So your breathing will remain pretty much normal,
>>> you'll simply fall uncoscious and die.
>>
>> Didn't know that.
>>
>
> similar with nitrogen.
>
> When I was in electronics we had a nitrogen blanket over the flow solder
> pot to stop oxidation. When the maintenance crew had the hatches open they
> had to wear breathing apparatus as they would have little warning if there
> was a nitrogen leak, just pass out. The cold formerly compressed nitrogen
> would sink to the floor where it would finish you off.
>

So a car exhaust, now non toxic as it's free of CO bubbled through
caustic soda solution will still do the job.

On Fri, 10 Sep 2021 18:16:23 -0000 (UTC), wessie
<willnotwork@tesco.net> wrote:

>similar with nitrogen.
>
>When I was in electronics we had a nitrogen blanket over the flow solder
>pot to stop oxidation. When the maintenance crew had the hatches open they
>had to wear breathing apparatus as they would have little warning if there
>was a nitrogen leak, just pass out. The cold formerly compressed nitrogen
>would sink to the floor where it would finish you off.

I've been in places where N2 was used and there were O2 sensors
pinging away every thirty seconds or so.

--

-Pip

AJH <news@loampitsfarm.co.uk> wrote:

> So a car exhaust, now non toxic as it's free of CO bubbled through
> caustic soda solution will still do the job.

Free of CO, but certainly not free of CO2? Or does passing it through
the caustic soda solution somehow collect the CO2 as well?

Been a while since I had my last chemistry class (Sorry Prof Pignolet).

--
FJR1300A, GL1000, KLR650A6F, EX250J9A, DR200SE, Vespa Ciao

On 10/09/2021 18:29 Ace penned these words:
> On 10 Sep 2021 08:09:59 GMT, "sweller" <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk>
> wrote:
>
>> Turby wrote:
>>
>>>> Or you could survive just long enough to make your last minutes a
>>>> living hell.
>>>>
>>> This. Helium is painless.
>>
>> Why is helium painless?
>>
>> I would have thought you would still be gripped by panic and fight for
>> breath?
>
> No, it's not lack of oxygen that causes you to breath hard, but excess
> carbon dioxide. So your breathing will remain pretty much normal,
> you'll simply fall uncoscious and die.
>

I believe I saw a documentary snippet where there was talk of doing this as a
execution method in the US, there was some practice work done on pigs. Hypoxia
is an issue we had to be aware of diving rebreathers since you just pass out.

--
Ian

"Man will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of
the last priest"

On 11/09/2021 04:43 Mark Olson penned these words:
> AJH <news@loampitsfarm.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> So a car exhaust, now non toxic as it's free of CO bubbled through
>> caustic soda solution will still do the job.
>
> Free of CO, but certainly not free of CO2? Or does passing it through
> the caustic soda solution somehow collect the CO2 as well?
>
> Been a while since I had my last chemistry class (Sorry Prof Pignolet).
>
Not sure if caustic soda alone will do, what you want it is soda lime which has
some other additions that is generally used. It's an exothermic reaction so as
the soda lime absorbs CO2 and depletes it gets hot.

--
Ian

"Man will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of
the last priest"

On 07/09/2021 10:07, sweller wrote:
> Champ wrote:
>
>>> I never got my head round wh some kids, including at least one of my
>>> brothers, would bother painting airfkx models, let alone toy
>>> soldiers. Sure, I'd stick the transfers on, but painting them just
>>> seemed like faff for the sake of faff.
>>
>> Eh? Painting was part of the job, and the fun.
>>
>> I even used to try and create a 'skin tone' colour to paint the face
>> of the pilot in the plane.
>
> The bulk of the painting was done whilst it was still in the frames.
>
Did you remember to wash them in mild washing-up liquid to remove the
glaze so that the paint would adhere better and could be applied thinner
so that the fine moulding detail wasn't lost?

Tim wrote:

> Did you remember to wash them in mild washing-up liquid to remove the
> glaze so that the paint would adhere better and could be applied
> thinner so that the fine moulding detail wasn't lost?

I can't say I did that - I wasn't that good at painting...

--
Simon

On 10/09/2021 17:48, Pipl wrote:
> On Fri, 10 Sep 2021 17:08:03 +0100, Colin Irvine
> <look@colinandpat.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 10 Sep 2021 12:51:47 +0100, Champ <neal@champ.org.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> On 10 Sep 2021 10:50:20 GMT, "sweller" <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Ace wrote:
>>>>> No, it's not lack of oxygen that causes you to breath hard, but excess
>>>>> carbon dioxide. So your breathing will remain pretty much normal,
>>>>> you'll simply fall uncoscious and die.
>>>
>>>> Didn't know that.
>>>
>>> Me neither.
>>
>> +1
>
> There was that Lear jet that crashed after the cabin lost pressure as
> it was climbing to cruise altitude: everyone on board simply fell
> unconscious. The CVR recorded that cabin pressurisation alarm was
> sounding in the last thirty minutes of flight.
>
> The theory was that the cabin pressure checklist was so convoluted
> that the crew passed out while trying to follow it. Apparently the
> NTSB recommendation from that was that the first line should read "Put
> on oxygen mask", among other things.
>

The golfer. <googles> Payne Stewart.

--
/Simon

On Sat, 11 Sep 2021 12:51:11 +0100, siwilson
<siwilson@nodamnspam.hotmail.com> wrote:

>On 10/09/2021 17:48, Pipl wrote:
>> There was that Lear jet that crashed after the cabin lost pressure as
>> it was climbing to cruise altitude: everyone on board simply fell
>> unconscious. The CVR recorded that cabin pressurisation alarm was
>> sounding in the last thirty minutes of flight.
>>
>> The theory was that the cabin pressure checklist was so convoluted
>> that the crew passed out while trying to follow it. Apparently the
>> NTSB recommendation from that was that the first line should read "Put
>> on oxygen mask", among other things.
>>
>
>The golfer. <googles> Payne Stewart.

That's the one.

--

-Pip

On Fri, 10 Sep 2021 21:11:36 +0100, Pipl <pluscher@live.co.uk> wrote:

>On Fri, 10 Sep 2021 18:16:23 -0000 (UTC), wessie
><willnotwork@tesco.net> wrote:
>
>>similar with nitrogen.
>>
>>When I was in electronics we had a nitrogen blanket over the flow solder
>>pot to stop oxidation. When the maintenance crew had the hatches open they
>>had to wear breathing apparatus as they would have little warning if there
>>was a nitrogen leak, just pass out. The cold formerly compressed nitrogen
>>would sink to the floor where it would finish you off.
>
>I've been in places where N2 was used and there were O2 sensors
>pinging away every thirty seconds or so.

On some ships I served on there were spaces which had inert gas
(argon, IIRC) flooding fire control systems. Oxygen sensors would be
redundant, but of course there were processes in place to ensure said
spaces were evacuated and isolated before use. I don't quite remember
the details though.

--
Ace
http://www.chaletbeauroc.com/

On 11/09/2021 03:17, Boots wrote:
> On 11/09/2021 04:43 Mark Olson penned these words:
>> AJH <news@loampitsfarm.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> So a car exhaust, now non toxic as it's free of CO bubbled through
>>> caustic soda solution will still do the job.
>>
>> Free of CO, but certainly not free of CO2? Or does passing it through
>> the caustic soda solution somehow collect the CO2 as well?
>>
>> Been a while since I had my last chemistry class (Sorry Prof Pignolet).
>>
> Not sure if caustic soda alone will do, what you want it is soda lime which has
> some other additions that is generally used. It's an exothermic reaction so as
> the soda lime absorbs CO2 and depletes it gets hot.
>
You are right it's calcium hydroxide thats needed to precipitate out
chalk, not sodium hydroxide, I was mixing up the common names

On 11/09/2021 03:11, Boots wrote:
> On 10/09/2021 18:29 Ace penned these words:
>> On 10 Sep 2021 08:09:59 GMT, "sweller" <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Turby wrote:
>>>
>>>>> Or you could survive just long enough to make your last minutes a
>>>>> living hell.
>>>>>
>>>> This. Helium is painless.
>>>
>>> Why is helium painless?
>>>
>>> I would have thought you would still be gripped by panic and fight for
>>> breath?
>>
>> No, it's not lack of oxygen that causes you to breath hard, but excess
>> carbon dioxide. So your breathing will remain pretty much normal,
>> you'll simply fall uncoscious and die.
>>
>
> I believe I saw a documentary snippet where there was talk of doing this as a
> execution method in the US, there was some practice work done on pigs. Hypoxia
> is an issue we had to be aware of diving rebreathers since you just pass out.

Someone who was on a bassists' web forum I'm on killed himself this way
a few years ago. He wrote about his plans on his website just prior to
his death. There was a link, but it's gone now (the link, that is, the
website might still be there). Can't remember what gas he intended to use.

On 11/09/2021 20:46 Ace penned these words:
> On Fri, 10 Sep 2021 21:11:36 +0100, Pipl <pluscher@live.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 10 Sep 2021 18:16:23 -0000 (UTC), wessie
>> <willnotwork@tesco.net> wrote:
>>
>>> similar with nitrogen.
>>>
>>> When I was in electronics we had a nitrogen blanket over the flow solder
>>> pot to stop oxidation. When the maintenance crew had the hatches open they
>>> had to wear breathing apparatus as they would have little warning if there
>>> was a nitrogen leak, just pass out. The cold formerly compressed nitrogen
>>> would sink to the floor where it would finish you off.
>>
>> I've been in places where N2 was used and there were O2 sensors
>> pinging away every thirty seconds or so.
>
> On some ships I served on there were spaces which had inert gas
> (argon, IIRC) flooding fire control systems. Oxygen sensors would be
> redundant, but of course there were processes in place to ensure said
> spaces were evacuated and isolated before use. I don't quite remember
> the details though.
>
The halon systems used a lot of places I worked had a siren and strobes that
triggered 30 seconds before gas as I recall for mush the same reason.

--
Ian

"Man will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of
the last priest"

On Sun, 12 Sep 2021 09:42:53 +0800, Boots
<news@millhouse-communications.co.uk> wrote:

>On 11/09/2021 20:46 Ace penned these words:

>> On some ships I served on there were spaces which had inert gas
>> (argon, IIRC) flooding fire control systems. Oxygen sensors would be
>> redundant, but of course there were processes in place to ensure said
>> spaces were evacuated and isolated before use. I don't quite remember
>> the details though.
>>
>The halon systems used a lot of places I worked had a siren and strobes that
>triggered 30 seconds before gas as I recall for mush the same reason.

Yeah, that sounds familiar, and also the use, back then of halon. not
argon.

Oddly enough it seems (or so google tells me) that halon use was
discontinued twenty years or more ago, now using various agents
instead, most commonly a 50/50 argon/nitrogen mixture, so meh.

--
Ace
http://www.chaletbeauroc.com/