On 05/05/2022 15:59, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 05/05/2022 12:48, GB wrote:
>> If, as others have suggested, the OP appoints a solicitor or bank as
>> executor, it could be easy for Hubby to keep the executor in the dark
>> about the death. Then, Hubby claims the body, and by the time the
>> executor comes on the scene perhaps months later, the body has long
>> since been cremated.
>
> I think this is verging on fantasy.
> A death involves many agencies - possibly police, ambulance, social
> services..it's quite hard to keep them apart.
>
> For example unless you forge signatures you cant access a dead person's
> account that easily, and if you do, its criminal .
>
> That is unless something is clearly passed on to you by the will, or by
> common law,  grabbing it is theft.
>

I'm not talking about raiding the bank.

When Mother in Law died, she did so at home. The doctor issued a death
certificate. There may have been two doctors involved, as this was
post-Shipley. The coroner wasn't interested.

The funeral was arranged by my BIL, and the only document he was asked
to show was the death certificate. She was actually buried less than 24
hours after she died, because that suited BIL.

As it happens, BIL was one of the executors, but he was never required
to prove it.

I really can't see what would stop the OP's husband from doing likewise,
except he'd choose a cheap cremation. Where's the fantasy?

On 05/05/2022 16:00, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 05/05/2022 12:36, aprilswee...@gmail.com wrote:
>> Outside of large cities local solicitors can be of varying standards.
> whereas inside of cities they are universally shark like
>

:)

On 05/05/2022 15:59, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 05/05/2022 12:48, GB wrote:
>> If, as others have suggested, the OP appoints a solicitor or bank as
>> executor, it could be easy for Hubby to keep the executor in the dark
>> about the death. Then, Hubby claims the body, and by the time the
>> executor comes on the scene perhaps months later, the body has long
>> since been cremated.
>
> I think this is verging on fantasy.
> A death involves many agencies - possibly police, ambulance, social
> services..it's quite hard to keep them apart.
>
> For example unless you forge signatures you cant access a dead person's
> account that easily, and if you do, its criminal .
>
> That is unless something is clearly passed on to you by the will, or by
> common law,  grabbing it is theft.
>

I have no idea why you claim it is "verging on fantasy". Nothing in the
normal process after a death requires enquiries into the existence of a
will before the funeral. If Hubby is not the executor he could, if
asked, deny knowledge of any will. He then stand as clearly first in
line in the putative intestacy and not just able to arrange the disposal
of the body but responsible for doing so. What happens later when the
executor learns of the death is another matter. But AFAIK Hubby would
have committed no criminal offence. And who would have standing to sue
him and for what?

--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

On 05/05/2022 17:03, Robin wrote:
> On 05/05/2022 15:59, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> On 05/05/2022 12:48, GB wrote:
>>> If, as others have suggested, the OP appoints a solicitor or bank as
>>> executor, it could be easy for Hubby to keep the executor in the dark
>>> about the death. Then, Hubby claims the body, and by the time the
>>> executor comes on the scene perhaps months later, the body has long
>>> since been cremated.
>>
>> I think this is verging on fantasy.
>> A death involves many agencies - possibly police, ambulance, social
>> services..it's quite hard to keep them apart.
>>
>> For example unless you forge signatures you cant access a dead
>> person's account that easily, and if you do, its criminal .
>>
>> That is unless something is clearly passed on to you by the will, or
>> by common law,  grabbing it is theft.
>>
>
> I have no idea why you claim it is "verging on fantasy".  Nothing in the
> normal process after a death requires enquiries into the existence of a
> will before the funeral.  If Hubby is not the executor he could, if
> asked, deny knowledge of any will.  He then stand as clearly first in
> line in the putative intestacy and not just able to arrange the disposal
> of the body but responsible for doing so.   What happens later when the
> executor learns of the death is another matter.  But AFAIK Hubby would
> have committed no criminal offence.  And who would have standing to sue
> him and for what?
>

I was perplexed by the reference to social services. They have their
work cut out caring for the living.

On Thu, 05 May 2022 19:28:03 +1000, Owain Lastname
<spuorgelgoog@gowanhill.com> wrote:

> On Thursday, 5 May 2022 at 09:45:33 UTC+1, John Rumm wrote:
>> Decide what you want, arrange it and pay for it now, then leave detailed
>> instructions. Put it in the will, and chose trustworthy executors.
>
> That's about it.
> Also, put in the Will that any costs for any other type of funeral are
> not to be paid from estate funds (that may not be legally enforceable),

> or if they are, they are to come out of husband's share of the estate.

Certainly not going to be legally enforceable and may see the whole will
binned.

On Thu, 05 May 2022 20:59:09 +1000, Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> wrote:

> Jock wrote:
>
>> Andy Burns wrote:
>>
>>> aprilswee...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
>>>> Is there any way I can ensure he doesnt send me off to a paupers grave
>>>> or worse, burn me to save money?
>>>
>>> Put it in your will, and name someone you trust to carry out your
>>> wishes as your executor?
>> He can just ignore the will unless you pick an executor who will force
>> it to be carried out.
>
> That's what I said, if she doesn't trust him to carry out her will, pick
> someone else who she does trust.
>
> It'd work out more expensive to use a solicitor rather than a relative
> as executor, but they're far more likely to do as she requests.

Trouble is that a relo may die or be killed first.

Not sure what happens if the solicitor retires or goes broke.

On Thu, 05 May 2022 21:33:47 +1000, Clive Arthur <clive@nowaytoday.co.uk>
wrote:

> On 05/05/2022 07:56, aprilswee...@gmail.com wrote:
>> My OH and I have very different ideas about funerals. I want to be
>> buried in a churchyard ( my family are a graveyard type family). My OH
>> have always been burners.
>>
> <snipped>
>> I dont want a paupers funeral. I dont want a paupers grave. I can
>> afford better. Is there any way I can ensure he doesnt send me off to
>> a paupers grave or worse, burn me to save money?
>> I know people ignore wills. Many have been sidestepped in my family
>> and my OH's. Burned, lost, and plain ignored. Is there a way I can
>> make sure I just get a decent burial when I am gone from this life?
>
> A tattoo would be hard to ignore.

He can always claim she changed her mind and hadn't
gotten around to having the tattoo changed because
the original tattoo was very unpleasant when it was done.

On Fri, 06 May 2022 00:59:15 +1000, The Natural Philosopher
<tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:

> On 05/05/2022 12:48, GB wrote:
>> If, as others have suggested, the OP appoints a solicitor or bank as
>> executor, it could be easy for Hubby to keep the executor in the dark
>> about the death. Then, Hubby claims the body, and by the time the
>> executor comes on the scene perhaps months later, the body has long
>> since been cremated.

> I think this is verging on fantasy.

I don't.

> A death involves many agencies - possibly police, ambulance, social
> services..it's quite hard to keep them apart.

But it can still take quite a while before a bank or solicitor finds
out about a death, by which time the body has been cremated.

> For example unless you forge signatures you cant access a dead person's
> account that easily, and if you do, its criminal .

But her hubby may well decide to go for the cheaper
cremation, pay for that out of his own money given
that he knows that her estate will be his eventually.

> That is unless something is clearly passed on to you by the will, or by
> common law, grabbing it is theft.

But it wouldn't be grabbing anyting to pay for the cremation
knowing that you will end up with more when the estate settles.

GB used his keyboard to write :
> You can have telephone cons with your GP, as and when needed.

They are now pushing F2F and limiting the issue of phone appointments.

On 05/05/2022 19:37, Harry Bloomfield Esq wrote:
> GB used his keyboard to write :
>> You can have telephone cons with your GP, as and when needed.
>
> They are now pushing F2F and limiting the issue of phone appointments.

That's good to know.

GB laid this down on his screen :
> That's good to know.

I fancy the NHS has leaned on local surgeries, to run more F2F
appoinments. I wanted a phone appointment last wekk, but none available
for weeks - I had to settle for a next day F2F.

On 05/05/2022 20:15, Harry Bloomfield Esq wrote:
> GB laid this down on his screen :
>> That's good to know.
>
> I fancy the NHS has leaned on local surgeries, to run more F2F
> appoinments. I wanted a phone appointment last wekk, but none available
> for weeks - I had to settle for a next day F2F.

Typical of large institutions and governments - in trying to solve the
lack of f2f appointments, they effectively remove the option of phone
appointments, forcing people who work to take half a day or more
(depending upon commute time and appointment time) off, for a few
minutes to discuss getting a referral elsewhere!

On 05/05/2022 07:56, aprilswee...@gmail.com wrote:
> My OH and I have very different ideas about funerals. I want to be buried in a churchyard ( my family are a graveyard type family). My OH have always been burners.
>
> The other day ( after watching TV adverts or listening to some radio programme about funerals I think) he told me that funeral costs were very expensive and indicated that if I die before him he will opt for the plainest, simplest funeral/ cremation he can get to "Save money" We dont need to save money is the first point here. I have money of my own from my aunt as an inheritance anyway. Thats in addition to working for 40 odd years and having some money from that although that always ended up in the joint money pot ( big mistake as OH thinks he earned all that money, not me). He is something of a miser.
>
> I dont want a paupers funeral. I dont want a paupers grave. I can afford better. Is there any way I can ensure he doesnt send me off to a paupers grave or worse, burn me to save money?
>
> I know people ignore wills. Many have been sidestepped in my family and my OH's. Burned, lost, and plain ignored. Is there a way I can make sure I just get a decent burial when I am gone from this life?
>
> I know its a contentious issue. I wont engage in the whys and wherefores of peoples ideas on disposing of bodies after death. The question is simple for me.

Can he bury you under your bridge?

In article <t517nn$a7m$1@dont-email.me>,
Harry Bloomfield Esq <a@harrym1byt.plus.com> wrote:
> GB laid this down on his screen :
> > That's good to know.

> I fancy the NHS has leaned on local surgeries, to run more F2F
> appoinments. I wanted a phone appointment last wekk, but none available
> for weeks - I had to settle for a next day F2F.

I hae=da F2F booked about a month ago, I was run the day before saying it
would be a phone call since the doctor was self isolating.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

On 05/05/2022 16:14, Peter Johnson wrote:
> On Thu, 5 May 2022 10:30:19 +0100, Colin Bignell
> <cpb@bignellREMOVETHIS.me.uk> wrote:
>
>
>>
>> However, remember that, these days, a burial plot is normally not yours
>> forever. What you buy is a right to exclusive use for a set period,
>> usually between 50 and 100 years. After that time, notices will be
>> posted on the headstone and, if known, sent to the holder of the right,
>> asking if the right is to be renewed, for a payment. If not, the body
>> will not be disturbed, but the headstone may be removed and another body
>> buried in the same plot.
>
> The only place where I have found that, in more than 100 churchyards
> and cemeteries visited, is at the Kensal Green Roman Catholic Cemetery
> in north London. There, they levelled part of the site, tipped about a
> yard depth of earth over the top and started burials again. Don't know
> what they did with the original memorials.
> In a good number of cemeteries/churchards I often think that the
> interred woulf be horrified if they knew how their graves were
> neglected. Even a bequest for maintenance is no guarantee. £100 left
> in 1910, Shirehampton, Bristol, would not have lasted very long.

I'm going by what the funeral director told me when arranging for my
late partner's funeral and before we found that her will said she wanted
to be cremated.

--
Colin Bignell

On 05/05/2022 18:11, Jock wrote:

> Not sure what happens if the solicitor retires or goes broke.

I was once half way through a complicated property transaction when the
other party's solicitor suddenly died. We had to start from scratch.

Bill

On 05/05/2022 12:38, aprilswee...@gmail.com wrote:
> It needs a solution not a bunch of anti depressants to make me feel happy about something I am not happy about.

It's true that medication or CBT cannot put your life right, but they
can help you cope with its defects.

Bill

On 05/05/2022 18:00, Jock wrote:
> On Thu, 05 May 2022 19:28:03 +1000, Owain Lastname
> <spuorgelgoog@gowanhill.com> wrote:
>
>> On Thursday, 5 May 2022 at 09:45:33 UTC+1, John Rumm wrote:
>>> Decide what you want, arrange it and pay for it now, then leave detailed
>>> instructions. Put it in the will, and chose trustworthy executors.
>>
>> That's about it.
>> Also, put in the Will that any costs for any other type of funeral are
>> not to be paid from estate funds (that may not be legally enforceable),
>
>> or if they are, they are to come out of husband's share of the estate.
>
> Certainly not going to be legally enforceable and may see the whole will
> binned.

Please do explain why.

On Fri, 06 May 2022 10:30:08 +1000, williamwright <wrightsaerials@f2s.com>
wrote:

> On 05/05/2022 18:11, Jock wrote:
>
>> Not sure what happens if the solicitor retires or goes broke.
>
> I was once half way through a complicated property transaction when the
> other party's solicitor suddenly died. We had to start from scratch.

It's different tho with an executor. Not sure what happens when
the executor dies and is no longer able to be the executor.

Not sure what happens fees wise if say you specify that another solicitor
if the
first executor dies, whether you have to pay both up front when making out
the will.

On Fri, 06 May 2022 11:11:24 +1000, Fredxx <fredxx@spam.uk> wrote:

> On 05/05/2022 18:00, Jock wrote:
>> On Thu, 05 May 2022 19:28:03 +1000, Owain Lastname
>> <spuorgelgoog@gowanhill.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Thursday, 5 May 2022 at 09:45:33 UTC+1, John Rumm wrote:
>>>> Decide what you want, arrange it and pay for it now, then leave
>>>> detailed
>>>> instructions. Put it in the will, and chose trustworthy executors.
>>>
>>> That's about it.
>>> Also, put in the Will that any costs for any other type of funeral are
>>> not to be paid from estate funds (that may not be legally enforceable),
>>
>>> or if they are, they are to come out of husband's share of the estate.
>> Certainly not going to be legally enforceable and may see the whole
>> will binned.
>
> Please do explain why.

You can't specify what the husband's share of the estate gets spent on.

On Fri, 06 May 2022 11:30:49 +1000, Jock <kdj@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Fri, 06 May 2022 11:11:24 +1000, Fredxx <fredxx@spam.uk> wrote:
>
>> On 05/05/2022 18:00, Jock wrote:
>>> On Thu, 05 May 2022 19:28:03 +1000, Owain Lastname
>>> <spuorgelgoog@gowanhill.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Thursday, 5 May 2022 at 09:45:33 UTC+1, John Rumm wrote:
>>>>> Decide what you want, arrange it and pay for it now, then leave
>>>>> detailed
>>>>> instructions. Put it in the will, and chose trustworthy executors.
>>>>
>>>> That's about it.
>>>> Also, put in the Will that any costs for any other type of funeral
>>>> are not to be paid from estate funds (that may not be legally
>>>> enforceable),
>>>
>>>> or if they are, they are to come out of husband's share of the estate.
>>> Certainly not going to be legally enforceable and may see the whole
>>> will binned.
>>
>> Please do explain why.
>
> You can't specify what the husband's share of the estate gets spent on.

Academic anyway given that he wants to spend less on the what
happens to the body than she does and wants what is essentially
instesticce with the distribution of the estate which means he get
the lot apart from some other things the estate pays for.

On 06/05/2022 02:30, Jock wrote:
> On Fri, 06 May 2022 11:11:24 +1000, Fredxx <fredxx@spam.uk> wrote:
>
>> On 05/05/2022 18:00, Jock wrote:
>>> On Thu, 05 May 2022 19:28:03 +1000, Owain Lastname
>>> <spuorgelgoog@gowanhill.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Thursday, 5 May 2022 at 09:45:33 UTC+1, John Rumm wrote:
>>>>> Decide what you want, arrange it and pay for it now, then leave
>>>>> detailed
>>>>> instructions. Put it in the will, and chose trustworthy executors.
>>>>
>>>> That's about it.
>>>> Also, put in the Will that any costs for any other type of funeral
>>>> are not to be paid from estate funds (that may not be legally
>>>> enforceable),
>>>
>>>> or if they are, they are to come out of husband's share of the estate.
>>>  Certainly not going to be legally enforceable and may see the whole
>>> will binned.
>>
>> Please do explain why.
>
> You can't specify what the husband's share of the estate gets spent on.

Quite, the issue is about the wife's share. Where there is a dispute the
amount the hubby could ever claim is half the estate or along the lines
as if they had divorced.

That still doesn't mean that her share going to him can't be conditional
on her being buried. So such a Will can be enforceable.

On Fri, 06 May 2022 11:47:50 +1000, Fredxx <fredxx@spam.uk> wrote:

> On 06/05/2022 02:30, Jock wrote:
>> On Fri, 06 May 2022 11:11:24 +1000, Fredxx <fredxx@spam.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> On 05/05/2022 18:00, Jock wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 05 May 2022 19:28:03 +1000, Owain Lastname
>>>> <spuorgelgoog@gowanhill.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Thursday, 5 May 2022 at 09:45:33 UTC+1, John Rumm wrote:
>>>>>> Decide what you want, arrange it and pay for it now, then leave
>>>>>> detailed
>>>>>> instructions. Put it in the will, and chose trustworthy executors.
>>>>>
>>>>> That's about it.
>>>>> Also, put in the Will that any costs for any other type of funeral
>>>>> are not to be paid from estate funds (that may not be legally
>>>>> enforceable),
>>>>
>>>>> or if they are, they are to come out of husband's share of the
>>>>> estate.
>>>> Certainly not going to be legally enforceable and may see the whole
>>>> will binned.
>>>
>>> Please do explain why.
>> You can't specify what the husband's share of the estate gets spent on.
>
> Quite, the issue is about the wife's share.

That is not what Owan said.

> Where there is a dispute

There is no dispute given that she wants intestacy on the distribution.

> the amount the hubby could ever claim

There is no claim given that she wants intestacy on the distribution.

> is half the estate or along the lines as if they had divorced.

That isnt what intestacy delivers.

> That still doesn't mean that her share going to him can't be conditional
> on her being buried. So such a Will can be enforceable.

She said she wants intestacy, not a specification of who gets what.

On Friday, May 6, 2022 at 1:33:08 AM UTC+1, wrights...@f2s.com wrote:
> On 05/05/2022 12:38, aprilswee...@gmail.com wrote:
> > It needs a solution not a bunch of anti depressants to make me feel happy about something I am not happy about.
> It's true that medication or CBT cannot put your life right, but they
> can help you cope with its defects.
>
> Bill

It is not appropriate for my situation. I am not suffering from a mental illness/ health issue. CBT will not change the fact my OH wants to burn me when I want to be buried. Or are you suggesting I ask a therapist to change my thinking patterns to accept my OH's point of view?

CBT can only change the thinking patterns of those who under go it. It cannot change a situation.

aprilswee...@gmail.com <aprilsweetheartrose@gmail.com> wrote:
> My OH and I have very different ideas about funerals. I want to be
> buried in a churchyard ( my family are a graveyard type family). My OH
> have always been burners.
>
> The other day ( after watching TV adverts or listening to some radio
> programme about funerals I think) he told me that funeral costs were very
> expensive and indicated that if I die before him he will opt for the
> plainest, simplest funeral/ cremation he can get to "Save money" We dont
> need to save money is the first point here. I have money of my own from
> my aunt as an inheritance anyway. Thats in addition to working for 40 odd
> years and having some money from that although that always ended up in
> the joint money pot ( big mistake as OH thinks he earned all that money,
> not me). He is something of a miser.
>
> I dont want a paupers funeral. I dont want a paupers grave. I can afford
> better. Is there any way I can ensure he doesnt send me off to a
> paupers grave or worse, burn me to save money?
>
> I know people ignore wills. Many have been sidestepped in my family and
> my OH's. Burned, lost, and plain ignored. Is there a way I can make
> sure I just get a decent burial when I am gone from this life?
>
> I know its a contentious issue. I wont engage in the whys and wherefores
> of peoples ideas on disposing of bodies after death. The question is simple for me.
>

Buy one of those pre-paid plans and pay for it.

Nothing will be saved if your wishes aren’t followed.