I used a week off work between Christmas and New Year to replace the
fork seals on a 1997 Honda NTV 650. I think they were still original,
the outer dust caps were falling apart and concealed a nasty oil/water
gunge underneath. Everything went swimmingly until I came to dismantle
the second fork leg. Whilst employing the 'slide hammer' method to
remove the fork tube and top bush/oil seal (worked fine on the first
leg) I came up against a tight top bush and ended up with the fork tube
breaking free whilst somehow leaving the top bush and oil seal still in
the slider. Problem! I got the oil seal out OK but the top bush was
firmly stuck (and unreachable). I decided that heat was going to be the
answer but was worried about the plastic coating on the aluminium
slider. I read on the internet that a deep fat fryer was the solution,
180 degC without damaging the plastic coating. I got as far as warming
up the chip fryer but decided to have a careful go with a blowtorch
first. Gently warmed the slider around the bush, bashed it end first on
a block of wood and was rewarded with a satisfying 'clink' as the top
bush fell out.
Re- assembly went without problem and I'm pleased with the result, the
difference is comparable with night and day.
Things I learned: Allow plenty of time so inevitable problems can be
handled by sitting back with a cup of tea and a think instead of
ploughing on with angle grinder/ hammer and chisel.
Mr Honda puts his motorcycles together exceedingly well.
WD40 penetrating oil is good stuff (has a very authentic workshop smell
too).
Replacing fork seals on a SOB can be very rewarding.
Whilst scrubbing the dismantled forks clean in the kitchen sink, my
daughter (working on a laptop at the kitchen table) suddenly leaned
back in her chair, stared wistfully at the ceiling and said " That
smell, it reminds me of the car deck on a cross-channel ferry" and she
was right :-)

--
Geoff

On 03/01/2022 20:11, geoffC wrote:
>
> I used a week off work between Christmas and New Year to replace the

> fork seals on a 1997 Honda NTV 650. I think they were still original,

<snip>

> Things I learned: Allow plenty of time so inevitable problems can be
> handled by sitting back with a cup of tea and a think instead of
> ploughing on with angle grinder/ hammer and chisel.

This is why I don't do fork seals, I prefer to find "a man who can".

> Mr Honda puts his motorcycles together exceedingly well.
> WD40 penetrating oil is good stuff (has a very authentic workshop smell
> too).
> Replacing fork seals on a SOB can be very rewarding.

Only when the "man who can" does it for me.

> Whilst scrubbing the dismantled forks clean in the kitchen sink, my
> daughter (working on a laptop at the kitchen table) suddenly leaned
> back in her chair, stared wistfully at the ceiling and said " That
> smell, it reminds me of the car deck on a cross-channel ferry" and she
> was right :-)
>

I'd be wondering what daughter was doing on that car deck .....
>

--
Bruce Porter
"The internet is a huge and diverse community but mainly friendly"
http://ytc1.blogspot.co.uk/
There *is* an alternative! http://www.openoffice.org/

geoffC <me@home.nl> wrote:
>
> Things I learned: Allow plenty of time so inevitable problems can be
> handled by sitting back with a cup of tea and a think instead of
> ploughing on with angle grinder/ hammer and chisel.

A valuable lesson. Unfortunately, one that some of us have had to
(or yet to) learn through plenty of repetition.

--
FJR1300A, GL1000, KLR650A6F, EX250J9A, DR200SE, Vespa Ciao

YTC#1 wrote:

> On 03/01/2022 20:11, geoffC wrote:
<SNIP>
>
> > Whilst scrubbing the dismantled forks clean in the kitchen sink, my
> > daughter (working on a laptop at the kitchen table) suddenly leaned
> > back in her chair, stared wistfully at the ceiling and said " That
> > smell, it reminds me of the car deck on a cross-channel ferry" and
> > she was right :-)
> >
>
> I'd be wondering what daughter was doing on that car deck .....
> >

Getting in or out of the car, it's the time when they have usually just
raised or lowered the loading ramp and you get that peculiar
'hydraulic' smell

--
Geoff

geoffC wrote:

> WD40 penetrating oil is good stuff (has a very authentic workshop
> smell too).

Is this different to the ubiquitous blue can stuff? The water
dispersant spray is hopeless as a penetrating fluid.

I once had some black fluid just described as "Penetrating Oil" on the
large, elderly and old fashioned oil can. It had magic loosening
properties (I regularly worked on a lot of very old and manky vehicles)
- no idea who made it.

> Replacing fork seals on a SOB can be very rewarding.

Used fork oil is on my list of most foul smelling substances, along
with used EP gearbox oil. Both get everywhere too.

--
Simon

On 04/01/2022 08:21, sweller wrote:
> geoffC wrote:
>
>> WD40 penetrating oil is good stuff (has a very authentic workshop
>> smell too).
>
> Is this different to the ubiquitous blue can stuff? The water
> dispersant spray is hopeless as a penetrating fluid.
>
> I once had some black fluid just described as "Penetrating Oil" on the
> large, elderly and old fashioned oil can. It had magic loosening
> properties (I regularly worked on a lot of very old and manky vehicles)
> - no idea who made it.
>
>
>> Replacing fork seals on a SOB can be very rewarding.
>
> Used fork oil is on my list of most foul smelling substances, along
> with used EP gearbox oil. Both get everywhere too.
>

Indeed. Rancid Putoline fork oil Ewww!

Nothing acts faster (Tm. Anadin) than Plusgas IME. Though 'Shock 'n
Unlock' has it's uses if a bit of heat can be used.

--
Moto Morini 2C/375, Moto Morini 2C/350
Gilera 175 Sport, Husqvarna 401 Svartpilen
1937 Sunbeam Model 14 250 Sports
"Do not adjust your mind, there is a fault in the reality"

Pete Fisher wrote:

> Nothing acts faster (Tm. Anadin) than Plusgas IME

It's good but I've found the graphite pentrating oil from Toolstation
to be just as effective - and a lot cheaper.

--
Simon

On 04/01/2022 08:38, sweller wrote:
> Pete Fisher wrote:
>
>> Nothing acts faster (Tm. Anadin) than Plusgas IME
>
> It's good but I've found the graphite pentrating oil from Toolstation
> to be just as effective - and a lot cheaper.
>

Personal recommendation is always welcome. I shall JFGI.

--
Moto Morini 2C/375, Moto Morini 2C/350
Gilera 175 Sport, Husqvarna 401 Svartpilen
1937 Sunbeam Model 14 250 Sports
"Do not adjust your mind, there is a fault in the reality"

Pete Fisher <peter@ps-fisher.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> On 04/01/2022 08:38, sweller wrote:
>> Pete Fisher wrote:
>>
>>> Nothing acts faster (Tm. Anadin) than Plusgas IME
>>
>> It's good but I've found the graphite pentrating oil from Toolstation
>> to be just as effective - and a lot cheaper.
>>
>
> Personal recommendation is always welcome. I shall JFGI.

Kroil has a good reputation on this side of the pond. Not sure if
you can buy it in the UK.

https://www.kroil.com/products/kroil-original-penetrant-best-penetrating-oil/

--
FJR1300A, GL1000, KLR650A6F, EX250J9A, DR200SE, Vespa Ciao

Mark Olson wrote:

> Pete Fisher <peter@ps-fisher.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> > On 04/01/2022 08:38, sweller wrote:
> >> Pete Fisher wrote:
> >>
> >>> Nothing acts faster (Tm. Anadin) than Plusgas IME
> >>
> >> It's good but I've found the graphite pentrating oil from
> Toolstation >> to be just as effective - and a lot cheaper.
> >>
> >
> > Personal recommendation is always welcome. I shall JFGI.
>
> Kroil has a good reputation on this side of the pond. Not sure if
> you can buy it in the UK.
>
>
https://www.kroil.com/products/kroil-original-penetrant-best-penetrating-oil/

Project Farm on YT has done penetrating oils, but not including PlusGas
or S&U iirc. I'm slightly on S&U's side these days.

--
Krusty

On Mon, 3 Jan 2022 21:57:08 +0000, YTC#1 <bdp@ytc1-spambin.co.uk>
wrote:

>> Things I learned: Allow plenty of time so inevitable problems can be
>> handled by sitting back with a cup of tea and a think instead of
>> ploughing on with angle grinder/ hammer and chisel.

>This is why I don't do fork seals, I prefer to find "a man who can".

I'm with you on this. I've pretty much done every job on a
motorcycle, including multiple various engine rebuilds, but forks -
ugh. Think I've done it once or twice
--
Champ
neal at champ dot org dot uk

I don't know, but I been told
You never slow down, you never grow old

Champ <neal@champ.org.uk> wrote:
> On Mon, 3 Jan 2022 21:57:08 +0000, YTC#1 <bdp@ytc1-spambin.co.uk>
> wrote:
>
>>> Things I learned: Allow plenty of time so inevitable problems can be
>>> handled by sitting back with a cup of tea and a think instead of
>>> ploughing on with angle grinder/ hammer and chisel.
>
>>This is why I don't do fork seals, I prefer to find "a man who can".
>
> I'm with you on this. I've pretty much done every job on a
> motorcycle, including multiple various engine rebuilds, but forks -
> ugh. Think I've done it once or twice

My problem is finding someone / someplace I can trust not to fuck it
up. I haven't had the greatest luck having simple jobs done correctly
at dealerships over the years.

The FJR forks have a middle bushing that's a bit tricky to install
without a piece of thin wall tubing of the proper diameter, which I
was lucky enough to find when I rebuilt them.

Which reminds me, it is overdue for a valve lash check/adjust. Ugh.

--
FJR1300A, GL1000, KLR650A6F, EX250J9A, DR200SE, Vespa Ciao

sweller wrote:

> geoffC wrote:
>
> > WD40 penetrating oil is good stuff (has a very authentic workshop
> > smell too).
>
> Is this different to the ubiquitous blue can stuff? The water
> dispersant spray is hopeless as a penetrating fluid.
>

Yes it's different,

https://www.wd40.com/products/penetrating-oil/

I used to use Plus Gas but it's not readily available here in NL.

--
Geoff

On 04/01/2022 08:38, sweller wrote:
> Pete Fisher wrote:
>
>> Nothing acts faster (Tm. Anadin) than Plusgas IME
>
> It's good but I've found the graphite pentrating oil from Toolstation
> to be just as effective - and a lot cheaper.
>

I use graphite power to lubricate locks but not seen an oil with it in,
what's the brand name and I'll give it a go.

I have an exhaust manifold to remove from a 55 year old tractor to
remove but I'm thinking the studs will break and have to be drilled.

On Tue, 04 Jan 2022 17:24:20 +0000, Champ <neal@champ.org.uk> wrote:

>On Mon, 3 Jan 2022 21:57:08 +0000, YTC#1 <bdp@ytc1-spambin.co.uk>
>wrote:
>
>>> Things I learned: Allow plenty of time so inevitable problems can be
>>> handled by sitting back with a cup of tea and a think instead of
>>> ploughing on with angle grinder/ hammer and chisel.
>
>>This is why I don't do fork seals, I prefer to find "a man who can".
>
>I'm with you on this. I've pretty much done every job on a
>motorcycle, including multiple various engine rebuilds, but forks -
>ugh. Think I've done it once or twice

Me too. It's a mucky, horrible job.

--

-Pip

On 4 Jan 2022 08:21:29 GMT, "sweller" <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk>
wrote:

>geoffC wrote:
>
>> WD40 penetrating oil is good stuff (has a very authentic workshop
>> smell too).
>
>Is this different to the ubiquitous blue can stuff? The water
>dispersant spray is hopeless as a penetrating fluid.
>
>I once had some black fluid just described as "Penetrating Oil" on the
>large, elderly and old fashioned oil can. It had magic loosening
>properties (I regularly worked on a lot of very old and manky vehicles)
>- no idea who made it.
>
>
>> Replacing fork seals on a SOB can be very rewarding.
>
>Used fork oil is on my list of most foul smelling substances,

Yes, I hate the stuff too.

>along
>with used EP gearbox oil.

....but oddly, not this.

> Both get everywhere too.

IME fork oil is worse for this: gearboxes would be fine if only
manufacturers would put the damn drain plug where it can actually
drain straight down and not onto e.g. a collector box.

--

-Pip

On 04/01/2022 17:33, Mark Olson wrote:
> Champ <neal@champ.org.uk> wrote:
>> On Mon, 3 Jan 2022 21:57:08 +0000, YTC#1 <bdp@ytc1-spambin.co.uk>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>> Things I learned: Allow plenty of time so inevitable problems can be
>>>> handled by sitting back with a cup of tea and a think instead of
>>>> ploughing on with angle grinder/ hammer and chisel.
>>
>>> This is why I don't do fork seals, I prefer to find "a man who can".
>>
>> I'm with you on this. I've pretty much done every job on a
>> motorcycle, including multiple various engine rebuilds, but forks -
>> ugh. Think I've done it once or twice
>
> My problem is finding someone / someplace I can trust not to fuck it
> up. I haven't had the greatest luck having simple jobs done correctly
> at dealerships over the years.

Heh, yeah.
After sourcing some seals for the Funduro in North Chile I spent a
couple of days hunting out the local mechanic (it was Xmas week), only
to watch him use a hammer and screwdriver ...........

When the seal went again a couple of days later I let the oil piss out
and then rode it without.

--
Bruce Porter
"The internet is a huge and diverse community but mainly friendly"
http://ytc1.blogspot.co.uk/
There *is* an alternative! http://www.openoffice.org/

On Tue, 4 Jan 2022 09:02:17 +0000, Pete Fisher
<peter@ps-fisher.demon.co.uk> wrote:

>On 04/01/2022 08:38, sweller wrote:
>> Pete Fisher wrote:
>>
>>> Nothing acts faster (Tm. Anadin) than Plusgas IME
>>
>> It's good but I've found the graphite pentrating oil from Toolstation
>> to be just as effective - and a lot cheaper.
>>
>
>Personal recommendation is always welcome. I shall JFGI.

It looks as though Holts Penetrating Oil, of which I have some left in
the bottom of the tin, is no longer available. Mind, mine must be
getting on for 50 years old, but it still works.

--
Colin Irvine
FJR1300A

Colin Irvine <look@colinandpat.co.uk> wrote in
news:vnratglkmbffvvje87b8fia503rradakr9@4ax.com:

> On Tue, 4 Jan 2022 09:02:17 +0000, Pete Fisher
> <peter@ps-fisher.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>On 04/01/2022 08:38, sweller wrote:
>>> Pete Fisher wrote:
>>>
>>>> Nothing acts faster (Tm. Anadin) than Plusgas IME
>>>
>>> It's good but I've found the graphite pentrating oil from Toolstation
>>> to be just as effective - and a lot cheaper.
>>>
>>
>>Personal recommendation is always welcome. I shall JFGI.
>
> It looks as though Holts Penetrating Oil, of which I have some left in
> the bottom of the tin, is no longer available. Mind, mine must be
> getting on for 50 years old, but it still works.
>

like most of those tins, it's now in an aerosol
https://www.holtsauto.com/holts/products/maintenance-spray/

On Tuesday, 4 January 2022 at 22:26:58 UTC, Pipl wrote:
> On Tue, 04 Jan 2022 17:24:20 +0000, Champ <ne...@champ.org.uk> wrote:

> >I'm with you on this. I've pretty much done every job on a
> >motorcycle, including multiple various engine rebuilds, but forks -
> >ugh. Think I've done it once or twice
> Me too. It's a mucky, horrible job.

I quite like it. Once the filthy old oil is drained then it's not a bad job.

I suspect I've rebuilt half a dozen or so sets of forks, mostly
dirt bikes but also some BMWs. Having the right tools certainly helps.

It's carburettors I don't like messing with. Oh, and fasteners on 1970s
bikes.

On Wed, 5 Jan 2022 11:37:49 -0000 (UTC), wessie
<willnotwork@tesco.net> wrote:

>Colin Irvine <look@colinandpat.co.uk> wrote in
>news:vnratglkmbffvvje87b8fia503rradakr9@4ax.com:
>
>> On Tue, 4 Jan 2022 09:02:17 +0000, Pete Fisher
>> <peter@ps-fisher.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>>On 04/01/2022 08:38, sweller wrote:
>>>> Pete Fisher wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Nothing acts faster (Tm. Anadin) than Plusgas IME
>>>>
>>>> It's good but I've found the graphite pentrating oil from Toolstation
>>>> to be just as effective - and a lot cheaper.
>>>>
>>>
>>>Personal recommendation is always welcome. I shall JFGI.
>>
>> It looks as though Holts Penetrating Oil, of which I have some left in
>> the bottom of the tin, is no longer available. Mind, mine must be
>> getting on for 50 years old, but it still works.
>>
>
>like most of those tins, it's now in an aerosol
>https://www.holtsauto.com/holts/products/maintenance-spray/

Huh. A retrograde step, IMHO. And it doesn't say what's in it.

--
Colin Irvine
FJR1300A

Colin Irvine <look@colinandpat.co.uk> wrote:
> On Wed, 5 Jan 2022 11:37:49 -0000 (UTC), wessie
> <willnotwork@tesco.net> wrote:
>
>>Colin Irvine <look@colinandpat.co.uk> wrote in

>>> It looks as though Holts Penetrating Oil, of which I have some left in
>>> the bottom of the tin, is no longer available. Mind, mine must be
>>> getting on for 50 years old, but it still works.
>>>
>>
>>like most of those tins, it's now in an aerosol
>>https://www.holtsauto.com/holts/products/maintenance-spray/
>
> Huh. A retrograde step, IMHO. And it doesn't say what's in it.

Almost certainly it's not the same formula as before. Might still
work OK, but my expectation, as with paint stripper, brake and carb
cleaners, and most other chemicals available to the public, that the
new stuff is safer to be around, but odds are it doesn't work nearly
as well as the old stuff.

--
FJR1300A, GL1000, KLR650A6F, EX250J9A, DR200SE, Vespa Ciao

On Wed, 5 Jan 2022 03:55:06 -0800 (PST), Stephen Packer
<stephen.packer@gmail.com> wrote:

<forks>

Having the right tools certainly helps.

*ding* - I remember, that's one of the reasons I don't like it. On
Japanese bikes, it's one of the few jobs that requires special tool
--
Champ
neal at champ dot org dot uk

I don't know, but I been told
You never slow down, you never grow old

Champ wrote:

> it's one of the few jobs that requires special tool

Do you mean getting a responsible adult in?

--
"There's nothing more dangreous than a resourceful idiot"

On Wed, 5 Jan 2022 13:20:20 -0000 (UTC), Mark Olson
<olsonm@tiny.invalid> wrote:

>Colin Irvine <look@colinandpat.co.uk> wrote:
>> On Wed, 5 Jan 2022 11:37:49 -0000 (UTC), wessie
>> <willnotwork@tesco.net> wrote:

>>>like most of those tins, it's now in an aerosol
>>>https://www.holtsauto.com/holts/products/maintenance-spray/
>>
>> Huh. A retrograde step, IMHO. And it doesn't say what's in it.
>
>Almost certainly it's not the same formula as before. Might still
>work OK, but my expectation, as with paint stripper, brake and carb
>cleaners, and most other chemicals available to the public, that the
>new stuff is safer to be around, but odds are it doesn't work nearly
>as well as the old stuff.

Bloody elf 'n safety.

I was pleasantly surprised when I first moved over the channel at the
range of proper chemicals available in most French supermarkets,
including acetone, hydrochloric acid, proper turps, white spirit and
all sorts of other stuff.

No carbon tetrachloride, though, which I recall had many cleaning
applications back in the day, including cleaning the computer tape
machines when I worked in operations at RR. Happy days, that stuff
only needed a whif to get the head reeling.

--
Ace
http://www.chaletbeauroc.com/