On Wednesday, June 23, 2021 at 1:12:27 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> On 2021-06-23 10:03 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> > On Monday, June 21, 2021 at 5:58:39 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> >> On 2021-06-20 9:25 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> >>> On Thursday, June 17, 2021 at 4:05:30 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker
> >>> wrote:
> >>>> On 2021-06-16 6:24 p.m., ed wrote:
> >>>>> On Tuesday, June 15, 2021 at 10:26:25 PM UTC-4, Thomas E.
> >>>>> wrote: . ..
> >>>>>> Plus, by going through the pain millions of us have
> >>>>>> acquired natural immunity that is now part of the case
> >>>>>> decline. One could ask how many future deaths were avoided
> >>>>>> by allowing the virus to immunize the population.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> So you're arguing we might be avoiding future deaths.. by
> >>>>> having already infected - and killed off - a bunch of
> >>>>> people... Yea, not a good thing.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Remember, when all this started there was no clear path to
> >>>>>> vaccines. So-called experts were saying it would take
> >>>>>> years. It did not, but it was no sure thing a year ago.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Yep, that was presented as a possibility. And a lot of
> >>>>> vaccines that were in development haven't been approved yet,
> >>>>> so we're lucky we have a couple good options that were
> >>>>> developed quickly.
> >>>>>
> >>>> And the fact that having vaccines was going to take a while was
> >>>> the very reason for imposing restrictions...
> >>>>
> >>>> ...that have saved countless lives in many countries...
> >>>>
> >>>> ...just not in the US.
> >>>
> >>> We had restrictions prior to vaccines too. They did save lives.
> >>>
> >> Keep yapping, Liarboy.
> >>
> >> The simple truth is that you've killed nearly 6 times as many of
> >> your citizens in Indiana as compared to BC per capita.
> >>
> >> For our countries as a whole, the ratio is 2.7 times as many deaths
> >> per capita.
> >>
> >> Where's the big advantage you've gained from letting all those
> >> people die, Liarboy?
> >>
> >> Is it in GDP?
> >>
> >> <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth-annual>
> >>
> >> <https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/gdp-growth-annual>
> >>
> >> Ours dropped a little more and is coming back a little slower.
> >>
> >> Unemployment?
> >>
> >> <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/unemployment-rate>
> >>
> >> <https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/unemployment-rate>
> >>
> >> Yours actually spiked WORSE than ours and now we're doing better
> >> on relative rate from immediately before the pandemic than you are.
> >> You've gone from 3.5% immediately before to just less than 6% now
> >> (an increase of a little less than 71%) compared to Canada at 5.5%
> >> pre-pandemic and about 8.25% now (and increase of about 50%).
> >>
> >> Well, Liarboy?
> >
> > Alan as I have stated before it's not all about the numbers. How do
> > you compare the mental well-being of the vastly more numerous
> > survivors to the pain of death losses from the relatively few (many
> > of which were imminent anyway given the age demographics involved).
> > You cannot.
> Bleat on!
> >
> > Now I'm going to make you really mad. As of yesterday the local
> > symphony eliminated attendance limits for our outdoor summer concert
> > series. It was set at 4,000, about half capacity. Now no limits on
> > ticket sales. We will be attending almost all of the concerts. The
> > fall indoor concert tickets are going on sale, with no attendance
> > limits shown on the website. https://www.indianapolissymphony.org/
> > The site has a photo that shows an audience wearing masks. But if you
> > look closely it's all Asians in the seats. That's not real. The
> > audience is typically older and predominately Caucasian. And, there
> > is no mention of COVID restrictions that I can fine on the ISO site.
> > You too can buy a ticket to go to the June 27 performance of Beatles
> > music by the entire orchestra.
> > https://tickets.indianapolissymphony.org/events/detail/11912/11933
> > It's going to be a lot of fun! Bring your dinner and drinks, and come
> > on down!
> Your priorities are so messed up.
> >
> > Our first convention of what will be a very busy summer kicks off in
> > a few days. Later this year GENCON and the FFA are planning on 50-70k
> > attendees.
> >
> > Out and about these last few days a rough estimate of mask wearing by
> > the general public - about 2-5%. Employees mandated are still masking
> > up in many places of business as a condition of employment.
> I see.
>
> And that's fine with you.
> >
> > Indiana cases and deaths continue to wane despite almost total
> > freedom to travel and assemble with no restrictions. Before and after
> > the Indy 500 new case and death trends were consistent. No surge,
> > just no effect. https://www.coronavirus.in.gov/2393.htm
> And the dead are still dead.
> >
> > Same is true for the entire country.
> > https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#trends_dailytrendscases
> >
> > If you want to be critical here's a topic. Six months after the first
> > vaccine doses given Indiana is only 47% fully vaccinated for the 12
> > and up population. That's shameful. We could be even lower on cases
> > and deaths than we currently are. We are one of the lowest states in
> > percent vaccinated.
> Maybe if you didn't live in a country that makes ignorance a badge of
> honour.
> >
> > What is also interesting is the the Democrats have been in power
> > since January with no apparent effect on declining case and death
> > trends. In fact, the Biden administration has basically done nothing
> > other than tweaking vaccine distribution on the COVID front. What
> > does that tell you? There was and is across party lines no political
> > will in this country to give up personal freedoms to the extent that
> > Canadians are willing to do so. So criticize Americans if you want
> > to. I'm just one voter. I did not vote for Biden. Had Democrats
> > nominated a credible candidate I would not have voted for Trump.
> That you chose to keep Trump in office tells me all I need about you.
>
> Biden was far more "credible" than Trump.

Biden is a borderline dementia case. He has moments of lost train of thought, frequently won't take questions, mumbles, whispers at reporters...

https://www.msn.com/en-us/tv/news/creepy-joe-trends-after-biden-continually-whispers-through-press-conference/ar-AALpuyZ?ocid=uxbndlbing
https://marypatriotnews.com/let-my-wife-come-home-joe-biden-goes-on-awkward-and-bizarre-tangent-during-climate-summit-video/

On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 8:28:48 AM UTC-4, Thomas E. wrote:
> On Wednesday, June 23, 2021 at 2:43:32 PM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
> > On Wednesday, June 23, 2021 at 1:03:19 PM UTC-4, Thomas E. wrote:
> > > On Monday, June 21, 2021 at 5:58:39 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> > > > On 2021-06-20 9:25 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> > > > > On Thursday, June 17, 2021 at 4:05:30 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> > > > >> On 2021-06-16 6:24 p.m., ed wrote:
> > > > >>> On Tuesday, June 15, 2021 at 10:26:25 PM UTC-4, Thomas E. wrote: .
> > > > >>> ..
> > > > >>>> Plus, by going through the pain millions of us have acquired
> > > > >>>> natural immunity that is now part of the case decline. One could
> > > > >>>> ask how many future deaths were avoided by allowing the virus to
> > > > >>>> immunize the population.
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>> So you're arguing we might be avoiding future deaths.. by having
> > > > >>> already infected - and killed off - a bunch of people... Yea, not a
> > > > >>> good thing.
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>> Remember, when all this started there was no clear path to
> > > > >>>> vaccines. So-called experts were saying it would take years. It did
> > > > >>>> not, but it was no sure thing a year ago.
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>> Yep, that was presented as a possibility. And a lot of vaccines that
> > > > >>> were in development haven't been approved yet, so we're lucky we have
> > > > >>> a couple good options that were developed quickly.
> > > > >>>
> > > > >> And the fact that having vaccines was going to take a while was the very
> > > > >> reason for imposing restrictions...
> > > > >>
> > > > >> ...that have saved countless lives in many countries...
> > > > >>
> > > > >> ...just not in the US.
> > > > >
> > > > > We had restrictions prior to vaccines too. They did save lives.
> > > > >
> > > > Keep yapping, Liarboy.
> > > >
> > > > The simple truth is that you've killed nearly 6 times as many of your
> > > > citizens in Indiana as compared to BC per capita.
> > > >
> > > > For our countries as a whole, the ratio is 2.7 times as many deaths per
> > > > capita.
> > > >
> > > > Where's the big advantage you've gained from letting all those people
> > > > die, Liarboy?
> > > >
> > > > Is it in GDP?
> > > >
> > > > <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth-annual>
> > > >
> > > > <https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/gdp-growth-annual>
> > > >
> > > > Ours dropped a little more and is coming back a little slower.
> > > >
> > > > Unemployment?
> > > >
> > > > <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/unemployment-rate>
> > > >
> > > > <https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/unemployment-rate>
> > > >
> > > > Yours actually spiked WORSE than ours and now we're doing better on
> > > > relative rate from immediately before the pandemic than you are. You've
> > > > gone from 3.5% immediately before to just less than 6% now (an increase
> > > > of a little less than 71%) compared to Canada at 5.5% pre-pandemic and
> > > > about 8.25% now (and increase of about 50%).
> > > >
> > > > Well, Liarboy?
> > >
> > > Alan as I have stated before it's not all about the numbers. How do you compare
> > > the mental well-being of the vastly more numerous survivors to the pain of death
> > > losses from the relatively few (many of which were imminent anyway given the
> > > age demographics involved). You cannot.
> > While psychological ailments shouldn't be dismissed, CoVid is manifesting multiple
> > direct physiological harm to a much larger fraction than merely those who died.
> > By some current estimates, ~30% of survivors are manifesting some level of "long"
> > ailments, and there's chronic conditions emerging from everything from lung scarring
> > and heart inflammation to diabetes (Type 1) and male fertility decline
> > > Now I'm going to make you really mad. As of yesterday the local symphony eliminated
> > > attendance limits for our outdoor summer concert series. It was set at 4,000, about half capacity.
> > > Now no limits on ticket sales.
> > Oh, so then Indiana is weeks behind New York City in reopening, as they just had a 100% *indoor*
> > capacity concert last Sunday:
> >
> > <https://www.cnn.com/2021/06/21/entertainment/foo-fighters-madison-square-garden/index.html>
> > > Out and about these last few days a rough estimate of mask wearing by the general public -
> > > about 2-5%. Employees mandated are still masking up in many places of business as a condition
> > > of employment.
> > Around 33% here, which is a shortsightedness risk, as the Delta variant is at 20% of cases & growing,
> > particularly in regions with lower vaccination rates (FL hospitalizations were up +30% last week):
> >
> > <https://graphics.reuters.com/HEALTH-CORONAVIRUS/USA-TRENDS/dgkvlgkrkpb/>
> >
> > <https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2021/06/14/covid-cases-vaccination-rates/>
> > > If you want to be critical here's a topic. Six months after the first vaccine doses given Indiana is only
> > > 47% fully vaccinated for the 12 and up population. That's shameful. We could be even lower on cases
> > > and deaths than we currently are. We are one of the lowest states in percent vaccinated.
> > Probably because you're a "Trump" Red state who prioritize "personal freedoms" over
> > the collective good of society ...
> >
> > ...as vaccination rates have been successfully correlated to political affiliation; see:
> >
> > <https://www.npr.org/2021/06/09/1004430257/theres-a-stark-red-blue-divide-when-it-comes-to-states-vaccination-rates>
> >
> > "Correlation of Biden vote share and adult Covid vaccination rate is now at .847 (CDC data)"
> > <https://mobile.twitter.com/smotus/status/1404483957647831046>
> > > What is also interesting is the the Democrats have been in power since January with no apparent effect
> > > on declining case and death trends.
> > "No apparent effect at all"?
> > Nationally, the mortality rate for the week ending 1/17/21 was 10.32 deaths/day per million.
> > Two months later (3/14/21) it was less than half ... 4.05 deaths/day per million.
> > Last week (6/20/21), it was ~half as much again ... 2.07 deaths/day per million.
> > > In fact, the Biden administration has basically done nothing other than tweaking vaccine
> > > distribution on the COVID front. What does that tell you?
> > The Federal lead for vaccine distribution is a civilian Army executive at TACOM-Warren,
> > and we were given an in-house briefing a few months ago ... I alluded to it in a few posts
> > on how vaccine deployment rates were going to ramp up to 25M/week. What you're trying
> > to claim as mere "tweaks" is false: you've been grossly misinformed.
> > > There was and is across party lines no political will in this country to give up personal freedoms
> > > to the extent that Canadians are willing to do so.
> > No, what you're really doing is admitting that Americans have degraded into petty selfishness.
> >
>
>
> The Biden administration has done nothing different to stop the spread was my comment.

Well, if that’s actually what you meant to say, then it’s a non sequitur, because restrictions
and vaccination uptake are what affects spread and both are implemented State by State.

Which is also why CoVid rates are increasing in the Midwest now too: a lack of controls
to limit R0, along with a population who doesn’t want to take the vaccine.

-hh

On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 11:55:53 AM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
> On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 8:28:48 AM UTC-4, Thomas E. wrote:
> > On Wednesday, June 23, 2021 at 2:43:32 PM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
> > > On Wednesday, June 23, 2021 at 1:03:19 PM UTC-4, Thomas E. wrote:
> > > > On Monday, June 21, 2021 at 5:58:39 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> > > > > On 2021-06-20 9:25 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> > > > > > On Thursday, June 17, 2021 at 4:05:30 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> > > > > >> On 2021-06-16 6:24 p.m., ed wrote:
> > > > > >>> On Tuesday, June 15, 2021 at 10:26:25 PM UTC-4, Thomas E. wrote: .
> > > > > >>> ..
> > > > > >>>> Plus, by going through the pain millions of us have acquired
> > > > > >>>> natural immunity that is now part of the case decline. One could
> > > > > >>>> ask how many future deaths were avoided by allowing the virus to
> > > > > >>>> immunize the population.
> > > > > >>>
> > > > > >>> So you're arguing we might be avoiding future deaths.. by having
> > > > > >>> already infected - and killed off - a bunch of people... Yea, not a
> > > > > >>> good thing.
> > > > > >>>
> > > > > >>>> Remember, when all this started there was no clear path to
> > > > > >>>> vaccines. So-called experts were saying it would take years. It did
> > > > > >>>> not, but it was no sure thing a year ago.
> > > > > >>>
> > > > > >>> Yep, that was presented as a possibility. And a lot of vaccines that
> > > > > >>> were in development haven't been approved yet, so we're lucky we have
> > > > > >>> a couple good options that were developed quickly.
> > > > > >>>
> > > > > >> And the fact that having vaccines was going to take a while was the very
> > > > > >> reason for imposing restrictions...
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> ...that have saved countless lives in many countries...
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> ...just not in the US.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > We had restrictions prior to vaccines too. They did save lives.
> > > > > >
> > > > > Keep yapping, Liarboy.
> > > > >
> > > > > The simple truth is that you've killed nearly 6 times as many of your
> > > > > citizens in Indiana as compared to BC per capita.
> > > > >
> > > > > For our countries as a whole, the ratio is 2.7 times as many deaths per
> > > > > capita.
> > > > >
> > > > > Where's the big advantage you've gained from letting all those people
> > > > > die, Liarboy?
> > > > >
> > > > > Is it in GDP?
> > > > >
> > > > > <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth-annual>
> > > > >
> > > > > <https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/gdp-growth-annual>
> > > > >
> > > > > Ours dropped a little more and is coming back a little slower.
> > > > >
> > > > > Unemployment?
> > > > >
> > > > > <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/unemployment-rate>
> > > > >
> > > > > <https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/unemployment-rate>
> > > > >
> > > > > Yours actually spiked WORSE than ours and now we're doing better on
> > > > > relative rate from immediately before the pandemic than you are. You've
> > > > > gone from 3.5% immediately before to just less than 6% now (an increase
> > > > > of a little less than 71%) compared to Canada at 5.5% pre-pandemic and
> > > > > about 8.25% now (and increase of about 50%).
> > > > >
> > > > > Well, Liarboy?
> > > >
> > > > Alan as I have stated before it's not all about the numbers. How do you compare
> > > > the mental well-being of the vastly more numerous survivors to the pain of death
> > > > losses from the relatively few (many of which were imminent anyway given the
> > > > age demographics involved). You cannot.
> > > While psychological ailments shouldn't be dismissed, CoVid is manifesting multiple
> > > direct physiological harm to a much larger fraction than merely those who died.
> > > By some current estimates, ~30% of survivors are manifesting some level of "long"
> > > ailments, and there's chronic conditions emerging from everything from lung scarring
> > > and heart inflammation to diabetes (Type 1) and male fertility decline
> > > > Now I'm going to make you really mad. As of yesterday the local symphony eliminated
> > > > attendance limits for our outdoor summer concert series. It was set at 4,000, about half capacity.
> > > > Now no limits on ticket sales.
> > > Oh, so then Indiana is weeks behind New York City in reopening, as they just had a 100% *indoor*
> > > capacity concert last Sunday:
> > >
> > > <https://www.cnn.com/2021/06/21/entertainment/foo-fighters-madison-square-garden/index.html>
> > > > Out and about these last few days a rough estimate of mask wearing by the general public -
> > > > about 2-5%. Employees mandated are still masking up in many places of business as a condition
> > > > of employment.
> > > Around 33% here, which is a shortsightedness risk, as the Delta variant is at 20% of cases & growing,
> > > particularly in regions with lower vaccination rates (FL hospitalizations were up +30% last week):
> > >
> > > <https://graphics.reuters.com/HEALTH-CORONAVIRUS/USA-TRENDS/dgkvlgkrkpb/>
> > >
> > > <https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2021/06/14/covid-cases-vaccination-rates/>
> > > > If you want to be critical here's a topic. Six months after the first vaccine doses given Indiana is only
> > > > 47% fully vaccinated for the 12 and up population. That's shameful. We could be even lower on cases
> > > > and deaths than we currently are. We are one of the lowest states in percent vaccinated.
> > > Probably because you're a "Trump" Red state who prioritize "personal freedoms" over
> > > the collective good of society ...
> > >
> > > ...as vaccination rates have been successfully correlated to political affiliation; see:
> > >
> > > <https://www.npr.org/2021/06/09/1004430257/theres-a-stark-red-blue-divide-when-it-comes-to-states-vaccination-rates>
> > >
> > > "Correlation of Biden vote share and adult Covid vaccination rate is now at .847 (CDC data)"
> > > <https://mobile.twitter.com/smotus/status/1404483957647831046>
> > > > What is also interesting is the the Democrats have been in power since January with no apparent effect
> > > > on declining case and death trends.
> > > "No apparent effect at all"?
> > > Nationally, the mortality rate for the week ending 1/17/21 was 10.32 deaths/day per million.
> > > Two months later (3/14/21) it was less than half ... 4.05 deaths/day per million.
> > > Last week (6/20/21), it was ~half as much again ... 2.07 deaths/day per million.
> > > > In fact, the Biden administration has basically done nothing other than tweaking vaccine
> > > > distribution on the COVID front. What does that tell you?
> > > The Federal lead for vaccine distribution is a civilian Army executive at TACOM-Warren,
> > > and we were given an in-house briefing a few months ago ... I alluded to it in a few posts
> > > on how vaccine deployment rates were going to ramp up to 25M/week. What you're trying
> > > to claim as mere "tweaks" is false: you've been grossly misinformed.
> > > > There was and is across party lines no political will in this country to give up personal freedoms
> > > > to the extent that Canadians are willing to do so.
> > > No, what you're really doing is admitting that Americans have degraded into petty selfishness.
> > >
> >
> >
> > The Biden administration has done nothing different to stop the spread was my comment.
> Well, if that’s actually what you meant to say, then it’s a non sequitur, because restrictions
> and vaccination uptake are what affects spread and both are implemented State by State.
>
> Which is also why CoVid rates are increasing in the Midwest now too: a lack of controls
> to limit R0, along with a population who doesn’t want to take the vaccine.
>
>
> -hh

On Wednesday, June 23, 2021 at 1:12:27 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> On 2021-06-23 10:03 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> > On Monday, June 21, 2021 at 5:58:39 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> >> On 2021-06-20 9:25 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> >>> On Thursday, June 17, 2021 at 4:05:30 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker
> >>> wrote:
> >>>> On 2021-06-16 6:24 p.m., ed wrote:
> >>>>> On Tuesday, June 15, 2021 at 10:26:25 PM UTC-4, Thomas E.
> >>>>> wrote: . ..
> >>>>>> Plus, by going through the pain millions of us have
> >>>>>> acquired natural immunity that is now part of the case
> >>>>>> decline. One could ask how many future deaths were avoided
> >>>>>> by allowing the virus to immunize the population.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> So you're arguing we might be avoiding future deaths.. by
> >>>>> having already infected - and killed off - a bunch of
> >>>>> people... Yea, not a good thing.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Remember, when all this started there was no clear path to
> >>>>>> vaccines. So-called experts were saying it would take
> >>>>>> years. It did not, but it was no sure thing a year ago.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Yep, that was presented as a possibility. And a lot of
> >>>>> vaccines that were in development haven't been approved yet,
> >>>>> so we're lucky we have a couple good options that were
> >>>>> developed quickly.
> >>>>>
> >>>> And the fact that having vaccines was going to take a while was
> >>>> the very reason for imposing restrictions...
> >>>>
> >>>> ...that have saved countless lives in many countries...
> >>>>
> >>>> ...just not in the US.
> >>>
> >>> We had restrictions prior to vaccines too. They did save lives.
> >>>
> >> Keep yapping, Liarboy.
> >>
> >> The simple truth is that you've killed nearly 6 times as many of
> >> your citizens in Indiana as compared to BC per capita.
> >>
> >> For our countries as a whole, the ratio is 2.7 times as many deaths
> >> per capita.
> >>
> >> Where's the big advantage you've gained from letting all those
> >> people die, Liarboy?
> >>
> >> Is it in GDP?
> >>
> >> <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth-annual>
> >>
> >> <https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/gdp-growth-annual>
> >>
> >> Ours dropped a little more and is coming back a little slower.
> >>
> >> Unemployment?
> >>
> >> <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/unemployment-rate>
> >>
> >> <https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/unemployment-rate>
> >>
> >> Yours actually spiked WORSE than ours and now we're doing better
> >> on relative rate from immediately before the pandemic than you are.
> >> You've gone from 3.5% immediately before to just less than 6% now
> >> (an increase of a little less than 71%) compared to Canada at 5.5%
> >> pre-pandemic and about 8.25% now (and increase of about 50%).
> >>
> >> Well, Liarboy?
> >
> > Alan as I have stated before it's not all about the numbers. How do
> > you compare the mental well-being of the vastly more numerous
> > survivors to the pain of death losses from the relatively few (many
> > of which were imminent anyway given the age demographics involved).
> > You cannot.
> Bleat on!
> >
> > Now I'm going to make you really mad. As of yesterday the local
> > symphony eliminated attendance limits for our outdoor summer concert
> > series. It was set at 4,000, about half capacity. Now no limits on
> > ticket sales. We will be attending almost all of the concerts. The
> > fall indoor concert tickets are going on sale, with no attendance
> > limits shown on the website. https://www.indianapolissymphony.org/
> > The site has a photo that shows an audience wearing masks. But if you
> > look closely it's all Asians in the seats. That's not real. The
> > audience is typically older and predominately Caucasian. And, there
> > is no mention of COVID restrictions that I can fine on the ISO site.
> > You too can buy a ticket to go to the June 27 performance of Beatles
> > music by the entire orchestra.
> > https://tickets.indianapolissymphony.org/events/detail/11912/11933
> > It's going to be a lot of fun! Bring your dinner and drinks, and come
> > on down!
> Your priorities are so messed up.
> >
> > Our first convention of what will be a very busy summer kicks off in
> > a few days. Later this year GENCON and the FFA are planning on 50-70k
> > attendees.
> >
> > Out and about these last few days a rough estimate of mask wearing by
> > the general public - about 2-5%. Employees mandated are still masking
> > up in many places of business as a condition of employment.
> I see.
>
> And that's fine with you.
> >
> > Indiana cases and deaths continue to wane despite almost total
> > freedom to travel and assemble with no restrictions. Before and after
> > the Indy 500 new case and death trends were consistent. No surge,
> > just no effect. https://www.coronavirus.in.gov/2393.htm
> And the dead are still dead.
> >
> > Same is true for the entire country.
> > https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#trends_dailytrendscases
> >
> > If you want to be critical here's a topic. Six months after the first
> > vaccine doses given Indiana is only 47% fully vaccinated for the 12
> > and up population. That's shameful. We could be even lower on cases
> > and deaths than we currently are. We are one of the lowest states in
> > percent vaccinated.
> Maybe if you didn't live in a country that makes ignorance a badge of
> honour.
> >
> > What is also interesting is the the Democrats have been in power
> > since January with no apparent effect on declining case and death
> > trends. In fact, the Biden administration has basically done nothing
> > other than tweaking vaccine distribution on the COVID front. What
> > does that tell you? There was and is across party lines no political
> > will in this country to give up personal freedoms to the extent that
> > Canadians are willing to do so. So criticize Americans if you want
> > to. I'm just one voter. I did not vote for Biden. Had Democrats
> > nominated a credible candidate I would not have voted for Trump.
> That you chose to keep Trump in office tells me all I need about you.
>
> Biden was far more "credible" than Trump.

It's not "my" priorities it's the country's. The dead are dead, true, but we did our part. We masked, distanced, were careful to avoid large indoor crowds and got the Pfizer vaccine doses at first opportunity in February/March. We did not get COVID, and could not have transmitted it to anybody. (The wife was tested several times for medical procedure screening, and I once, all negative.)

You did get COVID, IIRC. How irresponsible was that? You could have made someone else sick.

Now that we are vaccinated it's not a concern. The Pfizer vaccine is reportedly effective against the variants, at least so far. I'll gladly take a booster shot if needed.

I tried making some social media posts to the effect that if you are not vaccinated, well good luck. The response was that I was shaming others, and needed to continue to mask and "stay away from me." One respondent even went so far as to state that the vaccinated are shedding the virus and infecting others! Wow, if true U.S. COVID cases should be through the roof.

One of my social media posts was deleted for being abusive, and my account suspended. The account was restored after I promised not to do that again.

I live in a country that is scientifically illiterate. I'll certainly grant anyone that claim!

On 2021-07-03 11:52 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 11:55:53 AM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
>> On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 8:28:48 AM UTC-4, Thomas E. wrote:
>>> On Wednesday, June 23, 2021 at 2:43:32 PM UTC-4, -hh wrote:

>>> The Biden administration has done nothing different to stop the
>>> spread was my comment.
>> Well, if that’s actually what you meant to say, then it’s a non
>> sequitur, because restrictions and vaccination uptake are what
>> affects spread and both are implemented State by State.
>>
>> Which is also why CoVid rates are increasing in the Midwest now
>> too: a lack of controls to limit R0, along with a population who
>> doesn’t want to take the vaccine.
>>
>>
>> -hh
>
> Which Midwest states are you talking about? Missouri is the only one
> I can find with any sign of an increase. Biden could have encourage
> states to keep restrictions, he has done nothing. He could have taken
> a stronger position on vaccination. In fact, some months back, he
> stated that "There is nothing we can do to change the pandemic
> trajectory...". And, that's what his administration has done,
> nothing. Promise fulfilled.
>
> https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/22/biden-says-nothing-can-change-the-trajectory-of-covid-pandemic-over-the-next-several-months.html
>

How about Indiana?

'Federal guidelines advise that states wait until they experience a
downward trajectory of documented cases within a 14-day period before
proceeding to a phased opening. In the state-specific view of the graph,
this two-week period is highlighted in orange if cases are trending
upward, or green if they are trending down.'

<https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/new-cases-50-states/indiana>

Tell us, Liarboy:

What colour is the current two-week period?

Wait.. ...don't tell me:

It's a data anomaly and you understand better than Johns Hopkins University.

:-)

On 2021-07-03 12:07 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> On Wednesday, June 23, 2021 at 1:12:27 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
>> On 2021-06-23 10:03 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
>>> On Monday, June 21, 2021 at 5:58:39 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
>>>> On 2021-06-20 9:25 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
>>>>> On Thursday, June 17, 2021 at 4:05:30 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> On 2021-06-16 6:24 p.m., ed wrote:
>>>>>>> On Tuesday, June 15, 2021 at 10:26:25 PM UTC-4, Thomas
>>>>>>> E. wrote: . ..
>>>>>>>> Plus, by going through the pain millions of us have
>>>>>>>> acquired natural immunity that is now part of the case
>>>>>>>> decline. One could ask how many future deaths were
>>>>>>>> avoided by allowing the virus to immunize the
>>>>>>>> population.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So you're arguing we might be avoiding future deaths..
>>>>>>> by having already infected - and killed off - a bunch of
>>>>>>> people... Yea, not a good thing.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Remember, when all this started there was no clear path
>>>>>>>> to vaccines. So-called experts were saying it would
>>>>>>>> take years. It did not, but it was no sure thing a year
>>>>>>>> ago.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Yep, that was presented as a possibility. And a lot of
>>>>>>> vaccines that were in development haven't been approved
>>>>>>> yet, so we're lucky we have a couple good options that
>>>>>>> were developed quickly.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> And the fact that having vaccines was going to take a while
>>>>>> was the very reason for imposing restrictions...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ...that have saved countless lives in many countries...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ...just not in the US.
>>>>>
>>>>> We had restrictions prior to vaccines too. They did save
>>>>> lives.
>>>>>
>>>> Keep yapping, Liarboy.
>>>>
>>>> The simple truth is that you've killed nearly 6 times as many
>>>> of your citizens in Indiana as compared to BC per capita.
>>>>
>>>> For our countries as a whole, the ratio is 2.7 times as many
>>>> deaths per capita.
>>>>
>>>> Where's the big advantage you've gained from letting all those
>>>> people die, Liarboy?
>>>>
>>>> Is it in GDP?
>>>>
>>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth-annual>
>>>>
>>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/gdp-growth-annual>
>>>>
>>>> Ours dropped a little more and is coming back a little slower.
>>>>
>>>> Unemployment?
>>>>
>>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/unemployment-rate>
>>>>
>>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/unemployment-rate>
>>>>
>>>> Yours actually spiked WORSE than ours and now we're doing
>>>> better on relative rate from immediately before the pandemic
>>>> than you are. You've gone from 3.5% immediately before to just
>>>> less than 6% now (an increase of a little less than 71%)
>>>> compared to Canada at 5.5% pre-pandemic and about 8.25% now
>>>> (and increase of about 50%).
>>>>
>>>> Well, Liarboy?
>>>
>>> Alan as I have stated before it's not all about the numbers. How
>>> do you compare the mental well-being of the vastly more numerous
>>> survivors to the pain of death losses from the relatively few
>>> (many of which were imminent anyway given the age demographics
>>> involved). You cannot.
>> Bleat on!
>>>
>>> Now I'm going to make you really mad. As of yesterday the local
>>> symphony eliminated attendance limits for our outdoor summer
>>> concert series. It was set at 4,000, about half capacity. Now no
>>> limits on ticket sales. We will be attending almost all of the
>>> concerts. The fall indoor concert tickets are going on sale, with
>>> no attendance limits shown on the website.
>>> https://www.indianapolissymphony.org/ The site has a photo that
>>> shows an audience wearing masks. But if you look closely it's all
>>> Asians in the seats. That's not real. The audience is typically
>>> older and predominately Caucasian. And, there is no mention of
>>> COVID restrictions that I can fine on the ISO site. You too can
>>> buy a ticket to go to the June 27 performance of Beatles music by
>>> the entire orchestra.
>>> https://tickets.indianapolissymphony.org/events/detail/11912/11933
>>>
>>>
It's going to be a lot of fun! Bring your dinner and drinks, and come
>>> on down!
>> Your priorities are so messed up.
>>>
>>> Our first convention of what will be a very busy summer kicks off
>>> in a few days. Later this year GENCON and the FFA are planning on
>>> 50-70k attendees.
>>>
>>> Out and about these last few days a rough estimate of mask
>>> wearing by the general public - about 2-5%. Employees mandated
>>> are still masking up in many places of business as a condition of
>>> employment.
>> I see.
>>
>> And that's fine with you.
>>>
>>> Indiana cases and deaths continue to wane despite almost total
>>> freedom to travel and assemble with no restrictions. Before and
>>> after the Indy 500 new case and death trends were consistent. No
>>> surge, just no effect. https://www.coronavirus.in.gov/2393.htm
>> And the dead are still dead.
>>>
>>> Same is true for the entire country.
>>> https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#trends_dailytrendscases
>>>
>>>
>>>
If you want to be critical here's a topic. Six months after the first
>>> vaccine doses given Indiana is only 47% fully vaccinated for the
>>> 12 and up population. That's shameful. We could be even lower on
>>> cases and deaths than we currently are. We are one of the lowest
>>> states in percent vaccinated.
>> Maybe if you didn't live in a country that makes ignorance a badge
>> of honour.
>>>
>>> What is also interesting is the the Democrats have been in power
>>> since January with no apparent effect on declining case and
>>> death trends. In fact, the Biden administration has basically
>>> done nothing other than tweaking vaccine distribution on the
>>> COVID front. What does that tell you? There was and is across
>>> party lines no political will in this country to give up personal
>>> freedoms to the extent that Canadians are willing to do so. So
>>> criticize Americans if you want to. I'm just one voter. I did not
>>> vote for Biden. Had Democrats nominated a credible candidate I
>>> would not have voted for Trump.
>> That you chose to keep Trump in office tells me all I need about
>> you.
>>
>> Biden was far more "credible" than Trump.
>
> It's not "my" priorities it's the country's. The dead are dead, true,
> but we did our part. We masked, distanced, were careful to avoid
> large indoor crowds and got the Pfizer vaccine doses at first
> opportunity in February/March. We did not get COVID, and could not
> have transmitted it to anybody. (The wife was tested several times
> for medical procedure screening, and I once, all negative.)

You're the one crowing about how wonderful it was that you kept your
"freedom" by killing a whole lot more people.

>
> You did get COVID, IIRC. How irresponsible was that? You could have
> made someone else sick.

You think you can control absolutely whether or not you get an illness?

As soon as I discovered I had been exposed, I went and got tested, and
we removed everyone from the house who didn't have it.

>
> Now that we are vaccinated it's not a concern. The Pfizer vaccine is
> reportedly effective against the variants, at least so far. I'll
> gladly take a booster shot if needed.
>
> I tried making some social media posts to the effect that if you are
> not vaccinated, well good luck. The response was that I was shaming
> others, and needed to continue to mask and "stay away from me." One
> respondent even went so far as to state that the vaccinated are
> shedding the virus and infecting others! Wow, if true U.S. COVID
> cases should be through the roof.

On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 3:37:09 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> On 2021-07-03 11:52 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> > On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 11:55:53 AM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
> >> On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 8:28:48 AM UTC-4, Thomas E. wrote:
> >>> On Wednesday, June 23, 2021 at 2:43:32 PM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
>
> >>> The Biden administration has done nothing different to stop the
> >>> spread was my comment.
> >> Well, if that’s actually what you meant to say, then it’s a non
> >> sequitur, because restrictions and vaccination uptake are what
> >> affects spread and both are implemented State by State.
> >>
> >> Which is also why CoVid rates are increasing in the Midwest now
> >> too: a lack of controls to limit R0, along with a population who
> >> doesn’t want to take the vaccine.
> >>
> >>
> >> -hh
> >
> > Which Midwest states are you talking about? Missouri is the only one
> > I can find with any sign of an increase. Biden could have encourage
> > states to keep restrictions, he has done nothing. He could have taken
> > a stronger position on vaccination. In fact, some months back, he
> > stated that "There is nothing we can do to change the pandemic
> > trajectory...". And, that's what his administration has done,
> > nothing. Promise fulfilled.
> >
> > https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/22/biden-says-nothing-can-change-the-trajectory-of-covid-pandemic-over-the-next-several-months.html
> >
> How about Indiana?
> 'Federal guidelines advise that states wait until they experience a
> downward trajectory of documented cases within a 14-day period before
> proceeding to a phased opening. In the state-specific view of the graph,
> this two-week period is highlighted in orange if cases are trending
> upward, or green if they are trending down.'
>
> <https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/new-cases-50-states/indiana>
> Tell us, Liarboy:
>
> What colour is the current two-week period?
>
> Wait.. ...don't tell me:
>
> It's a data anomaly and you understand better than Johns Hopkins University.
>
> :-)

Why not look at primary data? https://www.coronavirus.in.gov/2393.htm

Looks a bit different from the secondary source you cited.

On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 3:58:34 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> On 2021-07-03 12:07 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> > On Wednesday, June 23, 2021 at 1:12:27 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> >> On 2021-06-23 10:03 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> >>> On Monday, June 21, 2021 at 5:58:39 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> >>>> On 2021-06-20 9:25 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> >>>>> On Thursday, June 17, 2021 at 4:05:30 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker
> >>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>> On 2021-06-16 6:24 p.m., ed wrote:
> >>>>>>> On Tuesday, June 15, 2021 at 10:26:25 PM UTC-4, Thomas
> >>>>>>> E. wrote: . ..
> >>>>>>>> Plus, by going through the pain millions of us have
> >>>>>>>> acquired natural immunity that is now part of the case
> >>>>>>>> decline. One could ask how many future deaths were
> >>>>>>>> avoided by allowing the virus to immunize the
> >>>>>>>> population.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> So you're arguing we might be avoiding future deaths..
> >>>>>>> by having already infected - and killed off - a bunch of
> >>>>>>> people... Yea, not a good thing.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Remember, when all this started there was no clear path
> >>>>>>>> to vaccines. So-called experts were saying it would
> >>>>>>>> take years. It did not, but it was no sure thing a year
> >>>>>>>> ago.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Yep, that was presented as a possibility. And a lot of
> >>>>>>> vaccines that were in development haven't been approved
> >>>>>>> yet, so we're lucky we have a couple good options that
> >>>>>>> were developed quickly.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>> And the fact that having vaccines was going to take a while
> >>>>>> was the very reason for imposing restrictions...
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> ...that have saved countless lives in many countries...
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> ...just not in the US.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> We had restrictions prior to vaccines too. They did save
> >>>>> lives.
> >>>>>
> >>>> Keep yapping, Liarboy.
> >>>>
> >>>> The simple truth is that you've killed nearly 6 times as many
> >>>> of your citizens in Indiana as compared to BC per capita.
> >>>>
> >>>> For our countries as a whole, the ratio is 2.7 times as many
> >>>> deaths per capita.
> >>>>
> >>>> Where's the big advantage you've gained from letting all those
> >>>> people die, Liarboy?
> >>>>
> >>>> Is it in GDP?
> >>>>
> >>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth-annual>
> >>>>
> >>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/gdp-growth-annual>
> >>>>
> >>>> Ours dropped a little more and is coming back a little slower.
> >>>>
> >>>> Unemployment?
> >>>>
> >>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/unemployment-rate>
> >>>>
> >>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/unemployment-rate>
> >>>>
> >>>> Yours actually spiked WORSE than ours and now we're doing
> >>>> better on relative rate from immediately before the pandemic
> >>>> than you are. You've gone from 3.5% immediately before to just
> >>>> less than 6% now (an increase of a little less than 71%)
> >>>> compared to Canada at 5.5% pre-pandemic and about 8.25% now
> >>>> (and increase of about 50%).
> >>>>
> >>>> Well, Liarboy?
> >>>
> >>> Alan as I have stated before it's not all about the numbers. How
> >>> do you compare the mental well-being of the vastly more numerous
> >>> survivors to the pain of death losses from the relatively few
> >>> (many of which were imminent anyway given the age demographics
> >>> involved). You cannot.
> >> Bleat on!
> >>>
> >>> Now I'm going to make you really mad. As of yesterday the local
> >>> symphony eliminated attendance limits for our outdoor summer
> >>> concert series. It was set at 4,000, about half capacity. Now no
> >>> limits on ticket sales. We will be attending almost all of the
> >>> concerts. The fall indoor concert tickets are going on sale, with
> >>> no attendance limits shown on the website.
> >>> https://www.indianapolissymphony.org/ The site has a photo that
> >>> shows an audience wearing masks. But if you look closely it's all
> >>> Asians in the seats. That's not real. The audience is typically
> >>> older and predominately Caucasian. And, there is no mention of
> >>> COVID restrictions that I can fine on the ISO site. You too can
> >>> buy a ticket to go to the June 27 performance of Beatles music by
> >>> the entire orchestra.
> >>> https://tickets.indianapolissymphony.org/events/detail/11912/11933
> >>>
> >>>
> It's going to be a lot of fun! Bring your dinner and drinks, and come
> >>> on down!
> >> Your priorities are so messed up.
> >>>
> >>> Our first convention of what will be a very busy summer kicks off
> >>> in a few days. Later this year GENCON and the FFA are planning on
> >>> 50-70k attendees.
> >>>
> >>> Out and about these last few days a rough estimate of mask
> >>> wearing by the general public - about 2-5%. Employees mandated
> >>> are still masking up in many places of business as a condition of
> >>> employment.
> >> I see.
> >>
> >> And that's fine with you.
> >>>
> >>> Indiana cases and deaths continue to wane despite almost total
> >>> freedom to travel and assemble with no restrictions. Before and
> >>> after the Indy 500 new case and death trends were consistent. No
> >>> surge, just no effect. https://www.coronavirus.in.gov/2393.htm
> >> And the dead are still dead.
> >>>
> >>> Same is true for the entire country.
> >>> https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#trends_dailytrendscases
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> If you want to be critical here's a topic. Six months after the first
> >>> vaccine doses given Indiana is only 47% fully vaccinated for the
> >>> 12 and up population. That's shameful. We could be even lower on
> >>> cases and deaths than we currently are. We are one of the lowest
> >>> states in percent vaccinated.
> >> Maybe if you didn't live in a country that makes ignorance a badge
> >> of honour.
> >>>
> >>> What is also interesting is the the Democrats have been in power
> >>> since January with no apparent effect on declining case and
> >>> death trends. In fact, the Biden administration has basically
> >>> done nothing other than tweaking vaccine distribution on the
> >>> COVID front. What does that tell you? There was and is across
> >>> party lines no political will in this country to give up personal
> >>> freedoms to the extent that Canadians are willing to do so. So
> >>> criticize Americans if you want to. I'm just one voter. I did not
> >>> vote for Biden. Had Democrats nominated a credible candidate I
> >>> would not have voted for Trump.
> >> That you chose to keep Trump in office tells me all I need about
> >> you.
> >>
> >> Biden was far more "credible" than Trump.
> >
> > It's not "my" priorities it's the country's. The dead are dead, true,
> > but we did our part. We masked, distanced, were careful to avoid
> > large indoor crowds and got the Pfizer vaccine doses at first
> > opportunity in February/March. We did not get COVID, and could not
> > have transmitted it to anybody. (The wife was tested several times
> > for medical procedure screening, and I once, all negative.)
> You're the one crowing about how wonderful it was that you kept your
> "freedom" by killing a whole lot more people.
> >
> > You did get COVID, IIRC. How irresponsible was that? You could have
> > made someone else sick.
> You think you can control absolutely whether or not you get an illness?
>
> As soon as I discovered I had been exposed, I went and got tested, and
> we removed everyone from the house who didn't have it.
> >
> > Now that we are vaccinated it's not a concern. The Pfizer vaccine is
> > reportedly effective against the variants, at least so far. I'll
> > gladly take a booster shot if needed.
> >
> > I tried making some social media posts to the effect that if you are
> > not vaccinated, well good luck. The response was that I was shaming
> > others, and needed to continue to mask and "stay away from me." One
> > respondent even went so far as to state that the vaccinated are
> > shedding the virus and infecting others! Wow, if true U.S. COVID
> > cases should be through the roof.
> Yes. The US celebration of ignorance is definitely coming home to roost.
> >
> > One of my social media posts was deleted for being abusive, and my
> > account suspended. The account was restored after I promised not to
> > do that again.
> >
> > I live in a country that is scientifically illiterate. I'll certainly
> > grant anyone that claim!
> Not just illiterate: proud of it.

On 2021-07-03 1:02 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 3:37:09 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
>> On 2021-07-03 11:52 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
>>> On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 11:55:53 AM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
>>>> On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 8:28:48 AM UTC-4, Thomas E. wrote:
>>>>> On Wednesday, June 23, 2021 at 2:43:32 PM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
>>
>>>>> The Biden administration has done nothing different to stop the
>>>>> spread was my comment.
>>>> Well, if that’s actually what you meant to say, then it’s a non
>>>> sequitur, because restrictions and vaccination uptake are what
>>>> affects spread and both are implemented State by State.
>>>>
>>>> Which is also why CoVid rates are increasing in the Midwest now
>>>> too: a lack of controls to limit R0, along with a population who
>>>> doesn’t want to take the vaccine.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -hh
>>>
>>> Which Midwest states are you talking about? Missouri is the only one
>>> I can find with any sign of an increase. Biden could have encourage
>>> states to keep restrictions, he has done nothing. He could have taken
>>> a stronger position on vaccination. In fact, some months back, he
>>> stated that "There is nothing we can do to change the pandemic
>>> trajectory...". And, that's what his administration has done,
>>> nothing. Promise fulfilled.
>>>
>>> https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/22/biden-says-nothing-can-change-the-trajectory-of-covid-pandemic-over-the-next-several-months.html
>>>
>> How about Indiana?
>> 'Federal guidelines advise that states wait until they experience a
>> downward trajectory of documented cases within a 14-day period before
>> proceeding to a phased opening. In the state-specific view of the graph,
>> this two-week period is highlighted in orange if cases are trending
>> upward, or green if they are trending down.'
>>
>> <https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/new-cases-50-states/indiana>
>> Tell us, Liarboy:
>>
>> What colour is the current two-week period?
>>
>> Wait.. ...don't tell me:
>>
>> It's a data anomaly and you understand better than Johns Hopkins University.
>>
>> :-)
>
> Why not look at primary data? https://www.coronavirus.in.gov/2393.htm
>
> Looks a bit different from the secondary source you cited.
>

So you do think you understand better than Johns Hopkins University, is
that right?

On 2021-07-03 1:03 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 3:58:34 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
>> On 2021-07-03 12:07 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
>>> On Wednesday, June 23, 2021 at 1:12:27 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
>>>> On 2021-06-23 10:03 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
>>>>> On Monday, June 21, 2021 at 5:58:39 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
>>>>>> On 2021-06-20 9:25 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
>>>>>>> On Thursday, June 17, 2021 at 4:05:30 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 2021-06-16 6:24 p.m., ed wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Tuesday, June 15, 2021 at 10:26:25 PM UTC-4, Thomas
>>>>>>>>> E. wrote: . ..
>>>>>>>>>> Plus, by going through the pain millions of us have
>>>>>>>>>> acquired natural immunity that is now part of the case
>>>>>>>>>> decline. One could ask how many future deaths were
>>>>>>>>>> avoided by allowing the virus to immunize the
>>>>>>>>>> population.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> So you're arguing we might be avoiding future deaths..
>>>>>>>>> by having already infected - and killed off - a bunch of
>>>>>>>>> people... Yea, not a good thing.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Remember, when all this started there was no clear path
>>>>>>>>>> to vaccines. So-called experts were saying it would
>>>>>>>>>> take years. It did not, but it was no sure thing a year
>>>>>>>>>> ago.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Yep, that was presented as a possibility. And a lot of
>>>>>>>>> vaccines that were in development haven't been approved
>>>>>>>>> yet, so we're lucky we have a couple good options that
>>>>>>>>> were developed quickly.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And the fact that having vaccines was going to take a while
>>>>>>>> was the very reason for imposing restrictions...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ...that have saved countless lives in many countries...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ...just not in the US.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> We had restrictions prior to vaccines too. They did save
>>>>>>> lives.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Keep yapping, Liarboy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The simple truth is that you've killed nearly 6 times as many
>>>>>> of your citizens in Indiana as compared to BC per capita.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> For our countries as a whole, the ratio is 2.7 times as many
>>>>>> deaths per capita.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Where's the big advantage you've gained from letting all those
>>>>>> people die, Liarboy?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Is it in GDP?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth-annual>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/gdp-growth-annual>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ours dropped a little more and is coming back a little slower.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Unemployment?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/unemployment-rate>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/unemployment-rate>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yours actually spiked WORSE than ours and now we're doing
>>>>>> better on relative rate from immediately before the pandemic
>>>>>> than you are. You've gone from 3.5% immediately before to just
>>>>>> less than 6% now (an increase of a little less than 71%)
>>>>>> compared to Canada at 5.5% pre-pandemic and about 8.25% now
>>>>>> (and increase of about 50%).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Well, Liarboy?
>>>>>
>>>>> Alan as I have stated before it's not all about the numbers. How
>>>>> do you compare the mental well-being of the vastly more numerous
>>>>> survivors to the pain of death losses from the relatively few
>>>>> (many of which were imminent anyway given the age demographics
>>>>> involved). You cannot.
>>>> Bleat on!
>>>>>
>>>>> Now I'm going to make you really mad. As of yesterday the local
>>>>> symphony eliminated attendance limits for our outdoor summer
>>>>> concert series. It was set at 4,000, about half capacity. Now no
>>>>> limits on ticket sales. We will be attending almost all of the
>>>>> concerts. The fall indoor concert tickets are going on sale, with
>>>>> no attendance limits shown on the website.
>>>>> https://www.indianapolissymphony.org/ The site has a photo that
>>>>> shows an audience wearing masks. But if you look closely it's all
>>>>> Asians in the seats. That's not real. The audience is typically
>>>>> older and predominately Caucasian. And, there is no mention of
>>>>> COVID restrictions that I can fine on the ISO site. You too can
>>>>> buy a ticket to go to the June 27 performance of Beatles music by
>>>>> the entire orchestra.
>>>>> https://tickets.indianapolissymphony.org/events/detail/11912/11933
>>>>>
>>>>>
>> It's going to be a lot of fun! Bring your dinner and drinks, and come
>>>>> on down!
>>>> Your priorities are so messed up.
>>>>>
>>>>> Our first convention of what will be a very busy summer kicks off
>>>>> in a few days. Later this year GENCON and the FFA are planning on
>>>>> 50-70k attendees.
>>>>>
>>>>> Out and about these last few days a rough estimate of mask
>>>>> wearing by the general public - about 2-5%. Employees mandated
>>>>> are still masking up in many places of business as a condition of
>>>>> employment.
>>>> I see.
>>>>
>>>> And that's fine with you.
>>>>>
>>>>> Indiana cases and deaths continue to wane despite almost total
>>>>> freedom to travel and assemble with no restrictions. Before and
>>>>> after the Indy 500 new case and death trends were consistent. No
>>>>> surge, just no effect. https://www.coronavirus.in.gov/2393.htm
>>>> And the dead are still dead.
>>>>>
>>>>> Same is true for the entire country.
>>>>> https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#trends_dailytrendscases
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>> If you want to be critical here's a topic. Six months after the first
>>>>> vaccine doses given Indiana is only 47% fully vaccinated for the
>>>>> 12 and up population. That's shameful. We could be even lower on
>>>>> cases and deaths than we currently are. We are one of the lowest
>>>>> states in percent vaccinated.
>>>> Maybe if you didn't live in a country that makes ignorance a badge
>>>> of honour.
>>>>>
>>>>> What is also interesting is the the Democrats have been in power
>>>>> since January with no apparent effect on declining case and
>>>>> death trends. In fact, the Biden administration has basically
>>>>> done nothing other than tweaking vaccine distribution on the
>>>>> COVID front. What does that tell you? There was and is across
>>>>> party lines no political will in this country to give up personal
>>>>> freedoms to the extent that Canadians are willing to do so. So
>>>>> criticize Americans if you want to. I'm just one voter. I did not
>>>>> vote for Biden. Had Democrats nominated a credible candidate I
>>>>> would not have voted for Trump.
>>>> That you chose to keep Trump in office tells me all I need about
>>>> you.
>>>>
>>>> Biden was far more "credible" than Trump.
>>>
>>> It's not "my" priorities it's the country's. The dead are dead, true,
>>> but we did our part. We masked, distanced, were careful to avoid
>>> large indoor crowds and got the Pfizer vaccine doses at first
>>> opportunity in February/March. We did not get COVID, and could not
>>> have transmitted it to anybody. (The wife was tested several times
>>> for medical procedure screening, and I once, all negative.)
>> You're the one crowing about how wonderful it was that you kept your
>> "freedom" by killing a whole lot more people.
>>>
>>> You did get COVID, IIRC. How irresponsible was that? You could have
>>> made someone else sick.
>> You think you can control absolutely whether or not you get an illness?
>>
>> As soon as I discovered I had been exposed, I went and got tested, and
>> we removed everyone from the house who didn't have it.
>>>
>>> Now that we are vaccinated it's not a concern. The Pfizer vaccine is
>>> reportedly effective against the variants, at least so far. I'll
>>> gladly take a booster shot if needed.
>>>
>>> I tried making some social media posts to the effect that if you are
>>> not vaccinated, well good luck. The response was that I was shaming
>>> others, and needed to continue to mask and "stay away from me." One
>>> respondent even went so far as to state that the vaccinated are
>>> shedding the virus and infecting others! Wow, if true U.S. COVID
>>> cases should be through the roof.
>> Yes. The US celebration of ignorance is definitely coming home to roost.
>>>
>>> One of my social media posts was deleted for being abusive, and my
>>> account suspended. The account was restored after I promised not to
>>> do that again.
>>>
>>> I live in a country that is scientifically illiterate. I'll certainly
>>> grant anyone that claim!
>> Not just illiterate: proud of it.
>
> I'm not proud of it.

On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 4:15:24 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> On 2021-07-03 1:02 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> > On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 3:37:09 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> >> On 2021-07-03 11:52 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> >>> On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 11:55:53 AM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
> >>>> On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 8:28:48 AM UTC-4, Thomas E. wrote:
> >>>>> On Wednesday, June 23, 2021 at 2:43:32 PM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
> >>
> >>>>> The Biden administration has done nothing different to stop the
> >>>>> spread was my comment.
> >>>> Well, if that’s actually what you meant to say, then it’s a non
> >>>> sequitur, because restrictions and vaccination uptake are what
> >>>> affects spread and both are implemented State by State.
> >>>>
> >>>> Which is also why CoVid rates are increasing in the Midwest now
> >>>> too: a lack of controls to limit R0, along with a population who
> >>>> doesn’t want to take the vaccine.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> -hh
> >>>
> >>> Which Midwest states are you talking about? Missouri is the only one
> >>> I can find with any sign of an increase. Biden could have encourage
> >>> states to keep restrictions, he has done nothing. He could have taken
> >>> a stronger position on vaccination. In fact, some months back, he
> >>> stated that "There is nothing we can do to change the pandemic
> >>> trajectory...". And, that's what his administration has done,
> >>> nothing. Promise fulfilled.
> >>>
> >>> https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/22/biden-says-nothing-can-change-the-trajectory-of-covid-pandemic-over-the-next-several-months.html
> >>>
> >> How about Indiana?
> >> 'Federal guidelines advise that states wait until they experience a
> >> downward trajectory of documented cases within a 14-day period before
> >> proceeding to a phased opening. In the state-specific view of the graph,
> >> this two-week period is highlighted in orange if cases are trending
> >> upward, or green if they are trending down.'
> >>
> >> <https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/new-cases-50-states/indiana>
> >> Tell us, Liarboy:
> >>
> >> What colour is the current two-week period?
> >>
> >> Wait.. ...don't tell me:
> >>
> >> It's a data anomaly and you understand better than Johns Hopkins University.
> >>
> >> :-)
> >
> > Why not look at primary data? https://www.coronavirus.in.gov/2393.htm
> >
> > Looks a bit different from the secondary source you cited.
> >
> So you do think you understand better than Johns Hopkins University, is
> that right?

No, I think Indiana reports very different numbers from what John Hopkins reports FOR Indiana

Here is the trailing 7 Day MA from both sources:

Date JH Indiana
2021-06-25 Missing 200
2021-06-26 243 200
2021-06-27 259 198
2021-06-28 275 198
2021-06-29 289 210
2021-06-30 338 214
2021-07-01 405 221

Last 7 days as reported by Indiana

248
131
136
180
288
259
302

How do you get a 405 average out of those numbers?

On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 2:52:29 PM UTC-4, Thomas E. wrote:
> On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 11:55:53 AM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
> > ...
> > Which is also why CoVid rates are increasing in the Midwest now too: a lack of controls
> > to limit R0, along with a population who doesn’t want to take the vaccine.
>
> Which Midwest states are you talking about? Missouri is the only one I can find with any sign of an increase.

At the time, there were IIRC five States with increasing case countsincreasing. Now there's 24 States
who have reported increases of +10% or more over the past fourteen days:

<https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/us/covid-cases.html>

> Biden could have encourage states to keep restrictions, he has done nothing. He could have taken a
> stronger position on vaccination. In fact, some months back, he stated that "There is nothing we can
> do to change the pandemic trajectory...". And, that's what his administration has done, nothing. Promise fulfilled.
>
> https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/22/biden-says-nothing-can-change-the-trajectory-of-covid-pandemic-over-the-next-several-months.html

But of course you cherrypick a statement made 48 hours after inauguration....plus you're forgetting that Trump
absolutely refused to cooperate with the transition, which set them back ~3 months.

-hh

On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 4:54:02 PM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
> On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 2:52:29 PM UTC-4, Thomas E. wrote:
> > On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 11:55:53 AM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
> > > ...
> > > Which is also why CoVid rates are increasing in the Midwest now too: a lack of controls
> > > to limit R0, along with a population who doesn’t want to take the vaccine.
> >
> > Which Midwest states are you talking about? Missouri is the only one I can find with any sign of an increase.
> At the time, there were IIRC five States with increasing case countsincreasing. Now there's 24 States
> who have reported increases of +10% or more over the past fourteen days:
>
> <https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/us/covid-cases.html>
> > Biden could have encourage states to keep restrictions, he has done nothing. He could have taken a
> > stronger position on vaccination. In fact, some months back, he stated that "There is nothing we can
> > do to change the pandemic trajectory...". And, that's what his administration has done, nothing. Promise fulfilled.
> >
> > https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/22/biden-says-nothing-can-change-the-trajectory-of-covid-pandemic-over-the-next-several-months.html
> But of course you cherrypick a statement made 48 hours after inauguration....plus you're forgetting that Trump
> absolutely refused to cooperate with the transition, which set them back ~3 months.
>
>
> -hh

I do not have a NY Times subscription, and that article is behind the paywall. I found this instead. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/tracking-coronavirus-case-surges-states-across-country-winter-n1247103
There are states with upticks. Will that turn into a surge? Will it increase immunity? Maybe and yes.

Cherry-picked Biden? Name one thing that the administration has done other than an initial distribution tweak? Strongly encouraged vaccination? No. Requested prolonged mask use and discouraged large gatherings? No.

In fact, CDC has stated than the vaccinated have little fear in outdoor gatherings. I'll be going to an outdoor 4th of July concert in about 90 minutes. It's going to be a huge crowd. A good friend, and cousin, invited us to be with their group at a front row table. Patriotic Pops and fireworks to the 1812 Overture for a finale. All because CDC, which is part of the Biden administration, said it's OK. LOL, wake up Hugh.

https://www.indianapolissymphony.org/event/star-spangled/

On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 4:20:24 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> On 2021-07-03 1:03 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> > On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 3:58:34 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> >> On 2021-07-03 12:07 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> >>> On Wednesday, June 23, 2021 at 1:12:27 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> >>>> On 2021-06-23 10:03 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> >>>>> On Monday, June 21, 2021 at 5:58:39 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> >>>>>> On 2021-06-20 9:25 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> >>>>>>> On Thursday, June 17, 2021 at 4:05:30 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker
> >>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>> On 2021-06-16 6:24 p.m., ed wrote:
> >>>>>>>>> On Tuesday, June 15, 2021 at 10:26:25 PM UTC-4, Thomas
> >>>>>>>>> E. wrote: . ..
> >>>>>>>>>> Plus, by going through the pain millions of us have
> >>>>>>>>>> acquired natural immunity that is now part of the case
> >>>>>>>>>> decline. One could ask how many future deaths were
> >>>>>>>>>> avoided by allowing the virus to immunize the
> >>>>>>>>>> population.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> So you're arguing we might be avoiding future deaths..
> >>>>>>>>> by having already infected - and killed off - a bunch of
> >>>>>>>>> people... Yea, not a good thing.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> Remember, when all this started there was no clear path
> >>>>>>>>>> to vaccines. So-called experts were saying it would
> >>>>>>>>>> take years. It did not, but it was no sure thing a year
> >>>>>>>>>> ago.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Yep, that was presented as a possibility. And a lot of
> >>>>>>>>> vaccines that were in development haven't been approved
> >>>>>>>>> yet, so we're lucky we have a couple good options that
> >>>>>>>>> were developed quickly.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> And the fact that having vaccines was going to take a while
> >>>>>>>> was the very reason for imposing restrictions...
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> ...that have saved countless lives in many countries...
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> ...just not in the US.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> We had restrictions prior to vaccines too. They did save
> >>>>>>> lives.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>> Keep yapping, Liarboy.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> The simple truth is that you've killed nearly 6 times as many
> >>>>>> of your citizens in Indiana as compared to BC per capita.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> For our countries as a whole, the ratio is 2.7 times as many
> >>>>>> deaths per capita.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Where's the big advantage you've gained from letting all those
> >>>>>> people die, Liarboy?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Is it in GDP?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth-annual>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/gdp-growth-annual>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Ours dropped a little more and is coming back a little slower.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Unemployment?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/unemployment-rate>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/unemployment-rate>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Yours actually spiked WORSE than ours and now we're doing
> >>>>>> better on relative rate from immediately before the pandemic
> >>>>>> than you are. You've gone from 3.5% immediately before to just
> >>>>>> less than 6% now (an increase of a little less than 71%)
> >>>>>> compared to Canada at 5.5% pre-pandemic and about 8.25% now
> >>>>>> (and increase of about 50%).
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Well, Liarboy?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Alan as I have stated before it's not all about the numbers. How
> >>>>> do you compare the mental well-being of the vastly more numerous
> >>>>> survivors to the pain of death losses from the relatively few
> >>>>> (many of which were imminent anyway given the age demographics
> >>>>> involved). You cannot.
> >>>> Bleat on!
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Now I'm going to make you really mad. As of yesterday the local
> >>>>> symphony eliminated attendance limits for our outdoor summer
> >>>>> concert series. It was set at 4,000, about half capacity. Now no
> >>>>> limits on ticket sales. We will be attending almost all of the
> >>>>> concerts. The fall indoor concert tickets are going on sale, with
> >>>>> no attendance limits shown on the website.
> >>>>> https://www.indianapolissymphony.org/ The site has a photo that
> >>>>> shows an audience wearing masks. But if you look closely it's all
> >>>>> Asians in the seats. That's not real. The audience is typically
> >>>>> older and predominately Caucasian. And, there is no mention of
> >>>>> COVID restrictions that I can fine on the ISO site. You too can
> >>>>> buy a ticket to go to the June 27 performance of Beatles music by
> >>>>> the entire orchestra.
> >>>>> https://tickets.indianapolissymphony.org/events/detail/11912/11933
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >> It's going to be a lot of fun! Bring your dinner and drinks, and come
> >>>>> on down!
> >>>> Your priorities are so messed up.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Our first convention of what will be a very busy summer kicks off
> >>>>> in a few days. Later this year GENCON and the FFA are planning on
> >>>>> 50-70k attendees.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Out and about these last few days a rough estimate of mask
> >>>>> wearing by the general public - about 2-5%. Employees mandated
> >>>>> are still masking up in many places of business as a condition of
> >>>>> employment.
> >>>> I see.
> >>>>
> >>>> And that's fine with you.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Indiana cases and deaths continue to wane despite almost total
> >>>>> freedom to travel and assemble with no restrictions. Before and
> >>>>> after the Indy 500 new case and death trends were consistent. No
> >>>>> surge, just no effect. https://www.coronavirus.in.gov/2393.htm
> >>>> And the dead are still dead.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Same is true for the entire country.
> >>>>> https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#trends_dailytrendscases
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >> If you want to be critical here's a topic. Six months after the first
> >>>>> vaccine doses given Indiana is only 47% fully vaccinated for the
> >>>>> 12 and up population. That's shameful. We could be even lower on
> >>>>> cases and deaths than we currently are. We are one of the lowest
> >>>>> states in percent vaccinated.
> >>>> Maybe if you didn't live in a country that makes ignorance a badge
> >>>> of honour.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> What is also interesting is the the Democrats have been in power
> >>>>> since January with no apparent effect on declining case and
> >>>>> death trends. In fact, the Biden administration has basically
> >>>>> done nothing other than tweaking vaccine distribution on the
> >>>>> COVID front. What does that tell you? There was and is across
> >>>>> party lines no political will in this country to give up personal
> >>>>> freedoms to the extent that Canadians are willing to do so. So
> >>>>> criticize Americans if you want to. I'm just one voter. I did not
> >>>>> vote for Biden. Had Democrats nominated a credible candidate I
> >>>>> would not have voted for Trump.
> >>>> That you chose to keep Trump in office tells me all I need about
> >>>> you.
> >>>>
> >>>> Biden was far more "credible" than Trump.
> >>>
> >>> It's not "my" priorities it's the country's. The dead are dead, true,
> >>> but we did our part. We masked, distanced, were careful to avoid
> >>> large indoor crowds and got the Pfizer vaccine doses at first
> >>> opportunity in February/March. We did not get COVID, and could not
> >>> have transmitted it to anybody. (The wife was tested several times
> >>> for medical procedure screening, and I once, all negative.)
> >> You're the one crowing about how wonderful it was that you kept your
> >> "freedom" by killing a whole lot more people.
> >>>
> >>> You did get COVID, IIRC. How irresponsible was that? You could have
> >>> made someone else sick.
> >> You think you can control absolutely whether or not you get an illness?
> >>
> >> As soon as I discovered I had been exposed, I went and got tested, and
> >> we removed everyone from the house who didn't have it.
> >>>
> >>> Now that we are vaccinated it's not a concern. The Pfizer vaccine is
> >>> reportedly effective against the variants, at least so far. I'll
> >>> gladly take a booster shot if needed.
> >>>
> >>> I tried making some social media posts to the effect that if you are
> >>> not vaccinated, well good luck. The response was that I was shaming
> >>> others, and needed to continue to mask and "stay away from me." One
> >>> respondent even went so far as to state that the vaccinated are
> >>> shedding the virus and infecting others! Wow, if true U.S. COVID
> >>> cases should be through the roof.
> >> Yes. The US celebration of ignorance is definitely coming home to roost.
> >>>
> >>> One of my social media posts was deleted for being abusive, and my
> >>> account suspended. The account was restored after I promised not to
> >>> do that again.
> >>>
> >>> I live in a country that is scientifically illiterate. I'll certainly
> >>> grant anyone that claim!
> >> Not just illiterate: proud of it.
> >
> > I'm not proud of it.
> You're proud of the "freedom" that led to
> >
> > You could have infected someone before you had the test.
> Except I was careful to wear a mask all the times that I was anywhere
> but with my immediate family.

On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 3:58:34 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> On 2021-07-03 12:07 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> > On Wednesday, June 23, 2021 at 1:12:27 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> >> On 2021-06-23 10:03 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> >>> On Monday, June 21, 2021 at 5:58:39 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> >>>> On 2021-06-20 9:25 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> >>>>> On Thursday, June 17, 2021 at 4:05:30 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker
> >>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>> On 2021-06-16 6:24 p.m., ed wrote:
> >>>>>>> On Tuesday, June 15, 2021 at 10:26:25 PM UTC-4, Thomas
> >>>>>>> E. wrote: . ..
> >>>>>>>> Plus, by going through the pain millions of us have
> >>>>>>>> acquired natural immunity that is now part of the case
> >>>>>>>> decline. One could ask how many future deaths were
> >>>>>>>> avoided by allowing the virus to immunize the
> >>>>>>>> population.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> So you're arguing we might be avoiding future deaths..
> >>>>>>> by having already infected - and killed off - a bunch of
> >>>>>>> people... Yea, not a good thing.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Remember, when all this started there was no clear path
> >>>>>>>> to vaccines. So-called experts were saying it would
> >>>>>>>> take years. It did not, but it was no sure thing a year
> >>>>>>>> ago.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Yep, that was presented as a possibility. And a lot of
> >>>>>>> vaccines that were in development haven't been approved
> >>>>>>> yet, so we're lucky we have a couple good options that
> >>>>>>> were developed quickly.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>> And the fact that having vaccines was going to take a while
> >>>>>> was the very reason for imposing restrictions...
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> ...that have saved countless lives in many countries...
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> ...just not in the US.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> We had restrictions prior to vaccines too. They did save
> >>>>> lives.
> >>>>>
> >>>> Keep yapping, Liarboy.
> >>>>
> >>>> The simple truth is that you've killed nearly 6 times as many
> >>>> of your citizens in Indiana as compared to BC per capita.
> >>>>
> >>>> For our countries as a whole, the ratio is 2.7 times as many
> >>>> deaths per capita.
> >>>>
> >>>> Where's the big advantage you've gained from letting all those
> >>>> people die, Liarboy?
> >>>>
> >>>> Is it in GDP?
> >>>>
> >>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth-annual>
> >>>>
> >>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/gdp-growth-annual>
> >>>>
> >>>> Ours dropped a little more and is coming back a little slower.
> >>>>
> >>>> Unemployment?
> >>>>
> >>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/unemployment-rate>
> >>>>
> >>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/unemployment-rate>
> >>>>
> >>>> Yours actually spiked WORSE than ours and now we're doing
> >>>> better on relative rate from immediately before the pandemic
> >>>> than you are. You've gone from 3.5% immediately before to just
> >>>> less than 6% now (an increase of a little less than 71%)
> >>>> compared to Canada at 5.5% pre-pandemic and about 8.25% now
> >>>> (and increase of about 50%).
> >>>>
> >>>> Well, Liarboy?
> >>>
> >>> Alan as I have stated before it's not all about the numbers. How
> >>> do you compare the mental well-being of the vastly more numerous
> >>> survivors to the pain of death losses from the relatively few
> >>> (many of which were imminent anyway given the age demographics
> >>> involved). You cannot.
> >> Bleat on!
> >>>
> >>> Now I'm going to make you really mad. As of yesterday the local
> >>> symphony eliminated attendance limits for our outdoor summer
> >>> concert series. It was set at 4,000, about half capacity. Now no
> >>> limits on ticket sales. We will be attending almost all of the
> >>> concerts. The fall indoor concert tickets are going on sale, with
> >>> no attendance limits shown on the website.
> >>> https://www.indianapolissymphony.org/ The site has a photo that
> >>> shows an audience wearing masks. But if you look closely it's all
> >>> Asians in the seats. That's not real. The audience is typically
> >>> older and predominately Caucasian. And, there is no mention of
> >>> COVID restrictions that I can fine on the ISO site. You too can
> >>> buy a ticket to go to the June 27 performance of Beatles music by
> >>> the entire orchestra.
> >>> https://tickets.indianapolissymphony.org/events/detail/11912/11933
> >>>
> >>>
> It's going to be a lot of fun! Bring your dinner and drinks, and come
> >>> on down!
> >> Your priorities are so messed up.
> >>>
> >>> Our first convention of what will be a very busy summer kicks off
> >>> in a few days. Later this year GENCON and the FFA are planning on
> >>> 50-70k attendees.
> >>>
> >>> Out and about these last few days a rough estimate of mask
> >>> wearing by the general public - about 2-5%. Employees mandated
> >>> are still masking up in many places of business as a condition of
> >>> employment.
> >> I see.
> >>
> >> And that's fine with you.
> >>>
> >>> Indiana cases and deaths continue to wane despite almost total
> >>> freedom to travel and assemble with no restrictions. Before and
> >>> after the Indy 500 new case and death trends were consistent. No
> >>> surge, just no effect. https://www.coronavirus.in.gov/2393.htm
> >> And the dead are still dead.
> >>>
> >>> Same is true for the entire country.
> >>> https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#trends_dailytrendscases
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> If you want to be critical here's a topic. Six months after the first
> >>> vaccine doses given Indiana is only 47% fully vaccinated for the
> >>> 12 and up population. That's shameful. We could be even lower on
> >>> cases and deaths than we currently are. We are one of the lowest
> >>> states in percent vaccinated.
> >> Maybe if you didn't live in a country that makes ignorance a badge
> >> of honour.
> >>>
> >>> What is also interesting is the the Democrats have been in power
> >>> since January with no apparent effect on declining case and
> >>> death trends. In fact, the Biden administration has basically
> >>> done nothing other than tweaking vaccine distribution on the
> >>> COVID front. What does that tell you? There was and is across
> >>> party lines no political will in this country to give up personal
> >>> freedoms to the extent that Canadians are willing to do so. So
> >>> criticize Americans if you want to. I'm just one voter. I did not
> >>> vote for Biden. Had Democrats nominated a credible candidate I
> >>> would not have voted for Trump.
> >> That you chose to keep Trump in office tells me all I need about
> >> you.
> >>
> >> Biden was far more "credible" than Trump.
> >
> > It's not "my" priorities it's the country's. The dead are dead, true,
> > but we did our part. We masked, distanced, were careful to avoid
> > large indoor crowds and got the Pfizer vaccine doses at first
> > opportunity in February/March. We did not get COVID, and could not
> > have transmitted it to anybody. (The wife was tested several times
> > for medical procedure screening, and I once, all negative.)
> You're the one crowing about how wonderful it was that you kept your
> "freedom" by killing a whole lot more people.
> >
> > You did get COVID, IIRC. How irresponsible was that? You could have
> > made someone else sick.
> You think you can control absolutely whether or not you get an illness?
>
> As soon as I discovered I had been exposed, I went and got tested, and
> we removed everyone from the house who didn't have it.
> >
> > Now that we are vaccinated it's not a concern. The Pfizer vaccine is
> > reportedly effective against the variants, at least so far. I'll
> > gladly take a booster shot if needed.
> >
> > I tried making some social media posts to the effect that if you are
> > not vaccinated, well good luck. The response was that I was shaming
> > others, and needed to continue to mask and "stay away from me." One
> > respondent even went so far as to state that the vaccinated are
> > shedding the virus and infecting others! Wow, if true U.S. COVID
> > cases should be through the roof.
> Yes. The US celebration of ignorance is definitely coming home to roost.
> >
> > One of my social media posts was deleted for being abusive, and my
> > account suspended. The account was restored after I promised not to
> > do that again.
> >
> > I live in a country that is scientifically illiterate. I'll certainly
> > grant anyone that claim!
> Not just illiterate: proud of it.

On 2021-07-04 2:07 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 3:58:34 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
>> On 2021-07-03 12:07 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
>>> On Wednesday, June 23, 2021 at 1:12:27 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
>>>> On 2021-06-23 10:03 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
>>>>> On Monday, June 21, 2021 at 5:58:39 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
>>>>>> On 2021-06-20 9:25 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
>>>>>>> On Thursday, June 17, 2021 at 4:05:30 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 2021-06-16 6:24 p.m., ed wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Tuesday, June 15, 2021 at 10:26:25 PM UTC-4, Thomas
>>>>>>>>> E. wrote: . ..
>>>>>>>>>> Plus, by going through the pain millions of us have
>>>>>>>>>> acquired natural immunity that is now part of the case
>>>>>>>>>> decline. One could ask how many future deaths were
>>>>>>>>>> avoided by allowing the virus to immunize the
>>>>>>>>>> population.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> So you're arguing we might be avoiding future deaths..
>>>>>>>>> by having already infected - and killed off - a bunch of
>>>>>>>>> people... Yea, not a good thing.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Remember, when all this started there was no clear path
>>>>>>>>>> to vaccines. So-called experts were saying it would
>>>>>>>>>> take years. It did not, but it was no sure thing a year
>>>>>>>>>> ago.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Yep, that was presented as a possibility. And a lot of
>>>>>>>>> vaccines that were in development haven't been approved
>>>>>>>>> yet, so we're lucky we have a couple good options that
>>>>>>>>> were developed quickly.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And the fact that having vaccines was going to take a while
>>>>>>>> was the very reason for imposing restrictions...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ...that have saved countless lives in many countries...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ...just not in the US.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> We had restrictions prior to vaccines too. They did save
>>>>>>> lives.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Keep yapping, Liarboy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The simple truth is that you've killed nearly 6 times as many
>>>>>> of your citizens in Indiana as compared to BC per capita.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> For our countries as a whole, the ratio is 2.7 times as many
>>>>>> deaths per capita.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Where's the big advantage you've gained from letting all those
>>>>>> people die, Liarboy?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Is it in GDP?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth-annual>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/gdp-growth-annual>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ours dropped a little more and is coming back a little slower.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Unemployment?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/unemployment-rate>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/unemployment-rate>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yours actually spiked WORSE than ours and now we're doing
>>>>>> better on relative rate from immediately before the pandemic
>>>>>> than you are. You've gone from 3.5% immediately before to just
>>>>>> less than 6% now (an increase of a little less than 71%)
>>>>>> compared to Canada at 5.5% pre-pandemic and about 8.25% now
>>>>>> (and increase of about 50%).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Well, Liarboy?
>>>>>
>>>>> Alan as I have stated before it's not all about the numbers. How
>>>>> do you compare the mental well-being of the vastly more numerous
>>>>> survivors to the pain of death losses from the relatively few
>>>>> (many of which were imminent anyway given the age demographics
>>>>> involved). You cannot.
>>>> Bleat on!
>>>>>
>>>>> Now I'm going to make you really mad. As of yesterday the local
>>>>> symphony eliminated attendance limits for our outdoor summer
>>>>> concert series. It was set at 4,000, about half capacity. Now no
>>>>> limits on ticket sales. We will be attending almost all of the
>>>>> concerts. The fall indoor concert tickets are going on sale, with
>>>>> no attendance limits shown on the website.
>>>>> https://www.indianapolissymphony.org/ The site has a photo that
>>>>> shows an audience wearing masks. But if you look closely it's all
>>>>> Asians in the seats. That's not real. The audience is typically
>>>>> older and predominately Caucasian. And, there is no mention of
>>>>> COVID restrictions that I can fine on the ISO site. You too can
>>>>> buy a ticket to go to the June 27 performance of Beatles music by
>>>>> the entire orchestra.
>>>>> https://tickets.indianapolissymphony.org/events/detail/11912/11933
>>>>>
>>>>>
>> It's going to be a lot of fun! Bring your dinner and drinks, and come
>>>>> on down!
>>>> Your priorities are so messed up.
>>>>>
>>>>> Our first convention of what will be a very busy summer kicks off
>>>>> in a few days. Later this year GENCON and the FFA are planning on
>>>>> 50-70k attendees.
>>>>>
>>>>> Out and about these last few days a rough estimate of mask
>>>>> wearing by the general public - about 2-5%. Employees mandated
>>>>> are still masking up in many places of business as a condition of
>>>>> employment.
>>>> I see.
>>>>
>>>> And that's fine with you.
>>>>>
>>>>> Indiana cases and deaths continue to wane despite almost total
>>>>> freedom to travel and assemble with no restrictions. Before and
>>>>> after the Indy 500 new case and death trends were consistent. No
>>>>> surge, just no effect. https://www.coronavirus.in.gov/2393.htm
>>>> And the dead are still dead.
>>>>>
>>>>> Same is true for the entire country.
>>>>> https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#trends_dailytrendscases
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>> If you want to be critical here's a topic. Six months after the first
>>>>> vaccine doses given Indiana is only 47% fully vaccinated for the
>>>>> 12 and up population. That's shameful. We could be even lower on
>>>>> cases and deaths than we currently are. We are one of the lowest
>>>>> states in percent vaccinated.
>>>> Maybe if you didn't live in a country that makes ignorance a badge
>>>> of honour.
>>>>>
>>>>> What is also interesting is the the Democrats have been in power
>>>>> since January with no apparent effect on declining case and
>>>>> death trends. In fact, the Biden administration has basically
>>>>> done nothing other than tweaking vaccine distribution on the
>>>>> COVID front. What does that tell you? There was and is across
>>>>> party lines no political will in this country to give up personal
>>>>> freedoms to the extent that Canadians are willing to do so. So
>>>>> criticize Americans if you want to. I'm just one voter. I did not
>>>>> vote for Biden. Had Democrats nominated a credible candidate I
>>>>> would not have voted for Trump.
>>>> That you chose to keep Trump in office tells me all I need about
>>>> you.
>>>>
>>>> Biden was far more "credible" than Trump.
>>>
>>> It's not "my" priorities it's the country's. The dead are dead, true,
>>> but we did our part. We masked, distanced, were careful to avoid
>>> large indoor crowds and got the Pfizer vaccine doses at first
>>> opportunity in February/March. We did not get COVID, and could not
>>> have transmitted it to anybody. (The wife was tested several times
>>> for medical procedure screening, and I once, all negative.)
>> You're the one crowing about how wonderful it was that you kept your
>> "freedom" by killing a whole lot more people.
>>>
>>> You did get COVID, IIRC. How irresponsible was that? You could have
>>> made someone else sick.
>> You think you can control absolutely whether or not you get an illness?
>>
>> As soon as I discovered I had been exposed, I went and got tested, and
>> we removed everyone from the house who didn't have it.
>>>
>>> Now that we are vaccinated it's not a concern. The Pfizer vaccine is
>>> reportedly effective against the variants, at least so far. I'll
>>> gladly take a booster shot if needed.
>>>
>>> I tried making some social media posts to the effect that if you are
>>> not vaccinated, well good luck. The response was that I was shaming
>>> others, and needed to continue to mask and "stay away from me." One
>>> respondent even went so far as to state that the vaccinated are
>>> shedding the virus and infecting others! Wow, if true U.S. COVID
>>> cases should be through the roof.
>> Yes. The US celebration of ignorance is definitely coming home to roost.
>>>
>>> One of my social media posts was deleted for being abusive, and my
>>> account suspended. The account was restored after I promised not to
>>> do that again.
>>>
>>> I live in a country that is scientifically illiterate. I'll certainly
>>> grant anyone that claim!
>> Not just illiterate: proud of it.
>
> Second thoughts. I killed no one. You could have.
>

On 2021-07-04 2:04 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 4:54:02 PM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
>> On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 2:52:29 PM UTC-4, Thomas E. wrote:
>>> On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 11:55:53 AM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
>>>> ...
>>>> Which is also why CoVid rates are increasing in the Midwest now too: a lack of controls
>>>> to limit R0, along with a population who doesn’t want to take the vaccine.
>>>
>>> Which Midwest states are you talking about? Missouri is the only one I can find with any sign of an increase.
>> At the time, there were IIRC five States with increasing case countsincreasing. Now there's 24 States
>> who have reported increases of +10% or more over the past fourteen days:
>>
>> <https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/us/covid-cases.html>
>>> Biden could have encourage states to keep restrictions, he has done nothing. He could have taken a
>>> stronger position on vaccination. In fact, some months back, he stated that "There is nothing we can
>>> do to change the pandemic trajectory...". And, that's what his administration has done, nothing. Promise fulfilled.
>>>
>>> https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/22/biden-says-nothing-can-change-the-trajectory-of-covid-pandemic-over-the-next-several-months.html
>> But of course you cherrypick a statement made 48 hours after inauguration...plus you're forgetting that Trump
>> absolutely refused to cooperate with the transition, which set them back ~3 months.
>>
>>
>> -hh
>
> I do not have a NY Times subscription, and that article is behind the paywall. I found this instead. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/tracking-coronavirus-case-surges-states-across-country-winter-n1247103
> There are states with upticks. Will that turn into a surge? Will it increase immunity? Maybe and yes.

And you're not bright enough to avoid a paywall to read a single article...

....and the NY Times allows you view any of their pages on COVID-19
without restriction if you simply sign up for a free account.

Seems like you're looking for excuses.

But to make it clear, the NY Times site shows Indiana's cases are
rising, just as Johns Hopkins University's site shows. Up 8% over the
last 14 days.

<https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/us/indiana-covid-cases.html>

It's even up 8% in your county, Liarboy:

<https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/us/hamilton-indiana-covid-cases.html>

And it shows a clear point in early June where a strong downward trend
basically stopped...

....just a little more than 30 days after Memorial Day.

>
> Cherry-picked Biden? Name one thing that the administration has done other than an initial distribution tweak? Strongly encouraged vaccination? No. Requested prolonged mask use and discouraged large gatherings? No.

Cherry picked an article from 48 hours after the inauguration.

On 2021-07-04 2:06 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 4:20:24 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
>> On 2021-07-03 1:03 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
>>> On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 3:58:34 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
>>>> On 2021-07-03 12:07 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
>>>>> On Wednesday, June 23, 2021 at 1:12:27 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> On 2021-06-23 10:03 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
>>>>>>> On Monday, June 21, 2021 at 5:58:39 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 2021-06-20 9:25 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Thursday, June 17, 2021 at 4:05:30 PM UTC-4, Alan
>>>>>>>>> Baker wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 2021-06-16 6:24 p.m., ed wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On Tuesday, June 15, 2021 at 10:26:25 PM UTC-4,
>>>>>>>>>>> Thomas E. wrote: . ..
>>>>>>>>>>>> Plus, by going through the pain millions of us
>>>>>>>>>>>> have acquired natural immunity that is now part
>>>>>>>>>>>> of the case decline. One could ask how many
>>>>>>>>>>>> future deaths were avoided by allowing the
>>>>>>>>>>>> virus to immunize the population.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> So you're arguing we might be avoiding future
>>>>>>>>>>> deaths.. by having already infected - and killed
>>>>>>>>>>> off - a bunch of people... Yea, not a good
>>>>>>>>>>> thing.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Remember, when all this started there was no
>>>>>>>>>>>> clear path to vaccines. So-called experts were
>>>>>>>>>>>> saying it would take years. It did not, but it
>>>>>>>>>>>> was no sure thing a year ago.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Yep, that was presented as a possibility. And a
>>>>>>>>>>> lot of vaccines that were in development haven't
>>>>>>>>>>> been approved yet, so we're lucky we have a
>>>>>>>>>>> couple good options that were developed quickly.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> And the fact that having vaccines was going to take
>>>>>>>>>> a while was the very reason for imposing
>>>>>>>>>> restrictions...
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> ...that have saved countless lives in many
>>>>>>>>>> countries...
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> ...just not in the US.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> We had restrictions prior to vaccines too. They did
>>>>>>>>> save lives.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Keep yapping, Liarboy.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The simple truth is that you've killed nearly 6 times
>>>>>>>> as many of your citizens in Indiana as compared to BC
>>>>>>>> per capita.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> For our countries as a whole, the ratio is 2.7 times as
>>>>>>>> many deaths per capita.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Where's the big advantage you've gained from letting
>>>>>>>> all those people die, Liarboy?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Is it in GDP?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth-annual>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
<https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/gdp-growth-annual>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Ours dropped a little more and is coming back a little
>>>>>>>> slower.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Unemployment?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> <https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/unemployment-rate>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
<https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/unemployment-rate>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Yours actually spiked WORSE than ours and now we're
>>>>>>>> doing better on relative rate from immediately before
>>>>>>>> the pandemic than you are. You've gone from 3.5%
>>>>>>>> immediately before to just less than 6% now (an
>>>>>>>> increase of a little less than 71%) compared to Canada
>>>>>>>> at 5.5% pre-pandemic and about 8.25% now (and increase
>>>>>>>> of about 50%).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Well, Liarboy?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Alan as I have stated before it's not all about the
>>>>>>> numbers. How do you compare the mental well-being of the
>>>>>>> vastly more numerous survivors to the pain of death
>>>>>>> losses from the relatively few (many of which were
>>>>>>> imminent anyway given the age demographics involved). You
>>>>>>> cannot.
>>>>>> Bleat on!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Now I'm going to make you really mad. As of yesterday the
>>>>>>> local symphony eliminated attendance limits for our
>>>>>>> outdoor summer concert series. It was set at 4,000, about
>>>>>>> half capacity. Now no limits on ticket sales. We will be
>>>>>>> attending almost all of the concerts. The fall indoor
>>>>>>> concert tickets are going on sale, with no attendance
>>>>>>> limits shown on the website.
>>>>>>> https://www.indianapolissymphony.org/ The site has a
>>>>>>> photo that shows an audience wearing masks. But if you
>>>>>>> look closely it's all Asians in the seats. That's not
>>>>>>> real. The audience is typically older and predominately
>>>>>>> Caucasian. And, there is no mention of COVID restrictions
>>>>>>> that I can fine on the ISO site. You too can buy a ticket
>>>>>>> to go to the June 27 performance of Beatles music by the
>>>>>>> entire orchestra.
>>>>>>> https://tickets.indianapolissymphony.org/events/detail/11912/11933
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>
It's going to be a lot of fun! Bring your dinner and drinks, and come
>>>>>>> on down!
>>>>>> Your priorities are so messed up.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Our first convention of what will be a very busy summer
>>>>>>> kicks off in a few days. Later this year GENCON and the
>>>>>>> FFA are planning on 50-70k attendees.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Out and about these last few days a rough estimate of
>>>>>>> mask wearing by the general public - about 2-5%.
>>>>>>> Employees mandated are still masking up in many places of
>>>>>>> business as a condition of employment.
>>>>>> I see.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And that's fine with you.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Indiana cases and deaths continue to wane despite almost
>>>>>>> total freedom to travel and assemble with no
>>>>>>> restrictions. Before and after the Indy 500 new case and
>>>>>>> death trends were consistent. No surge, just no effect.
>>>>>>> https://www.coronavirus.in.gov/2393.htm
>>>>>> And the dead are still dead.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Same is true for the entire country.
>>>>>>> https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#trends_dailytrendscases
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>
If you want to be critical here's a topic. Six months after the first
>>>>>>> vaccine doses given Indiana is only 47% fully vaccinated
>>>>>>> for the 12 and up population. That's shameful. We could
>>>>>>> be even lower on cases and deaths than we currently are.
>>>>>>> We are one of the lowest states in percent vaccinated.
>>>>>> Maybe if you didn't live in a country that makes ignorance
>>>>>> a badge of honour.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What is also interesting is the the Democrats have been
>>>>>>> in power since January with no apparent effect on
>>>>>>> declining case and death trends. In fact, the Biden
>>>>>>> administration has basically done nothing other than
>>>>>>> tweaking vaccine distribution on the COVID front. What
>>>>>>> does that tell you? There was and is across party lines
>>>>>>> no political will in this country to give up personal
>>>>>>> freedoms to the extent that Canadians are willing to do
>>>>>>> so. So criticize Americans if you want to. I'm just one
>>>>>>> voter. I did not vote for Biden. Had Democrats nominated
>>>>>>> a credible candidate I would not have voted for Trump.
>>>>>> That you chose to keep Trump in office tells me all I need
>>>>>> about you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Biden was far more "credible" than Trump.
>>>>>
>>>>> It's not "my" priorities it's the country's. The dead are
>>>>> dead, true, but we did our part. We masked, distanced, were
>>>>> careful to avoid large indoor crowds and got the Pfizer
>>>>> vaccine doses at first opportunity in February/March. We did
>>>>> not get COVID, and could not have transmitted it to anybody.
>>>>> (The wife was tested several times for medical procedure
>>>>> screening, and I once, all negative.)
>>>> You're the one crowing about how wonderful it was that you kept
>>>> your "freedom" by killing a whole lot more people.
>>>>>
>>>>> You did get COVID, IIRC. How irresponsible was that? You
>>>>> could have made someone else sick.
>>>> You think you can control absolutely whether or not you get an
>>>> illness?
>>>>
>>>> As soon as I discovered I had been exposed, I went and got
>>>> tested, and we removed everyone from the house who didn't have
>>>> it.
>>>>>
>>>>> Now that we are vaccinated it's not a concern. The Pfizer
>>>>> vaccine is reportedly effective against the variants, at
>>>>> least so far. I'll gladly take a booster shot if needed.
>>>>>
>>>>> I tried making some social media posts to the effect that if
>>>>> you are not vaccinated, well good luck. The response was that
>>>>> I was shaming others, and needed to continue to mask and
>>>>> "stay away from me." One respondent even went so far as to
>>>>> state that the vaccinated are shedding the virus and
>>>>> infecting others! Wow, if true U.S. COVID cases should be
>>>>> through the roof.
>>>> Yes. The US celebration of ignorance is definitely coming home
>>>> to roost.
>>>>>
>>>>> One of my social media posts was deleted for being abusive,
>>>>> and my account suspended. The account was restored after I
>>>>> promised not to do that again.
>>>>>
>>>>> I live in a country that is scientifically illiterate. I'll
>>>>> certainly grant anyone that claim!
>>>> Not just illiterate: proud of it.
>>>
>>> I'm not proud of it.
>> You're proud of the "freedom" that led to
>>>
>>> You could have infected someone before you had the test.
>> Except I was careful to wear a mask all the times that I was
>> anywhere but with my immediate family.
>
> Your own family is not a concern? You might have infected someone, I
> repeat. Masks are not a panacea either.
>

On 2021-07-03 1:24 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 4:15:24 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
>> On 2021-07-03 1:02 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
>>> On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 3:37:09 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
>>>> On 2021-07-03 11:52 a.m., Thomas E. wrote:
>>>>> On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 11:55:53 AM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
>>>>>> On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 8:28:48 AM UTC-4, Thomas E. wrote:
>>>>>>> On Wednesday, June 23, 2021 at 2:43:32 PM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>>> The Biden administration has done nothing different to stop the
>>>>>>> spread was my comment.
>>>>>> Well, if that’s actually what you meant to say, then it’s a non
>>>>>> sequitur, because restrictions and vaccination uptake are what
>>>>>> affects spread and both are implemented State by State.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Which is also why CoVid rates are increasing in the Midwest now
>>>>>> too: a lack of controls to limit R0, along with a population who
>>>>>> doesn’t want to take the vaccine.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -hh
>>>>>
>>>>> Which Midwest states are you talking about? Missouri is the only one
>>>>> I can find with any sign of an increase. Biden could have encourage
>>>>> states to keep restrictions, he has done nothing. He could have taken
>>>>> a stronger position on vaccination. In fact, some months back, he
>>>>> stated that "There is nothing we can do to change the pandemic
>>>>> trajectory...". And, that's what his administration has done,
>>>>> nothing. Promise fulfilled.
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/22/biden-says-nothing-can-change-the-trajectory-of-covid-pandemic-over-the-next-several-months.html
>>>>>
>>>> How about Indiana?
>>>> 'Federal guidelines advise that states wait until they experience a
>>>> downward trajectory of documented cases within a 14-day period before
>>>> proceeding to a phased opening. In the state-specific view of the graph,
>>>> this two-week period is highlighted in orange if cases are trending
>>>> upward, or green if they are trending down.'
>>>>
>>>> <https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/new-cases-50-states/indiana>
>>>> Tell us, Liarboy:
>>>>
>>>> What colour is the current two-week period?
>>>>
>>>> Wait.. ...don't tell me:
>>>>
>>>> It's a data anomaly and you understand better than Johns Hopkins University.
>>>>
>>>> :-)
>>>
>>> Why not look at primary data? https://www.coronavirus.in.gov/2393.htm
>>>
>>> Looks a bit different from the secondary source you cited.
>>>
>> So you do think you understand better than Johns Hopkins University, is
>> that right?
>
> No, I think Indiana reports very different numbers from what John Hopkins reports FOR Indiana
>
> Here is the trailing 7 Day MA from both sources:
>
> Date JH Indiana
> 2021-06-25 Missing 200
> 2021-06-26 243 200
> 2021-06-27 259 198
> 2021-06-28 275 198
> 2021-06-29 289 210
> 2021-06-30 338 214
> 2021-07-01 405 221
>
> Last 7 days as reported by Indiana
>
> 248
> 131
> 136
> 180
> 288
> 259
> 302
>
> How do you get a 405 average out of those numbers?
>

And you can't think of any reason your own government might downplay the
figures...

'All data displayed is preliminary and subject to change as more
information is reported to ISDH. Tests are displayed by the date the
test was performed and deaths are displayed by the date the death occurred.

Expect historical data to change as data is reported to ISDH.'

On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 4:54:02 PM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
> On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 2:52:29 PM UTC-4, Thomas E. wrote:
> > On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 11:55:53 AM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
> > > ...
> > > Which is also why CoVid rates are increasing in the Midwest now too: a lack of controls
> > > to limit R0, along with a population who doesn’t want to take the vaccine.
> >
> > Which Midwest states are you talking about? Missouri is the only one I can find with any sign of an increase.
> At the time, there were IIRC five States with increasing case countsincreasing. Now there's 24 States
> who have reported increases of +10% or more over the past fourteen days:
>
> <https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/us/covid-cases.html>
> > Biden could have encourage states to keep restrictions, he has done nothing. He could have taken a
> > stronger position on vaccination. In fact, some months back, he stated that "There is nothing we can
> > do to change the pandemic trajectory...". And, that's what his administration has done, nothing. Promise fulfilled.
> >
> > https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/22/biden-says-nothing-can-change-the-trajectory-of-covid-pandemic-over-the-next-several-months.html
> But of course you cherrypick a statement made 48 hours after inauguration....plus you're forgetting that Trump
> absolutely refused to cooperate with the transition, which set them back ~3 months.
>
>
> -hh
More

https://48hills.org/2021/06/why-has-biden-issued-no-covid-standards-for-workplaces/

“[I]t has become increasingly clear that the federal pandemic response framework developed under the Trump administration – where rules and regulations are left up to the states, and the White House bets everything on vaccines – has not fundamentally changed.”

"The fact is that Biden, now that he is President, has just as much reason as Trump did to foster the impression that COVID infections and deaths are lower than they actually are."

"According to social epidemiologist Justen Feldman, a social epidemiologiest at Harvard’s François-Xavier Bagnoud Center for Health and Human Rights:

“The Biden administration has failed frontline workers. Its policies have likely contributed to tens of thousands of deaths, largely among lower-income people of color. He can, and should, still act because COVID-19 is not going away, it’s likely to reemerge at higher levels this coming winter.”

On Sunday, July 4, 2021 at 5:26:05 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> On 2021-07-04 2:04 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> > On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 4:54:02 PM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
> >> On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 2:52:29 PM UTC-4, Thomas E. wrote:
> >>> On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 11:55:53 AM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
> >>>> ...
> >>>> Which is also why CoVid rates are increasing in the Midwest now too: a lack of controls
> >>>> to limit R0, along with a population who doesn’t want to take the vaccine.
> >>>
> >>> Which Midwest states are you talking about? Missouri is the only one I can find with any sign of an increase.
> >> At the time, there were IIRC five States with increasing case countsincreasing. Now there's 24 States
> >> who have reported increases of +10% or more over the past fourteen days:
> >>
> >> <https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/us/covid-cases.html>
> >>> Biden could have encourage states to keep restrictions, he has done nothing. He could have taken a
> >>> stronger position on vaccination. In fact, some months back, he stated that "There is nothing we can
> >>> do to change the pandemic trajectory...". And, that's what his administration has done, nothing. Promise fulfilled.
> >>>
> >>> https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/22/biden-says-nothing-can-change-the-trajectory-of-covid-pandemic-over-the-next-several-months.html
> >> But of course you cherrypick a statement made 48 hours after inauguration...plus you're forgetting that Trump
> >> absolutely refused to cooperate with the transition, which set them back ~3 months.
> >>
> >>
> >> -hh
> >
> > I do not have a NY Times subscription, and that article is behind the paywall. I found this instead. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/tracking-coronavirus-case-surges-states-across-country-winter-n1247103
> > There are states with upticks. Will that turn into a surge? Will it increase immunity? Maybe and yes.
> And you're not bright enough to avoid a paywall to read a single article....
>
> ...and the NY Times allows you view any of their pages on COVID-19
> without restriction if you simply sign up for a free account.
>
> Seems like you're looking for excuses.
>
> But to make it clear, the NY Times site shows Indiana's cases are
> rising, just as Johns Hopkins University's site shows. Up 8% over the
> last 14 days.
>
> <https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/us/indiana-covid-cases.html>
>
> It's even up 8% in your county, Liarboy:
>
> <https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/us/hamilton-indiana-covid-cases..html>
>
> And it shows a clear point in early June where a strong downward trend
> basically stopped...
>
> ...just a little more than 30 days after Memorial Day.
> >
> > Cherry-picked Biden? Name one thing that the administration has done other than an initial distribution tweak? Strongly encouraged vaccination? No.. Requested prolonged mask use and discouraged large gatherings? No.
> Cherry picked an article from 48 hours after the inauguration.

Alan, just download the raw data from the primary source and stop quoting others: https://hub.mph.in.gov/dataset/ab9d97ab-84e3-4c19-97f8-af045ee51882/resource/182b6742-edac-442d-8eeb-62f96b17773e/download/covid_report_date.xlsx

Date Training 7 Day MA New Cases
2021-05-30 472
2021-05-31 450
2021-06-01 400
2021-06-02 474
2021-06-03 451
2021-06-04 441
2021-06-05 428
2021-06-06 444
2021-06-07 434
2021-06-08 438
2021-06-09 323
2021-06-10 309
2021-06-11 303
2021-06-12 299
2021-06-13 280
2021-06-14 271
2021-06-15 258
2021-06-16 239
2021-06-17 225
2021-06-18 256
2021-06-19 242
2021-06-20 243
2021-06-21 236
2021-06-22 236
2021-06-23 236
2021-06-24 242
2021-06-25 200
2021-06-26 200
2021-06-27 198
2021-06-28 198
2021-06-29 210
2021-06-30 214
2021-07-01 221

CDC is reporting 407 new cases for 2 July, but INDH has not officially released a number. Just a week ago they stopped updating on Saturday and Sunday, so 1 July is the latest number on their site. Let's wait until Tuesday, the next reporting date due to the holiday, and see if that's an outlier from some previously unreported cases.

Now, where is the surge in the official data above through 1 July? If you cherry pick 1 July and 28 June it's a 5.5% increase. Otherwise 221 for the latest 7 day MA is one of the lowest since Memorial Day. In fact, it's less than half the week before Memorial Day that ended 30 May with a 472 average.. If anything, maybe the 500 race reduced new cases. Probably had no effect..

I remembered recently that lawyers do not call people liars. The polite adjective in unreliable. So, Unreliableboy, let's wait for more information instead of jumping to conclusions.

On 2021-07-04 2:55 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> On Sunday, July 4, 2021 at 5:26:05 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
>> On 2021-07-04 2:04 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
>>> On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 4:54:02 PM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
>>>> On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 2:52:29 PM UTC-4, Thomas E.
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 11:55:53 AM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
>>>>>> ... Which is also why CoVid rates are increasing in the
>>>>>> Midwest now too: a lack of controls to limit R0, along with
>>>>>> a population who doesn’t want to take the vaccine.
>>>>>
>>>>> Which Midwest states are you talking about? Missouri is the
>>>>> only one I can find with any sign of an increase.
>>>> At the time, there were IIRC five States with increasing case
>>>> countsincreasing. Now there's 24 States who have reported
>>>> increases of +10% or more over the past fourteen days:
>>>>
>>>> <https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/us/covid-cases.html>
>>>>> Biden could have encourage states to keep restrictions, he
>>>>> has done nothing. He could have taken a stronger position on
>>>>> vaccination. In fact, some months back, he stated that "There
>>>>> is nothing we can do to change the pandemic trajectory...".
>>>>> And, that's what his administration has done, nothing.
>>>>> Promise fulfilled.
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/22/biden-says-nothing-can-change-the-trajectory-of-covid-pandemic-over-the-next-several-months.html
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> But of course you cherrypick a statement made 48 hours after
>>>> inauguration...plus you're forgetting that Trump
>>>> absolutely refused to cooperate with the transition, which set
>>>> them back ~3 months.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -hh
>>>
>>> I do not have a NY Times subscription, and that article is behind
>>> the paywall. I found this instead.
>>> https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/tracking-coronavirus-case-surges-states-across-country-winter-n1247103
>>>
>>>
>>> There are states with upticks. Will that turn into a surge? Will it
>>> increase immunity? Maybe and yes.
>> And you're not bright enough to avoid a paywall to read a single
>> article...
>>
>> ...and the NY Times allows you view any of their pages on COVID-19
>> without restriction if you simply sign up for a free account.
>>
>> Seems like you're looking for excuses.
>>
>> But to make it clear, the NY Times site shows Indiana's cases are
>> rising, just as Johns Hopkins University's site shows. Up 8% over
>> the last 14 days.
>>
>> <https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/us/indiana-covid-cases.html>
>>
>>
>>
>> It's even up 8% in your county, Liarboy:
>>
>> <https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/us/hamilton-indiana-covid-cases.html>
>>
>>
>>
>> And it shows a clear point in early June where a strong downward
>> trend basically stopped...
>>
>> ...just a little more than 30 days after Memorial Day.
>>>
>>> Cherry-picked Biden? Name one thing that the administration has
>>> done other than an initial distribution tweak? Strongly
>>> encouraged vaccination? No. Requested prolonged mask use and
>>> discouraged large gatherings? No.
>> Cherry picked an article from 48 hours after the inauguration.
>
> Alan, just download the raw data from the primary source and stop
> quoting others:
> https://hub.mph.in.gov/dataset/ab9d97ab-84e3-4c19-97f8-af045ee51882/resource/182b6742-edac-442d-8eeb-62f96b17773e/download/covid_report_date.xlsx

And why do you imagine that this data is more accurate than Johns
Hopkins's data?

What is your source for this faith?

<snip>

>
> CDC is reporting 407 new cases for 2 July, but INDH has not
> officially released a number. Just a week ago they stopped updating
> on Saturday and Sunday, so 1 July is the latest number on their site.
> Let's wait until Tuesday, the next reporting date due to the holiday,
> and see if that's an outlier from some previously unreported cases.
>
> Now, where is the surge in the official data above through 1 July? If
> you cherry pick 1 July and 28 June it's a 5.5% increase. Otherwise
> 221 for the latest 7 day MA is one of the lowest since Memorial Day.
> In fact, it's less than half the week before Memorial Day that ended
> 30 May with a 472 average. If anything, maybe the 500 race reduced
> new cases. Probably had no effect.
>
> I remembered recently that lawyers do not call people liars. The
> polite adjective in unreliable. So, Unreliableboy, let's wait for
> more information instead of jumping to conclusions.
>

Suddenly, it's "let's wait"...

On Sunday, July 4, 2021 at 5:31:21 PM UTC-4, Thomas E. wrote:
> More
>
> https://48hills.org/2021/06/why-has-biden-issued-no-covid-standards-for-workplaces/

Which states:
“ On January 21, Biden ordered the Occupational Safety and Health Administration
to create emergency COVID safety standards for workplaces by mid-March.”

So they’re running behind schedule … but they did start, whereas Trump:

> “[I]t has become increasingly clear that the federal pandemic response
> framework developed under the Trump administration – where rules
> and regulations are left up to the states,…”

Did not even try to lead…yet you give him a buy.

Fuck Trump to hell.

-hh

On Sunday, July 4, 2021 at 7:10:10 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> On 2021-07-04 2:55 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> > On Sunday, July 4, 2021 at 5:26:05 PM UTC-4, Alan Baker wrote:
> >> On 2021-07-04 2:04 p.m., Thomas E. wrote:
> >>> On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 4:54:02 PM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
> >>>> On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 2:52:29 PM UTC-4, Thomas E.
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>>> On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 11:55:53 AM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
> >>>>>> ... Which is also why CoVid rates are increasing in the
> >>>>>> Midwest now too: a lack of controls to limit R0, along with
> >>>>>> a population who doesn’t want to take the vaccine.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Which Midwest states are you talking about? Missouri is the
> >>>>> only one I can find with any sign of an increase.
> >>>> At the time, there were IIRC five States with increasing case
> >>>> countsincreasing. Now there's 24 States who have reported
> >>>> increases of +10% or more over the past fourteen days:
> >>>>
> >>>> <https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/us/covid-cases.html>
> >>>>> Biden could have encourage states to keep restrictions, he
> >>>>> has done nothing. He could have taken a stronger position on
> >>>>> vaccination. In fact, some months back, he stated that "There
> >>>>> is nothing we can do to change the pandemic trajectory...".
> >>>>> And, that's what his administration has done, nothing.
> >>>>> Promise fulfilled.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/22/biden-says-nothing-can-change-the-trajectory-of-covid-pandemic-over-the-next-several-months.html
> >>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>> But of course you cherrypick a statement made 48 hours after
> >>>> inauguration...plus you're forgetting that Trump
> >>>> absolutely refused to cooperate with the transition, which set
> >>>> them back ~3 months.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> -hh
> >>>
> >>> I do not have a NY Times subscription, and that article is behind
> >>> the paywall. I found this instead.
> >>> https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/tracking-coronavirus-case-surges-states-across-country-winter-n1247103
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> There are states with upticks. Will that turn into a surge? Will it
> >>> increase immunity? Maybe and yes.
> >> And you're not bright enough to avoid a paywall to read a single
> >> article...
> >>
> >> ...and the NY Times allows you view any of their pages on COVID-19
> >> without restriction if you simply sign up for a free account.
> >>
> >> Seems like you're looking for excuses.
> >>
> >> But to make it clear, the NY Times site shows Indiana's cases are
> >> rising, just as Johns Hopkins University's site shows. Up 8% over
> >> the last 14 days.
> >>
> >> <https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/us/indiana-covid-cases.html>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> It's even up 8% in your county, Liarboy:
> >>
> >> <https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/us/hamilton-indiana-covid-cases.html>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> And it shows a clear point in early June where a strong downward
> >> trend basically stopped...
> >>
> >> ...just a little more than 30 days after Memorial Day.
> >>>
> >>> Cherry-picked Biden? Name one thing that the administration has
> >>> done other than an initial distribution tweak? Strongly
> >>> encouraged vaccination? No. Requested prolonged mask use and
> >>> discouraged large gatherings? No.
> >> Cherry picked an article from 48 hours after the inauguration.
> >
> > Alan, just download the raw data from the primary source and stop
> > quoting others:
> > https://hub.mph.in.gov/dataset/ab9d97ab-84e3-4c19-97f8-af045ee51882/resource/182b6742-edac-442d-8eeb-62f96b17773e/download/covid_report_date.xlsx
> And why do you imagine that this data is more accurate than Johns
> Hopkins's data?
>
> What is your source for this faith?
>
> <snip>
> >
> > CDC is reporting 407 new cases for 2 July, but INDH has not
> > officially released a number. Just a week ago they stopped updating
> > on Saturday and Sunday, so 1 July is the latest number on their site.
> > Let's wait until Tuesday, the next reporting date due to the holiday,
> > and see if that's an outlier from some previously unreported cases.
> >
> > Now, where is the surge in the official data above through 1 July? If
> > you cherry pick 1 July and 28 June it's a 5.5% increase. Otherwise
> > 221 for the latest 7 day MA is one of the lowest since Memorial Day.
> > In fact, it's less than half the week before Memorial Day that ended
> > 30 May with a 472 average. If anything, maybe the 500 race reduced
> > new cases. Probably had no effect.
> >
> > I remembered recently that lawyers do not call people liars. The
> > polite adjective in unreliable. So, Unreliableboy, let's wait for
> > more information instead of jumping to conclusions.
> >
> Suddenly, it's "let's wait"...

Quote from the state DOH COVID site: "In observance of the Fourth of July, the dashboard will not update on Monday, 7/5. Normal updates will resume on Tuesday, 7/6."

Because, Unreliableboy, it is INDOH that collects and reports the actual data from testing sites. They report it to CDC. JH has no independent source.

Here is the actual CDC requirement: https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/lab/reporting-lab-data.html

<quote>

Submit laboratory testing data directly to state or local public health departments according to state/or local law or policy. Data must be sent using existing reporting channels to ensure rapid initiation of case investigations, and concurrent reporting of results must be shared with the ordering provider or patient, as applicable.

Submit laboratory testing data to state and local public health departments through a centralized platform, where the data will then be routed to the appropriate state and local authorities and routed to CDC after removal of personally identifiable information according to applicable rules and regulations.

Submit laboratory testing data through a state or regional Health Information Exchange (HIE) to the appropriate state or local public health department and then to CDC as directed by the state.

CMS-certified long-term care facilities may submit point-of-care SARS-CoV-2 testing data, including antigen testing data, to CDC’s National Healthcare Safety Network (NHSN). This CDC- and CMS-preferred pathway to submit data to CDC’s NHSN applies only to CMS-certified long-term care facilities. Test data submitted to NHSN will be reported to appropriate state and local health departments using standard electronic laboratory messages. Other types of LTC facilities may also report testing data in NHSN for self-tracking or to fulfill state or local reporting requirements, if any.​

Public health departments will submit de-identified data to CDC on a daily basis, using either Health Level 7 (HL7) messaging or the National ELR Flat File and HL7 Generator tool.

<end quote>

Note that there is no mention of testing site reporting to Johns Hopkins. Even CDC is a secondary source.

The latest data for Hamilton County weekly (updated on Wednesdays) positive rate is 2.03% and declining. See the County Distributions map at: https://www.coronavirus.in.gov/2393.htm

Are you ever going to do a nanosecond of research before spouting off?

More tomorrow.

BTW, the Symphony on the Prairie concert last night was amazing. Pretty much a full crowd. The city fireworks tonight are about a mile away, one of three sites. Huge crowds will be there too. Have fun doing whatever you do to entertain yourself. I can post videos I took of last night's Stars Spangled Banner and fireworks if it will help you pass the time until BC fully opens up.

The Carmel celebration details are here: https://www.carmelfest.net/

Anyone who attends knows the risks. If not vaccinated it's their decision. I tried to help a few people on NextDoor see the light and got a slap on the hand for my efforts. So be it.

On Sunday, July 4, 2021 at 8:21:41 PM UTC-4, -hh wrote:
> On Sunday, July 4, 2021 at 5:31:21 PM UTC-4, Thomas E. wrote:
> > More
> >
> > https://48hills.org/2021/06/why-has-biden-issued-no-covid-standards-for-workplaces/
>
> Which states:
> “ On January 21, Biden ordered the Occupational Safety and Health Administration
> to create emergency COVID safety standards for workplaces by mid-March.”
>
> So they’re running behind schedule … but they did start, whereas Trump:
> > “[I]t has become increasingly clear that the federal pandemic response
> > framework developed under the Trump administration – where rules
> > and regulations are left up to the states,…”
>
> Did not even try to lead…yet you give him a buy.
>
> Fuck Trump to hell.
>
> -hh

6 months later is "behind schedule"? By the time it's done we may be in a different pandemic!

Fuck Sleepy Joe! All he is concerned about is his so-called infrastructure plan and his political legacy. Fuck Trump too. I voted against Biden, not for Trump.