On 2022-01-28 5:25 p.m., build wrote:
> On Saturday, January 29, 2022 at 3:48:48 AM UTC+11, Mark Jackson wrote:
>> On 1/28/2022 3:12 AM, build wrote:
>>> These tyres are nothing more than a fashion statement.
>> As I've been pointing out that's not the reason for the change.
>>> Any physicist or engineer will tell you the same.
>> Did I mention my three degrees in physics, or my 30 years in industrial
>> physics and systems engineering?
>> --
>> Mark Jackson - https://mark-jackson.online/
>> As for behavior, I have shocking news:
>> Physicists can be arrogant. - Mike Tamor
>
> Then you *should* be able to work it out. It's not difficult.

It's really not difficult to notice that no high performance cars...

Race or road.

....use 13" wheels.

On 2022-01-28 5:26 p.m., build wrote:
> On Saturday, January 29, 2022 at 6:22:25 AM UTC+11, Alan wrote:
>> On 2022-01-28 8:48 a.m., Mark Jackson wrote:
>>> On 1/28/2022 3:12 AM, build wrote:
>>>> These tyres are nothing more than a fashion statement.
>>>
>>> As I've been pointing out that's not the reason for the change.
>>>
>>>> Any physicist or engineer will tell you the same.
>>>
>>> Did I mention my three degrees in physics, or my 30 years in industrial
>>> physics and systems engineering?
>>>
>> I find it hilarious that people believe that 13" is some magic number
>> with respect to wheel diameter.
>>
>> I challenge anyone to show a road racing class that uses 13" rims that
>> isn't doing so because it's a rule.
>
> Who said 13" was a *magic number* ?
> I can only see you saying that.

You're implying it.

Let me ask you:

Would 14" rims work better or worse than the 13" rims for F1?

How about 15"?

16?

17?

18?

On Friday, January 28, 2022 at 6:51:56 PM UTC-7, Alan wrote:

> You're implying it.
>
> Let me ask you:
>
> Would 14" rims work better or worse than the 13" rims for F1?
>
> How about 15"?
>
> 16?
>
> 17?
>
> 18?

deflect. rinse. repeat

On 2022-01-28 6:05 p.m., texas gate wrote:
> On Friday, January 28, 2022 at 6:51:56 PM UTC-7, Alan wrote:
>
>> You're implying it.
>>
>> Let me ask you:
>>
>> Would 14" rims work better or worse than the 13" rims for F1?
>>
>> How about 15"?
>>
>> 16?
>>
>> 17?
>>
>> 18?
>
> deflect. rinse. repeat

You're very dim, and I should ignore you, but just this once:

There are only 3 possibilities:

1. 13" is the perfect size.

2. The perfect size is larger.

3. The perfect size is smaller.

Alan <nope@nope.com> writes:

> On 2022-01-27 7:02 a.m., rtr wrote:
>> build <buildy@gmail.com> writes:
>>
>>> It's getting ridiculous when the cars are put on slower low
>>> profile tyres simply to go with a ridiculous fashion.
>>> As some of you know the Porsche's went from a proper race
>>> tyre to a low-profile some years ago. At Philip Island we
>>> lost 3 seconds a lap.
>>> I know with the aero changes the cars were supposed to be
>>> faster but the loss from the tyres will be difficult to gain
>>> back.
>>>
>>> Testing will be very interesting.
>>>
>>> build
>> As far as I know, one of the main reasons why they're
>> switching to 18-inch wheels is so that it's easier for the
>> viewers to associate the pirellis to actual road tyres.
>>
>
> Not quite.
>
> Consumer fashion follows what works in racing and high performance cars...
>
> ...but then exaggerates.
>
> So consumers saw the cambers being run on racing cars...
>
> ...and now we have "stanced" cars with ridiculous negative camber.
>
> That the enthusiasts have overdone it doesn't mean that the negative
> camber you see on (say) an Indycar doesn't work.
>
> It's the same with low profile tires.
>
> Getting the best grip out of a tire is a battle between two factors
> that are in opposition to each other with respect to inflation
> pressure.
>
> The nature of rubber/pavement friction is such that lower pressures
> mean more grip due to a larger, lower pressure contact patch.
>
> But lower pressures mean less overall stiffness of the tire carcass...
>
> ...which leads to the more distortion of the contact patch...
>
> ...which means a smaller contact patch...
>
> ...and less grip.
>
> One of the ways to change the balance is to make the carcass stiffer.
>
> Which you can do by making the sidewalls shorter... ...and (to keep
> the overall diameter the same) the wheel bigger.
>
>
> Can you overdo it? Of course.
>
> But they idea that 13" is some sort of automatic "ideal"...
>
> ...no.
>

Oh wow. I've never thought of it that way. But that makes sense.

--
Give them an inch and they will take a mile.
--
gemini://rtr.kalayaan.xyz

Alan <nope@nope.com> writes:

> On 2022-01-27 2:23 p.m., geoff wrote:
>> On 28/01/2022 4:02 am, rtr wrote:
>>> build <buildy@gmail.com> writes:
>>>
>>>> It's getting ridiculous when the cars are put on slower low
>>>> profile tyres simply to go with a ridiculous fashion.
>>>> As some of you know the Porsche's went from a proper race
>>>> tyre to a low-profile some years ago. At Philip Island we
>>>> lost 3 seconds a lap.
>>>> I know with the aero changes the cars were supposed to be
>>>> faster but the loss from the tyres will be difficult to gain
>>>> back.
>>>>
>>>> Testing will be very interesting.
>>>>
>>>> build
>>>
>>> As far as I know, one of the main reasons why they're
>>> switching to 18-inch wheels is so that it's easier for the
>>> viewers to associate the pirellis to actual road tyres.
>>>
>> I thought is was to enable decent sized tyres to fit on the wheels,
>> the tyres now having a reduced-height sidewall (ie lower profile) to
>> address lateral flexing issues.
>
> I think Pirelli wanted this for a couple of reasons:
>
> Yes. It now matches more with what their customers think of as a high
> performance tire.
>
> But also, all the other high-end series that Pirelli makes tires for...
>
> ...they use tires that are much more like what F1's new tires are
> going to be. So there's more commonality in the design problem.
>

So they're trying to hit two birds with one stone?

--
Give them an inch and they will take a mile.
--
gemini://rtr.kalayaan.xyz

On 2022-01-28 4:11 p.m., rtr wrote:
> Alan <nope@nope.com> writes:
>
>> On 2022-01-27 2:23 p.m., geoff wrote:
>>> On 28/01/2022 4:02 am, rtr wrote:
>>>> build <buildy@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>
>>>>> It's getting ridiculous when the cars are put on slower low
>>>>> profile tyres simply to go with a ridiculous fashion.
>>>>> As some of you know the Porsche's went from a proper race
>>>>> tyre to a low-profile some years ago. At Philip Island we
>>>>> lost 3 seconds a lap.
>>>>> I know with the aero changes the cars were supposed to be
>>>>> faster but the loss from the tyres will be difficult to gain
>>>>> back.
>>>>>
>>>>> Testing will be very interesting.
>>>>>
>>>>> build
>>>>
>>>> As far as I know, one of the main reasons why they're
>>>> switching to 18-inch wheels is so that it's easier for the
>>>> viewers to associate the pirellis to actual road tyres.
>>>>
>>> I thought is was to enable decent sized tyres to fit on the wheels,
>>> the tyres now having a reduced-height sidewall (ie lower profile) to
>>> address lateral flexing issues.
>>
>> I think Pirelli wanted this for a couple of reasons:
>>
>> Yes. It now matches more with what their customers think of as a high
>> performance tire.
>>
>> But also, all the other high-end series that Pirelli makes tires for...
>>
>> ...they use tires that are much more like what F1's new tires are
>> going to be. So there's more commonality in the design problem.
>>
>
> So they're trying to hit two birds with one stone?
>

Pirelli is a business and so anything that enhances their brand is going
to be important to them.

But the simple fact is that high performance cars aren't using low
profile tires because they look cooler.

A Ferrari 308 started out with 205/70R14 tires.

Then it got 220/55R390 tires (390mm is 15.375")

The 328 that replaced it was close to the same...

....but the 348 that replaced that had 215/50R17 tires in front, and
255/45R17 rears.

The F355 that replaced that had wider, lower profile tires still, and
the trend has continued.

And believe me:

Ferrari doesn't do that for style.

The Ferrari 488 can circulate the skidpad at about 1.02g...

....the 308: 0.81g

Now some of that is down to the choice of tire compound, I'm sure.

But not all.

Alan wrote:

> On 2022-01-23 5:24 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
> > build wrote:
> >
> > > It's getting ridiculous when the cars are put on slower low
> > > profile tyres simply to go with a ridiculous fashion.
> >
> > AIUI the new tyres are not even "low profile".
> >
> > Unless I have figured it wrongly the rear tyre is a 405/65 R18 (like
> > many higher profile road cars) and the front a higher AR at 305/86
> > R18 (very much higher profile than most road cars.
> >
> > I stand to be corrected.
> >
> >
> >
>
> You have figured it VERY wrongly.

Then correct me.

--
Bozo bin
Felicity
George R
Irving S
Texasgate
Enjoy!

Alan wrote:

> On 2022-01-28 1:51 p.m., Bigbird wrote:
> > Alan wrote:
> >
> > > On 2022-01-28 1:32 p.m., Bigbird wrote:
> > > > Alan wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > On 2022-01-28 1:10 p.m., Bigbird wrote:
> > > > > > Alan wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > On 2022-01-28 11:41 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
> > > > > > > > Alan wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > On 2022-01-28 8:48 a.m., Mark Jackson wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > On 1/28/2022 3:12 AM, build wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > These tyres are nothing more than a fashion
> > > > > > > > > > > statement.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > As I've been pointing out that's not the reason for
> > > > > > > > > > the change.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Any physicist or engineer will tell you the same.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Did I mention my three degrees in physics, or my 30
> > > > > > > > > > years in industrial physics and systems
> > > > > > > > > > engineering?
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I find it hilarious that people believe that 13" is
> > > > > > > > > some magic number with respect to wheel diameter.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I challenge anyone to show a road racing class that
> > > > > > > > > uses 13" rims that isn't doing so because it's a rule.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Well there's the rub.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Which road racing classes do not specify tyres?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > There are lots of classes that don't specify tires.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Lots have moved to a spec tire
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Quite.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > in an effort to control COST, but the
> > > > > > > size of the wheels and tires that are used hasn't changed
> > > > > > > from when it was a free choice.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So, give some examples.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > All the top LeMans classes specify a MAXIMUM wheel
> > > > > > > diameter of 18"...
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > >
> >
<https://assets.lemans.org/explorer/pdf/courses/2018/24-heures-du-mans/regulations/2018-technical-regulations-lm-p1-hybrid.pdf>
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > >
> >
<https://assets.lemans.org/explorer/pdf/courses/2018/24-heures-du-mans/regulations/2018-technical-regulations-lm-p1-non-hybrid.pdf>
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > >
> >
<https://assets.lemans.org/explorer/pdf/courses/2018/24-heures-du-mans/regulations/2018-technical-regulations-lm-p2-homologated-in-2017.pdf>
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > And the tires aren't specified.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So, what do they use?
> > > > >
> > > > > I don't know.
> > > > >
> > > > > The point is that they're not specced to any particular tire.
> > > >
> > > > ...and you don't know who specified 18" or why? It's not as if
> > > > they are an off the shelf product. Someone has to make them.
> > >
> > > How does that effect anything?
> > >
> >
> > If they tyre is not available they can't use it, can they.
>
> The tire manufacturers will build whatever you'll pay for.
>

Have you any idea the cost of optimising a race specification tyre.

> >
> > > The size is specced to a MAXIMUM, so anyone who wanted to use a
> > > smaller size would be free to do so...
> > >
> > > ...but no one does.
> >
> > Say a team wanted to use a smaller tyre where would they get them?
> >
> > Who actually specifies the tyre?
>
> The designer.
>
> Why are you arguing this, fuckwit?

Well, for one because you clearly are incapable of grasping the
simplest point... which kind of makes you the fuckwit.

>
> The fact of the matter is that racing tires have migrated from
> narrow, high aspect ratio, to wide and very low aspect ratio.
>

No, they haven't.

> F1 only kept using 13" wheels because the rules prevented them from
> going bigger.

....and water is wet. We know that.

It also had more to do with brake size than any of the factors
mentioned to date.

--
Bozo bin
Felicity
George R
Irving S
Texasgate
Enjoy!

Alan wrote:

> On 2022-01-28 6:05 p.m., texas gate wrote:
> > On Friday, January 28, 2022 at 6:51:56 PM UTC-7, Alan wrote:
> >
> > > You're implying it.
> > >
> > > Let me ask you:
> > >
> > > Would 14" rims work better or worse than the 13" rims for F1?
> > >
> > > How about 15"?
> > >
> > > 16?
> > >
> > > 17?
> > >
> > > 18?
> >
> > deflect. rinse. repeat
>
> You're very dim, and I should ignore you, but just this once:
>
> There are only 3 possibilities:
>
> 1. 13" is the perfect size.
>
> 2. The perfect size is larger.
>
> 3. The perfect size is smaller.

4. There is no "perfect" size.

Like many things it is a compromise.
There are arguments for larger rims e.g. brake size
There are arguments for smaller sidewalls e.g. stability
There are arguments for the larger sidewalls as argued above.

--
Bozo bin
Felicity
George R
Irving S
Texasgate
Enjoy!

Alan wrote:

> On 2022-01-28 1:49 p.m., Bigbird wrote:
> > Alan wrote:
> >
> > > On 2022-01-28 1:18 p.m., Bigbird wrote:
> > > > Alan wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > On 2022-01-28 11:40 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
> > > > > > Alan wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > On 2022-01-28 2:13 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
> > > > > > > > Alan wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > On 2022-01-27 2:23 p.m., geoff wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > On 28/01/2022 4:02 am, rtr wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>build <buildy@gmail.com> writes:
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > It's getting ridiculous when the cars are put on
> > > > > > > > > > > > slower low profile tyres simply to go with a
> > > > > > > > > > > > ridiculous fashion. As some of you know the
> > > > > > > > > > > > Porsche's went from a proper race tyre to a
> > > > > > > > > > > > low-profile some years ago. At Philip Island we
> > > > > > > > > > > > lost 3 seconds a lap. I know with the aero
> > > > > > > > > > > > changes the cars were supposed to be faster but
> > > > > > > > > > > > the loss from the tyres will be difficult to
> > > > > > > > > > > > gain back.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Testing will be very interesting.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > build
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > As far as I know, one of the main reasons why
> > > > > > > > > > > they're switching to 18-inch wheels is so that
> > > > > > > > > > > it's easier for the viewers to associate the
> > > > > > > > > > > pirellis to actual road tyres.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > I thought is was to enable decent sized tyres to
> > > > > > > > > > fit on the wheels, the tyres now having a
> > > > > > > > > > reduced-height sidewall (ie lower profile) to
> > > > > > > > > > address lateral flexing issues.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I think Pirelli wanted this for a couple of reasons:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Yes. It now matches more with what their customers
> > > > > > > > > think of as a high performance tire.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > How do the profiles compare?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > What do you mean?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > You know what a tyre profile is?
> > > > >
> > > > > Yes, but you didn't say "How do the tire profiles compare?"
> > > > > now did you?
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > Lol, what is the discussion about?
> > > >
> > > > Stop being a fuckwit for two minutes.
> > > >
> > > > > > Have you never bought tyres?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Maybe it's different in Canada. Let me check. No, it's the
> > > > > > same.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Let me try again. How do the ratio's compare? is that
> > > > > > easier?
> > > > >
> > > > > You mean "aspect ratio", right?
> > > > >
> > > > > Well let's look.
> > > > >
> > > > > I'll lift this text, because I can't see any point in
> > > > > reinventing the wheel (see what I did there? 😎):
> > > > >
> > > > > 'The new tire sizes for F1 starting in 2022 are 305/720R18 and
> > > > > 405/720R18. That's the equivalent (more or less) to 305/45R18
> > > > > and 405/30R18.'
> > > > >
> > > > > And here's the first LMP1 spec I came across:
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > Not a road tyre.
> > > >
> > > > "It now matches more with what their customers think of
> >>> as a high performance tire."
> > > >
> > > > So what did you mean by that?
> > >
> > > "Stop being a fuckwit for two minutes."
> > >
> >
> > So you don't know what you meant or are unable to elaborate
> > proffering to confirm your "fuckwit" status.
> >
> > Try again. What do you mean by "what their customers think of as a
> > high performance tire." You had something in mind when you wrote
> > that but it doesn't relate well to the rest of your post, so
> > explain "what their customers think of as a high performance tire."
> >

<crickets>

> > > >
> > > > > 'Front tyres 31/71-18
> >>>> Rear tyres 31/71-18'
> > > > >
> > > > > <https://toyotagazooracing.com/wec/cars/2017/>
> > > > >
> > > > > Translated, that's 310/710R18...
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > Translated to what? garbage?
> > >
> > > Translated to values in millimetres rather than centimetres.
> > >
> > > "Stop being a fuckwit for two minutes."
> > >
> >
> > We are talking tyre profile and you have yet to provide any
> > comparison of profile.
> >
> > Who is being the fuckwit?
>
> Oh... ...you're not knowledgeable enough to realize that:
>
> 305/720R18
>
> Gives you the exact same information as:
>
> 305/43R18
>

Wrong, that something can be deduced is far from being easily
comparable.
Also if you have been paying attention to the thread in the slightest
you know you differently and are basically lying, again.

Yet you still choose not to give easily comparable profile figures.

Hiding something... like ignorance?

> That is the F1 front tire re-written as section width, aspect ratio
> and wheel diameter instead of the more common racing usage of section
> width, overall diameter and wheel diameter.
>
> The numbers for the Toyota LeMans car become
>
> 310/41R18
>
> So the two tires are very nearly the same "profile".
>
> So the fuckwit remains you.
>
>
> >
> > > >
> > > > > ...or almost the same size as the F1 front tire.
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > But also, all the other high-end series that Pirelli
> > > > > > > > > makes tires for...
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > ...they use tires that are much more like what F1's
> > > > > > > > > new tires are going to be. So there's more
> > > > > > > > > commonality in the design problem.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Give some examples.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > You're joking. Seriously?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Pirelli has said precisely this.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So you can't. Nevermind then.
> > > > >
> > > > > I can and just did.
> > > >
> > > > Nope. But go ahead.
> > >
> > > I just showed that Le Mans cars are using tires almost precisely
> > > the same size as F1's front tires.
> > >
> > > In what way is that not what you wanted?
>
> No answer.
>
> Got it.
>
> > >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > But do you deny that Pirelli said that?
> > > >
> > > > ?
> > >
> > > Do you deny that Pirelli has said that F1's new tires sizes are
> > > more relevant to the design of their other high performance tires?
> >
> > Why would I, were you lying, again?
>
> I notice that's not actually an answer.

Bigbird wrote:

> Alan wrote:
>
> > On 2022-01-28 1:18 p.m., Bigbird wrote:
> > Do you deny that Pirelli has said that F1's new tires sizes are more
> > relevant to the design of their other high performance tires?
>
> I hadn't considered that you might be fabricating but now that you
> suggest it perhaps you should provide a cite as I don't recall reading
> of them saying that.
>

"No response, I get it"

> I am pretty sure I have only read about claimed relevancy to road
> tyres.

--
Bozo bin
Felicity
George R
Irving S
Texasgate
Enjoy!

On 2022-01-30 9:01 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
> Alan wrote:
>
>> On 2022-01-23 5:24 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
>>> build wrote:
>>>
>>>> It's getting ridiculous when the cars are put on slower low
>>>> profile tyres simply to go with a ridiculous fashion.
>>>
>>> AIUI the new tyres are not even "low profile".
>>>
>>> Unless I have figured it wrongly the rear tyre is a 405/65 R18 (like
>>> many higher profile road cars) and the front a higher AR at 305/86
>>> R18 (very much higher profile than most road cars.
>>>
>>> I stand to be corrected.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> You have figured it VERY wrongly.
>
> Then correct me.
>

Sure. But if you'd actually been reading, I already did in another thread.

Road tires are designated by section width then the section height
expressed as a percentage and then finally the wheel diameter.

So BMW (for instance) has 215/40R18 front tires and 245/35R18 rear tires.

However, racing tires are often designated simply by section width,
overall diameter and wheel size.

So F1 tires are sized (in mm for width and overall diameter) as
305/720R18 front and 405/720R18

Converting from one to the other involves taking the overall diameter
(720) subtracting the wheel diameter (which you convert to millimetres,
so 457.2) then you divide by 2 before dividing by the width (305 or 405).

Where you went wrong was failing to divide by two, so you got:

(720-457.2)/305 = 0.86 (86%)
(720-457.2)/405 = 0.86 (65%)

On Saturday, January 29, 2022 at 12:51:56 PM UTC+11, Alan wrote:
> On 2022-01-28 5:26 p.m., build wrote:
> > On Saturday, January 29, 2022 at 6:22:25 AM UTC+11, Alan wrote:
> >> On 2022-01-28 8:48 a.m., Mark Jackson wrote:
> >>> On 1/28/2022 3:12 AM, build wrote:
> >>>> These tyres are nothing more than a fashion statement.
> >>>
> >>> As I've been pointing out that's not the reason for the change.
> >>>
> >>>> Any physicist or engineer will tell you the same.
> >>>
> >>> Did I mention my three degrees in physics, or my 30 years in industrial
> >>> physics and systems engineering?
> >>>
> >> I find it hilarious that people believe that 13" is some magic number
> >> with respect to wheel diameter.
> >>
> >> I challenge anyone to show a road racing class that uses 13" rims that
> >> isn't doing so because it's a rule.
> >
> > Who said 13" was a *magic number* ?
> > I can only see you saying that.

> You're implying it.

I'm not implying that and I never have.
You are either very mistaken or worse.
(Alan, you should know that I never get distracted by strawman especially very pathetic strawman yours below.)

>
> Let me ask you:
>
> Would 14" rims work better or worse than the 13" rims for F1?
>
> How about 15"?
>
> 16?
>
> 17?
>
> 18?

On Saturday, January 29, 2022 at 12:51:17 PM UTC+11, Alan wrote:
> On 2022-01-28 5:25 p.m., build wrote:
> > On Saturday, January 29, 2022 at 3:48:48 AM UTC+11, Mark Jackson wrote:
> >> On 1/28/2022 3:12 AM, build wrote:
> >>> These tyres are nothing more than a fashion statement.
> >> As I've been pointing out that's not the reason for the change.
> >>> Any physicist or engineer will tell you the same.
> >> Did I mention my three degrees in physics, or my 30 years in industrial
> >> physics and systems engineering?
> >> --
> >> Mark Jackson - https://mark-jackson.online/
> >> As for behavior, I have shocking news:
> >> Physicists can be arrogant. - Mike Tamor
> >
> > Then you *should* be able to work it out. It's not difficult.

> It's really not difficult to notice that no high performance cars...
> Race or road use 13" wheels.

Which ones are as fast as 2021 F1 cars.

On 2022-01-30 3:41 p.m., build wrote:
> On Saturday, January 29, 2022 at 12:51:17 PM UTC+11, Alan wrote:
>> On 2022-01-28 5:25 p.m., build wrote:
>>> On Saturday, January 29, 2022 at 3:48:48 AM UTC+11, Mark Jackson wrote:
>>>> On 1/28/2022 3:12 AM, build wrote:
>>>>> These tyres are nothing more than a fashion statement.
>>>> As I've been pointing out that's not the reason for the change.
>>>>> Any physicist or engineer will tell you the same.
>>>> Did I mention my three degrees in physics, or my 30 years in industrial
>>>> physics and systems engineering?
>>>> --
>>>> Mark Jackson - https://mark-jackson.online/
>>>> As for behavior, I have shocking news:
>>>> Physicists can be arrogant. - Mike Tamor
>>>
>>> Then you *should* be able to work it out. It's not difficult.
>
>> It's really not difficult to notice that no high performance cars...
>> Race or road use 13" wheels.
>
> Which ones are as fast as 2021 F1 cars.
>

Oh, please...

Make a decent argument, would you?

Are you saying that F1 cars are faster BECAUSE of 13" wheels?

On Sunday, January 30, 2022 at 10:58:24 PM UTC-7, Alan wrote:

> Are you saying that F1 cars are faster BECAUSE of 13" wheels?

Take your gay ass all caps and shove
them up your diseased worn asshole.
You queer fuck.

Alan wrote:

> On 2022-01-30 9:01 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
> > Alan wrote:
> >
> > > On 2022-01-23 5:24 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
> > > > build wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > It's getting ridiculous when the cars are put on slower low
> > > > > profile tyres simply to go with a ridiculous fashion.
> > > >
> > > > AIUI the new tyres are not even "low profile".
> > > >
> > > > Unless I have figured it wrongly the rear tyre is a 405/65 R18
> > > > (like many higher profile road cars) and the front a higher AR
> > > > at 305/86 R18 (very much higher profile than most road cars.
> > > >
> > > > I stand to be corrected.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > You have figured it VERY wrongly.
> >
> > Then correct me.
> >
>
> So F1 tires are sized (in mm for width and overall diameter) as
> 305/720R18 front and 405/720R18
>
> Converting from one to the other involves taking the overall diameter
> (720) subtracting the wheel diameter (which you convert to
> millimetres, so 457.2) then you divide by 2

I thought that was probably what I had missed.

Well caught.

If only you could manage to do it without looking a fucking ASSHOLE.

A test you have yet to pass.

:-D

--
Bozo bin
Felicity
George R
Irving S
Texasgate
Enjoy!

On 2022-01-31 4:30 p.m., Bigbird wrote:
> Alan wrote:
>
>> On 2022-01-30 9:01 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
>>> Alan wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2022-01-23 5:24 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
>>>>> build wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> It's getting ridiculous when the cars are put on slower low
>>>>>> profile tyres simply to go with a ridiculous fashion.
>>>>>
>>>>> AIUI the new tyres are not even "low profile".
>>>>>
>>>>> Unless I have figured it wrongly the rear tyre is a 405/65 R18
>>>>> (like many higher profile road cars) and the front a higher AR
>>>>> at 305/86 R18 (very much higher profile than most road cars.
>>>>>
>>>>> I stand to be corrected.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> You have figured it VERY wrongly.
>>>
>>> Then correct me.
>>>
>>
>> So F1 tires are sized (in mm for width and overall diameter) as
>> 305/720R18 front and 405/720R18
>>
>> Converting from one to the other involves taking the overall diameter
>> (720) subtracting the wheel diameter (which you convert to
>> millimetres, so 457.2) then you divide by 2
>
> I thought that was probably what I had missed.
>
> Well caught.
>
> If only you could manage to do it without looking a fucking ASSHOLE.
>
> A test you have yet to pass.

Take a look in the mirror some time.

On 1/02/2022 1:30 pm, Bigbird wrote:
> Alan wrote:
>
>> On 2022-01-30 9:01 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
>>> Alan wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2022-01-23 5:24 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
>>>>> build wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> It's getting ridiculous when the cars are put on slower low
>>>>>> profile tyres simply to go with a ridiculous fashion.
>>>>>
>>>>> AIUI the new tyres are not even "low profile".
>>>>>
>>>>> Unless I have figured it wrongly the rear tyre is a 405/65 R18
>>>>> (like many higher profile road cars) and the front a higher AR
>>>>> at 305/86 R18 (very much higher profile than most road cars.
>>>>>
>>>>> I stand to be corrected.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> You have figured it VERY wrongly.
>>>
>>> Then correct me.
>>>
>>
>> So F1 tires are sized (in mm for width and overall diameter) as
>> 305/720R18 front and 405/720R18
>>
>> Converting from one to the other involves taking the overall diameter
>> (720) subtracting the wheel diameter (which you convert to
>> millimetres, so 457.2) then you divide by 2
>
> I thought that was probably what I had missed.
>
> Well caught.
>
> If only you could manage to do it without looking a fucking ASSHOLE.
>
> A test you have yet to pass.
>
> :-D

So I make them to be roughly:

405/32R18 on the rear and 305/43R18 on the front.

I stand to be corrected (and wonder why, if they want road-relevance they don't use nomenclature
that buyers of road car tyres understand).

--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy little classification
in the DSM"
David Melville

This is not an email and hasn't been checked for viruses by any half-arsed self-promoting software.

On 1/02/2022 5:57 pm, ~misfit~ wrote:
> On 1/02/2022 1:30 pm, Bigbird wrote:
>> Alan wrote:
>>
>>> On 2022-01-30 9:01 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
>>>> Alan wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 2022-01-23 5:24 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
>>>>>> build wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It's getting ridiculous when the cars are put on slower low
>>>>>>> profile tyres simply to go with a ridiculous fashion.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> AIUI the new tyres are not even "low profile".
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Unless I have figured it wrongly the rear tyre is a 405/65 R18
>>>>>> (like many higher profile road cars) and the front a higher AR
>>>>>> at 305/86 R18 (very much higher profile than most road cars.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I stand to be corrected.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> You have figured it VERY wrongly.
>>>>
>>>> Then correct me.
>>>>
>>>
>>> So F1 tires are sized (in mm for width and overall diameter) as
>>> 305/720R18 front and 405/720R18
>>>
>>> Converting from one to the other involves taking the overall diameter
>>> (720) subtracting the wheel diameter (which you convert to
>>> millimetres, so 457.2) then you divide by 2
>>
>> I thought that was probably what I had missed.
>>
>> Well caught.
>>
>> If only you could manage to do it without looking a fucking ASSHOLE.
>>
>> A test you have yet to pass.
>>
>> :-D
>
> So I make them to be roughly:
>
> 405/32R18 on the rear and 305/43R18 on the front.
>
> I stand to be corrected (and wonder why, if they want road-relevance they don't use nomenclature
> that buyers of road car tyres understand).
>

..... and..... I just realised I could have simply halved your sidewall to width ratios Bigbird to
come up with the figures that I painstakingly calculated.
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy little classification
in the DSM"
David Melville

This is not an email and hasn't been checked for viruses by any half-arsed self-promoting software.

~misfit~ wrote:

> On 1/02/2022 1:30 pm, Bigbird wrote:
> > Alan wrote:
> >
> > > On 2022-01-30 9:01 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
> > > > Alan wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > On 2022-01-23 5:24 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
> > > > > > build wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > It's getting ridiculous when the cars are put on slower
> > > > > > > low profile tyres simply to go with a ridiculous fashion.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > AIUI the new tyres are not even "low profile".
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Unless I have figured it wrongly the rear tyre is a 405/65
> > > > > > R18 (like many higher profile road cars) and the front a
> > > > > > higher AR at 305/86 R18 (very much higher profile than most
> > > > > > road cars.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I stand to be corrected.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > You have figured it VERY wrongly.
> > > >
> > > > Then correct me.
> > > >
> > >
> > > So F1 tires are sized (in mm for width and overall diameter) as
> > > 305/720R18 front and 405/720R18
> > >
> > > Converting from one to the other involves taking the overall
> > > diameter (720) subtracting the wheel diameter (which you convert
> > > to millimetres, so 457.2) then you divide by 2
> >
> > I thought that was probably what I had missed.
> >
> > Well caught.
> >
> > If only you could manage to do it without looking a fucking ASSHOLE.
> >
> > A test you have yet to pass.
> >
> > :-D
>
> So I make them to be roughly:
>
> 405/32R18 on the rear and 305/43R18 on the front.
>
> I stand to be corrected (and wonder why, if they want road-relevance
> they don't use nomenclature that buyers of road car tyres understand).

I think the reason I didn't pick up the error is that I was expecting
relatively high numbers.

It's not until I thought about what is being calculated that I realised
that the width of the tyre on an F1 car means that for a similar
profile the sidewall is proportionally larger.

That is why these do not look like low profile road tyres but more like
the tyres on van the I use for the dogs. 215/55 R16

If you scale down 720 R18 to the vans tyre diameter you get a 16" rim
so pretty much dead on analogy.

To have a 720mm wheel that looked like a low profile road car tyre (say
a 225/45R18) you'd have to have a 19.6"rim or to look like a 225/40 R19
the rims would have to be another inch bigger than that.

So while they look more like road tyres from the side they do not
resemble "fashionable" low profile road tyres at all.

--
Bozo bin
Felicity
George R
Irving S
Texasgate
Enjoy!

On 2/1/2022 9:03 AM, Bigbird wrote:
> ~misfit~ wrote:
>
>> On 1/02/2022 1:30 pm, Bigbird wrote:
>>> Alan wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2022-01-30 9:01 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
>>>>> Alan wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 2022-01-23 5:24 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
>>>>>>> build wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It's getting ridiculous when the cars are put on slower
>>>>>>>> low profile tyres simply to go with a ridiculous fashion.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> AIUI the new tyres are not even "low profile".
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Unless I have figured it wrongly the rear tyre is a 405/65
>>>>>>> R18 (like many higher profile road cars) and the front a
>>>>>>> higher AR at 305/86 R18 (very much higher profile than most
>>>>>>> road cars.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I stand to be corrected.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You have figured it VERY wrongly.
>>>>>
>>>>> Then correct me.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> So F1 tires are sized (in mm for width and overall diameter) as
>>>> 305/720R18 front and 405/720R18
>>>>
>>>> Converting from one to the other involves taking the overall
>>>> diameter (720) subtracting the wheel diameter (which you convert
>>>> to millimetres, so 457.2) then you divide by 2
>>>
>>> I thought that was probably what I had missed.
>>>
>>> Well caught.
>>>
>>> If only you could manage to do it without looking a fucking ASSHOLE.
>>>
>>> A test you have yet to pass.
>>>
>>> :-D
>>
>> So I make them to be roughly:
>>
>> 405/32R18 on the rear and 305/43R18 on the front.
>>
>> I stand to be corrected (and wonder why, if they want road-relevance
>> they don't use nomenclature that buyers of road car tyres understand).
>
> I think the reason I didn't pick up the error is that I was expecting
> relatively high numbers.
>
> It's not until I thought about what is being calculated that I realised
> that the width of the tyre on an F1 car means that for a similar
> profile the sidewall is proportionally larger.
>
> That is why these do not look like low profile road tyres but more like
> the tyres on van the I use for the dogs. 215/55 R16
>
> If you scale down 720 R18 to the vans tyre diameter you get a 16" rim
> so pretty much dead on analogy.
>
> To have a 720mm wheel that looked like a low profile road car tyre (say
> a 225/45R18) you'd have to have a 19.6"rim or to look like a 225/40 R19
> the rims would have to be another inch bigger than that.
>
> So while they look more like road tyres from the side they do not
> resemble "fashionable" low profile road tyres at all.
>

The rare admission: didn't understand the formula.

On 2022-02-01 2:38 a.m., ~misfit~ wrote:
> On 1/02/2022 5:57 pm, ~misfit~ wrote:
>> On 1/02/2022 1:30 pm, Bigbird wrote:
>>> Alan wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2022-01-30 9:01 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
>>>>> Alan wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 2022-01-23 5:24 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
>>>>>>> build wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It's getting ridiculous when the cars are put on slower low
>>>>>>>> profile tyres simply to go with a ridiculous fashion.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> AIUI the new tyres are not even "low profile".
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Unless I have figured it wrongly the rear tyre is a 405/65 R18
>>>>>>> (like many higher profile road cars) and the front a higher AR
>>>>>>> at 305/86 R18 (very much higher profile than most road cars.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I stand to be corrected.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You have figured it VERY wrongly.
>>>>>
>>>>> Then correct me.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> So F1 tires are sized (in mm for width and overall diameter) as
>>>> 305/720R18 front and 405/720R18
>>>>
>>>> Converting from one to the other involves taking the overall diameter
>>>> (720) subtracting the wheel diameter (which you convert to
>>>> millimetres, so 457.2) then you divide by 2
>>>
>>> I thought that was probably what I had missed.
>>>
>>> Well caught.
>>>
>>> If only you could manage to do it without looking a fucking ASSHOLE.
>>>
>>> A test you have yet to pass.
>>>
>>> :-D
>>
>> So I make them to be roughly:
>>
>> 405/32R18 on the rear and 305/43R18 on the front.
>>
>> I stand to be corrected (and wonder why, if they want road-relevance
>> they don't use nomenclature that buyers of road car tyres understand).
>>
>
> .... and..... I just realised I could have simply halved your sidewall
> to width ratios Bigbird to come up with the figures that I painstakingly
> calculated.

Yup!

:-)

On Tuesday, February 1, 2022 at 9:37:33 AM UTC-7, Alan wrote:

> Yup!

fuck off simpleton