"Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com> Wrote in message:r
> On 7/3/2022 3:19 PM, waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com wrote:> On Sunday, July 3, 2022 at 7:00:11 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:>> On 7/2/2022 4:53 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:>>> On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at 4:16:22 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>> On Sat, 2 Jul 2022 07:39:53 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <not...@noland.com>>>>> wrote:>>>>> On 7/1/2022 4:58 PM, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 11:56:20 -0700 (PDT),>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Friday, July 1, 2022 at 2:27:15 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT),>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >From an op-ed article by Mick Mulvaney in USA Today: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's quite likely that Trump attempted to obstruct justice, which may turn out to be the most serious, and most provable crime he committed according to Mick Mulvaney, Director of the Office of Management and Budget; White House Chief of Staff.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Per Mulvaney, such claims are the threat Trump should be most worried about.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He also described a former White House aide's Tuesday testi
mony as "eminently credible.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The former acting White House chief of staff Mick Mulvaney wrote on Wednesday that in his view the real threat to former President Donald Trump was evidence that might lead to accusations of obstruction of justice.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney wrote that he had previously defended the former president against claims that he did "anything illegal or criminal" in relation to the Capitol riot. He said he was having difficulty maintaining that position, however, particularly after Hutchinson's testimony, which he said he found "eminently credible.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Because after some of the bombshells that got dropped in that hearing, my guess is that things could get very dark for the former president," Mulvaney wrote.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney also said, though, that Tuesday's hearing revealed one real threat to Trump that didn't hinge on Hutchinson's words or credibility. "It is the one that jumped out at me," he wrote. "And it is the one that should most worry the former president.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He referred to the evidence presented by Rep. Liz Cheney of Wyoming toward the end of the hearing consisting of two messages that Janu
ary 6 panel witnesses said they received before giving their depositions. The messages included allusions to being a "team player" to "stay in the good graces in Trump world" as well as a reminder that Trump read transcripts of interviews.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney said that the implication behind displaying the messages during the hearing was "crystal clear.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The Jan. 6 committee members believe they have evidence that people within the Trump operation attempted to intimidate witnesses," Mulvaney wrote. "And that, any way you slice it, is obstruction of justice.">>>>>>>> What do you want to bet, if Trump said he wasn't running in 2024, this>>>>>>>> whole witch hunt evaporates. De Santis may be taking that option away>>>>>>>> from him anyway.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ===>>>>>>>>>>>>>> witch-hunt>>>>>>> /?wiCH ?h?nt/>>>>>>> nounhistorical>>>>>>> noun: witch-hunt; plural noun: witch-hunts; noun: witchhunt; plural noun: witchhunts>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a) search for and subsequent persecution of a supposed witch.>>>>>>> b) informal: a campaign directed against a person or group holding unorthodox or unpopular views.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I take some exception to your use of "witch-hunt" bec
ause of its implication of a search for something that isn't real. In my mind, and the mind of many others, Trump's criminality is very real. The question is how best to prove it, and how best to punish it. I'm not sure it's enough to just keep him from running in 2024 but that's a good start. I'd like to see his cult mystique with the right win sector of the Republican party totally annihilated so that we never have to deal with his toxic influence again.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The whole process bothers me. Even you admit, the whole exercise is>>>>>> designed to prevent him from running again (two impeachments, one>>>>>> after he left office and now you are hanging your hat on the 14th>>>>>> amendment)>>>>>> Isn't this supposed to be up to the voters?>>>>>> Why are you folks so afraid of open and free elections?>>>>>> I would much prefer that he simply gets clobbered in the primaries by>>>>>> margins too great to protest. De Santis is already chipping away at>>>>>> his base.>>>>>> I still believe the risks of trying to charge this guy over bullshit>>>>>> and the social upheaval it might cause is not worth the risk for the>>>>>> slim chance you can get any kind of conviction by 2024.>
>>>>> The court would still be hearing motions by then.>>>>>> I mentioned before, Cruz is still in court for a school shooting in>>>>>> 2018 and it was a slam dunk against a kid with few resources to>>>>>> present a defense.>>>>>> Trump may be a piece of shit but he is a rich piece of shit who has>>>>>> always been surrounded by lawyers.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Even Biden the Bozo isn't blaming Trump for much anymore.>>>>> It's all "Russia, Russia, Russia".>>>> Biden has to be a little careful or someone will point out Russia was>>>> pretty quiet on Trump's watch. They got frisky during Obama's watch>>>> and started a war on Biden's watch.>>>>>> ===>>>>>> Putin had Trump right where he wanted him and didn't want to upset the balance.>>>>>> https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/cc2560c/2147483647/strip/false/crop/3259x2423+0+0/resize/1486x1105!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fbrightspot%2F5d%2F6e%2F99f75ab4481499aab953bee3ff59%2Fcolor-edit-toon-trump-on-nato-and-russia.jpg>> Cute.>>>> It's obvious you have an intense dislike for Trump which is>> understandable. Based on your many posts about him, your>> dislike goes back a long ways ..
. back when he was in>> private business and well before he ran for and won the>> Presidency.>>>> But, if you can put that intense dislike and bias aside for>> a moment, do you really feel the USA is in better positions>> and conditions, economically, domestically and globally>> today compared to four years ago?.>> -- > > ===> > The seeds of inflation were planted on Trump's watch with the Quantitative Easing program. It helped to keep the economy afloat during the Covid crisis but now were paying the price. The same can be said for the global supply chain crisis. Could Trump have done anything about it if still in office? Frankly I doubt it. He would have done a good job of blaming it on someone else however. That's his special talent. Does it not matter to you that he tried to overthrow an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of power? That is the bedrock of our democracy, and Trump reminds us of how fragile it can be. The vast majority of the electorate saw through his bluff, bluster and bullshit in the 2020 election and rightfully voted him out of office. For better or worse Biden was the only choice. For that we can thank the feckless Republican party who st
ood by their flawed candidate while the ship was burning.I guess where we differ is in the Trump's alleged attempt to overthrow an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of power. I really don'tthink that the events of Jan 6th was as serious or threatening to thethe country as the media and the Jan 6 commission is trying to make itout to be. I also distinctly recall Trump calling for a "peaceful"demonstration .... not a riot or attempt to take over the government.He's not the first by any means. His style is unique for sure andmay be inappropriate but I seem to remember a guy named Gore contestingan election for months and, more recently, a woman named Hillary who,to this day, still contends that the 2016 election was "stolen" fromher.-- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.https://www.avg.com

Justan Ohlphart <me@yourservice.com> wrote:
> "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com> Wrote in message:r
>> On 7/3/2022 3:19 PM, waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com wrote:> On Sunday,
>> July 3, 2022 at 7:00:11 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:>> On 7/2/2022 4:53 PM,
>> waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:>>> On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at 4:16:22
>> PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>> On Sat, 2 Jul 2022 07:39:53 -0400,
>> "Mr. Luddite" <not...@noland.com>>>>> wrote:>>>>> On 7/1/2022 4:58 PM,
>> gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 11:56:20 -0700 (PDT),>>>>>>
>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>> On
>> Friday, July 1, 2022 at 2:27:15 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>>>>>>
>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT),>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com"
>> <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >From an op-ed article by
>> Mick Mulvaney in USA Today: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's quite likely that
>> Trump attempted to obstruct justice, which may turn out to be the most
>> serious, and most provable crime he committed according to Mick
>> Mulvaney, Director of the Office of Management and Budget; White House
>> Chief of Staff.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Per Mulvaney, such claims are the
>> threat Trump should be most worried about.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He also
>> described a former White House aide's Tuesday testimony as "eminently
>> credible.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The former acting White House chief of
>> staff Mick Mulvaney wrote on Wednesday that in his view the real threat
>> to former President Donald Trump was evidence that might lead to
>> accusations of obstruction of justice.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney wrote
>> that he had previously defended the former president against claims that
>> he did "anything illegal or criminal" in relation to the Capitol riot.
>> He said he was having difficulty maintaining that position, however,
>> particularly after Hutchinson's testimony, which he said he found
>> "eminently credible.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Because after some of the
>> bombshells that got dropped in that hearing, my guess is that things
>> could get very dark for the former president," Mulvaney
>> wrote.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney also said, though, that Tuesday's
>> hearing revealed one real threat to Trump that didn't hinge on
>> Hutchinson's words or credibility. "It is the one that jumped out at
>> me," he wrote. "And it is the one that should most worry the former
>> president.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He referred to the evidence presented by
>> Rep. Liz Cheney of Wyoming toward the end of the hearing consisting of
>> two messages that January 6 panel witnesses said they received before
>> giving their depositions. The messages included allusions to being a
>> "team player" to "stay in the good graces in Trump world" as well as a
>> reminder that Trump read transcripts of interviews.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> Mulvaney said that the implication behind displaying the messages during
>> the hearing was "crystal clear.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The Jan. 6 committee
>> members believe they have evidence that people within the Trump
>> operation attempted to intimidate witnesses," Mulvaney wrote. "And that,
>> any way you slice it, is obstruction of justice.">>>>>>>> What do you
>> want to bet, if Trump said he wasn't running in 2024, this>>>>>>>> whole
>> witch hunt evaporates. De Santis may be taking that option away>>>>>>>>
>> from him anyway.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ===>>>>>>>>>>>>>> witch-hunt>>>>>>>
>> /?wiCH ?h?nt/>>>>>>> nounhistorical>>>>>>> noun: witch-hunt; plural
>> noun: witch-hunts; noun: witchhunt; plural noun:
>> witchhunts>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a) search for and subsequent persecution of a
>> supposed witch.>>>>>>> b) informal: a campaign directed against a person
>> or group holding unorthodox or unpopular views.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I take
>> some exception to your use of "witch-hunt" because of its implication of
>> a search for something that isn't real. In my mind, and the mind of many
>> others, Trump's criminality is very real. The question is how best to
>> prove it, and how best to punish it. I'm not sure it's enough to just
>> keep him from running in 2024 but that's a good start. I'd like to see
>> his cult mystique with the right win sector of the Republican party
>> totally annihilated so that we never have to deal with his toxic influence
>> again.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The whole process bothers me. Even you admit,
>> the whole exercise is>>>>>> designed to prevent him from running again
>> (two impeachments, one>>>>>> after he left office and now you are
>> hanging your hat on the 14th>>>>>> amendment)>>>>>> Isn't this supposed
>> to be up to the voters?>>>>>> Why are you folks so afraid of open and free
>> elections?>>>>>> I would much prefer that he simply gets clobbered in
>> the primaries by>>>>>> margins too great to protest. De Santis is
>> already chipping away at>>>>>> his base.>>>>>> I still believe the risks
>> of trying to charge this guy over bullshit>>>>>> and the social upheaval
>> it might cause is not worth the risk for the>>>>>> slim chance you can
>> get any kind of conviction by 2024.>>>>>> The court would still be
>> hearing motions by then.>>>>>> I mentioned before, Cruz is still in
>> court for a school shooting in>>>>>> 2018 and it was a slam dunk against
>> a kid with few resources to>>>>>> present a defense.>>>>>> Trump may be
>> a piece of shit but he is a rich piece of shit who has>>>>>> always been
>> surrounded by lawyers.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Even Biden the Bozo isn't blaming
>> Trump for much anymore.>>>>> It's all "Russia, Russia, Russia".>>>>
>> Biden has to be a little careful or someone will point out Russia
>> was>>>> pretty quiet on Trump's watch. They got frisky during Obama's
>> watch>>>> and started a war on Biden's watch.>>>>>> ===>>>>>> Putin had
>> Trump right where he wanted him and didn't want to upset the balance.>>>>>>
>> https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/cc2560c/2147483647/strip/false/crop/3259x2423+0+0/resize/1486x1105!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fbrightspot%2F5d%2F6e%2F99f75ab4481499aab953bee3ff59%2Fcolor-edit-toon-trump-on-nato-and-russia.jpg>>
>> Cute.>>>> It's obvious you have an intense dislike for Trump which is>>
>> understandable. Based on your many posts about him, your>> dislike goes
>> back a long ways ... back when he was in>> private business and well
>> before he ran for and won the>> Presidency.>>>> But, if you can put that
>> intense dislike and bias aside for>> a moment, do you really feel the
>> USA is in better positions>> and conditions, economically, domestically
>> and globally>> today compared to four years ago?.>> -- > > ===> > The
>> seeds of inflation were planted on Trump's watch with the Quantitative
>> Easing program. It helped to keep the economy afloat during the Covid
>> crisis but now were paying the price. The same can be said for the
>> global supply chain crisis. Could Trump have done anything about it if
>> still in office? Frankly I doubt it. He would have done a good job of
>> blaming it on someone else however. That's his special talent. Does it
>> not matter to you that he tried to overthrow an election and obstruct
>> the peaceful transfer of power? That is the bedrock of our democracy,
>> and Trump reminds us of how fragile it can be. The vast majority of the
>> electorate saw through his bluff, bluster and bullshit in the 2020
>> election and rightfully voted him out of office. For better or worse
>> Biden was the only choice. For that we can thank the feckless
>> Republican party who stood by their flawed candidate while the ship was
>> burning.I guess where we differ is in the Trump's alleged attempt to
>> overthrow an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of power. I
>> really don'tthink that the events of Jan 6th was as serious or
>> threatening to thethe country as the media and the Jan 6 commission is
>> trying to make itout to be. I also distinctly recall Trump calling for a
>> "peaceful"demonstration .... not a riot or attempt to take over the
>> government.He's not the first by any means. His style is unique for
>> sure andmay be inappropriate but I seem to remember a guy named Gore
>> contestingan election for months and, more recently, a woman named
>> Hillary who,to this day, still contends that the 2016 election was
>> "stolen" fromher.-- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.https://www.avg.com
>
> To WayneTrump is the root of all evil. He seems obliviius to the
> civil unrest, crime, graft, corruption, and the ship of state is
> rudderless. All the can say is we're watching and we're doing all
> we can. My question is what are they trying to do to our country,
> and why? Constitution no good.Lets rewrite it. Supreme court no
> good. Lets pack it or get rid of it. Nobody should suffer jail
> time. Go out and buy an electric car NOW. It doesn't matter that
> we dont have infrostructure to support it. Borders dont matter.
> Hunter Biden is the smartest person Sleepy Joe knows.
>
> Im going to celebrate independence day anyway. My flags are coming
> down tomorrow until the next event worth celebrating.

Keyser Soze <keysersoze@whitehouse.com> Wrote in message:r
> Justan Ohlphart <me@yourservice.com> wrote:> "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com> Wrote in message:r>> On 7/3/2022 3:19 PM, waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com wrote:> On Sunday,>> July 3, 2022 at 7:00:11 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:>> On 7/2/2022 4:53 PM,>> waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:>>> On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at 4:16:22>> PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>> On Sat, 2 Jul 2022 07:39:53 -0400,>> "Mr. Luddite" <not...@noland.com>>>>> wrote:>>>>> On 7/1/2022 4:58 PM,>> gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 11:56:20 -0700 (PDT),>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>> On>> Friday, July 1, 2022 at 2:27:15 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT),>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com">> <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >From an op-ed article by>> Mick Mulvaney in USA Today: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's quite likely that>> Trump attempted to obstruct justice, which may turn out to be the most>> serious, and most provable crime he committed according to Mick>> Mulvaney, Director of the Office of Management and Budget; White House>> Chief of Staff.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Per Mulvaney, such claims
are the>> threat Trump should be most worried about.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He also>> described a former White House aide's Tuesday testimony as "eminently>> credible.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The former acting White House chief of>> staff Mick Mulvaney wrote on Wednesday that in his view the real threat>> to former President Donald Trump was evidence that might lead to>> accusations of obstruction of justice.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney wrote>> that he had previously defended the former president against claims that>> he did "anything illegal or criminal" in relation to the Capitol riot.>> He said he was having difficulty maintaining that position, however,>> particularly after Hutchinson's testimony, which he said he found>> "eminently credible.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Because after some of the>> bombshells that got dropped in that hearing, my guess is that things>> could get very dark for the former president," Mulvaney>> wrote.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney also said, though, that Tuesday's>> hearing revealed one real threat to Trump that didn't hinge on>> Hutchinson's words or credibility. "It is the one that jumped out at>> me," he wrote. "And it is the one that should most worry the former>>
president.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He referred to the evidence presented by>> Rep. Liz Cheney of Wyoming toward the end of the hearing consisting of>> two messages that January 6 panel witnesses said they received before>> giving their depositions. The messages included allusions to being a>> "team player" to "stay in the good graces in Trump world" as well as a>> reminder that Trump read transcripts of interviews.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney said that the implication behind displaying the messages during>> the hearing was "crystal clear.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The Jan. 6 committee>> members believe they have evidence that people within the Trump>> operation attempted to intimidate witnesses," Mulvaney wrote. "And that,>> any way you slice it, is obstruction of justice.">>>>>>>> What do you>> want to bet, if Trump said he wasn't running in 2024, this>>>>>>>> whole>> witch hunt evaporates. De Santis may be taking that option away>>>>>>>>>> from him anyway.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ===>>>>>>>>>>>>>> witch-hunt>>>>>>>>> /?wiCH ?h?nt/>>>>>>> nounhistorical>>>>>>> noun: witch-hunt; plural>> noun: witch-hunts; noun: witchhunt; plural noun:>> witchhunts>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a) search for and subsequent persecut
ion of a>> supposed witch.>>>>>>> b) informal: a campaign directed against a person>> or group holding unorthodox or unpopular views.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I take>> some exception to your use of "witch-hunt" because of its implication of>> a search for something that isn't real. In my mind, and the mind of many>> others, Trump's criminality is very real. The question is how best to>> prove it, and how best to punish it. I'm not sure it's enough to just>> keep him from running in 2024 but that's a good start. I'd like to see>> his cult mystique with the right win sector of the Republican party>> totally annihilated so that we never have to deal with his toxic influence>> again.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The whole process bothers me. Even you admit,>> the whole exercise is>>>>>> designed to prevent him from running again>> (two impeachments, one>>>>>> after he left office and now you are>> hanging your hat on the 14th>>>>>> amendment)>>>>>> Isn't this supposed>> to be up to the voters?>>>>>> Why are you folks so afraid of open and free>> elections?>>>>>> I would much prefer that he simply gets clobbered in>> the primaries by>>>>>> margins too great to protest. De Santis is>> already chipping away
at>>>>>> his base.>>>>>> I still believe the risks>> of trying to charge this guy over bullshit>>>>>> and the social upheaval>> it might cause is not worth the risk for the>>>>>> slim chance you can>> get any kind of conviction by 2024.>>>>>> The court would still be>> hearing motions by then.>>>>>> I mentioned before, Cruz is still in>> court for a school shooting in>>>>>> 2018 and it was a slam dunk against>> a kid with few resources to>>>>>> present a defense.>>>>>> Trump may be>> a piece of shit but he is a rich piece of shit who has>>>>>> always been>> surrounded by lawyers.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Even Biden the Bozo isn't blaming>> Trump for much anymore.>>>>> It's all "Russia, Russia, Russia".>>>>>> Biden has to be a little careful or someone will point out Russia>> was>>>> pretty quiet on Trump's watch. They got frisky during Obama's>> watch>>>> and started a war on Biden's watch.>>>>>> ===>>>>>> Putin had>> Trump right where he wanted him and didn't want to upset the balance.>>>>>>>> https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/cc2560c/2147483647/strip/false/crop/3259x2423+0+0/resize/1486x1105!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fbrigh
tspot%2F5d%2F6e%2F99f75ab4481499aab953bee3ff59%2Fcolor-edit-toon-trump-on-nato-and-russia.jpg>>>> Cute.>>>> It's obvious you have an intense dislike for Trump which is>>>> understandable. Based on your many posts about him, your>> dislike goes>> back a long ways ... back when he was in>> private business and well>> before he ran for and won the>> Presidency.>>>> But, if you can put that>> intense dislike and bias aside for>> a moment, do you really feel the>> USA is in better positions>> and conditions, economically, domestically>> and globally>> today compared to four years ago?.>> -- > > ===> > The>> seeds of inflation were planted on Trump's watch with the Quantitative>> Easing program. It helped to keep the economy afloat during the Covid>> crisis but now were paying the price. The same can be said for the>> global supply chain crisis. Could Trump have done anything about it if>> still in office? Frankly I doubt it. He would have done a good job of>> blaming it on someone else however. That's his special talent. Does it>> not matter to you that he tried to overthrow an election and obstruct>> the peaceful transfer of power? That is the bedrock of our democracy,>> and T
rump reminds us of how fragile it can be. The vast majority of the>> electorate saw through his bluff, bluster and bullshit in the 2020>> election and rightfully voted him out of office. For better or worse>> Biden was the only choice. For that we can thank the feckless>> Republican party who stood by their flawed candidate while the ship was>> burning.I guess where we differ is in the Trump's alleged attempt to>> overthrow an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of power. I>> really don'tthink that the events of Jan 6th was as serious or>> threatening to thethe country as the media and the Jan 6 commission is>> trying to make itout to be. I also distinctly recall Trump calling for a>> "peaceful"demonstration .... not a riot or attempt to take over the>> government.He's not the first by any means. His style is unique for>> sure andmay be inappropriate but I seem to remember a guy named Gore>> contestingan election for months and, more recently, a woman named>> Hillary who,to this day, still contends that the 2016 election was>> "stolen" fromher.-- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.https://www.avg.com> > To WayneTrump is the root of all evil. He seems obli
viius to the> civil unrest, crime, graft, corruption, and the ship of state is> rudderless. All the can say is we're watching and we're doing all> we can. My question is what are they trying to do to our country,> and why? Constitution no good.Lets rewrite it. Supreme court no> good. Lets pack it or get rid of it. Nobody should suffer jail> time. Go out and buy an electric car NOW. It doesn't matter that> we dont have infrostructure to support it. Borders dont matter.> Hunter Biden is the smartest person Sleepy Joe knows.> > Im going to celebrate independence day anyway. My flags are coming> down tomorrow until the next event worth celebrating.If you, herring, and bilious bill had any talent, you could revive theNairobi Trio and appear to be more clever than any of you are. https://youtu.be/5-tFyBLo71U-- Lock Trump Up

Justan Ohlphart <me@yourservice.com> wrote:
> Keyser Soze <keysersoze@whitehouse.com> Wrote in message:r
>> Justan Ohlphart <me@yourservice.com> wrote:> "Mr. Luddite"
>> <nothere@noland.com> Wrote in message:r>> On 7/3/2022 3:19 PM,
>> waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com wrote:> On Sunday,>> July 3, 2022 at
>> 7:00:11 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:>> On 7/2/2022 4:53 PM,>>
>> waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:>>> On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at
>> 4:16:22>> PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>> On Sat, 2 Jul 2022
>> 07:39:53 -0400,>> "Mr. Luddite" <not...@noland.com>>>>> wrote:>>>>> On
>> 7/1/2022 4:58 PM,>> gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022
>> 11:56:20 -0700 (PDT),>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com"
>> <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>> On>> Friday, July 1, 2022 at
>> 2:27:15 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022
>> 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT),>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com">>
>> <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >From an op-ed article
>> by>> Mick Mulvaney in USA Today: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's quite likely
>> that>> Trump attempted to obstruct justice, which may turn out to be the
>> most>> serious, and most provable crime he committed according to Mick>>
>> Mulvaney, Director of the Office of Management and Budget; White House>>
>> Chief of Staff.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Per Mulvaney, such claims are the>>
>> threat Trump should be most worried about.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He also>>
>> described a former White House aide's Tuesday testimony as "eminently>>
>> credible.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The former acting White House chief of>>
>> staff Mick Mulvaney wrote on Wednesday that in his view the real
>> threat>> to former President Donald Trump was evidence that might lead
>> to>> accusations of obstruction of justice.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney
>> wrote>> that he had previously defended the former president against
>> claims that>> he did "anything illegal or criminal" in relation to the
>> Capitol riot.>> He said he was having difficulty maintaining that
>> position, however,>> particularly after Hutchinson's testimony, which he
>> said he found>> "eminently credible.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Because after
>> some of the>> bombshells that got dropped in that hearing, my guess is
>> that things>> could get very dark for the former president," Mulvaney>>
>> wrote.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney also said, though, that Tuesday's>>
>> hearing revealed one real threat to Trump that didn't hinge on>>
>> Hutchinson's words or credibility. "It is the one that jumped out at>>
>> me," he wrote. "And it is the one that should most worry the former>>
>> president.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He referred to the evidence presented by>>
>> Rep. Liz Cheney of Wyoming toward the end of the hearing consisting of>>
>> two messages that January 6 panel witnesses said they received before>>
>> giving their depositions. The messages included allusions to being a>>
>> "team player" to "stay in the good graces in Trump world" as well as a>>
>> reminder that Trump read transcripts of interviews.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> Mulvaney said that the implication behind displaying the messages
>> during>> the hearing was "crystal clear.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The Jan. 6
>> committee>> members believe they have evidence that people within the
>> Trump>> operation attempted to intimidate witnesses," Mulvaney wrote.
>> "And that,>> any way you slice it, is obstruction of justice.">>>>>>>>
>> What do you>> want to bet, if Trump said he wasn't running in 2024,
>> this>>>>>>>> whole>> witch hunt evaporates. De Santis may be taking that
>> option away>>>>>>>>>> from him anyway.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ===>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> witch-hunt>>>>>>>>> /?wiCH ?h?nt/>>>>>>> nounhistorical>>>>>>> noun:
>> witch-hunt; plural>> noun: witch-hunts; noun: witchhunt; plural noun:>>
>> witchhunts>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a) search for and subsequent persecution of a>>
>> supposed witch.>>>>>>> b) informal: a campaign directed against a
>> person>> or group holding unorthodox or unpopular views.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I
>> take>> some exception to your use of "witch-hunt" because of its
>> implication of>> a search for something that isn't real. In my mind, and
>> the mind of many>> others, Trump's criminality is very real. The
>> question is how best to>> prove it, and how best to punish it. I'm not
>> sure it's enough to just>> keep him from running in 2024 but that's a
>> good start. I'd like to see>> his cult mystique with the right win
>> sector of the Republican party>> totally annihilated so that we never
>> have to deal with his toxic influence>> again.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The
>> whole process bothers me. Even you admit,>> the whole exercise is>>>>>>
>> designed to prevent him from running again>> (two impeachments,
>> one>>>>>> after he left office and now you are>> hanging your hat on the
>> 14th>>>>>> amendment)>>>>>> Isn't this supposed>> to be up to the
>> voters?>>>>>> Why are you folks so afraid of open and free>>
>> elections?>>>>>> I would much prefer that he simply gets clobbered in>>
>> the primaries by>>>>>> margins too great to protest. De Santis is>>
>> already chipping away at>>>>>> his base.>>>>>> I still believe the
>> risks>> of trying to charge this guy over bullshit>>>>>> and the social
>> upheaval>> it might cause is not worth the risk for the>>>>>> slim
>> chance you can>> get any kind of conviction by 2024.>>>>>> The court
>> would still be>> hearing motions by then.>>>>>> I mentioned before, Cruz
>> is still in>> court for a school shooting in>>>>>> 2018 and it was a
>> slam dunk against>> a kid with few resources to>>>>>> present a
>> defense.>>>>>> Trump may be>> a piece of shit but he is a rich piece of
>> shit who has>>>>>> always been>> surrounded by lawyers.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> Even Biden the Bozo isn't blaming>> Trump for much anymore.>>>>> It's
>> all "Russia, Russia, Russia".>>>>>> Biden has to be a little careful or
>> someone will point out Russia>> was>>>> pretty quiet on Trump's watch.
>> They got frisky during Obama's>> watch>>>> and started a war on Biden's
>> watch.>>>>>> ===>>>>>> Putin had>> Trump right where he wanted him and
>> didn't want to upset the balance.>>>>>>>>
>> https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/cc2560c/2147483647/strip/false/crop/3259x2423+0+0/resize/1486x1105!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fbrightspot%2F5d%2F6e%2F99f75ab4481499aab953bee3ff59%2Fcolor-edit-toon-trump-on-nato-and-russia.jpg>>>>
>> Cute.>>>> It's obvious you have an intense dislike for Trump which
>> is>>>> understandable. Based on your many posts about him, your>>
>> dislike goes>> back a long ways ... back when he was in>> private
>> business and well>> before he ran for and won the>> Presidency.>>>> But,
>> if you can put that>> intense dislike and bias aside for>> a moment, do
>> you really feel the>> USA is in better positions>> and conditions,
>> economically, domestically>> and globally>> today compared to four years
>> ago?.>> -- > > ===> > The>> seeds of inflation were planted on Trump's
>> watch with the Quantitative>> Easing program. It helped to keep the
>> economy afloat during the Covid>> crisis but now were paying the price.
>> The same can be said for the>> global supply chain crisis. Could Trump
>> have done anything about it if>> still in office? Frankly I doubt it.
>> He would have done a good job of>> blaming it on someone else however.
>> That's his special talent. Does it>> not matter to you that he tried to
>> overthrow an election and obstruct>> the peaceful transfer of power?
>> That is the bedrock of our democracy,>> and Trump reminds us of how
>> fragile it can be. The vast majority of the>> electorate saw through
>> his bluff, bluster and bullshit in the 2020>> election and rightfully
>> voted him out of office. For better or worse>> Biden was the only
>> choice. For that we can thank the feckless>> Republican party who stood
>> by their flawed candidate while the ship was>> burning.I guess where we
>> differ is in the Trump's alleged attempt to>> overthrow an election and
>> obstruct the peaceful transfer of power. I>> really don'tthink that the
>> events of Jan 6th was as serious or>> threatening to thethe country as
>> the media and the Jan 6 commission is>> trying to make itout to be. I
>> also distinctly recall Trump calling for a>> "peaceful"demonstration
>> .... not a riot or attempt to take over the>> government.He's not the
>> first by any means. His style is unique for>> sure andmay be
>> inappropriate but I seem to remember a guy named Gore>> contestingan
>> election for months and, more recently, a woman named>> Hillary who,to
>> this day, still contends that the 2016 election was>> "stolen"
>> fromher.-- This email has been checked for viruses by
>> AVG.https://www.avg.com> > To WayneTrump is the root of all evil. He
>> seems obliviius to the> civil unrest, crime, graft, corruption, and the
>> ship of state is> rudderless. All the can say is we're watching and
>> we're doing all> we can. My question is what are they trying to do to
>> our country,> and why? Constitution no good.Lets rewrite it. Supreme
>> court no> good. Lets pack it or get rid of it. Nobody should suffer
>> jail> time. Go out and buy an electric car NOW. It doesn't matter that>
>> we dont have infrostructure to support it. Borders dont matter.>
>> Hunter Biden is the smartest person Sleepy Joe knows.> > Im going to
>> celebrate independence day anyway. My flags are coming> down tomorrow
>> until the next event worth celebrating.If you, herring, and bilious bill
>> had any talent, you could revive theNairobi Trio and appear to be more
>> clever than any of you are. https://youtu.be/5-tFyBLo71U-- Lock Trump Up
>
> Clever is not the guy in Maryland who suffered two bankruptcies,
> countless loan and tax defaults, hasn't held down an honest job
> since his Clown college days, abandoned his family, lies about
> everything in order to impress Donnie. Keeps a shotgun behind his
> front door because he's afraid of the boogy man. Claims to be
> married but can't verify it. Says he lost a couple a hundred
> pounds but cant verify it. Says he's owned yachts but cant verify
> it. Doesn't own any property on record. In other words, a
> complete loser.
As Donnie says: I agree completely with this post.

On Monday, 4 July 2022 at 12:37:33 UTC-3, Bill wrote:
> Justan Ohlphart <m...@yourservice.com> wrote:
> > Keyser Soze <keyse...@whitehouse.com> Wrote in message:r
> >> Justan Ohlphart <m...@yourservice.com> wrote:> "Mr. Luddite"
> >> <not...@noland.com> Wrote in message:r>> On 7/3/2022 3:19 PM,
> >> waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:> On Sunday,>> July 3, 2022 at
> >> 7:00:11 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:>> On 7/2/2022 4:53 PM,>>
> >> waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:>>> On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at
> >> 4:16:22>> PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>> On Sat, 2 Jul 2022
> >> 07:39:53 -0400,>> "Mr. Luddite" <not...@noland.com>>>>> wrote:>>>>> On
> >> 7/1/2022 4:58 PM,>> gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022
> >> 11:56:20 -0700 (PDT),>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com"
> >> <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>> On>> Friday, July 1, 2022 at
> >> 2:27:15 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022
> >> 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT),>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com">>
> >> <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >From an op-ed article
> >> by>> Mick Mulvaney in USA Today: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's quite likely
> >> that>> Trump attempted to obstruct justice, which may turn out to be the
> >> most>> serious, and most provable crime he committed according to Mick>>
> >> Mulvaney, Director of the Office of Management and Budget; White House>>
> >> Chief of Staff.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Per Mulvaney, such claims are the>>
> >> threat Trump should be most worried about.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He also>>
> >> described a former White House aide's Tuesday testimony as "eminently>>
> >> credible.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The former acting White House chief of>>
> >> staff Mick Mulvaney wrote on Wednesday that in his view the real
> >> threat>> to former President Donald Trump was evidence that might lead
> >> to>> accusations of obstruction of justice.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney
> >> wrote>> that he had previously defended the former president against
> >> claims that>> he did "anything illegal or criminal" in relation to the
> >> Capitol riot.>> He said he was having difficulty maintaining that
> >> position, however,>> particularly after Hutchinson's testimony, which he
> >> said he found>> "eminently credible.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Because after
> >> some of the>> bombshells that got dropped in that hearing, my guess is
> >> that things>> could get very dark for the former president," Mulvaney>>
> >> wrote.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney also said, though, that Tuesday's>>
> >> hearing revealed one real threat to Trump that didn't hinge on>>
> >> Hutchinson's words or credibility. "It is the one that jumped out at>>
> >> me," he wrote. "And it is the one that should most worry the former>>
> >> president.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He referred to the evidence presented by>>
> >> Rep. Liz Cheney of Wyoming toward the end of the hearing consisting of>>
> >> two messages that January 6 panel witnesses said they received before>>
> >> giving their depositions. The messages included allusions to being a>>
> >> "team player" to "stay in the good graces in Trump world" as well as a>>
> >> reminder that Trump read transcripts of interviews.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> Mulvaney said that the implication behind displaying the messages
> >> during>> the hearing was "crystal clear.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The Jan. 6
> >> committee>> members believe they have evidence that people within the
> >> Trump>> operation attempted to intimidate witnesses," Mulvaney wrote.
> >> "And that,>> any way you slice it, is obstruction of justice.">>>>>>>>
> >> What do you>> want to bet, if Trump said he wasn't running in 2024,
> >> this>>>>>>>> whole>> witch hunt evaporates. De Santis may be taking that
> >> option away>>>>>>>>>> from him anyway.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ===>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> witch-hunt>>>>>>>>> /?wiCH ?h?nt/>>>>>>> nounhistorical>>>>>>> noun:
> >> witch-hunt; plural>> noun: witch-hunts; noun: witchhunt; plural noun:>>
> >> witchhunts>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a) search for and subsequent persecution of a>>
> >> supposed witch.>>>>>>> b) informal: a campaign directed against a
> >> person>> or group holding unorthodox or unpopular views.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I
> >> take>> some exception to your use of "witch-hunt" because of its
> >> implication of>> a search for something that isn't real. In my mind, and
> >> the mind of many>> others, Trump's criminality is very real. The
> >> question is how best to>> prove it, and how best to punish it. I'm not
> >> sure it's enough to just>> keep him from running in 2024 but that's a
> >> good start. I'd like to see>> his cult mystique with the right win
> >> sector of the Republican party>> totally annihilated so that we never
> >> have to deal with his toxic influence>> again.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The
> >> whole process bothers me. Even you admit,>> the whole exercise is>>>>>>
> >> designed to prevent him from running again>> (two impeachments,
> >> one>>>>>> after he left office and now you are>> hanging your hat on the
> >> 14th>>>>>> amendment)>>>>>> Isn't this supposed>> to be up to the
> >> voters?>>>>>> Why are you folks so afraid of open and free>>
> >> elections?>>>>>> I would much prefer that he simply gets clobbered in>>
> >> the primaries by>>>>>> margins too great to protest. De Santis is>>
> >> already chipping away at>>>>>> his base.>>>>>> I still believe the
> >> risks>> of trying to charge this guy over bullshit>>>>>> and the social
> >> upheaval>> it might cause is not worth the risk for the>>>>>> slim
> >> chance you can>> get any kind of conviction by 2024.>>>>>> The court
> >> would still be>> hearing motions by then.>>>>>> I mentioned before, Cruz
> >> is still in>> court for a school shooting in>>>>>> 2018 and it was a
> >> slam dunk against>> a kid with few resources to>>>>>> present a
> >> defense.>>>>>> Trump may be>> a piece of shit but he is a rich piece of
> >> shit who has>>>>>> always been>> surrounded by lawyers.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> Even Biden the Bozo isn't blaming>> Trump for much anymore.>>>>> It's
> >> all "Russia, Russia, Russia".>>>>>> Biden has to be a little careful or
> >> someone will point out Russia>> was>>>> pretty quiet on Trump's watch.
> >> They got frisky during Obama's>> watch>>>> and started a war on Biden's
> >> watch.>>>>>> ===>>>>>> Putin had>> Trump right where he wanted him and
> >> didn't want to upset the balance.>>>>>>>>
> >> https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/cc2560c/2147483647/strip/false/crop/3259x2423+0+0/resize/1486x1105!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fbrightspot%2F5d%2F6e%2F99f75ab4481499aab953bee3ff59%2Fcolor-edit-toon-trump-on-nato-and-russia.jpg>>>>
> >> Cute.>>>> It's obvious you have an intense dislike for Trump which
> >> is>>>> understandable. Based on your many posts about him, your>>
> >> dislike goes>> back a long ways ... back when he was in>> private
> >> business and well>> before he ran for and won the>> Presidency.>>>> But,
> >> if you can put that>> intense dislike and bias aside for>> a moment, do
> >> you really feel the>> USA is in better positions>> and conditions,
> >> economically, domestically>> and globally>> today compared to four years
> >> ago?.>> -- > > ===> > The>> seeds of inflation were planted on Trump's
> >> watch with the Quantitative>> Easing program. It helped to keep the
> >> economy afloat during the Covid>> crisis but now were paying the price..
> >> The same can be said for the>> global supply chain crisis. Could Trump
> >> have done anything about it if>> still in office? Frankly I doubt it.
> >> He would have done a good job of>> blaming it on someone else however.
> >> That's his special talent. Does it>> not matter to you that he tried to
> >> overthrow an election and obstruct>> the peaceful transfer of power?
> >> That is the bedrock of our democracy,>> and Trump reminds us of how
> >> fragile it can be. The vast majority of the>> electorate saw through
> >> his bluff, bluster and bullshit in the 2020>> election and rightfully
> >> voted him out of office. For better or worse>> Biden was the only
> >> choice. For that we can thank the feckless>> Republican party who stood
> >> by their flawed candidate while the ship was>> burning.I guess where we
> >> differ is in the Trump's alleged attempt to>> overthrow an election and
> >> obstruct the peaceful transfer of power. I>> really don'tthink that the
> >> events of Jan 6th was as serious or>> threatening to thethe country as
> >> the media and the Jan 6 commission is>> trying to make itout to be. I
> >> also distinctly recall Trump calling for a>> "peaceful"demonstration
> >> .... not a riot or attempt to take over the>> government.He's not the
> >> first by any means. His style is unique for>> sure andmay be
> >> inappropriate but I seem to remember a guy named Gore>> contestingan
> >> election for months and, more recently, a woman named>> Hillary who,to
> >> this day, still contends that the 2016 election was>> "stolen"
> >> fromher.-- This email has been checked for viruses by
> >> AVG.https://www.avg.com> > To WayneTrump is the root of all evil. He
> >> seems obliviius to the> civil unrest, crime, graft, corruption, and the
> >> ship of state is> rudderless. All the can say is we're watching and
> >> we're doing all> we can. My question is what are they trying to do to
> >> our country,> and why? Constitution no good.Lets rewrite it. Supreme
> >> court no> good. Lets pack it or get rid of it. Nobody should suffer
> >> jail> time. Go out and buy an electric car NOW. It doesn't matter that>
> >> we dont have infrostructure to support it. Borders dont matter.>
> >> Hunter Biden is the smartest person Sleepy Joe knows.> > Im going to
> >> celebrate independence day anyway. My flags are coming> down tomorrow
> >> until the next event worth celebrating.If you, herring, and bilious bill
> >> had any talent, you could revive theNairobi Trio and appear to be more
> >> clever than any of you are. https://youtu.be/5-tFyBLo71U-- Lock Trump Up
> >
> > Clever is not the guy in Maryland who suffered two bankruptcies,
> > countless loan and tax defaults, hasn't held down an honest job
> > since his Clown college days, abandoned his family, lies about
> > everything in order to impress Donnie. Keeps a shotgun behind his
> > front door because he's afraid of the boogy man. Claims to be
> > married but can't verify it. Says he lost a couple a hundred
> > pounds but cant verify it. Says he's owned yachts but cant verify
> > it. Doesn't own any property on record. In other words, a
> > complete loser.
> As Donnie says: I agree completely with this post.

On Monday, 4 July 2022 at 12:23:09 UTC-3, Justan Ohlphart wrote:
> Keyser Soze <keyse...@whitehouse.com> Wrote in message:r
> > Justan Ohlphart <m...@yourservice.com> wrote:> "Mr. Luddite" <not...@noland.com> Wrote in message:r>> On 7/3/2022 3:19 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:> On Sunday,>> July 3, 2022 at 7:00:11 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:>> On 7/2/2022 4:53 PM,>> waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:>>> On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at 4:16:22>> PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>> On Sat, 2 Jul 2022 07:39:53 -0400,>> "Mr. Luddite" <not...@noland.com>>>>> wrote:>>>>> On 7/1/2022 4:58 PM,>> gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 11:56:20 -0700 (PDT),>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>> On>> Friday, July 1, 2022 at 2:27:15 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT),>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com">> <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >From an op-ed article by>> Mick Mulvaney in USA Today: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's quite likely that>> Trump attempted to obstruct justice, which may turn out to be the most>> serious, and most provable crime he committed according to Mick>> Mulvaney, Director of the Office of Management and Budget; White House>> Chief of Staff.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Per Mulvaney, such claims are the>> threat Trump should be most worried about.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He also>> described a former White House aide's Tuesday testimony as "eminently>> credible.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The former acting White House chief of>> staff Mick Mulvaney wrote on Wednesday that in his view the real threat>> to former President Donald Trump was evidence that might lead to>> accusations of obstruction of justice.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney wrote>> that he had previously defended the former president against claims that>> he did "anything illegal or criminal" in relation to the Capitol riot.>> He said he was having difficulty maintaining that position, however,>> particularly after Hutchinson's testimony, which he said he found>> "eminently credible.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Because after some of the>> bombshells that got dropped in that hearing, my guess is that things>> could get very dark for the former president," Mulvaney>> wrote.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney also said, though, that Tuesday's>> hearing revealed one real threat to Trump that didn't hinge on>> Hutchinson's words or credibility. "It is the one that jumped out at>> me," he wrote. "And it is the one that should most worry the former>> president.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He referred to the evidence presented by>> Rep. Liz Cheney of Wyoming toward the end of the hearing consisting of>> two messages that January 6 panel witnesses said they received before>> giving their depositions. The messages included allusions to being a>> "team player" to "stay in the good graces in Trump world" as well as a>> reminder that Trump read transcripts of interviews.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney said that the implication behind displaying the messages during>> the hearing was "crystal clear.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The Jan. 6 committee>> members believe they have evidence that people within the Trump>> operation attempted to intimidate witnesses," Mulvaney wrote. "And that,>> any way you slice it, is obstruction of justice.">>>>>>>> What do you>> want to bet, if Trump said he wasn't running in 2024, this>>>>>>>> whole>> witch hunt evaporates. De Santis may be taking that option away>>>>>>>>>> from him anyway.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ===>>>>>>>>>>>>>> witch-hunt>>>>>>>>> /?wiCH ?h?nt/>>>>>>> nounhistorical>>>>>>> noun: witch-hunt; plural>> noun: witch-hunts; noun: witchhunt; plural noun:>> witchhunts>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a) search for and subsequent persecution of a>> supposed witch.>>>>>>> b) informal: a campaign directed against a person>> or group holding unorthodox or unpopular views.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I take>> some exception to your use of "witch-hunt" because of its implication of>> a search for something that isn't real. In my mind, and the mind of many>> others, Trump's criminality is very real. The question is how best to>> prove it, and how best to punish it. I'm not sure it's enough to just>> keep him from running in 2024 but that's a good start. I'd like to see>> his cult mystique with the right win sector of the Republican party>> totally annihilated so that we never have to deal with his toxic influence>> again..>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The whole process bothers me. Even you admit,>> the whole exercise is>>>>>> designed to prevent him from running again>> (two impeachments, one>>>>>> after he left office and now you are>> hanging your hat on the 14th>>>>>> amendment)>>>>>> Isn't this supposed>> to be up to the voters?>>>>>> Why are you folks so afraid of open and free>> elections?>>>>>> I would much prefer that he simply gets clobbered in>> the primaries by>>>>>> margins too great to protest. De Santis is>> already chipping away at>>>>>> his base.>>>>>> I still believe the risks>> of trying to charge this guy over bullshit>>>>>> and the social upheaval>> it might cause is not worth the risk for the>>>>>> slim chance you can>> get any kind of conviction by 2024.>>>>>> The court would still be>> hearing motions by then.>>>>>> I mentioned before, Cruz is still in>> court for a school shooting in>>>>>> 2018 and it was a slam dunk against>> a kid with few resources to>>>>>> present a defense.>>>>>> Trump may be>> a piece of shit but he is a rich piece of shit who has>>>>>> always been>> surrounded by lawyers.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Even Biden the Bozo isn't blaming>> Trump for much anymore.>>>>> It's all "Russia, Russia, Russia".>>>>>> Biden has to be a little careful or someone will point out Russia>> was>>>> pretty quiet on Trump's watch. They got frisky during Obama's>> watch>>>> and started a war on Biden's watch.>>>>>> ===>>>>>> Putin had>> Trump right where he wanted him and didn't want to upset the balance.>>>>>>>> https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/cc2560c/2147483647/strip/false/crop/3259x2423+0+0/resize/1486x1105!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fbrightspot%2F5d%2F6e%2F99f75ab4481499aab953bee3ff59%2Fcolor-edit-toon-trump-on-nato-and-russia.jpg>>>> Cute.>>>> It's obvious you have an intense dislike for Trump which is>>>> understandable. Based on your many posts about him, your>> dislike goes>> back a long ways ... back when he was in>> private business and well>> before he ran for and won the>> Presidency.>>>> But, if you can put that>> intense dislike and bias aside for>> a moment, do you really feel the>> USA is in better positions>> and conditions, economically, domestically>> and globally>> today compared to four years ago?.>> -- > > ===> > The>> seeds of inflation were planted on Trump's watch with the Quantitative>> Easing program. It helped to keep the economy afloat during the Covid>> crisis but now were paying the price. The same can be said for the>> global supply chain crisis. Could Trump have done anything about it if>> still in office? Frankly I doubt it. He would have done a good job of>> blaming it on someone else however. That's his special talent. Does it>> not matter to you that he tried to overthrow an election and obstruct>> the peaceful transfer of power? That is the bedrock of our democracy,>> and Trump reminds us of how fragile it can be. The vast majority of the>> electorate saw through his bluff, bluster and bullshit in the 2020>> election and rightfully voted him out of office. For better or worse>> Biden was the only choice. For that we can thank the feckless>> Republican party who stood by their flawed candidate while the ship was>> burning.I guess where we differ is in the Trump's alleged attempt to>> overthrow an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of power. I>> really don'tthink that the events of Jan 6th was as serious or>> threatening to thethe country as the media and the Jan 6 commission is>> trying to make itout to be. I also distinctly recall Trump calling for a>> "peaceful"demonstration .... not a riot or attempt to take over the>> government.He's not the first by any means. His style is unique for>> sure andmay be inappropriate but I seem to remember a guy named Gore>> contestingan election for months and, more recently, a woman named>> Hillary who,to this day, still contends that the 2016 election was>> "stolen" fromher.-- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.https://www.avg.com> > To WayneTrump is the root of all evil. He seems obliviius to the> civil unrest, crime, graft, corruption, and the ship of state is> rudderless. All the can say is we're watching and we're doing all> we can. My question is what are they trying to do to our country,> and why? Constitution no good.Lets rewrite it. Supreme court no> good. Lets pack it or get rid of it. Nobody should suffer jail> time. Go out and buy an electric car NOW. It doesn't matter that> we dont have infrostructure to support it. Borders dont matter.> Hunter Biden is the smartest person Sleepy Joe knows.> > Im going to celebrate independence day anyway. My flags are coming> down tomorrow until the next event worth celebrating.If you, herring, and bilious bill had any talent, you could revive theNairobi Trio and appear to be more clever than any of you are. https://youtu.be/5-tFyBLo71U-- Lock Trump Up
>
> Clever is not the guy in Maryland who suffered two bankruptcies,
> countless loan and tax defaults, hasn't held down an honest job
> since his Clown college days, abandoned his family, lies about
> everything in order to impress Donnie. Keeps a shotgun behind his
> front door because he's afraid of the boogy man. Claims to be
> married but can't verify it. Says he lost a couple a hundred
> pounds but cant verify it. Says he's owned yachts but cant verify
> it. Doesn't own any property on record. In other words, a
> complete loser.
> --
> lets go Brandon...
>
>
> ----Android NewsGroup Reader----
> https://piaohong.s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/usenet/index.html

True North <princecraft49@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r
> On Monday, 4 July 2022 at 12:37:33 UTC-3, Bill wrote:> Justan Ohlphart <m...@yourservice.com> wrote: > > Keyser Soze <keyse...@whitehouse.com> Wrote in message:r > >> Justan Ohlphart <m...@yourservice.com> wrote:> "Mr. Luddite" > >> <not...@noland.com> Wrote in message:r>> On 7/3/2022 3:19 PM, > >> waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:> On Sunday,>> July 3, 2022 at > >> 7:00:11 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:>> On 7/2/2022 4:53 PM,>> > >> waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:>>> On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at > >> 4:16:22>> PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>> On Sat, 2 Jul 2022 > >> 07:39:53 -0400,>> "Mr. Luddite" <not...@noland.com>>>>> wrote:>>>>> On > >> 7/1/2022 4:58 PM,>> gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 > >> 11:56:20 -0700 (PDT),>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" > >> <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>> On>> Friday, July 1, 2022 at > >> 2:27:15 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 > >> 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT),>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com">> > >> <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >From an op-ed article > >> by>> Mick Mulvaney in USA Today: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's quite likely > >> that>> Trump attempted to obstruct justice, whi
ch may turn out to be the > >> most>> serious, and most provable crime he committed according to Mick>> > >> Mulvaney, Director of the Office of Management and Budget; White House>> > >> Chief of Staff.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Per Mulvaney, such claims are the>> > >> threat Trump should be most worried about.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He also>> > >> described a former White House aide's Tuesday testimony as "eminently>> > >> credible.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The former acting White House chief of>> > >> staff Mick Mulvaney wrote on Wednesday that in his view the real > >> threat>> to former President Donald Trump was evidence that might lead > >> to>> accusations of obstruction of justice.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney > >> wrote>> that he had previously defended the former president against > >> claims that>> he did "anything illegal or criminal" in relation to the > >> Capitol riot.>> He said he was having difficulty maintaining that > >> position, however,>> particularly after Hutchinson's testimony, which he > >> said he found>> "eminently credible.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Because after > >> some of the>> bombshells that got dropped in that hearing, my guess is > >> that things>> could get very dark fo
r the former president," Mulvaney>> > >> wrote.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney also said, though, that Tuesday's>> > >> hearing revealed one real threat to Trump that didn't hinge on>> > >> Hutchinson's words or credibility. "It is the one that jumped out at>> > >> me," he wrote. "And it is the one that should most worry the former>> > >> president.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He referred to the evidence presented by>> > >> Rep. Liz Cheney of Wyoming toward the end of the hearing consisting of>> > >> two messages that January 6 panel witnesses said they received before>> > >> giving their depositions. The messages included allusions to being a>> > >> "team player" to "stay in the good graces in Trump world" as well as a>> > >> reminder that Trump read transcripts of interviews.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >> Mulvaney said that the implication behind displaying the messages > >> during>> the hearing was "crystal clear.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The Jan. 6 > >> committee>> members believe they have evidence that people within the > >> Trump>> operation attempted to intimidate witnesses," Mulvaney wrote. > >> "And that,>> any way you slice it, is obstruction of justice.">>>>>>>> > >> What do you>> want to be
t, if Trump said he wasn't running in 2024, > >> this>>>>>>>> whole>> witch hunt evaporates. De Santis may be taking that > >> option away>>>>>>>>>> from him anyway.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ===>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >> witch-hunt>>>>>>>>> /?wiCH ?h?nt/>>>>>>> nounhistorical>>>>>>> noun: > >> witch-hunt; plural>> noun: witch-hunts; noun: witchhunt; plural noun:>> > >> witchhunts>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a) search for and subsequent persecution of a>> > >> supposed witch.>>>>>>> b) informal: a campaign directed against a > >> person>> or group holding unorthodox or unpopular views.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I > >> take>> some exception to your use of "witch-hunt" because of its > >> implication of>> a search for something that isn't real. In my mind, and > >> the mind of many>> others, Trump's criminality is very real. The > >> question is how best to>> prove it, and how best to punish it. I'm not > >> sure it's enough to just>> keep him from running in 2024 but that's a > >> good start. I'd like to see>> his cult mystique with the right win > >> sector of the Republican party>> totally annihilated so that we never > >> have to deal with his toxic influence>> again.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The > >> whole process bothers me. E
ven you admit,>> the whole exercise is>>>>>> > >> designed to prevent him from running again>> (two impeachments, > >> one>>>>>> after he left office and now you are>> hanging your hat on the > >> 14th>>>>>> amendment)>>>>>> Isn't this supposed>> to be up to the > >> voters?>>>>>> Why are you folks so afraid of open and free>> > >> elections?>>>>>> I would much prefer that he simply gets clobbered in>> > >> the primaries by>>>>>> margins too great to protest. De Santis is>> > >> already chipping away at>>>>>> his base.>>>>>> I still believe the > >> risks>> of trying to charge this guy over bullshit>>>>>> and the social > >> upheaval>> it might cause is not worth the risk for the>>>>>> slim > >> chance you can>> get any kind of conviction by 2024.>>>>>> The court > >> would still be>> hearing motions by then.>>>>>> I mentioned before, Cruz > >> is still in>> court for a school shooting in>>>>>> 2018 and it was a > >> slam dunk against>> a kid with few resources to>>>>>> present a > >> defense.>>>>>> Trump may be>> a piece of shit but he is a rich piece of > >> shit who has>>>>>> always been>> surrounded by lawyers.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >> Even Biden the Bozo isn't blaming>> Trump for
much anymore.>>>>> It's > >> all "Russia, Russia, Russia".>>>>>> Biden has to be a little careful or > >> someone will point out Russia>> was>>>> pretty quiet on Trump's watch. > >> They got frisky during Obama's>> watch>>>> and started a war on Biden's > >> watch.>>>>>> ===>>>>>> Putin had>> Trump right where he wanted him and > >> didn't want to upset the balance.>>>>>>>> > >> https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/cc2560c/2147483647/strip/false/crop/3259x2423+0+0/resize/1486x1105!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fbrightspot%2F5d%2F6e%2F99f75ab4481499aab953bee3ff59%2Fcolor-edit-toon-trump-on-nato-and-russia.jpg>>>> > >> Cute.>>>> It's obvious you have an intense dislike for Trump which > >> is>>>> understandable. Based on your many posts about him, your>> > >> dislike goes>> back a long ways ... back when he was in>> private > >> business and well>> before he ran for and won the>> Presidency.>>>> But, > >> if you can put that>> intense dislike and bias aside for>> a moment, do > >> you really feel the>> USA is in better positions>> and conditions, > >> economically, domestically>> and globally>> today compared to four years >
>> ago?.>> -- > > ===> > The>> seeds of inflation were planted on Trump's > >> watch with the Quantitative>> Easing program. It helped to keep the > >> economy afloat during the Covid>> crisis but now were paying the price. > >> The same can be said for the>> global supply chain crisis. Could Trump > >> have done anything about it if>> still in office? Frankly I doubt it. > >> He would have done a good job of>> blaming it on someone else however. > >> That's his special talent. Does it>> not matter to you that he tried to > >> overthrow an election and obstruct>> the peaceful transfer of power? > >> That is the bedrock of our democracy,>> and Trump reminds us of how > >> fragile it can be. The vast majority of the>> electorate saw through > >> his bluff, bluster and bullshit in the 2020>> election and rightfully > >> voted him out of office. For better or worse>> Biden was the only > >> choice. For that we can thank the feckless>> Republican party who stood > >> by their flawed candidate while the ship was>> burning.I guess where we > >> differ is in the Trump's alleged attempt to>> overthrow an election and > >> obstruct the peaceful transfer of power. I>> really don'tthink that
the > >> events of Jan 6th was as serious or>> threatening to thethe country as > >> the media and the Jan 6 commission is>> trying to make itout to be. I > >> also distinctly recall Trump calling for a>> "peaceful"demonstration > >> .... not a riot or attempt to take over the>> government.He's not the > >> first by any means. His style is unique for>> sure andmay be > >> inappropriate but I seem to remember a guy named Gore>> contestingan > >> election for months and, more recently, a woman named>> Hillary who,to > >> this day, still contends that the 2016 election was>> "stolen" > >> fromher.-- This email has been checked for viruses by > >> AVG.https://www.avg.com> > To WayneTrump is the root of all evil. He > >> seems obliviius to the> civil unrest, crime, graft, corruption, and the > >> ship of state is> rudderless. All the can say is we're watching and > >> we're doing all> we can. My question is what are they trying to do to > >> our country,> and why? Constitution no good.Lets rewrite it. Supreme > >> court no> good. Lets pack it or get rid of it. Nobody should suffer > >> jail> time. Go out and buy an electric car NOW. It doesn't matter that> > >> we dont have infrostruc
ture to support it. Borders dont matter.> > >> Hunter Biden is the smartest person Sleepy Joe knows.> > Im going to > >> celebrate independence day anyway. My flags are coming> down tomorrow > >> until the next event worth celebrating.If you, herring, and bilious bill > >> had any talent, you could revive theNairobi Trio and appear to be more > >> clever than any of you are. https://youtu.be/5-tFyBLo71U-- Lock Trump Up > > > > Clever is not the guy in Maryland who suffered two bankruptcies, > > countless loan and tax defaults, hasn't held down an honest job > > since his Clown college days, abandoned his family, lies about > > everything in order to impress Donnie. Keeps a shotgun behind his > > front door because he's afraid of the boogy man. Claims to be > > married but can't verify it. Says he lost a couple a hundred > > pounds but cant verify it. Says he's owned yachts but cant verify > > it. Doesn't own any property on record. In other words, a > > complete loser.> As Donnie says: I agree completely with this post.Donnie who, Swill?Not what I say.

True North <princecraft49@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r
> On Monday, 4 July 2022 at 12:23:09 UTC-3, Justan Ohlphart wrote:> Keyser Soze <keyse...@whitehouse.com> Wrote in message:r > > Justan Ohlphart <m...@yourservice.com> wrote:> "Mr. Luddite" <not...@noland.com> Wrote in message:r>> On 7/3/2022 3:19 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:> On Sunday,>> July 3, 2022 at 7:00:11 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:>> On 7/2/2022 4:53 PM,>> waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:>>> On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at 4:16:22>> PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>> On Sat, 2 Jul 2022 07:39:53 -0400,>> "Mr. Luddite" <not...@noland.com>>>>> wrote:>>>>> On 7/1/2022 4:58 PM,>> gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 11:56:20 -0700 (PDT),>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>> On>> Friday, July 1, 2022 at 2:27:15 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT),>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com">> <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >From an op-ed article by>> Mick Mulvaney in USA Today: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's quite likely that>> Trump attempted to obstruct justice, which may turn out to be the most>> serious, and most provable crime he committed according to Mick>> Mulvaney, D
irector of the Office of Management and Budget; White House>> Chief of Staff.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Per Mulvaney, such claims are the>> threat Trump should be most worried about.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He also>> described a former White House aide's Tuesday testimony as "eminently>> credible.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The former acting White House chief of>> staff Mick Mulvaney wrote on Wednesday that in his view the real threat>> to former President Donald Trump was evidence that might lead to>> accusations of obstruction of justice.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney wrote>> that he had previously defended the former president against claims that>> he did "anything illegal or criminal" in relation to the Capitol riot.>> He said he was having difficulty maintaining that position, however,>> particularly after Hutchinson's testimony, which he said he found>> "eminently credible.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Because after some of the>> bombshells that got dropped in that hearing, my guess is that things>> could get very dark for the former president," Mulvaney>> wrote.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney also said, though, that Tuesday's>> hearing revealed one real threat to Trump that didn't hinge on>> Hutchinson's words
or credibility. "It is the one that jumped out at>> me," he wrote. "And it is the one that should most worry the former>> president.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He referred to the evidence presented by>> Rep. Liz Cheney of Wyoming toward the end of the hearing consisting of>> two messages that January 6 panel witnesses said they received before>> giving their depositions. The messages included allusions to being a>> "team player" to "stay in the good graces in Trump world" as well as a>> reminder that Trump read transcripts of interviews.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney said that the implication behind displaying the messages during>> the hearing was "crystal clear.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The Jan. 6 committee>> members believe they have evidence that people within the Trump>> operation attempted to intimidate witnesses," Mulvaney wrote. "And that,>> any way you slice it, is obstruction of justice.">>>>>>>> What do you>> want to bet, if Trump said he wasn't running in 2024, this>>>>>>>> whole>> witch hunt evaporates. De Santis may be taking that option away>>>>>>>>>> from him anyway.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ===>>>>>>>>>>>>>> witch-hunt>>>>>>>>> /?wiCH ?h?nt/>>>>>>> nounhistorical>>>>>>> noun: witch-hunt; p
lural>> noun: witch-hunts; noun: witchhunt; plural noun:>> witchhunts>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a) search for and subsequent persecution of a>> supposed witch.>>>>>>> b) informal: a campaign directed against a person>> or group holding unorthodox or unpopular views.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I take>> some exception to your use of "witch-hunt" because of its implication of>> a search for something that isn't real. In my mind, and the mind of many>> others, Trump's criminality is very real. The question is how best to>> prove it, and how best to punish it. I'm not sure it's enough to just>> keep him from running in 2024 but that's a good start. I'd like to see>> his cult mystique with the right win sector of the Republican party>> totally annihilated so that we never have to deal with his toxic influence>> again.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The whole process bothers me. Even you admit,>> the whole exercise is>>>>>> designed to prevent him from running again>> (two impeachments, one>>>>>> after he left office and now you are>> hanging your hat on the 14th>>>>>> amendment)>>>>>> Isn't this supposed>> to be up to the voters?>>>>>> Why are you folks so afraid of open and free>> elections?>>>>>> I would much prefer that
he simply gets clobbered in>> the primaries by>>>>>> margins too great to protest. De Santis is>> already chipping away at>>>>>> his base.>>>>>> I still believe the risks>> of trying to charge this guy over bullshit>>>>>> and the social upheaval>> it might cause is not worth the risk for the>>>>>> slim chance you can>> get any kind of conviction by 2024.>>>>>> The court would still be>> hearing motions by then.>>>>>> I mentioned before, Cruz is still in>> court for a school shooting in>>>>>> 2018 and it was a slam dunk against>> a kid with few resources to>>>>>> present a defense.>>>>>> Trump may be>> a piece of shit but he is a rich piece of shit who has>>>>>> always been>> surrounded by lawyers.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Even Biden the Bozo isn't blaming>> Trump for much anymore.>>>>> It's all "Russia, Russia, Russia".>>>>>> Biden has to be a little careful or someone will point out Russia>> was>>>> pretty quiet on Trump's watch. They got frisky during Obama's>> watch>>>> and started a war on Biden's watch.>>>>>> ===>>>>>> Putin had>> Trump right where he wanted him and didn't want to upset the balance.>>>>>>>> https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/cc2560c/2147483647/strip/false/crop/3
259x2423+0+0/resize/1486x1105!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fbrightspot%2F5d%2F6e%2F99f75ab4481499aab953bee3ff59%2Fcolor-edit-toon-trump-on-nato-and-russia.jpg>>>> Cute.>>>> It's obvious you have an intense dislike for Trump which is>>>> understandable. Based on your many posts about him, your>> dislike goes>> back a long ways ... back when he was in>> private business and well>> before he ran for and won the>> Presidency.>>>> But, if you can put that>> intense dislike and bias aside for>> a moment, do you really feel the>> USA is in better positions>> and conditions, economically, domestically>> and globally>> today compared to four years ago?.>> -- > > ===> > The>> seeds of inflation were planted on Trump's watch with the Quantitative>> Easing program. It helped to keep the economy afloat during the Covid>> crisis but now were paying the price. The same can be said for the>> global supply chain crisis. Could Trump have done anything about it if>> still in office? Frankly I doubt it. He would have done a good job of>> blaming it on someone else however. That's his special talent. Does it>> not matter to you that he tried to o
verthrow an election and obstruct>> the peaceful transfer of power? That is the bedrock of our democracy,>> and Trump reminds us of how fragile it can be. The vast majority of the>> electorate saw through his bluff, bluster and bullshit in the 2020>> election and rightfully voted him out of office. For better or worse>> Biden was the only choice. For that we can thank the feckless>> Republican party who stood by their flawed candidate while the ship was>> burning.I guess where we differ is in the Trump's alleged attempt to>> overthrow an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of power. I>> really don'tthink that the events of Jan 6th was as serious or>> threatening to thethe country as the media and the Jan 6 commission is>> trying to make itout to be. I also distinctly recall Trump calling for a>> "peaceful"demonstration .... not a riot or attempt to take over the>> government.He's not the first by any means. His style is unique for>> sure andmay be inappropriate but I seem to remember a guy named Gore>> contestingan election for months and, more recently, a woman named>> Hillary who,to this day, still contends that the 2016 election was>> "stolen" fromher.-- This email has
been checked for viruses by AVG.https://www.avg.com> > To WayneTrump is the root of all evil. He seems obliviius to the> civil unrest, crime, graft, corruption, and the ship of state is> rudderless. All the can say is we're watching and we're doing all> we can. My question is what are they trying to do to our country,> and why? Constitution no good.Lets rewrite it. Supreme court no> good. Lets pack it or get rid of it. Nobody should suffer jail> time. Go out and buy an electric car NOW. It doesn't matter that> we dont have infrostructure to support it. Borders dont matter.> Hunter Biden is the smartest person Sleepy Joe knows.> > Im going to celebrate independence day anyway. My flags are coming> down tomorrow until the next event worth celebrating.If you, herring, and bilious bill had any talent, you could revive theNairobi Trio and appear to be more clever than any of you are. https://youtu.be/5-tFyBLo71U-- Lock Trump Up > > Clever is not the guy in Maryland who suffered two bankruptcies, > countless loan and tax defaults, hasn't held down an honest job > since his Clown college days, abandoned his family, lies about > everything in order to impress Donnie. Keeps a shotgun behin
d his > front door because he's afraid of the boogy man. Claims to be > married but can't verify it. Says he lost a couple a hundred > pounds but cant verify it. Says he's owned yachts but cant verify > it. Doesn't own any property on record. In other words, a > complete loser.> -- > lets go Brandon... > > > ----Android NewsGroup Reader---- > https://piaohong.s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/usenet/index.html"a couple a hundred pounds" ??Want to repeat that in proper English, Justine.

On Mon, 4 Jul 2022 06:42:39 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
wrote:

>On 7/3/2022 2:32 PM, Justan Ohlphart wrote:
>> Keyser Söze <KeyserSöze@whitehouse.com> Wrote in message:r
>>> On 7/3/22 7:00 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:>> > But, if you can put that intense dislike and bias aside for> a moment, do you really feel the USA is in better positions> and conditions, economically, domestically and globally> today compared to four years ago?.Trump has ramped up the amount of hatred in this country, but Biden has
worked to relieve that, and he certainly has improved our alliances with our allies. It is going to take years if not decades to get the Supreme Court back to the middle. The economy is a mixed bag.-- * I just want to find 11,780 votes... *
>>
>
>
>> Bydone has done zilch to unifu the country. He's alienated just
>> about everyone but AOC. He's afraid of that bartender.
>
>Even AOC has Biden on her shit list for "doing nothing" about
>recent Supreme Court decisions. She wants to either impeach
>them or do away with the SCOTUS completely.

People do not seem to recognize what the SCOTUS does. It is not ruling
on the moral implications of the case or even what the public thinks
is right. They only read the Constitution and enforce what it says.
Roberts is only one of the justices over the years who have said the
rest is a legislative issue, not a Constitutional one.
In the case of Dobbs and abortion, I simply have to point to the Civil
Rights Act of 1964. Congress granted rights that were not spelled out
in the Constitution and if they had the votes, they could do the same
with abortion. That is why Schumer wants to kill the filibuster.
Somebody needs to point out to him, if he did, the next time the pro
life folks hold 50%+1 in the house and senate, they could repeal that
law.

On Mon, 4 Jul 2022 06:55:57 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
wrote:

>On 7/3/2022 8:01 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>> On Sun, 3 Jul 2022 12:19:49 -0700 (PDT),
>> "waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com" <wayne.beardsley@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Sunday, July 3, 2022 at 7:00:11 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
>>>> On 7/2/2022 4:53 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>>> On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at 4:16:22 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>> On Sat, 2 Jul 2022 07:39:53 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <not...@noland.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 7/1/2022 4:58 PM, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 11:56:20 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Friday, July 1, 2022 at 2:27:15 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> >From an op-ed article by Mick Mulvaney in USA Today:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> It's quite likely that Trump attempted to obstruct justice, which may turn out to be the most serious, and most provable crime he committed according to Mick Mulvaney, Director of the Office of Management and Budget; White House Chief of Staff.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Per Mulvaney, such claims are the threat Trump should be most worried about.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> He also described a former White House aide's Tuesday testimony as "eminently credible."
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The former acting White House chief of staff Mick Mulvaney wrote on Wednesday that in his view the real threat to former President Donald Trump was evidence that might lead to accusations of obstruction of justice.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney wrote that he had previously defended the former president against claims that he did "anything illegal or criminal" in relation to the Capitol riot. He said he was having difficulty maintaining that position, however, particularly after Hutchinson's testimony, which he said he found "eminently credible."
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> "Because after some of the bombshells that got dropped in that hearing, my guess is that things could get very dark for the former president," Mulvaney wrote.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney also said, though, that Tuesday's hearing revealed one real threat to Trump that didn't hinge on Hutchinson's words or credibility. "It is the one that jumped out at me," he wrote. "And it is the one that should most worry the former president."
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> He referred to the evidence presented by Rep. Liz Cheney of Wyoming toward the end of the hearing consisting of two messages that January 6 panel witnesses said they received before giving their depositions. The messages included allusions to being a "team player" to "stay in the good graces in Trump world" as well as a reminder that Trump read transcripts of interviews.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney said that the implication behind displaying the messages during the hearing was "crystal clear."
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> "The Jan. 6 committee members believe they have evidence that people within the Trump operation attempted to intimidate witnesses," Mulvaney wrote. "And that, any way you slice it, is obstruction of justice."
>>>>>>>>>> What do you want to bet, if Trump said he wasn't running in 2024, this
>>>>>>>>>> whole witch hunt evaporates. De Santis may be taking that option away
>>>>>>>>>> from him anyway.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ===
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> witch-hunt
>>>>>>>>> /?wiCH ?h?nt/
>>>>>>>>> nounhistorical
>>>>>>>>> noun: witch-hunt; plural noun: witch-hunts; noun: witchhunt; plural noun: witchhunts
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> a) search for and subsequent persecution of a supposed witch.
>>>>>>>>> b) informal: a campaign directed against a person or group holding unorthodox or unpopular views.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I take some exception to your use of "witch-hunt" because of its implication of a search for something that isn't real. In my mind, and the mind of many others, Trump's criminality is very real. The question is how best to prove it, and how best to punish it. I'm not sure it's enough to just keep him from running in 2024 but that's a good start. I'd like to see his cult mystique with the right win sector of the Republican party totally annihilated so that we never have to deal with his toxic influence again.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The whole process bothers me. Even you admit, the whole exercise is
>>>>>>>> designed to prevent him from running again (two impeachments, one
>>>>>>>> after he left office and now you are hanging your hat on the 14th
>>>>>>>> amendment)
>>>>>>>> Isn't this supposed to be up to the voters?
>>>>>>>> Why are you folks so afraid of open and free elections?
>>>>>>>> I would much prefer that he simply gets clobbered in the primaries by
>>>>>>>> margins too great to protest. De Santis is already chipping away at
>>>>>>>> his base.
>>>>>>>> I still believe the risks of trying to charge this guy over bullshit
>>>>>>>> and the social upheaval it might cause is not worth the risk for the
>>>>>>>> slim chance you can get any kind of conviction by 2024.
>>>>>>>> The court would still be hearing motions by then.
>>>>>>>> I mentioned before, Cruz is still in court for a school shooting in
>>>>>>>> 2018 and it was a slam dunk against a kid with few resources to
>>>>>>>> present a defense.
>>>>>>>> Trump may be a piece of shit but he is a rich piece of shit who has
>>>>>>>> always been surrounded by lawyers.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Even Biden the Bozo isn't blaming Trump for much anymore.
>>>>>>> It's all "Russia, Russia, Russia".
>>>>>> Biden has to be a little careful or someone will point out Russia was
>>>>>> pretty quiet on Trump's watch. They got frisky during Obama's watch
>>>>>> and started a war on Biden's watch.
>>>>>
>>>>> ===
>>>>>
>>>>> Putin had Trump right where he wanted him and didn't want to upset the balance.
>>>>>
>>>>> https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/cc2560c/2147483647/strip/false/crop/3259x2423+0+0/resize/1486x1105!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fbrightspot%2F5d%2F6e%2F99f75ab4481499aab953bee3ff59%2Fcolor-edit-toon-trump-on-nato-and-russia.jpg
>>>> Cute.
>>>>
>>>> It's obvious you have an intense dislike for Trump which is
>>>> understandable. Based on your many posts about him, your
>>>> dislike goes back a long ways ... back when he was in
>>>> private business and well before he ran for and won the
>>>> Presidency.
>>>>
>>>> But, if you can put that intense dislike and bias aside for
>>>> a moment, do you really feel the USA is in better positions
>>>> and conditions, economically, domestically and globally
>>>> today compared to four years ago?.
>>>> --
>>>
>>> ===
>>>
>>> The seeds of inflation were planted on Trump's watch with the Quantitative Easing program. It helped to keep the economy afloat during the Covid crisis but now were paying the price. The same can be said for the global supply chain crisis. Could Trump have done anything about it if still in office? Frankly I doubt it. He would have done a good job of blaming it on someone else however. That's his special talent. Does it not matter to you that he tried to overthrow an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of power? That is the bedrock of our democracy, and Trump reminds us of how fragile it can be. The vast majority of the electorate saw through his bluff, bluster and bullshit in the 2020 election and rightfully voted him out of office. For better or worse Biden was the only choice. For that we can thank the feckless Republican party who stood by their flawed candidate while the ship was burning.
>>
>
>
>> The Obama fiscal policy rewarded his rich contributors, bankers and
>> Wall Street but it left the middle class suffering. The more we hear
>> about who actually got the money the more pissed people are. They are
>> really just scratching the surface of the massive fraud with a few
>> small timers who got charged. The big players who raked in millions
>> and padded their bottom line with it, like airlines are still free to
>> do it again.
>>
>
>I have a hunch that history will record the Obama/Biden years as being
>the most corrupt in modern times.

On Mon, 4 Jul 2022 14:58:04 -0000 (UTC), Keyser Soze
<keysersoze@whitehouse.com> wrote:

>> To WayneTrump is the root of all evil. He seems obliviius to the
>> civil unrest, crime, graft, corruption, and the ship of state is
>> rudderless. All the can say is we're watching and we're doing all
>> we can. My question is what are they trying to do to our country,
>> and why? Constitution no good.Lets rewrite it. Supreme court no
>> good. Lets pack it or get rid of it. Nobody should suffer jail
>> time. Go out and buy an electric car NOW. It doesn't matter that
>> we dont have infrostructure to support it. Borders dont matter.
>> Hunter Biden is the smartest person Sleepy Joe knows.
>>
>> Im going to celebrate independence day anyway. My flags are coming
>> down tomorrow until the next event worth celebrating.
>
>If you, herring, and bilious bill had any talent, you could revive the
>Nairobi Trio and appear to be more clever than any of you are.
>https://youtu.be/5-tFyBLo71U

"That's not a baby kicking, Karen dear, it's just a fetus!"

John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:
> On Mon, 4 Jul 2022 14:58:04 -0000 (UTC), Keyser Soze
> <keysersoze@whitehouse.com> wrote:
>
>
>>> To WayneTrump is the root of all evil. He seems obliviius to the
>>> civil unrest, crime, graft, corruption, and the ship of state is
>>> rudderless. All the can say is we're watching and we're doing all
>>> we can. My question is what are they trying to do to our country,
>>> and why? Constitution no good.Lets rewrite it. Supreme court no
>>> good. Lets pack it or get rid of it. Nobody should suffer jail
>>> time. Go out and buy an electric car NOW. It doesn't matter that
>>> we dont have infrostructure to support it. Borders dont matter.
>>> Hunter Biden is the smartest person Sleepy Joe knows.
>>>
>>> Im going to celebrate independence day anyway. My flags are coming
>>> down tomorrow until the next event worth celebrating.
>>
>> If you, herring, and bilious bill had any talent, you could revive the
>> Nairobi Trio and appear to be more clever than any of you are.
>> https://youtu.be/5-tFyBLo71U
>
>
> "That's not a baby kicking, Karen dear, it's just a fetus!"
>

I guess a lack of talent allows us to be still be married to our first
wife, not ever declaring bankruptcy, let alone twice. Talk about talent,
Harry. Yours seems to be to live of others work.

On Monday, July 4, 2022 at 6:53:06 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
> On 7/3/2022 3:19 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > On Sunday, July 3, 2022 at 7:00:11 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
> >> On 7/2/2022 4:53 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:
> >>> On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at 4:16:22 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
> >>>> On Sat, 2 Jul 2022 07:39:53 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <not...@noland.com>
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>>> On 7/1/2022 4:58 PM, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
> >>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 11:56:20 -0700 (PDT),
> >>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> On Friday, July 1, 2022 at 2:27:15 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
> >>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT),
> >>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> >From an op-ed article by Mick Mulvaney in USA Today:
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> It's quite likely that Trump attempted to obstruct justice, which may turn out to be the most serious, and most provable crime he committed according to Mick Mulvaney, Director of the Office of Management and Budget; White House Chief of Staff.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Per Mulvaney, such claims are the threat Trump should be most worried about.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> He also described a former White House aide's Tuesday testimony as "eminently credible."
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> The former acting White House chief of staff Mick Mulvaney wrote on Wednesday that in his view the real threat to former President Donald Trump was evidence that might lead to accusations of obstruction of justice..
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Mulvaney wrote that he had previously defended the former president against claims that he did "anything illegal or criminal" in relation to the Capitol riot. He said he was having difficulty maintaining that position, however, particularly after Hutchinson's testimony, which he said he found "eminently credible."
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> "Because after some of the bombshells that got dropped in that hearing, my guess is that things could get very dark for the former president," Mulvaney wrote.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Mulvaney also said, though, that Tuesday's hearing revealed one real threat to Trump that didn't hinge on Hutchinson's words or credibility. "It is the one that jumped out at me," he wrote. "And it is the one that should most worry the former president."
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> He referred to the evidence presented by Rep. Liz Cheney of Wyoming toward the end of the hearing consisting of two messages that January 6 panel witnesses said they received before giving their depositions. The messages included allusions to being a "team player" to "stay in the good graces in Trump world" as well as a reminder that Trump read transcripts of interviews.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Mulvaney said that the implication behind displaying the messages during the hearing was "crystal clear."
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> "The Jan. 6 committee members believe they have evidence that people within the Trump operation attempted to intimidate witnesses," Mulvaney wrote. "And that, any way you slice it, is obstruction of justice."
> >>>>>>>> What do you want to bet, if Trump said he wasn't running in 2024, this
> >>>>>>>> whole witch hunt evaporates. De Santis may be taking that option away
> >>>>>>>> from him anyway.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> ===
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> witch-hunt
> >>>>>>> /?wiCH ?h?nt/
> >>>>>>> nounhistorical
> >>>>>>> noun: witch-hunt; plural noun: witch-hunts; noun: witchhunt; plural noun: witchhunts
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> a) search for and subsequent persecution of a supposed witch.
> >>>>>>> b) informal: a campaign directed against a person or group holding unorthodox or unpopular views.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> I take some exception to your use of "witch-hunt" because of its implication of a search for something that isn't real. In my mind, and the mind of many others, Trump's criminality is very real. The question is how best to prove it, and how best to punish it. I'm not sure it's enough to just keep him from running in 2024 but that's a good start. I'd like to see his cult mystique with the right win sector of the Republican party totally annihilated so that we never have to deal with his toxic influence again.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> The whole process bothers me. Even you admit, the whole exercise is
> >>>>>> designed to prevent him from running again (two impeachments, one
> >>>>>> after he left office and now you are hanging your hat on the 14th
> >>>>>> amendment)
> >>>>>> Isn't this supposed to be up to the voters?
> >>>>>> Why are you folks so afraid of open and free elections?
> >>>>>> I would much prefer that he simply gets clobbered in the primaries by
> >>>>>> margins too great to protest. De Santis is already chipping away at
> >>>>>> his base.
> >>>>>> I still believe the risks of trying to charge this guy over bullshit
> >>>>>> and the social upheaval it might cause is not worth the risk for the
> >>>>>> slim chance you can get any kind of conviction by 2024.
> >>>>>> The court would still be hearing motions by then.
> >>>>>> I mentioned before, Cruz is still in court for a school shooting in
> >>>>>> 2018 and it was a slam dunk against a kid with few resources to
> >>>>>> present a defense.
> >>>>>> Trump may be a piece of shit but he is a rich piece of shit who has
> >>>>>> always been surrounded by lawyers.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Even Biden the Bozo isn't blaming Trump for much anymore.
> >>>>> It's all "Russia, Russia, Russia".
> >>>> Biden has to be a little careful or someone will point out Russia was
> >>>> pretty quiet on Trump's watch. They got frisky during Obama's watch
> >>>> and started a war on Biden's watch.
> >>>
> >>> ===
> >>>
> >>> Putin had Trump right where he wanted him and didn't want to upset the balance.
> >>>
> >>> https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/cc2560c/2147483647/strip/false/crop/3259x2423+0+0/resize/1486x1105!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fbrightspot%2F5d%2F6e%2F99f75ab4481499aab953bee3ff59%2Fcolor-edit-toon-trump-on-nato-and-russia.jpg
> >> Cute.
> >>
> >> It's obvious you have an intense dislike for Trump which is
> >> understandable. Based on your many posts about him, your
> >> dislike goes back a long ways ... back when he was in
> >> private business and well before he ran for and won the
> >> Presidency.
> >>
> >> But, if you can put that intense dislike and bias aside for
> >> a moment, do you really feel the USA is in better positions
> >> and conditions, economically, domestically and globally
> >> today compared to four years ago?.
> >> --
> >
> > ===
> >
> > The seeds of inflation were planted on Trump's watch with the Quantitative Easing program. It helped to keep the economy afloat during the Covid crisis but now were paying the price. The same can be said for the global supply chain crisis. Could Trump have done anything about it if still in office? Frankly I doubt it. He would have done a good job of blaming it on someone else however. That's his special talent. Does it not matter to you that he tried to overthrow an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of power? That is the bedrock of our democracy, and Trump reminds us of how fragile it can be. The vast majority of the electorate saw through his bluff, bluster and bullshit in the 2020 election and rightfully voted him out of office. For better or worse Biden was the only choice. For that we can thank the feckless Republican party who stood by their flawed candidate while the ship was burning.
> I guess where we differ is in the Trump's alleged attempt to overthrow
> an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of power. I really don't
> think that the events of Jan 6th was as serious or threatening to the
> the country as the media and the Jan 6 commission is trying to make it
> out to be. I also distinctly recall Trump calling for a "peaceful"
> demonstration .... not a riot or attempt to take over the government.
>
> He's not the first by any means. His style is unique for sure and
> may be inappropriate but I seem to remember a guy named Gore contesting
> an election for months and, more recently, a woman named Hillary who,
> to this day, still contends that the 2016 election was "stolen" from
> her.
> --
> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> https://www.avg.com

On 7/4/2022 4:02 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
> On Mon, 4 Jul 2022 06:55:57 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On 7/3/2022 8:01 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>>> On Sun, 3 Jul 2022 12:19:49 -0700 (PDT),
>>> "waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com" <wayne.beardsley@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Sunday, July 3, 2022 at 7:00:11 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
>>>>> On 7/2/2022 4:53 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>>>> On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at 4:16:22 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>> On Sat, 2 Jul 2022 07:39:53 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <not...@noland.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 7/1/2022 4:58 PM, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 11:56:20 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Friday, July 1, 2022 at 2:27:15 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> >From an op-ed article by Mick Mulvaney in USA Today:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> It's quite likely that Trump attempted to obstruct justice, which may turn out to be the most serious, and most provable crime he committed according to Mick Mulvaney, Director of the Office of Management and Budget; White House Chief of Staff.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Per Mulvaney, such claims are the threat Trump should be most worried about.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> He also described a former White House aide's Tuesday testimony as "eminently credible."
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> The former acting White House chief of staff Mick Mulvaney wrote on Wednesday that in his view the real threat to former President Donald Trump was evidence that might lead to accusations of obstruction of justice.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney wrote that he had previously defended the former president against claims that he did "anything illegal or criminal" in relation to the Capitol riot. He said he was having difficulty maintaining that position, however, particularly after Hutchinson's testimony, which he said he found "eminently credible."
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> "Because after some of the bombshells that got dropped in that hearing, my guess is that things could get very dark for the former president," Mulvaney wrote.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney also said, though, that Tuesday's hearing revealed one real threat to Trump that didn't hinge on Hutchinson's words or credibility. "It is the one that jumped out at me," he wrote. "And it is the one that should most worry the former president."
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> He referred to the evidence presented by Rep. Liz Cheney of Wyoming toward the end of the hearing consisting of two messages that January 6 panel witnesses said they received before giving their depositions. The messages included allusions to being a "team player" to "stay in the good graces in Trump world" as well as a reminder that Trump read transcripts of interviews.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney said that the implication behind displaying the messages during the hearing was "crystal clear."
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> "The Jan. 6 committee members believe they have evidence that people within the Trump operation attempted to intimidate witnesses," Mulvaney wrote. "And that, any way you slice it, is obstruction of justice."
>>>>>>>>>>> What do you want to bet, if Trump said he wasn't running in 2024, this
>>>>>>>>>>> whole witch hunt evaporates. De Santis may be taking that option away
>>>>>>>>>>> from him anyway.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> ===
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> witch-hunt
>>>>>>>>>> /?wiCH ?h?nt/
>>>>>>>>>> nounhistorical
>>>>>>>>>> noun: witch-hunt; plural noun: witch-hunts; noun: witchhunt; plural noun: witchhunts
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> a) search for and subsequent persecution of a supposed witch.
>>>>>>>>>> b) informal: a campaign directed against a person or group holding unorthodox or unpopular views.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I take some exception to your use of "witch-hunt" because of its implication of a search for something that isn't real. In my mind, and the mind of many others, Trump's criminality is very real. The question is how best to prove it, and how best to punish it. I'm not sure it's enough to just keep him from running in 2024 but that's a good start. I'd like to see his cult mystique with the right win sector of the Republican party totally annihilated so that we never have to deal with his toxic influence again.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The whole process bothers me. Even you admit, the whole exercise is
>>>>>>>>> designed to prevent him from running again (two impeachments, one
>>>>>>>>> after he left office and now you are hanging your hat on the 14th
>>>>>>>>> amendment)
>>>>>>>>> Isn't this supposed to be up to the voters?
>>>>>>>>> Why are you folks so afraid of open and free elections?
>>>>>>>>> I would much prefer that he simply gets clobbered in the primaries by
>>>>>>>>> margins too great to protest. De Santis is already chipping away at
>>>>>>>>> his base.
>>>>>>>>> I still believe the risks of trying to charge this guy over bullshit
>>>>>>>>> and the social upheaval it might cause is not worth the risk for the
>>>>>>>>> slim chance you can get any kind of conviction by 2024.
>>>>>>>>> The court would still be hearing motions by then.
>>>>>>>>> I mentioned before, Cruz is still in court for a school shooting in
>>>>>>>>> 2018 and it was a slam dunk against a kid with few resources to
>>>>>>>>> present a defense.
>>>>>>>>> Trump may be a piece of shit but he is a rich piece of shit who has
>>>>>>>>> always been surrounded by lawyers.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Even Biden the Bozo isn't blaming Trump for much anymore.
>>>>>>>> It's all "Russia, Russia, Russia".
>>>>>>> Biden has to be a little careful or someone will point out Russia was
>>>>>>> pretty quiet on Trump's watch. They got frisky during Obama's watch
>>>>>>> and started a war on Biden's watch.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ===
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Putin had Trump right where he wanted him and didn't want to upset the balance.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/cc2560c/2147483647/strip/false/crop/3259x2423+0+0/resize/1486x1105!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fbrightspot%2F5d%2F6e%2F99f75ab4481499aab953bee3ff59%2Fcolor-edit-toon-trump-on-nato-and-russia.jpg
>>>>> Cute.
>>>>>
>>>>> It's obvious you have an intense dislike for Trump which is
>>>>> understandable. Based on your many posts about him, your
>>>>> dislike goes back a long ways ... back when he was in
>>>>> private business and well before he ran for and won the
>>>>> Presidency.
>>>>>
>>>>> But, if you can put that intense dislike and bias aside for
>>>>> a moment, do you really feel the USA is in better positions
>>>>> and conditions, economically, domestically and globally
>>>>> today compared to four years ago?.
>>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> ===
>>>>
>>>> The seeds of inflation were planted on Trump's watch with the Quantitative Easing program. It helped to keep the economy afloat during the Covid crisis but now were paying the price. The same can be said for the global supply chain crisis. Could Trump have done anything about it if still in office? Frankly I doubt it. He would have done a good job of blaming it on someone else however. That's his special talent. Does it not matter to you that he tried to overthrow an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of power? That is the bedrock of our democracy, and Trump reminds us of how fragile it can be. The vast majority of the electorate saw through his bluff, bluster and bullshit in the 2020 election and rightfully voted him out of office. For better or worse Biden was the only choice. For that we can thank the feckless Republican party who stood by their flawed candidate while the ship was burning.
>>>
>>
>>
>>> The Obama fiscal policy rewarded his rich contributors, bankers and
>>> Wall Street but it left the middle class suffering. The more we hear
>>> about who actually got the money the more pissed people are. They are
>>> really just scratching the surface of the massive fraud with a few
>>> small timers who got charged. The big players who raked in millions
>>> and padded their bottom line with it, like airlines are still free to
>>> do it again.
>>>
>>
>> I have a hunch that history will record the Obama/Biden years as being
>> the most corrupt in modern times.
>
> I would put the stick in the dirt when GHWB took office and we have
> suffered from bad leadership since. That is both on the corporate and
> government side. The corporations adopted a 90 day window for their
> decision making, just trying to make good quarterly numbers, not
> really building anything and they were supported by the same mentality
> in Washington. It was all about how Wall Street is doing with no real
> concern with how things are going on Main Street, what we do next year
> or how we will ever service the debt they incurred. The Democrats
> embraced Rubin, Summers, Geithner and Greenspan more than the
> Republicans.
> We can complain about the American oligarchs like Jobs, Bezos and Musk
> but at least they were building things.
> Musk and Bezos are pretty frustrated with the government too.

On 7/5/2022 3:23 AM, Richard Grew wrote:
> On Monday, July 4, 2022 at 6:53:06 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
>> On 7/3/2022 3:19 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>> On Sunday, July 3, 2022 at 7:00:11 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
>>>> On 7/2/2022 4:53 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>>> On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at 4:16:22 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>> On Sat, 2 Jul 2022 07:39:53 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <not...@noland.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 7/1/2022 4:58 PM, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 11:56:20 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Friday, July 1, 2022 at 2:27:15 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> >From an op-ed article by Mick Mulvaney in USA Today:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> It's quite likely that Trump attempted to obstruct justice, which may turn out to be the most serious, and most provable crime he committed according to Mick Mulvaney, Director of the Office of Management and Budget; White House Chief of Staff.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Per Mulvaney, such claims are the threat Trump should be most worried about.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> He also described a former White House aide's Tuesday testimony as "eminently credible."
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The former acting White House chief of staff Mick Mulvaney wrote on Wednesday that in his view the real threat to former President Donald Trump was evidence that might lead to accusations of obstruction of justice.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney wrote that he had previously defended the former president against claims that he did "anything illegal or criminal" in relation to the Capitol riot. He said he was having difficulty maintaining that position, however, particularly after Hutchinson's testimony, which he said he found "eminently credible."
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> "Because after some of the bombshells that got dropped in that hearing, my guess is that things could get very dark for the former president," Mulvaney wrote.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney also said, though, that Tuesday's hearing revealed one real threat to Trump that didn't hinge on Hutchinson's words or credibility. "It is the one that jumped out at me," he wrote. "And it is the one that should most worry the former president."
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> He referred to the evidence presented by Rep. Liz Cheney of Wyoming toward the end of the hearing consisting of two messages that January 6 panel witnesses said they received before giving their depositions. The messages included allusions to being a "team player" to "stay in the good graces in Trump world" as well as a reminder that Trump read transcripts of interviews.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney said that the implication behind displaying the messages during the hearing was "crystal clear."
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> "The Jan. 6 committee members believe they have evidence that people within the Trump operation attempted to intimidate witnesses," Mulvaney wrote. "And that, any way you slice it, is obstruction of justice."
>>>>>>>>>> What do you want to bet, if Trump said he wasn't running in 2024, this
>>>>>>>>>> whole witch hunt evaporates. De Santis may be taking that option away
>>>>>>>>>> from him anyway.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ===
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> witch-hunt
>>>>>>>>> /?wiCH ?h?nt/
>>>>>>>>> nounhistorical
>>>>>>>>> noun: witch-hunt; plural noun: witch-hunts; noun: witchhunt; plural noun: witchhunts
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> a) search for and subsequent persecution of a supposed witch.
>>>>>>>>> b) informal: a campaign directed against a person or group holding unorthodox or unpopular views.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I take some exception to your use of "witch-hunt" because of its implication of a search for something that isn't real. In my mind, and the mind of many others, Trump's criminality is very real. The question is how best to prove it, and how best to punish it. I'm not sure it's enough to just keep him from running in 2024 but that's a good start. I'd like to see his cult mystique with the right win sector of the Republican party totally annihilated so that we never have to deal with his toxic influence again.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The whole process bothers me. Even you admit, the whole exercise is
>>>>>>>> designed to prevent him from running again (two impeachments, one
>>>>>>>> after he left office and now you are hanging your hat on the 14th
>>>>>>>> amendment)
>>>>>>>> Isn't this supposed to be up to the voters?
>>>>>>>> Why are you folks so afraid of open and free elections?
>>>>>>>> I would much prefer that he simply gets clobbered in the primaries by
>>>>>>>> margins too great to protest. De Santis is already chipping away at
>>>>>>>> his base.
>>>>>>>> I still believe the risks of trying to charge this guy over bullshit
>>>>>>>> and the social upheaval it might cause is not worth the risk for the
>>>>>>>> slim chance you can get any kind of conviction by 2024.
>>>>>>>> The court would still be hearing motions by then.
>>>>>>>> I mentioned before, Cruz is still in court for a school shooting in
>>>>>>>> 2018 and it was a slam dunk against a kid with few resources to
>>>>>>>> present a defense.
>>>>>>>> Trump may be a piece of shit but he is a rich piece of shit who has
>>>>>>>> always been surrounded by lawyers.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Even Biden the Bozo isn't blaming Trump for much anymore.
>>>>>>> It's all "Russia, Russia, Russia".
>>>>>> Biden has to be a little careful or someone will point out Russia was
>>>>>> pretty quiet on Trump's watch. They got frisky during Obama's watch
>>>>>> and started a war on Biden's watch.
>>>>>
>>>>> ===
>>>>>
>>>>> Putin had Trump right where he wanted him and didn't want to upset the balance.
>>>>>
>>>>> https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/cc2560c/2147483647/strip/false/crop/3259x2423+0+0/resize/1486x1105!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fbrightspot%2F5d%2F6e%2F99f75ab4481499aab953bee3ff59%2Fcolor-edit-toon-trump-on-nato-and-russia.jpg
>>>> Cute.
>>>>
>>>> It's obvious you have an intense dislike for Trump which is
>>>> understandable. Based on your many posts about him, your
>>>> dislike goes back a long ways ... back when he was in
>>>> private business and well before he ran for and won the
>>>> Presidency.
>>>>
>>>> But, if you can put that intense dislike and bias aside for
>>>> a moment, do you really feel the USA is in better positions
>>>> and conditions, economically, domestically and globally
>>>> today compared to four years ago?.
>>>> --
>>>
>>> ===
>>>
>>> The seeds of inflation were planted on Trump's watch with the Quantitative Easing program. It helped to keep the economy afloat during the Covid crisis but now were paying the price. The same can be said for the global supply chain crisis. Could Trump have done anything about it if still in office? Frankly I doubt it. He would have done a good job of blaming it on someone else however. That's his special talent. Does it not matter to you that he tried to overthrow an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of power? That is the bedrock of our democracy, and Trump reminds us of how fragile it can be. The vast majority of the electorate saw through his bluff, bluster and bullshit in the 2020 election and rightfully voted him out of office. For better or worse Biden was the only choice. For that we can thank the feckless Republican party who stood by their flawed candidate while the ship was burning.
>> I guess where we differ is in the Trump's alleged attempt to overthrow
>> an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of power. I really don't
>> think that the events of Jan 6th was as serious or threatening to the
>> the country as the media and the Jan 6 commission is trying to make it
>> out to be. I also distinctly recall Trump calling for a "peaceful"
>> demonstration .... not a riot or attempt to take over the government.
>>
>> He's not the first by any means. His style is unique for sure and
>> may be inappropriate but I seem to remember a guy named Gore contesting
>> an election for months and, more recently, a woman named Hillary who,
>> to this day, still contends that the 2016 election was "stolen" from
>> her.
>> --
>> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
>> https://www.avg.com
>
> She also tried to get electors to switch their votes and 7 actually did switch from Trump in 2016. It's OK for democrats to try but not republicans.

On Tue, 5 Jul 2022 07:13:31 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
wrote:

>On 7/4/2022 4:02 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>> On Mon, 4 Jul 2022 06:55:57 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On 7/3/2022 8:01 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 3 Jul 2022 12:19:49 -0700 (PDT),
>>>> "waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com" <wayne.beardsley@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Sunday, July 3, 2022 at 7:00:11 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
>>>>>> On 7/2/2022 4:53 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>>>>> On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at 4:16:22 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Sat, 2 Jul 2022 07:39:53 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <not...@noland.com>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 7/1/2022 4:58 PM, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 11:56:20 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Friday, July 1, 2022 at 2:27:15 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> >From an op-ed article by Mick Mulvaney in USA Today:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's quite likely that Trump attempted to obstruct justice, which may turn out to be the most serious, and most provable crime he committed according to Mick Mulvaney, Director of the Office of Management and Budget; White House Chief of Staff.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Per Mulvaney, such claims are the threat Trump should be most worried about.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> He also described a former White House aide's Tuesday testimony as "eminently credible."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> The former acting White House chief of staff Mick Mulvaney wrote on Wednesday that in his view the real threat to former President Donald Trump was evidence that might lead to accusations of obstruction of justice.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney wrote that he had previously defended the former president against claims that he did "anything illegal or criminal" in relation to the Capitol riot. He said he was having difficulty maintaining that position, however, particularly after Hutchinson's testimony, which he said he found "eminently credible."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Because after some of the bombshells that got dropped in that hearing, my guess is that things could get very dark for the former president," Mulvaney wrote.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney also said, though, that Tuesday's hearing revealed one real threat to Trump that didn't hinge on Hutchinson's words or credibility. "It is the one that jumped out at me," he wrote. "And it is the one that should most worry the former president."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> He referred to the evidence presented by Rep. Liz Cheney of Wyoming toward the end of the hearing consisting of two messages that January 6 panel witnesses said they received before giving their depositions. The messages included allusions to being a "team player" to "stay in the good graces in Trump world" as well as a reminder that Trump read transcripts of interviews.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney said that the implication behind displaying the messages during the hearing was "crystal clear."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The Jan. 6 committee members believe they have evidence that people within the Trump operation attempted to intimidate witnesses," Mulvaney wrote. "And that, any way you slice it, is obstruction of justice."
>>>>>>>>>>>> What do you want to bet, if Trump said he wasn't running in 2024, this
>>>>>>>>>>>> whole witch hunt evaporates. De Santis may be taking that option away
>>>>>>>>>>>> from him anyway.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ===
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> witch-hunt
>>>>>>>>>>> /?wiCH ?h?nt/
>>>>>>>>>>> nounhistorical
>>>>>>>>>>> noun: witch-hunt; plural noun: witch-hunts; noun: witchhunt; plural noun: witchhunts
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> a) search for and subsequent persecution of a supposed witch.
>>>>>>>>>>> b) informal: a campaign directed against a person or group holding unorthodox or unpopular views.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I take some exception to your use of "witch-hunt" because of its implication of a search for something that isn't real. In my mind, and the mind of many others, Trump's criminality is very real. The question is how best to prove it, and how best to punish it. I'm not sure it's enough to just keep him from running in 2024 but that's a good start. I'd like to see his cult mystique with the right win sector of the Republican party totally annihilated so that we never have to deal with his toxic influence again.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The whole process bothers me. Even you admit, the whole exercise is
>>>>>>>>>> designed to prevent him from running again (two impeachments, one
>>>>>>>>>> after he left office and now you are hanging your hat on the 14th
>>>>>>>>>> amendment)
>>>>>>>>>> Isn't this supposed to be up to the voters?
>>>>>>>>>> Why are you folks so afraid of open and free elections?
>>>>>>>>>> I would much prefer that he simply gets clobbered in the primaries by
>>>>>>>>>> margins too great to protest. De Santis is already chipping away at
>>>>>>>>>> his base.
>>>>>>>>>> I still believe the risks of trying to charge this guy over bullshit
>>>>>>>>>> and the social upheaval it might cause is not worth the risk for the
>>>>>>>>>> slim chance you can get any kind of conviction by 2024.
>>>>>>>>>> The court would still be hearing motions by then.
>>>>>>>>>> I mentioned before, Cruz is still in court for a school shooting in
>>>>>>>>>> 2018 and it was a slam dunk against a kid with few resources to
>>>>>>>>>> present a defense.
>>>>>>>>>> Trump may be a piece of shit but he is a rich piece of shit who has
>>>>>>>>>> always been surrounded by lawyers.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Even Biden the Bozo isn't blaming Trump for much anymore.
>>>>>>>>> It's all "Russia, Russia, Russia".
>>>>>>>> Biden has to be a little careful or someone will point out Russia was
>>>>>>>> pretty quiet on Trump's watch. They got frisky during Obama's watch
>>>>>>>> and started a war on Biden's watch.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ===
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Putin had Trump right where he wanted him and didn't want to upset the balance.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/cc2560c/2147483647/strip/false/crop/3259x2423+0+0/resize/1486x1105!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fbrightspot%2F5d%2F6e%2F99f75ab4481499aab953bee3ff59%2Fcolor-edit-toon-trump-on-nato-and-russia.jpg
>>>>>> Cute.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's obvious you have an intense dislike for Trump which is
>>>>>> understandable. Based on your many posts about him, your
>>>>>> dislike goes back a long ways ... back when he was in
>>>>>> private business and well before he ran for and won the
>>>>>> Presidency.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But, if you can put that intense dislike and bias aside for
>>>>>> a moment, do you really feel the USA is in better positions
>>>>>> and conditions, economically, domestically and globally
>>>>>> today compared to four years ago?.
>>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>> ===
>>>>>
>>>>> The seeds of inflation were planted on Trump's watch with the Quantitative Easing program. It helped to keep the economy afloat during the Covid crisis but now were paying the price. The same can be said for the global supply chain crisis. Could Trump have done anything about it if still in office? Frankly I doubt it. He would have done a good job of blaming it on someone else however. That's his special talent. Does it not matter to you that he tried to overthrow an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of power? That is the bedrock of our democracy, and Trump reminds us of how fragile it can be. The vast majority of the electorate saw through his bluff, bluster and bullshit in the 2020 election and rightfully voted him out of office. For better or worse Biden was the only choice. For that we can thank the feckless Republican party who stood by their flawed candidate while the ship was burning.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> The Obama fiscal policy rewarded his rich contributors, bankers and
>>>> Wall Street but it left the middle class suffering. The more we hear
>>>> about who actually got the money the more pissed people are. They are
>>>> really just scratching the surface of the massive fraud with a few
>>>> small timers who got charged. The big players who raked in millions
>>>> and padded their bottom line with it, like airlines are still free to
>>>> do it again.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I have a hunch that history will record the Obama/Biden years as being
>>> the most corrupt in modern times.
>>
>> I would put the stick in the dirt when GHWB took office and we have
>> suffered from bad leadership since. That is both on the corporate and
>> government side. The corporations adopted a 90 day window for their
>> decision making, just trying to make good quarterly numbers, not
>> really building anything and they were supported by the same mentality
>> in Washington. It was all about how Wall Street is doing with no real
>> concern with how things are going on Main Street, what we do next year
>> or how we will ever service the debt they incurred. The Democrats
>> embraced Rubin, Summers, Geithner and Greenspan more than the
>> Republicans.
>> We can complain about the American oligarchs like Jobs, Bezos and Musk
>> but at least they were building things.
>> Musk and Bezos are pretty frustrated with the government too.
>
>When I think of corruption I am not thinking bad policies, etc.
>
>I am thinking corruption in the sense of using the power and
>influence of an elected office for personal financial gains.
>Biden is a perfect example of a smiling, career politician who has his
>hand out everywhere. Hunter's laptop will eventually do him in.
>
>I don't think GWB was corrupt in this sense. You can argue his
>policies but there's no evidence anywhere of him personally
>gaining by them financially, at least not by plan.
>
>This will irk Wayne and Harry but neither did Trump.

On 7/5/2022 11:02 AM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
> On Tue, 5 Jul 2022 07:13:31 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On 7/4/2022 4:02 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>>> On Mon, 4 Jul 2022 06:55:57 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 7/3/2022 8:01 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>>>>> On Sun, 3 Jul 2022 12:19:49 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>> "waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com" <wayne.beardsley@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sunday, July 3, 2022 at 7:00:11 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
>>>>>>> On 7/2/2022 4:53 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at 4:16:22 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 2 Jul 2022 07:39:53 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <not...@noland.com>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 7/1/2022 4:58 PM, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 11:56:20 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Friday, July 1, 2022 at 2:27:15 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>>>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> >From an op-ed article by Mick Mulvaney in USA Today:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's quite likely that Trump attempted to obstruct justice, which may turn out to be the most serious, and most provable crime he committed according to Mick Mulvaney, Director of the Office of Management and Budget; White House Chief of Staff.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Per Mulvaney, such claims are the threat Trump should be most worried about.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He also described a former White House aide's Tuesday testimony as "eminently credible."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The former acting White House chief of staff Mick Mulvaney wrote on Wednesday that in his view the real threat to former President Donald Trump was evidence that might lead to accusations of obstruction of justice.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney wrote that he had previously defended the former president against claims that he did "anything illegal or criminal" in relation to the Capitol riot. He said he was having difficulty maintaining that position, however, particularly after Hutchinson's testimony, which he said he found "eminently credible."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Because after some of the bombshells that got dropped in that hearing, my guess is that things could get very dark for the former president," Mulvaney wrote.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney also said, though, that Tuesday's hearing revealed one real threat to Trump that didn't hinge on Hutchinson's words or credibility. "It is the one that jumped out at me," he wrote. "And it is the one that should most worry the former president."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He referred to the evidence presented by Rep. Liz Cheney of Wyoming toward the end of the hearing consisting of two messages that January 6 panel witnesses said they received before giving their depositions. The messages included allusions to being a "team player" to "stay in the good graces in Trump world" as well as a reminder that Trump read transcripts of interviews.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney said that the implication behind displaying the messages during the hearing was "crystal clear."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The Jan. 6 committee members believe they have evidence that people within the Trump operation attempted to intimidate witnesses," Mulvaney wrote. "And that, any way you slice it, is obstruction of justice."
>>>>>>>>>>>>> What do you want to bet, if Trump said he wasn't running in 2024, this
>>>>>>>>>>>>> whole witch hunt evaporates. De Santis may be taking that option away
>>>>>>>>>>>>> from him anyway.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> ===
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> witch-hunt
>>>>>>>>>>>> /?wiCH ?h?nt/
>>>>>>>>>>>> nounhistorical
>>>>>>>>>>>> noun: witch-hunt; plural noun: witch-hunts; noun: witchhunt; plural noun: witchhunts
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> a) search for and subsequent persecution of a supposed witch.
>>>>>>>>>>>> b) informal: a campaign directed against a person or group holding unorthodox or unpopular views.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I take some exception to your use of "witch-hunt" because of its implication of a search for something that isn't real. In my mind, and the mind of many others, Trump's criminality is very real. The question is how best to prove it, and how best to punish it. I'm not sure it's enough to just keep him from running in 2024 but that's a good start. I'd like to see his cult mystique with the right win sector of the Republican party totally annihilated so that we never have to deal with his toxic influence again.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The whole process bothers me. Even you admit, the whole exercise is
>>>>>>>>>>> designed to prevent him from running again (two impeachments, one
>>>>>>>>>>> after he left office and now you are hanging your hat on the 14th
>>>>>>>>>>> amendment)
>>>>>>>>>>> Isn't this supposed to be up to the voters?
>>>>>>>>>>> Why are you folks so afraid of open and free elections?
>>>>>>>>>>> I would much prefer that he simply gets clobbered in the primaries by
>>>>>>>>>>> margins too great to protest. De Santis is already chipping away at
>>>>>>>>>>> his base.
>>>>>>>>>>> I still believe the risks of trying to charge this guy over bullshit
>>>>>>>>>>> and the social upheaval it might cause is not worth the risk for the
>>>>>>>>>>> slim chance you can get any kind of conviction by 2024.
>>>>>>>>>>> The court would still be hearing motions by then.
>>>>>>>>>>> I mentioned before, Cruz is still in court for a school shooting in
>>>>>>>>>>> 2018 and it was a slam dunk against a kid with few resources to
>>>>>>>>>>> present a defense.
>>>>>>>>>>> Trump may be a piece of shit but he is a rich piece of shit who has
>>>>>>>>>>> always been surrounded by lawyers.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Even Biden the Bozo isn't blaming Trump for much anymore.
>>>>>>>>>> It's all "Russia, Russia, Russia".
>>>>>>>>> Biden has to be a little careful or someone will point out Russia was
>>>>>>>>> pretty quiet on Trump's watch. They got frisky during Obama's watch
>>>>>>>>> and started a war on Biden's watch.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ===
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Putin had Trump right where he wanted him and didn't want to upset the balance.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/cc2560c/2147483647/strip/false/crop/3259x2423+0+0/resize/1486x1105!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fbrightspot%2F5d%2F6e%2F99f75ab4481499aab953bee3ff59%2Fcolor-edit-toon-trump-on-nato-and-russia.jpg
>>>>>>> Cute.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It's obvious you have an intense dislike for Trump which is
>>>>>>> understandable. Based on your many posts about him, your
>>>>>>> dislike goes back a long ways ... back when he was in
>>>>>>> private business and well before he ran for and won the
>>>>>>> Presidency.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But, if you can put that intense dislike and bias aside for
>>>>>>> a moment, do you really feel the USA is in better positions
>>>>>>> and conditions, economically, domestically and globally
>>>>>>> today compared to four years ago?.
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ===
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The seeds of inflation were planted on Trump's watch with the Quantitative Easing program. It helped to keep the economy afloat during the Covid crisis but now were paying the price. The same can be said for the global supply chain crisis. Could Trump have done anything about it if still in office? Frankly I doubt it. He would have done a good job of blaming it on someone else however. That's his special talent. Does it not matter to you that he tried to overthrow an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of power? That is the bedrock of our democracy, and Trump reminds us of how fragile it can be. The vast majority of the electorate saw through his bluff, bluster and bullshit in the 2020 election and rightfully voted him out of office. For better or worse Biden was the only choice. For that we can thank the feckless Republican party who stood by their flawed candidate while the ship was burning.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> The Obama fiscal policy rewarded his rich contributors, bankers and
>>>>> Wall Street but it left the middle class suffering. The more we hear
>>>>> about who actually got the money the more pissed people are. They are
>>>>> really just scratching the surface of the massive fraud with a few
>>>>> small timers who got charged. The big players who raked in millions
>>>>> and padded their bottom line with it, like airlines are still free to
>>>>> do it again.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I have a hunch that history will record the Obama/Biden years as being
>>>> the most corrupt in modern times.
>>>
>>> I would put the stick in the dirt when GHWB took office and we have
>>> suffered from bad leadership since. That is both on the corporate and
>>> government side. The corporations adopted a 90 day window for their
>>> decision making, just trying to make good quarterly numbers, not
>>> really building anything and they were supported by the same mentality
>>> in Washington. It was all about how Wall Street is doing with no real
>>> concern with how things are going on Main Street, what we do next year
>>> or how we will ever service the debt they incurred. The Democrats
>>> embraced Rubin, Summers, Geithner and Greenspan more than the
>>> Republicans.
>>> We can complain about the American oligarchs like Jobs, Bezos and Musk
>>> but at least they were building things.
>>> Musk and Bezos are pretty frustrated with the government too.
>>
>> When I think of corruption I am not thinking bad policies, etc.
>>
>> I am thinking corruption in the sense of using the power and
>> influence of an elected office for personal financial gains.
>> Biden is a perfect example of a smiling, career politician who has his
>> hand out everywhere. Hunter's laptop will eventually do him in.
>>
>> I don't think GWB was corrupt in this sense. You can argue his
>> policies but there's no evidence anywhere of him personally
>> gaining by them financially, at least not by plan.
>>
>> This will irk Wayne and Harry but neither did Trump.
>

On 7/5/22 7:13 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
> On 7/4/2022 4:02 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>> On Mon, 4 Jul 2022 06:55:57 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On 7/3/2022 8:01 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 3 Jul 2022 12:19:49 -0700 (PDT),
>>>> "waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com" <wayne.beardsley@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Sunday, July 3, 2022 at 7:00:11 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
>>>>>> On 7/2/2022 4:53 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>>>>> On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at 4:16:22 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Sat, 2 Jul 2022 07:39:53 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
>>>>>>>> <not...@noland.com>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 7/1/2022 4:58 PM, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 11:56:20 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Friday, July 1, 2022 at 2:27:15 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com
>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> >From an op-ed article by Mick Mulvaney in USA Today:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's quite likely that Trump attempted to obstruct justice,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> which may turn out to be the most serious, and most
>>>>>>>>>>>>> provable crime he committed according to Mick Mulvaney,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Director of the Office of Management and Budget; White
>>>>>>>>>>>>> House Chief of Staff.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Per Mulvaney, such claims are the threat Trump should be
>>>>>>>>>>>>> most worried about.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> He also described a former White House aide's Tuesday
>>>>>>>>>>>>> testimony as "eminently credible."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> The former acting White House chief of staff Mick Mulvaney
>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote on Wednesday that in his view the real threat to
>>>>>>>>>>>>> former President Donald Trump was evidence that might lead
>>>>>>>>>>>>> to accusations of obstruction of justice.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney wrote that he had previously defended the former
>>>>>>>>>>>>> president against claims that he did "anything illegal or
>>>>>>>>>>>>> criminal" in relation to the Capitol riot. He said he was
>>>>>>>>>>>>> having difficulty maintaining that position, however,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> particularly after Hutchinson's testimony, which he said he
>>>>>>>>>>>>> found "eminently credible."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Because after some of the bombshells that got dropped in
>>>>>>>>>>>>> that hearing, my guess is that things could get very dark
>>>>>>>>>>>>> for the former president," Mulvaney wrote.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney also said, though, that Tuesday's hearing revealed
>>>>>>>>>>>>> one real threat to Trump that didn't hinge on Hutchinson's
>>>>>>>>>>>>> words or credibility. "It is the one that jumped out at
>>>>>>>>>>>>> me," he wrote. "And it is the one that should most worry
>>>>>>>>>>>>> the former president."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> He referred to the evidence presented by Rep. Liz Cheney of
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Wyoming toward the end of the hearing consisting of two
>>>>>>>>>>>>> messages that January 6 panel witnesses said they received
>>>>>>>>>>>>> before giving their depositions. The messages included
>>>>>>>>>>>>> allusions to being a "team player" to "stay in the good
>>>>>>>>>>>>> graces in Trump world" as well as a reminder that Trump
>>>>>>>>>>>>> read transcripts of interviews.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney said that the implication behind displaying the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> messages during the hearing was "crystal clear."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The Jan. 6 committee members believe they have evidence
>>>>>>>>>>>>> that people within the Trump operation attempted to
>>>>>>>>>>>>> intimidate witnesses," Mulvaney wrote. "And that, any way
>>>>>>>>>>>>> you slice it, is obstruction of justice."
>>>>>>>>>>>> What do you want to bet, if Trump said he wasn't running in
>>>>>>>>>>>> 2024, this
>>>>>>>>>>>> whole witch hunt evaporates. De Santis may be taking that
>>>>>>>>>>>> option away
>>>>>>>>>>>> from him anyway.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ===
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> witch-hunt
>>>>>>>>>>> /?wiCH ?h?nt/
>>>>>>>>>>> nounhistorical
>>>>>>>>>>> noun: witch-hunt; plural noun: witch-hunts; noun: witchhunt;
>>>>>>>>>>> plural noun: witchhunts
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> a) search for and subsequent persecution of a supposed witch.
>>>>>>>>>>> b) informal: a campaign directed against a person or group
>>>>>>>>>>> holding unorthodox or unpopular views.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I take some exception to your use of "witch-hunt" because of
>>>>>>>>>>> its implication of a search for something that isn't real. In
>>>>>>>>>>> my mind, and the mind of many others, Trump's criminality is
>>>>>>>>>>> very real. The question is how best to prove it, and how best
>>>>>>>>>>> to punish it. I'm not sure it's enough to just keep him from
>>>>>>>>>>> running in 2024 but that's a good start. I'd like to see his
>>>>>>>>>>> cult mystique with the right win sector of the Republican
>>>>>>>>>>> party totally annihilated so that we never have to deal with
>>>>>>>>>>> his toxic influence again.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The whole process bothers me. Even you admit, the whole
>>>>>>>>>> exercise is
>>>>>>>>>> designed to prevent him from running again (two impeachments, one
>>>>>>>>>> after he left office and now you are hanging your hat on the 14th
>>>>>>>>>> amendment)
>>>>>>>>>> Isn't this supposed to be up to the voters?
>>>>>>>>>> Why are you folks so afraid of open and free elections?
>>>>>>>>>> I would much prefer that he simply gets clobbered in the
>>>>>>>>>> primaries by
>>>>>>>>>> margins too great to protest. De Santis is already chipping
>>>>>>>>>> away at
>>>>>>>>>> his base.
>>>>>>>>>> I still believe the risks of trying to charge this guy over
>>>>>>>>>> bullshit
>>>>>>>>>> and the social upheaval it might cause is not worth the risk
>>>>>>>>>> for the
>>>>>>>>>> slim chance you can get any kind of conviction by 2024.
>>>>>>>>>> The court would still be hearing motions by then.
>>>>>>>>>> I mentioned before, Cruz is still in court for a school
>>>>>>>>>> shooting in
>>>>>>>>>> 2018 and it was a slam dunk against a kid with few resources to
>>>>>>>>>> present a defense.
>>>>>>>>>> Trump may be a piece of shit but he is a rich piece of shit
>>>>>>>>>> who has
>>>>>>>>>> always been surrounded by lawyers.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Even Biden the Bozo isn't blaming Trump for much anymore.
>>>>>>>>> It's all "Russia, Russia, Russia".
>>>>>>>> Biden has to be a little careful or someone will point out
>>>>>>>> Russia was
>>>>>>>> pretty quiet on Trump's watch. They got frisky during Obama's watch
>>>>>>>> and started a war on Biden's watch.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ===
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Putin had Trump right where he wanted him and didn't want to
>>>>>>> upset the balance.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/cc2560c/2147483647/strip/false/crop/3259x2423+0+0/resize/1486x1105!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fbrightspot%2F5d%2F6e%2F99f75ab4481499aab953bee3ff59%2Fcolor-edit-toon-trump-on-nato-and-russia.jpg
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cute.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's obvious you have an intense dislike for Trump which is
>>>>>> understandable. Based on your many posts about him, your
>>>>>> dislike goes back a long ways ... back when he was in
>>>>>> private business and well before he ran for and won the
>>>>>> Presidency.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But, if you can put that intense dislike and bias aside for
>>>>>> a moment, do you really feel the USA is in better positions
>>>>>> and conditions, economically, domestically and globally
>>>>>> today compared to four years ago?.
>>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>> ===
>>>>>
>>>>> The seeds of inflation were planted on Trump's watch with the
>>>>> Quantitative Easing program.  It helped to keep the economy afloat
>>>>> during the Covid crisis but now were paying the price.  The same
>>>>> can be said for the global supply chain crisis.  Could Trump have
>>>>> done anything about it if still in office?  Frankly I doubt it.  He
>>>>> would have done a good job of blaming it on someone else however.
>>>>> That's his special talent.  Does it not matter to you that he tried
>>>>> to overthrow an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of
>>>>> power?  That is the bedrock of our democracy, and Trump reminds us
>>>>> of how fragile it can be.  The vast majority of the electorate saw
>>>>> through his bluff, bluster and bullshit in the 2020 election and
>>>>> rightfully voted him out of office.  For better or worse Biden was
>>>>> the only choice.  For that we can thank the feckless Republican
>>>>> party who stood by their flawed candidate while the ship was burning.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> The Obama fiscal policy rewarded his rich contributors, bankers and
>>>> Wall Street but it left the middle class suffering. The more we hear
>>>> about who actually got the money the more pissed people are. They are
>>>> really just scratching the surface of the massive fraud with a few
>>>> small timers who got charged. The big players who raked in millions
>>>> and padded their bottom line with it, like airlines are still free to
>>>> do it again.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I have a hunch that history will record the Obama/Biden years as being
>>> the most corrupt in modern times.
>>
>> I would put the stick in the dirt when GHWB took office and we have
>> suffered from bad leadership since. That is both on the corporate and
>> government side. The corporations adopted a 90 day window for their
>> decision making, just trying to make good quarterly numbers, not
>> really building anything and they were supported by the same mentality
>> in Washington. It was all about how Wall Street is doing with no real
>> concern with how things are going on Main Street, what we do next year
>> or how we will ever service the debt they incurred. The Democrats
>> embraced Rubin, Summers, Geithner and Greenspan more than the
>> Republicans.
>> We can complain about the American oligarchs like Jobs, Bezos and Musk
>> but at least they were building things.
>> Musk and Bezos are pretty frustrated with the government too.
>
> When I think of corruption I am not thinking bad policies, etc.
>
> I am thinking corruption in the sense of using the power and
> influence of an elected office for personal financial gains.
> Biden is a perfect example of a smiling, career politician who has his
> hand out everywhere. Hunter's laptop will eventually do him in.
>
> I don't think GWB was corrupt in this sense.  You can argue his
> policies but there's no evidence anywhere of him personally
> gaining by them financially, at least not by plan.
>
> This will irk Wayne and Harry but neither did Trump.
>
Trump was the most corrupt POTUS in our history, and his adult children
are equally corrupt.
--
* I just want to find 11,780 votes... *

On 7/5/22 3:23 AM, Richard Grew wrote:
> On Monday, July 4, 2022 at 6:53:06 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
>> On 7/3/2022 3:19 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>> On Sunday, July 3, 2022 at 7:00:11 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
>>>> On 7/2/2022 4:53 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>>> On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at 4:16:22 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>> On Sat, 2 Jul 2022 07:39:53 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <not...@noland.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 7/1/2022 4:58 PM, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 11:56:20 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Friday, July 1, 2022 at 2:27:15 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> >From an op-ed article by Mick Mulvaney in USA Today:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> It's quite likely that Trump attempted to obstruct justice, which may turn out to be the most serious, and most provable crime he committed according to Mick Mulvaney, Director of the Office of Management and Budget; White House Chief of Staff.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Per Mulvaney, such claims are the threat Trump should be most worried about.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> He also described a former White House aide's Tuesday testimony as "eminently credible."
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The former acting White House chief of staff Mick Mulvaney wrote on Wednesday that in his view the real threat to former President Donald Trump was evidence that might lead to accusations of obstruction of justice.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney wrote that he had previously defended the former president against claims that he did "anything illegal or criminal" in relation to the Capitol riot. He said he was having difficulty maintaining that position, however, particularly after Hutchinson's testimony, which he said he found "eminently credible."
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> "Because after some of the bombshells that got dropped in that hearing, my guess is that things could get very dark for the former president," Mulvaney wrote.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney also said, though, that Tuesday's hearing revealed one real threat to Trump that didn't hinge on Hutchinson's words or credibility. "It is the one that jumped out at me," he wrote. "And it is the one that should most worry the former president."
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> He referred to the evidence presented by Rep. Liz Cheney of Wyoming toward the end of the hearing consisting of two messages that January 6 panel witnesses said they received before giving their depositions. The messages included allusions to being a "team player" to "stay in the good graces in Trump world" as well as a reminder that Trump read transcripts of interviews.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney said that the implication behind displaying the messages during the hearing was "crystal clear."
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> "The Jan. 6 committee members believe they have evidence that people within the Trump operation attempted to intimidate witnesses," Mulvaney wrote. "And that, any way you slice it, is obstruction of justice."
>>>>>>>>>> What do you want to bet, if Trump said he wasn't running in 2024, this
>>>>>>>>>> whole witch hunt evaporates. De Santis may be taking that option away
>>>>>>>>>> from him anyway.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ===
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> witch-hunt
>>>>>>>>> /?wiCH ?h?nt/
>>>>>>>>> nounhistorical
>>>>>>>>> noun: witch-hunt; plural noun: witch-hunts; noun: witchhunt; plural noun: witchhunts
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> a) search for and subsequent persecution of a supposed witch.
>>>>>>>>> b) informal: a campaign directed against a person or group holding unorthodox or unpopular views.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I take some exception to your use of "witch-hunt" because of its implication of a search for something that isn't real. In my mind, and the mind of many others, Trump's criminality is very real. The question is how best to prove it, and how best to punish it. I'm not sure it's enough to just keep him from running in 2024 but that's a good start. I'd like to see his cult mystique with the right win sector of the Republican party totally annihilated so that we never have to deal with his toxic influence again.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The whole process bothers me. Even you admit, the whole exercise is
>>>>>>>> designed to prevent him from running again (two impeachments, one
>>>>>>>> after he left office and now you are hanging your hat on the 14th
>>>>>>>> amendment)
>>>>>>>> Isn't this supposed to be up to the voters?
>>>>>>>> Why are you folks so afraid of open and free elections?
>>>>>>>> I would much prefer that he simply gets clobbered in the primaries by
>>>>>>>> margins too great to protest. De Santis is already chipping away at
>>>>>>>> his base.
>>>>>>>> I still believe the risks of trying to charge this guy over bullshit
>>>>>>>> and the social upheaval it might cause is not worth the risk for the
>>>>>>>> slim chance you can get any kind of conviction by 2024.
>>>>>>>> The court would still be hearing motions by then.
>>>>>>>> I mentioned before, Cruz is still in court for a school shooting in
>>>>>>>> 2018 and it was a slam dunk against a kid with few resources to
>>>>>>>> present a defense.
>>>>>>>> Trump may be a piece of shit but he is a rich piece of shit who has
>>>>>>>> always been surrounded by lawyers.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Even Biden the Bozo isn't blaming Trump for much anymore.
>>>>>>> It's all "Russia, Russia, Russia".
>>>>>> Biden has to be a little careful or someone will point out Russia was
>>>>>> pretty quiet on Trump's watch. They got frisky during Obama's watch
>>>>>> and started a war on Biden's watch.
>>>>>
>>>>> ===
>>>>>
>>>>> Putin had Trump right where he wanted him and didn't want to upset the balance.
>>>>>
>>>>> https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/cc2560c/2147483647/strip/false/crop/3259x2423+0+0/resize/1486x1105!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fbrightspot%2F5d%2F6e%2F99f75ab4481499aab953bee3ff59%2Fcolor-edit-toon-trump-on-nato-and-russia.jpg
>>>> Cute.
>>>>
>>>> It's obvious you have an intense dislike for Trump which is
>>>> understandable. Based on your many posts about him, your
>>>> dislike goes back a long ways ... back when he was in
>>>> private business and well before he ran for and won the
>>>> Presidency.
>>>>
>>>> But, if you can put that intense dislike and bias aside for
>>>> a moment, do you really feel the USA is in better positions
>>>> and conditions, economically, domestically and globally
>>>> today compared to four years ago?.
>>>> --
>>>
>>> ===
>>>
>>> The seeds of inflation were planted on Trump's watch with the Quantitative Easing program. It helped to keep the economy afloat during the Covid crisis but now were paying the price. The same can be said for the global supply chain crisis. Could Trump have done anything about it if still in office? Frankly I doubt it. He would have done a good job of blaming it on someone else however. That's his special talent. Does it not matter to you that he tried to overthrow an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of power? That is the bedrock of our democracy, and Trump reminds us of how fragile it can be. The vast majority of the electorate saw through his bluff, bluster and bullshit in the 2020 election and rightfully voted him out of office. For better or worse Biden was the only choice. For that we can thank the feckless Republican party who stood by their flawed candidate while the ship was burning.
>> I guess where we differ is in the Trump's alleged attempt to overthrow
>> an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of power. I really don't
>> think that the events of Jan 6th was as serious or threatening to the
>> the country as the media and the Jan 6 commission is trying to make it
>> out to be. I also distinctly recall Trump calling for a "peaceful"
>> demonstration .... not a riot or attempt to take over the government.
>>
>> He's not the first by any means. His style is unique for sure and
>> may be inappropriate but I seem to remember a guy named Gore contesting
>> an election for months and, more recently, a woman named Hillary who,
>> to this day, still contends that the 2016 election was "stolen" from
>> her.
>> --
>> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
>> https://www.avg.com
>
> She also tried to get electors to switch their votes and 7 actually did switch from Trump in 2016. It's OK for democrats to try but not republicans.

On 7/4/22 6:44 PM, Bill wrote:
> John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:
>> On Mon, 4 Jul 2022 14:58:04 -0000 (UTC), Keyser Soze
>> <keysersoze@whitehouse.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>> To WayneTrump is the root of all evil. He seems obliviius to the
>>>> civil unrest, crime, graft, corruption, and the ship of state is
>>>> rudderless. All the can say is we're watching and we're doing all
>>>> we can. My question is what are they trying to do to our country,
>>>> and why? Constitution no good.Lets rewrite it. Supreme court no
>>>> good. Lets pack it or get rid of it. Nobody should suffer jail
>>>> time. Go out and buy an electric car NOW. It doesn't matter that
>>>> we dont have infrostructure to support it. Borders dont matter.
>>>> Hunter Biden is the smartest person Sleepy Joe knows.
>>>>
>>>> Im going to celebrate independence day anyway. My flags are coming
>>>> down tomorrow until the next event worth celebrating.
>>>
>>> If you, herring, and bilious bill had any talent, you could revive the
>>> Nairobi Trio and appear to be more clever than any of you are.
>>> https://youtu.be/5-tFyBLo71U
>>
>>
>> "That's not a baby kicking, Karen dear, it's just a fetus!"
>>
>
> I guess a lack of talent allows us to be still be married to our first
> wife, not ever declaring bankruptcy, let alone twice. Talk about talent,
> Harry. Yours seems to be to live of others work.
>

You, Herring, and Justin couldn't win, place, or show in a race in which
there were no other horses. And wasn't Herring previously married?
Justin carefully keeps all the details of his life a big secret, and for
good reason. How far can he travel wearing that ankle bracelet? And all
three of you are boringly repetitive. Yawn.
+

--
* I just want to find 11,780 votes... *

Keyser Söze <KeyserSöze@whitehouse.com> Wrote in message:r
> On 7/5/22 7:13 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:> On 7/4/2022 4:02 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:>> On Mon, 4 Jul 2022 06:55:57 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>>> wrote:>>>>> On 7/3/2022 8:01 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:>>>> On Sun, 3 Jul 2022 12:19:49 -0700 (PDT),>>>> "waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com" <wayne.beardsley@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>> On Sunday, July 3, 2022 at 7:00:11 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:>>>>>> On 7/2/2022 4:53 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:>>>>>>> On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at 4:16:22 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com >>>>>>> wrote:>>>>>>>> On Sat, 2 Jul 2022 07:39:53 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" >>>>>>>> <not...@noland.com>>>>>>>>> wrote:>>>>>>>>> On 7/1/2022 4:58 PM, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 11:56:20 -0700 (PDT),>>>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Friday, July 1, 2022 at 2:27:15 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com >>>>>>>>>>> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT),>>>>>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >From an op-ed article by Mick Mulvaney in USA Today:>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's quite likely that Trump attempted to obst
ruct justice, >>>>>>>>>>>>> which may turn out to be the most serious, and most >>>>>>>>>>>>> provable crime he committed according to Mick Mulvaney, >>>>>>>>>>>>> Director of the Office of Management and Budget; White >>>>>>>>>>>>> House Chief of Staff.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Per Mulvaney, such claims are the threat Trump should be >>>>>>>>>>>>> most worried about.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He also described a former White House aide's Tuesday >>>>>>>>>>>>> testimony as "eminently credible.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The former acting White House chief of staff Mick Mulvaney >>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote on Wednesday that in his view the real threat to >>>>>>>>>>>>> former President Donald Trump was evidence that might lead >>>>>>>>>>>>> to accusations of obstruction of justice.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney wrote that he had previously defended the former >>>>>>>>>>>>> president against claims that he did "anything illegal or >>>>>>>>>>>>> criminal" in relation to the Capitol riot. He said he was >>>>>>>>>>>>> having difficulty maintaining that position, however, >>>>>>>>>>>>> particularly after Hutchinson's testimony, which he said he >>>>>>>>>>>>> found "eminently credible.">>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Because after some of the bombshells that got dropped in >>>>>>>>>>>>> that hearing, my guess is that things could get very dark >>>>>>>>>>>>> for the former president," Mulvaney wrote.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney also said, though, that Tuesday's hearing revealed >>>>>>>>>>>>> one real threat to Trump that didn't hinge on Hutchinson's >>>>>>>>>>>>> words or credibility. "It is the one that jumped out at >>>>>>>>>>>>> me," he wrote. "And it is the one that should most worry >>>>>>>>>>>>> the former president.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He referred to the evidence presented by Rep. Liz Cheney of >>>>>>>>>>>>> Wyoming toward the end of the hearing consisting of two >>>>>>>>>>>>> messages that January 6 panel witnesses said they received >>>>>>>>>>>>> before giving their depositions. The messages included >>>>>>>>>>>>> allusions to being a "team player" to "stay in the good >>>>>>>>>>>>> graces in Trump world" as well as a reminder that Trump >>>>>>>>>>>>> read transcripts of interviews.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney said that the implication behind displaying the >>>>>>>>>>>>> messages during the hearing was "crystal clear.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> "The Jan. 6 committee members believe they have evidence >>>>>>>>>>>>> that people within the Trump operation attempted to >>>>>>>>>>>>> intimidate witnesses," Mulvaney wrote. "And that, any way >>>>>>>>>>>>> you slice it, is obstruction of justice.">>>>>>>>>>>> What do you want to bet, if Trump said he wasn't running in >>>>>>>>>>>> 2024, this>>>>>>>>>>>> whole witch hunt evaporates. De Santis may be taking that >>>>>>>>>>>> option away>>>>>>>>>>>> from him anyway.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ===>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> witch-hunt>>>>>>>>>>> /?wiCH ?h?nt/>>>>>>>>>>> nounhistorical>>>>>>>>>>> noun: witch-hunt; plural noun: witch-hunts; noun: witchhunt; >>>>>>>>>>> plural noun: witchhunts>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a) search for and subsequent persecution of a supposed witch.>>>>>>>>>>> b) informal: a campaign directed against a person or group >>>>>>>>>>> holding unorthodox or unpopular views.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I take some exception to your use of "witch-hunt" because of >>>>>>>>>>> its implication of a search for something that isn't real. In >>>>>>>>>>> my mind, and the mind of many others, Trump's criminality is >>>>>>>>>>> very real. The question is how best to prove it, and how be
st >>>>>>>>>>> to punish it. I'm not sure it's enough to just keep him from >>>>>>>>>>> running in 2024 but that's a good start. I'd like to see his >>>>>>>>>>> cult mystique with the right win sector of the Republican >>>>>>>>>>> party totally annihilated so that we never have to deal with >>>>>>>>>>> his toxic influence again.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The whole process bothers me. Even you admit, the whole >>>>>>>>>> exercise is>>>>>>>>>> designed to prevent him from running again (two impeachments, one>>>>>>>>>> after he left office and now you are hanging your hat on the 14th>>>>>>>>>> amendment)>>>>>>>>>> Isn't this supposed to be up to the voters?>>>>>>>>>> Why are you folks so afraid of open and free elections?>>>>>>>>>> I would much prefer that he simply gets clobbered in the >>>>>>>>>> primaries by>>>>>>>>>> margins too great to protest. De Santis is already chipping >>>>>>>>>> away at>>>>>>>>>> his base.>>>>>>>>>> I still believe the risks of trying to charge this guy over >>>>>>>>>> bullshit>>>>>>>>>> and the social upheaval it might cause is not worth the risk >>>>>>>>>> for the>>>>>>>>>> slim chance you can get any kind of conviction by 2024.>>>>>>>>>> The court
would still be hearing motions by then.>>>>>>>>>> I mentioned before, Cruz is still in court for a school >>>>>>>>>> shooting in>>>>>>>>>> 2018 and it was a slam dunk against a kid with few resources to>>>>>>>>>> present a defense.>>>>>>>>>> Trump may be a piece of shit but he is a rich piece of shit >>>>>>>>>> who has>>>>>>>>>> always been surrounded by lawyers.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Even Biden the Bozo isn't blaming Trump for much anymore.>>>>>>>>> It's all "Russia, Russia, Russia".>>>>>>>> Biden has to be a little careful or someone will point out >>>>>>>> Russia was>>>>>>>> pretty quiet on Trump's watch. They got frisky during Obama's watch>>>>>>>> and started a war on Biden's watch.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ===>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Putin had Trump right where he wanted him and didn't want to >>>>>>> upset the balance.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/cc2560c/2147483647/strip/false/crop/3259x2423+0+0/resize/1486x1105!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fbrightspot%2F5d%2F6e%2F99f75ab4481499aab953bee3ff59%2Fcolor-edit-toon-trump-on-nato-and-russia.jpg >>>>>>>>>>>>> Cute.>>>>>>>>>>>> It's obvious you have an intense disl
ike for Trump which is>>>>>> understandable. Based on your many posts about him, your>>>>>> dislike goes back a long ways ... back when he was in>>>>>> private business and well before he ran for and won the>>>>>> Presidency.>>>>>>>>>>>> But, if you can put that intense dislike and bias aside for>>>>>> a moment, do you really feel the USA is in better positions>>>>>> and conditions, economically, domestically and globally>>>>>> today compared to four years ago?.>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> ===>>>>>>>>>> The seeds of inflation were planted on Trump's watch with the >>>>> Quantitative Easing program. It helped to keep the economy afloat >>>>> during the Covid crisis but now were paying the price. The same >>>>> can be said for the global supply chain crisis. Could Trump have >>>>> done anything about it if still in office? Frankly I doubt it. He >>>>> would have done a good job of blaming it on someone else however. >>>>> That's his special talent. Does it not matter to you that he tried >>>>> to overthrow an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of >>>>> power? That is the bedrock of our democracy, and Trump reminds us >>>>> of how fragile it can be. The vast majority of the
electorate saw >>>>> through his bluff, bluster and bullshit in the 2020 election and >>>>> rightfully voted him out of office. For better or worse Biden was >>>>> the only choice. For that we can thank the feckless Republican >>>>> party who stood by their flawed candidate while the ship was burning.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The Obama fiscal policy rewarded his rich contributors, bankers and>>>> Wall Street but it left the middle class suffering. The more we hear>>>> about who actually got the money the more pissed people are. They are>>>> really just scratching the surface of the massive fraud with a few>>>> small timers who got charged. The big players who raked in millions>>>> and padded their bottom line with it, like airlines are still free to>>>> do it again.>>>>>>>>>> I have a hunch that history will record the Obama/Biden years as being>>> the most corrupt in modern times.>>>> I would put the stick in the dirt when GHWB took office and we have>> suffered from bad leadership since. That is both on the corporate and>> government side. The corporations adopted a 90 day window for their>> decision making, just trying to make good quarterly numbers, not>> really building anything and
they were supported by the same mentality>> in Washington. It was all about how Wall Street is doing with no real>> concern with how things are going on Main Street, what we do next year>> or how we will ever service the debt they incurred. The Democrats>> embraced Rubin, Summers, Geithner and Greenspan more than the>> Republicans.>> We can complain about the American oligarchs like Jobs, Bezos and Musk>> but at least they were building things.>> Musk and Bezos are pretty frustrated with the government too.> > When I think of corruption I am not thinking bad policies, etc.> > I am thinking corruption in the sense of using the power and> influence of an elected office for personal financial gains.> Biden is a perfect example of a smiling, career politician who has his> hand out everywhere. Hunter's laptop will eventually do him in.> > I don't think GWB was corrupt in this sense. You can argue his> policies but there's no evidence anywhere of him personally> gaining by them financially, at least not by plan.> > This will irk Wayne and Harry but neither did Trump.> Trump was the most corrupt POTUS in our history, and his adult children are equally corrupt.-- * I just want to find 11
,780 votes... *

Keyser Söze <KeyserSöze@whitehouse.com> Wrote in message:r
> On 7/5/22 3:23 AM, Richard Grew wrote:> On Monday, July 4, 2022 at 6:53:06 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:>> On 7/3/2022 3:19 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:>>> On Sunday, July 3, 2022 at 7:00:11 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:>>>> On 7/2/2022 4:53 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:>>>>> On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at 4:16:22 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>>>> On Sat, 2 Jul 2022 07:39:53 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <not...@noland.com>>>>>>> wrote:>>>>>>> On 7/1/2022 4:58 PM, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 11:56:20 -0700 (PDT),>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Friday, July 1, 2022 at 2:27:15 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT),>>>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >From an op-ed article by Mick Mulvaney in USA Today: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's quite likely that Trump attempted to obstruct justice, which may turn out to be the most serious, and most provable crime he committed according to Mick Mulvaney, Director of the Office of Management and Budget; White House Chief of Staff.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Per Mulvaney, such
claims are the threat Trump should be most worried about.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He also described a former White House aide's Tuesday testimony as "eminently credible.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The former acting White House chief of staff Mick Mulvaney wrote on Wednesday that in his view the real threat to former President Donald Trump was evidence that might lead to accusations of obstruction of justice.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney wrote that he had previously defended the former president against claims that he did "anything illegal or criminal" in relation to the Capitol riot. He said he was having difficulty maintaining that position, however, particularly after Hutchinson's testimony, which he said he found "eminently credible.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Because after some of the bombshells that got dropped in that hearing, my guess is that things could get very dark for the former president," Mulvaney wrote.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney also said, though, that Tuesday's hearing revealed one real threat to Trump that didn't hinge on Hutchinson's words or credibility. "It is the one that jumped out at me," he wrote. "And it is the one that should most worry the former president
.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He referred to the evidence presented by Rep. Liz Cheney of Wyoming toward the end of the hearing consisting of two messages that January 6 panel witnesses said they received before giving their depositions. The messages included allusions to being a "team player" to "stay in the good graces in Trump world" as well as a reminder that Trump read transcripts of interviews.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney said that the implication behind displaying the messages during the hearing was "crystal clear.">>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The Jan. 6 committee members believe they have evidence that people within the Trump operation attempted to intimidate witnesses," Mulvaney wrote. "And that, any way you slice it, is obstruction of justice.">>>>>>>>>> What do you want to bet, if Trump said he wasn't running in 2024, this>>>>>>>>>> whole witch hunt evaporates. De Santis may be taking that option away>>>>>>>>>> from him anyway.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ===>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> witch-hunt>>>>>>>>> /?wiCH ?h?nt/>>>>>>>>> nounhistorical>>>>>>>>> noun: witch-hunt; plural noun: witch-hunts; noun: witchhunt; plural noun: witchhunts>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a) search for and subsequent persecution of
a supposed witch.>>>>>>>>> b) informal: a campaign directed against a person or group holding unorthodox or unpopular views.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I take some exception to your use of "witch-hunt" because of its implication of a search for something that isn't real. In my mind, and the mind of many others, Trump's criminality is very real. The question is how best to prove it, and how best to punish it. I'm not sure it's enough to just keep him from running in 2024 but that's a good start. I'd like to see his cult mystique with the right win sector of the Republican party totally annihilated so that we never have to deal with his toxic influence again.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The whole process bothers me. Even you admit, the whole exercise is>>>>>>>> designed to prevent him from running again (two impeachments, one>>>>>>>> after he left office and now you are hanging your hat on the 14th>>>>>>>> amendment)>>>>>>>> Isn't this supposed to be up to the voters?>>>>>>>> Why are you folks so afraid of open and free elections?>>>>>>>> I would much prefer that he simply gets clobbered in the primaries by>>>>>>>> margins too great to protest. De Santis is already chipping away at>>>>>>>> his
base.>>>>>>>> I still believe the risks of trying to charge this guy over bullshit>>>>>>>> and the social upheaval it might cause is not worth the risk for the>>>>>>>> slim chance you can get any kind of conviction by 2024.>>>>>>>> The court would still be hearing motions by then.>>>>>>>> I mentioned before, Cruz is still in court for a school shooting in>>>>>>>> 2018 and it was a slam dunk against a kid with few resources to>>>>>>>> present a defense.>>>>>>>> Trump may be a piece of shit but he is a rich piece of shit who has>>>>>>>> always been surrounded by lawyers.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Even Biden the Bozo isn't blaming Trump for much anymore.>>>>>>> It's all "Russia, Russia, Russia".>>>>>> Biden has to be a little careful or someone will point out Russia was>>>>>> pretty quiet on Trump's watch. They got frisky during Obama's watch>>>>>> and started a war on Biden's watch.>>>>>>>>>> ===>>>>>>>>>> Putin had Trump right where he wanted him and didn't want to upset the balance.>>>>>>>>>> https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/cc2560c/2147483647/strip/false/crop/3259x2423+0+0/resize/1486x1105!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fb
rightspot%2F5d%2F6e%2F99f75ab4481499aab953bee3ff59%2Fcolor-edit-toon-trump-on-nato-and-russia.jpg>>>> Cute.>>>>>>>> It's obvious you have an intense dislike for Trump which is>>>> understandable. Based on your many posts about him, your>>>> dislike goes back a long ways ... back when he was in>>>> private business and well before he ran for and won the>>>> Presidency.>>>>>>>> But, if you can put that intense dislike and bias aside for>>>> a moment, do you really feel the USA is in better positions>>>> and conditions, economically, domestically and globally>>>> today compared to four years ago?.>>>> -- >>>>>> ===>>>>>> The seeds of inflation were planted on Trump's watch with the Quantitative Easing program. It helped to keep the economy afloat during the Covid crisis but now were paying the price. The same can be said for the global supply chain crisis. Could Trump have done anything about it if still in office? Frankly I doubt it. He would have done a good job of blaming it on someone else however. That's his special talent. Does it not matter to you that he tried to overthrow an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of power? That is the bedrock of our democracy, and Trump
reminds us of how fragile it can be. The vast majority of the electorate saw through his bluff, bluster and bullshit in the 2020 election and rightfully voted him out of office. For better or worse Biden was the only choice. For that we can thank the feckless Republican party who stood by their flawed candidate while the ship was burning.>> I guess where we differ is in the Trump's alleged attempt to overthrow>> an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of power. I really don't>> think that the events of Jan 6th was as serious or threatening to the>> the country as the media and the Jan 6 commission is trying to make it>> out to be. I also distinctly recall Trump calling for a "peaceful">> demonstration .... not a riot or attempt to take over the government.>>>> He's not the first by any means. His style is unique for sure and>> may be inappropriate but I seem to remember a guy named Gore contesting>> an election for months and, more recently, a woman named Hillary who,>> to this day, still contends that the 2016 election was "stolen" from>> her.>> -- >> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.>> https://www.avg.com> > She also tried to get electors to switch their vo
tes and 7 actually did switch from Trump in 2016. It's OK for democrats to try but not republicans.That's part of the bullshit spewed by Dinesh D?Souza, a felon.-- * I just want to find 11,780 votes... *

On Tue, 5 Jul 2022 14:50:15 -0400, Keyser Söze
<KeyserSöze@whitehouse.com> wrote:

>On 7/5/22 7:13 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
>> On 7/4/2022 4:02 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>>> On Mon, 4 Jul 2022 06:55:57 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 7/3/2022 8:01 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>>>>> On Sun, 3 Jul 2022 12:19:49 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>> "waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com" <wayne.beardsley@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sunday, July 3, 2022 at 7:00:11 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
>>>>>>> On 7/2/2022 4:53 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at 4:16:22 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 2 Jul 2022 07:39:53 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
>>>>>>>>> <not...@noland.com>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 7/1/2022 4:58 PM, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 11:56:20 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Friday, July 1, 2022 at 2:27:15 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com
>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>>>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> >From an op-ed article by Mick Mulvaney in USA Today:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's quite likely that Trump attempted to obstruct justice,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> which may turn out to be the most serious, and most
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> provable crime he committed according to Mick Mulvaney,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Director of the Office of Management and Budget; White
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> House Chief of Staff.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Per Mulvaney, such claims are the threat Trump should be
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> most worried about.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He also described a former White House aide's Tuesday
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> testimony as "eminently credible."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The former acting White House chief of staff Mick Mulvaney
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote on Wednesday that in his view the real threat to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> former President Donald Trump was evidence that might lead
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to accusations of obstruction of justice.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney wrote that he had previously defended the former
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> president against claims that he did "anything illegal or
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> criminal" in relation to the Capitol riot. He said he was
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> having difficulty maintaining that position, however,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> particularly after Hutchinson's testimony, which he said he
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> found "eminently credible."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Because after some of the bombshells that got dropped in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that hearing, my guess is that things could get very dark
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for the former president," Mulvaney wrote.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney also said, though, that Tuesday's hearing revealed
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> one real threat to Trump that didn't hinge on Hutchinson's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> words or credibility. "It is the one that jumped out at
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> me," he wrote. "And it is the one that should most worry
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the former president."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He referred to the evidence presented by Rep. Liz Cheney of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Wyoming toward the end of the hearing consisting of two
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> messages that January 6 panel witnesses said they received
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> before giving their depositions. The messages included
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> allusions to being a "team player" to "stay in the good
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> graces in Trump world" as well as a reminder that Trump
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> read transcripts of interviews.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney said that the implication behind displaying the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> messages during the hearing was "crystal clear."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The Jan. 6 committee members believe they have evidence
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that people within the Trump operation attempted to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> intimidate witnesses," Mulvaney wrote. "And that, any way
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you slice it, is obstruction of justice."
>>>>>>>>>>>>> What do you want to bet, if Trump said he wasn't running in
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2024, this
>>>>>>>>>>>>> whole witch hunt evaporates. De Santis may be taking that
>>>>>>>>>>>>> option away
>>>>>>>>>>>>> from him anyway.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> ===
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> witch-hunt
>>>>>>>>>>>> /?wiCH ?h?nt/
>>>>>>>>>>>> nounhistorical
>>>>>>>>>>>> noun: witch-hunt; plural noun: witch-hunts; noun: witchhunt;
>>>>>>>>>>>> plural noun: witchhunts
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> a) search for and subsequent persecution of a supposed witch.
>>>>>>>>>>>> b) informal: a campaign directed against a person or group
>>>>>>>>>>>> holding unorthodox or unpopular views.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I take some exception to your use of "witch-hunt" because of
>>>>>>>>>>>> its implication of a search for something that isn't real. In
>>>>>>>>>>>> my mind, and the mind of many others, Trump's criminality is
>>>>>>>>>>>> very real. The question is how best to prove it, and how best
>>>>>>>>>>>> to punish it. I'm not sure it's enough to just keep him from
>>>>>>>>>>>> running in 2024 but that's a good start. I'd like to see his
>>>>>>>>>>>> cult mystique with the right win sector of the Republican
>>>>>>>>>>>> party totally annihilated so that we never have to deal with
>>>>>>>>>>>> his toxic influence again.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The whole process bothers me. Even you admit, the whole
>>>>>>>>>>> exercise is
>>>>>>>>>>> designed to prevent him from running again (two impeachments, one
>>>>>>>>>>> after he left office and now you are hanging your hat on the 14th
>>>>>>>>>>> amendment)
>>>>>>>>>>> Isn't this supposed to be up to the voters?
>>>>>>>>>>> Why are you folks so afraid of open and free elections?
>>>>>>>>>>> I would much prefer that he simply gets clobbered in the
>>>>>>>>>>> primaries by
>>>>>>>>>>> margins too great to protest. De Santis is already chipping
>>>>>>>>>>> away at
>>>>>>>>>>> his base.
>>>>>>>>>>> I still believe the risks of trying to charge this guy over
>>>>>>>>>>> bullshit
>>>>>>>>>>> and the social upheaval it might cause is not worth the risk
>>>>>>>>>>> for the
>>>>>>>>>>> slim chance you can get any kind of conviction by 2024.
>>>>>>>>>>> The court would still be hearing motions by then.
>>>>>>>>>>> I mentioned before, Cruz is still in court for a school
>>>>>>>>>>> shooting in
>>>>>>>>>>> 2018 and it was a slam dunk against a kid with few resources to
>>>>>>>>>>> present a defense.
>>>>>>>>>>> Trump may be a piece of shit but he is a rich piece of shit
>>>>>>>>>>> who has
>>>>>>>>>>> always been surrounded by lawyers.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Even Biden the Bozo isn't blaming Trump for much anymore.
>>>>>>>>>> It's all "Russia, Russia, Russia".
>>>>>>>>> Biden has to be a little careful or someone will point out
>>>>>>>>> Russia was
>>>>>>>>> pretty quiet on Trump's watch. They got frisky during Obama's watch
>>>>>>>>> and started a war on Biden's watch.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ===
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Putin had Trump right where he wanted him and didn't want to
>>>>>>>> upset the balance.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/cc2560c/2147483647/strip/false/crop/3259x2423+0+0/resize/1486x1105!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fbrightspot%2F5d%2F6e%2F99f75ab4481499aab953bee3ff59%2Fcolor-edit-toon-trump-on-nato-and-russia.jpg
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Cute.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It's obvious you have an intense dislike for Trump which is
>>>>>>> understandable. Based on your many posts about him, your
>>>>>>> dislike goes back a long ways ... back when he was in
>>>>>>> private business and well before he ran for and won the
>>>>>>> Presidency.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But, if you can put that intense dislike and bias aside for
>>>>>>> a moment, do you really feel the USA is in better positions
>>>>>>> and conditions, economically, domestically and globally
>>>>>>> today compared to four years ago?.
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ===
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The seeds of inflation were planted on Trump's watch with the
>>>>>> Quantitative Easing program.  It helped to keep the economy afloat
>>>>>> during the Covid crisis but now were paying the price.  The same
>>>>>> can be said for the global supply chain crisis.  Could Trump have
>>>>>> done anything about it if still in office?  Frankly I doubt it.  He
>>>>>> would have done a good job of blaming it on someone else however.
>>>>>> That's his special talent.  Does it not matter to you that he tried
>>>>>> to overthrow an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of
>>>>>> power?  That is the bedrock of our democracy, and Trump reminds us
>>>>>> of how fragile it can be.  The vast majority of the electorate saw
>>>>>> through his bluff, bluster and bullshit in the 2020 election and
>>>>>> rightfully voted him out of office.  For better or worse Biden was
>>>>>> the only choice.  For that we can thank the feckless Republican
>>>>>> party who stood by their flawed candidate while the ship was burning.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> The Obama fiscal policy rewarded his rich contributors, bankers and
>>>>> Wall Street but it left the middle class suffering. The more we hear
>>>>> about who actually got the money the more pissed people are. They are
>>>>> really just scratching the surface of the massive fraud with a few
>>>>> small timers who got charged. The big players who raked in millions
>>>>> and padded their bottom line with it, like airlines are still free to
>>>>> do it again.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I have a hunch that history will record the Obama/Biden years as being
>>>> the most corrupt in modern times.
>>>
>>> I would put the stick in the dirt when GHWB took office and we have
>>> suffered from bad leadership since. That is both on the corporate and
>>> government side. The corporations adopted a 90 day window for their
>>> decision making, just trying to make good quarterly numbers, not
>>> really building anything and they were supported by the same mentality
>>> in Washington. It was all about how Wall Street is doing with no real
>>> concern with how things are going on Main Street, what we do next year
>>> or how we will ever service the debt they incurred. The Democrats
>>> embraced Rubin, Summers, Geithner and Greenspan more than the
>>> Republicans.
>>> We can complain about the American oligarchs like Jobs, Bezos and Musk
>>> but at least they were building things.
>>> Musk and Bezos are pretty frustrated with the government too.
>>
>> When I think of corruption I am not thinking bad policies, etc.
>>
>> I am thinking corruption in the sense of using the power and
>> influence of an elected office for personal financial gains.
>> Biden is a perfect example of a smiling, career politician who has his
>> hand out everywhere. Hunter's laptop will eventually do him in.
>>
>> I don't think GWB was corrupt in this sense.  You can argue his
>> policies but there's no evidence anywhere of him personally
>> gaining by them financially, at least not by plan.
>>
>> This will irk Wayne and Harry but neither did Trump.
>>
>Trump was the most corrupt POTUS in our history, and his adult children
>are equally corrupt.

On Tue, 5 Jul 2022 11:19:00 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
wrote:

>On 7/5/2022 11:02 AM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>> On Tue, 5 Jul 2022 07:13:31 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On 7/4/2022 4:02 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 4 Jul 2022 06:55:57 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 7/3/2022 8:01 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>> On Sun, 3 Jul 2022 12:19:49 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>>> "waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com" <wayne.beardsley@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Sunday, July 3, 2022 at 7:00:11 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 7/2/2022 4:53 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at 4:16:22 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 2 Jul 2022 07:39:53 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" <not...@noland.com>
>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On 7/1/2022 4:58 PM, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 11:56:20 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Friday, July 1, 2022 at 2:27:15 PM UTC-4, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 1 Jul 2022 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT),
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >From an op-ed article by Mick Mulvaney in USA Today:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's quite likely that Trump attempted to obstruct justice, which may turn out to be the most serious, and most provable crime he committed according to Mick Mulvaney, Director of the Office of Management and Budget; White House Chief of Staff.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Per Mulvaney, such claims are the threat Trump should be most worried about.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He also described a former White House aide's Tuesday testimony as "eminently credible."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The former acting White House chief of staff Mick Mulvaney wrote on Wednesday that in his view the real threat to former President Donald Trump was evidence that might lead to accusations of obstruction of justice.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney wrote that he had previously defended the former president against claims that he did "anything illegal or criminal" in relation to the Capitol riot. He said he was having difficulty maintaining that position, however, particularly after Hutchinson's testimony, which he said he found "eminently credible."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Because after some of the bombshells that got dropped in that hearing, my guess is that things could get very dark for the former president," Mulvaney wrote.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney also said, though, that Tuesday's hearing revealed one real threat to Trump that didn't hinge on Hutchinson's words or credibility. "It is the one that jumped out at me," he wrote. "And it is the one that should most worry the former president."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He referred to the evidence presented by Rep. Liz Cheney of Wyoming toward the end of the hearing consisting of two messages that January 6 panel witnesses said they received before giving their depositions. The messages included allusions to being a "team player" to "stay in the good graces in Trump world" as well as a reminder that Trump read transcripts of interviews.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mulvaney said that the implication behind displaying the messages during the hearing was "crystal clear."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The Jan. 6 committee members believe they have evidence that people within the Trump operation attempted to intimidate witnesses," Mulvaney wrote. "And that, any way you slice it, is obstruction of justice."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> What do you want to bet, if Trump said he wasn't running in 2024, this
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> whole witch hunt evaporates. De Santis may be taking that option away
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from him anyway.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ===
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> witch-hunt
>>>>>>>>>>>>> /?wiCH ?h?nt/
>>>>>>>>>>>>> nounhistorical
>>>>>>>>>>>>> noun: witch-hunt; plural noun: witch-hunts; noun: witchhunt; plural noun: witchhunts
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> a) search for and subsequent persecution of a supposed witch.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> b) informal: a campaign directed against a person or group holding unorthodox or unpopular views.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I take some exception to your use of "witch-hunt" because of its implication of a search for something that isn't real. In my mind, and the mind of many others, Trump's criminality is very real. The question is how best to prove it, and how best to punish it. I'm not sure it's enough to just keep him from running in 2024 but that's a good start. I'd like to see his cult mystique with the right win sector of the Republican party totally annihilated so that we never have to deal with his toxic influence again.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> The whole process bothers me. Even you admit, the whole exercise is
>>>>>>>>>>>> designed to prevent him from running again (two impeachments, one
>>>>>>>>>>>> after he left office and now you are hanging your hat on the 14th
>>>>>>>>>>>> amendment)
>>>>>>>>>>>> Isn't this supposed to be up to the voters?
>>>>>>>>>>>> Why are you folks so afraid of open and free elections?
>>>>>>>>>>>> I would much prefer that he simply gets clobbered in the primaries by
>>>>>>>>>>>> margins too great to protest. De Santis is already chipping away at
>>>>>>>>>>>> his base.
>>>>>>>>>>>> I still believe the risks of trying to charge this guy over bullshit
>>>>>>>>>>>> and the social upheaval it might cause is not worth the risk for the
>>>>>>>>>>>> slim chance you can get any kind of conviction by 2024.
>>>>>>>>>>>> The court would still be hearing motions by then.
>>>>>>>>>>>> I mentioned before, Cruz is still in court for a school shooting in
>>>>>>>>>>>> 2018 and it was a slam dunk against a kid with few resources to
>>>>>>>>>>>> present a defense.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Trump may be a piece of shit but he is a rich piece of shit who has
>>>>>>>>>>>> always been surrounded by lawyers.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Even Biden the Bozo isn't blaming Trump for much anymore.
>>>>>>>>>>> It's all "Russia, Russia, Russia".
>>>>>>>>>> Biden has to be a little careful or someone will point out Russia was
>>>>>>>>>> pretty quiet on Trump's watch. They got frisky during Obama's watch
>>>>>>>>>> and started a war on Biden's watch.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ===
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Putin had Trump right where he wanted him and didn't want to upset the balance.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> https://cdn.forumcomm.com/dims4/default/cc2560c/2147483647/strip/false/crop/3259x2423+0+0/resize/1486x1105!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fforum-communications-production-web.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fbrightspot%2F5d%2F6e%2F99f75ab4481499aab953bee3ff59%2Fcolor-edit-toon-trump-on-nato-and-russia.jpg
>>>>>>>> Cute.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It's obvious you have an intense dislike for Trump which is
>>>>>>>> understandable. Based on your many posts about him, your
>>>>>>>> dislike goes back a long ways ... back when he was in
>>>>>>>> private business and well before he ran for and won the
>>>>>>>> Presidency.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> But, if you can put that intense dislike and bias aside for
>>>>>>>> a moment, do you really feel the USA is in better positions
>>>>>>>> and conditions, economically, domestically and globally
>>>>>>>> today compared to four years ago?.
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ===
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The seeds of inflation were planted on Trump's watch with the Quantitative Easing program. It helped to keep the economy afloat during the Covid crisis but now were paying the price. The same can be said for the global supply chain crisis. Could Trump have done anything about it if still in office? Frankly I doubt it. He would have done a good job of blaming it on someone else however. That's his special talent. Does it not matter to you that he tried to overthrow an election and obstruct the peaceful transfer of power? That is the bedrock of our democracy, and Trump reminds us of how fragile it can be. The vast majority of the electorate saw through his bluff, bluster and bullshit in the 2020 election and rightfully voted him out of office. For better or worse Biden was the only choice. For that we can thank the feckless Republican party who stood by their flawed candidate while the ship was burning.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> The Obama fiscal policy rewarded his rich contributors, bankers and
>>>>>> Wall Street but it left the middle class suffering. The more we hear
>>>>>> about who actually got the money the more pissed people are. They are
>>>>>> really just scratching the surface of the massive fraud with a few
>>>>>> small timers who got charged. The big players who raked in millions
>>>>>> and padded their bottom line with it, like airlines are still free to
>>>>>> do it again.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I have a hunch that history will record the Obama/Biden years as being
>>>>> the most corrupt in modern times.
>>>>
>>>> I would put the stick in the dirt when GHWB took office and we have
>>>> suffered from bad leadership since. That is both on the corporate and
>>>> government side. The corporations adopted a 90 day window for their
>>>> decision making, just trying to make good quarterly numbers, not
>>>> really building anything and they were supported by the same mentality
>>>> in Washington. It was all about how Wall Street is doing with no real
>>>> concern with how things are going on Main Street, what we do next year
>>>> or how we will ever service the debt they incurred. The Democrats
>>>> embraced Rubin, Summers, Geithner and Greenspan more than the
>>>> Republicans.
>>>> We can complain about the American oligarchs like Jobs, Bezos and Musk
>>>> but at least they were building things.
>>>> Musk and Bezos are pretty frustrated with the government too.
>>>
>>> When I think of corruption I am not thinking bad policies, etc.
>>>
>>> I am thinking corruption in the sense of using the power and
>>> influence of an elected office for personal financial gains.
>>> Biden is a perfect example of a smiling, career politician who has his
>>> hand out everywhere. Hunter's laptop will eventually do him in.
>>>
>>> I don't think GWB was corrupt in this sense. You can argue his
>>> policies but there's no evidence anywhere of him personally
>>> gaining by them financially, at least not by plan.
>>>
>>> This will irk Wayne and Harry but neither did Trump.
>>
>
>> If that is your standard, Nixon was one of the most honest politicians
>> ever. ;-)
>>
>
>Well, he *was* honest about Checkers. :-)

Keyser Söze <KeyserSöze@whitehouse.com> wrote:
> On 7/4/22 6:44 PM, Bill wrote:
>> John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:
>>> On Mon, 4 Jul 2022 14:58:04 -0000 (UTC), Keyser Soze
>>> <keysersoze@whitehouse.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>> To WayneTrump is the root of all evil. He seems obliviius to the
>>>>> civil unrest, crime, graft, corruption, and the ship of state is
>>>>> rudderless. All the can say is we're watching and we're doing all
>>>>> we can. My question is what are they trying to do to our country,
>>>>> and why? Constitution no good.Lets rewrite it. Supreme court no
>>>>> good. Lets pack it or get rid of it. Nobody should suffer jail
>>>>> time. Go out and buy an electric car NOW. It doesn't matter that
>>>>> we dont have infrostructure to support it. Borders dont matter.
>>>>> Hunter Biden is the smartest person Sleepy Joe knows.
>>>>>
>>>>> Im going to celebrate independence day anyway. My flags are coming
>>>>> down tomorrow until the next event worth celebrating.
>>>>
>>>> If you, herring, and bilious bill had any talent, you could revive the
>>>> Nairobi Trio and appear to be more clever than any of you are.
>>>> https://youtu.be/5-tFyBLo71U
>>>
>>>
>>> "That's not a baby kicking, Karen dear, it's just a fetus!"
>>>
>>
>> I guess a lack of talent allows us to be still be married to our first
>> wife, not ever declaring bankruptcy, let alone twice. Talk about talent,
>> Harry. Yours seems to be to live of others work.
>>
>
> You, Herring, and Justin couldn't win, place, or show in a race in which
> there were no other horses. And wasn't Herring previously married?
> Justin carefully keeps all the details of his life a big secret, and for
> good reason. How far can he travel wearing that ankle bracelet? And all
> three of you are boringly repetitive. Yawn.
> +
>

But a heck of a lot more talented than a twice bankrupt loser.