On Sun, 20 Jun 2021 20:33:19 -0400, J. Clarke
<jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Sun, 20 Jun 2021 16:45:24 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
><dtravel@sonic.net> wrote:
>
>>On 6/20/2021 2:50 PM, edstas...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>> Dimensional Traveler
>>>>> Ed Stasiak
>>>>>
>>>>> Are you claiming that this "invisible uniform" (however you define that)
>>>>> is WORSE TODAY in the U.S. then it was when Black folks were subjected
>>>>> to open and institutionalized racism on a daily basis and trapped under
>>>>> an economic glass ceiling prior to the 1960s?
>>>>
>>>> An openly "subjected" people will generally try to keep their heads down
>>>> to avoid triggering severe punishment for petty slights.
>>>>
>>>> A people that have been told officially that they are treated equally
>>>> and have the same opportunities as the rest of the population but don't
>>>> see that happening WILL start "acting out" in frustration in a variety
>>>> of ways. More violence in general is one way. Rejection of the larger
>>>> culture is another. Killing "their own" who "sell out" by succeeding in
>>>> the larger culture is another. Lashing out at the larger society for
>>>> not doing as well because one rejected it is another. Violent reaction
>>>> to being beaten down by people telling you they aren't beating you down
>>>> for being different is common. More common than violent reaction to
>>>> being beaten down by those who openly subjugate you.
>>>>
>>>> Its not so much that their situation is worse today as the unfulfilled
>>>> promise that they are and will be treated as equals makes them more
>>>> willing to use violence to force the promise to be fulfilled, INSTANTLY.
>>>> (Which simply isn't possible since there is at least a small portion
>>>> of meritocracy involved in advancing in our society. It takes time to
>>>> build the education, experience and social connections to advance.) But
>>>> by our nature as humans we are not all that good as a species at
>>>> specifically targeted violence. General mayhem at targets of
>>>> opportunity is more our thing.
>>>
>>> So back to the unsubstantiated standardized “it’s White people’s fault!”
>>> excuse, which can’t be countered as there is nothing concrete to address,
>>> one must simply accept it as fact or be labeled a racist. Got it.
>>>
>>Not what I said. It is much more complex than any simple "Its THEIR
>>fault!".
>
>This whole business of "fault" is part of the problem. I used to work
>for a little tiny company. Whenever anything went wrong, the boss
>wanted to know whose fault it was. Now I work for a great big
>company. Whenever anything goes wrong, the boss wants to know how we
>change the system so it doesn't happen again. (note that I've worked
>for great big companies where blame is the game too--where I work now
>is exceptional).

Indeed.

Fixing the problem is better than placing the blame.

But also less satisfying.

And, besides, if the argument is about /who is at fault/, then the
discussion of /how to fix the problem/ can be ... shelved.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."

On Sun, 20 Jun 2021 15:01:56 -0700 (PDT), "edstas...@gmail.com"
<edstasiak1067@gmail.com> wrote:

>> Paul S Person
>> > J. Clarke
>> >
>> > Evething is disgusting to liberals. Except more and more and
>> > more government control.
>>
>> And yet it is in /Texas/, hardly a liberal State whose Guv touts
>> individual freedom, that people with "smart" thermostats are
>> having them adjusted by the power company to save energy.
>
>That's not unique to Texas.
>
>Back when I bought my first house, I got suckered by electric
>company here in Michigan into signing up for their interruptible
>AC service with the claim that I'd be saving all kinda money.
>
>I quickly discovered that the "savings" came from my AC being
>turned off for most of the day, which resulted in my house being
>900* when I came home from work and the AC not turning back
>on until I went to bed, then running all night long to try and cool
>down the house.

I'm hoping that was actually 90 degrees Fahrenheit which, God knows,
is quite hot enough.

>Meanwhile, commercial properties had their AC turned down to
>60* and the girls in the office at work were wearing sweaters...

I once worked in a facility on a military base whose heating system
was controlled by the Engineers. In the Winter, we froze, as the heat
was off. In the Summer, we sweltered, as the heat was back on. In both
cases, the local military dress code became ... very flexible. As in
"whatever you need to keep working".

Our conclusion: the thermostat for /our/ building was located in
Antarctica.

>Needless to say, I called and bitched up a storm, demanding that
>this useless service be disconnected and was told I was shit out'a
>luck and committed to it for an entire year.

Ah, a company who had tamed whatever regulatory agency may have been
created to keep tabs on them.

>Luckily, my nextdoor neighbor worked for the gas company and
>had experience with AC systems, so he came over with the special
>key needed to unlock the interruptible control box and disabled it.
>
>Never Never NEVER sign up for an interruptible "smart" thermostat
>program from the electric company, they'll fuck you every time.

Thanks for the information.

Two observations:

1) Looks to me like an interstate problem calling for a Federal
solution. Those not liking Federal solutions, please note that you can
probably still avoid one by taking control of the situation on the
State level.

2) I have always been skeptical of the "smart house", but usually I
expressed this by saying that I didn't want to receive an urgent
notification every two minutes from my refrigerator telling me that my
toaster was no longer responding to it. That someone would actually
use the technology to literally (ok, electronically) go into someone's
home and change their thermostat never entered my mind.

Fortunately, the only "intelligent" device installed by someone else
on /this/ house is the electric meter. And all that does is avoid
paying to have someone come out every other month and read it.

If I and my brother (co-owners) ever decide to do some upgrading, I
will be insisting on /really stupid/ thermostats and other similar
items.

I should also point out that, in the Texas case, the temp was raised
from 72 to 78 (degrees Fahrenheit). Raising it to 74 might have gone
unnoticed. So the Electric Company is not only /rude/ and /invasive/,
it is also /stupid/.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."

On Mon, 21 Jun 2021 09:43:33 -0700 (PDT), "edstas...@gmail.com"
<edstasiak1067@gmail.com> wrote:

>> J. Clarke
>> > Dimensional Traveler
>> > > Ed Stasiak
>> > >
>> > > So back to the unsubstantiated standardized “it’s White people’s fault!”
>> > > excuse, which can’t be countered as there is nothing concrete to address,
>> > > one must simply accept it as fact or be labeled a racist. Got it.
>> >
>> > Not what I said. It is much more complex than any simple "Its THEIR fault!".
>>
>> This whole business of "fault" is part of the problem.
>
>I agree, the claim that guns are at fault and thus ALL Americans should be
>stripped of their right to keep & bear arms has been proven again and again
>over the decades to be bullshit.
>
>Its a willful disregard for scientific evidence to promote a political agenda and
>something that those here would never support on any other subject but when
>it comes to guns, they turn their brain off and go along with the propaganda.
>
>The simply fact is that guns are not and have never been the problem and
>imposing gun control does not and will not fix the problem, as criminals who
>are willing to rob, rape and kill aren’t dissuaded by gun laws, the ONLY people
>who are affected are the already law abiding victims of criminals.

On the other hand it _will_ create another class of scofflaws.

"edstas...@gmail.com" <edstasiak1067@gmail.com> wrote in
news:00453254-901f-48b5-8d31-1e26046d6eaan@googlegroups.com:

>> Paul S Person
>> > Ninapenda Jibini
>> >
>> > If you remove the name, the recent history of the left and
>> > the history of the rise of power of the Nazi party in Germany
>> > in the 20s is identical. Largely, I expect, because they're
>> > using that history as a textbook.
>>
>> It is Trump and the Republican base, however, who are engaged
>> in insurrection.
>
> https://trendingpolitics.com/blm-blames-biden-for-terrorizing-bla
> ck-communities-says-he-is-worse-than-trump-knab/
>
> "Property insurance data estimates that 140 of the Black Lives
> Matter protests in 2020 cost communities between $1 billion and
> $2 billion in damages. Hundreds of police officers were injured
> in BLM protests in 2020, two of them killed. BLM was linked to
> over 91% of riots in a three month period last year, which gave
> rise to numerous innocent civilians' deaths. One particularly
> tumultuous period led to at least 19 deaths."
>
Peaceful protests, indeed.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

Paul S Person <psperson1@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote in
news:6psucgthnba8v2d4kerch92gt3nvetk7i5@4ax.com:

> And the argument is that gun-control /increases/ gun deaths.
>
No one has made that argument, liar.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

"edstas...@gmail.com" <edstasiak1067@gmail.com> wrote in
news:126a7e66-43c8-46a6-b9c8-ec4efa49308an@googlegroups.com:

>> Paul S Person
>> > Ed Stasiak
>> >
>> > The statistics show that NYC’s strict anti-gun laws, which
>> > were
> imposed
>> > back in the late 1800s, have had no observable effect on
>> > crime.
>> >
>> > https://ibb.co/RcxwHmL
>>
>> I wasn't aware that 2018 was "in the late 1800s".
>>
>> And the argument is that gun-control /increases/ gun deaths.
>>
>> So, unless NYC put /new/ control measures into effect, the data
>> does /not/ support the argument, as the number of shootings is
>> rising while the gun-control laws remain the same.
>
> You seem to be missing the point: the murder rates in NYC went
> up and down REGARDLESS of the existing and draconian gun control
> laws.
>
> Guns are not and have never been the problem.
>
Assuming the goal is lower crime rates, that is. The "gun problem"
isn't crime, it's that the "wrong people" have them. Namely, people
who will defend themselves against the fascist coup.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote in
news:rml0dgp5f4mm3gt7vl0ja14gaqi9duff1e@4ax.com:

> The sad part is that gun control advocates think that a "war on
> guns" is going to have a different outcome.
>
You abuse the word "think." No cookie for you.

The rank and file - like the idiots here - *believe* it will. The
people in charge know full well it will have the same outcome. That
is their *goald*. The more crime rates rise, the more power they can
seize, and the easier it becomes for them to simply murder their
opponents and get away with it.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

"pete...@gmail.com" <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote in
news:db16c148-ea11-437d-b740-d457937c1d89n@googlegroups.com:

> I
> looked up the statistics and showed that Terry was in fact
> correct.

I generally am in what I actually say. What Baker and his butthole
buddies hallucinate I said is not my responsibility. Even when I say
it in a way as to feed their madness.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

"Gary R. Schmidt" <grschmidt@acm.org> wrote in
news:hk60qh-up2.ln1@paranoia.mcleod-schmidt.id.au:

> On 19/06/2021 04:55, Wolffan wrote:
>> On 2021 Jun 18, Quadibloc wrote
>> (in
>> article<ac6cb5d8-8afc-4121-88a9-e9a0a25ebb46n@googlegroups.com>)
>> :
>>
>>> On Thursday, June 17, 2021 at 3:29:26 PM UTC-6, Alan Baker
>>> wrote:
>>>> On 2021-06-17 2:18 p.m., edstas...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
>>>>> If guns were the problem then the murder rate would be more
>>>>> or less the same across the country, instead of being
>>>>> concentrated in the same inner cities year after year and
>>>>> ought to be astronomically higher today.
>>>
>>>> Nope. That doesn't follow.
>>>
>>> Oh, it _does_ follow. Guns aren't "the problem". If peaceful
>>> law-abiding citizens owned guns in greater numbers, this would
>>> not greatly increase crime using guns.
>>>
>>> The principal cause of crime is, after all, criminals.
>>>
>>> The case for gun control is a bit more difficult to make.
>>
>> Gun control Will Not Bloody Work. It’s not just my opinion,
>> it’s demonstrable.
>>
> [SNIP]
> Worked perfectly well here in Oz.

From your own governments Bureau of Statistics

https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/people/crime-and-
justice/recorded-crime-victims/latest-release

https://tinyurl.com/76jktpfb

"Between 2018 and 2019, the number of victims of homicide and
related offences in Australia increased by 10% (39 victims) to 416
victims.

"All homicide and related offences increased in Australia between
2018 and 2019:

"Attempted murder (up 21 victims or 17%)
Manslaughter (up 17 victims or 59%)
Murder (up 6 victims or 3%)

"In 2019 there were 26,892 victims of sexual assault in Australia,
an increase of 2% from the previous year. This was the eighth
consecutive annual increase and the highest number for this offence
recorded in a single year. After accounting for population growth,
the victimisation rate has also increased annually over this eight-
year period from 83 to 106 victims per 100,000 persons.

"In 2019 there were 11,775 victims of robbery in Australia,
increasing by 16% from the previous year. This was the fourth
consecutive annual increase and the highest recorded number of
victims since 2012.

"In 2019 there were 173,344 victims of unlawful entry with intent,
which was a 3% (5,294 victims) increase from the previous year.

"In 2019 there were 58,021 victims of motor vehicle theft in
Australia, an increase of 9% or 4,697 victims from the previous
year. This was the highest recorded number of victims for this
offence since 2012.

"The number of victims of other theft offences increased by 8%
between 2018 and 2019 to 569,404 victims. This was the highest
recorded number of victims in the last ten years."

Not a single category has gone down recently. So perhaps it hasn't
worked quite as well as your masters have spoon fed you to believe.
>
> Violent crimes committed with guns are down, with no increase in
> knife/brick/hand grenade usage.
>
> Domestic violence using guns is down. (But, sadly, DV is on the
> increase,

And there's the standard bullshit evasion by the gun grabbers:

"You're more dead if you're killed with a gun than if you're killed
with a knife, or a baseball bat, or a fist."

That is why I consider you a subhuman animal.

> Of course, Australians aren't barbarian morons who need a gun to
> compensate for their general uselessness. [OBSF - Wizards and
> Swords.]
>
No, they're mindless sheep who gobble down whatever bullshit their
masters feed them.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote in
news:jidrcglsmetcfpd3019ssbu8us6c14sagt@4ax.com:

> If they aren't barbarian morons then why can't they be trusted
> with weapons?
>
Heh. Because guns emit evil mind control rays that *force* otherwise
law abiding citizens to become mass murderes.

You *know* he's going to say that at some point. Not in those words,
of course, because he's programmed with the more sophosticated
talking point, but that's the buttom line.

He's already resorted to "you're more dead if you're killed with a
gun than if you're killed with something else."

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

"Gary R. Schmidt" <grschmidt@acm.org> wrote in
news:bk81qh-33d.ln1@paranoia.mcleod-schmidt.id.au:

> On 19/06/2021 19:22, J. Clarke wrote:
>> On Sat, 19 Jun 2021 13:58:42 +1000, "Gary R. Schmidt"
>> <grschmidt@acm.org> wrote:
>>
>>> On 19/06/2021 04:55, Wolffan wrote:
>>>> On 2021 Jun 18, Quadibloc wrote
>>>> (in
>>>> article<ac6cb5d8-8afc-4121-88a9-e9a0a25ebb46n@googlegroups.com
>>>> >):
>>>>
>>>>> On Thursday, June 17, 2021 at 3:29:26 PM UTC-6, Alan Baker
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> On 2021-06-17 2:18 p.m., edstas...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> If guns were the problem then the murder rate would be
>>>>>>> more or less the same across the country, instead of being
>>>>>>> concentrated in the same inner cities year after year and
>>>>>>> ought to be astronomically higher today.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Nope. That doesn't follow.
>>>>>
>>>>> Oh, it _does_ follow. Guns aren't "the problem". If peaceful
>>>>> law-abiding citizens owned guns in greater numbers, this
>>>>> would not greatly increase crime using guns.
>>>>>
>>>>> The principal cause of crime is, after all, criminals.
>>>>>
>>>>> The case for gun control is a bit more difficult to make.
>>>>
>>>> Gun control Will Not Bloody Work. It’s not just my opinion,
>>>> it’s demonstrable.
>>>>
>>> [SNIP]
>>> Worked perfectly well here in Oz.
>>
>> The same way my can of elephant repellant works in Connecticut.
>> Since I got my elephant repellant I haven't seen a single
>> elepehant, so that solved the elephant problem real good.
>>>
>>> Violent crimes committed with guns are down, with no increase
>>> in knife/brick/hand grenade usage.
>>
>> Down from what to what?
>>
>>> Domestic violence using guns is down. (But, sadly, DV is on
>>> the increase, although some of the rozzers I know put some/a
>>> lot of that down to them taking it more seriously, and being
>>> *trained* in what to do, so it gets reported more often. And
>>> COVID-19.)
>>
>> Down from what to what?
>>
>>> The suicide rate of farmers, in general, is down, and
>>> noticeably the number where a gun is used are down.
>>
>> Down from what to what?
>>
>>> And we haven't had a three year-old kill a family member with
>>> an unsecured firearm in, oh, forever.
>>
>> So how many did you have per year before your gun laws?
>>
>>> Of course, Australians aren't barbarian morons who need a gun
>>> to compensate for their general uselessness. [OBSF - Wizards
>>> and Swords.]
>>
>> If they aren't barbarian morons then why can't they be trusted
>> with weapons?
>>
> Here's a general answer:
> <https://www.jcu.edu.au/news/releases/2018/october/tough-laws-pre
> vent-gun-deaths> - "“In Australia we went from 614 firearm
> deaths in 1990 to 274 in 2016".
>
Violent crime rates in the US went down pretty substantially in the
same period.

While guns were getting easier and easier to legally buy and own.

Now talk about the last two years, where every category of crime
appears to have increased. Or not. We both know you won't.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> wrote in
news:0f97a17b-9692-4853-bc78-8723ed260c81n@googlegroups.com:

> On Saturday, June 19, 2021 at 7:55:17 AM UTC-6, J. Clarke wrote:
>> On Sat, 19 Jun 2021 23:38:51 +1000, "Gary R. Schmidt"
>> <grsc...@acm.org> wrote:
>
>> >Here's a general answer:
>> ><https://www.jcu.edu.au/news/releases/2018/october/tough-laws-p
>> >revent-gu
> n-deaths>
>> >- "“In Australia we went from 614 firearm deaths in 1990 to
>> >274
> in 2016".
>
>> In other words you went from nothing to nothing. You didn't
>> have a problem that needed to be fixed but you fixed it anyway.
>
> Since every single human life is of immense value, they did, in
> fact, address a major and serious problem. The fact that some
> other countries have an even worse problem, but refuse to take
> action against it is not a valid criticism of Australia.
>
Baby, bathwater, etc.

But Aussies are sheep who despierately *need* to have their betters
tell them how to live, so they're all good with being reduced to
indentured servitude. I mean, look at their history. They're all
descended from cirminals. How could it be any different?

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

"Gary R. Schmidt" <grschmidt@acm.org> wrote in
news:81q2qh-ac3.ln1@paranoia.mcleod-schmidt.id.au:

> On 19/06/2021 23:55, J. Clarke wrote:
>> On Sat, 19 Jun 2021 23:38:51 +1000, "Gary R. Schmidt"
>> <grschmidt@acm.org> wrote:
>>
>>> On 19/06/2021 19:22, J. Clarke wrote:
>>>> On Sat, 19 Jun 2021 13:58:42 +1000, "Gary R. Schmidt"
>>>> <grschmidt@acm.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 19/06/2021 04:55, Wolffan wrote:
>>>>>> On 2021 Jun 18, Quadibloc wrote
>>>>>> (in
>>>>>> article<ac6cb5d8-8afc-4121-88a9-e9a0a25ebb46n@googlegroups.c
>>>>>> om>):
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Thursday, June 17, 2021 at 3:29:26 PM UTC-6, Alan Baker
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 2021-06-17 2:18 p.m., edstas...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> If guns were the problem then the murder rate would be
>>>>>>>>> more or less the same across the country, instead of
>>>>>>>>> being concentrated in the same inner cities year after
>>>>>>>>> year and ought to be astronomically higher today.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Nope. That doesn't follow.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Oh, it _does_ follow. Guns aren't "the problem". If
>>>>>>> peaceful law-abiding citizens owned guns in greater
>>>>>>> numbers, this would not greatly increase crime using guns.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The principal cause of crime is, after all, criminals.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The case for gun control is a bit more difficult to make.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Gun control Will Not Bloody Work. It’s not just my
>>>>>> opinion, it’s demonstrable.
>>>>>>
>>>>> [SNIP]
>>>>> Worked perfectly well here in Oz.
>>>>
>>>> The same way my can of elephant repellant works in
>>>> Connecticut. Since I got my elephant repellant I haven't
>>>> seen a single elepehant, so that solved the elephant problem
>>>> real good.
>>>>>
>>>>> Violent crimes committed with guns are down, with no
>>>>> increase in knife/brick/hand grenade usage.
>>>>
>>>> Down from what to what?
>>>>
>>>>> Domestic violence using guns is down. (But, sadly, DV is on
>>>>> the increase, although some of the rozzers I know put some/a
>>>>> lot of that down to them taking it more seriously, and being
>>>>> *trained* in what to do, so it gets reported more often.
>>>>> And COVID-19.)
>>>>
>>>> Down from what to what?
>>>>
>>>>> The suicide rate of farmers, in general, is down, and
>>>>> noticeably the number where a gun is used are down.
>>>>
>>>> Down from what to what?
>>>>
>>>>> And we haven't had a three year-old kill a family member
>>>>> with an unsecured firearm in, oh, forever.
>>>>
>>>> So how many did you have per year before your gun laws?
>>>>
>>>>> Of course, Australians aren't barbarian morons who need a
>>>>> gun to compensate for their general uselessness. [OBSF -
>>>>> Wizards and Swords.]
>>>>
>>>> If they aren't barbarian morons then why can't they be
>>>> trusted with weapons?
>>>>
>>> Here's a general answer:
>>> <https://www.jcu.edu.au/news/releases/2018/october/tough-laws-p
>>> revent-gun-deaths> - "“In Australia we went from 614 firearm
>>> deaths in 1990 to 274 in 2016".
>>
>> In other words you went from nothing to nothing. You didn't
>> have a problem that needed to be fixed but you fixed it anyway.
>>
> That. Is . Just. Disgusting.
>
> And proof, if we needed any more, that in the USA, it is true
> that no lives matter.
>
> And although I rarely publicise it, this piece of trash is now
> in the permanent kill file.
>
Typical gun grabbing lefty: can't refuse the facts, so you run away
and hide.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote in
news:b92ucgpivtcj8mj326tik6k34a73eub8is@4ax.com:

> On Sun, 20 Jun 2021 13:42:00 +1000, "Gary R. Schmidt"
> <grschmidt@acm.org> wrote:
>
>>On 19/06/2021 23:55, J. Clarke wrote:
>>> On Sat, 19 Jun 2021 23:38:51 +1000, "Gary R. Schmidt"
>>> <grschmidt@acm.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 19/06/2021 19:22, J. Clarke wrote:
>>>>> On Sat, 19 Jun 2021 13:58:42 +1000, "Gary R. Schmidt"
>>>>> <grschmidt@acm.org> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 19/06/2021 04:55, Wolffan wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2021 Jun 18, Quadibloc wrote
>>>>>>> (in
>>>>>>> article<ac6cb5d8-8afc-4121-88a9-e9a0a25ebb46n@googlegroups.
>>>>>>> com>):
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Thursday, June 17, 2021 at 3:29:26 PM UTC-6, Alan
>>>>>>>> Baker wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 2021-06-17 2:18 p.m., edstas...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> If guns were the problem then the murder rate would be
>>>>>>>>>> more or less the same across the country, instead of
>>>>>>>>>> being concentrated in the same inner cities year after
>>>>>>>>>> year and ought to be astronomically higher today.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Nope. That doesn't follow.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Oh, it _does_ follow. Guns aren't "the problem". If
>>>>>>>> peaceful law-abiding citizens owned guns in greater
>>>>>>>> numbers, this would not greatly increase crime using
>>>>>>>> guns.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The principal cause of crime is, after all, criminals.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The case for gun control is a bit more difficult to make.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Gun control Will Not Bloody Work. It’s not just my
>>>>>>> opinion, it’s demonstrable.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> [SNIP]
>>>>>> Worked perfectly well here in Oz.
>>>>>
>>>>> The same way my can of elephant repellant works in
>>>>> Connecticut. Since I got my elephant repellant I haven't
>>>>> seen a single elepehant, so that solved the elephant problem
>>>>> real good.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Violent crimes committed with guns are down, with no
>>>>>> increase in knife/brick/hand grenade usage.
>>>>>
>>>>> Down from what to what?
>>>>>
>>>>>> Domestic violence using guns is down. (But, sadly, DV is
>>>>>> on the increase, although some of the rozzers I know put
>>>>>> some/a lot of that down to them taking it more seriously,
>>>>>> and being *trained* in what to do, so it gets reported more
>>>>>> often. And COVID-19.)
>>>>>
>>>>> Down from what to what?
>>>>>
>>>>>> The suicide rate of farmers, in general, is down, and
>>>>>> noticeably the number where a gun is used are down.
>>>>>
>>>>> Down from what to what?
>>>>>
>>>>>> And we haven't had a three year-old kill a family member
>>>>>> with an unsecured firearm in, oh, forever.
>>>>>
>>>>> So how many did you have per year before your gun laws?
>>>>>
>>>>>> Of course, Australians aren't barbarian morons who need a
>>>>>> gun to compensate for their general uselessness. [OBSF -
>>>>>> Wizards and Swords.]
>>>>>
>>>>> If they aren't barbarian morons then why can't they be
>>>>> trusted with weapons?
>>>>>
>>>> Here's a general answer:
>>>> <https://www.jcu.edu.au/news/releases/2018/october/tough-laws-
>>>> prevent-gun-deaths> - "“In Australia we went from 614
>>>> firearm deaths in 1990 to 274 in 2016".
>>>
>>> In other words you went from nothing to nothing. You didn't
>>> have a problem that needed to be fixed but you fixed it
>>> anyway.
>>>
>>That. Is . Just. Disgusting.
>
> Evething is disgusting to liberals.

Especially themselves, if they're white men.

> Except more and more and
> more government control.
>
>>And proof, if we needed any more, that in the USA, it is true
>>that no lives matter.
>
> Freedom is not free. And lives are one of the costs.
>
>>And although I rarely publicise it, this piece of trash is now
>>in the permanent kill file.
>
> Standard liberal reaction to anyone who disagrees with them,
> fingers in the ears and la-la-la.
>
It's a feature of the kind of cowardice that goes beyond being too
afraid to defend themselves against violent attacks, and extends to
trying to force everyone else to be cowards, too. Nothing is more
dangerous than a bunch of cowards.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

Paul S Person <psperson1@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote in
news:3rrucglss4mhkb1p7a0kisqn7bopuudkk6@4ax.com:

> On Sun, 20 Jun 2021 05:25:30 -0400, J. Clarke
> <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Sorry to break in, but this might be of interest.
>
>>Evething is disgusting to liberals. Except more and more and
>>more government control.
>
> And yet it is in /Texas/, hardly a liberal State whose Guv touts
> individual freedom, that people with "smart" thermostats are
> having them adjusted by the power company to save energy.
>
> Talk about "more and more government control".

ERCOT isn't run by the Texas government, retard.
>
> And, no, saying that power company isn't part of the gummint
> doesn't help. They couldn't do it if the gummint didn't let them
> and that would merely make it a problem with unbridled
> capitalism.

So, out of one side of your mouth, you're criticizing them because
they have too much government control, but out of the otherside,
you're criticizing them for not having enough?
>
> Having your life controlled by the Electric Company is no better
> than having it controlled by the gummint. Indeed, since the
> gummint can be replaced with a new gumming but the Electric
> Company, being a corporation, is immortal and does not answer to
> anyone, it is much much worse.

Despite your insane fantasies, no amount of government regulation
will change the amount of electricity available on their grid.

(And they have their own grid because . . . they're Texas, and
demanded that independence 70+ years ago. Dumbass.)

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

Paul S Person <psperson1@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote in
news:mgg1dgpps22bkk93qabs969u8qhb0f8sr6@4ax.com:

> On Sun, 20 Jun 2021 15:01:56 -0700 (PDT), "edstas...@gmail.com"
> <edstasiak1067@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>> Paul S Person
>>> > J. Clarke
>>> >
>>> > Evething is disgusting to liberals. Except more and more and
>>> > more government control.
>>>
>>> And yet it is in /Texas/, hardly a liberal State whose Guv
>>> touts individual freedom, that people with "smart" thermostats
>>> are having them adjusted by the power company to save energy.
>>
>>That's not unique to Texas.
>>
>>Back when I bought my first house, I got suckered by electric
>>company here in Michigan into signing up for their interruptible
>>AC service with the claim that I'd be saving all kinda money.
>>
>>I quickly discovered that the "savings" came from my AC being
>>turned off for most of the day, which resulted in my house being
>>900* when I came home from work and the AC not turning back
>>on until I went to bed, then running all night long to try and
>>cool down the house.
>
> I'm hoping that was actually 90 degrees Fahrenheit which, God
> knows, is quite hot enough.
>
>>Meanwhile, commercial properties had their AC turned down to
>>60* and the girls in the office at work were wearing sweaters...
>
> I once worked in a facility on a military base whose heating
> system was controlled by the Engineers. In the Winter, we froze,
> as the heat was off. In the Summer, we sweltered, as the heat
> was back on. In both cases, the local military dress code became
> ... very flexible. As in "whatever you need to keep working".
>
> Our conclusion: the thermostat for /our/ building was located in
> Antarctica.
>
>>Needless to say, I called and bitched up a storm, demanding that
>>this useless service be disconnected and was told I was shit
>>out'a luck and committed to it for an entire year.
>
> Ah, a company who had tamed whatever regulatory agency may have
> been created to keep tabs on them.
>
>>Luckily, my nextdoor neighbor worked for the gas company and
>>had experience with AC systems, so he came over with the special
>>key needed to unlock the interruptible control box and disabled
>>it.
>>
>>Never Never NEVER sign up for an interruptible "smart"
>>thermostat program from the electric company, they'll fuck you
>>every time.
>
> Thanks for the information.
>
> Two observations:
>
> 1) Looks to me like an interstate problem calling for a Federal
> solution. Those not liking Federal solutions, please note that
> you can probably still avoid one by taking control of the
> situation on the State level.

The ISO is not controlled by either the feds or the states. They
are mostly controlled by the laws of physics, which say you can't
pull gigawatts of electricity out of your ass on demand. They are
seriously hampered by state and federal regulations that keep them
from building additional generating capacity and building out the
infrastructure to distribute it. (They are also hampered by
deregulation resulting in them being run by idiots who only care
about short term profit, but the inability to build generating
capacity in places that need it is the greater problem.)
>
> 2) I have always been skeptical of the "smart house", but
> usually I expressed this by saying that I didn't want to receive
> an urgent notification every two minutes from my refrigerator
> telling me that my toaster was no longer responding to it. That
> someone would actually use the technology to literally (ok,
> electronically) go into someone's home and change their
> thermostat never entered my mind.

That would be because you're an idiot with no imagination.
>
> Fortunately, the only "intelligent" device installed by someone
> else on /this/ house is the electric meter. And all that does is
> avoid paying to have someone come out every other month and read
> it.

Wanna bet? That's all they've used it for so far. That's hardly all
its capable of. (They have been used, for instance, to identify
marijuana "grow houses" based on not only total energy usage, but
usage patterns.)
>
> If I and my brother (co-owners) ever decide to do some
> upgrading, I will be insisting on /really stupid/ thermostats
> and other similar items.

Just remember, the thermostat is just a fancy on/off switch. In a
real pinch, you can hotwire the control wires to the furnace/AC
manually.
>
> I should also point out that, in the Texas case, the temp was
> raised from 72 to 78 (degrees Fahrenheit). Raising it to 74
> might have gone unnoticed. So the Electric Company is not only
> /rude/ and /invasive/, it is also /stupid/.

It chose values that would keep the grid from collapsing under the
load it was experiencing. It was "find enough cuts to keep demand
no higher than supply" or "*everybody* goes dark, people die as a
result, and hope we can replace the equipment physically damaged by
the collapse in less than several months."

Sometimes, professionals on whose work lives depend have to make
touch choices.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

Magewolf <Magewolf@nc.rr.com> wrote in
news:sao8c1$vp7$2@dont-email.me:

> On Sun, 20 Jun 2021 13:42:00 +1000, Gary R. Schmidt wrote:
>
>> On 19/06/2021 23:55, J. Clarke wrote:
>>> On Sat, 19 Jun 2021 23:38:51 +1000, "Gary R. Schmidt"
>>> <grschmidt@acm.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 19/06/2021 19:22, J. Clarke wrote:
>>>>> On Sat, 19 Jun 2021 13:58:42 +1000, "Gary R. Schmidt"
>>>>> <grschmidt@acm.org> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 19/06/2021 04:55, Wolffan wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2021 Jun 18, Quadibloc wrote (in
>>>>>>> article<ac6cb5d8-8afc-4121-88a9-e9a0a25ebb46n@googlegroups.
>>>>>>> com>):
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Thursday, June 17, 2021 at 3:29:26 PM UTC-6, Alan
>>>>>>>> Baker wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 2021-06-17 2:18 p.m., edstas...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> If guns were the problem then the murder rate would be
>>>>>>>>>> more or less the same across the country, instead of
>>>>>>>>>> being concentrated in the same inner cities year after
>>>>>>>>>> year and ought to be astronomically higher today.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Nope. That doesn't follow.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Oh, it _does_ follow. Guns aren't "the problem". If
>>>>>>>> peaceful law-abiding citizens owned guns in greater
>>>>>>>> numbers, this would not greatly increase crime using
>>>>>>>> guns.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The principal cause of crime is, after all, criminals.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The case for gun control is a bit more difficult to make.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Gun control Will Not Bloody Work. It’s not just my
>>>>>>> opinion, it’s demonstrable.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> [SNIP]
>>>>>> Worked perfectly well here in Oz.
>>>>>
>>>>> The same way my can of elephant repellant works in
>>>>> Connecticut. Since I got my elephant repellant I haven't
>>>>> seen a single elepehant, so that solved the elephant problem
>>>>> real good.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Violent crimes committed with guns are down, with no
>>>>>> increase in knife/brick/hand grenade usage.
>>>>>
>>>>> Down from what to what?
>>>>>
>>>>>> Domestic violence using guns is down. (But, sadly, DV is
>>>>>> on the increase, although some of the rozzers I know put
>>>>>> some/a lot of that down to them taking it more seriously,
>>>>>> and being *trained* in what to do, so it gets reported more
>>>>>> often. And COVID-19.)
>>>>>
>>>>> Down from what to what?
>>>>>
>>>>>> The suicide rate of farmers, in general, is down, and
>>>>>> noticeably the number where a gun is used are down.
>>>>>
>>>>> Down from what to what?
>>>>>
>>>>>> And we haven't had a three year-old kill a family member
>>>>>> with an unsecured firearm in, oh, forever.
>>>>>
>>>>> So how many did you have per year before your gun laws?
>>>>>
>>>>>> Of course, Australians aren't barbarian morons who need a
>>>>>> gun to compensate for their general uselessness. [OBSF -
>>>>>> Wizards and Swords.]
>>>>>
>>>>> If they aren't barbarian morons then why can't they be
>>>>> trusted with weapons?
>>>>>
>>>> Here's a general answer:
>>>> <https://www.jcu.edu.au/news/releases/2018/october/tough-laws-
>>>> prevent-
> gun-deaths>
>>>> - "“In Australia we went from 614 firearm deaths in 1990 to
>>>> 274 in 2016".
>>>
>>> In other words you went from nothing to nothing. You didn't
>>> have a problem that needed to be fixed but you fixed it
>>> anyway.
>>>
>> That. Is . Just. Disgusting.
>>
>> And proof, if we needed any more, that in the USA, it is true
>> that no lives matter.
>>
>> And although I rarely publicise it, this piece of trash is now
>> in the permanent kill file.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Gary B-)
>
> That is a drop of less than 400 people a year. More people die
> from faulty ladders per year in the US than that and yet I do
> not see an entire industry thriving on attacking the evil ladder
> companies and the people who buy them. I wonder why?
>
You are apparently unaware of how much of the price of a ladder is
to "defray liability."

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> wrote in
news:sam281$c7m$1@dont-email.me:

> On 6/19/2021 3:10 PM, edstas...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>> If the problem was economics, then why isn't Appalachia (the
>> poorest region in the U.S.) not knee deep in blood?
>>
> Because all the clan *ahem* excuse me, gang warfare there ended
> a hundred or so years ago when enough of the clans^H^H^H^H^H
> gangs had been exterminated.
>
Bigot. I guess its still socially acceptable to hate poor white
people for being poor. And white.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> wrote in
news:3dd5b5c8-b834-4037-80f3-721c90379d5fn@googlegroups.com:

> That may be, but black Americans who make it into the middle
> class aren't a crime problem. So it is not necessary to wade
> into controversy by ascribing some sort of inferiority to black
> Americans.

Good thing nobody did, then.

Fairly typical of the gun grabbing left, and item #3 on the list of
Bullet Points of Bullshit Propagnada:

"When cornered with facts, accuse the other side of racism."

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> wrote in
news:sanovp$oh1$1@dont-email.me:

> On 6/20/2021 6:38 AM, edstas...@gmail.com wrote:
>>> Quadibloc
>>>> Ed Stasiak
>>>>
>>>> If the problem was economics, then why isn't Appalachia (the
>>>> poorest region in the U.S.) knee deep in blood?
>>>
>>> That may be, but black Americans who make it into the middle
>>> class aren't a crime problem.
>>
>> True, yet the murder rate for Black-Americans regardless of
>> economic standing is higher then for other ethnic groups.
>>
>> https://ibb.co/sCybsYW
>>
>>> So it is not necessary to wade into controversy by ascribing
>>> some sort of inferiority to black Americans.
>>
>> Its not some kinda genetic inferiority, its clearly cultural.
>> While the Black murder rate (and other negative metrics) prior
>> to the 1970s was higher then the White rate, it wasn't that
>> much higher despite Blacks literally living in an apartheid
>> state but after LBJ's "Great Society" reforms, their murder
>> rate sky rocketed and has remained ridiculously high ever
>> since.
>>
>> Again; half the murders in the U.S. are committed by 2-3% of
>> the population who are young Black males. This has NOTHING to
>> do with guns, as Whites, Hispanics, Asians and every other
>> ethnic group in the U.S. has the same access to guns as Blacks
>> yet for some reason, they're not killing each other in record
>> numbers.
>>
>> https://ibb.co/KzS8WF9
>>
>>> Either being better able to earn a living through honest work
>>> will cure any cultural flaws of black Americans... or the
>>> different reaction to poverty can be explained by things like
>>> the "invisible uniform" effect or alienation from the dominant
>>> society.
>>
>> Are you claiming that this "invisible uniform" (however you
>> define that) is WORSE TODAY in the U.S. then it was when Black
>> folks were subjected to open and institutionalized racism on a
>> daily basis and trapped under an economic glass ceiling prior
>> to the 1960s?
>>
> An openly "subjected" people will generally try to keep their
> heads down to avoid triggering severe punishment for petty
> slights.

So you're saying that black people are inherently more violent and
prone to criminality?

That seems like a pretty bold statement these days.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

Paul S Person <psperson1@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote in
news:ibg1dgt4v786msr2t23ct739ueuphprl27@4ax.com:

> On Sun, 20 Jun 2021 20:33:19 -0400, J. Clarke
> <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 20 Jun 2021 16:45:24 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
>><dtravel@sonic.net> wrote:
>>
>>>On 6/20/2021 2:50 PM, edstas...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>> Dimensional Traveler
>>>>>> Ed Stasiak
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Are you claiming that this "invisible uniform" (however you
>>>>>> define that) is WORSE TODAY in the U.S. then it was when
>>>>>> Black folks were subjected to open and institutionalized
>>>>>> racism on a daily basis and trapped under an economic glass
>>>>>> ceiling prior to the 1960s?
>>>>>
>>>>> An openly "subjected" people will generally try to keep
>>>>> their heads down to avoid triggering severe punishment for
>>>>> petty slights.
>>>>>
>>>>> A people that have been told officially that they are
>>>>> treated equally and have the same opportunities as the rest
>>>>> of the population but don't see that happening WILL start
>>>>> "acting out" in frustration in a variety of ways. More
>>>>> violence in general is one way. Rejection of the larger
>>>>> culture is another. Killing "their own" who "sell out" by
>>>>> succeeding in the larger culture is another. Lashing out at
>>>>> the larger society for not doing as well because one
>>>>> rejected it is another. Violent reaction to being beaten
>>>>> down by people telling you they aren't beating you down
>>>>> for being different is common. More common than violent
>>>>> reaction to being beaten down by those who openly subjugate
>>>>> you.
>>>>>
>>>>> Its not so much that their situation is worse today as the
>>>>> unfulfilled promise that they are and will be treated as
>>>>> equals makes them more willing to use violence to force the
>>>>> promise to be fulfilled, INSTANTLY. (Which simply isn't
>>>>> possible since there is at least a small portion of
>>>>> meritocracy involved in advancing in our society. It takes
>>>>> time to build the education, experience and social
>>>>> connections to advance.) But by our nature as humans we are
>>>>> not all that good as a species at specifically targeted
>>>>> violence. General mayhem at targets of opportunity is more
>>>>> our thing.
>>>>
>>>> So back to the unsubstantiated standardized �it�s White
>>>> people�s fault!� excuse, which can�t be countered as there is
>>>> nothing concrete to address, one must simply accept it as
>>>> fact or be labeled a racist. Got it.
>>>>
>>>Not what I said. It is much more complex than any simple "Its
>>>THEIR fault!".
>>
>>This whole business of "fault" is part of the problem. I used
>>to work for a little tiny company. Whenever anything went
>>wrong, the boss wanted to know whose fault it was. Now I work
>>for a great big company. Whenever anything goes wrong, the boss
>>wants to know how we change the system so it doesn't happen
>>again. (note that I've worked for great big companies where
>>blame is the game too--where I work now is exceptional).
>
> Indeed.
>
> Fixing the problem is better than placing the blame.
>
> But also less satisfying.
>
> And, besides, if the argument is about /who is at fault/, then
> the discussion of /how to fix the problem/ can be ... shelved.

If you *solve* the problem, you can no longer get wealthy leading
teh charge against it.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

Kevrob <kevrob@my-deja.com> wrote in
news:9d45913d-8658-4510-9bea-2a962ac676d8n@googlegroups.com:

> On Friday, June 18, 2021 at 1:14:43 PM UTC-4, Jibini Kula
> Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
>> "edstas...@gmail.com" <edstas...@gmail.com> wrote in
>> news:62488d91-7af7-4fff...@googlegroups.com:
>> > There is no point where anti-gun fundies will ever say;
>> > "that's enough gun control".
>> >
>> That's simply not true. "Enough gun control" is when they have
>> all teh guns, and can kill anyone they want at any time for no
>> reason without fear of any consequences. They've made that
>> *very* clear. --
>
> Then it's time for "sword control."
>
> {As the peasants turn farming tools into pikes, or bills.
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_(weapon) }
>
It's been discussed in particularly anti-gun countries, when
criminals turned to knives instead.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

"edstas...@gmail.com" <edstasiak1067@gmail.com> wrote in
news:43ac5b89-d862-481f-9eb8-61c35c15dce3n@googlegroups.com:

>> Paul S Person
>> > J. Clarke
>> >
>> > Evething is disgusting to liberals. Except more and more and
>> > more government control.
>>
>> And yet it is in /Texas/, hardly a liberal State whose Guv touts
>> individual freedom, that people with "smart" thermostats are
>> having them adjusted by the power company to save energy.
>
> That's not unique to Texas.

Indeed. Californiastan was warning of possible blackouts during the
heat wave last week. Again.

And California isn't exactly a bastion of conservative politics, now
is it?

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

On 6/21/2021 9:43 AM, edstas...@gmail.com wrote:
> J. Clarke
>> Dimensional Traveler
>>> Ed Stasiak
>>>>
>>>> So back to the unsubstantiated standardized “it’s White people’s fault!”
>>>> excuse, which can’t be countered as there is nothing concrete to address,
>>>> one must simply accept it as fact or be labeled a racist. Got it.
>>>
>>> Not what I said. It is much more complex than any simple "Its THEIR fault!".
>>
>> This whole business of "fault" is part of the problem.
>
> I agree, the claim that guns are at fault and thus ALL Americans should be
> stripped of their right to keep & bear arms has been proven again and again
> over the decades to be bullshit.
>
> Its a willful disregard for scientific evidence to promote a political agenda and
> something that those here would never support on any other subject but when
> it comes to guns, they turn their brain off and go along with the propaganda.
>
> The simply fact is that guns are not and have never been the problem and
> imposing gun control does not and will not fix the problem, as criminals who
> are willing to rob, rape and kill aren’t dissuaded by gun laws, the ONLY people
> who are affected are the already law abiding victims of criminals.
>
At least have the common decency to NOT fuck around with the
attributions. Or to try to imply that I was saying ANYTHING about gun
control when you know I wasn't even when you couldn't be bothered to
read or have the ability to understand what I had posted.

--
Troll, troll, troll your post gently down the thread
Angrily, angrily, angrily, the net's a nut's scream.

On Monday, June 21, 2021 at 7:20:42 PM UTC-4, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
> Kevrob <kev...@my-deja.com> wrote in
> news:9d45913d-8658-4510...@googlegroups.com:
>
> > On Friday, June 18, 2021 at 1:14:43 PM UTC-4, Jibini Kula
> > Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
> >> "edstas...@gmail.com" <edstas...@gmail.com> wrote in
> >> news:62488d91-7af7-4fff...@googlegroups.com:
> >> > There is no point where anti-gun fundies will ever say;
> >> > "that's enough gun control".
> >> >
> >> That's simply not true. "Enough gun control" is when they have
> >> all teh guns, and can kill anyone they want at any time for no
> >> reason without fear of any consequences. They've made that
> >> *very* clear. --
> >
> > Then it's time for "sword control."
> >
> > {As the peasants turn farming tools into pikes, or bills.
> >
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_(weapon) }
> >
> It's been discussed in particularly anti-gun countries, when
> criminals turned to knives instead.

Again, to throw some actual facts into this tempest in a teacup.

2019: Australia has 0.15 gun homicides/100,000
2017: US has 4.46/100,000

https://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate

Pt