On Thu, 1 Jul 2021 20:46:20 -0000 (UTC), Magewolf <Magewolf@nc.rr.com>
wrote:

>On Thu, 01 Jul 2021 08:45:21 -0700, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
>wrote:
>
>> "edstas...@gmail.com" <edstasiak1067@gmail.com> wrote in
>> news:0d10ac3b-cf07-4cb4-9ed3-533b29d5d171n@googlegroups.com:
>>
>>>> Steve Coltrin
>>>> > Dorothy J Heydt
>>>> >
>>>> > And let's not forget Bayta Darrell, and her daughter Arkady.
>>>>
>>>> Oh, and characters who were men in the stories being women in the
>>>> series
>>>
>>>> is apparently some sort of war crime.
>>>
>>> It's a valid complaint, as these remakes that change the cast into
>>> women or minorities are presented as being somehow "empowering" when
>>> they’re actually all about attacking and tearing down White men and
>>> Western civilization.
>>
>> What it' about is making money. If you make a movie that offends a
>> significant part of the potential audience, you won't get to make any
>> more movies.
>
>Who would not having the correct percentage of minorities(determined by
>who?) actually offend? A few people on twitter and their sock-puppet
>accounts? It is not like I said to myself I can not go to Black Panther
>because there are not enough white people in it.

It had white people in it? (No, seriously: I saw it but memory fades).

My take was that it was like watching a good Tarzan movie -- without
Tarzan.

Guess which part of Burrough's works I was reading at the time?
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."

On Thu, 01 Jul 2021 15:35:48 -0700, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
<taustinca@gmail.com> wrote:

>Magewolf <Magewolf@nc.rr.com> wrote in
>news:sbl9ir$ch1$2@dont-email.me:
>
>> On Thu, 01 Jul 2021 08:45:21 -0700, Jibini Kula Tumbili
>> Kujisalimisha wrote:
>>
>>> "edstas...@gmail.com" <edstasiak1067@gmail.com> wrote in
>>> news:0d10ac3b-cf07-4cb4-9ed3-533b29d5d171n@googlegroups.com:
>>>
>>>>> Steve Coltrin
>>>>> > Dorothy J Heydt
>>>>> >
>>>>> > And let's not forget Bayta Darrell, and her daughter
>>>>> > Arkady.
>>>>>
>>>>> Oh, and characters who were men in the stories being women in
>>>>> the series
>>>>
>>>>> is apparently some sort of war crime.
>>>>
>>>> It's a valid complaint, as these remakes that change the cast
>>>> into women or minorities are presented as being somehow
>>>> "empowering" when they’re actually all about attacking and
>>>> tearing down White men and Western civilization.
>>>
>>> What it' about is making money. If you make a movie that
>>> offends a significant part of the potential audience, you won't
>>> get to make any more movies.
>>
>> Who would not having the correct percentage of
>> minorities(determined by who?) actually offend?
>
>If you're really interested, go read . . . pretty much anything
>about any movie in the last 10 years, and note the bylines.
>
>> A few people on
>> twitter and their sock-puppet accounts? It is not like I said
>> to myself I can not go to Black Panther because there are not
>> enough white people in it.
>>
>And yet, there are those did just that.

And they missed ... a not-too-bad Marvel's Avengers movie.

Ho, hum!
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."

On Fri, 02 Jul 2021 14:17:41 GMT, Ninapenda Jibini
<taustinca@gmail.com> wrote:

>"edstas...@gmail.com" <edstasiak1067@gmail.com> wrote in
>news:f2dd9006-e490-4ac7-b8a2-3ffa6c4ea93en@googlegroups.com:
>
>>> Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
>>> > Ed Stasiak
>>> >
>>> > It's a valid complaint, as these remakes that change the cast
>>> > into women or minorities are presented as being somehow
>>> > "empowering" when they’re actually all about attacking and
>>> > tearing down White men and Western civilization.
>>>
>>> What it' about is making money. If you make a movie that
>>> offends a significant part of the potential audience, you won't
>>> get to make any more movies.
>>
>> Making money is a secondary consideration to promoting an agenda
>> and those in Hollywood are True Believers at the forefront of
>> the propaganda campaign.
>
>You are an idiot. Not that this hasn't been obvious for some time.
>
>Again: shiny side in or out?

Is there some reason it can't have /two/ shiny sides?

Just askin'.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."

Paul S Person <psperson1@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote in
news:phhudg92crspm6uuiua7adknvric12v9b8@4ax.com:

> On Thu, 01 Jul 2021 15:35:48 -0700, Jibini Kula Tumbili
> Kujisalimisha <taustinca@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Magewolf <Magewolf@nc.rr.com> wrote in
>>news:sbl9ir$ch1$2@dont-email.me:
>>
>>> On Thu, 01 Jul 2021 08:45:21 -0700, Jibini Kula Tumbili
>>> Kujisalimisha wrote:
>>>
>>>> "edstas...@gmail.com" <edstasiak1067@gmail.com> wrote in
>>>> news:0d10ac3b-cf07-4cb4-9ed3-533b29d5d171n@googlegroups.com:
>>>>
>>>>>> Steve Coltrin
>>>>>> > Dorothy J Heydt
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > And let's not forget Bayta Darrell, and her daughter
>>>>>> > Arkady.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Oh, and characters who were men in the stories being women
>>>>>> in the series
>>>>>
>>>>>> is apparently some sort of war crime.
>>>>>
>>>>> It's a valid complaint, as these remakes that change the
>>>>> cast into women or minorities are presented as being somehow
>>>>> "empowering" when they’re actually all about attacking and
>>>>> tearing down White men and Western civilization.
>>>>
>>>> What it' about is making money. If you make a movie that
>>>> offends a significant part of the potential audience, you
>>>> won't get to make any more movies.
>>>
>>> Who would not having the correct percentage of
>>> minorities(determined by who?) actually offend?
>>
>>If you're really interested, go read . . . pretty much anything
>>about any movie in the last 10 years, and note the bylines.
>>
>>> A few people on
>>> twitter and their sock-puppet accounts? It is not like I said
>>> to myself I can not go to Black Panther because there are not
>>> enough white people in it.
>>>
>>And yet, there are those did just that.
>
> And they missed ... a not-too-bad Marvel's Avengers movie.
>
> Ho, hum!

It was highly regarded, to be sure. But for me, it's unforgivable
sin was that it came out after I was over superhero movies.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

Paul S Person <psperson1@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote in
news:0mhudgdkf84d8d4qpli6gm4ll0d5u61fp7@4ax.com:

> On Fri, 02 Jul 2021 14:17:41 GMT, Ninapenda Jibini
> <taustinca@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>"edstas...@gmail.com" <edstasiak1067@gmail.com> wrote in
>>news:f2dd9006-e490-4ac7-b8a2-3ffa6c4ea93en@googlegroups.com:
>>
>>>> Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
>>>> > Ed Stasiak
>>>> >
>>>> > It's a valid complaint, as these remakes that change the
>>>> > cast into women or minorities are presented as being
>>>> > somehow "empowering" when they’re actually all about
>>>> > attacking and tearing down White men and Western
>>>> > civilization.
>>>>
>>>> What it' about is making money. If you make a movie that
>>>> offends a significant part of the potential audience, you
>>>> won't get to make any more movies.
>>>
>>> Making money is a secondary consideration to promoting an
>>> agenda and those in Hollywood are True Believers at the
>>> forefront of the propaganda campaign.
>>
>>You are an idiot. Not that this hasn't been obvious for some
>>time.
>>
>>Again: shiny side in or out?
>
> Is there some reason it can't have /two/ shiny sides?
>
> Just askin'.

That would both enhance the tracking satellites *and* absorb even
more of the mind control alsers, you fool!

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

On Fri, 2 Jul 2021 05:08:33 -0700 (PDT), "edstas...@gmail.com"
<edstasiak1067@gmail.com> wrote:

>> Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
>> > Ed Stasiak
>> >
>> > It's a valid complaint, as these remakes that change the cast
>> > into women or minorities are presented as being somehow
>> > "empowering" when they’re actually all about attacking and
>> > tearing down White men and Western civilization.
>>
>> What it' about is making money. If you make a movie that offends
>> a significant part of the potential audience, you won't get to make
>> any more movies.
>
>Making money is a secondary consideration to promoting an agenda
>and those in Hollywood are True Believers at the forefront of the
>propaganda campaign.

Well, then they won't be in business much longer, will they?

"Bums on seats" is all its about.

>> Movies (like science fiction) reflect the society they're made for,
>> not the other way around. And right now, you're in a minority. How
>> small a minority is hard to say, but definition a minority of the
>> movie going public, at least.
>
>Then why for instance, base the new Star Wars movies around female
>characters (as well as the new Star Trek tv show and Doctor Who, etc.)
>when the fanbase is overwhelmingly male and gals aren’t particularly
>interested in sci-fi?

Do you actually have to be /told/ why a mostly-male fanbase would be
attracted to a female cast?

>> > The result is they only further the belief that women and
>> > minorities can't create their own art and have to steal it from
>> > White men.
>>
>> Shiny side in, or out? A tough question. Shiny side out reflects
>> the orbital tracking satellites, but shiny side in absorbs the mind
>> control lasers.
>
>And yet we see this happening again and again while at the same
>time, the occasional production with a White actor replacing the
>original non-White character (such as Scarlett Johansson in “Ghost
>in the Shell”) are vilified as “cultural appropriation!”.

Appropriation or not, it wasn't that good a film. I liked it better
than the animated version, but not by much.

>Meanwhile, the Brits just released a _historical_ tv drama series
>about Anne Boleyn with a Black actress in the staring role and when
>many pointed out how utterly ridiculous this is, they were told it
>doesn’t matter who the actor is and it's racist to complain about it.
>
>https://www.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article23534869.ece/alternates/s615/3_Anne_Boleyn_played_by_Jodie_Turner-Smith_5995_jpg_m14736ed.jpg

Now, now, they just want to have their cake and eat it too. Just as
the alt-right does.

What goes around, comes around.

I fairly recently saw a Dicken's adaptation that did something like
that. It mostly worked fine. Not a bad adaptation, either.

>I wonder what the reaction would be if the shoe was on the other foot?
>
>https://ibb.co/gD75bVT
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."

Paul S Person <psperson1@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote in
news:onhudgltjfgirg39d1vpsqenjbp8eq2spn@4ax.com:

> Do you actually have to be /told/ why a mostly-male fanbase
> would be attracted to a female cast?
>
Indeed. When was the last time you saw a big budget film starring an
overweight actress that wasn't a comedy? And it's only be in recent
years that any female actress has been allowed to be the main
character without looking like a teenager.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

On Fri, 2 Jul 2021 06:04:53 -0700 (PDT), Jack Bohn
<jack.bohn64@gmail.com> wrote:

>Magewolf wrote:
>
>> No offense intended but I have heard that argument a lot and it never
>> made any sense to me. You pay money(often a lot of money) for the rights
>> to something and then act like it is a set of chains you have to
>> destroy. It seems to me if you are so much better than the property you
>> are working on then you would be better off making your own story and
>> putting the rights money into the budget for your own personal story.
>
>In movies and TV it's not a single person making a personal story. It's a hydra satisfying a variety of demands. (Some may be able to wrest enough control to be satisfied that the final product tells a personal tale, pays respect to a friend, or says hi to the kids.)
>
>In copyright-happy times, the project may have started out as a personal story, or at least thought to be original, found not to be so, and rights to a pre-existing work bought to prevent lawsuit -- either from that work, or as cover protecting from a third work.
>
>(Of course, they could also have been intended ripoff, and still seeking cover. My first step into cynicism was seeing Glen Larsen and Universal rip of Star Wars with "Battlestar Galactica," get sued for ripping it off, then make "Buck Rogers" into a ripoff of Star Wars, and not get sued.)
>
>(Actually, there's an answer to the false dichotomy of "if it pisses off a few fans, but makes money, who cares?" Look at "The Shape of Things to Come" (which may actually have the official title of "H. G. Wells' The Shape of Things to Come"). Could it have actually made less money if it had tried to at least be as intelligent as Wells?)

This last point was unclear until I did some spelunking and came
across a film of that name
(<https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0079894/?ref_=nv_sr_srsg_4>) which,
given the plot summary, would fit your description.

There are at least 3 films titled /Things to Come/; AFAIK, only the
1936 version claims any relationship to Wells.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."

On 3/07/21 12:08 am, edstas...@gmail.com wrote:

>
> Meanwhile, the Brits just released a _historical_ tv drama series
> about Anne Boleyn with a Black actress in the staring role and when
> many pointed out how utterly ridiculous this is, they were told it
> doesn’t matter who the actor is and it's racist to complain about it.
>
> https://www.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article23534869.ece/alternates/s615/3_Anne_Boleyn_played_by_Jodie_Turner-Smith_5995_jpg_m14736ed.jpg

> I wonder what the reaction would be if the shoe was on the other foot?
>
> https://ibb.co/gD75bVT

Dear Ed,
As you can not make a distinction between those examples, it is not
surprising that you wear your shoes on the wrong feet. What really
puzzles me is how do you peel your bananas whilst wearing shoes?

On Friday, July 2, 2021 at 10:08:35 PM UTC+10, edstas...@gmail.com wrote:
> gals aren’t particularly interested in sci-fi?

You really are an idiot, aren't you?

-Moriarty

On Fri, 02 Jul 2021 10:06:16 -0700, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
<taustinca@gmail.com> wrote:

>Paul S Person <psperson1@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote in
>news:0mhudgdkf84d8d4qpli6gm4ll0d5u61fp7@4ax.com:
>
>> On Fri, 02 Jul 2021 14:17:41 GMT, Ninapenda Jibini
>> <taustinca@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>"edstas...@gmail.com" <edstasiak1067@gmail.com> wrote in
>>>news:f2dd9006-e490-4ac7-b8a2-3ffa6c4ea93en@googlegroups.com:
>>>
>>>>> Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
>>>>> > Ed Stasiak
>>>>> >
>>>>> > It's a valid complaint, as these remakes that change the
>>>>> > cast into women or minorities are presented as being
>>>>> > somehow "empowering" when they’re actually all about
>>>>> > attacking and tearing down White men and Western
>>>>> > civilization.
>>>>>
>>>>> What it' about is making money. If you make a movie that
>>>>> offends a significant part of the potential audience, you
>>>>> won't get to make any more movies.
>>>>
>>>> Making money is a secondary consideration to promoting an
>>>> agenda and those in Hollywood are True Believers at the
>>>> forefront of the propaganda campaign.
>>>
>>>You are an idiot. Not that this hasn't been obvious for some
>>>time.
>>>
>>>Again: shiny side in or out?
>>
>> Is there some reason it can't have /two/ shiny sides?
>>
>> Just askin'.
>
>That would both enhance the tracking satellites *and* absorb even
>more of the mind control alsers, you fool!

Ahh!

Thanks for the clarification!
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."

On Fri, 02 Jul 2021 09:05:54 -0700, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
<taustinca@gmail.com> wrote:

>scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) wrote in
>news:7EGDI.17513$Vj7.12139@fx46.iad:
>
>> Jack Bohn <jack.bohn64@gmail.com> writes:
>>>Scott Lurndal wrote:
>>>>=20
>>>> How many people in the world have actually read _Foundation_
>>>> et alia?=20
>>>
>>>Enough people, cumulatively over its first thirty-some years to
>>>put the fou= rth book on the best-seller list when it came out.
>>
>> Today it takes selling 5000 copies a week to be a best seller.
>> Not sure what it was back in the 1970s.
>>
>> On the scale of a potential global television audience, that's
>> still in the noise.
>>
>There are commercials that get better ratings than that.

One of the reasons I stopped watching broadcast TV was that it was
apparent that the commercials had more effort and more money put into
them (on a per-minute basis) than the filler -- er, the actual shows.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."

Paul S Person <psperson1@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote in
news:9q31egtu6nkvatfo77dnuni335k5grfknl@4ax.com:

> On Fri, 02 Jul 2021 09:05:54 -0700, Jibini Kula Tumbili
> Kujisalimisha <taustinca@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) wrote in
>>news:7EGDI.17513$Vj7.12139@fx46.iad:
>>
>>> Jack Bohn <jack.bohn64@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>Scott Lurndal wrote:
>>>>>=20
>>>>> How many people in the world have actually read _Foundation_
>>>>> et alia?=20
>>>>
>>>>Enough people, cumulatively over its first thirty-some years
>>>>to put the fou= rth book on the best-seller list when it came
>>>>out.
>>>
>>> Today it takes selling 5000 copies a week to be a best seller.
>>> Not sure what it was back in the 1970s.
>>>
>>> On the scale of a potential global television audience, that's
>>> still in the noise.
>>>
>>There are commercials that get better ratings than that.
>
> One of the reasons I stopped watching broadcast TV was that it
> was apparent that the commercials had more effort and more money
> put into them (on a per-minute basis) than the filler -- er, the
> actual shows.

About 90% of what I watch is reruns from the 70s (and even
earlier). Some shows hold up surprisingly well.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.

On 30/06/2021 18.41, Kevrob wrote:
> On Wednesday, June 30, 2021 at 4:08:34 PM UTC-4, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:

>> How about recasting Wonder Woman as a man? Prince Dane of the all
>> male island of something-mumble, and so on. You *really* think
>> there wouldn't be the same (only more so) reaction to a Wonder Man
>> movie?

> Sometimes a "gender-flip" adds something. My favorite is
> Roz Russell as Hildy Johnson, turning "The Front Page" into
> "His Girl Friday."
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/His_Girl_Friday

John Varley went one better in _Steel Beach_ by having Hildy start
out (in the novel) as male and then switch to female. Now I need to
reread it to see if some character is a Cary Grant analog.

--
Michael F. Stemper
This sentence no verb.

In article <sbqd3a$74b$1@dont-email.me>,
Michael F. Stemper <michael.stemper@gmail.com> wrote:
>On 30/06/2021 18.41, Kevrob wrote:
>> On Wednesday, June 30, 2021 at 4:08:34 PM UTC-4, Jibini Kula Tumbili
>Kujisalimisha wrote:
>
>>> How about recasting Wonder Woman as a man? Prince Dane of the all
>>> male island of something-mumble, and so on. You *really* think
>>> there wouldn't be the same (only more so) reaction to a Wonder Man
>>> movie?
>
>> Sometimes a "gender-flip" adds something. My favorite is
>> Roz Russell as Hildy Johnson, turning "The Front Page" into
>> "His Girl Friday."
>>
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/His_Girl_Friday
>
>John Varley went one better in _Steel Beach_ by having Hildy start
>out (in the novel) as male and then switch to female. Now I need to
>reread it to see if some character is a Cary Grant analog.

Well, let us know. Now, if you'd generalized it as a
gender-switching story of any kind with a Cary Grant analog, I'd
recommend "Some Like It Hot," in which Tony Curtis's character,
when not hiding from the mob in female clothing, adopts a Cary
Grant accent to woo Marilyn Monroe's character. He came by the
accent almost honestly; he was in the US Navy during WWII and
stationed someplace where there was a projector but only a few
films, one of which starred Grant. The guys got to the point
where they knew every line of dialog, so they'd turn the sound
off and recite the dialog themselves. Curtis got to voice
Grant.

--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
Www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/

On Thu, 01 Jul 2021 09:41:42 -0700, Paul S Person
<psperson1@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote:

Actually, thinking further about this

>In which the "dumb blond" is revealed to be not "dumb" at all, albeit
>a bit strange.

I think it was inaccurate.

I don't think she was a "dumb blond" at all. Or "strange"; perhaps
that is best regarded as a sign that I was (perhaps am) still
recovering from the heat wave.

At least, not if Marilyn Monroe's characters in /The Seven Year Itch/
and /Some Like It Hot/ are "dumb blonds".

I think the secretary was a person of normal intelligence who
graduated High School, having taken the Business Course option. She
may also have taken Night School classes to enhance her skills.

I should note that she does not appear to be intimidated at all by the
computer system they set her up with. The film came out in 1984, when
PCs were not all that common. But she appears to have seen them
before.

She is not, of course, on a par with the three founders, who were all
PhDs. OK, one may have had a PhD in underwater basket weaving for all
we could tell, but another might have had one in the scholarly study
of the paranormal, and the third was almost certainly some sort of
engineer. But that doesn't make her dumb; it makes her normal.

All this being, of course, IMHO.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."

On Sat, 3 Jul 2021 21:55:47 GMT, djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt)
wrote:

>In article <sbqd3a$74b$1@dont-email.me>,
>Michael F. Stemper <michael.stemper@gmail.com> wrote:
>>On 30/06/2021 18.41, Kevrob wrote:
>>> On Wednesday, June 30, 2021 at 4:08:34 PM UTC-4, Jibini Kula Tumbili
>>Kujisalimisha wrote:
>>
>>>> How about recasting Wonder Woman as a man? Prince Dane of the all
>>>> male island of something-mumble, and so on. You *really* think
>>>> there wouldn't be the same (only more so) reaction to a Wonder Man
>>>> movie?
>>
>>> Sometimes a "gender-flip" adds something. My favorite is
>>> Roz Russell as Hildy Johnson, turning "The Front Page" into
>>> "His Girl Friday."
>>>
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/His_Girl_Friday
>>
>>John Varley went one better in _Steel Beach_ by having Hildy start
>>out (in the novel) as male and then switch to female. Now I need to
>>reread it to see if some character is a Cary Grant analog.
>
>Well, let us know. Now, if you'd generalized it as a
>gender-switching story of any kind with a Cary Grant analog, I'd
>recommend "Some Like It Hot," in which Tony Curtis's character,
>when not hiding from the mob in female clothing, adopts a Cary
>Grant accent to woo Marilyn Monroe's character. He came by the
>accent almost honestly; he was in the US Navy during WWII and
>stationed someplace where there was a projector but only a few
>films, one of which starred Grant. The guys got to the point
>where they knew every line of dialog, so they'd turn the sound
>off and recite the dialog themselves. Curtis got to voice
>Grant.

It's not really gender-switching, but Cary Grant spends about half of
"Bringing Up Baby" wearing Katherine Hepburn's bathrobe.

In article <lnc2eg5skvr46jk22u4r9uigbm7hniq91g@4ax.com>,
J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Sat, 3 Jul 2021 21:55:47 GMT, djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt)
>wrote:
>
>>In article <sbqd3a$74b$1@dont-email.me>,
>>Michael F. Stemper <michael.stemper@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>On 30/06/2021 18.41, Kevrob wrote:
>>>> On Wednesday, June 30, 2021 at 4:08:34 PM UTC-4, Jibini Kula Tumbili
>>>Kujisalimisha wrote:
>>>
>>>>> How about recasting Wonder Woman as a man? Prince Dane of the all
>>>>> male island of something-mumble, and so on. You *really* think
>>>>> there wouldn't be the same (only more so) reaction to a Wonder Man
>>>>> movie?
>>>
>>>> Sometimes a "gender-flip" adds something. My favorite is
>>>> Roz Russell as Hildy Johnson, turning "The Front Page" into
>>>> "His Girl Friday."
>>>>
>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/His_Girl_Friday
>>>
>>>John Varley went one better in _Steel Beach_ by having Hildy start
>>>out (in the novel) as male and then switch to female. Now I need to
>>>reread it to see if some character is a Cary Grant analog.
>>
>>Well, let us know. Now, if you'd generalized it as a
>>gender-switching story of any kind with a Cary Grant analog, I'd
>>recommend "Some Like It Hot," in which Tony Curtis's character,
>>when not hiding from the mob in female clothing, adopts a Cary
>>Grant accent to woo Marilyn Monroe's character. He came by the
>>accent almost honestly; he was in the US Navy during WWII and
>>stationed someplace where there was a projector but only a few
>>films, one of which starred Grant. The guys got to the point
>>where they knew every line of dialog, so they'd turn the sound
>>off and recite the dialog themselves. Curtis got to voice
>>Grant.
>
>It's not really gender-switching, but Cary Grant spends about half of
>"Bringing Up Baby" wearing Katherine Hepburn's bathrobe.

That's because he just went gay all of a sudden.
--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..

On 4 Jul 2021 06:10:08 GMT, ted@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan <tednolan>)
wrote:

>In article <lnc2eg5skvr46jk22u4r9uigbm7hniq91g@4ax.com>,
>J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>On Sat, 3 Jul 2021 21:55:47 GMT, djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt)
>>wrote:
>>
>>>In article <sbqd3a$74b$1@dont-email.me>,
>>>Michael F. Stemper <michael.stemper@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>On 30/06/2021 18.41, Kevrob wrote:
>>>>> On Wednesday, June 30, 2021 at 4:08:34 PM UTC-4, Jibini Kula Tumbili
>>>>Kujisalimisha wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> How about recasting Wonder Woman as a man? Prince Dane of the all
>>>>>> male island of something-mumble, and so on. You *really* think
>>>>>> there wouldn't be the same (only more so) reaction to a Wonder Man
>>>>>> movie?
>>>>
>>>>> Sometimes a "gender-flip" adds something. My favorite is
>>>>> Roz Russell as Hildy Johnson, turning "The Front Page" into
>>>>> "His Girl Friday."
>>>>>
>>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/His_Girl_Friday
>>>>
>>>>John Varley went one better in _Steel Beach_ by having Hildy start
>>>>out (in the novel) as male and then switch to female. Now I need to
>>>>reread it to see if some character is a Cary Grant analog.
>>>
>>>Well, let us know. Now, if you'd generalized it as a
>>>gender-switching story of any kind with a Cary Grant analog, I'd
>>>recommend "Some Like It Hot," in which Tony Curtis's character,
>>>when not hiding from the mob in female clothing, adopts a Cary
>>>Grant accent to woo Marilyn Monroe's character. He came by the
>>>accent almost honestly; he was in the US Navy during WWII and
>>>stationed someplace where there was a projector but only a few
>>>films, one of which starred Grant. The guys got to the point
>>>where they knew every line of dialog, so they'd turn the sound
>>>off and recite the dialog themselves. Curtis got to voice
>>>Grant.
>>
>>It's not really gender-switching, but Cary Grant spends about half of
>>"Bringing Up Baby" wearing Katherine Hepburn's bathrobe.
>
>That's because he just went gay all of a sudden.

IIRC people making that assumption was part of the humor.

On Saturday, 3 July 2021 at 20:17:01 UTC+1, Michael F. Stemper wrote:
> On 30/06/2021 18.41, Kevrob wrote:
> > On Wednesday, June 30, 2021 at 4:08:34 PM UTC-4, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
>
> >> How about recasting Wonder Woman as a man? Prince Dane of the all
> >> male island of something-mumble, and so on. You *really* think
> >> there wouldn't be the same (only more so) reaction to a Wonder Man
> >> movie?
> > Sometimes a "gender-flip" adds something. My favorite is
> > Roz Russell as Hildy Johnson, turning "The Front Page" into
> > "His Girl Friday."
> >
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/His_Girl_Friday
>
> John Varley went one better in _Steel Beach_ by having Hildy start
> out (in the novel) as male and then switch to female. Now I need to
> reread it to see if some character is a Cary Grant analog.

Comics didn't invent the Amazons. The premise
was that a society of women not oppressed by men
would be achieved by not having any. In comics
at least, or some of them, the positions of gods and
goddesses as regards sexual politics also are a factor.
Sending Hippolyta's daughter as an ambassador for
peace is modern, as far as I know. If that's what she
was doing during her original Second World War
appearances. Also, her real life inventor was so kinky
that they are still making movies about that.

A society of men with no women is seen in various
religious communities, with the question of how
laundry is done addressed by not having any.
However, Captain America's original situation
was an American army camp which I suppose
probably was all guys, I don't know. It really is
not quite the same.

On 04/07/2021 10.05, Robert Carnegie wrote:
> On Saturday, 3 July 2021 at 20:17:01 UTC+1, Michael F. Stemper wrote:
>> On 30/06/2021 18.41, Kevrob wrote:
>>> On Wednesday, June 30, 2021 at 4:08:34 PM UTC-4, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
>>
>>>> How about recasting Wonder Woman as a man? Prince Dane of the all
>>>> male island of something-mumble, and so on. You *really* think
>>>> there wouldn't be the same (only more so) reaction to a Wonder Man
>>>> movie?
>>> Sometimes a "gender-flip" adds something. My favorite is
>>> Roz Russell as Hildy Johnson, turning "The Front Page" into
>>> "His Girl Friday."
>>>
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/His_Girl_Friday
>>
>> John Varley went one better in _Steel Beach_ by having Hildy start
>> out (in the novel) as male and then switch to female. Now I need to
>> reread it to see if some character is a Cary Grant analog.
>
> Comics didn't invent the Amazons. The premise
> was that a society of women not oppressed by men
> would be achieved by not having any.

What does this have to do with:
1. _The Front Page_
2. _His Girl Friday-
3. _Steel Beach_
??

--
Michael F. Stemper
This sentence no verb.

On Fri, 2 Jul 2021 06:04:53 -0700 (PDT), Jack Bohn
<jack.bohn64@gmail.com> wrote:

>(Actually, there's an answer to the false dichotomy of "if it pisses off a few fans, but makes money, who cares?" Look at "The Shape of Things to Come" (which may actually have the official title of "H. G. Wells' The Shape of Things to Come"). Could it have actually made less money if it had tried to at least be as intelligent as Wells?)

You know Wells himself oversaw the movie's production, right?

--
My webpage is at http://www.watt-evans.com
My latest novel is Tom Derringer & the Steam-Powered Saurians.

Ninapenda Jibini <taustinca@gmail.com> writes:
>Paul S Person <psperson1@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote in
>news:9q31egtu6nkvatfo77dnuni335k5grfknl@4ax.com:
>
>> On Fri, 02 Jul 2021 09:05:54 -0700, Jibini Kula Tumbili
>> Kujisalimisha <taustinca@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) wrote in
>>>news:7EGDI.17513$Vj7.12139@fx46.iad:
>>>
>>>> Jack Bohn <jack.bohn64@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>>Scott Lurndal wrote:
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> How many people in the world have actually read _Foundation_
>>>>>> et alia?=20
>>>>>
>>>>>Enough people, cumulatively over its first thirty-some years
>>>>>to put the fou= rth book on the best-seller list when it came
>>>>>out.
>>>>
>>>> Today it takes selling 5000 copies a week to be a best seller.
>>>> Not sure what it was back in the 1970s.
>>>>
>>>> On the scale of a potential global television audience, that's
>>>> still in the noise.
>>>>
>>>There are commercials that get better ratings than that.
>>
>> One of the reasons I stopped watching broadcast TV was that it
>> was apparent that the commercials had more effort and more money
>> put into them (on a per-minute basis) than the filler -- er, the
>> actual shows.
>
>About 90% of what I watch is reruns from the 70s (and even
>earlier). Some shows hold up surprisingly well.

_Laugh In_ on IMDB tv has been enjoyable. Old carson shows
on YouTube. Hogan's Hero's is a guilty pleasure.

Lawrence Watt-Evans wrote:
> On Fri, 2 Jul 2021 06:04:53 -0700 (PDT), Jack Bohn
> <jack....@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >(Actually, there's an answer to the false dichotomy of "if it pisses off a few fans, but makes money, who cares?" Look at "The Shape of Things to Come" (which may actually have the official title of "H. G. Wells' The Shape of Things to Come"). Could it have actually made less money if it had tried to at least be as intelligent as Wells?)
> You know Wells himself oversaw the movie's production, right?

That's the trick I'm talking about! When Star Wars began making so much money, other studios began trying for some by creating characters, backgrounds, and events as much like Star Wars as possible. They also began looking at existing properties and seeing if those characters, backgrounds, and events could be twisted to be as much like Star Wars as possible. Buck Rogers, Star Trek, and Flash Gordon got revivals more or less influenced by Star Wars, _Moonraker_ and "Enemy Mine" got adaptations, as did the legend of Perseus and Medusa, which threw in Hephaestus making a clockwork robotic Owl-2 D-2. My theory is that as existing properties, they stove off lawsuits from 20th Century Fox. In these days of sequels, remakes, and reboots, I theorize that additionally as properties whose ownership is settled, they help stave off efforts by the writers who make them interesting and directors who make them exciting to get a bigger cut of the pie.

By far the worst example (and I think even Sea Wasp -- who is an anime fan, and a Lensman fan, but not a fan of the Lensman anime -- will agree,) is a movie advertised as "H. G. Wells' The Shape of Things to Come," an purported sequel to "Things to Come," the movie version of the book _The Shape of Things to Come_. It is a sequel in name, only, a few characters named Caball. Otherwise it takes a stew of half-thought-through sf ideas: lunar colony, survivors of a war-torn Earth, the alternate dimensions of FTL travel, a megalomaniac on a distant planet using robots as a conquering army, and works its way through them episodically until the good guys blow up the bad guy's fortress at the end. I'm guessing the box office depended less on the merits of the film than on how many theaters needed a movie the week it was offered. Would it have killed their budget to get one revision of the script through some starving sf author of the time? Any intelligence that survived further revisions would be a bonus! (I'm thinking they would try to reference the earlier movie, maybe some aside that from the point of view of the future the war that began at the end of the 1930s WAS fought through the 1950s.)

--
-Jack

On Sun, 04 Jul 2021 17:30:18 -0700, Lawrence Watt-Evans
<misenchantedpress@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Fri, 2 Jul 2021 06:04:53 -0700 (PDT), Jack Bohn
><jack.bohn64@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>(Actually, there's an answer to the false dichotomy of "if it pisses off a few fans, but makes money, who cares?" Look at "The Shape of Things to Come" (which may actually have the official title of "H. G. Wells' The Shape of Things to Come"). Could it have actually made less money if it had tried to at least be as intelligent as Wells?)
>
>You know Wells himself oversaw the movie's production, right?

The 1936 /Things to Come/, yes.

The film in question was done later -- 1979, per Maltin. It's relation
to HG Wells -- well, let's just say that the rule "any film that
claims to be somebody's whatever is nothing of the sort" applies here,
as it does to /Bram Stoker's Dracula/ which, of course, is nothing of
the kind (although, to be fair, it /does/ end up back in
Transylvania).
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."