In article <k2ochmFbct3U3@mid.individual.net>, Jolly Roger
<jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:

> On 2023-01-17, sms <scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:
> > there are still people slow-charging their phones in the mistaken
> > belief that that will extend the life of their phone battery. Neither
> > are true.
>
> There are plenty of others who charge their devices overnight while they
> sleep, where slow charging is perfectly fine.

a concept entirely lost on the trolls.

nospam wrote:

> anyone who claims something other than the laws of physics is not an
> expert of any sort. more accurately, they have an agenda.

With respect to overall lifetime (not the daily use but over years)...

You too, nospam, ignore laws of physics with respect to iPhone batteries.
<https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT208387>
"A normal battery is designed to retain up to 80%
of its original capacity
at 500 complete charge cycles"

Do you notice something about physics there, nospam?
Android battery === much bigger
iPhone battery === laughably puny

Can you low IQ uneducated iKooks do the math?
*The (larger) Android battery will have a longer lifetime*

The reason is that 80% of a puny capacity is a lot less capacity than 80%
of a much larger capacity which almost all the current Android phones have.

You probably don't own the IQ nor education to realize what that means.
*The iPhone battery will _always_ degrade below threshold before Android*

The reason is simple:
An iPhone battery is laughably puny; the (typical) Android battery is not.

You have an agenda, so you ignore the physics that iPhone batteries will
_always_ die sooner than the (typical) Android batteries over its lifetime.

Even Apple says you lose a huge percentage of battery capacity after 500
charges, where both Android and iPhone batteries lose the same percentage.

*A big percentage of a smaller battery is why iPhone batteries die sooner*

If you are pointing out (correctly so, by the way) that Steve is trained in
physics but he ignores the laws of physics (as he did with his T-Mobile
maps) whenever he has his own personal agenda...

Why is it that you, nospam, don't understand the physics of batteries?

You've often made the preposterous claim that the ridiculously laughably
puny iPhone batteries don't degrade below threshold sooner than the much
larger Android batteries do.
By making those statements, *you deny the laws of physics*, nospam.

Since the battery chemistry is similar between a larger versus smaller
capacity battery, and since the aging process is percent per charge, then
over the typical 500 charge lifetime, the iPhone battery will _always_ age
below minimum threshold well before the much larger Android battery will.

*This is simple physics, nospam, which you deny.*

The iPhone battery will always degrade sooner than the Android battery.
It's physics.
--
Posted out of the goodness of my heart to disseminate useful information
which, in this case, is to point out nospam denies basic physics whenever
he tries to defend the laughably puny iPhone battery lifetime claims.

On 17.01.23 22:00, nospam wrote:
>>> there are still people slow-charging their phones in the mistaken
>>> belief that that will extend the life of their phone battery. Neither
>>> are true.
>>
>> There are plenty of others who charge their devices overnight while they
>> sleep, where slow charging is perfectly fine.
>
> a concept entirely lost on the trolls.

I'm happy to not have to charge it every night since it lasts two days now.
And I like when my phone charges in an hour. Sometimes two. Never longer.

It's so fast I don't bother with worrying how low the battery may get to.
With fast charging, I don't need to worry or even think about anything.

It's like breathing.
When you need it, you take a breath.

When you need a charge in the battery, you plug it in and it charges FAST!

On 1/17/2023 10:32 AM, Jerry Friedman wrote:
> On 1/16/23 7:05 PM, sms wrote:
>> If you really want to increase the lifespan of the battery, don't
>> charge it past 80%
>
> Where is the setting on the phone to set that 80% battery charge autolimit?

No such setting in Android or iOS.

There are Android apps can be set to notify you when the battery is at
80% but they won't stop charging.

The reality is that it's not worth worrying about. First of all "100%
charged" is not 100% of the battery capacity, the manufacturer doesn't
charge the battery to the actual 100% capacity nor do they discharge it
to the actual 0% capacity. Any increase in battery life that would
result from keeping the battery between 20% and 80% of the charge level
displayed on the phone would be inconsequential. Just as using a 5W
(5V@1A) charger would have an inconsequential, if any, difference in
battery life versus using an 18W (9V@2A) charger that reduces the
wattage as the battery approaches full charge..

On Jan 17, 2023, sms wrote
(in article<news:tq73un$vdd$1@gioia.aioe.org>):

> There are Android apps can be set to notify you when the battery is at
> 80% but they won't stop charging.

Yes they do stop charging. It's in the Android settings.
Android 12 anyways. It stops at 85%. https://i.redd.it/jzthob0qi4281.jpg
In addition, you can customize the whole charging pattern if you like.

Is this iOS:Android comparative information in your Google doc?

Ron, the humblest guy in town.

On 2023-01-17 14:39, nospam wrote:
> In article <YxCxL.729623$GNG9.362425@fx18.iad>, Alan Browne
> <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
>
>>>>> Where is the setting on the phone to set that 80% battery charge
>>>>> autolimit? [AAA]
>>>>
>>>> There is none, alas [BBB]
>>>
>>> there is. [CCC]
>>

The question was: "Where is the setting on the phone to set that 80%
battery charge autolimit?" [AAA]

My reply was: "There is none" [BBB]

You reply: "There is." [CCC]

But there isn't as your reply below clearly shows.

>> Do tell. I want my iPhone to stop charging at 80%. Not a joule more.
>
> in shortcuts, create a new personal automation, choose battery level,
> set desired charge level & action to occur.
>
> the action can be an alarm, text message or pretty much whatever else
> you want, although to start/stop charging, you will need a homekit
> compatible mains power plug.

That's a little convoluted (not /horribly/ convoluted). I charge my
iPhone at several locations in the house (front hallway, home/work
office off a wart, home/work office off the Mac, in the car on longer
drives, etc.)

Ideally it would be a system setting.

The only homekit plug I had I sent back for not being very good - though
it was at the other end of the house from the WiFi. Should try again
some day.

--
“Donald Trump and his allies and supporters are a clear and present
danger to American democracy.”
- J Michael Luttig - 2022-06-16
- Former US appellate court judge (R) testifying to the January 6
committee

On 17/01/2023 19:54, Alan Browne wrote:

>>> If you really want to increase the lifespan of the battery, don't
>>> charge it past 80%
>>
>> Where is the setting on the phone to set that 80% battery charge autolimit?
>
> There is none, alas

Android 12 phones have a "Protect Battery" capability which will stop
charging at a set percent to prolong the long term life of the phone.

In iOS 13, Apple introduced a different method called "Optimized Battery
Charging" which is their way to reduce the wear on their iPhone batteries.

The main difference between these implementations is "Protect Battery"
physically stops charging the battery above 85% while "Optimized Battery
Charging" tries to reduce the time the iPhone spends fully charged.

The assumption is that you might be around 80% to 90% if not fully charged.
Also on Android are apps which have charging curves you can customize.
--
Regards,
Martin Brown

On Mon, 16 Jan 2023 18:10:41 -0800, sms <scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:

>> Those prices show what I said, and not what you said.
>>
>> You said "Samsung... actually charges more"
>> I said bullshit.
>
> That's why I included the links, so you could easily check the prices
> yourself from Apple, Samsung, and Amazon. But I can't force you to use
> the actual prices charged by the manufacturer. If you want to pay more,
> at a store that charges more than MSRP that's certainly your choice. But
> I'm not going to use unrealistic prices in my document; you can create
> your own document "How to Pay More for Everything."

Can you at least answer the question of whether the Apple and Samsung
chargers support both the common PD and more common QC charging standards?

On Mon, 16 Jan 2023 02:28:40 -0800, sms <scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:

> I think that it's time to stop complaining about this. It's over. Apple
> saved over $6 billion by not including chargers

Not only did Apple save a lot of money by not including chargers, but they
sell at least a stock of their branded chargers now to every store chain.

Do you know if those Apple or Samsung chargers support PD and QC standards?

On 2023-01-17, Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
>
> Ideally it would be a system setting.

Ideally, you'd stop babysitting your "precious" and just use and enjoy
your device replacing the battery every few years as intended. But once
you've thrown that out the window, I suppose anything goes.

--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

On 2023-01-17 16:53, Martin Brown wrote:
> On 17/01/2023 19:54, Alan Browne wrote:
>
>>>> If you really want to increase the lifespan of the battery, don't
>>>> charge it past 80%
>>>
>>> Where is the setting on the phone to set that 80% battery charge
>>> autolimit?
>>
>> There is none, alas
>
> Android 12 phones have a "Protect Battery" capability which will stop
> charging at a set percent to prolong the long term life of the phone.
>
> In iOS 13, Apple introduced a different method called "Optimized Battery
> Charging" which is their way to reduce the wear on their iPhone batteries.
>
> The main difference between these implementations is "Protect Battery"
> physically stops charging the battery above 85% while "Optimized Battery
> Charging" tries to reduce the time the iPhone spends fully charged.
>
> The assumption is that you might be around 80% to 90% if not fully charged.
> Also on Android are apps which have charging curves you can customize.

As I understand the Apple approach it is to analyze your use and charge
it to 80% and then attempt to charge it to full for about the time you
would likely leave the house. This leaves it charged at 100% in the
end. With my irregular charging habits it always ends up at 100.

If you use the phone a lot in the am, then this is not so bad as a short
duration at 100% is not so bad (it's not just about heat).

But I'd prefer iOS do as Android does: give me the option to set it to a
hard 80%.

(Another issue I have is that the CarPlay system in my car is wired to
the phone - so would be nice to cap it at 80% there too - though on a
long road trip I'd want the phone up to 100% in case of an emergency).

--
“Donald Trump and his allies and supporters are a clear and present
danger to American democracy.”
- J Michael Luttig - 2022-06-16
- Former US appellate court judge (R) testifying to the January 6
committee

In article <tq73un$vdd$1@gioia.aioe.org>, sms
<scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:

> >
> > Where is the setting on the phone to set that 80% battery charge autolimit?
>
> No such setting in Android or iOS.
>
> There are Android apps can be set to notify you when the battery is at
> 80% but they won't stop charging.

that can easily be done on ios, without any app at all, and can link to
a smartplug to control charging.

once again, you demonstrate how little you know about ios.

In article <TKExL.26392$5jd8.1916@fx05.iad>, Alan Browne
<bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:

>
>
> That's a little convoluted (not /horribly/ convoluted).

it's very easy, although to be fair, it's not particularly discoverable.

> I charge my
> iPhone at several locations in the house (front hallway, home/work
> office off a wart, home/work office off the Mac, in the car on longer
> drives, etc.)

set the action to sound an alarm. the action can be pretty much
anything. shortcuts are *very* powerful.

> Ideally it would be a system setting.

nothing is perfect. the number of people who want it is not enough to
justify implementing it. other things have a higher priority.

> The only homekit plug I had I sent back for not being very good - though
> it was at the other end of the house from the WiFi. Should try again
> some day.

dunno which one you had but try again. they're better now.

On 2023-01-17 17:33, nospam wrote:
> In article <TKExL.26392$5jd8.1916@fx05.iad>, Alan Browne
> <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> That's a little convoluted (not /horribly/ convoluted).
>
> it's very easy, although to be fair, it's not particularly discoverable.

Since you chopped out all of the prior discussion about system settings
(being the sub-topic at hand...)

>
>> I charge my
>> iPhone at several locations in the house (front hallway, home/work
>> office off a wart, home/work office off the Mac, in the car on longer
>> drives, etc.)
>
> set the action to sound an alarm. the action can be pretty much
> anything. shortcuts are *very* powerful.

I want it to take care of itself per my needs - not be yelped at to take
care of it. (But I might set that up as an experiment for that sake
alone - lord knows I bark at my watch for timers, alarms and reminders
enough).

>> Ideally it would be a system setting.
>
> nothing is perfect. the number of people who want it is not enough to
> justify implementing it. other things have a higher priority.

Pretty trivial to implement (after all - Android did so) - and very useful.

>> The only homekit plug I had I sent back for not being very good - though
>> it was at the other end of the house from the WiFi. Should try again
>> some day.
>
> dunno which one you had but try again. they're better now.

Don't recall - bought via the Apple site. Returned there too.

--
“Donald Trump and his allies and supporters are a clear and present
danger to American democracy.”
- J Michael Luttig - 2022-06-16
- Former US appellate court judge (R) testifying to the January 6
committee

In article <IBFxL.74333$Olad.47307@fx35.iad>, Alan Browne
<bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:

> > set the action to sound an alarm. the action can be pretty much
> > anything. shortcuts are *very* powerful.
>
> I want it to take care of itself per my needs - not be yelped at to take
> care of it. (But I might set that up as an experiment for that sake
> alone - lord knows I bark at my watch for timers, alarms and reminders
> enough).

you can do that at home with a smartswtich, and use an alarm elsewhere.

> >> Ideally it would be a system setting.
> >
> > nothing is perfect. the number of people who want it is not enough to
> > justify implementing it. other things have a higher priority.
>
> Pretty trivial to implement (after all - Android did so) - and very useful.

it's not like it's the only item on the list. no company has unlimited
resources, so things get prioritized.

also, not all android devices support it either, making it
manufacturer-specific, not android-native, which goes back to different
priorities for different companies.

On 2023-01-17 17:59, nospam wrote:
> In article <IBFxL.74333$Olad.47307@fx35.iad>, Alan Browne
> <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
>
>>> set the action to sound an alarm. the action can be pretty much
>>> anything. shortcuts are *very* powerful.
>>
>> I want it to take care of itself per my needs - not be yelped at to take
>> care of it. (But I might set that up as an experiment for that sake
>> alone - lord knows I bark at my watch for timers, alarms and reminders
>> enough).
>
> you can do that at home with a smartswtich, and use an alarm elsewhere.
>
>>>> Ideally it would be a system setting.
>>>
>>> nothing is perfect. the number of people who want it is not enough to
>>> justify implementing it. other things have a higher priority.
>>
>> Pretty trivial to implement (after all - Android did so) - and very useful.
>
> it's not like it's the only item on the list. no company has unlimited
> resources, so things get prioritized.

Regardless - this is a fairly trivial thing to implement and would
please many. It probably simply offends someone at Apple who's
"invested" in the current scheme of things.

--
“Donald Trump and his allies and supporters are a clear and present
danger to American democracy.”
- J Michael Luttig - 2022-06-16
- Former US appellate court judge (R) testifying to the January 6
committee

On 1/17/2023 11:46 AM, Silvano wrote:

<snip>

> But what you really want is to set any desired custom autocharge limit.
> https://krispitech.com/battery-charge-limit/

Nice, but requires root.

> https://www.getdroidtips.com/custom-battery-charge-limit-android/

Accubattery will alert you when your phone reaches the limit but you
must manually disconnect the charger

> https://android.gadgethacks.com/how-to/set-charging-limit-your-android-device-avoid-excess-battery-wear-0176280/

Nice, but requires root.

On 1/17/2023 12:13 PM, Freethinker wrote:

<snip>

> I'm happy to not have to charge it every night since it lasts two days now.
> And I like when my phone charges in an hour. Sometimes two. Never longer.
>
> It's so fast I don't bother with worrying how low the battery may get to.
> With fast charging, I don't need to worry or even think about anything.
>
> It's like breathing.
> When you need it, you take a breath.
>
> When you need a charge in the battery, you plug it in and it charges FAST!

I'd guess that most people do plug in their phones when they go to sleep
and when they wake up it's charged. But there's no advantage in terms of
prolonging battery life to charge at 5V@1A (the 5W charger that used to
come with iPhones (prior to the iPhone 11)) versus using an 18W USB-C PD
charger. Apple is expert at managing battery charging to maximize
battery life. They don't want to be replacing batteries under warranty
or under AppleCare+.

sms hat am 17.01.2023 um 17:19 geschrieben:
>> https://www.getdroidtips.com/custom-battery-charge-limit-android/
>
> Accubattery will alert you when your phone reaches the limit but you
> must manually disconnect the charger

There are many audible & visual charging indicators like Accubattery is.
https://play.google.com/store/search?q=charge%20indicator&c=apps

The built in Android setting will stop charging at 85% capacity.
The Apple iOS setting works different in that it hovers around 100%.

Which do you think is better for preserving the life of the battery?

nospam wrote:

>> Ideally it would be a system setting.
>
> nothing is perfect. the number of people who want it is not enough to
> justify implementing it. other things have a higher priority.

Whenever nospam says "nobody wants it", it's proof he doesn't have the
intelligence to come up with a reasonable excuse for Apple's huge flaws.

*Why does nospam always claim iOS can't do what Android easily does?*
<https://i.postimg.cc/VL6HGPGc/battery01.jpg> Android Battery Settings

On Android, it's part of the operating system for most Androids sold today.
Even my free Samsung Galaxy A32-5G has it. And yet, iOS is crippled.

As always with nospam, "nobody wants it" only on iOS which is his way of
admitting that iOS is so crippled that you can't do the simplest of things.

Simple things, like this...
<https://i.postimg.cc/ZKXpZP4x/battery13.jpg> BBS comprehensive settings

Alan Browne wrote:

>> nothing is perfect. the number of people who want it is not enough to
>> justify implementing it. other things have a higher priority.
>
> Pretty trivial to implement (after all - Android did so) - and very useful.

When nospam says "nobody wants it", he really means Apple doesn't allow it.
By way of example, Android has _tons_ and more tons of battery controls.

Here are the GSAM controls, which is just _one_ of the many apps "nobody
wants", according to nospam, and yet, it exists and many people love it.
<https://i.postimg.cc/bNGQrMzn/gsam01.jpg> GSam Battery Monitor on Google
<https://i.postimg.cc/dQN2qvKv/gsam02.jpg> com.gsamlabs.bbm on Google Play
<https://i.postimg.cc/wBzJWjD5/gsam03.jpg> Running GSam Battery Monitor
<https://i.postimg.cc/brr1QVkK/gsam04.jpg> OPTIONAL grant access w/o root
<https://i.postimg.cc/BbRP2SqK/gsam05.jpg> Enable More Stats (via adb)
<https://i.postimg.cc/9MJGwHRd/gsam06.jpg> Battery Usage Since Unplugged
<https://i.postimg.cc/XNPCR8wY/gsam07.jpg> Compare WiFi & Phone power
<https://i.postimg.cc/nzH4LhzV/gsam08.jpg> Battery consumption charts
<https://i.postimg.cc/QxWThTbk/gsam09.jpg> Battery consumption by CPU
<https://i.postimg.cc/MpQbPLNw/gsam10.jpg> Battery consumption by app

Here is another set of screenshots on my phone, with another popular app.
<https://i.postimg.cc/VL6HGPGc/battery01.jpg> Android Battery Settings
<https://i.postimg.cc/Gh5g6gVT/battery02.jpg> Android Battery Utilities
<https://i.postimg.cc/9fqnPJgw/battery03.jpg> BBS run adb set permissions
<https://i.postimg.cc/L5735Xck/battery04.jpg> BBS Permissions from adb
<https://i.postimg.cc/Z5dhCkM5/battery05.jpg> BatteryDog, BatteryIndicator
<https://i.postimg.cc/T2WCz3nM/battery06.jpg> adb dumbsys batterystats
<https://i.postimg.cc/8Cm6hqWZ/battery07.jpg> Android 12 battery stats
<https://i.postimg.cc/kGz6J93g/battery08.jpg> Android Battery Dog watchdog
<https://i.postimg.cc/SsZYPCg8/battery09.jpg> BatteryBotPro options
<https://i.postimg.cc/vZRgCQtP/battery10.jpg> BatteryBotPro statistics
<https://i.postimg.cc/90nTDZTV/battery11.jpg> BetterBatteryStats graphs
<https://i.postimg.cc/T1p5v1ss/battery12.jpg> BBS actions by percentage
<https://i.postimg.cc/ZKXpZP4x/battery13.jpg> BBS comprehensive settings
<https://i.postimg.cc/kXSDQ0PW/battery14.jpg> Some BBS settings options
<https://i.postimg.cc/RCyNnMyM/battery15.jpg> More BBS settings options
<https://i.postimg.cc/fLW05BfD/battery16.jpg> Even more BBS options

Whenever nospam says "nobody wants it", he knows everyone wants it but he
also knows that Apple didn't provide it - so it's his way of apologizing.

nospam wrote:

>> Pretty trivial to implement (after all - Android did so) - and very useful.
>
> it's not like it's the only item on the list. no company has unlimited
> resources, so things get prioritized.

Whenever nospam says that, what he's really saying is Apple is only a
MARKETING company (much like Coca Cola); Apple doesn't invest in R&D.

It needs to be noted that, while Apple spends oodles of money on MARKETING,
the R&D spend for Apple has historically always been abysmal compared to
all similar high tech companies.

*Apple spends the least in R&D in all high tech*

That fact alone tells you what Apple's competency is, and it's NOT R&D.
*It's MARKETING*

Companies a fraction of Apple's size spend more in R&D than Apple does.

On 1/17/2023 5:07 PM, Alan Browne wrote:
> Regardless - this is a fairly trivial thing to implement and would
> please many. It probably simply offends someone at Apple who's
> "invested" in the current scheme of things.

Probably Apple doesn't want to call attention to their small batteries.

On 1/17/2023 1:40 PM, RonTheGuy wrote:
> On Jan 17, 2023, sms wrote
> (in article<news:tq73un$vdd$1@gioia.aioe.org>):
>
>> There are Android apps can be set to notify you when the battery is at
>> 80% but they won't stop charging.
>
> Yes they do stop charging. It's in the Android settings.
> Android 12 anyways. It stops at 85%. https://i.redd.it/jzthob0qi4281.jpg
> In addition, you can customize the whole charging pattern if you like.

<snip>

I think that it's a Samsung-only feature. I have no phone with Android
12, but on a phone with Android 13 it's not there (nor is it there on my
old Samsung Galaxy Note 9 with Android 10). Pixel devices automatically
limit battery charge level to 80% under certain circumstances but it's
not user selectable.

I just added this information as 207a on page 107 of the document
<https://docs.google.com/document/d/1JznrWfGJDA8CYVfjSnPTwfVy8-gAC0kPyaApuJTcUNE>.

I recently added another Samsung-only Android feature, dual Bluetooth
audio connections so two people can connect to the same phone and get
the same audio. iOS has a similar feature but it works only with AirPods
or Beats Audio headphones, while the Samsung dual audio works with any
Bluetooth earpods or headphones; I added the iOS dual audio feature as
46i on page 20. I'm not aware of any other brand of Android devices that
supports dual Bluetooth audio.

I also added "AirTags" as 45i on page 20 and "SMS Based Location
Sharing" as 206a on page 106.

---------------------------------------•-----------------------------------------
✓ 46 iOS & iPhone Features Which [many] Android Users Wish they Had ✓
✓ 207 Android & Android Phone Features Which [many] iOS Users Wish
they Had ✓
<https://tinyurl.com/iOS-Android-Features>

✓ 109 Pages of Extensively Referenced Information with Hundreds of
Citations ✓
✓ 100% Fact Checked ✓
---------------------------------------•-----------------------------------------

On 1/17/2023 1:53 PM, Martin Brown wrote:
> On 17/01/2023 19:54, Alan Browne wrote:
>
>>>> If you really want to increase the lifespan of the battery, don't
>>>> charge it past 80%
>>>
>>> Where is the setting on the phone to set that 80% battery charge
>>> autolimit?
>>
>> There is none, alas
>
> Android 12 phones have a "Protect Battery" capability which will stop
> charging at a set percent to prolong the long term life of the phone.

Are you sure that this is an Android feature, or is it just a Samsung
feature? I don't have that option on my Pixel 7 Pro with Android 13. But
I have no phones with Android 12 to check this on.