On Tuesday, January 3, 2023 at 9:25:13 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> George Dance wrote:
>
> > On Thursday, December 1, 2022 at 1:14:05 PM UTC-5, michaelmalef...@gmail.com wrote:
> >> On Thursday, December 1, 2022 at 12:23:48 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> >> > On Thursday, December 1, 2022 at 7:23:43 AM UTC-5, george...@yahoo.ca wrote:
> >> > > On 2022-11-30 5:51 p.m., Will Dockery wrote:
> >> > > > On Wednesday, November 30, 2022 at 9:08:25 AM UTC-5, rjbur...@gmail..com wrote:
> >> > > >> On Wednesday, November 30, 2022 at 8:30:05 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> >> > > >>> On Wednesday, November 30, 2022 at 8:25:12 AM UTC-5, rjbur...@gmail.com wrote: :
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Sunday, November 27, 2022 at 6:39:31 AM UTC-5, Spam-I-Am wrote:
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Saturday, November 26, 2022 at 3:49:07 PM UTC-5, george...@yahoo.ca wrote:
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My Father's House
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is my father's house, although
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The man died thirteen years ago.
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> They said it would be quite all right
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To take a drive to see it now.
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dad laid those grey foundation blocks
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And built the whole thing (from a box),
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Toiling after each full day's work.
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I helped, though I was only six.
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Look, here's the back door I would use
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And here's where I'd remove my shoes
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To enter; there I'd leave my things
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And, when allowed, climb up these stairs.
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> In this room I'd wash many a dish,
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gaze out this window, and I'd wish
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To be so many other places.
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (Wishy-washy? Oh, I guess!)
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Outside, the garden that he grew
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Where I would work the summers through,
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> While watching my friends run and play
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mysterious games I never knew.
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That room's all changed; oh, where is it,
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The one chair I was let to sit?
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (For boys can be such filthy things.)
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Which, the corner where boys were put?
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Oh ... down that hall there is a room
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Where I'd be shut (as in a tomb)
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> After the meal, to make no noise,
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To read or play alone, and then
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Lights out: in bed by nine each night,
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Some nights wanting to pee with fright,
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Face and pyjama bottoms down
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> As for my father's belt I'd wait.
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Oh, if I were a millionaire
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'd buy my father's house, and there
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'd build a bonfire, oh so high
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Its flames would light up all the air.
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ~~
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> George J. Dance
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from Logos and other logoi, 2021
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Okay, so the poem tells a story of remembered abuse..
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> The extent to which the story in the poem reflects the
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> true story of your life and memory is fundamentally
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> irrelevant to the reader except to the extent that your
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> life experience informs your ability to write emotionally
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> convincing stories that are of interest to other people.
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> When you say “My” father’s house, “By” George J. Dance,
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> people are going to think you’re talking about yourself.
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Therefore, “my” recommendation is to change the title of “your” poem from
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> “My Father’s House” to “Our Father’s House”, and all of the relevant pronouns
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> from singular to plural possessive. “Our” Father’s House allows “you” to represent
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> and speak for “your” kin, those who identify with the speaker, and also provides a
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> subtle religious connotation, “Our Father, who art in heaven…”, that “My” does not.
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for giving it so much thought and effort. I have to acknowledge
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> that.
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Pluralizing all the pronouns would change the poem considerably, but one
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> thing it wouldn't change is the confusion you mentioned. If someone
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> thought this was a poem about my own father and childhood because it was
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> titled "My Father's House," they'd be just as likely to think that if it
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> were titled "Our Father's House".
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Except, of course, for that religious connotation; some might think it
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> was a poem about God. But it's not a poem about God, and that's an
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> interpretation I wouldn't want to encourage.
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Lose the parentheses.
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I like them. They're both interruptions in the speaker's thought process.
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>>> Exactly, you are the best judge of how your poem should be presented......
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>>>>>> Words of wisdom from a man who chooses to live
> >> > > >>>>>>>>> Key word being "chooses".
> >> > > >>>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>>>> Correct. The key word is "chooses"
> >> > > >>>>>>> And, as we all know, Zod chose the path of the Dharma Bum.
> >> > > >>>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>>
> >> > > >>>>>> Do you really believe that a person who was truly following what you call "the "path of the Dharma Bum" would send a minute of their time and energy in a place like aapc?
> >> > > >>>>> Jack Kerouac, maybe, probably not Gary Snyder.
> >> > > >>>> Discovering that his most well known book spawned acolytes like you and Zod is the main reason why Jack Kerouac drank himself to death.
> >> > > >>> Not really.
> >> > > >>>
> >> > > >>> Jack Kerouac was a hard drinker long before he became famous.
> >> > > >>>
> >> > > >>> Look it up.
> >> > > >> I don't have to look it up, Will.
> >> > > >> My best friend's parents bought Kerouac's Northport house from Kerouac himself and he's a Kerouac scholar. He met Kerouac, has an unpublished Kerouac manuscript that he found in the house. He and I have spent many hours discussing Kerouac's life and work. Kerouac drank himself to death because of people like you.
> >> > > >
> >> > > > No, not really, Robert.
> >> > > >
> >> > > > Your judgement of me is /not/ me, only your biased opinion of me..
> >> > > >
> >> > > Oh, but Will ... Bobby Rurro has a "friend". And the friend
> >> > > coincidentally just happens to be a "Kerouac scholar". Are you refusing
> >> > > to accept the judgement of a "Kerouac scholar"?
> >> > I've been reading Jack Kerouac since 1973, so I know a bit about the man, myself.
> >> Robert's friend met him, was(is?) living in his house, and owns an unpublished manuscript by Kerouac.
> >>
> > Even if all that is true; it does not show that the "Kerouac scholar" ever claimed that Kerouac drank himself to death because of people like Will Dockery; and in fact Robert never claimed that was anything but his own opinion.
>
> >> I'd say that trumps having read some of his books.
>
> > It's the second-oldest way to position oneself as a Usenet authority in the pre-web era: to say that you have a friend who knows all about a subject. (The oldest, of course, is saying that you yourself know all about a subject.)
> And then not explain his claims, of course.

As usual, you demonstrate your ignorance of Jack Kerouac, Pendragon.

HTH and HAND.

On Tuesday, January 3, 2023 at 10:14:27 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> As usual, you demonstrate your ignorance of Jack Kerouac, Pendragon.

Really?

Post a quote from Kerouac stating that he loved being a guru for sub-moronic, illiterate, pissbums.

There's no such quote from Jack Kerouac because he never really felt that way.

HTH and HAND.

On Tuesday, January 3, 2023 at 11:00:17 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> There's no such quote from Jack Kerouac because he never really felt that way.

Of course he did. Any writer who counted a Donkey and his Stink among his most ardent fans would feel that way.

If I thought that my writing appealed to you and your ilk, I'd have tossed out my pen ages ago.

Michael Pendragon
"I'll ask you again to to put your claims in my mouth."
-- George "Fillerup" Dance

Michael Pendragon wrote:

> On Tuesday, January 3, 2023 at 11:00:17 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
>> There's no such quote from Jack Kerouac because he never really felt that way.

> Of course he did

Let's see a quote, then.

🙂

On Wednesday, January 4, 2023 at 11:20:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> Michael Pendragon wrote:
>
> > On Tuesday, January 3, 2023 at 11:00:17 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> >> There's no such quote from Jack Kerouac because he never really felt that way.
>
> > Of course he did
> Let's see a quote, then.

"Last night after tripping on hi-grade LSD, I had the most disturbing dream imaginable. This fat hillbilly, a white man with an afro and big ears, had just been named "The Worst Poet Who Ever Lived." The papers were all interviewing him and stuff. I mean it was like this huge, media joke because this dumbo didn't realize that they were all laughing at him. When asked how he felt about having received the 'award,' he claimed that other poets were all jealous of his talents, obsessed with him, and such. It was all a big joke, you know? But then this one reporter asked him who his biggest influence was as a poet, and without missing a beat, he said 'Jack Kerouac.' And I laughed because I thought it was really funny, but then I noticed that none of the reporters were laughing, but had suddenly turned all serious, and were nodding their heads in agreement. I haven't been able to get a decent night's sleep since."
-- Jack Kerouac, journal entry, 6/3/1967.

On Wednesday, January 4, 2023 at 5:03:06 PM UTC, michaelmalef...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Wednesday, January 4, 2023 at 11:20:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> > Michael Pendragon wrote:
> >
> > > On Tuesday, January 3, 2023 at 11:00:17 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> > >> There's no such quote from Jack Kerouac because he never really felt that way.
> >
> > > Of course he did
> > Let's see a quote, then.
> "Last night after tripping on hi-grade LSD, I had the most disturbing dream imaginable. This fat hillbilly, a white man with an afro and big ears, had just been named "The Worst Poet Who Ever Lived." The papers were all interviewing him and stuff. I mean it was like this huge, media joke because this dumbo didn't realize that they were all laughing at him. When asked how he felt about having received the 'award,' he claimed that other poets were all jealous of his talents, obsessed with him, and such. It was all a big joke, you know? But then this one reporter asked him who his biggest influence was as a poet, and without missing a beat, he said 'Jack Kerouac.' And I laughed because I thought it was really funny, but then I noticed that none of the reporters were laughing, but had suddenly turned all serious, and were nodding their heads in agreement. I haven't been able to get a decent night's sleep since."
> -- Jack Kerouac, journal entry, 6/3/1967.

We remember reading that quote. How awful to think of one's self as a good writer and find out that one's audience can hardly read and just looks at the pictures. An audience which never grew up, never educated themselves, never worked.

So now Michael Pendragon forges Jack Kerouac quotes.

No surprise there.

🙂

On Wednesday, January 4, 2023 at 11:20:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> Michael Pendragon wrote:
>
> > On Tuesday, January 3, 2023 at 11:00:17 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
>
> >> There's no such quote from Jack Kerouac because he never really felt that way.
>
> > Of course he did
> Let's see a quote, then.
>
> 🙂

Here's the REAL Jack Kerouac on the kind of people he loved:

https://nieman.harvard.edu/stories/the-only-people-for-me-are-the-mad-ones-the-ones-who-are-made-to-live-mad-to-talk-made-to-be-saved-desirous-of-everything-at-the-same-time-the-ones-who-never-yawn-or-say-a-commonplace-th/

“The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes 'Awww!'" ---Jack Kerouac

On Saturday, November 26, 2022 at 3:49:07 PM UTC-5, george...@yahoo.ca wrote:
>
> My Father's House
>
> This is my father's house, although
> The man died thirteen years ago.
> They said it would be quite all right
> To take a drive to see it now.
>
> Dad laid those grey foundation blocks
> And built the whole thing (from a box),
> Toiling after each full day's work.
> I helped, though I was only six.
>
> Look, here's the back door I would use
> And here's where I'd remove my shoes
> To enter; there I'd leave my things
> And, when allowed, climb up these stairs.
>
> In this room I'd wash many a dish,
> Gaze out this window, and I'd wish
> To be so many other places.
> (Wishy-washy? Oh, I guess!)
>
> Outside, the garden that he grew
> Where I would work the summers through,
> While watching my friends run and play
> Mysterious games I never knew.
>
> That room's all changed; oh, where is it,
> The one chair I was let to sit?
> (For boys can be such filthy things.)
> Which, the corner where boys were put?
>
> Oh ... down that hall there is a room
> Where I'd be shut (as in a tomb)
> After the meal, to make no noise,
> To read or play alone, and then
>
> Lights out: in bed by nine each night,
> Some nights wanting to pee with fright,
> Face and pyjama bottoms down
> As for my father's belt I'd wait.
>
> Oh, if I were a millionaire
> I'd buy my father's house, and there
> I'd build a bonfire, oh so high
> Its flames would light up all the air.
>
> ~~
> George J. Dance
> from Logos and other logoi, 2021

George Dance , this was a common sight in every school I attended as a youth. Image provided to accompany the thread for your poem "My Father's House" (Linked below).

https://m.facebook.com/groups/105463832836304/permalink/5814642668585030/?mibextid=Nif5oz

On Wednesday, January 4, 2023 at 6:01:41 PM UTC-5, Zod wrote:
> On Wednesday, January 4, 2023 at 11:20:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> > Michael Pendragon wrote:
> >
> > > On Tuesday, January 3, 2023 at 11:00:17 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> >
> > >> There's no such quote from Jack Kerouac because he never really felt that way.
> >
> > > Of course he did
> > Let's see a quote, then.
> >
> > 🙂
> Here's the REAL Jack Kerouac on the kind of people he loved:
>
> https://nieman.harvard.edu/stories/the-only-people-for-me-are-the-mad-ones-the-ones-who-are-made-to-live-mad-to-talk-made-to-be-saved-desirous-of-everything-at-the-same-time-the-ones-who-never-yawn-or-say-a-commonplace-th/
>
> “The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes 'Awww!'" ---Jack Kerouac
>

Which are the exact opposite of deadbeat, drop-out dunces like your Donkey and yourself.

Michael Pendragon wrote:

> On Wednesday, January 4, 2023 at 6:01:41 PM UTC-5, Zod wrote:
>> On Wednesday, January 4, 2023 at 11:20:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
>> > Michael Pendragon wrote:
>> >
>> > > On Tuesday, January 3, 2023 at 11:00:17 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
>> >
>> > >> There's no such quote from Jack Kerouac because he never really felt that way.
>> >
>> > > Of course he did
>> > Let's see a quote, then.
>> >
>> > 🙂
>> Here's the REAL Jack Kerouac on the kind of people he loved:
>>
>> https://nieman.harvard.edu/stories/the-only-people-for-me-are-the-mad-ones-the-ones-who-are-made-to-live-mad-to-talk-made-to-be-saved-desirous-of-everything-at-the-same-time-the-ones-who-never-yawn-or-say-a-commonplace-th/
>>
>> “The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes 'Awww!'" ---Jack Kerouac
>>

> Which are the exact opposite

Says Michael Pendragon, who has delusional fantasies about being a better poet than T.S. Eliot.

🙂

On Thursday, January 5, 2023 at 10:08:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> Michael Pendragon wrote:
>
> > On Wednesday, January 4, 2023 at 6:01:41 PM UTC-5, Zod wrote:
> >> On Wednesday, January 4, 2023 at 11:20:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> >> > Michael Pendragon wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > On Tuesday, January 3, 2023 at 11:00:17 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> >> >
> >> > >> There's no such quote from Jack Kerouac because he never really felt that way.
> >> >
> >> > > Of course he did
> >> > Let's see a quote, then.
> >> >
> >> > 🙂
> >> Here's the REAL Jack Kerouac on the kind of people he loved:
> >>
> >> https://nieman.harvard.edu/stories/the-only-people-for-me-are-the-mad-ones-the-ones-who-are-made-to-live-mad-to-talk-made-to-be-saved-desirous-of-everything-at-the-same-time-the-ones-who-never-yawn-or-say-a-commonplace-th/
> >>
> >> “The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes 'Awww!'" ---Jack Kerouac
> >>
>
> > Which are the exact opposite
> Says Michael Pendragon, who has delusional fantasies about being a better poet than T.S. Eliot.

I don't see any firecrackers exploding like spiders over Columbus, Donkey.

"Last night after tripping on hi-grade LSD, I had the most disturbing dream imaginable. This fat hillbilly, a white man with an afro and big ears, had just been named "The Worst Poet Who Ever Lived." The papers were all interviewing him and stuff. I mean it was like this huge, media joke because this dumbo didn't realize that they were all laughing at him. When asked how he felt about having received the 'award,' he claimed that other poets were all jealous of his talents, obsessed with him, and such. It was all a big joke, you know? But then this one reporter asked him who his biggest influence was as a poet, and without missing a beat, he said 'Jack Kerouac.' And I laughed because I thought it was really funny, but then I noticed that none of the reporters were laughing, but had suddenly turned all serious, and were nodding their heads in agreement. I haven't been able to get a decent night's sleep since."
-- Jack Kerouac, journal entry, 6/3/1967.

Michael Pendragon wrote:
> Will Dockery wrote:
>> Zod wrote:
>>> On Wednesday, January 4, 2023 at 11:20:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
>>> > Michael Pendragon wrote:
>>> >
>>> > > On Tuesday, January 3, 2023 at 11:00:17 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
>>> >
>>> > >> There's no such quote from Jack Kerouac because he never really felt that way.
>>> >
>>> > > Of course he did
>>> > Let's see a quote, then.
>>> >
>>> > 🙂
>>> Here's the REAL Jack Kerouac on the kind of people he loved:
>>>
>>> https://nieman.harvard.edu/stories/the-only-people-for-me-are-the-mad-ones-the-ones-who-are-made-to-live-mad-to-talk-made-to-be-saved-desirous-of-everything-at-the-same-time-the-ones-who-never-yawn-or-say-a-commonplace-th/
>>>
>>> “The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes 'Awww!'" ---Jack Kerouac
>>>

>> Which are the exact opposite

> Says Michael Pendragon, who has delusional fantasies about being a better poet than T.S. Eliot.

> I don't see

I didn't expect that you would, Pendragon.

🙂

On Thursday, January 5, 2023 at 11:30:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> Michael Pendragon wrote:
> > Will Dockery wrote:
> >> Zod wrote:
> >>> On Wednesday, January 4, 2023 at 11:20:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> >>> > Michael Pendragon wrote:
> >>> >
> >>> > > On Tuesday, January 3, 2023 at 11:00:17 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> >>> >
> >>> > >> There's no such quote from Jack Kerouac because he never really felt that way.
> >>> >
> >>> > > Of course he did
> >>> > Let's see a quote, then.
> >>> >
> >>> > 🙂
> >>> Here's the REAL Jack Kerouac on the kind of people he loved:
> >>>
> >>> https://nieman.harvard.edu/stories/the-only-people-for-me-are-the-mad-ones-the-ones-who-are-made-to-live-mad-to-talk-made-to-be-saved-desirous-of-everything-at-the-same-time-the-ones-who-never-yawn-or-say-a-commonplace-th/
> >>>
> >>> “The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes 'Awww!'" ---Jack Kerouac
> >>>
>
> >> Which are the exact opposite
>
> > Says Michael Pendragon, who has delusional fantasies about being a better poet than T.S. Eliot.
> > I don't see
>
> I didn't expect that you would, Pendragon.

Nor should anyone expect that. Columbus may have its share of crackers, but their "firecrackers" are as rare as cameras in the 1970s.

Michael Pendragon
"Cameras were rare back in seventy-six
So I hung with Zu-Bolton but didn't get no pix..."
-- Will Donkey, from The Shitholeville Mythos

Michael Pendragon wrote:

> On Thursday, January 5, 2023 at 11:30:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
>> Michael Pendragon wrote:
>> > Will Dockery wrote:
>> >> Zod wrote:
>> >>> On Wednesday, January 4, 2023 at 11:20:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
>> >>> > Michael Pendragon wrote:
>> >>> >
>> >>> > > On Tuesday, January 3, 2023 at 11:00:17 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
>> >>> >
>> >>> > >> There's no such quote from Jack Kerouac because he never really felt that way.
>> >>> >
>> >>> > > Of course he did
>> >>> > Let's see a quote, then.
>> >>> >
>> >>> > 🙂
>> >>> Here's the REAL Jack Kerouac on the kind of people he loved:
>> >>>
>> >>> https://nieman.harvard.edu/stories/the-only-people-for-me-are-the-mad-ones-the-ones-who-are-made-to-live-mad-to-talk-made-to-be-saved-desirous-of-everything-at-the-same-time-the-ones-who-never-yawn-or-say-a-commonplace-th/
>> >>>
>> >>> “The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes 'Awww!'" ---Jack Kerouac
>> >>>
>>
>> >> Which are the exact opposite
>>
>> > Says Michael Pendragon, who has delusional fantasies about being a better poet than T.S. Eliot.
>> > I don't see
>>
>> I didn't expect that you would, Pendragon.

> Nor should anyone expect that. Columbus may have its share of crackers, but their "firecrackers" are as rare as cameras in the 1970s.

> Michael Pendragon
> "Cameras were rare back in seventy-six
> So I hung with Zu-Bolton but didn't get no pix..."
> -- Will Donkey, from The Shitholeville Mythos

I see you still want to misrepresent my statement about cameras.

As the question goes, why do you lie and misrepresent so much, Michael Pendragon?

🙂

On Thursday, January 5, 2023 at 1:20:16 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> Michael Pendragon wrote:
>
> > On Thursday, January 5, 2023 at 11:30:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> >> Michael Pendragon wrote:
> >> > Will Dockery wrote:
> >> >> Zod wrote:
> >> >>> On Wednesday, January 4, 2023 at 11:20:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> >> >>> > Michael Pendragon wrote:
> >> >>> >
> >> >>> > > On Tuesday, January 3, 2023 at 11:00:17 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> >> >>> >
> >> >>> > >> There's no such quote from Jack Kerouac because he never really felt that way.
> >> >>> >
> >> >>> > > Of course he did
> >> >>> > Let's see a quote, then.
> >> >>> >
> >> >>> > 🙂
> >> >>> Here's the REAL Jack Kerouac on the kind of people he loved:
> >> >>>
> >> >>> https://nieman.harvard.edu/stories/the-only-people-for-me-are-the-mad-ones-the-ones-who-are-made-to-live-mad-to-talk-made-to-be-saved-desirous-of-everything-at-the-same-time-the-ones-who-never-yawn-or-say-a-commonplace-th/
> >> >>>
> >> >>> “The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes 'Awww!'" ---Jack Kerouac
> >> >>>
> >>
> >> >> Which are the exact opposite
> >>
> >> > Says Michael Pendragon, who has delusional fantasies about being a better poet than T.S. Eliot.
> >> > I don't see
> >>
> >> I didn't expect that you would, Pendragon.
>
> > Nor should anyone expect that. Columbus may have its share of crackers, but their "firecrackers" are as rare as cameras in the 1970s.
>
> > Michael Pendragon
> > "Cameras were rare back in seventy-six
> > So I hung with Zu-Bolton but didn't get no pix..."
> > -- Will Donkey, from The Shitholeville Mythos
> I see you still want to misrepresent my statement about cameras.
>
> As the question goes, why do you lie and misrepresent so much, Michael Pendragon?

"Again, Senetto, cameras and photographs were not so common in 1976 as they are now, so I don't have a huge number of photos from those days."
-- Will Donkey, on the scarcity of cameras in the late 20th Century

Michael Pendragon wrote:

> On Thursday, January 5, 2023 at 1:20:16 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
>> Michael Pendragon wrote:
>>
>> > On Thursday, January 5, 2023 at 11:30:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
>> >> Michael Pendragon wrote:
>> >> > Will Dockery wrote:
>> >> >> Zod wrote:
>> >> >>> On Wednesday, January 4, 2023 at 11:20:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
>> >> >>> > Michael Pendragon wrote:
>> >> >>> >
>> >> >>> > > On Tuesday, January 3, 2023 at 11:00:17 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
>> >> >>> >
>> >> >>> > >> There's no such quote from Jack Kerouac because he never really felt that way.
>> >> >>> >
>> >> >>> > > Of course he did
>> >> >>> > Let's see a quote, then.
>> >> >>> >
>> >> >>> > 🙂
>> >> >>> Here's the REAL Jack Kerouac on the kind of people he loved:
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> https://nieman.harvard.edu/stories/the-only-people-for-me-are-the-mad-ones-the-ones-who-are-made-to-live-mad-to-talk-made-to-be-saved-desirous-of-everything-at-the-same-time-the-ones-who-never-yawn-or-say-a-commonplace-th/
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> “The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes 'Awww!'" ---Jack Kerouac
>> >> >>>
>> >>
>> >> >> Which are the exact opposite
>> >>
>> >> > Says Michael Pendragon, who has delusional fantasies about being a better poet than T.S. Eliot.
>> >> > I don't see
>> >>
>> >> I didn't expect that you would, Pendragon.
>>
>> > Nor should anyone expect that. Columbus may have its share of crackers, but their "firecrackers" are as rare as cameras in the 1970s.
>>
>> > Michael Pendragon
>> > "Cameras were rare back in seventy-six
>> > So I hung with Zu-Bolton but didn't get no pix..."
>> > -- Will Donkey, from The Shitholeville Mythos
>> I see you still want to misrepresent my statement about cameras.
>>
>> As the question goes, why do you lie and misrepresent so much, Michael Pendragon?

> "Again, Senetto, cameras and photographs were not so common in 1976 as they are now, so I don't have a huge number of photos from those days."

Which is actually still correct.

On Thursday, January 5, 2023 at 7:45:18 PM UTC, michaelmalef...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Thursday, January 5, 2023 at 1:20:16 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> > Michael Pendragon wrote:
> >
> > > On Thursday, January 5, 2023 at 11:30:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> > >> Michael Pendragon wrote:
> > >> > Will Dockery wrote:
> > >> >> Zod wrote:
> > >> >>> On Wednesday, January 4, 2023 at 11:20:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> > >> >>> > Michael Pendragon wrote:
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> > > On Tuesday, January 3, 2023 at 11:00:17 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> > >> There's no such quote from Jack Kerouac because he never really felt that way.
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> > > Of course he did
> > >> >>> > Let's see a quote, then.
> > >> >>> >
> > >> >>> > 🙂
> > >> >>> Here's the REAL Jack Kerouac on the kind of people he loved:
> > >> >>>
> > >> >>> https://nieman.harvard.edu/stories/the-only-people-for-me-are-the-mad-ones-the-ones-who-are-made-to-live-mad-to-talk-made-to-be-saved-desirous-of-everything-at-the-same-time-the-ones-who-never-yawn-or-say-a-commonplace-th/
> > >> >>>
> > >> >>> “The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes 'Awww!'" ---Jack Kerouac
> > >> >>>
> > >>
> > >> >> Which are the exact opposite
> > >>
> > >> > Says Michael Pendragon, who has delusional fantasies about being a better poet than T.S. Eliot.
> > >> > I don't see
> > >>
> > >> I didn't expect that you would, Pendragon.
> >
> > > Nor should anyone expect that. Columbus may have its share of crackers, but their "firecrackers" are as rare as cameras in the 1970s.
> >
> > > Michael Pendragon
> > > "Cameras were rare back in seventy-six
> > > So I hung with Zu-Bolton but didn't get no pix..."
> > > -- Will Donkey, from The Shitholeville Mythos
> > I see you still want to misrepresent my statement about cameras.
> >
> > As the question goes, why do you lie and misrepresent so much, Michael Pendragon?
> "Again, Senetto, cameras and photographs were not so common in 1976 as they are now, so I don't have a huge number of photos from those days."
> -- Will Donkey, on the scarcity of cameras in the late 20th Century

We question why Airman basic David R. Procter would have a camera with him at Christmas dinner in 1968 in Vietnam. Of course there were no cameras in the 1960s unless Mathew Brady or Ansel Adams wandered by.

You're confused, NancyGene.

I didn't say there were no cameras in 1976, cameras were definitely not as common as today, in the age of cell phones.

HTH and HAND.

NancyGene wrote:

> On Thursday, January 5, 2023 at 7:45:18 PM UTC, michaelmalef...@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Thursday, January 5, 2023 at 1:20:16 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
>> > Michael Pendragon wrote:
>> > > On Thursday, January 5, 2023 at 11:30:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
>
>> > >> >>> > >> There's no such quote from Jack Kerouac because he never really felt that way.
>> > >> >>> >
>> > >> >>> > > Of course he did
>> > >> >>> > Let's see a quote, then.
>> > >> >>> >
>> > >> >>> > 🙂
>> > >> >>> Here's the REAL Jack Kerouac on the kind of people he loved:
>> > >> >>>
>> > >> >>> https://nieman.harvard.edu/stories/the-only-people-for-me-are-the-mad-ones-the-ones-who-are-made-to-live-mad-to-talk-made-to-be-saved-desirous-of-everything-at-the-same-time-the-ones-who-never-yawn-or-say-a-commonplace-th/
>> > >> >>>
>> > >> >>> “The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes 'Awww!'" ---Jack Kerouac
>
>> > > "Cameras were rare back in seventy-six
>> > > So I hung with Zu-Bolton but didn't get no pix..."
>
>> > I see you still want to misrepresent my statement about cameras.
>> >
>> > As the question goes, why do you lie and misrepresent so much, Michael Pendragon?
>> "Again, Senetto, cameras and photographs were not so common in 1976 as they are now, so I don't have a huge number of photos from those days."
>>
> We question why Airman basic David R. Procter would have a camera with him at Christmas dinner in 1968 in Vietnam. Of course there were no cameras in the 1960s unless Mathew Brady or Ansel Adams wandered by.

Doc wrote "not so common", not "no cameras"....

Are you really that clueless, Nancy G.....?

On Tuesday, January 3, 2023 at 12:47:10 PM UTC-5, george...@yahoo.ca wrote:
> On Thursday, December 1, 2022 at 1:14:05 PM UTC-5, michaelmalef...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Thursday, December 1, 2022 at 12:23:48 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> > > On Thursday, December 1, 2022 at 7:23:43 AM UTC-5, george...@yahoo.ca wrote:
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My Father's House
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is my father's house, although
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The man died thirteen years ago.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> They said it would be quite all right
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To take a drive to see it now.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dad laid those grey foundation blocks
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And built the whole thing (from a box),
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Toiling after each full day's work.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I helped, though I was only six.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Look, here's the back door I would use
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And here's where I'd remove my shoes
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To enter; there I'd leave my things
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And, when allowed, climb up these stairs.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> In this room I'd wash many a dish,
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gaze out this window, and I'd wish
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To be so many other places.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (Wishy-washy? Oh, I guess!)
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Outside, the garden that he grew
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Where I would work the summers through,
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> While watching my friends run and play
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mysterious games I never knew.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That room's all changed; oh, where is it,
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The one chair I was let to sit?
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (For boys can be such filthy things.)
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Which, the corner where boys were put?
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Oh ... down that hall there is a room
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Where I'd be shut (as in a tomb)
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> After the meal, to make no noise,
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To read or play alone, and then
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Lights out: in bed by nine each night,
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Some nights wanting to pee with fright,
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Face and pyjama bottoms down
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> As for my father's belt I'd wait.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Oh, if I were a millionaire
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'd buy my father's house, and there
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'd build a bonfire, oh so high
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Its flames would light up all the air.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ~~
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> George J. Dance
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from Logos and other logoi, 2021
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Okay, so the poem tells a story of remembered abuse.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> The extent to which the story in the poem reflects the
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> true story of your life and memory is fundamentally
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> irrelevant to the reader except to the extent that your
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> life experience informs your ability to write emotionally
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> convincing stories that are of interest to other people.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> When you say “My” father’s house, “By” George J. Dance,
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> people are going to think you’re talking about yourself.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Therefore, “my” recommendation is to change the title of “your” poem from
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> “My Father’s House” to “Our Father’s House”, and all of the relevant pronouns
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> from singular to plural possessive. “Our” Father’s House allows “you” to represent
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> and speak for “your” kin, those who identify with the speaker, and also provides a
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> subtle religious connotation, “Our Father, who art in heaven…”, that “My” does not.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for giving it so much thought and effort. I have to acknowledge
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> that.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Pluralizing all the pronouns would change the poem considerably, but one
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> thing it wouldn't change is the confusion you mentioned. If someone
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> thought this was a poem about my own father and childhood because it was
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> titled "My Father's House," they'd be just as likely to think that if it
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> were titled "Our Father's House".
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Except, of course, for that religious connotation; some might think it
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> was a poem about God. But it's not a poem about God, and that's an
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> interpretation I wouldn't want to encourage.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Lose the parentheses.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I like them. They're both interruptions in the speaker's thought process.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Exactly, you are the best judge of how your poem should be presented......
> > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>> Words of wisdom from a man who chooses to live
> > > > >>>>>>>>> Key word being "chooses".
> > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>> Correct. The key word is "chooses"
> > > > >>>>>>> And, as we all know, Zod chose the path of the Dharma Bum.
> > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>> Do you really believe that a person who was truly following what you call "the "path of the Dharma Bum" would send a minute of their time and energy in a place like aapc?
> > > > >>>>> Jack Kerouac, maybe, probably not Gary Snyder.
> > > > >>>> Discovering that his most well known book spawned acolytes like you and Zod is the main reason why Jack Kerouac drank himself to death.
> > > > >>> Not really.
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>> Jack Kerouac was a hard drinker long before he became famous.
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>> Look it up.
> > > > >> I don't have to look it up, Will.
> > > > >> My best friend's parents bought Kerouac's Northport house from Kerouac himself and he's a Kerouac scholar. He met Kerouac, has an unpublished Kerouac manuscript that he found in the house. He and I have spent many hours discussing Kerouac's life and work. Kerouac drank himself to death because of people like you.
> > > > >
> > > > > No, not really, Robert.
> > > > >
> > > > > Your judgement of me is /not/ me, only your biased opinion of me.
> > > > >
> > > > Oh, but Will ... Bobby Rurro has a "friend". And the friend
> > > > coincidentally just happens to be a "Kerouac scholar". Are you refusing
> > > > to accept the judgement of a "Kerouac scholar"?
> > > I've been reading Jack Kerouac since 1973, so I know a bit about the man, myself.
> > Robert's friend met him, was(is?) living in his house, and owns an unpublished manuscript by Kerouac.
> >
> Even if all that is true; it does not show that the "Kerouac scholar" ever claimed that Kerouac drank himself to death because of people like Will Dockery; and in fact Robert never claimed that was anything but his own opinion.
>
> > I'd say that trumps having read some of his books.
>
> It's the second-oldest way to position oneself as a Usenet authority in the pre-web era: to say that you have a friend who knows all about a subject.. (The oldest, of course, is saying that you yourself know all about a subject.)

On Thursday, January 5, 2023 at 2:55:14 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> Michael Pendragon wrote:
>
> > On Thursday, January 5, 2023 at 1:20:16 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> >> Michael Pendragon wrote:
> >>
> >> > On Thursday, January 5, 2023 at 11:30:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> >> >> Michael Pendragon wrote:
> >> >> > Will Dockery wrote:
> >> >> >> Zod wrote:
> >> >> >>> On Wednesday, January 4, 2023 at 11:20:14 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> >> >> >>> > Michael Pendragon wrote:
> >> >> >>> >
> >> >> >>> > > On Tuesday, January 3, 2023 at 11:00:17 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> >> >> >>> >
> >> >> >>> > >> There's no such quote from Jack Kerouac because he never really felt that way.
> >> >> >>> >
> >> >> >>> > > Of course he did
> >> >> >>> > Let's see a quote, then.
> >> >> >>> >
> >> >> >>> > 🙂
> >> >> >>> Here's the REAL Jack Kerouac on the kind of people he loved:
> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >>> https://nieman.harvard.edu/stories/the-only-people-for-me-are-the-mad-ones-the-ones-who-are-made-to-live-mad-to-talk-made-to-be-saved-desirous-of-everything-at-the-same-time-the-ones-who-never-yawn-or-say-a-commonplace-th/
> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >>> “The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and everybody goes 'Awww!'" ---Jack Kerouac
> >> >> >>>
> >> >>
> >> >> >> Which are the exact opposite
> >> >>
> >> >> > Says Michael Pendragon, who has delusional fantasies about being a better poet than T.S. Eliot.
> >> >> > I don't see
> >> >>
> >> >> I didn't expect that you would, Pendragon.
> >>
> >> > Nor should anyone expect that. Columbus may have its share of crackers, but their "firecrackers" are as rare as cameras in the 1970s.
> >>
> >> > Michael Pendragon
> >> > "Cameras were rare back in seventy-six
> >> > So I hung with Zu-Bolton but didn't get no pix..."
> >> > -- Will Donkey, from The Shitholeville Mythos
> >> I see you still want to misrepresent my statement about cameras.
> >>
> >> As the question goes, why do you lie and misrepresent so much, Michael Pendragon?
>
> > "Again, Senetto, cameras and photographs were not so common in 1976 as they are now, so I don't have a huge number of photos from those days."
> Which is actually still correct.

"By 1898, just ten years after the first Kodak was introduced, one photography journal estimated that over 1.5 million roll-film cameras had reached the hands of amateur shutterbugs."

*** Yes, that EIGHTEEN Ninety-Eight.

https://www.metmuseum.org/toah/hd/kodk/hd_kodk.htm

"1972 — Kodak’s worldwide sales passed $3 billion."

https://brand-minds.medium.com/why-did-kodak-fail-and-what-can-you-learn-from-its-failure-70b92793493c

"More than 50 million Instamatic cameras were produced between 1963 and 1970."

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-16627167

The US population in 1976 was 218 million. By 1970, 50 million (about 1/5 of the entire population) Americans owned a Kodak Instamatic. That one model of camera from one manufacturer. And by 1972, Kodak was making $3 billion a year in camera sales.

This doesn't account for Canon, Polaroid, Nikon, or other brands.

It's safe to say that the average American family owed at least one camera in 1976. IIRC, my family owned six at that time.

Feel like an idiot yet?

On Tuesday, January 3, 2023 at 12:47:10 PM UTC-5, george...@yahoo.ca wrote:
> On Thursday, December 1, 2022 at 1:14:05 PM UTC-5, michaelmalef...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Thursday, December 1, 2022 at 12:23:48 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> > > On Thursday, December 1, 2022 at 7:23:43 AM UTC-5, george...@yahoo.ca wrote:
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My Father's House
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is my father's house, although
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The man died thirteen years ago.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> They said it would be quite all right
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To take a drive to see it now.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dad laid those grey foundation blocks
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And built the whole thing (from a box),
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Toiling after each full day's work.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I helped, though I was only six.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Look, here's the back door I would use
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And here's where I'd remove my shoes
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To enter; there I'd leave my things
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And, when allowed, climb up these stairs.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> In this room I'd wash many a dish,
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gaze out this window, and I'd wish
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To be so many other places.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (Wishy-washy? Oh, I guess!)
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Outside, the garden that he grew
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Where I would work the summers through,
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> While watching my friends run and play
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mysterious games I never knew.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That room's all changed; oh, where is it,
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The one chair I was let to sit?
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (For boys can be such filthy things.)
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Which, the corner where boys were put?
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Oh ... down that hall there is a room
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Where I'd be shut (as in a tomb)
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> After the meal, to make no noise,
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To read or play alone, and then
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Lights out: in bed by nine each night,
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Some nights wanting to pee with fright,
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Face and pyjama bottoms down
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> As for my father's belt I'd wait.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Oh, if I were a millionaire
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'd buy my father's house, and there
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'd build a bonfire, oh so high
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Its flames would light up all the air.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ~~
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> George J. Dance
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from Logos and other logoi, 2021
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Okay, so the poem tells a story of remembered abuse.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> The extent to which the story in the poem reflects the
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> true story of your life and memory is fundamentally
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> irrelevant to the reader except to the extent that your
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> life experience informs your ability to write emotionally
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> convincing stories that are of interest to other people.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> When you say “My” father’s house, “By” George J. Dance,
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> people are going to think you’re talking about yourself.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Therefore, “my” recommendation is to change the title of “your” poem from
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> “My Father’s House” to “Our Father’s House”, and all of the relevant pronouns
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> from singular to plural possessive. “Our” Father’s House allows “you” to represent
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> and speak for “your” kin, those who identify with the speaker, and also provides a
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> subtle religious connotation, “Our Father, who art in heaven…”, that “My” does not.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for giving it so much thought and effort. I have to acknowledge
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> that.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Pluralizing all the pronouns would change the poem considerably, but one
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> thing it wouldn't change is the confusion you mentioned. If someone
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> thought this was a poem about my own father and childhood because it was
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> titled "My Father's House," they'd be just as likely to think that if it
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> were titled "Our Father's House".
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Except, of course, for that religious connotation; some might think it
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> was a poem about God. But it's not a poem about God, and that's an
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> interpretation I wouldn't want to encourage.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Lose the parentheses.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I like them. They're both interruptions in the speaker's thought process.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Exactly, you are the best judge of how your poem should be presented......
> > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>> Words of wisdom from a man who chooses to live
> > > > >>>>>>>>> Key word being "chooses".
> > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>>> Correct. The key word is "chooses"
> > > > >>>>>>> And, as we all know, Zod chose the path of the Dharma Bum.
> > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>>
> > > > >>>>>> Do you really believe that a person who was truly following what you call "the "path of the Dharma Bum" would send a minute of their time and energy in a place like aapc?
> > > > >>>>> Jack Kerouac, maybe, probably not Gary Snyder.
> > > > >>>> Discovering that his most well known book spawned acolytes like you and Zod is the main reason why Jack Kerouac drank himself to death.
> > > > >>> Not really.
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>> Jack Kerouac was a hard drinker long before he became famous.
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>> Look it up.
> > > > >> I don't have to look it up, Will.
> > > > >> My best friend's parents bought Kerouac's Northport house from Kerouac himself and he's a Kerouac scholar. He met Kerouac, has an unpublished Kerouac manuscript that he found in the house. He and I have spent many hours discussing Kerouac's life and work. Kerouac drank himself to death because of people like you.
> > > > >
> > > > > No, not really, Robert.
> > > > >
> > > > > Your judgement of me is /not/ me, only your biased opinion of me.
> > > > >
> > > > Oh, but Will ... Bobby Rurro has a "friend". And the friend
> > > > coincidentally just happens to be a "Kerouac scholar". Are you refusing
> > > > to accept the judgement of a "Kerouac scholar"?
> > > I've been reading Jack Kerouac since 1973, so I know a bit about the man, myself.
> > Robert's friend met him, was(is?) living in his house, and owns an unpublished manuscript by Kerouac.
> >
> Even if all that is true; it does not show that the "Kerouac scholar" ever claimed that Kerouac drank himself to death because of people like Will Dockery; and in fact Robert never claimed that was anything but his own opinion.
>
> > I'd say that trumps having read some of his books.
>
> It's the second-oldest way to position oneself as a Usenet authority in the pre-web era: to say that you have a friend who knows all about a subject.. (The oldest, of course, is saying that you yourself know all about a subject.)