Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> On 19/02/2022 14:05, Recliner wrote:
>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 13:14:29 +0000, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 19/02/2022 11:27, Recliner wrote:
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> In message <suqh0e$447$1@dont-email.me>, at 10:32:48 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>>> 2022, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>> On 19/02/2022 08:27, Graeme Wall wrote:
>>>>>>> On 18/02/2022 22:06, Recliner wrote:
>>>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Graham Harrison <edward.harrisom.one@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, 14 Feb 2022 21:16:53 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
>>>>>>>>>> <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I was wondering if mainline rail charters hauled by Flying
>>>>>>>>>>> Scotsman are
>>>>>>>>>>> shown in RTT?  I notice that this one hasn't appeared (yet), and
>>>>>>>>>>> I know
>>>>>>>>>>> that the timings shown online differ from the actual finalised
>>>>>>>>>>> timings. The
>>>>>>>>>>> light engine moves to and from Southall are shown.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> <https://www.railwaytouring.net/the-cotswold-venturer-2022 " rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.railwaytouring.net/the-cotswold-venturer-2022>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The letter accompanying the ticket says:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Please note due to trespassing issues we have been asked
>>>>>>>>>>> by Network Rail and the
>>>>>>>>>>> British
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Transport Police to not publicise the final timings for th
>>>>>>>>>>> e train so we would appreciate it if you could
>>>>>>>>>>> treat the timings given overleaf as strictly confidential.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I just received a message to say it's been cancelled.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Ah, yes, you're right, thanks for the warning. I've not yet received an
>>>>>>>>> email to that effect, but it's on the website:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> https://www.railwaytouring.net/the-cotswold-venturer-2022
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Found the email:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Cotswold Venturer - Urgent Update - Tour Cancelled
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> We have just been informed that despite the best efforts of the Network
>>>>>>>> Rail Charter Division in monitoring the situation throughout the day and
>>>>>>>> looking at alternative routing in case the original route was not
>>>>>>>> possible
>>>>>>>> for our train, the Regional Network Rail Route Director has this evening
>>>>>>>> made the decision to cancel our Cotswold Venturer train tomorrow.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> We are very sorry for the late notice of this cancellation, which is
>>>>>>>> outside of our control, and we apologise for any disappointment it may
>>>>>>>> cause, everyone involved had worked together in the hope that the train
>>>>>>>> would be able to take place tomorrow.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> We are now working with our operating company, West Coast Railways,
>>>>>>>> Network
>>>>>>>> Rail and the caretakers of Flying Scotsman to try and redate the tour in
>>>>>>>> March and will be in touch with you as soon as we have a firm date
>>>>>>>> for this
>>>>>>>> rescheduling. Should the new date not be convenient for you, then
>>>>>>>> you will
>>>>>>>> be entitled to transfer your funds to a different tour or to receive
>>>>>>>> a full
>>>>>>>> refund of monies paid to us.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Your patience at this time will be appreciated whilst we make the
>>>>>>>> necessary
>>>>>>>> arrangements, we will be in touch with you again in the coming days to
>>>>>>>> advise further.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Once again our sincere apologies for any inconvenience.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> —————
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I wonder how much this will cost the FS operation (NRM?), WCR, RTC and
>>>>>>>> Gravy Train (caterers), and wonder if NR covers some or all of the costs?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I don't have any wasted travel or hotel costs, but I'm sure many of the
>>>>>>>> other would-be passengers will have.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Act of God invoked presumably.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Two other railtours / charters have managed to run today (19 February),
>>>>>> albeit both running rather late:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Reading to Lincoln:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:U68002/2022-02-19/detailed
>>>>>
>>>>> +137 at Banbury!
>>>>>
>>>>>> and Telford Central to Appleby:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:U91449/2022-02-19/detaile
>>>>>> d#allox_id=0
>>>>>
>>>>> Are either of them kettles?
>>>>
>>>> No, as you can see from RTT, they're diesel-hauled.
>>>>
>>> According to reports elsewhere, a Class 68 to Lincoln, and a pair of 47s
>>> to Appleby and back.
>>
>> Yes, the 47s were identified. I wonder why the 68 was pathed as only a
>> 75mph loco? It's the most powerful diesel loco
>> in service in the UK, and can easily pull a train like that at 100mph.
>
> Is the stock cleared for more than 75mph?
>

Few charters use any stock not capable of 100mph running. Only the British
Pullman has a lower limit.

Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 19/02/2022 14:05, Recliner wrote:
>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 13:14:29 +0000, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 19/02/2022 11:27, Recliner wrote:
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> In message <suqh0e$447$1@dont-email.me>, at 10:32:48 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>>> 2022, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>> On 19/02/2022 08:27, Graeme Wall wrote:
>>>>>>> On 18/02/2022 22:06, Recliner wrote:
>>>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Graham Harrison <edward.harrisom.one@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, 14 Feb 2022 21:16:53 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
>>>>>>>>>> <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I was wondering if mainline rail charters hauled by Flying
>>>>>>>>>>> Scotsman are
>>>>>>>>>>> shown in RTT?  I notice that this one hasn't appeared (yet), and
>>>>>>>>>>> I know
>>>>>>>>>>> that the timings shown online differ from the actual finalised
>>>>>>>>>>> timings. The
>>>>>>>>>>> light engine moves to and from Southall are shown.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> <https://www.railwaytouring.net/the-cotswold-venturer-2022 " rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.railwaytouring.net/the-cotswold-venturer-2022>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The letter accompanying the ticket says:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Please note due to trespassing issues we have been asked
>>>>>>>>>>> by Network Rail and the
>>>>>>>>>>> British
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Transport Police to not publicise the final timings for th
>>>>>>>>>>> e train so we would appreciate it if you could
>>>>>>>>>>> treat the timings given overleaf as strictly confidential.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I just received a message to say it's been cancelled.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Ah, yes, you're right, thanks for the warning. I've not yet received an
>>>>>>>>> email to that effect, but it's on the website:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> https://www.railwaytouring.net/the-cotswold-venturer-2022
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Found the email:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Cotswold Venturer - Urgent Update - Tour Cancelled
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> We have just been informed that despite the best efforts of the Network
>>>>>>>> Rail Charter Division in monitoring the situation throughout the day and
>>>>>>>> looking at alternative routing in case the original route was not
>>>>>>>> possible
>>>>>>>> for our train, the Regional Network Rail Route Director has this evening
>>>>>>>> made the decision to cancel our Cotswold Venturer train tomorrow.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> We are very sorry for the late notice of this cancellation, which is
>>>>>>>> outside of our control, and we apologise for any disappointment it may
>>>>>>>> cause, everyone involved had worked together in the hope that the train
>>>>>>>> would be able to take place tomorrow.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> We are now working with our operating company, West Coast Railways,
>>>>>>>> Network
>>>>>>>> Rail and the caretakers of Flying Scotsman to try and redate the tour in
>>>>>>>> March and will be in touch with you as soon as we have a firm date
>>>>>>>> for this
>>>>>>>> rescheduling. Should the new date not be convenient for you, then
>>>>>>>> you will
>>>>>>>> be entitled to transfer your funds to a different tour or to receive
>>>>>>>> a full
>>>>>>>> refund of monies paid to us.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Your patience at this time will be appreciated whilst we make the
>>>>>>>> necessary
>>>>>>>> arrangements, we will be in touch with you again in the coming days to
>>>>>>>> advise further.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Once again our sincere apologies for any inconvenience.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> —————
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I wonder how much this will cost the FS operation (NRM?), WCR, RTC and
>>>>>>>> Gravy Train (caterers), and wonder if NR covers some or all of the costs?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I don't have any wasted travel or hotel costs, but I'm sure many of the
>>>>>>>> other would-be passengers will have.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Act of God invoked presumably.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Two other railtours / charters have managed to run today (19 February),
>>>>>> albeit both running rather late:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Reading to Lincoln:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:U68002/2022-02-19/detailed
>>>>>
>>>>> +137 at Banbury!
>>>>>
>>>>>> and Telford Central to Appleby:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:U91449/2022-02-19/detaile
>>>>>> d#allox_id=0
>>>>>
>>>>> Are either of them kettles?
>>>>
>>>> No, as you can see from RTT, they're diesel-hauled.
>>>>
>>> According to reports elsewhere, a Class 68 to Lincoln, and a pair of 47s
>>> to Appleby and back.
>>
>> Yes, the 47s were identified. I wonder why the 68 was pathed as only a 75mph loco?
>
> Probably the line limit on some parts of the route.

No, this is the maximum train speed used when calculating the timings, and
is independent of the route. The calculated timings take account of both
train and line speeds.

Steam trains are treated as having a top speed of 60mph, though many of the
main line locos are permitted to run at 75mph. Their assumed lower speed
compensates for their lower acceleration and the limited time they manage
to get over 60mph.

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <l0u11hlos9iedpvr2huc2krs9dv2a4fdeq@4ax.com>, at 14:01:14 on
> Sat, 19 Feb 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 13:43:39 +0000, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk wrote:
>>
>>> On 19/02/2022 13:24, Tweed wrote:
>>>> <martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
>>>>> On 19/02/2022 12:37, Roland Perry wrote:
>>>>>> In message <suqnml$b22$1@dont-email.me>, at 12:27:01 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>>>> 2022, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk remarked:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  What's wrong with having a sacrificial gmail address for companies
>>>>>>>> to  use? Not difficult to have a second or third address on your
>>>>>>>> phone and  abandon it if/when it gets abused.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Too much hassle.  It's a painful process setting up google email
>>>>>>> addresses.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I like to provide each organisation I have a dealing with a unique
>>>>>>> email address.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And how often has that identified a data breach?
>>>>>
>>>>> More than you might imagine. The usual procedure is that when the
>>>>> company decides that I'm unlikely to purchase from them again they sell
>>>>> my address on.
>>>>
>>>> You must be very unlucky. I’ve a work email address that’s been public for
>>>> 25 years and a private one that sits in full view on a website. Neither
>>>> attract much in the way of unwanted spam. Most of the spam is correctly
>>>> identified and dumped by the providers of the email services.
>>>
>>> You are very lucky indeed.
>>>
>>> Most of my spam is a result of data breaches.
>>
>> Is the selling on of a mailing list a data breach?
>
> It is if done in a way that infringes long standing law on such matters.
> What's usually the case is the consumer didn't read the small print when
> they signed up.

Yes, very likely.

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <suqvrl$hg6$1@dont-email.me>, at 14:46:13 on Sat, 19 Feb
> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 14:35:06 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
>>> <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 12:20:49 +0000, Roland Perry
>>>>> <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> In message <suqkmj$ds3$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:35:46 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>>>> 2022, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk remarked:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The only email I have on my phone is my personal address only known to
>>>>>>> relatives and close friends. I certainly wouldn't trust it to
>>>>>>> commercial organisations.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Most smartphones need an email address from either Apple or Google to
>>>>>> set them up. But I'm loving all this anti-email-on-phone stuff, having
>>>>>> been on the receiving end of accusations of being an anti-Mticketing
>>>>>> luddite in the past.
>>>>>
>>>>> I suspect that you are Martin fall into the category of the eccentric
>>>>> elderly who don't use their phones like most of
>>>>> the population.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> There’s basically two ways forwards - you either adapt to the changing
>>>> world or spend the rest of your few years left on the planet complaining
>>>> about how the world doesn’t work how you’d like it to. I’d wager that the
>>>> latter just leads to unhappiness and changes nothing.
>>>
>>> I think we can see the evidence of that here.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Eg, I detest Brexit and all that has ensued from it. However, I’ll get with
>>>> the ETIAS scheme and make the best of it. Complaining, or calling out as
>>>> one poster here likes to call it, won’t change anything. I aim to go to my
>>>> grave in the best possible mood that I can muster.
>>>
>>> Yes, 100% agreed. There's no point banging on about what a mistake
>>> Brexit was, and we just have to make the best of the situation we
>>> are now in, including taking advantage of any opportunities that it
>>> presents. They may be few and far between, but we must make the most
>>> of any that arise.
>>
>> I apologise for what appears to be a lack of apostrophes in my posts. They
>> are present leaving here on my iPad and NewsTap, but seem to get lost in
>> the wash, judging by the quotes of my posts. I’m guessing my apostrophes
>> aren’t standard ascii ones, but I’ve no idea how to fix this.
>
> Your postings (and replies) look fine here, using a tried and tested
> newsreader. See if this posting preserves them.

Thanks - yes they are preserved. However some peoples’ quotes seem to drop
the apostrophes. Odd.

On 19/02/2022 16:11, Recliner wrote:
> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>> On 19/02/2022 14:05, Recliner wrote:
>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 13:14:29 +0000, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 19/02/2022 11:27, Recliner wrote:
>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>> In message <suqh0e$447$1@dont-email.me>, at 10:32:48 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>>>> 2022, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>> On 19/02/2022 08:27, Graeme Wall wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 18/02/2022 22:06, Recliner wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Graham Harrison <edward.harrisom.one@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, 14 Feb 2022 21:16:53 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
>>>>>>>>>>> <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I was wondering if mainline rail charters hauled by Flying
>>>>>>>>>>>> Scotsman are
>>>>>>>>>>>> shown in RTT?  I notice that this one hasn't appeared (yet), and
>>>>>>>>>>>> I know
>>>>>>>>>>>> that the timings shown online differ from the actual finalised
>>>>>>>>>>>> timings. The
>>>>>>>>>>>> light engine moves to and from Southall are shown.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://www.railwaytouring.net/the-cotswold-venturer-2022 " rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.railwaytouring.net/the-cotswold-venturer-2022>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> The letter accompanying the ticket says:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Please note due to trespassing issues we have been asked
>>>>>>>>>>>> by Network Rail and the
>>>>>>>>>>>> British
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Transport Police to not publicise the final timings for th
>>>>>>>>>>>> e train so we would appreciate it if you could
>>>>>>>>>>>> treat the timings given overleaf as strictly confidential.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I just received a message to say it's been cancelled.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Ah, yes, you're right, thanks for the warning. I've not yet received an
>>>>>>>>>> email to that effect, but it's on the website:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> https://www.railwaytouring.net/the-cotswold-venturer-2022
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Found the email:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Cotswold Venturer - Urgent Update - Tour Cancelled
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> We have just been informed that despite the best efforts of the Network
>>>>>>>>> Rail Charter Division in monitoring the situation throughout the day and
>>>>>>>>> looking at alternative routing in case the original route was not
>>>>>>>>> possible
>>>>>>>>> for our train, the Regional Network Rail Route Director has this evening
>>>>>>>>> made the decision to cancel our Cotswold Venturer train tomorrow.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> We are very sorry for the late notice of this cancellation, which is
>>>>>>>>> outside of our control, and we apologise for any disappointment it may
>>>>>>>>> cause, everyone involved had worked together in the hope that the train
>>>>>>>>> would be able to take place tomorrow.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> We are now working with our operating company, West Coast Railways,
>>>>>>>>> Network
>>>>>>>>> Rail and the caretakers of Flying Scotsman to try and redate the tour in
>>>>>>>>> March and will be in touch with you as soon as we have a firm date
>>>>>>>>> for this
>>>>>>>>> rescheduling. Should the new date not be convenient for you, then
>>>>>>>>> you will
>>>>>>>>> be entitled to transfer your funds to a different tour or to receive
>>>>>>>>> a full
>>>>>>>>> refund of monies paid to us.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Your patience at this time will be appreciated whilst we make the
>>>>>>>>> necessary
>>>>>>>>> arrangements, we will be in touch with you again in the coming days to
>>>>>>>>> advise further.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Once again our sincere apologies for any inconvenience.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> —————
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I wonder how much this will cost the FS operation (NRM?), WCR, RTC and
>>>>>>>>> Gravy Train (caterers), and wonder if NR covers some or all of the costs?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I don't have any wasted travel or hotel costs, but I'm sure many of the
>>>>>>>>> other would-be passengers will have.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Act of God invoked presumably.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Two other railtours / charters have managed to run today (19 February),
>>>>>>> albeit both running rather late:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Reading to Lincoln:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:U68002/2022-02-19/detailed
>>>>>>
>>>>>> +137 at Banbury!
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> and Telford Central to Appleby:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:U91449/2022-02-19/detaile
>>>>>>> d#allox_id=0
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Are either of them kettles?
>>>>>
>>>>> No, as you can see from RTT, they're diesel-hauled.
>>>>>
>>>> According to reports elsewhere, a Class 68 to Lincoln, and a pair of 47s
>>>> to Appleby and back.
>>>
>>> Yes, the 47s were identified. I wonder why the 68 was pathed as only a
>>> 75mph loco? It's the most powerful diesel loco
>>> in service in the UK, and can easily pull a train like that at 100mph.
>>
>> Is the stock cleared for more than 75mph?
>>
>
> Few charters use any stock not capable of 100mph running. Only the British
> Pullman has a lower limit.
>

I've often seen Pullmans marshalled in charter sets but thinking about
it they would have been Mk1s as well.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <suqvrl$hg6$1@dont-email.me>, at 14:46:13 on Sat, 19 Feb
>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 14:35:06 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
>>>> <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 12:20:49 +0000, Roland Perry
>>>>>> <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In message <suqkmj$ds3$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:35:46 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>>>>> 2022, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk remarked:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The only email I have on my phone is my personal address only known to
>>>>>>>> relatives and close friends. I certainly wouldn't trust it to
>>>>>>>> commercial organisations.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Most smartphones need an email address from either Apple or Google to
>>>>>>> set them up. But I'm loving all this anti-email-on-phone stuff, having
>>>>>>> been on the receiving end of accusations of being an anti-Mticketing
>>>>>>> luddite in the past.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I suspect that you are Martin fall into the category of the eccentric
>>>>>> elderly who don't use their phones like most of
>>>>>> the population.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> There’s basically two ways forwards - you either adapt to the changing
>>>>> world or spend the rest of your few years left on the planet complaining
>>>>> about how the world doesn’t work how you’d like it to. I’d wager that the
>>>>> latter just leads to unhappiness and changes nothing.
>>>>
>>>> I think we can see the evidence of that here.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Eg, I detest Brexit and all that has ensued from it. However, I’ll get with
>>>>> the ETIAS scheme and make the best of it. Complaining, or calling out as
>>>>> one poster here likes to call it, won’t change anything. I aim to go to my
>>>>> grave in the best possible mood that I can muster.
>>>>
>>>> Yes, 100% agreed. There's no point banging on about what a mistake
>>>> Brexit was, and we just have to make the best of the situation we
>>>> are now in, including taking advantage of any opportunities that it
>>>> presents. They may be few and far between, but we must make the most
>>>> of any that arise.
>>>
>>> I apologise for what appears to be a lack of apostrophes in my posts. They
>>> are present leaving here on my iPad and NewsTap, but seem to get lost in
>>> the wash, judging by the quotes of my posts. I’m guessing my apostrophes
>>> aren’t standard ascii ones, but I’ve no idea how to fix this.
>>
>> Your postings (and replies) look fine here, using a tried and tested
>> newsreader. See if this posting preserves them.
>
> Thanks - yes they are preserved. However some peoples’ quotes seem to drop
> the apostrophes. Odd.

I think the culprit in this case was Forte Agent, which I use on my PC. It
ignores or converts into ? any but basic ASCII characters. I've not been
able to find any option which stops it doing that. I'd welcome any
suggestions for how to change its behaviour.

Incidentally, it doesn't drop basic apostrophes but drops the ones Word
creates or which you find in published text. NewsTap on my iPad is much
more forgiving and also lets me insert any text. So I think Agent will
only retain the first of these three apostrophes: '‘’

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <suqvrl$hg6$1@dont-email.me>, at 14:46:13 on Sat, 19 Feb
> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 14:35:06 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
>>> <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 12:20:49 +0000, Roland Perry
>>>>> <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> In message <suqkmj$ds3$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:35:46 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>>>> 2022, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk remarked:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The only email I have on my phone is my personal address only known to
>>>>>>> relatives and close friends. I certainly wouldn't trust it to
>>>>>>> commercial organisations.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Most smartphones need an email address from either Apple or Google to
>>>>>> set them up. But I'm loving all this anti-email-on-phone stuff, having
>>>>>> been on the receiving end of accusations of being an anti-Mticketing
>>>>>> luddite in the past.
>>>>>
>>>>> I suspect that you are Martin fall into the category of the eccentric
>>>>> elderly who don't use their phones like most of
>>>>> the population.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> There’s basically two ways forwards - you either adapt to the changing
>>>> world or spend the rest of your few years left on the planet complaining
>>>> about how the world doesn’t work how you’d like it to. I’d wager that the
>>>> latter just leads to unhappiness and changes nothing.
>>>
>>> I think we can see the evidence of that here.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Eg, I detest Brexit and all that has ensued from it. However, I’ll get with
>>>> the ETIAS scheme and make the best of it. Complaining, or calling out as
>>>> one poster here likes to call it, won’t change anything. I aim to go to my
>>>> grave in the best possible mood that I can muster.
>>>
>>> Yes, 100% agreed. There's no point banging on about what a mistake
>>> Brexit was, and we just have to make the best of the situation we
>>> are now in, including taking advantage of any opportunities that it
>>> presents. They may be few and far between, but we must make the most
>>> of any that arise.
>>
>> I apologise for what appears to be a lack of apostrophes in my posts. They
>> are present leaving here on my iPad and NewsTap, but seem to get lost in
>> the wash, judging by the quotes of my posts. I’m guessing my apostrophes
>> aren’t standard ascii ones, but I’ve no idea how to fix this.
>
> Your postings (and replies) look fine here, using a tried and tested
> newsreader. See if this posting preserves them.

Does your tried and tested newsreader quote and preserve these 25
space-separated characters:
™ ‰ ∞ ¶ § ± ≤ ≥ ∏ … æ ° ± ≠ ∑ ® √ ∫ “ ” — ˆ Ø ÷ …

And could you type them in? I just typed them straight into NewsTap from
my normal keyboard (Padkeys).

On 19/02/2022 16:45, Recliner wrote:
> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <suqvrl$hg6$1@dont-email.me>, at 14:46:13 on Sat, 19 Feb
>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 14:35:06 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
>>>> <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 12:20:49 +0000, Roland Perry
>>>>>> <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In message <suqkmj$ds3$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:35:46 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>>>>> 2022, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk remarked:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The only email I have on my phone is my personal address only known to
>>>>>>>> relatives and close friends. I certainly wouldn't trust it to
>>>>>>>> commercial organisations.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Most smartphones need an email address from either Apple or Google to
>>>>>>> set them up. But I'm loving all this anti-email-on-phone stuff, having
>>>>>>> been on the receiving end of accusations of being an anti-Mticketing
>>>>>>> luddite in the past.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I suspect that you are Martin fall into the category of the eccentric
>>>>>> elderly who don't use their phones like most of
>>>>>> the population.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> There’s basically two ways forwards - you either adapt to the changing
>>>>> world or spend the rest of your few years left on the planet complaining
>>>>> about how the world doesn’t work how you’d like it to. I’d wager that the
>>>>> latter just leads to unhappiness and changes nothing.
>>>>
>>>> I think we can see the evidence of that here.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Eg, I detest Brexit and all that has ensued from it. However, I’ll get with
>>>>> the ETIAS scheme and make the best of it. Complaining, or calling out as
>>>>> one poster here likes to call it, won’t change anything. I aim to go to my
>>>>> grave in the best possible mood that I can muster.
>>>>
>>>> Yes, 100% agreed. There's no point banging on about what a mistake
>>>> Brexit was, and we just have to make the best of the situation we
>>>> are now in, including taking advantage of any opportunities that it
>>>> presents. They may be few and far between, but we must make the most
>>>> of any that arise.
>>>
>>> I apologise for what appears to be a lack of apostrophes in my posts. They
>>> are present leaving here on my iPad and NewsTap, but seem to get lost in
>>> the wash, judging by the quotes of my posts. I’m guessing my apostrophes
>>> aren’t standard ascii ones, but I’ve no idea how to fix this.
>>
>> Your postings (and replies) look fine here, using a tried and tested
>> newsreader. See if this posting preserves them.
>
> Does your tried and tested newsreader quote and preserve these 25
> space-separated characters:
> ™ ‰ ∞ ¶ § ± ≤ ≥ ∏ … æ ° ± ≠ ∑ ® √ ∫ “ ” — ˆ Ø ÷ …
>
> And could you type them in? I just typed them straight into NewsTap from
> my normal keyboard (Padkeys).
>

All work fine on Thunderbird.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

On 19/02/2022 16:45, Recliner wrote:
> Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <suqvrl$hg6$1@dont-email.me>, at 14:46:13 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 14:35:06 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
>>>>> <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 12:20:49 +0000, Roland Perry
>>>>>>> <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> In message <suqkmj$ds3$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:35:46 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>>>>>> 2022, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk remarked:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The only email I have on my phone is my personal address only known to
>>>>>>>>> relatives and close friends. I certainly wouldn't trust it to
>>>>>>>>> commercial organisations.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Most smartphones need an email address from either Apple or Google to
>>>>>>>> set them up. But I'm loving all this anti-email-on-phone stuff, having
>>>>>>>> been on the receiving end of accusations of being an anti-Mticketing
>>>>>>>> luddite in the past.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I suspect that you are Martin fall into the category of the eccentric
>>>>>>> elderly who don't use their phones like most of
>>>>>>> the population.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There’s basically two ways forwards - you either adapt to the changing
>>>>>> world or spend the rest of your few years left on the planet complaining
>>>>>> about how the world doesn’t work how you’d like it to. I’d wager that the
>>>>>> latter just leads to unhappiness and changes nothing.
>>>>>
>>>>> I think we can see the evidence of that here.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Eg, I detest Brexit and all that has ensued from it. However, I’ll get with
>>>>>> the ETIAS scheme and make the best of it. Complaining, or calling out as
>>>>>> one poster here likes to call it, won’t change anything. I aim to go to my
>>>>>> grave in the best possible mood that I can muster.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, 100% agreed. There's no point banging on about what a mistake
>>>>> Brexit was, and we just have to make the best of the situation we
>>>>> are now in, including taking advantage of any opportunities that it
>>>>> presents. They may be few and far between, but we must make the most
>>>>> of any that arise.
>>>>
>>>> I apologise for what appears to be a lack of apostrophes in my posts. They
>>>> are present leaving here on my iPad and NewsTap, but seem to get lost in
>>>> the wash, judging by the quotes of my posts. I’m guessing my apostrophes
>>>> aren’t standard ascii ones, but I’ve no idea how to fix this.
>>>
>>> Your postings (and replies) look fine here, using a tried and tested
>>> newsreader. See if this posting preserves them.
>>
>> Thanks - yes they are preserved. However some peoples’ quotes seem to drop
>> the apostrophes. Odd.
>
> I think the culprit in this case was Forte Agent, which I use on my PC. It
> ignores or converts into ? any but basic ASCII characters. I've not been
> able to find any option which stops it doing that. I'd welcome any
> suggestions for how to change its behaviour.
>
> Incidentally, it doesn't drop basic apostrophes but drops the ones Word
> creates or which you find in published text. NewsTap on my iPad is much
> more forgiving and also lets me insert any text. So I think Agent will
> only retain the first of these three apostrophes: '‘’
>
All three are are visible in Thunderbird.

Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> On 19/02/2022 16:11, Recliner wrote:
>> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>> On 19/02/2022 14:05, Recliner wrote:
>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 13:14:29 +0000, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 19/02/2022 11:27, Recliner wrote:
>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>> In message <suqh0e$447$1@dont-email.me>, at 10:32:48 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>>>>> 2022, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>> On 19/02/2022 08:27, Graeme Wall wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 18/02/2022 22:06, Recliner wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> Graham Harrison <edward.harrisom.one@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, 14 Feb 2022 21:16:53 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
>>>>>>>>>>>> <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I was wondering if mainline rail charters hauled by Flying
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Scotsman are
>>>>>>>>>>>>> shown in RTT?  I notice that this one hasn't appeared (yet), and
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I know
>>>>>>>>>>>>> that the timings shown online differ from the actual finalised
>>>>>>>>>>>>> timings. The
>>>>>>>>>>>>> light engine moves to and from Southall are shown.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://www.railwaytouring.net/the-cotswold-venturer-2022 " rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.railwaytouring.net/the-cotswold-venturer-2022>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> The letter accompanying the ticket says:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Please note due to trespassing issues we have been asked
>>>>>>>>>>>>> by Network Rail and the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> British
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Transport Police to not publicise the final timings for th
>>>>>>>>>>>>> e train so we would appreciate it if you could
>>>>>>>>>>>>> treat the timings given overleaf as strictly confidential.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I just received a message to say it's been cancelled.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Ah, yes, you're right, thanks for the warning. I've not yet received an
>>>>>>>>>>> email to that effect, but it's on the website:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> https://www.railwaytouring.net/the-cotswold-venturer-2022
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Found the email:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Cotswold Venturer - Urgent Update - Tour Cancelled
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> We have just been informed that despite the best efforts of the Network
>>>>>>>>>> Rail Charter Division in monitoring the situation throughout the day and
>>>>>>>>>> looking at alternative routing in case the original route was not
>>>>>>>>>> possible
>>>>>>>>>> for our train, the Regional Network Rail Route Director has this evening
>>>>>>>>>> made the decision to cancel our Cotswold Venturer train tomorrow.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> We are very sorry for the late notice of this cancellation, which is
>>>>>>>>>> outside of our control, and we apologise for any disappointment it may
>>>>>>>>>> cause, everyone involved had worked together in the hope that the train
>>>>>>>>>> would be able to take place tomorrow.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> We are now working with our operating company, West Coast Railways,
>>>>>>>>>> Network
>>>>>>>>>> Rail and the caretakers of Flying Scotsman to try and redate the tour in
>>>>>>>>>> March and will be in touch with you as soon as we have a firm date
>>>>>>>>>> for this
>>>>>>>>>> rescheduling. Should the new date not be convenient for you, then
>>>>>>>>>> you will
>>>>>>>>>> be entitled to transfer your funds to a different tour or to receive
>>>>>>>>>> a full
>>>>>>>>>> refund of monies paid to us.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Your patience at this time will be appreciated whilst we make the
>>>>>>>>>> necessary
>>>>>>>>>> arrangements, we will be in touch with you again in the coming days to
>>>>>>>>>> advise further.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Once again our sincere apologies for any inconvenience.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> —————
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I wonder how much this will cost the FS operation (NRM?), WCR, RTC and
>>>>>>>>>> Gravy Train (caterers), and wonder if NR covers some or all of the costs?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I don't have any wasted travel or hotel costs, but I'm sure many of the
>>>>>>>>>> other would-be passengers will have.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Act of God invoked presumably.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Two other railtours / charters have managed to run today (19 February),
>>>>>>>> albeit both running rather late:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Reading to Lincoln:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:U68002/2022-02-19/detailed
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> +137 at Banbury!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> and Telford Central to Appleby:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:U91449/2022-02-19/detaile
>>>>>>>> d#allox_id=0
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Are either of them kettles?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No, as you can see from RTT, they're diesel-hauled.
>>>>>>
>>>>> According to reports elsewhere, a Class 68 to Lincoln, and a pair of 47s
>>>>> to Appleby and back.
>>>>
>>>> Yes, the 47s were identified. I wonder why the 68 was pathed as only a
>>>> 75mph loco? It's the most powerful diesel loco
>>>> in service in the UK, and can easily pull a train like that at 100mph.
>>>
>>> Is the stock cleared for more than 75mph?
>>>
>>
>> Few charters use any stock not capable of 100mph running. Only the British
>> Pullman has a lower limit.
>>
>
> I've often seen Pullmans marshalled in charter sets but thinking about
> it they would have been Mk1s as well.
>

Yes, lots of tarted-up Mk 1, Mk 2 and Mk 3 carriages are labelled as
Pullman, but only the British Pullman set has genuine pre-War carriages
with a lower top speed.

Here's a WCR Mk 1 'Pullman' carriage:
<https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/51226268561/in/album-72157719347934973>

It was nicely appointed inside, but still just a normal Mk 1:
<https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/51227340835/in/album-72157719347934973/>

On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 16:45:39 -0000 (UTC), Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:

>Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <suqvrl$hg6$1@dont-email.me>, at 14:46:13 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 14:35:06 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
>>>>> <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 12:20:49 +0000, Roland Perry
>>>>>>> <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> In message <suqkmj$ds3$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:35:46 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>>>>>> 2022, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk remarked:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The only email I have on my phone is my personal address only known to
>>>>>>>>> relatives and close friends. I certainly wouldn't trust it to
>>>>>>>>> commercial organisations.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Most smartphones need an email address from either Apple or Google to
>>>>>>>> set them up. But I'm loving all this anti-email-on-phone stuff, having
>>>>>>>> been on the receiving end of accusations of being an anti-Mticketing
>>>>>>>> luddite in the past.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I suspect that you are Martin fall into the category of the eccentric
>>>>>>> elderly who don't use their phones like most of
>>>>>>> the population.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There’s basically two ways forwards - you either adapt to the changing
>>>>>> world or spend the rest of your few years left on the planet complaining
>>>>>> about how the world doesn’t work how you’d like it to. I’d wager that the
>>>>>> latter just leads to unhappiness and changes nothing.
>>>>>
>>>>> I think we can see the evidence of that here.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Eg, I detest Brexit and all that has ensued from it. However, I’ll get with
>>>>>> the ETIAS scheme and make the best of it. Complaining, or calling out as
>>>>>> one poster here likes to call it, won’t change anything. I aim to go to my
>>>>>> grave in the best possible mood that I can muster.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, 100% agreed. There's no point banging on about what a mistake
>>>>> Brexit was, and we just have to make the best of the situation we
>>>>> are now in, including taking advantage of any opportunities that it
>>>>> presents. They may be few and far between, but we must make the most
>>>>> of any that arise.
>>>>
>>>> I apologise for what appears to be a lack of apostrophes in my posts. They
>>>> are present leaving here on my iPad and NewsTap, but seem to get lost in
>>>> the wash, judging by the quotes of my posts. I’m guessing my apostrophes
>>>> aren’t standard ascii ones, but I’ve no idea how to fix this.
>>>
>>> Your postings (and replies) look fine here, using a tried and tested
>>> newsreader. See if this posting preserves them.
>>
>> Thanks - yes they are preserved. However some peoples’ quotes seem to drop
>> the apostrophes. Odd.
>
>I think the culprit in this case was Forte Agent, which I use on my PC. It
>ignores or converts into ? any but basic ASCII characters. I've not been
>able to find any option which stops it doing that. I'd welcome any
>suggestions for how to change its behaviour.
>
>Incidentally, it doesn't drop basic apostrophes but drops the ones Word
>creates or which you find in published text. NewsTap on my iPad is much
>more forgiving and also lets me insert any text. So I think Agent will
>only retain the first of these three apostrophes: '‘’

Well, I was wrong, Agent has retained all three. Hopefully it'll post them, too.

On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 17:15:26 +0000, Recliner wrote:

> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 16:45:39 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
> <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> In message <suqvrl$hg6$1@dont-email.me>, at 14:46:13 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 14:35:06 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
>>>>>> <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 12:20:49 +0000, Roland Perry
>>>>>>>> <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> In message <suqkmj$ds3$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:35:46 on Sat, 19
>>>>>>>>> Feb 2022, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk remarked:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The only email I have on my phone is my personal address only
>>>>>>>>>> known to relatives and close friends. I certainly wouldn't
>>>>>>>>>> trust it to commercial organisations.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Most smartphones need an email address from either Apple or
>>>>>>>>> Google to set them up. But I'm loving all this
>>>>>>>>> anti-email-on-phone stuff, having been on the receiving end of
>>>>>>>>> accusations of being an anti-Mticketing luddite in the past.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I suspect that you are Martin fall into the category of the
>>>>>>>> eccentric elderly who don't use their phones like most of the
>>>>>>>> population.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> There’s basically two ways forwards - you either adapt to the
>>>>>>> changing world or spend the rest of your few years left on the
>>>>>>> planet complaining about how the world doesn’t work how you’d
like
>>>>>>> it to. I’d wager that the latter just leads to unhappiness and
>>>>>>> changes nothing.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think we can see the evidence of that here.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Eg, I detest Brexit and all that has ensued from it. However, I’ll
>>>>>>> get with the ETIAS scheme and make the best of it. Complaining, or
>>>>>>> calling out as one poster here likes to call it, won’t change
>>>>>>> anything. I aim to go to my grave in the best possible mood that I
>>>>>>> can muster.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yes, 100% agreed. There's no point banging on about what a mistake
>>>>>> Brexit was, and we just have to make the best of the situation we
>>>>>> are now in, including taking advantage of any opportunities that
>>>>>> it presents. They may be few and far between, but we must make the
>>>>>> most of any that arise.
>>>>>
>>>>> I apologise for what appears to be a lack of apostrophes in my
>>>>> posts. They are present leaving here on my iPad and NewsTap, but
>>>>> seem to get lost in the wash, judging by the quotes of my posts. I’m
>>>>> guessing my apostrophes aren’t standard ascii ones, but I’ve no
idea
>>>>> how to fix this.
>>>>
>>>> Your postings (and replies) look fine here, using a tried and tested
>>>> newsreader. See if this posting preserves them.
>>>
>>> Thanks - yes they are preserved. However some peoples’ quotes seem to
>>> drop the apostrophes. Odd.
>>
>>I think the culprit in this case was Forte Agent, which I use on my PC.
>>It ignores or converts into ? any but basic ASCII characters. I've not
>>been able to find any option which stops it doing that. I'd welcome any
>>suggestions for how to change its behaviour.
>>
>>Incidentally, it doesn't drop basic apostrophes but drops the ones Word
>>creates or which you find in published text. NewsTap on my iPad is much
>>more forgiving and also lets me insert any text. So I think Agent will
>>only retain the first of these three apostrophes: '‘’
>
> Well, I was wrong, Agent has retained all three. Hopefully it'll post
> them, too.

It didn't! Saw all of the 25 symbols in your test post, and all three of
the apostrophes, but your quoting above shows one apostrophe, one 0091
character and one 0092 (hex). That's Pan on Linux.

nib

On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 16:52:31 +0000, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:

>On 19/02/2022 16:45, Recliner wrote:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <suqvrl$hg6$1@dont-email.me>, at 14:46:13 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 14:35:06 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
>>>>> <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 12:20:49 +0000, Roland Perry
>>>>>>> <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> In message <suqkmj$ds3$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:35:46 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>>>>>> 2022, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk remarked:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The only email I have on my phone is my personal address only known to
>>>>>>>>> relatives and close friends. I certainly wouldn't trust it to
>>>>>>>>> commercial organisations.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Most smartphones need an email address from either Apple or Google to
>>>>>>>> set them up. But I'm loving all this anti-email-on-phone stuff, having
>>>>>>>> been on the receiving end of accusations of being an anti-Mticketing
>>>>>>>> luddite in the past.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I suspect that you are Martin fall into the category of the eccentric
>>>>>>> elderly who don't use their phones like most of
>>>>>>> the population.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There’s basically two ways forwards - you either adapt to the changing
>>>>>> world or spend the rest of your few years left on the planet complaining
>>>>>> about how the world doesn’t work how you’d like it to. I’d wager that the
>>>>>> latter just leads to unhappiness and changes nothing.
>>>>>
>>>>> I think we can see the evidence of that here.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Eg, I detest Brexit and all that has ensued from it. However, I’ll get with
>>>>>> the ETIAS scheme and make the best of it. Complaining, or calling out as
>>>>>> one poster here likes to call it, won’t change anything. I aim to go to my
>>>>>> grave in the best possible mood that I can muster.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, 100% agreed. There's no point banging on about what a mistake
>>>>> Brexit was, and we just have to make the best of the situation we
>>>>> are now in, including taking advantage of any opportunities that it
>>>>> presents. They may be few and far between, but we must make the most
>>>>> of any that arise.
>>>>
>>>> I apologise for what appears to be a lack of apostrophes in my posts. They
>>>> are present leaving here on my iPad and NewsTap, but seem to get lost in
>>>> the wash, judging by the quotes of my posts. I’m guessing my apostrophes
>>>> aren’t standard ascii ones, but I’ve no idea how to fix this.
>>>
>>> Your postings (and replies) look fine here, using a tried and tested
>>> newsreader. See if this posting preserves them.
>>
>> Does your tried and tested newsreader quote and preserve these 25
>> space-separated characters:
>> ™ ‰ ? ¶ § ± ? ? ? … æ ° ± ? ? ® ? ? “ ” — ˆ Ø ÷ …
>>
>> And could you type them in? I just typed them straight into NewsTap from
>> my normal keyboard (Padkeys).
>>
>
>All work fine on Thunderbird.

Except that they didn't. Eight have been replaced by ?s. So that's a score of 68%.

Agent is the same.

On 19/02/2022 17:18, Recliner wrote:
> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 16:52:31 +0000, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> On 19/02/2022 16:45, Recliner wrote:
>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> In message <suqvrl$hg6$1@dont-email.me>, at 14:46:13 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 14:35:06 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
>>>>>> <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 12:20:49 +0000, Roland Perry
>>>>>>>> <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> In message <suqkmj$ds3$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:35:46 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>>>>>>> 2022, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk remarked:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The only email I have on my phone is my personal address only known to
>>>>>>>>>> relatives and close friends. I certainly wouldn't trust it to
>>>>>>>>>> commercial organisations.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Most smartphones need an email address from either Apple or Google to
>>>>>>>>> set them up. But I'm loving all this anti-email-on-phone stuff, having
>>>>>>>>> been on the receiving end of accusations of being an anti-Mticketing
>>>>>>>>> luddite in the past.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I suspect that you are Martin fall into the category of the eccentric
>>>>>>>> elderly who don't use their phones like most of
>>>>>>>> the population.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> There’s basically two ways forwards - you either adapt to the changing
>>>>>>> world or spend the rest of your few years left on the planet complaining
>>>>>>> about how the world doesn’t work how you’d like it to. I’d wager that the
>>>>>>> latter just leads to unhappiness and changes nothing.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think we can see the evidence of that here.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Eg, I detest Brexit and all that has ensued from it. However, I’ll get with
>>>>>>> the ETIAS scheme and make the best of it. Complaining, or calling out as
>>>>>>> one poster here likes to call it, won’t change anything. I aim to go to my
>>>>>>> grave in the best possible mood that I can muster.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yes, 100% agreed. There's no point banging on about what a mistake
>>>>>> Brexit was, and we just have to make the best of the situation we
>>>>>> are now in, including taking advantage of any opportunities that it
>>>>>> presents. They may be few and far between, but we must make the most
>>>>>> of any that arise.
>>>>>
>>>>> I apologise for what appears to be a lack of apostrophes in my posts. They
>>>>> are present leaving here on my iPad and NewsTap, but seem to get lost in
>>>>> the wash, judging by the quotes of my posts. I’m guessing my apostrophes
>>>>> aren’t standard ascii ones, but I’ve no idea how to fix this.
>>>>
>>>> Your postings (and replies) look fine here, using a tried and tested
>>>> newsreader. See if this posting preserves them.
>>>
>>> Does your tried and tested newsreader quote and preserve these 25
>>> space-separated characters:
>>> ™ ‰ ? ¶ § ± ? ? ? … æ ° ± ? ? ® ? ? “ ” — ˆ Ø ÷ …
>>>
>>> And could you type them in? I just typed them straight into NewsTap from
>>> my normal keyboard (Padkeys).
>>>
>>
>> All work fine on Thunderbird.
>
> Except that they didn't. Eight have been replaced by ?s. So that's a score of 68%.
>
> Agent is the same.

Stranger and stranger!

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 14:57:04 +0000, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:

>In message <f2021hta4h84u9a0l75aj1981g3avu1aa0@4ax.com>, at 14:39:11 on
>Sat, 19 Feb 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>
>>>I detest Brexit and all that has ensued from it. However, I’ll get with
>>>the ETIAS scheme and make the best of it. Complaining, or calling out as
>>>one poster here likes to call it, won’t change anything. I aim to go to my
>>>grave in the best possible mood that I can muster.
>>
>>Yes, 100% agreed. There's no point banging on about what a mistake
>>Brexit was,
>
>There is a point, because the perpetrators are still in power, and are
>screwing up the aftermath.

So, criticise them for their current incompetence, not what they said in 2016. And, note that the current PM was
elected on a platform of achieving a hard Brexit, which is exactly what he's done. So, that's one election promise he
did keep. There's no point complaining if a politician was elected on a clear platform, and proceeded to deliver it,
just because you don't like it.

>
>>and we just have to make the best of the situation we are now in,
>>including taking advantage of any opportunities that it presents.
>
>Including improving the recovery process by having different/better
>leaders/policies to cope with the consequences of leaving.

How are you going to achieve that? Not by moaning about Brexit.

As we all know, there's a high probability that BoJo will soon be leaving politics, but he will most likely be replaced
by another Brexiteer with a better chance of winning the 2024 general election.

On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 17:18:08 -0000 (UTC), nib <news@ingram-bromley.co.uk> wrote:

>On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 17:15:26 +0000, Recliner wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 16:45:39 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
>> <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> In message <suqvrl$hg6$1@dont-email.me>, at 14:46:13 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 14:35:06 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
>>>>>>> <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 12:20:49 +0000, Roland Perry
>>>>>>>>> <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> In message <suqkmj$ds3$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:35:46 on Sat, 19
>>>>>>>>>> Feb 2022, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk remarked:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The only email I have on my phone is my personal address only
>>>>>>>>>>> known to relatives and close friends. I certainly wouldn't
>>>>>>>>>>> trust it to commercial organisations.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Most smartphones need an email address from either Apple or
>>>>>>>>>> Google to set them up. But I'm loving all this
>>>>>>>>>> anti-email-on-phone stuff, having been on the receiving end of
>>>>>>>>>> accusations of being an anti-Mticketing luddite in the past.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I suspect that you are Martin fall into the category of the
>>>>>>>>> eccentric elderly who don't use their phones like most of the
>>>>>>>>> population.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> There?s basically two ways forwards - you either adapt to the
>>>>>>>> changing world or spend the rest of your few years left on the
>>>>>>>> planet complaining about how the world doesn?t work how you?d
>like
>>>>>>>> it to. I?d wager that the latter just leads to unhappiness and
>>>>>>>> changes nothing.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I think we can see the evidence of that here.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Eg, I detest Brexit and all that has ensued from it. However, I?ll
>>>>>>>> get with the ETIAS scheme and make the best of it. Complaining, or
>>>>>>>> calling out as one poster here likes to call it, won?t change
>>>>>>>> anything. I aim to go to my grave in the best possible mood that I
>>>>>>>> can muster.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Yes, 100% agreed. There's no point banging on about what a mistake
>>>>>>> Brexit was, and we just have to make the best of the situation we
>>>>>>> are now in, including taking advantage of any opportunities that
>>>>>>> it presents. They may be few and far between, but we must make the
>>>>>>> most of any that arise.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I apologise for what appears to be a lack of apostrophes in my
>>>>>> posts. They are present leaving here on my iPad and NewsTap, but
>>>>>> seem to get lost in the wash, judging by the quotes of my posts. I?m
>>>>>> guessing my apostrophes aren?t standard ascii ones, but I?ve no
>idea
>>>>>> how to fix this.
>>>>>
>>>>> Your postings (and replies) look fine here, using a tried and tested
>>>>> newsreader. See if this posting preserves them.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks - yes they are preserved. However some peoples? quotes seem to
>>>> drop the apostrophes. Odd.
>>>
>>>I think the culprit in this case was Forte Agent, which I use on my PC.
>>>It ignores or converts into ? any but basic ASCII characters. I've not
>>>been able to find any option which stops it doing that. I'd welcome any
>>>suggestions for how to change its behaviour.
>>>
>>>Incidentally, it doesn't drop basic apostrophes but drops the ones Word
>>>creates or which you find in published text. NewsTap on my iPad is much
>>>more forgiving and also lets me insert any text. So I think Agent will
>>>only retain the first of these three apostrophes: '??
>>
>> Well, I was wrong, Agent has retained all three. Hopefully it'll post
>> them, too.
>
>It didn't! Saw all of the 25 symbols in your test post, and all three of
>the apostrophes, but your quoting above shows one apostrophe, one 0091
>character and one 0092 (hex). That's Pan on Linux.

All three apostrophes do show up in Agent on Windows: '‘’. No ?s among them. So, it appears than Pan on Linux is even
worse than Agent on Windows!

On 19/02/2022 17:25, Recliner wrote:
> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 14:57:04 +0000, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> In message <f2021hta4h84u9a0l75aj1981g3avu1aa0@4ax.com>, at 14:39:11 on
>> Sat, 19 Feb 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>
>>>> I detest Brexit and all that has ensued from it. However, I’ll get with
>>>> the ETIAS scheme and make the best of it. Complaining, or calling out as
>>>> one poster here likes to call it, won’t change anything. I aim to go to my
>>>> grave in the best possible mood that I can muster.
>>>
>>> Yes, 100% agreed. There's no point banging on about what a mistake
>>> Brexit was,
>>
>> There is a point, because the perpetrators are still in power, and are
>> screwing up the aftermath.
>
> So, criticise them for their current incompetence, not what they said in 2016.

That's all the brexiteers can do, keep harking back to what they claim
other people said 6 years ago rather than face up to reality of what is
happening now.

And, note that the current PM was
> elected on a platform of achieving a hard Brexit, which is exactly what he's done. So, that's one election promise he
> did keep. There's no point complaining if a politician was elected on a clear platform, and proceeded to deliver it,
> just because you don't like it.

He was elected to get Brexit done which he has singularly failed to do.

>
>>
>>> and we just have to make the best of the situation we are now in,
>>> including taking advantage of any opportunities that it presents.
>>
>> Including improving the recovery process by having different/better
>> leaders/policies to cope with the consequences of leaving.
>
> How are you going to achieve that? Not by moaning about Brexit.
>
> As we all know, there's a high probability that BoJo will soon be leaving politics, but he will most likely be replaced
> by another Brexiteer with a better chance of winning the 2024 general election.

Don't count your chickens, Bojo is relying on Putin to do a Maggie for
him. When he says you will need tanks to get him out of Downing Street
he wasn't joking.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

On 19/02/2022 16:52, Graeme Wall wrote:
> On 19/02/2022 16:45, Recliner wrote:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <suqvrl$hg6$1@dont-email.me>, at 14:46:13 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 14:35:06 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
>>>>> <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 12:20:49 +0000, Roland Perry
>>>>>>> <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> In message <suqkmj$ds3$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:35:46 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>>>>>> 2022, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk remarked:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The only email I have on my phone is my personal address only
>>>>>>>>> known to
>>>>>>>>> relatives and close friends.  I certainly wouldn't trust it to
>>>>>>>>> commercial organisations.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Most smartphones need an email address from either Apple or
>>>>>>>> Google to
>>>>>>>> set them up. But I'm loving all this anti-email-on-phone stuff,
>>>>>>>> having
>>>>>>>> been on the receiving end of accusations of being an
>>>>>>>> anti-Mticketing
>>>>>>>> luddite in the past.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I suspect that you are Martin fall into the category of the
>>>>>>> eccentric
>>>>>>> elderly who don't use their phones like most of
>>>>>>> the population.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There’s basically two ways forwards - you either adapt to the
>>>>>> changing
>>>>>> world or spend the rest of your few years left on the planet
>>>>>> complaining
>>>>>> about how the world doesn’t work how you’d like it to. I’d wager
>>>>>> that the
>>>>>> latter just leads to unhappiness and changes nothing.
>>>>>
>>>>> I think we can see the evidence of that here.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Eg, I detest Brexit and all that has ensued from it. However, I’ll
>>>>>> get with
>>>>>> the ETIAS scheme and make the best of it. Complaining, or calling
>>>>>> out as
>>>>>> one poster here likes to call it, won’t change anything. I aim to
>>>>>> go to my
>>>>>> grave in the best possible mood that I can muster.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, 100% agreed. There's no point banging on about what a mistake
>>>>> Brexit  was, and we just have to make the best of the  situation we
>>>>> are now in, including taking advantage of any opportunities  that it
>>>>> presents. They may be few and far  between, but we must make the most
>>>>> of any that arise.
>>>>
>>>> I apologise for what appears to be a lack of apostrophes in my
>>>> posts. They
>>>> are present leaving here on my iPad and NewsTap, but seem to get
>>>> lost in
>>>> the wash, judging by the quotes of my posts. I’m guessing my
>>>> apostrophes
>>>> aren’t standard ascii ones, but I’ve no idea how to fix this.
>>>
>>> Your postings (and replies) look fine here, using a tried and tested
>>> newsreader. See if this posting preserves them.
>>
>> Does your tried and tested newsreader quote and preserve these 25
>> space-separated characters:
>> ™ ‰ ∞ ¶ § ± ≤ ≥ ∏ … æ ° ± ≠ ∑ ® √ ∫ “ ” — ˆ Ø ÷ …
>>
>> And could you type them in?  I just typed them straight into NewsTap from
>> my normal keyboard (Padkeys).
>>
>
> All work fine on Thunderbird.
>
The 25 characters are good but all three apostrophes are missing.
Perhaps it's quoted posts?

On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 17:28:21 +0000, Recliner wrote:

> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 17:18:08 -0000 (UTC), nib
> <news@ingram-bromley.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 17:15:26 +0000, Recliner wrote:
>>
>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 16:45:39 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
>>> <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>> In message <suqvrl$hg6$1@dont-email.me>, at 14:46:13 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>>>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 14:35:06 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
>>>>>>>> <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 12:20:49 +0000, Roland Perry
>>>>>>>>>> <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> In message <suqkmj$ds3$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:35:46 on Sat,
>>>>>>>>>>> 19 Feb 2022, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk remarked:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> The only email I have on my phone is my personal address only
>>>>>>>>>>>> known to relatives and close friends. I certainly wouldn't
>>>>>>>>>>>> trust it to commercial organisations.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Most smartphones need an email address from either Apple or
>>>>>>>>>>> Google to set them up. But I'm loving all this
>>>>>>>>>>> anti-email-on-phone stuff, having been on the receiving end of
>>>>>>>>>>> accusations of being an anti-Mticketing luddite in the past.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I suspect that you are Martin fall into the category of the
>>>>>>>>>> eccentric elderly who don't use their phones like most of the
>>>>>>>>>> population.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> There?s basically two ways forwards - you either adapt to the
>>>>>>>>> changing world or spend the rest of your few years left on the
>>>>>>>>> planet complaining about how the world doesn?t work how you?d
>>like
>>>>>>>>> it to. I?d wager that the latter just leads to unhappiness and
>>>>>>>>> changes nothing.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I think we can see the evidence of that here.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Eg, I detest Brexit and all that has ensued from it. However,
>>>>>>>>> I?ll get with the ETIAS scheme and make the best of it.
>>>>>>>>> Complaining, or calling out as one poster here likes to call it,
>>>>>>>>> won?t change anything. I aim to go to my grave in the best
>>>>>>>>> possible mood that I can muster.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Yes, 100% agreed. There's no point banging on about what a
>>>>>>>> mistake Brexit was, and we just have to make the best of the
>>>>>>>> situation we are now in, including taking advantage of any
>>>>>>>> opportunities that it presents. They may be few and far
>>>>>>>> between, but we must make the most of any that arise.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I apologise for what appears to be a lack of apostrophes in my
>>>>>>> posts. They are present leaving here on my iPad and NewsTap, but
>>>>>>> seem to get lost in the wash, judging by the quotes of my posts.
>>>>>>> I?m guessing my apostrophes aren?t standard ascii ones, but I?ve
>>>>>>> no
>>idea
>>>>>>> how to fix this.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Your postings (and replies) look fine here, using a tried and
>>>>>> tested newsreader. See if this posting preserves them.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks - yes they are preserved. However some peoples? quotes seem
>>>>> to drop the apostrophes. Odd.
>>>>
>>>>I think the culprit in this case was Forte Agent, which I use on my
>>>>PC.
>>>>It ignores or converts into ? any but basic ASCII characters. I've not
>>>>been able to find any option which stops it doing that. I'd welcome
>>>>any suggestions for how to change its behaviour.
>>>>
>>>>Incidentally, it doesn't drop basic apostrophes but drops the ones
>>>>Word creates or which you find in published text. NewsTap on my iPad
>>>>is much more forgiving and also lets me insert any text. So I think
>>>>Agent will only retain the first of these three apostrophes: '??
>>>
>>> Well, I was wrong, Agent has retained all three. Hopefully it'll post
>>> them, too.
>>
>>It didn't! Saw all of the 25 symbols in your test post, and all three
>>of the apostrophes, but your quoting above shows one apostrophe, one
>>0091 character and one 0092 (hex). That's Pan on Linux.
>
> All three apostrophes do show up in Agent on Windows: '‘’. No ?s among
> them. So, it appears than Pan on Linux is even worse than Agent on
> Windows!

Don't see that! It renders them all correctly the first time they appear,
but not after someone else has quoted them - surely it's that quoting
process elsewhere that has caused the corruption?

nib

On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 14:35:38 +0000, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:

>In message <dav11h55l3lg8ngt6aq5frpkronaodfee0@4ax.com>, at 14:24:11 on
>Sat, 19 Feb 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 12:20:49 +0000, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>>In message <suqkmj$ds3$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:35:46 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>2022, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk remarked:
>>>
>>>>The only email I have on my phone is my personal address only known to
>>>>relatives and close friends. I certainly wouldn't trust it to
>>>>commercial organisations.
>>>
>>>Most smartphones need an email address from either Apple or Google to
>>>set them up. But I'm loving all this anti-email-on-phone stuff, having
>>>been on the receiving end of accusations of being an anti-Mticketing
>>>luddite in the past.
>>
>>I suspect that you are Martin fall into the category of the eccentric
>>elderly who don't use their phones like most of the population.
>
>If having 300 apps and using them for a wide range of communications and
>other technical processes, including having two of them on my desk being
>interrogated dozens of times a day, is "eccentric", then maybe I'd have
>to agree with you.

How many other long-retired people, who don't go anywhere, fill their time with such activities?

>
>I just don't think they are very good at tasks like power-user (in terms
>of quantity and diversity) email.

Actual power users seem to manage to do a lot on their smartphones. It's just retired blokes like you who find them
inadequate.

On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 17:34:28 -0000 (UTC), nib <news@ingram-bromley.co.uk> wrote:

>On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 17:28:21 +0000, Recliner wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 17:18:08 -0000 (UTC), nib
>> <news@ingram-bromley.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>>On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 17:15:26 +0000, Recliner wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 16:45:39 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
>>>> <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>> In message <suqvrl$hg6$1@dont-email.me>, at 14:46:13 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>>>>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 14:35:06 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
>>>>>>>>> <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 12:20:49 +0000, Roland Perry
>>>>>>>>>>> <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> In message <suqkmj$ds3$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:35:46 on Sat,
>>>>>>>>>>>> 19 Feb 2022, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk remarked:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> The only email I have on my phone is my personal address only
>>>>>>>>>>>>> known to relatives and close friends. I certainly wouldn't
>>>>>>>>>>>>> trust it to commercial organisations.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Most smartphones need an email address from either Apple or
>>>>>>>>>>>> Google to set them up. But I'm loving all this
>>>>>>>>>>>> anti-email-on-phone stuff, having been on the receiving end of
>>>>>>>>>>>> accusations of being an anti-Mticketing luddite in the past.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I suspect that you are Martin fall into the category of the
>>>>>>>>>>> eccentric elderly who don't use their phones like most of the
>>>>>>>>>>> population.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> There?s basically two ways forwards - you either adapt to the
>>>>>>>>>> changing world or spend the rest of your few years left on the
>>>>>>>>>> planet complaining about how the world doesn?t work how you?d
>>>like
>>>>>>>>>> it to. I?d wager that the latter just leads to unhappiness and
>>>>>>>>>> changes nothing.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I think we can see the evidence of that here.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Eg, I detest Brexit and all that has ensued from it. However,
>>>>>>>>>> I?ll get with the ETIAS scheme and make the best of it.
>>>>>>>>>> Complaining, or calling out as one poster here likes to call it,
>>>>>>>>>> won?t change anything. I aim to go to my grave in the best
>>>>>>>>>> possible mood that I can muster.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Yes, 100% agreed. There's no point banging on about what a
>>>>>>>>> mistake Brexit was, and we just have to make the best of the
>>>>>>>>> situation we are now in, including taking advantage of any
>>>>>>>>> opportunities that it presents. They may be few and far
>>>>>>>>> between, but we must make the most of any that arise.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I apologise for what appears to be a lack of apostrophes in my
>>>>>>>> posts. They are present leaving here on my iPad and NewsTap, but
>>>>>>>> seem to get lost in the wash, judging by the quotes of my posts.
>>>>>>>> I?m guessing my apostrophes aren?t standard ascii ones, but I?ve
>>>>>>>> no
>>>idea
>>>>>>>> how to fix this.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Your postings (and replies) look fine here, using a tried and
>>>>>>> tested newsreader. See if this posting preserves them.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks - yes they are preserved. However some peoples? quotes seem
>>>>>> to drop the apostrophes. Odd.
>>>>>
>>>>>I think the culprit in this case was Forte Agent, which I use on my
>>>>>PC.
>>>>>It ignores or converts into ? any but basic ASCII characters. I've not
>>>>>been able to find any option which stops it doing that. I'd welcome
>>>>>any suggestions for how to change its behaviour.
>>>>>
>>>>>Incidentally, it doesn't drop basic apostrophes but drops the ones
>>>>>Word creates or which you find in published text. NewsTap on my iPad
>>>>>is much more forgiving and also lets me insert any text. So I think
>>>>>Agent will only retain the first of these three apostrophes: '??
>>>>
>>>> Well, I was wrong, Agent has retained all three. Hopefully it'll post
>>>> them, too.
>>>
>>>It didn't! Saw all of the 25 symbols in your test post, and all three
>>>of the apostrophes, but your quoting above shows one apostrophe, one
>>>0091 character and one 0092 (hex). That's Pan on Linux.
>>
>> All three apostrophes do show up in Agent on Windows: '??. No ?s among
>> them. So, it appears than Pan on Linux is even worse than Agent on
>> Windows!
>
>Don't see that! It renders them all correctly the first time they appear,
>but not after someone else has quoted them - surely it's that quoting
>process elsewhere that has caused the corruption?

Yes, that may be the problem.

On 19/02/2022 17:33, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk wrote:
> On 19/02/2022 16:52, Graeme Wall wrote:
>> On 19/02/2022 16:45, Recliner wrote:
>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> In message <suqvrl$hg6$1@dont-email.me>, at 14:46:13 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 14:35:06 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
>>>>>> <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 12:20:49 +0000, Roland Perry
>>>>>>>> <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> In message <suqkmj$ds3$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:35:46 on Sat, 19
>>>>>>>>> Feb
>>>>>>>>> 2022, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk remarked:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The only email I have on my phone is my personal address only
>>>>>>>>>> known to
>>>>>>>>>> relatives and close friends.  I certainly wouldn't trust it to
>>>>>>>>>> commercial organisations.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Most smartphones need an email address from either Apple or
>>>>>>>>> Google to
>>>>>>>>> set them up. But I'm loving all this anti-email-on-phone stuff,
>>>>>>>>> having
>>>>>>>>> been on the receiving end of accusations of being an
>>>>>>>>> anti-Mticketing
>>>>>>>>> luddite in the past.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I suspect that you are Martin fall into the category of the
>>>>>>>> eccentric
>>>>>>>> elderly who don't use their phones like most of
>>>>>>>> the population.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> There’s basically two ways forwards - you either adapt to the
>>>>>>> changing
>>>>>>> world or spend the rest of your few years left on the planet
>>>>>>> complaining
>>>>>>> about how the world doesn’t work how you’d like it to. I’d wager
>>>>>>> that the
>>>>>>> latter just leads to unhappiness and changes nothing.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think we can see the evidence of that here.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Eg, I detest Brexit and all that has ensued from it. However,
>>>>>>> I’ll get with
>>>>>>> the ETIAS scheme and make the best of it. Complaining, or calling
>>>>>>> out as
>>>>>>> one poster here likes to call it, won’t change anything. I aim to
>>>>>>> go to my
>>>>>>> grave in the best possible mood that I can muster.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yes, 100% agreed. There's no point banging on about what a mistake
>>>>>> Brexit  was, and we just have to make the best of the  situation we
>>>>>> are now in, including taking advantage of any opportunities  that it
>>>>>> presents. They may be few and far  between, but we must make the most
>>>>>> of any that arise.
>>>>>
>>>>> I apologise for what appears to be a lack of apostrophes in my
>>>>> posts. They
>>>>> are present leaving here on my iPad and NewsTap, but seem to get
>>>>> lost in
>>>>> the wash, judging by the quotes of my posts. I’m guessing my
>>>>> apostrophes
>>>>> aren’t standard ascii ones, but I’ve no idea how to fix this.
>>>>
>>>> Your postings (and replies) look fine here, using a tried and tested
>>>> newsreader. See if this posting preserves them.
>>>
>>> Does your tried and tested newsreader quote and preserve these 25
>>> space-separated characters:
>>> ™ ‰ ∞ ¶ § ± ≤ ≥ ∏ … æ ° ± ≠ ∑ ® √ ∫ “ ” — ˆ Ø ÷ …
>>>
>>> And could you type them in?  I just typed them straight into NewsTap
>>> from
>>> my normal keyboard (Padkeys).
>>>
>>
>> All work fine on Thunderbird.
>>
> The 25 characters are good but all three apostrophes are missing.
> Perhaps it's quoted posts?

When Recliner replied, I lost some of the characters, as he did. Your
reply still has them so the problem is his end it would appear.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 17:33:39 +0000, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk wrote:

>On 19/02/2022 16:52, Graeme Wall wrote:
>> On 19/02/2022 16:45, Recliner wrote:
>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> In message <suqvrl$hg6$1@dont-email.me>, at 14:46:13 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 14:35:06 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
>>>>>> <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 12:20:49 +0000, Roland Perry
>>>>>>>> <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> In message <suqkmj$ds3$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:35:46 on Sat, 19 Feb
>>>>>>>>> 2022, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk remarked:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The only email I have on my phone is my personal address only
>>>>>>>>>> known to
>>>>>>>>>> relatives and close friends.  I certainly wouldn't trust it to
>>>>>>>>>> commercial organisations.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Most smartphones need an email address from either Apple or
>>>>>>>>> Google to
>>>>>>>>> set them up. But I'm loving all this anti-email-on-phone stuff,
>>>>>>>>> having
>>>>>>>>> been on the receiving end of accusations of being an
>>>>>>>>> anti-Mticketing
>>>>>>>>> luddite in the past.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I suspect that you are Martin fall into the category of the
>>>>>>>> eccentric
>>>>>>>> elderly who don't use their phones like most of
>>>>>>>> the population.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> There’s basically two ways forwards - you either adapt to the
>>>>>>> changing
>>>>>>> world or spend the rest of your few years left on the planet
>>>>>>> complaining
>>>>>>> about how the world doesn’t work how you’d like it to. I’d wager
>>>>>>> that the
>>>>>>> latter just leads to unhappiness and changes nothing.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think we can see the evidence of that here.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Eg, I detest Brexit and all that has ensued from it. However, I’ll
>>>>>>> get with
>>>>>>> the ETIAS scheme and make the best of it. Complaining, or calling
>>>>>>> out as
>>>>>>> one poster here likes to call it, won’t change anything. I aim to
>>>>>>> go to my
>>>>>>> grave in the best possible mood that I can muster.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yes, 100% agreed. There's no point banging on about what a mistake
>>>>>> Brexit  was, and we just have to make the best of the  situation we
>>>>>> are now in, including taking advantage of any opportunities  that it
>>>>>> presents. They may be few and far  between, but we must make the most
>>>>>> of any that arise.
>>>>>
>>>>> I apologise for what appears to be a lack of apostrophes in my
>>>>> posts. They
>>>>> are present leaving here on my iPad and NewsTap, but seem to get
>>>>> lost in
>>>>> the wash, judging by the quotes of my posts. I’m guessing my
>>>>> apostrophes
>>>>> aren’t standard ascii ones, but I’ve no idea how to fix this.
>>>>
>>>> Your postings (and replies) look fine here, using a tried and tested
>>>> newsreader. See if this posting preserves them.
>>>
>>> Does your tried and tested newsreader quote and preserve these 25
>>> space-separated characters:
>>> ™ ‰ ? ¶ § ± ? ? ? … æ ° ± ? ? ® ? ? “ ” — ˆ Ø ÷ …
>>>
>>> And could you type them in?  I just typed them straight into NewsTap from
>>> my normal keyboard (Padkeys).
>>>
>>
>> All work fine on Thunderbird.
>>
>The 25 characters are good but all three apostrophes are missing.
>Perhaps it's quoted posts?

It does seem that quoting causes most of the problems.

On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 17:34:28 +0000, nib wrote:

> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 17:28:21 +0000, Recliner wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 17:18:08 -0000 (UTC), nib
>> <news@ingram-bromley.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>>On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 17:15:26 +0000, Recliner wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 16:45:39 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
>>>> <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>> In message <suqvrl$hg6$1@dont-email.me>, at 14:46:13 on Sat, 19
>>>>>>> Feb 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 14:35:06 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
>>>>>>>>> <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 12:20:49 +0000, Roland Perry
>>>>>>>>>>> <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> In message <suqkmj$ds3$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:35:46 on Sat,
>>>>>>>>>>>> 19 Feb 2022, martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk remarked:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> The only email I have on my phone is my personal address
>>>>>>>>>>>>> only known to relatives and close friends. I certainly
>>>>>>>>>>>>> wouldn't trust it to commercial organisations.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Most smartphones need an email address from either Apple or
>>>>>>>>>>>> Google to set them up. But I'm loving all this
>>>>>>>>>>>> anti-email-on-phone stuff, having been on the receiving end
>>>>>>>>>>>> of accusations of being an anti-Mticketing luddite in the
>>>>>>>>>>>> past.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I suspect that you are Martin fall into the category of the
>>>>>>>>>>> eccentric elderly who don't use their phones like most of the
>>>>>>>>>>> population.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> There?s basically two ways forwards - you either adapt to the
>>>>>>>>>> changing world or spend the rest of your few years left on the
>>>>>>>>>> planet complaining about how the world doesn?t work how you?d
>>>like
>>>>>>>>>> it to. I?d wager that the latter just leads to unhappiness and
>>>>>>>>>> changes nothing.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I think we can see the evidence of that here.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Eg, I detest Brexit and all that has ensued from it. However,
>>>>>>>>>> I?ll get with the ETIAS scheme and make the best of it.
>>>>>>>>>> Complaining, or calling out as one poster here likes to call
>>>>>>>>>> it,
>>>>>>>>>> won?t change anything. I aim to go to my grave in the best
>>>>>>>>>> possible mood that I can muster.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Yes, 100% agreed. There's no point banging on about what a
>>>>>>>>> mistake Brexit was, and we just have to make the best of the
>>>>>>>>> situation we are now in, including taking advantage of any
>>>>>>>>> opportunities that it presents. They may be few and far
>>>>>>>>> between, but we must make the most of any that arise.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I apologise for what appears to be a lack of apostrophes in my
>>>>>>>> posts. They are present leaving here on my iPad and NewsTap, but
>>>>>>>> seem to get lost in the wash, judging by the quotes of my posts.
>>>>>>>> I?m guessing my apostrophes aren?t standard ascii ones, but I?ve
>>>>>>>> no
>>>idea
>>>>>>>> how to fix this.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Your postings (and replies) look fine here, using a tried and
>>>>>>> tested newsreader. See if this posting preserves them.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks - yes they are preserved. However some peoples? quotes seem
>>>>>> to drop the apostrophes. Odd.
>>>>>
>>>>>I think the culprit in this case was Forte Agent, which I use on my
>>>>>PC.
>>>>>It ignores or converts into ? any but basic ASCII characters. I've
>>>>>not been able to find any option which stops it doing that. I'd
>>>>>welcome any suggestions for how to change its behaviour.
>>>>>
>>>>>Incidentally, it doesn't drop basic apostrophes but drops the ones
>>>>>Word creates or which you find in published text. NewsTap on my iPad
>>>>>is much more forgiving and also lets me insert any text. So I think
>>>>>Agent will only retain the first of these three apostrophes: '??
>>>>
>>>> Well, I was wrong, Agent has retained all three. Hopefully it'll post
>>>> them, too.
>>>
>>>It didn't! Saw all of the 25 symbols in your test post, and all three
>>>of the apostrophes, but your quoting above shows one apostrophe, one
>>>0091 character and one 0092 (hex). That's Pan on Linux.
>>
>> All three apostrophes do show up in Agent on Windows: '‘’. No ?s
among
>> them. So, it appears than Pan on Linux is even worse than Agent on
>> Windows!
>
> Don't see that! It renders them all correctly the first time they
> appear,
> but not after someone else has quoted them - surely it's that quoting
> process elsewhere that has caused the corruption?
>
> nib

Ah! The post of yours with the symbols showing all correct here was set
as Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8. The one where you had the
lines quoted was Content type ISO-8859-1 so it rendered it on that basis,
showing the illegal character symbols. Something in what you are using is
setting the type header according to whether it thinks it has non-ascii
characters in it!

nib

On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 17:32:10 +0000, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:

>On 19/02/2022 17:25, Recliner wrote:
>> On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 14:57:04 +0000, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> In message <f2021hta4h84u9a0l75aj1981g3avu1aa0@4ax.com>, at 14:39:11 on
>>> Sat, 19 Feb 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>
>>>>> I detest Brexit and all that has ensued from it. However, I’ll get with
>>>>> the ETIAS scheme and make the best of it. Complaining, or calling out as
>>>>> one poster here likes to call it, won’t change anything. I aim to go to my
>>>>> grave in the best possible mood that I can muster.
>>>>
>>>> Yes, 100% agreed. There's no point banging on about what a mistake
>>>> Brexit was,
>>>
>>> There is a point, because the perpetrators are still in power, and are
>>> screwing up the aftermath.
>>
>> So, criticise them for their current incompetence, not what they said in 2016.
>
>That's all the brexiteers can do, keep harking back to what they claim
>other people said 6 years ago rather than face up to reality of what is
>happening now.

The hardline Brexiteers want to see deregulation, Article 16 to be triggered in NI, and taxes cut. BoJo gave them
Brexit, but not the flavour of Brexit they wanted.

>
>And, note that the current PM was
>> elected on a platform of achieving a hard Brexit, which is exactly what he's done. So, that's one election promise he
>> did keep. There's no point complaining if a politician was elected on a clear platform, and proceeded to deliver it,
>> just because you don't like it.
>
>He was elected to get Brexit done which he has singularly failed to do.

By his standards, he did, though the ERG reckon he's failed to follow through on the deregulation they wanted.

>
>>
>>>
>>>> and we just have to make the best of the situation we are now in,
>>>> including taking advantage of any opportunities that it presents.
>>>
>>> Including improving the recovery process by having different/better
>>> leaders/policies to cope with the consequences of leaving.
>>
>> How are you going to achieve that? Not by moaning about Brexit.
>>
>> As we all know, there's a high probability that BoJo will soon be leaving politics, but he will most likely be replaced
>> by another Brexiteer with a better chance of winning the 2024 general election.
>
>Don't count your chickens, Bojo is relying on Putin to do a Maggie for
>him. When he says you will need tanks to get him out of Downing Street
>he wasn't joking.

He won't go voluntarily, but he'll still be evicted. Of course, it may well be Carrie who decides she's had enough (I
wonder what the Ashcroft excerpt in tomorrow's Mail will say to annoy her?), and tells him to resign. It's ironic that
it's the Mail, Telegraph and Spectator which are now the most difficult reading for the hapless Johnsons, not the Mirror
and Guardian.